Reply to post: @P. Lee

@P. Lee

"The problem is that government has become quite intrusive and is forcing people to do things they disagree with. It would be bizarre for the Labour party to be forced hire UKIP members or the British Atheist Society forced to hire ISIS members as secretaries and receptionists just because they aren't spokesmen or policy makers, but that is just what is happening for religious groups."

I think you'll find that my feelings on this subject are as yet rather undefined. I can see both sides of the argument, and think that we have not yet found the right compromise as a society. I don't think you should be able to fire someone because they're gay. But I also don't think you should have to have a minimum quota of gay people on staff. This is a really complex issue.

"Do you want to set up a B&B for people with like beliefs to come and stay with you? That's banned. "

See, it's not, here. If I operated a B&B I couldn't ban people who had different beliefs for staying there - the service must be available to all - but there's nothing preventing me from advertising exclusively to those who share my beliefs.

"Want to put biblical text up in your obviously christian-themed cafe? The police will shut you down. Neither of those things damage the public, but some lobby groups have pushed hard to try to eradicate all opposition to their beliefs from the public arena. They are the intolerant ones."

Yep, that sounds pretty dickish. Is that really a law there? That's pretty crap. I presume pictures of the flying spaghetti monster are also banned? I would hope so. Equality for all, not just for some!

"I shouldn't be allowed to discriminate based on what you are. I should be able to discriminate based on your beliefs and actions."

And here we'll vehemently disagree. I don't believe you should be able to discriminate based on belief. Only on actions. What a person believes is not your purview, nor the governments. This is the basis of human rights. You don't get to treat me differently because of what I believe, only only I behave.

Honestly, i can't even begin to understand what rationale or logic you could use to justify discrimination based on belief. You don't have to be friends or go out for beers with people who believe something in opposition to you, but you do have to treat them with all the same legal rights and privileges as everyone else.

"The so-called "centre" of politics isn't about moderation, its about not being associated with any given course of action which might be unpopular in the future. "

Again, I have to disagree. I'm largely a centrist. I absolutely have strongly held beliefs and they focus on pragmatism and finding the best solution for society as a whole. Usually that involves negotiation, compromise, and working with the extremes to forge a future everyone can live with.

The ideal most important to he centrist is that of unity. The concept that we're all stuck together and we have to learn to live with one another. That we won't convert everyone else to our way of thinking and that killing people who disagree with us is a dick move. As a Canadian, this is easier for me than for someone from another nation: multiculturalism works here. We have a unique culture that is founded on our ability to find a happy medium, seek compromise and recognize the value of different belief systems. So being a centrist is pretty natural for us.

Where it goes wrong - where it always goes wrong - is the belief that your particular ideology needs to "win". That the end goal is the eradication of other beliefs, or at least the subjugation of those who believe differently.

But at least you admit that you want to discriminate against people based on their beliefs. I can respect that, even if I believe that it is a dangerous and foolhardy approach to building a society. So, kudos for that.