back to article Big Tech falls in line with Euro demands to fight bots, deepfakes, disinformation

Meta, Twitter, Google, Microsoft and other tech companies and publishers have agreed to fight disinformation online in accordance with the European Commission's latest Code of Practice rules, which were published on Thursday. The code [PDF] lists a broad set of commitments that signatories can choose to adhere to in the fight …

  1. tip pc Silver badge
    Unhappy

    Beware dragons

    but also when we see attacks on democracy more broadly. We now have very significant commitments to reduce the impact of disinformation online

    "Disinformation is a form of invasion of our digital space, with tangible impact on our daily lives…Spreading disinformation should not bring a single euro to anyone. To be credible, the new Code of Practice will be backed up by the DSA - including for heavy dissuasive sanctions. Very large platforms that repeatedly break the Code and do not carry out risk mitigation measures properly risk fines of up to 6 [per cent] of their global turnover," he said.

    The biggest issue here is who gets to define what is fact and what is not.

    A recent EU fake news was when the EU triggered article 16 of the Brexit deal because they thought cv19 vaccines where being sent from Republic of Ireland to Northern Ireland.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/ursula-von-der-leyen-mistakes-were-made-but-we-got-it-right-on-article-16/

    That turned out to be fake news yet they reacted quickly and unilaterally to enact draconian measure.

    Another classic tail would be when Bush decided he wanted to finish the job his daddy started and persuaded Blair that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. The UN looked many times and didn’t find any, so the US and UK invaded anyway and still didn’t find any wmd’s even after Sadaam was disposed and hundreds of thousands of Iraqi’s where killed.

    Millions of people marched in London to oppose the invasion yet it still went ahead.

    The UK and US governments issued the fake news.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction

    1. LogicGate Silver badge

      Re: Beware dragons

      "A recent EU fake news was when the EU triggered article 16 of the Brexit deal because they thought cv19 vaccines where being sent from Republic of Ireland to Northern Ireland."

      -To the best of my knowledge, the EU, while getting very close to doing so, did not actually trigger article 16.

      1. tip pc Silver badge

        Re: Beware dragons

        -To the best of my knowledge, the EU, while getting very close to doing so, did not actually trigger article 16.

        That right there is disinformation.

        The European Union did trigger article 16, notices went out, border officials received their instructions and the time it was to be enacted was published.

        These things cannot happen instantly, there is always a delay between announcement and enactment.

        Yes they decided not to actually enforce their measures but they put in place the mechanisms to do so & would have.

        It’s disingenuous to say they didn’t trigger article 16 because they clearly did.

        It’s accurate to say they backed out without enacting the measures and notified everyone they where not going through with it anymore.

        https://www.irishnews.com/news/healthcarenews/2021/01/29/news/eu-invokes-article-16-introducing-controls-on-vaccine-exports-to-northern-ireland-2203719/

        https://news.sky.com/story/what-is-article-16-and-why-did-the-eu-make-a-u-turn-after-triggering-it-12202915

        Id be glad to read proof that they did not trigger article 16 but all the articles, even from the EU, show they pulled the trigger on article 16 then retracted it at the last moment.

        Given all the media attention it got it’s interesting that you don’t remember that.

        1. codejunky Silver badge

          Re: Beware dragons

          Its a good job the UK and Ireland reminded the EU of the brexit negotiations as they had already forgotten how important the Irish border issue was.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Beware dragons

            Article 16 is not the only thing that gets triggered by the EU. Hmmm?

            1. Version 1.0 Silver badge
              Facepalm

              Re: Beware dragons

              So will Rees-Mogg's current plan to axe EU laws will result in the elimination of Article 16?

              All the arguments around the EU and Brexit in the UK seem to be just designed to keep politicians elected so I expect that bots, deepfakes, and disinformation will just keep going like they have all the time in the past. People who use them will not eliminate them will they?

        2. LogicGate Silver badge

          Re: Beware dragons

          Please note that I wrote "to the best of my knowledge".

          Before posting I checked with a number of sources, but wheras I found enough headlines indicating that the EU did trigger article 16, reading the articles themselves, it seemed rather ambiguous as to whether there was only a (stupid) declaration of triggering, or an actual going through with it. What seems clear is that there was no physical consequences at the border (vaccines withheld), but again, please correct me if I am wrong.

          I fully agree that this was not the best moment for the EU. At the same time, what lead up to it should also not bee seen as a great moment for the UK government either, although it appears to be sold as such nowadays.

          1. codejunky Silver badge

            Re: Beware dragons

            @LogicGate

            "I fully agree that this was not the best moment for the EU. At the same time, what lead up to it should also not bee seen as a great moment for the UK government either, although it appears to be sold as such nowadays."

            I have noticed when I comment on the vaccination events that the staunch remain perspective assumes that is how the UK govs actions are sold. Its no secret I think the EU acted abysmally with the situation and I only give credit to the UK gov for doing what they should have done when it comes to the vaccine (and criticizing much of what else they did). Yet responses are usually desperate to ignore fact and reality to try and rewrite history that the EU didnt do so bad a job or even more worrying portray a good job!

            It wasnt that the UK made some stunning success, it did what any competent countries did on that front (even member countries after the EU failure was vastly exposed). Generally I come across people who dont realise how badly the EU screwed up, but responses here tend toward the fanatic pretending the EU somehow performed satisfactory or above.

            1. LogicGate Silver badge

              Re: Beware dragons

              The sad thing is that the way I see it, the UK had made such a mess out of their covid response (open borders, untested elderlies back into care-homes etc), that had the UK been acting in coordination with the EU, a strong case could have been made for giving the UK priority access to the vaccine.

              I do not think that the EU made really big mistakes with their vaccine response. The way I understand the situation, they believed that they had negotiated good and differentiated deals with multiple suppliers.

              Some did not work out. The UK, playing on only one card, was very lucky that AZ did not fail. Due to the aforementioned debacle, they HAD to act more quickly than the rest of the world. the fact that the various issues with clotting etc had to be discovered in other countries COULD be taken as an indication that the UK to some degree kept it's head in the sand with regards to looking for potential issues. This did not help. Neither did various EU government's responses to finding out about this, but by then, things had gotten rather tense. Mistakes were obviously made on all sides. With more coordination, a lot of these could have been avoided. However, one side has turned rejection of coordination into a way of staying in power.

              1. codejunky Silver badge

                Re: Beware dragons

                @LogicGate

                "that had the UK been acting in coordination with the EU, a strong case could have been made for giving the UK priority access to the vaccine."

                Kinda irrelevant since the UK gave some of its vaccine to the EU (from the Netherlands) because the EU didnt have enough. The UK already had priority access as we bought and paid for it under UK contract law. That was one of the sticking points which caused the EU to try to justify theft.

                "The way I understand the situation, they believed that they had negotiated good and differentiated deals with multiple suppliers."

                They didnt understand their contracts to begin with. EU law ment similar contracts for the UK and EU gave the UK priority as established by the EU taking AZ to court. Also the French limited the amount of vaccine ordered based on how much was ordered from the French pharma company. As a result the EU actually turned down vaccine production. Also they were months late to order and when vaccine was delivered were woefully unprepared to distribute it.

                "The UK, playing on only one card, was very lucky that AZ did not fail."

                The UK didnt play on one card. The UK also ordered from the other companies globally including some that failed (e.g. the French vaccine). It wasnt luck that got the developed world (ex EU) vaccine, it was basic competence. Even though it was late the Germans ordered vaccine far more efficiently once the EU had failed so it was a failure at EU level.

                "However, one side has turned rejection of coordination into a way of staying in power."

                I dont see any way that the UK gov would have got it right if it wasnt for their desperation to keep with brexit voters. I have no doubt at all the UK would have joined the EU otherwise and we would have the same failures the UK made AND the EU vaccination failure. We got lucky.

    2. nobody who matters

      Re: Beware dragons

      ".....when Bush ....... persuaded Blair that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. ...the US and UK invaded.....Millions of people marched in London to oppose the invasion......"

      There was no precise registration or counting of numbers, but reports at the time put the numbers at 750 thousand to 1 million. Rather less than "millions"

      If you want to call out others for using misleading information, you really do need to ensure your own information is correct ;)

      1. tip pc Silver badge

        Re: Beware dragons

        There was no precise registration or counting of numbers, but reports at the time put the numbers at 750 thousand to 1 million. Rather less than "millions"

        If you want to call out others for using misleading information, you really do need to ensure your own information is correct ;)

        that does kind of illustrate my point about defining facts.

        We can dance on the head of the pin around the minutia detail but it is clear that a significant demonstration happened. At the time the government claimed a low number and the protesters a far higher number, footage at the time shows the numbers at the million mark end of the scale, I'd say north of 1 million.

        I assume your taking millions to be multiple millions like 2 or more millions, but in this context I think most people would understand that millions means more than 1 million so 1million and 10 people is a valid use case of millions.

        we can multiply 1e6 by a value more than 1 but less than 2 and have a multi of 1 million, would that number be a plural of million?

  2. elsergiovolador Silver badge

    It's okay when we do it

    If the EU really wanted to fight disinformation, they would push European educational institutions to teach people how to recognise propaganda, manipulation techniques, how to find and verify sources and so on and so forth.

    They obviously don't want to do that, because people would be able to spot their own disinformation coming from the EU, so instead they want to control the information and force 3rd parties to do it for them, so they don't have to pay.

    It's a nasty business they are developing, when you also take into account they want to read private messages etc.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: It's okay when we do it

      Education for things like that is the responsibility of the member states and not done at EU level.

      I can, however, say that an attempt is made to try to teach kids to see through "fake news", to not overuse their phones/screen time, to use social media wisely and other anti online bullying measures... at least in the EU country where I live.

      1. Cederic Silver badge

        Re: It's okay when we do it

        Laws on free speech and the Internet are the responsibility of the members states and not done at.. oh, wait, the EU are steaming on in trampling all over the member state rights.

        Again.

        I think education in the EU would be a wonderful thing.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: It's okay when we do it

          Cederic >I think education in the EU would be a wonderful thing.

          At least at a funding level. Paid for my degree and resulted in my 6-figure salary. Pity no one in the UK will every get that advantage again.

      2. elsergiovolador Silver badge

        Re: It's okay when we do it

        Restrictions on access to information do affect education.

        to see through "fake news", to not overuse their phones/screen time, to use social media wisely and other anti online bullying measures... at least in the EU country where I live.

        I saw some of these initiatives - they are usually carefully constructed so that disinformation coming from governments' own sources would not be spotted.

    2. Filippo Silver badge

      Re: It's okay when we do it

      I'm sorry, are you advocating for the EU to dictate school curricula? Because it doesn't do that, and if it did, I suspect you would not be supportive.

      1. Khaptain Silver badge

        Re: It's okay when we do it

        It think you missed the irony.. Nobody in the EU wants that..

      2. elsergiovolador Silver badge

        Re: It's okay when we do it

        Regulating access to information does affect education.

  3. Khaptain Silver badge

    The Ministry Of Truth

    Who is going to control the Governments Disinformation Services ?

  4. imanidiot Silver badge
    Unhappy

    A rose by any other name

    It walks like a duck, flies like a duck and quacks like a duck.

  5. AlgernonFlowers4
    Paris Hilton

    Guards! Guards!

    Quis custodiet custard?

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Ooh 6%

    The percentage that always seems to be divided by a hundred or thousand before a fine is levied. Click bait for proles.

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