Is it a drone? Is it a balloon? Whatever it is the US warns locals not to let them fly in Iran Uncle Sam issued a stern warning about the threat posed by Iran's development of unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) — and reminded American companies to "be vigilant" in not supplying components needed to build these bomb-dropping drones and spy balloons. In a joint advisory on Friday, the US Departments of Commerce, Justice, …
Iranians are also looking to buy accelerometers, gyroscopes, inertial measurement units (IMUs), and other navigational sensors, the warning says. Additionally, aircraft spark-ignition and compression-ignition internal combustion piston engines, associated spare parts, and modules such as flight computers, are in high demand.
A while back, I was curious about this stuff, so did a little research. In which I learned there are a lot of nifty integrated modules that can include pretty much all that in one convenient package. So GPS, IMU, gyro, PIDs and flight computer. All available for often <$100.
Snag is pretty much all of those were made in China..
Other snag was YT is now convinced I'm actually interested in RC stuff, so now 'recommends' me a whole bunch of content I'm not interested in. And I guess if I expressed an interest in how to make my own drone, I'd maybe end up on more watchlists.
A few years ago I was working with a young programmer, someone who was Iranian but had fled the country (I'd guess to avoid military service but who knows?). He got into building quadcopters using open source components and software and using them as camera platforms. One day after showing us his latest video I asked him casually what the video was of. We all knew the scenery well -- Pacific Coast Highway where the Santa Monica Mountains meets the Oxnard plain. Very pretty. It also happens to be the location of the Navy's Pacific Missile Testing Range -- our young Iranian had unwittingly been taking aerial video of US military facilities. Harmless (you can see the same view on Google Earth) but try explaining that to the Men in Black....**
One of the biggest problems we face in the US is that our government is a decade or more behind the curve.
(**Yes, they really do look like that. We had one turn up asking about our next door neighbors some years ago. The couple next door both worked for the FBI so they got periodic checks on their home life -- propensity for wild, debauched parties, that sort of thing.)
Back when I was doing A-level chemistry, my Grandfather's old encyclopedia was very useful in giving us the instructions for making NI₃
Chemistry teacher was fortunately more amused than annoyed, but then again he had regaled us with stories from his time as a chemistry student.
When I was six or seven years old, my dad told me about pranks he and his college buddies would pull. One was to prepare a solution of NI3, put it into a pail, add sheets of notepaper to it, and smuggle it into a movie theatre, dropping the solution-soaked papers onto the floor behind them as they walked down the centre aisle.
By the time the movie was over, water in the solution had evaporated, leaving little crystals on the sheets, which people would walk over on their way out...
(in those "good" old days, people reacted with startlement and annoyance, rather than with mindless terror.)
you can also use it to paint a plazza near a business center by night, and see what happens the next day when unsuspecting office drones arrive...
(didn't work in UK for obvious reasons, perhaps now that summer temperatures go over 20°C it may be possible?)
"Back when I was doing A-level chemistry, my Grandfather's old encyclopedia was very useful in giving us the instructions for making NI₃
"
My chem teacher in school was a huge practical joker. I did a third year as independent study (only two year were offered formally). One of my project was to synthesize the ketone that gives buttered popcorn its odor. It was an involved process and I had to make most of the glassware as part of the project. One morning, the admin building/library reeked like a movie theatre. Had we done something noxious, steps would have been taken, but the smell of buttered popcorn just made everybody have the munchies. I asked about NI3 and was told if I ever made any I'd get a fail for the semester. The pranks we did were much better anyway. Far more subtle.
My chem teacher in school was a huge practical joker
Our A level lab tech's favourite phrase was "put a bit more in".. right up until overenthusiastic application of quantites of the stuff for thermite resulted in a large number of melted overhead ceiling tiles..
He was a bit more restrained after that.
One wonders if the old A-level chemistry and physics books are now considered contraband
I learned how to make touch powder from an old high-school chemistry textbook in the library.
I learned how to make dynamite and nitroglycerin from my dad's old high-school chemistry textbook.
Yes, libraries have taken those books off the shelves, and high school chem labs aren't allowed to have nitric acid (or even benzoyl peroxide)
high school chem labs aren't allowed to have nitric acid (or even benzoyl peroxide)
That is so sad. We used 6-molar nitric acid for an educational experiment which I don't recall, beyond my concern for following all the safety precautions so all my and my classmates' bodies remained un-dissolved and fully-intact.
At the same time, we didn't have any screwing around in those classes -- partly because because the screw-offs weren't interested in chemistry, and partly because the teachers could and did permanently ban any student who failed to follow proper safety procedures. (That happened in one of my electronics classes. I never before [nor since] had seen a 6'4"-tall person "levitated" off the floor, looking like a horizontal plank. Apparently, 300VDC can do that to you.)
Old-schoold rewards for being competent : access to the fun stuff. Todays one-size-fits-nobody education (outside of private schools) is joyless; is it any wonder nobody wants to do STEM subjects any longer than they have to?
Who wouldn't want to know what makes the world tick, and how things happen? Someone taught by bland text and multi-choice tests rather than by entertainment.
Brainiac is still good telly. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZZXmaBY_fU
Even better doing such shenanigans yourself (or at least in a classroom with a teacher). None of that now.
looks like in France using encrypted communication systems (you know, like https) is enough to label you as a terrorist...
« Tous les membres contactés adoptaient un comportement clandestin, avec une sécurité accrue des moyens de communications (applications cryptées, système d’exploitation Tails, protocole TOR permettant de naviguer de manière anonyme sur internet et wifi public). »
DGSI
« L’ensemble des membres de ce groupe se montraient particulièrement méfiants, ne communiquaient entre eux que par des applications cryptées, en particulier Signal, et procédaient au cryptage de leurs supports informatiques […]. »
Juge d’instruction
"All the members contacted adopted a clandestine behaviour, with increased use of secure means of communication (encrypted applications, Tails operating system, TOR protocol enabling anonymous surfing on the internet and public wifi)".
DGSI
"All the members of this group were particularly suspicious, only communicating with each other using encrypted applications, in particular Signal, and encrypting their computer media [...].
Investigating judge
"Ignition by John D Clark is a particular favourite; on the history of liquid rocket fuels."
I have a signed copy of Gary Sutton's "Rocket Propulsion Elements" sitting on a shelf not too far away from a book on RTG's. I also have several technical books on Russian spacecraft, in Russian, and lots of stuff from NASA. It used to be possible to get copies of mission summaries in hard copy from NASA and I buy them as I find them. I have all of the Mercury ones, nearly all of the Gemini and a good portion of the Apollo. Only a few of the Shuttle summaries were put out in the same format before they seem to have stopped publishing them at all.
Go study classic medical Gait Analysis, it's used accelerometers, gyroscopes, inertial measurement units (IMUs), and other navigational sensors ever since it was created to use devices like those about 70 years ago now. So we're going to ban things that can be used by people in other countries? Oh look they are breathing ... are we going to make that illegal too?
Banning "items" is only a very minor solution - the war in the Ukraine has created a considerable problem for Russia socially and economically ... it's much better effect to be saying Putin needs a high five in the face with a chair, than start firing nuclear missiles at everyone.
Why on earth would you search on YT for that kit? Never heard of a "search engine"?
Me, I just head for the local hobby-shop. All the parts (including "spark-ignition and compression-ignition internal combustion piston engines"[0]) are available right off the shelf, as is friendly knowledgeable sales staff to help put it all together. Yes, the electronics can be had for under a hundred bucks. A reliable motor, on the other hand, costs a trifle more.
This kind of thing is not exactly rocket surgery these days. Nor just a hobby for the wealthy or otherwise lifeless.
[0] Is that a way to say "gas engines"[1] in a way that's above the education level of most greens, in order to avoid one of those threads?
[1] Yes, I know, there are many kinds of fuel available for such tinkering. They are all CO2 producing hydrocarbons. The horror!
Why on earth would you search on YT for that kit?
I didn't..
Never heard of a "search engine"?
Never noticed that what you search for in a search engine, and not always Google, ends up somehow influencing your recommendations?
Me, I just head for the local hobby-shop. All the parts (including "spark-ignition and compression-ignition internal combustion piston engines"[0]) are available right off the shelf, as is friendly knowledgeable sales staff to help put it all together.
Aha, this could be an entrapment attempt! I also learned that the US, and probably many other nations have laws against arming drones. Like the FAA says "don't", and the NTSB could then prosecute you for illegal trasport of explosives with an aircraft for good measure. Biggest problem is that good'ol genie. Recent events have shown that drones are a more effective terror weapon than they may be a weapon, ie the attack on the Kremlin's flagpole. But drones have gotten a lot of publicity, and it's not the state-actors that we should be worrying about, but the assorted nutjobs trying to attach pressure cookers to DJIs.
We live in interesting times.
There was also a vid from Patrick Lancaster showing the work of a DPR drone-busting team, who said part of the drone wars is dealing with drones that have been modified to operate on non-standard frequencies, so I guess that knowledge is out there as well.
"Never noticed that what you search for in a search engine, and not always Google, ends up somehow influencing your recommendations?"
No. Might have something to do with how I route stuff ...
The so-called "Kremlin attack" was clearly a false flag operation. Nobody in their right mind would think that such a ploy would be useful in any way, shape or form. Total waste of time and materials.
For the record, I'm not transporting explosives. I'm transporting water and sandwiches for the yuppies who pay me to be allowed to prune my grapes.
"Recent events have shown that drones are a more effective terror weapon than they may be a weapon, ie the attack on the Kremlin's flagpole"
The Russian drone terror campaign on Ukraine would be far more representative of the last year, some did significant damage at Kiev and elsewhere.
Last year you were adamant that the Iranian drones were fake news, Russia would never acquire such things. How wrong/naive you were.
Last year you were adamant that the Iranian drones were fake news, Russia would never acquire such things. How wrong/naive you were.
Naive? Moi? I'm pretty sure I said Russia didn't need to buy Irainian drones. A nation that can build stuff like SU-57s would have no problem building it's own. Most of the key components it produces already, others it can buy-in from China, just as Ukraine's buying lots of Chinese DJI drones. Even if we continue to sanction Iran, they can just sell out of the factory being built in Russia to mass produce them, and as long as China's willing to supply both, or either party, and there's little we can do about it.
See also the upcoming BRICS(+) conference, where more nations are lining up to join that bloc..
I read "spark-ignition and compression-ignition internal combustion piston engines" as being Petrol (spark ignition) and Diesel (compression ignition) engines although would assume that the definition would also include methanol (gloplug) engines which are neither spark or true compression ignition
My SO is an amateur writer, and has often opined that her websearches have likely put her on some watch lists:
EMP generator, preferably easily portable
Typical activities for travelling British royalty
Datacenter security
etc
I don't think she did a search for ideas for her work-in-progress that involves one character kidnapping the SO of a (fictional) British royal; we simply discussed that one over dinner.
Followed the link in that sentence and found strange article: one that keeps saying that it found this that or the other academic paper, but there was not one single citation given in the article. If anything is easy to cite it is a published academic paper, there are published standard formats and whole databases set up to help you do so.
That's why UK universities shouldn't be publishing this stuff to foreigners.
If we had kept the invention of gravity a secret nobody else would have been able to throw a cricket ball accurately and we would be world champions
Unlike youse guys, I’ve actually *flown* a model quadcopter. Yes.
What seems peculiar to me is that we somehow look at these devices as threatening, as opposed to delicate apparatus always on the verge of falling out of the sky due to any single one of a countless set of minor catastrophes.
What I mean is, it’s quite an amazing miracle these things can get to a position where they pose any kind of a risk? When they are far, far more likely to wind up in a crumpled heap anywhere else?
Seems like a massive huge opportunity to develop & deploy “anti drone” solutions. And it really matters not how it works, any and all failure modes are equally successful (and rewardable).
Hyuge opportunity for the first one capable of “grabbing a brain”…
Quadcopters have no range and aren't involved. The war drones are custom built winged aircraft powered by a gasoline engine.
The custom parts and plans are what governments don't want moving across borders. If you got plans off the internet and parts from a hobby store, it wouldn't perform well enough.
Quadcopters have no range and aren't involved. The war drones are custom built winged aircraft powered by a gasoline engine.
They're both. There's plenty of footage of both sides using DJI drones for either surveillance, or modified to drop grenades. Plus some controversies around geofencing, or if techincal assistance has been provided to bypass manufacturer's software features to turn them into war drones.
The custom parts and plans are what governments don't want moving across borders. If you got plans off the internet and parts from a hobby store, it wouldn't perform well enough.
I think this is the concern, and the danger. There's plenty of information about how to build your own large model RC aircraft. There's a lot of neat gadgets like mini jet engines, or rotary engines that can give you speed, or range. There's a lot of modules that sit on standard CAN busses that can control and stabilise unconventional aircraft like flying chairs, or surfboards. Or just turn an RC aircraft into an autonomous one using GPS/INS guidance modules. Program your waypoints, and let it do it's thing. Hacksmith's YT channel did this where they built an autonomous drone security system to patrol their property that could RTB and land on a small charging pad. Problem is if they're no longer RC aircraft, there's nothing to jam, and if you can't lean on manufacturers to geo-fence, they can be programmed to fly anywhere.
So again we live in interesting times. Technology that was once the domain of the MIC selling multi-million dollar drones can now be replicated by hobbyists for fun, or not fun using components that can be bought from hobby shops or online. But this isn't a new problem, eg Israel's been dealing with a variety of home-brew RC and autonomous drones for years, as have prisons trying to stop stuff being delivered by air.
If China is on Russia's aide why is Ukraine allowed to use them ?
They're available, and they work I guess. I've read there's been pressure on DJI to disable Russian ones, but leave Ukrainian ones operational, but don't know how feasilble that would be. I also saw a vid where DPR and Ukrainian drone operators were duelling for control of a Mavic, and part of that game seems to be using tech to hijack each other's drones. Then add a $40 kit available on Amazon or Ebay, and start delivering packages.
I do wonder why we try for blanket bans on this stuff because they do have many uses. Just restrict what drones can be used for especially sensitive stuff, and call it good. I also wonder about the protectionism aspect, ie are there actually any competitive drones on the market that don't rely on Chinese core components? Like most of the sanctions, they'll harm us more than it harms China.
"ie are there actually any competitive drones on the market that don't rely on Chinese core components?"
Most electronics components are coming from China as first world countries make it harder for companies to make them anywhere else.
If you want to get really nerdy, you can buy each part of a drone individually and assemble it yourself without much fuss. I would suspect that doing it that way would mean that any built-in spyware would be useless. There's even open-source software, but that can be a right PIA to sort out if you don't have a background in 3D nav problems.
"But DJI drones are all controlled by Chinese spy agencies that's why our city council isn't allowed to buy them for inspecting work sites."
That speaks loads about the sort of people you have on the local council. I have a DJI drone and don't ever update it so it's not net connected. Even if it could rely data, I don't give it a chance. It also doesn't have a way to record data if I don't put a card in. My main concern is that the geo-fencing will be tightened if I update it and I'll have a hell of a time even though I get an authorization when required. I hold a FAA part 107 certification. The drone already puts up a nag box I have to check when I know for certain that I'm not someplace that requires advance notification.
Are any of the city work sites military/nuclear in nature? A certain amount of paranoia is a good survival trait, but.....
"Technology that was once the domain of the MIC selling multi-million dollar drones can now be replicated by hobbyists for fun, or not fun using components that can be bought from hobby shops or online."
When I was working on rockets, it was amazing how many components we used were coming from industrial supply companies such as McMaster-Carr. We also would buy spark coils from the local auto parts store. The spark driver PCB I designed used only a small number of off-the-shelf components. We had the boards made for a couple of bucks each in small quantities. The nav and control computers were PC-104 based stacks. The IMU was commonly available, but it's now very easy to get better, cheaper and small ones from all sorts of places. If you are good at writing Kalman filters, taking GPS (and it's cousins), IMU and radio station inputs to fix nav paths isn't super hard. It's not a skill I have in plentiful supply, but we had a few people at the company that could do that.
The really bespoke parts can be made locally and everything else is common as muck. If you want/need something that is mm accurate, you pay for that and need top-spec kit to do it. For far less, you can make something that's good for around 10m CEP and save enough to build a bunch of them.
The nav and control computers were PC-104 based stacks. The IMU was commonly available, but it's now very easy to get better, cheaper and small ones from all sorts of places. If you are good at writing Kalman filters, taking GPS (and it's cousins), IMU and radio station inputs to fix nav paths isn't super hard. It's not a skill I have in plentiful supply, but we had a few people at the company that could do that.
Yup. The modules I saw greatly simplify most of that stuff. I've also had some fun with a couple of PC games. One, From the Depths allows you to build all sorts of sailing, flying or submersibles. It's got defaults for controlling movement, weapons etc, but you can also use things like PIDs or custom modules. PIDs are fun for either smoothing motion, or making it more erratic and your vehicles harder to hit. See the infamous 'Flying Squirrel' for more info. You can also have Python scripts to program missile flight paths, or missile interceptors. The principles are equally applicable in the real-world. Another one I amuse myself with is Stationeers.. That's kind of an industrial automation survival sandbox, and comes complete with a MIPS implemenation for configuring and controlling devices. Plus some neat gas modelling, and they're due to add more phase-change simulation. So this will probably mean more explosions.
For arts grads at the Bbc, this stuff probably seems like magic, but technology's making it ever easier for hobbyists to do neat things for fun. Downside is people can also use the technology to do harm.
"Additionally, aircraft spark-ignition and compression-ignition internal combustion piston engines"
We all know "spark-ignition" means an ICE which uses spark plugs, but "compression-ignition" used to mean Diesel.
As far as I know, the last "successful" class of aircraft to use Diesel engines were Zeppelins, where the long range and safety considerations outweighed the power to weight ratio.
Does this mean Iran is making (gasp! [emotional baggage from multiple wars]) Zeppelin Drones?
If not, should someone (else?) _start_ making them?
[Next up: "Drone Fighters for taking down Drone Zeppelins"]
The little 0.049 cubic-inch engines used for our fly-via-control-cords (they could only circle around the flyer) had glow plugs powered by a physically-large-and-heavy 1.5-volt, high-current, "doorbell battery". Once you got the engine going, you no longer needed to power the glow plug. The fuel was bought pre-mixed from the hobby shop, and contained methanol, nitromethane, and gods-knows-what-else. The engine left a unique and unpleasant smell in the air.
"The little 0.049 cubic-inch engines used for our fly-via-control-cords (they could only circle around the flyer) had glow plugs powered by a physically-large-and-heavy 1.5-volt, high-current, "doorbell battery". "
I have a box someplace of what's left of those corded airplanes. I have no clue where to get the Cox fuel anymore. Hobby stores are nearly all gone around me and that fuel is something that would be too expensive to ship via common carrier. Now I'm wondering how much power could be extracted from one of those .049 engines.
Seems like an odd thing for a US government official to say. Surely if the Bad Guys™ are getting drones, that just provides more opportunities for Boeing/BAE/Lockheed etc. to sell anti-drone missiles or whatever. After all, enhancing shareholder value for 'defence' companies, is pretty much the raison d'etre of the US government right?
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