Posts by mrh2 41 publicly visible posts • joined 11 Mar 2011
"The broadcasters are now backing a new platform called FreeView Connect, which has yet to be officially announced, but is likely to be built into TVs next year. ®"
Except, beyond a Guardian article which also wrongly claimed the BBC and other PSBs were walking away from YouView, there's been no confirmation that FreeView Connect actually exists.
"It costs £15 a month for a package providing access to a movie catalog of 600, plus of course the line rental again."
BS, there's no "line rental" charge for Now TV and Now TV's player is available on all YouView boxes including those from BT and TalkTalk.
"It will also preclude companion screen applications involving smartphones and tablets, because that requires WiFi connectivity."
And yet a companion app is already being developed.
Neither Virgin's TiVo or Sky+ HD include WiFi as standard, one already has a companion screen app, the other is getting one.
>> If Apple is looking to discontinue optical drives on their products, it seems to me they're a bit cavalier about their customer's personal data storage and backup.
Surely the responsibility for the customer's personal data storage and backup rests with the customer?
Anyone needing a DVD drive can buy one for about 10quid online, Apple's computers will work with any USB drive, you don't have to buy their overpriced shiny one!
>> I think we may be in more agreement than disagreement.
Always a welcome sign of intelligence ;-)
>> If I'm wrong and it does reach a couple of million households or more then content will be attracted and viral promotion effects (seeing it at a friend's house) will kick in. But I think this is unlikely to occur even over the next 3 years.
All it takes is most of BT and TalkTalk's existing customer base to upgrade from the legacy boxes and there's 1m users there. Remember too that each ISP will have its own content on the system via a branded player, so content competition will be a key factor in driving take-up.
I'll be honest and say I think it'll actually be huge once the content is there and there are providers waiting in the wings to announce in the coming months. Some will probably surprise a lot of sceptics, certainly one is on very few large screen devices and will be massively popular.
>> That money would be better spent doing nice players for Samsung, LG and probably Sony and Panasonic along with business deals for long term high profile placement.
Except that TV makers drop support pretty quickly - there's a thread about this on Digital Spy right now, some big brand TV sets have been denied the iTV Player despite being a maximum 12 months old.
YouView will support devices until they cannot be supported without holding up improvements , not because maker X wants to lift another £1k from your bank.
>> That is where the numbers are going to be as the natural TV replacement cycle roles along
Ofcom reports that Smart TVs are less then 5% of the market and of these around 1/3 have never been connected to the internet. IF they're ever dominant it won't be for a long time.
>> Will the New Media (or equivalent) departments at ITV and C4 get multi-million pound pots of money to spend on advertising (even on their own channels)? I really doubt it.
They don't need millions. They already display ads for their catch-up services, it costs next to nothing for Channel 4 to redub the 4oD ad to include the line
'you can watch again or catch-up on Channel 4 shows on your big screen TV via YouView'
(except they'd word it better ;) )
>> I also don't think that there is anything next-gen about Youview it is very much current-gen along with Virgin Tivo and SkyHD (launched in 2006) although it may be better than both I don't see any generational shift. Although this does indicate how far behind BT still are (as they haven't launched their Youview offer yet).
I have a review YouView box in front of me. I used TiVo as paying customer and it was shite. YV works like the TiVo should have but still doesn't.
Once the third party content providers some on board it'll be a free marketplace - good for consumers - something TiVo and Sky+ can never be without taking cash away from the box providers.
And unlike TiVo, YouView will be available to everyone. VM can operate where they've laid down cable so 50% of the nation is closed to them.
>> BT have spent hundreds and hundreds of millions almost giving away BT Vision and I think that they don't have much more than 500K users
They have closer to 750k users....
>> Its hard to imagine them getting much back from their investment^W reckless splurge on football unless they offer something on other platforms
BT will offer the football matches but not the extra content - they've already said this. Expect exclusive post match interviews via a red button or app. This will help drive take-up as will finally offering HD.
>> Again I think that the need to make a real cash choice between boosting their platform or avoiding making obscene losses is going to lead the exclusive offer to be fairly weak.
They're using TV content to keep broadband and phone customers. The content is just an infrastructure cost like upgrading exchanges to Infinity.
>> Sky's pitch is very much content,
Indeed but that pitch has signed up as many people as it will using their current business model, hence why they've launcehd NOW TV and are going to be on YouView.
>> Youview's pitch is user experience and ease of use (I think) so actually being able to demo it is rather important but even having someone there who can explain the product is quite an achievement.
Agree. And on those front IMO it performs very well. But people need to see it.
>> Have you ever mystery shopped TV products in Currys or Comet? When I tried asking questions about Connected TVs a couple of years ago only about 1 of the 5 I tried did a good job.
Surprised it was that high.
That's not what it was, that product was what became SeeSaw which crashed and burned.
You also seem to be having some issues understanding the role the device makers play, YouView provide all the code other than the device drivers. The makers don't have to support any players, just the YV core software on a box built to a given spec.
The features are all decided and rilled out by YouView via software updates.
>> Firstly fair trading rules at least for the BBC will have to say that you can get iPlayer on Youview, Games Consoles, Connected TVs, Freeview HD devices, iPads, iPhones, Android phones, Android tablets, and PCs....
Indeed they will, which is why I specifically referred to "hree commercial terrestrial broadcasters" - i.e. not the BBC.
>> This may not apply to the others but they don't give much promotional airtime away for free so Youview would probably have to pay for adverts
There's a difference, this is a product designed to ensure the broadcasters retain control over their content's distribution not merely to enable its reception. It's in their interests for this to sell more than Smart TVs and other competing devices.
>> assuming it is worth the £100M spent on it
That was £70m between 7 equal shareholders including two ISPs using it as their next-gen TV boxes. including one who has some major football rights to milk for cash and who has already said they'll be offering some exclusive goodies only on their platform.
>> OR having nice friendly people to show you how it works and what you can do with it in every shopping mall in the land
I've never seen a shopping centre Sky demo which had a live working box.
>> There won't be a team of sales people demonstrating attractive content in the aisle of every shopping mall in the land (like Sky has). It will be a box on the shelf in Currys next to all the other black boxes from Humax and Topfield.
No, instead there'll be three commercial terrestrial broadcasters advertising it, SKy's NOW TV platform listing it as a place to receive the service, at least two major ISPs pushing it and a stream of other content providers (I know some but can't say) pushing their availability on it.
Overall that's probably a bit better than a pushy bloke disrupting your trip to Waitrose.
>> As the lad in the t-shirt told me instore 'We havent sold our operating systems for years'.
One of you is mistaken. Apple sold Snow Leopard on CD from their retail stores, Lion was the first to be available as a download and even then a US key drive was available.
>> When I asked how do I get to Snow Leopard? I was told... Go get it on eBay.
Apple offered all MobileMe users a free Snow Leopard CD a couple of months ago to ease their migration to iCloud - maybe worth rechecking your mailbox to see if you can snag a copy? Also the Genius bar are generally quite good at helping people upgrade if they're going to buy the latest version, indeed customers can even ask the store to do the upgrade if they lack a sufficiently fast broadband connection.
>> You have seen the YouView channel list right?
Yes, it's Freeview with added IPTV content in the shape of Sky's NOW TV plus other, to be announced but I know who some are, content providers. Given Freeview is the biggest of the UK's TV platforms it's a little odd you think the channel list will hamper YV's take-up.
The box is £50 more than a decent Freeview only PVR, why would people buy yesterday's technology when a tiny amount more will get them tomorrow's?
Rest assured, Sky aren't bringing their movies, sports and entertainment channels (unlike VM, YV is getting Sky Atlantic content via NOW TV) to the platform because they think it'll flop.
I think YouView will be more popular.
It's a free choice (as in there are other recording options available) and the ability to access Sky content on a per film or TV series basis will be a massive driver in home which previously eschewed subs-based pay TV.
The fact you can buy a simple & single box and move it between BT and TalkTalk (the launch ISP partners) without having another box installed or to learn will also make it popular.
And while YV may have removed apps, it launches with a working EPG (TiVo didn't, the data was dire on launch) YV are masters of their own software updates unlike VM.
In any event, Ofcom have shown that the majority of Smart TVs are used for catch-up services move all else and YV is built around catch-up and cost star less than a Smart TV.
When it sells and then outsells TiVo I'll let you pop back and doff your cap at me :-)
by removing the V+HD from sale, forcing anyone new VM customers who wanted to record TV to take a box that still lacks a number of basic features.
It's going to get its arse kicked by YouView which most of the offers same headline features but works with any ISP, & will offer content (at a cost) from Sky Atlantic and Sky Movies. Whereas Sky have content to flog on YV, Virgin will have to watch while the new boy eats their lunch.
>> I'd imagine that a lot of consumers buying this will just think that Apple == Best, irrespective of the details. <<
Those consumers, as indeed all consumers, should check such assumptions before parting with their money. I choose to by Apple because I like the look, feel and build of their devices. I also prefer Mac OS X to Windows.
People should always buy what's best for them and look beyond the hype when making any purchase.
>> It stuns me that this barely revised MBP machine is actually the cheapest laptop Apple UK sell at 999 quid! <<
It's not. The 11" MacBook Air is the cheapest at £849. http://store.apple.com/uk/browse/home/shop_mac/family/macbook_air
>> Am I the only one worried about taking a grand's worth of kit outside the house...ever? <<
That's what insurance is for. My hone contents policy covers me for accidental damage and theft for any item up to £3k when taken outside the home.
>> I know I'd rather have 3 of those Samsungs than one MBP any day of the week <<
Brilliant. No-one's going to tell you can't have three, four or even five of them if you want. Some of us prefer something that's a little shinnier that that and as it's our money there's no real harm being down to anyone in us indulging ourselves.
"Sky said yesterday that it's bringing its pay-per-view movies (called Now TV) and possibly sports to YouView"
No, Sky said very clearly
" Sky Movies will be available from launch and the service will later expand to offer sport and entertainment."
Not "possibly sports", DEFINITELY sports AND entertainment.
http://corporate.sky.com/investors/press_releases/2012/now_tv_to_be_available_on_youview
>> Get over it, its noting serious, nothing to worry about... How about getting on with something important, like 4g auctions, or the use of the term unlimited in contracts.
Well 4G auctions are OFCOM's work and the use of the term unlimited in contracts is an issue for the ASA.
Why do you imagine either wants the help of the Information Commissioner's Office?
They sold ebooks below cost prompting a move to publishers setting prices, how was that a good thing?
Unless you're referring to all those 99p self-published cack tittles which make up their bestseller list while other platforms such as Nook and IBooks have bestseller lists made up of proper books sold at high prices?
It would be good if another company (ie not Apple) made genuinely well selling tablet and Amazon's content deals could make it them but as they never release sales figures we'll never know.
...why not leave the older versions installed? Most Apple software - for example iWork &iLife - will happily sit alongside older versions of itself.
Maybe these 'Pros' don't realise there's no need to uninstall/overwrite their existing software just in case they need to go back to an older project?
Moving from local storage of important data to clod-based access is a non-starter for many. What happens if that document you have to submit is exiled on the cloud because you're web connection is down?
Apple's approach - and it's not a unique one, my Orange SPV backed up PIM data to a cloud - is more likely to gain traction with the masses than Google's 'you really can trust us to look after your confidentials' one.
Actually it's just obsolescence, the original iPhone and the 3G ran like pigs aftter one of the more recent iOS updates. Not forcing this update on them is an act of mercy,
Not quite the same as having handsets shipping with differing versions and being left out of updates until cellcos add their crud.
> It also makes the handing over of ID information an "option" for subscribers, meaning publishers face being cut-off from knowing who their readers actually are <
BLOODY APPLE, treating my data like it's mine and respecting my privacy rather than just handing it over to a publisher to spam me.
How dare they?!
Seriously, constantly amazed how many people lump the requirement that users agree to the data transfer in their list of anti-Apple gripes.
To install anything on a Mac you have to choose to start the installation running and type in a password. Then, the first time you run the software Mac OS warns you it was a file downloaded from a website and asks you to confirm you want to run it.
You'd have to be pretty dense to accidentally do all.
...Android is often GIVEN AWAY and that matters in this discussions.
A customer with a dumb phones goes into the store for their upgrade, sees less dumb phones then when they took out/renewed their contract 2 years ago and leaves with a cheap or free Android.
Is that a bad thing? Absolutely not. But a lot of people 'just get' a phone which happens to run Android, they're not all making a conscious decision to purchase one.
In contrast, if you stump up £200 to O2 for your iPhone 4 you're more likely to be spending money on apps and content then if you got given a free Android phone when you popped into Carphone Warehouse.
Of course in a pure numbers game that doesn't matter but if we're looking at the profitability or desirability of a platform - which are the only basis on which market share really matter - it does need to be factored into.
...because many of the people who slam Apple's tight control will no doubt try having it both ways by bashing them for allowing this app through.
If this were Android marketplace - apparently the 'better', 'freer' model - those unhappy about this app wouldn't have a snowball's chance of getting it removed.
Apple's forum rules are upheld pretty tightly, I get told off weekly for being 'harsh' in my posts.
In their defence, the forums are there as a user-user help resource and posting feedback aimed at Apple, polls or speculation/wider discussion about any Apple policy of unreleased product is strictly off-topic.
That's all made clear when we sign up. Doesn't make it less annoying when you get their email template in your inbox though!
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