* Posts by Steve Kerr

214 publicly visible posts • joined 26 Jul 2013


Bad eIDAS: Europe ready to intercept, spy on your encrypted HTTPS connections

Steve Kerr

Re: At last! A Brexit bonus!

I somewhat think that what the UK government will want to do is somewhat more draconian than what the EU are proposing.

I would even hazard that they will ask their friend, pooh bear to help - or at least the government mandarins that drive a lot of policy (regardless of the party in power) will.

Waiting for the UK government to make using VPNs illegal with a life sentence if/when caught!

New information physics theory is evidence 'we're living in a simulation,' says author

Steve Kerr

Sounds like a really am a figment of my own imagination!

Scripted shortcut caused double-click disaster of sysadmin's own making

Steve Kerr

Amiga hard disk partitioning

Made mistakes with Amiga hard disk partitioning

Whatever tool I was using to do it (may have been inbuilt one) didn't compare the size of the disk against the size of the partitions.

From memory, you had to specify the start/end block for each partition.

Somewhere along the line, I got confused and managed to create a partition or extend it beyond the end of the disk, what this ended up doing (unknown to me at the time), was wraparound the partiton back past the beginning of the disk (as that's what this partioning app done) - this particular tool didn't check for validity it seems!

Only noticed some days later when weird things strted happening and files got corrupted - took ages to sort out that mass, I think I actually had some backups that I managed to restore (done to VHS tapes no less) - no idea what I lost but I don't think it was much as I was only about 19-20 at the time so didn't have much of importance!

Fun times!

Not even the ghost of obsolescence can coerce users onto Windows 11

Steve Kerr


Got windows 11 on a work PC now

Seems to be spending time fighting againt it - so many things are a pain, the most annoying the forced location of the task bar - I know there are probably hacks etc.. around being able to change it, though this is a work PC so there's a limit to what I can do to it (and also corporate policy restrictions). I prefer to have the start bar on the side but no, microsoft says I'm not allowed to do that with the default install of windows 11.

So my own PC, I'm waiting for something better to come along (new framework laptop when it arrives will have linux), gaming PC will be sticking to windows - maybe windows 12 will be better.

So much for CAPTCHA then – bots can complete them quicker than humans

Steve Kerr

Re: Task failed successfully.

You got there first - pass the CAPTCHA test based on human mistakes for doing them - except when the bots are programmed to do that too!

Brit broadband subscribers caught between crappy connections and price hikes

Steve Kerr

Re: Ofcom rules?

Think beardy sold it years ago, it's a split between Liberty Global & Telefonica now.

Not heard good things about the first one

Bosses face losing 'key' workers after forcing a return to office

Steve Kerr

No more office

Mentioned in a previous comment on a previous article.

Company I work for used this as the opportune time to downsize their offices round the world where possible, 90% drop in space in european head office and moved to a managed office space elsewhere with some available hotdesking where needed.

So they've seen a way in saving a lot of costs - certainly in the UK but I would think elsewhere as well.

Suits me fine! (though I know for others home working does not suit them for a variety of reasons)

Third MOVEit bug fixed a day after PoC exploit made public

Steve Kerr

Automating internal attacks

Only a passing comment.

You would think if you have software that is written to be public internet facing that they would an internal set of automation tools that continually attempts to exploit their own software

So you would have a segregated network where you would use the same sort of tools that miscreants would use and then coninually attempt attacks at a variety of supported versions of your software.

I know if I was running a software vendor, I would do something like this.

For some internal software in the past, I have done things to try to break it though people moaned about why i was doing this - I said, we need to understand what will happen to all the interconnected components if something goes wrong, e.g. someone accidently deletes the contents of a table in a DB or services fail or servers fail.

Basically, test it into destuction - it's also a fun thing to do and it means that when it goes live to customers you've tried to minimise the chances of failure, though people can be quite good at breaking things by accident!

Fed up with slammed servers, IT replaced iTunes backups with a cow of a file

Steve Kerr

That media deletion virus

When I worked for an bank, we had lots of AV and mail AV to protect our stuff.

We also had lots of issues with file server storage always being low - back when 100-200 GB of fileserver space was a huge amount

Whilst on holiday, we had that virus pass thru that zero lengthed all media files, that came from our owner back as we didn't (until then), have mail AV on those links as we thought they were trusted.

Anyway, we recovered about 70% of our file server disk space pretty much immediately (only reason I knew was someone called me whilst I was in France).

When I got back we got so many requests for restores where when checked responses were "please provide a business justification to restore madonnas greated hits" or some such.

only area that got media restored was marketing.

We were much more aggressive in identifying and removing music/films without notification after that.

Airline puts international passengers on the scales pre-flight

Steve Kerr

Weight limit flight to Albania

Once flew to Albania for work and was on an airbus of some description.

Only about 40-50 passengers, the plane was at its weight limit.

The front few rows were filled and so were the rear few rows and only single window seats on the left hand side of the plane, someone wanted to move form the crowded front/back but was told this was not allowed because the plane was at its max carrying weight due to cargo and the seating arrangement was due to balance.

From gatwick it took most of the runway to get off the ground, landing in albania where the runway was short came in so low was skimming the fields for a minute then literally smacked into the tarmac just after the dirt and braked so hard I headbutted the seat in front and had to use my hands to push myself off the faceplant. Plane done a 180 at the other end with the wing actually over the dirt at the other end of the runway, was like doing a 180 at 20mph in a very large reliant robin!

As for passenger weight, I've seen a lot of videos from er....larger so called influencers bemoaning plane seat & aisle widths and saying that they should be given extra seats for free, to me, to be fair, should state your weight+baggage weight approx when booking tickets and pay the difference or refunded the difference at weigh ins at the airport - could be done discretely - only fair to charge per KG for travel, a bit like sending stuff via a parcel company!

Microsoft enables booting physical PCs directly into cloud PCs

Steve Kerr

Corporate use

I can see a use for this in a business setting - for instance, with a lot of WFH nowadays (myself included), rather than supplying laptops/PCs to employees they could do one of a couple of things.

Allow an employee to use their own PC to connect to a virtual PC on a hosted environment or provide a cheap thin client, like a RPi to connect, this means that companies can reduce phsyical hardware supplied to employees which would make it a lot cheaper.

Saying that, they don't need to run in some cloud providers environment as companies could just host it all themselves in their own environments using things like VMWare Horizon or one of the mass of other products out ther.

it wouldn't surprise me if companies go down that route, I fully expect that the company I work for would do that as literally only use the laptop for teams and outlook and my actual work is done thru hopping onto other secured hosts and from their jumping onwards.

Let white-hat hackers stick a probe in those voting machines, say senators

Steve Kerr

I'm sure i read something a few years back about suggestions that the voting machines go to be checked & tested by the Nevada gambling commission where they would also hold the software in escrow. As they're good at making sure the software in gambling machines does not skew the payouts etc..

From memory, the voting machine vendors point blank refused.

i saw a video as well where they got members of the public to watch whilst a sealed voting machine that was used in local elections was made to produce the "correct vote", they were sat in the room watching this happen, they were shocked at how easy it was to manipulate.

there needs to be more oversight of these machines and their software.

There was a push to use open source voting software where the source code was open to everyone to view, don't know what happened to that initiative though.

Also, I'm not American or in the US so the above is based on being an outside observer on stuff I've read.

IBM launches Watsonx to help enterprises streamline workers out the door

Steve Kerr

Re: Watsonx won't be any different from Watson

Although if it suggested that a bunch of middle managers and all of the upper management be dumped because it would be better to direct the company, it would be turned off so quick, you wouldn't believe someone could move so fast.

Microsoft suggests businesses buy fewer PCs. No, really

Steve Kerr

Re: As much as I like VDI

Because how else are they going to monetise you for a monthly fee for something you'll never own?

Payments firm accused of aiding 'contact Microsoft about a virus' scammers must cough $650k

Steve Kerr

When I get round to it, going to set up a VM that talks out to a squid proxy that will redirect to a local webserver hosting my "bank".

The PC will be in its own subnet so can only see the local gateway which will route stuff specifically.

Going to group policy it to the eyeballs and then go thru the entertainment of wasting their time.

My current go to name to give them is Benjamin Chow or Ben Chow for short - say it together and then look up Hindi swear words :-)

Military helicopter crash blamed on failure to apply software patch

Steve Kerr

Possibly "Windows for helicopters" wasn't such a good idea.

Windows: Your update has been installed and restart has been issued, please do not turn off your helicopter during this process.

Techie fired for inventing an acronym – and accidentally applying it to the boss

Steve Kerr

We have a few names - for people

We have some names rather than acryonyms for people - some of which is part of peoples names but won't say here.

We have named (internally in the team) certain colleagues as

Mr Shouty

Sargent Major Shouty (SMS) - ex army who believes he can treat civvies the way he treated people in the army, doesn't work!

Captain Chaos - he actually knew about this one and accpted it was was quite funny.

There are more but not saying those ones and many I've forgotten!

Atlassian to dump 500 – by email – in the name of 'rebalancing'

Steve Kerr

Re: I’m fine with it…

jira is OK once you get used to it.

I'm more for the slow, painful and excruciating death of those responsible for "confluence"

News Corp outfoxed by IT intruders for years

Steve Kerr

I think they're called "reporters" in the loosest sense of the term

Signal says it'll shut down in UK if Online Safety Bill approved

Steve Kerr

Re: Bring it in

Think that's heading in the direction of Judge Death from 2000ad

Accidental WhatsApp account takeovers? It's a thing

Steve Kerr

This is an issue with these "social" media companies

It's not a phone company problem, it's a social media company issue.

They're binding their service to a phone number and not an account, if it was bound to an account then this wouldn't happen.

huge copout from fakebook/whatsapp blaming someone else for their decision to bind accounts to a mobile number.

OK, there are other issues where companies send SMS messages for 2FA too so there are more complexities to it.

There's also a responsibility for the account owner to delete their phone numbers off of their social media.

So it's a mix of social media companies and the people with accounts with those services.

I would think there would be some kind of "migrating to a new number" thing in those apps, not that this wouldn't be used by identify thieves - it's a complex subject thinking more on it.

Giving up and going for a lunch break!

Most Londoners would quit before they give up working from home

Steve Kerr

No more office

The company I work for is just in the process of dumping its London office, they don't want to pay for the space, but if people are WFH, they don't have to pay for it, so that's a win/win for them.

They are going to rent a small managed office as a "collaboration space" for the things where occasionally you do have to do some face to face stuff.

As most of my communication is with people in different offices in the UK, europe, asia & the US, it doesn't really matter where I am to work, the added benefit is that I'm on call so waiting for 90 minutes for me to get to the office or get home to look at things becomes a few minutes so the company wins on quicker support.

China's Yangtze Memory reportedly lays off staff, evicts them from company housing

Steve Kerr

Re: I had much the same experience in Stockholm.

Did not know that - thanks for that insight, have worked in Stockhold a fair bit (staying in hotels for a couple of days) but wasn't aware of that rental market.

Changes afoot at Salesforce after activist investor Elliott takes a decisive slice

Steve Kerr

Re: "improve operating margins"

or IBM!

Twitter will lose 32 million users by end of 2024, Insider Intelligence predicts

Steve Kerr

Virtual users

Is that 32 million actual users or 32 million bots?

It's 2023, let's check in with the metaverse... Nope, still doesn't exist

Steve Kerr

Had a quick look on how to acess

Saw some fancy websites.

Saw some quotes about how it's going to change everything

Saw it's fragmented already with many different metaverse sites.

Saw nothing of interest

Lost interest.

Looks like it's stillborn.

Wasted 7 minutes looking at this stuff.

Going to look at something more interesting which to be honest, is anything else.

Fixing an upside-down USB plug: A case of supporting the insupportable

Steve Kerr

When I was doing electronic systems in college - certainly with a few people that shouldn't have been allowed near anything electrical, we had one guy who produced entertainment.

They used to have these plug boards with which you could fit components that was sort of a bit like lego, you could slot in these blocks that had components and a description of what it was on it, they were powered by a separate 12v power supply.

We heard a big bang and everyone turned round to see a mushroom cloud billow up to and across the ceiling and a look of horror on the guys face.

We never worked out how he managed to cause a transistor (I think it was) to lose its magic blue smoke.

We did jokingly create the "Theory of Random Connections" off of the back of what he done which was the running joke for the rest of the college year.

Fun times.

Apple exec sues over 'ageist' removal of $800k stock bonus

Steve Kerr

Re: Foot. Shot....

From the looks of it, all future RSUs are already NULL as looking behind the scenes, they're trying to manage him out.

So yeah, he's suing for ageism.

Chinese-linked cyber crims nab $529 million from Indian nationals

Steve Kerr

Love when the Indian scammers call

Have some great calls with the scammers until they start swearing at me - much entertainment.

Although it's crap that people got scammed out of money, is a bit funny that the what seems to be the majority of scammers are themselves being scammed.

The icing on the cake is if those scum that scammed people out of money were then scammed out those illgotten gains.

Rest in peace, Queen Elizabeth II – Britain's first high-tech monarch

Steve Kerr

Queen Elizabeth - demon driver

I think she has done so much for country, even amongst her own problems in her own family, just like every other family.

I do mourn her passing.

I was at Windsor Horse Show last year when we were asked to just wait for a minute.

These 3 black rangers pulled up next to us, they were going pretty fast, surprised the first one didn't do a handbrake sliding stop.

The drivers door opened and out got the queen, was totally aghast as she was just in front of us, I've got photos of her that close too.

She was watching one of the native showing classes, not in the main ring either, just the side ring and they had a chair there for her to sit on and watch.

We went and saw some other things and when we can back past she was just leaving, getting in the drivers seat leading the way, we saw her driving on the road up to the castle and she was accelerating away from the others, she must have been doing at least 70mph! Total demon driver, it was brilliant.

After the loss of Prince Philip it was so nice to see her so happy at Windsor watching all the horse.

A great loss to the country.

Nvidia books $1.32b inventory charge as PC market slows

Steve Kerr

Yup - charging significantly over MSRP whilst not actually dropping the prices to lower than the original MSRP for cards which are a couple of years old now.

So yeah, you're stuck with inventory because you're unwilling to drop the prices to something more acceptable to the market.

It's why I'm still using an 8 year old graphics card because I'm not paying those prices for yesterdays technology. Charging a premium for bleeding edge I can understand.

AMD have seen the writing on the wall and are starting to drop prices, Nvidia have their heads in the clouds still riding the crypto boom (and bust)

CityFibre loses appeal against Openreach discounts for ISPs

Steve Kerr

Unfortunately where I live the only fibre provider currently is price gouging the local area which I suspect won't stop until BT finally roll out fibre here.

Had a major row with one of their door to doors sales people that got aggressive after I said no, not interested. Believed he was entititled to know all the reasons why I would not switch there and then. His attitude pretty much sealed why they would never get my business even without considering their eye watering prices.

BT currently listed my area as before 2025 but I suspect will be after the heat death of the universe.

The perfect crime – undone by the perfect email backups

Steve Kerr

Turning up at work to a bunch of police

In a previous job turned up for a shift with a bunch of police that wanted to talk to me - scared the crap out of me.

Turns out, they wanted to listen to a voice recording of a particular line (lots of dealer lines & also some switchboard lines were recorded) and management told that to come to the building and I'd do it but didn't tell me that they were arriving.

These were analogue tapes that had something like 48 lines recorded and the tapes ran for 24 hours at a time.

Anyway, I ran thru a tape over a time period for one particular external line whilst they listened (and obviously I did too).

What transpired was there were some bomb threats being phoned in to reception, in listening to a scratchy recording, could hear a woman in the background and a child, it was one of the managers in the midsts of a mental breakdown phoning in bomb threats. Don't know what actually happened to him in the end. I was asked by the police about what I thought I heard.

Have had to listen in to a bunch of other dealer conversations which included hearing the sex lives of several of the dealers - oops!

Next major update of Windows 11 prepares for launch

Steve Kerr

Nothing of appeal

I've looked at it (on a VM) and currently, I see nothing on it which is giving me a "wow, must migrate to this immediately" as opposed to "kicking and screaming and throwing my toys out of my pram"

For some people out there it may be OK as it seems they are trying to go for the MacOS type look but in a Microsoft way.

Maybe windows 12 will be better, to me, this is like the Windows Vista/8 version, they've tried something different, it's going to fail so they go back to something similar to XP/Win7/Win10

The end of the iPod – last model available 'while supplies last'

Steve Kerr

IPod Touch

Still use my IPod Touch with stored music from ripped CD's and with Tidal in offline mode.

Was hoping they were going to release an updated one as it's useful for being small, good battery life and not having to worry about storage for everything else on a phone as well.

So when this dies or becomes incompatible with the latest Tidal App update will have to look for something else.

It's a shame as it was a really good simple product.

OpenVMS on x86-64 reaches production status with v9.2

Steve Kerr

Re: I wonder how many people still remember how to use it?

I think I know the confusion here.

From memory, (probably wrong), the filesystem was called Files11 or some such.

The file system had extensions to create databases as part of the filesystem with which you used FDL? (File Definition Language) that specified things like fields, sizes, types, bucket sizes, indexes and with that you can basically create a database file.

it was efficient, meant you could use standard backups as everything looked like a file, some really funky stuff.

My best effort was being able to pass commands to batch jobs real time using the OPER console functionality so could to a REPLY/TO the OPER prompt to direct the program what to do next, even done sanity checks on input - best one was a colleague saying it was impossible and couldn't be done and then me presenting, yeah, here's how to do it, I wrote this in a previous company. :-)

Windows 10 still growing, but Win 11 had another bad month, says AdDuplex

Steve Kerr

Re: So which is it?

I would assume that has kit dies, moves out of support he would migrate peoples PC's to mac/linux at that point, probably what I would do!

Real-time software? How about real-time patching?

Steve Kerr

Re: "Dont ask"

Been driven thru the back roads in Moscow back to the airport late at night on a terrifying journey after I flew over for a work meeting.

Outside of the middle of moscow, there is literally no street lights or electricity.

Picked up by some taxi driver and driven down narrow back streets was rather worried about exactly where we were going - think the driver saw the terror in my eyes and said "Is OK, no worries"

he was actually skipping the clogged main roads which are a nightmare, just everything outside was pitch black!

Pop quiz: The network team didn't make your change. The server is in a locked room. What do you do?

Steve Kerr

Locked in at night

I was doing some work late one evening for a bank in Newcastle, we finished about 10pm.

In the huge foyer the length of the building, the customer said as I was a visitor, I had to go out via the main entrance and they would go out via the staff only revolving doors that had to be used with a staff pass.

They duly left and I walked down to the main doors to find there was no-one there, main doors locked and the customer had legged it and I didn't have their mobile numbers to contact them to let me out.

Waited there for 20 minutes thinking I was going to be there all night locked in at bank.

Then I thought I heard music, thought I was hearing things it was so quiet, took me a few minutes to identify where it was coming from, had to go upstairs and pinpoint where it was coming from, found it finally when I found 2 guys replacing floor tiles at the other end. Told them what happened and asked if they had a pass that would get me out of the door.

Finally made it out after being stuck for 30 minutes and still no security showed up - even waved my arms in the air a bit in case there was security monitoring cameras!

The customer did laugh the following day and said that should have probably made sure I could get out before they left!

Fun times

Vulnerabilities and censorship tools among hot new features in Beijing's Olympics app

Steve Kerr

A lot of the list is for illegal items

China is bad for a lot of things and certainly not condoning their actions, so ignoring the holes in the app, the probable monitoring and tracking etc....

Someone has posted the list at https://raw.githubusercontent.com/citizenlab/chat-censorship/master/olympics/illegalwords.txt

Digging thru it, the far majority is for things that are illegal and are pretty much terms for "guns for sale, drugs for sale, prostitutes for sale" though some really odd ones like "national tourism board".

Have only had a 5 minute dig as currently in the midst of my work day.

Planning for power cuts? That's strictly for the birds

Steve Kerr

The joys of generator tests and failover

One financial institution I worked at many years ago decided to do a generator test late in the evening midweek - I was on shift that evening.

The failvoer goes Mains -> Battery -> Generator

On this test it went something like Mains -> Battery -> Generator (fails to start, everything goes black) -> Back to battery (everything comes on) -> back to generator (everything goes black) -> back to battery everything comes on -> batteries give out -> everything goes black and stays black.

No emergency lighting in the DC where the bridge was it turns out and no outside lighting to shine in thru the windows as there were none.

The hilarity, the mainframe batch runs that were in the progress at the time, the chaos - fun times.

So issues with the generators and lots of issues with failed batteries, lots of root cause analysis, lots of beefing up batteries, failover procedures etc...

There was fun at one bank where the generator fuel tanks spung a leak and flooded the basement canteen to a depth of 3 feet, they never did manage to paint over the diesel tide mark enough and their was a odour of diesel for the rest of the time I was there which never quite left.

GPU makers promise relief is at hand over chip shortages, prices expected to fall in second half of the year

Steve Kerr

Re: I, for one, shall remain patient.

I've got the AMD Ryzon box I built a couple of years back, still has a GTX970 in it from beginning of 2015 as I'm not paying these current eye watering prices (even if I could get hold of one)

ASUS recalls motherboards that flame out thanks to backwards capacitors

Steve Kerr

Re: New laptop board? It's a new laptop according to MS activation. Get a new license.

It's more likely these boards were part of self builds or small company builds so they would not have OEM licenses for windows.

I originally purchased a Win7 license when it was released (not OEM tied).

I've been thru this when I had an i7 die and the cost of a replacement was laughable, it was more cost effective to build a new machine and transplant some bits that I could (decided to do a pimped out box, with RGB lighting and stuff - never again will I do this after the 12-14 hours it took over 4 days with huge amounts of internal wiring!)

So, new case, motherboard (switched to AMD), RAM - only things that remained were the original SSDs and the graphics card.

I booted it and rather expected it to blue screen and die and have to reinstall windows, instead it installed all the correct drivers, didn't complain and asked to relicense which took less than 5 minutes to sort with the license key.

So as much as I hate to say it, but kudos to M$ for making a seemless migration with the same install into what was pretty much a totally different PC with a different CPU and drivers and not had any problems since in the 2 1/2 years since it was built.

Tesla disables in-car gaming feature that allowed play while MuskMobiles were in motion

Steve Kerr

Re: Back to horse-drawn buggies please!

There was a rumoured to be a case of someone being arrested in Hyde Park back in the day before motorvehicles of being drunk in charge of a horse.

in an interesting twist, it seemed that the horse was also drunk

NASA delays crewed Moon landing until 2025, citing technical infeasibility

Steve Kerr

Dust off Apollo

Just saying!

Shame that over the years it's all been turned into bean counters and strangled funding for Nasa where so much science and technology has come off of the back of pushing frontiers.

Would be good to see a second moon landing in my lifetime though the first I would've been mostly going "goo goo goo" and soiling nappies.

Facebook may soon reveal new name – we're sure Reg readers will be more creative than Zuck's marketroids

Steve Kerr

I would suggest Virtucon

Dr. Evils empire.

I bet zuck has a Mr. Bigglesworth too.

Based on the current company i would suggest the board isn't dissimilar to Dr. Evils various henchmen, sorry, that wasn't PC enough, hench'various entities of inteterminate genders (72 gender types or some such on fakebook now), rocks, trees, a pot of pentunias currently speeding towards the earth wondering whether "they" will be its friend or whatever'

Blue Origin employees complain of sexist culture that ignores safety concerns

Steve Kerr

Say it ain't so

Working for a Bezos owned company and not having a toxic workplace and being akin to slave labour?

Business as usual at Blue Origin then taking Amazon corporate ethos to new heights

If anyone can explain why Jupiter's Great Red Spot is spinning faster and shrinking, please speak up

Steve Kerr

Green energy

All we need to do is install a wind farm.

Problem solved.

Not sure which problem but it's solved.

kudos though for this, very interesting read - didn't realise that there had been astromonical views of this in the 1880's.

RIP Sir Clive Sinclair: British home computer trailblazer dies aged 81

Steve Kerr

RIP Sir Clive

Started in computing with a ZX81 when they first came out, was 11 years old with a 16K ram pack too.

As much as people have mocked him over the years - he kicked off the affordable home computer market in the UK.

Yes, some of his products failed, some were ropey but the point is, he tried to produce new product were ahead of the time but unfortunately the technology of the era sometimes was quite up to it.

Here I sit, working in IT over 45 years later and a good proportion of the reason for that all started with the ZX81 created by Sir Clive that was purchased from WH Smith.

I read he was still tinkering as recent as last week.

So I raise my beer to you as the impact you had will carry on for many years to come and a name that will live on in human history.

Facebook building 'on-demand executable file format' that self-inflates using homebrew compression

Steve Kerr

give developers minimum spec

Giving developers super fast machines with max everything means they don't care about efficency generally.

Give them yesteryears base models to work with and that will reduce bloat as they will have to work within the framework of what they have.

That's what I'd do!

back in the days of spectrums, c64s etc....software developers had to be so much more efficient to work within the limitations they had.