Google and Microsoft bombard Brussels over ad tracking

Google, Microsoft and other special interests are subjecting the European Commission to the most intense lobbying campaign it has ever faced, over regulation of how data is used to target advertising online, according to officials in Brussels. Commissioner Meglena Kuneva announced in March that her department would investigate …

[Anonymous Coward]

That there is a lot of shouting might suggest...

There is something to investigate. However, equally, if nobody had said anything on such a controversial topic that might mean it was expected and the industries potentiall most affected have already put in place the escape route.

I'm not normally a fan of regulation of FOI but I can't concieve of were unfettered market driven intrusion and tracking might take us. That it will have to be done by some feckless, ignorant, halfwitted jobsworth in Brussels also gives me the hebejebees

[MinionZero]

Their full goal as usual hidden behind a Public Relations smoke screen ...

Instead of calling it PR friendly things like "target advertising" and "ad tracking" etc... lets all call it what it really is, which is spying and then ask the whole population if they wish to be spied on continuously.

But clearly these companies wouldn't want it called spying, because that shows their true attitude of utter contempt towards everyone else. They spy on everyone for their own gain.

Edward Bernays (and other early pioneers like him) have a lot to answer for. Not just for re-branding Propaganda as Public Relations to make it sound better and more friendly, but also for helping to push forward the whole idea of using Propaganda and Psychology to manipulate large groups of people for business goals. Because that is where we are now and its getting ever more insidious as technology improves.

Its very unfortunate more people don't realise the scale of lying and manipulation even back in Edward Bernays's time and its getting ever worse. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays

[Andraž 'ruskie' Levstik]

Make it opt-in required

And I have no problem. But then I already DNS block so much that it would be a tad hard to actually get anything about me from anywhere. Coupled with tor and suddenly nobody has a clue who I am even if they might have known before.

[The BigYin]

More than just laws

Pass as many laws as you like, nothing will change.

Look at the barrage of spam we suffer. Does anyone do anything about it? Do they cock. Why don't ISP block the rogue machines? Why aren't lax ISPs blocked? The answer is simple - you ruin an ISPs business until they either go bust or shape-up. It's not hard.

Why does the industry drag its heels? Surely verifying the sender and the system they are using is possible. Why not do this and only accept/send mail that passes these checks?

Why do PCs default "all ports open, please rape me" rather than the much more secure "total lock-down"?

And just what is this hard-on for tracking that everyone has? The government wants to track and vet every facet of my life, now MS and Google (the two great evils) too? Feck off! Luckily I know enough to block their shite, but it won't be long before bending over and accepting the shafting will become mandatory.

The internet used to be an open way to communicate and share, it is slowly becoming one of the greatest threats to our basic liberties.

[Anonymous Coward]

No-one asking me..

Which is the problem with lobbying, it can only be done by large companies with large pockets and plenty of time to research who and what to lobby. The fact that they are making a big thing about it and making big that we are not clamoring to be heard is a nonsense.

It is time for Google and MS to be regulated some more, how much money has gone to these two fairly small groups of people from just about everyone else..

[TeeCee]

Ah, the death of Web 2.0

I can't see much Web 2.0ness going on if the EU turns off the targetted advertising money tap......

[MinionZero]

Yet another example of all lobbying is legalized corruption

The more I think about this news the more angry it makes me. I've said before, governments are voted in by the *people* not by corporations and this news shows yet again its the corporations that are getting the say, not the people. Our government *representatives* are suppose to represent the best interests of the *people*, not what is in the best interests of a few powerful corporations, often at the expense of the people.

We are not the slaves of the corporations yet they keep acting like the hidden puppet masters of the governments. But then its in the best interests of the big companies to have friends in politics to help them and its in the best interests of politicians to have friends in big business to help them get high paid jobs once they leave politics. Money and power working together as usual.

So yet again, the lobbyists actions make democracy look just like a PR smoke screen to placate the masses into thinking they are being served when its actually the goals of the rich and powerful who are really being served, often at the expense of the people.

Political campaigns need to be advertised as much as any product, so its no wonder governments are not rushing to silence all advertiser spying. So allowing any companies to get away with this push towards ever more spying is a very dangerous long term move. Politicians and big businesses are the people in power and just because the politicians say they have our best interests at heart, they keep showing they have themselves and their rich friends interest at heart. So as technology keeps improving the more the people in power are going to get ever more power over us all and so we keep loosing ever more freedom as they gain more power over us. Yet history has shown time and time again, the dangers of ever more totalitarian rule yet all around the world, people are rushing yet again into the same nightmare, only this time it'll be a global scale totalitarian rule.

It seems whatever political system the world comes up with, we always end up with the rich and powerful climbing to the top to rule over us all, ultimately for their own gain at the expense of everyone they rule over. Democracy was a move to attempt to limit the excesses of the far left and far right governments, which in the end, all end up behaving the same with extreme lack of empathy over all their slave like minions. Yet all governments regardless of which stated ideology they follow, all ultimately end up being about a hierarchy of powerful people forming within them, all seeking the personal gain from having such power over others. Now democracies are maturing into yet again just another way the rich and powerful can gain the power to control the powerless masses ultimately for their own gain. So as usual the vast majority of the human race suffers, just so the minority of rich and powerful people can live the high life.

So there's no way they will wipe out all this spying. The people in money and power all personally gain from keep on spying on everyone else so they won't stop no matter how hard their PR people I'm sure, will try to cover up how bad it really is. So it'll be yet more lies and half truths to placate the masses into thinking something has been done, yet quietly it'll just get ever worse spying and control over us all.

[JohnG]

EU answers to the US?

Self-regulation: as it was applied in the financial/banking sector? Yeah, that went well.

Why should US companies be dictating the nature of EU legislation? It's bad enough having comissioners appointed for life - it's even worse if they are directed from the USA. Google, MS and the rest should be TTFO, at least until the taxpayers/electorate have first had some opportunity to express their views on the subject. If the yanks are happy to allow their government to be run by their corporations, that's their business but I see no reason why the same US corporations should have any influence here.

[Jimmy 1]

Fecking twockers

@ MinionZero

Yes, you can be brutally honest and call it spying or surveillance as opposed to the euphemistic bullshit churned out by these parasites. On the other hand you could really indulge yourself and call it by its real name, Data Theft. That would be theft as in "taking without the owners consent" which is what car thieves are charged with when they get nicked.

The present government's cosy relationship with the digital twockers is a conspiracy of thieves in which Captain Brown puts a telescope to his glass eye and proudly proclaims "I see no ships!"

.

[RW]

Another example of a fundamental rule of business

If someone is making money, no matter how, it's immoral to impede him. Especially if a large corporation is involved.

And to throw a crumb to those liking anti-business adages:

The operative word in "small business" is *small*. Small goals, small morals, small profits, small minds. Small everything.

[Anonymous Coward]

Edward Bernays

As MinionZero says, Edward Bernays was the point between when adverts made people aware of products that are available, and convincing people they want such-and-such product whether they need it or not.

There is an excellent documentary by Adam Curtis called The Century of the Self that explains much about propaganda, advertising, and how politicians have now taken up the same methods to gain power. Funnily enough I don't think this gets repeated on TV very often , but highlight the below text, r-click on it, and search for it:

"Adam Curtis" "The Century of the Self" torrent

[dephormation.org.uk]

Loophole? What loophole?

There's no loophole.

What BT did in 2006, 2007, and 2008 was obviously criminal, unethical, immoral, and simply wrong.

BT/Phorm Directors should be in jail.

The same way that Stanford, and Liddell were given suspended sentences and fined in 2005.

The same way that Goodman and Mulcaire were jailed in 2007.

The same way corrupt officers involved in the Operation Barbatus case were jailed.

[Anonymous Coward]

greed is the mind killer

Know nothing about you: - advert: £1

Know something about you: - advert: £5

Know everything about you: - advert: £10

Why regulate capitalism, what could possibly go wrong?

[Gannon (J.) Dick]

Lesson #1

A similar lobbying frenzy is expected on Capitol Hill, where Congressman last week signalled they don't believe self-regulation will be adequate to protect consumers from tracking by online commercial interests.

For the Brits: Lobbying is using somebody else's finger to signal approval of self-regulation.

[Anonymous Coward]

Ding-a-ling?

Of course they will.

Where there is a numpty in charge and consequence extending to millions of euros what do you expect efficient organisations to do?

[Malcom Ryder 1]

Who pays attention to internet ads?

Let Google and MS track me and my web habits all they want. Let them know how I spend every penny. After they have compiled their data and presented it to the merchants of the world, who can then cross reference and analyze it. Once the merchants of the world realize I don't pay attention to internet ads Google and MS can finally go broke.