Good to see
Microsoft has done lots of testing of Windows 11 on various architectures prior to releasing it. Oh wait...
Chipmaker AMD has reported that some of its silicon lucky enough to have made the cut for Windows 11 is having difficulty with the new OS. While not yet listed on Microsoft's known issues dashboard for Windows 11, AMD has come out and said that there's a performance penalty when running "certain applications." The first issue …
And then there’s the companies I’ve worked in where incredibly creative engineering managers were going to revolutionize things by introducing their never thought of before version of Agile,- with a few er “practical modifications”, in reality making it the bastard child of waterfall and agile.
In being fair, would tightening up security often not suffer a performance penalty?
Win11 does turn on, by default, many security features and technologies not required as default on Win10. Certainly it is reasonable to believe that this, alone, will impose a performance hit?
I don't think it is reasonable actually, because they've restricted 11 to the subset of processors that can do all this extra security in hardware. Having done that, they ought to be able to redesign bits of the code to exploit the new processors. Apparently they haven't got round to that yet.
in the REAL world, security does NOT mean a performance reduction. If there IS one, and it is NOTICEABLE, you need to re-think your architecture.
Just because Micros~1's "solutions" (like Defender re-scanning your newly built executable and DLL files EVERY! TIME! YOU! BUILD! YOUR! PROGRAM! as one irritating example) most DEFINITELY get in the way of performance, does not mean it MUST be this way.
It's LAZY to sacrifice performance in the name of "security".
Shame man, don't know what you wrote that upset a whole slew of the downvoters.
Gave you an upvote just to offset one of them.
Cheers (hopefully the beer will improve your self-esteem)
Edited to change set off to offset (I thought it sounded strange, but could not put my finger on it).
Regression testing on "any supported Ryzen CPU" is not difficult to achieve.
I would also say that testing many configurations is not difficult for Microsoft. I work for a massively smaller company, and we have strategies for continually stability and regression testing a wide range of HW that are fairly effective. For example, whenever a dev PC is retired it gets sent down to the SQA basement and gets hooked up to the SQA cluster. We also buy newer machines, for example because we need to do tests with a new x86 extension.
I'm sure Microsoft can do a lot better than that.
A corporation with multiple billions in the bank unable to afford testing their OS on a range of kit? I think not! Linux appears to be able to handle most kit its thrown at, and I've never yet heard of Linux performing less well on a PC than Windows does on the same hardware. This despite MS and hardware vendors working to make "sure" everything is Windows compatible, etc. Clearly MS is doing things wrong/badly. I dont think they care about the quality of the product they emit because of userlock-in in some cases plus they know that the less IT-able tend to stick with what they know.
Not 'every' company, MS is the utter dregs, and has been for literally decades.
There are plenty of excellent software companies that try to make sure their product is okay. TBH it's only the dinosaurs like MS who still view the users as addicts willing to put up with ANY shit!
They also have slowdowns, according to
Virtualization-Based Security and Hypervisor-Protected Code Integrity features cause a slowdown of about 5% in testing apparently. Although they did point out that was about the performance difference between a Core i7 and a Core i9 (with a 35% cost difference).
It is called "wintel" for a reason...
Though I was always one for the alternative vendors, after the normal Intel 386, I had a 486(DX4-100, made by... I forgot) and then had a ... cyrix (?) 6-86 or however they called the thing, an AMD k-something and at university a Sparc (II I think?).
Too long ago, too much beer/wine/mead /distilled spirits, one thing driving out another as they say.
Intel did the 486DX4-100. I had an AMD 486DX40 which was really quick for the time.
The issue was getting the data bus on the motherboard to run stable at these higher clock speeds and a lot of vendors struggled with this. This is why motherboards with a lower clock speed and using a processor with a higher clock speed became popular.
I worked in a shop building PC's in the earliy 90's and we had someone come in asking for a 486DX50 machine. We built it, but ended up trying motherboards from 4 different vendors before we found one which worked reliably - not an issue in DOS6.x, but at the time critical for Windows 3.1 which would BSOD randomly. Also essential was a good VGA card from a well known vendor so you could get decent drivers.
Ahhh, the good old days.
yeah an artificial "NEED" to 'UP'grade your hardware and ARTFICIALLY create a "new computer" market. Where have we seen this before ... ?
C-C-C-Catch the wave! New WINDOWS (vista) !!!
(obligatory 'New Coke' Max Headroom reference mostly because Micros~1 is repeating their mistakes AGAIN, the same kinds of mistakes Coca Cola made with 'New Coke')
You've obviously not been exposed to how rabid a lot of FPS gamers are, even the "casual" ones. They'll spend bucks on a monitor, keyboard or a mouse that "reacts quicker" and 3%/5% would be absolutely unacceptable.
Actually I don't see why anyone should have to deal with lower performance at all, gamer or not. Can you imagine the reaction to asking airlines to accept 3%/5% poorer fuel economy in a new jet? Memory access speeds impact spreadsheets as much as it impacts games.
Spreadsheet speed isn't top of my list for not rolling out W11; I don't think 3%-5% would often be noticed.
Maybe it's part of a general asymmetry about time gains and losses. Take commuting. If you ask people how much they'd pay to cut 3 minutes off a one-hour commute, you might not get many high bids, but any local politician or official that adds 3 minutes to drivers' journeys had better be ready for a storm. Likewise, a lot of working Windows users wouldn't pay for a small speed increase, but a speed hit's news.
"Anal Gamers", don't you just love them?
They'll spend more time on the Steam forum arguing about some minor technical issue in hardware with 3 other people than actually playing the damn game they just paid £65 for!
These are people who've never played the simple 8 bit micro games back in the day, they'd appreciate what we had to suffer in the bad old days. Me and the missus play games but so long as we get 30fps at 1900x1200, we get to see blood spurts when we stab/shoot the bad guys, we get at minimum £1/hour playtime out of our game purchases and we have fun then we're happy bunnies!
I'm going to install this to a spare SSD
So that I can suss what there is to see.
With nothing to fear from errors and such,
I'll find out if problems are just too much--
Or, if it works out as well as MS doth say,
I can always upgrade on another day.
Seeing as how news about anything from M$ comes out as "good news stuff, bad news stuff", and we're still in the good news phase of Win11, what's next? Does this mean that when the bad news hits we find out the OS nukes all your AMD silicon into sand and the EULA you agreed to means you owe M$ themselves money for lost telemetry data? Only hyperbole until it isn't.
For increased security/reliability, due to using virtualization to protect drivers. How much that matters in practice, who knows.
All I know is that as CPUs have added various features to protect against attacks like protecting stacks, restricting pages where code can be executed, ASLR and on and on the bad guys have found different methods of attack. So while Windows 11 may be technically "more secure" in practice it won't matter because closing off one potential method of attack doesn't matter much to its real world security because so many other attacks remain and more are discovered every day.
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I did an OEM Windows 10 Pro install yesterday evening from a recovery image and during the install it offered me Windows 11 Pro as a free upgrade (I'm not on any preview channels; this is standard retail). It installed automatically with me barely even seeing a Win10 desktop. Caught me by surprise as I was expecting to wait a while for a roll-out.
Anyway, I'm using a Lenovo ThinkPad E14 Gen 2 which is a Ryzen 7 Pro 16GB and Vega graphics. I don't do games so can't comment on that, but can say that it is running totally fine in everyday use including Visual Studio and other dev tools. Faster and nicer than Windows 10, I've no regrets. Various editors and tools open snappier than ever, and whilst there are indeed fewer customisations there are no show-stoppers for me.
As an aside, under the Pro edition it was more obvious than with Windows 10 how to install with only a local account (Home won't allow it I hear) and BitLocker still works fine under that local account.
YMMV but I just thought I'd balance comments out a little and say (admittedly after only one day's usage) that (for me at least) AMD and Windows 11 are totally fine together.
Wow, a balanced view. What are you doing here? Is this not the "Window$ h4terZ anonymous"-thread?
I guess I have to admit I'd expect as much for "general" work. The bloat that comes with the different development environments "experience" is likely more of a culprit for my own gripes (on Win 10). Do I like the OS? No, not really. Can I do productive work? Yeah, sure (though I spent very productive months (not consecutive ones...) in a past job using mostly pencil and paper (in landscape format)). Would I prefer working using a linux machine? Depends on the work, sorry (at home it's linux only for me).
Do I hate it when MS breaks stuff during "upgrades"? Hell, yes! (but this is the admins' problem = not my problem, and I will not interfere with their work, they frown upon it with extreme predjudice).
Do I hate it when MS breaks my workflow? Or forces another stupid change down my throat? (like when certain browser makers stop supporting certain extensions and certain ways of arranging tabs). Or hides menues, moves options / submenues around, changes keyboard shortcuts? Yes, to all above.
Will I still be able to be productive? Sure. It will take a while to get used to new stuff (which I bloody hate! like when ElReg changed the site layout...), but most of my time is not spent hitting keys like a madman dancing on hot quicksand. I am also the first (ok, the third I guess) to admit that I can type faster than think about complex stuff, or at least arrive at a reasonable solution.
I will not blame my tools for my shoddy workmanship. Unless I have to coherently format documents written by others or - worse - collaboratively in Microsoft Word (solution: palm it off to somebody more junior).
I just upgraded mobo, CPU etc, as my gen 2 or 3? i7 and board were not win 11 compliant. It was getting old but still ran super fast, but whatever.
So my rebuild with a Ryzen 7 went well, reinstalled win 10, and the windows update panel now tells me my gear is ready for windows 11, coming soon. I guess it's being pushed out to OEM builders only for now.
Well indeed, it's been out for the public for 3 days!
Anyone who's worked in IT for more than 5 mins knows you never, ever install a GA release of any software, you just never do it. Always, always wait for the second major patch set then start playing in dev/UAT, check and go to prod once UAT clears testing.
Alrigh, overkill for a home O/S maybe but at least hold off for a couple of weeks until the serious patches are out.
That all depends on your approach to your local system. And I've been in IT since the late 1980s.
I switch between Windows and Linux quite regularly, almost depending on my mood, and sometimes I even switch twice in a week - a one hour coffee break whilst it installs is totally fine.
The secret, and the reason why I'm trying Windows 11 without any worries whilst knowing I can reinstall Windows 10 (or Mint etc) at any time, is to be in the situation where your machine can be formatted at a minute's notice without losing anything that matters.
Code is in git (commit often), and data (including music) is synced to PCloud - which works cross-platform. You can literally sneak up and reformat the drive and I don't care.
To be in such a situation means that provided you have Windows 10 installation media available there is no reason not to try the new shiny pretty much straight away. It's a very freeing and low-stress way to compute.
Good job I'm not a gamer.
Oh wait, I don't run Windows on my personal machines! Just that piece of shirt that 'our valued delivery partner' supplied to us this year.The one with the 128 GB SSD... Oh well, I'll lay in a good supply of popcorn for the next installment of the Microsoft Saturday Serial. Anyone got any old bottles of that blue Microsoft Brainwash soda?
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