@Dodgy Dave, AC(26th August 2009 20:23 GMT), deegee
FSF don't get it #
>" Those who run Fortune 500 companies really don't care about 'how it works inside', any more >than they care how their office lifts function." They just want to know there's someone they can >call when it goes wrong who'll fix it for them. That's why they're CEOs and not lift engineers."
If you're lifts need to be replaced every couple of years, because the current 'version' stops working (not because the lifts are not ok anymore, but because the vendor decided to make them stop working past a certain date, then I'd bet they would be very interested in having a lift vendor that doesn't place those restrictions on lifts.
It's not a matter of 'knowing' how it works, it's about business continuity and saving money so the business can make more profit. That's usually something CEOs are interested in.
>" They don't care about lock-in and 'antifeatures', or questionable behaviour over intellectual >property, because they're Big Business who do absolutely the same to their customers."
Any company really interested in business continuity, shouldn't place all its eggs in one basket. Placing vital infrastructure in the hands of only one vendor is asking for trouble. Doing business with companies that have dubious business ethics is another thing that's not good for (regular) businesses. In this case the business with the dubious business ethics is a multi-billion dollar company.
BTW this doesn't mean that companies should completely NOT use MS, only that real competition is good for the market, which is something lacking at the moment, due to MS having a monopoly.
Oh God not that lot again. #
>" Their (FSF) definition of 'free software' is completely rediculous. Basically you can change for >your free software, but then the person you sell it to can then give it to as many people as they >like free of charge thus neatly putting the people developing the software out of business."
Yes, that is really ridiculous, just imagine Red Hat and Novell giving all their free software away for no money at all.
Please get a clue. The F in FOSS is for free as in 'freedom' (of use) not free as in gratis/no money.
>" Full time developers working on free software can only really secure their jobs in one of four >ways:"
> 1) Find a big sponsor that uses your product and pays for its development.
What? You mean a sponsor like IBM, Redhat, Novell or SUN/Oracle? Yes, must be tough for all those developers working for free (as in no money) for big fortune 500 companies.
> 2) Rely on donations.
Yes, mostly from large companies who have a stake in Open Source software. Usually they're not called 'donations', but 'wages' though.
> 3) Make the software so complicated, unintuitive or poorly documented that people (or more >often companies where time is money) have to pay for overpriced support and training.
Something that would NEVER happen with proprietary software, I am sure.
> 4) Support your product with advertising.
I think you're confusing open source software with your regular email updates on where to buy the cheapest cyalis. Don't recall ever seeing spam come from any open source project, so please don't spread bullshit.
> No lets contrast this with the traditional approach:
> Everyone that wants to use the software pays the same, or pays an amount appropriate for >the features of that product they want to use.
Unlike open source software, where you get all the features for the same price (which is usually also free (as in gratis)). Yes, paying money for software, then paying more money for extra features is so much more appealing to me. Hang on, let me whip out my creditcard...
> Now that seems much more fair, and keeps lots of people employed too. Double win! >Furthermore with everyone willing to pay some money you should be able to get some decent >competition going too.
Yes, because all those open sauce developers are not earning anything people, just as the companies employing those same developers. Buy some software save a developer. Better yet, buy your software from a convicted monopolist to get better competition.
Any more FUD you'd like to share?
This type of idiocy will only push corporations away #
> @COG +1
> Linux has a LONG way to go before it can ever "Replace [ing] all your desktop systems with >GNU/Linux".
> Sorry to the Linux crowd, but Windows and OSX are years ahead, especially in usability. You
> won't get any mass exodus from Windows/OSX until you provide a comparable platform.
You really haven't been using any linux distribution the last few years have you? Although Ubuntu linux is far from perfect, working with Ubuntu on my desktop is a relief compared with running windows XP. Things actually work all the time and I can configure my desktop the way *I* want to configure my desktop, not the way MS thinks I should have my desktop configured.
> The only people that I recommend Linux distros to are home desktop "enthusiasts" who want >to do nothing but surf, email, run OpenOffice and GiMP. There literally is nothing else you can do >with it other than specialized educational/gov stuff or web/file servers, and most corporate >desktops do not fit into those categories.
The major part of regular users fall into that category; you must be recommending Linux quite often then. Literally can't do anything else with linux? Like developing in any of the non-MS specific languages, running multiple guest OS-es in a VM, playing games, running Windows applications (like photoshop? Yes, that's literally NOTHING.
> And for corporate desktops OO is NOT MSO and doesn't even compare.
Indeed the completely predictable behaviour of text formatting in OO Writer completely blows MSO's Word endless format tweaking out of the water, as does the ability to export my documents in PDF format without having to pay extra money. As for the price, wow, zero dollars for OO compared to $$ for MSO, whose older file formats don't even open properly in newer versions. I am so with you on that, it really doesn't compare.
> Linux devs needs to get their head out of the GNU and actually create some desired >applications if they wish to increase their share. Sending around letters like the FSF did is just >really lame.
Yes, linux devs should listen to you and develop what YOU want. Not what they find useful. Sending letters around is a bit lame, yes, but nothing MS wouldn't (and didn't stoop to) and might be one of the few methods available to get someone's attention at board room level (even if it's dismissed outright). Not a lot of alternatives for that amount of money.
> "Investing in Microsoft's Windows 7 will only get you more stuck and more dependent on >them..."
> And Ubuntu for example would be different how?...
Are you dense, or just trolling. Which bit of OPEN SOURCE do you NOT understand. Software running on your RedHat desktop will run fine on your Novell OpenSuse desktop or your Gentoo desktop. Still not clear what's meant or do you need a Powerpoint presentation to explain further?
> "... Linux doesn't tie you into the Microsoft treadmill because the raw code is openly available
> so that you or third parties can keep systems going and not rely on one company."
> Yeah, and I know lots of IT people who have nothing but free time to modify/compile custom >code all of the time. :-/
Yes, because you need to modify and compile FOSS all the time before it's usable. Wish someone would package all that software together in something called a distribution.... o wait... someone's already gone out a done that. GIT.
> This is so totally stupid I just can't fathom it. "We be hackerz., so should u..."
This is so totally stupid and I actually can fathom it. "We be morons and spreaders of FUD, join us and be a mindless FUD regurgitating GIT like us".
> Most corporations are not going to hire a $100k+/yr programmer on-staff. Time is money,
> it's way cheaper to invest in Windows than to spend days hacking linux code.
Depending on which type of $, but in US$, average wage for programmers is around 80k (just in case, that's 80,000 (US)dollars). And as a user of FOSS, a company doesn't have to hire programmers, they just need to purchase a support contract from a vendor who supports FOSS, like say, RedHat, IBM, Novell or SUN. Just like... proprietary software, only without the forced upgrade every couple of years.
You make such eloquent and educated statements that am just completely blown away by your intellect. Kudos to you Steve, next time please don't try to feel too bad if you didn't get a letter and the other 499 other CEOs did, it's nothing personal.