"We need a better approach which treats the root cause of this and fixes them before they fuck up someones life, not after."
only a 'feel' solution is likely to come out of this line of thinking, which means more gummint, stupidER laws, and a whole lot of emotion and getting NOTHING accomplished. no thanks.
Yes, because the current system works so well. The one that takes a teen with a few issues and turns them into criminals, denies them chances to get help and so on. I've worked with troubled teens. I've seen a high success rate. Kids who would've been dead or in prison in their late teens instead are hard working members of society with a good family of their own by their mid 20s.
But hey, lets just act like a bunch of retards and keep chucking people in prison and coming up with idiotic laws to further restrict freedoms and create even more criminals. You do know a common definition of insanity is "doing the same thing expecting different results", right? Doesn't that make society somewhat insane if we use the same idiotic methods in hopes of somehow improving this world?
Punishment instead of rehabilitation is and always will be a failure, and the worst criminals of the lot are the scum who willingly promote such things (I don't mean housewives who read Daily Mail etc who haven't given this sort of thing any thought, but people who claim intelligence who promote this stuff - if anyone should have a life sentence without parole it is them)
I'm not after whatever a "feel" solution is. I'm after an effective solution. It takes hard work, but the results are worth it, and in the long term cost society far less than what you promote.
How about this: you punish criminals as HARD as you can, keep them out of peaceful society for as LONG as you can ?
Tell me, with all the stuff your president elect appears to have done/promoted/has been accused of, what should be done with him? How long do you think should he be inside for?
As to supporting the death penalty, well.. Only the most hate-filled people can promote or support such things.
How can what you promote ever be part of "peaceful society"? Revenge breeds revenge, peace breeds peace, hate breeds hate, love breeds love. Revenge and hate are quick, easy, and feel good at the time, but the overall results are more revenge, hate, and pain. Peace and love however, while they take work to achieve and maintain, have better results long-term, and the overall quality of life for everyone is improved.
There is actual _EVIL_ in the world.
Yes, that's obvious just from your post.
There are people who will go out of their way to do criminal act to get money or pleasure [or whatever], even if their skills and intelligence could otherwise get them employed,
Not everyone who commits a crime is like that. Some don't know better, and have a chance to be educated. But the stupid idea of locking up people for longer only promotes crime, and more violent crime at that. If stealing a loaf of bread gets you 20 years, you might as well kill any witnesses as well.
The vast majority of people who commit crimes would rather not. They'd rather be educated and have good jobs. They'd rather be straight than on drugs or booze (try getting them away from peers who lead them that way and put them with peers who promote getting out and having a good time through sports/other social activities where you don't substances to give you a "high", the changes and rapidity of those changes will astound you!)
I've known a couple of these *kinds* of people: an uncle, and a friend's brother. Both are dead, and you COULD say their own evil/selfish lifestyle contributed to a short lifespan, as well as outright victimizing others (or society in general) from time to time.
Everything you do leads to the moment of your death. Many good people die young (eg a teenager who dies trying to save someone else from drowning vs many nasty people die old and rich (how many mob leaders, empires built on the back of drug victims and other victims of violent crimes, die old and filthy rich?).
I've also known a number of "these kinds" of people (whatever that is supposed to mean). I know from past volunteer work, and the friends I've had in more recent times who've made some significant mistakes, what it takes to cause someone to take a different track in life. A bad track is usually from an aberration that can be dealt with given appropriate "treatment" and resources. A change to a good track is the rewarding result of taking the time to find out what they need, then meeting that need.
It's not society's fault, their parents' fault, or anybody ELSE's fault but their own.
You don't see the hypocrisy in what you're saying here? You want to deprive people of their freedoms for as long as possible due to the mistakes they make, and you somehow think you are better than them? How messed up is your thinking?
Everyone who has input into your life has a hand in how you turn out. Not all have a totally causative effect, but there are a lot of factors. Most criminals for example come from poorer backgrounds and broken homes - lots of childhood stress which can have a significant detrimental impact on young brains and minds. Yet there are many children from extreme poverty who do well. It doesn't mean the parents of those who commit crimes are directly at fault, but there may be some fault in that they didn't find a way to reach the person who broke the law. Of course, those who bring their kids up around crime or drug/alcohol abuse are pretty directly responsible.
Changing the mindset, while they're still young, changes the outcome. But you have to have the resources and willingness to reach them, and you have to have them willing to come to you without fear of further problems. IOW, seeking help needs to lead to a life of freedom and health, not prison and pain. If people are afraid to get help for a problem before they commit a crime, then they'll not seek help.
There are several areas where society has a say in the outcome of a person's life. Example, I grew up gay, even though in NZ it became legal in my teens. In other parts of the world I believe it is (or at least was back then) a capital crime. Yes, people like you would be baying for my execution. There are those, even reading this now, who would want my death and eternity in hell for being gay. I was driven to suicide (one thing I proudly say I was a failure at!) by the efforts of some who thought they were decent people; vile trash who rated themselves so high and moral, yet they nearly succeeded in destroying the life of several teens. Some did. I was lucky, I managed to find a way out through my faith and into a better life. I still made mistakes, but I built a life I can be proud of. Not everyone I knew was so lucky, and some made choices that got them imprisoned, and a few took their lives over how society treated them. Can you imagine what it is like for a parent who loses a kid to suicide? How about a parent whose child is the most gentle loving soul you can imagine, but who has something they feel is so wrong they cannot live, be it homosexuality in decades past or other sexual fantasies or unusual thinking today? Can you imagine what that does to their siblings and friends? But that is, ultimately, what you promote. A life without hope of change, only to be punished by society.
I was headed towards some very violent crime. I hated everyone, and I wanted to punish everyone for the pain inflicted on me. The right person took a chance, and my life was turned around, and here I am. I can be proud of my life and achievements.
How society views certain things can make them worse for the person who experiences them. Since we're on a topic relating to sexual abuse.. If we were to lighten up on the views on such things to some degree, in regard to how we treat victims of such abuse, we would see a lowering of crime from them. Society does a lot to make the victims of abuse feel bad about themselves, and even worse than that we strongly and openly promote the views that they're more likely to become abusers or to commit other serious crimes. We heap so much bad upon their shoulders, over and above what they experienced, that we basically program them to become criminals.
Proverbs says "As a man thinks in his heart, so he is", and that is what we do to people. Over and over, constantly building and reinforcing this teaching that "because X happened you, you'll likely do Y and Z, and probably some V as well". The ones who don't fail are the ones who manage to change their thinking - but that can take a lot of work.
Neuroscience also agrees with this, and shows that if you continue to reinforce a habit/pattern, then it becomes more and more ingrained. If, however, you can break that pattern, then thinking and therefore actions can be changed. I've seen it happen with and without Christ, and although I obviously prefer "with Christ" I'll take anything that changes a person's life and stops them being a criminal. Anything intelligent and effective that is.
Fixing the root cause of THAT can only be done by eliminating the aberrations (criminally-minded people) from the bell curve of human nature.
If the death penalty works to prevent crimes, then why is the murder rate in the US so high? If incarceration works, why is the US (almost?) the country with the greatest number (%) of people in prison in the western world, yet also the country with the highest crime rate. If what you propose works so well, the US should be a country with very low crime.
It isn't. Clearly such practices are a complete failure and need to be abandoned.
(Post edited for El Reg 10kchar limit - and what's with the captcha?)