I asked the manager of my usual punk/rock/metal bar why he looked so grumpy when his music of choice was supposed to make him joyous.
Trapped wind, apparently.
Science says death metal fans delightful and intelligent people, great at dinner parties
In a shocking turn of events, boffins have used the power of science to determine that, generally speaking, death metal fans don't actually want to rip off your head and shit down your neck. Exploring the emotional effects of music, the team from Macquarie University in Sydney, Oz, pitted the extreme metal subgenre against …
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Thursday 14th March 2019 08:47 GMT jake
Re: On the one hand
For some reason, when I'm coding in C and assembler my brain functions better if I've got mid to late '70s Punk playing not quite loud enough to annoy SWMBO enough to threaten to rip off my head & shit down my neck.
No, she's not a fan of Death Metal, but she'll put up with it. Thankfully, she hates sunshine pop ...
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Thursday 14th March 2019 10:28 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: On the one hand
"Go on, get that out of your head. :D"
Thanks ... now Everything is Awesome! (*)
(*) recently when googling for audio of this to annoy my 18 year-old son I came across an article about the writing of "Everything is Aweseome" where the song-writer was in the middle of a very messy divorce when he wrote it and far from being the happy upbeat song everyone thinks it is the lyrics were written to be deeply sarcastic!
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Friday 15th March 2019 21:15 GMT Michael Wojcik
Re: On the one hand
Given its context in the film, I'd think it would be relatively clear to viewers with a decent capacity for critical thought to realize "Everything is Awesome" is meant to be at least thoroughly tongue-in-cheek, if not entirely sarcastic.
I realize that likely escapes most younger viewers, but I'd hope many of the adults would recognize that as the straightforward interpretation.
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Friday 15th March 2019 10:54 GMT Ugotta B. Kiddingme
Re: On the one hand
"I'm a Barbie girl, in a Barbie world. Life in plastic, it's fantastic..."
"Go on, get that out of your head. :D"
Easy. All I need is A Little Piece of Heaven
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Thursday 14th March 2019 14:58 GMT BebopWeBop
Re: On the one hand
Yes and unbelievably it has dropped in quality something I did not think possible after the first few months of Sands taking editorship.
On a side note, Private Eye had a short piece noting the absence of coverage on the Today program regarding the charity commissions findings on the late unlamented 'Garden Bridge' project - beloved of Sands, Johnson and Lumley and few others. The suggested that of course it was nothing to do with her loud support for it while editor of a daily newspaper in a previous life and her role as editor.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 08:38 GMT jake
Observation.
"death metal fans don't actually want to rip off your head and shit down your neck."
This is true for many values of "your" ... but as we all know, there's one in every crowd.
As a side note, why do none of the "$THING is brainwashing our yoof" set go on and on about random acts of comedy after some kid binge-watches a weekend's worth of sitcoms?
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Thursday 14th March 2019 08:45 GMT msknight
Free Thinkers
Personally, I find people who listen outside the mainstream, are more likely to be independent free thinkers rather than sheep... and make good conversation at the dinner table... whereas sheep on the other hand, tend to be served up on said dinner table :-D ... statistically speaking, of course.
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Friday 15th March 2019 21:18 GMT Michael Wojcik
Re: Free Thinkers
I think you vastly are underestimating the number of people who get involved in <Insert subculture of choice here> solely to give them a better chance of getting into somebody else's underwear.
Particularly those who get into the subculture of wearing other people's underwear. Efficiency!
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Thursday 14th March 2019 15:06 GMT CrazyOldCatMan
Re: Free Thinkers
sheep on the other hand, tend to be served up on said dinner table
Not in my house they don't[1] - I can't stand the taste (or smell while cooking) of lamb.
T'missus, on the gripping hand, quite likes a well-cooked lamb shank - so we compromise. She buys a pre-cooked one from a reputable supermarket and heats it up while I cover the smell by eating curry. It's a win/win.
[1] Except in cat food. But I suspect that the proportion of sheel protein is quite low compared to a lamb joint..
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Thursday 14th March 2019 09:38 GMT GruntyMcPugh
@AC
Spot on, I'm a metal fan, and a mate of mine, also a metal fan, is an accountant for entertainment and media types (some names, but I won't drop them). In the 90s, he managed a few bands, and promoted events, and I crewed quite a few dance events, mostly tribal techno, and I bloody loved it.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 10:14 GMT Mooseman
I spent many Friday nights at a rock and metal club in my youth. Most of the clientele looked like they'd rip your head off and crap down your throat, but were the nicest guys ( and girls) you could meet. there was rarely any aggro, anyone causing problems was dealt with. The trendy nightclub round the corner had regular fights spilling out on to the road, police squad cars in attendance, punters lying in the gutters either passed out drunk or thumped.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 12:43 GMT Mog_X
Metal fans do tend to be well behaved, despite the perceived view. The main rule at a concert where a pit forms is 'if they fall down, pick them up'.
Also something a Tube employee said to our group when we were off to see Slayer at Brixton Academy a few years back - "there are 'band hoodies' and 'brand hoodies' - we never have problems with the former"
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Thursday 14th March 2019 08:53 GMT Steve Button
Musically...
I prefer the Pharell Williams song. That death metal is utter noise. Give me some Metallica, Led Zep, Queens of the Stone age, even Rammstein or Korn. But slide the scale up to Venom and Slayer and to my ears it's tuneless, artless, not very imaginitive, lyrically challenged, etc.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 09:14 GMT Dave 126
Re: Musically...
Josh Homme of Queens of the Stone Age and John Paul Jones of Led Zeppelin play in a band, Them Crooked Vultures, with Dave Grohl of Nirvana and Foo Fighters fame. Dave Grohl also has a death metal band called Probot - presumably because he loves it.
But yeah, I suspect my musical tastes are more in line with yours, but I've always found punks, rockers, death metallers et al to be friendly folk.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 09:52 GMT GruntyMcPugh
Re: Musically...
Venom and Slayer aren't really Death Metal,... Venom would be Black Metal, and Slayer Thrash Metal. Now, yes there are cross overs and it's all differents shades of Black. But 'Ride the Lightning' by Metallica could be considered an early 'Death Metal' album.
That Pharell song is drek, either way.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 11:54 GMT Kevin Lomax
Re: Musically...
Heck yeah! Or Watershed...or Blackwater Park...or Damnation...anything really!
Also I recommend angL by Ishahn if you want progressive black metal (i.e. has melody and intelligible lyrics!)
Once went to see David Lee Roth back in the 80s (OK that's hair metal rather than death metal) at Birmingham NEC. Had a chat to the security guys for the venue and asked "do you ever get trouble at the metal shows"?
Their answer - "nah, metal fans are just here for the music. We had a massive punch up last week at a Chris de Burgh show though..." !!!
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Friday 15th March 2019 06:50 GMT the Jim bloke
Re: Musically...
stylistically, I dont believe in death metal.. on the other hand BLACK metal - originally the satanic flavour of the art - is actually an extremely diverse and welcoming field. As long as you diss Christianity, you are part of the family, so all the original "wah-wah-we-love-beelzebub" crowd trying to get into some teenage chickies panties now have to share with pagan and world music, spiritual ambient,.. it's where prog rock went to hide.
.. or you could go by wikipedias definition, where black has higher pitched screaming versus death metal.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 17:24 GMT MrDamage
Re: Musically...
I can also recommend Ancient Bards.
Symphonic metal group from Italy, and they are telling the "Story of the Black Crystal Sword" over the course of their 4 albums. Only got the first 3 so far, picking up the 4th when I go into town in the coming weeks.
Sample: Through my Veins
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Thursday 14th March 2019 09:00 GMT pavel.petrman
Not surprising
My experience is that people who listen to gory metal (or are outright fans or even take active part in production thereof) usually listen to all sorts of other things and are generally more accepting and more open to new and different things and views. Whereas fans of sterile pop usually listen to sterile pop only.
I run into metal guys quite often in the theatre or opera, into pop people not quite so often. So those saying that violent music brainwashes you or makes you violent basically sound to me like telling opera or classical theatre might as well cause the same, which thought is of course utterly ridiculous to those who say violent music does it for certain.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 09:30 GMT tony2heads
Re: Not surprising
Which operas?
Maybe Don Giovanni where the dead (in the form of a statue) come to life and the anti-hero gets dragged off to hell by demons.
I also remember that some bands use the Dance of the Knights (alias Montagues and Capulets) from Prokofiev's opera Romeo and Juliet as walk-on music, so this metal+opera link seems real.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 11:14 GMT T. F. M. Reader
Re: Not surprising
Prokofiev's opera Romeo and Juliet
Mmm... <pedantic>That's a ballet, actually...</pedantic> But that does not invalidate the argument at all.
My go-to example of opera and other types of music mixed together is Verdi's Anvil Chorus (Coro di zingari in the original) from the 2nd act of Il trovatore that has been reused almost in every genre imaginable. From big band jazz (Glenn Miller) to Marx Brothers to Muppets to, indeed, metal. Hell, there was at least one metal band called Anvil Chorus, an album of this name, etc.
[DIsclaimer: I am not an expert on metal history although I listened to some of it way back then. I just googled "anvil chorus metal" and references popped up.]
More than once I heard or read criticism of this particular creation of Verdi's on the grounds that it is rather low brow because it resembles something popular, hence "plebeian", too much. Little do the critics know where that "low brow" music really comes from...
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Thursday 14th March 2019 14:03 GMT Rich 11
Re: Not surprising
There've been a number of times over the years when I've answered the questions on classical music in pub quizzes and the people around the table have looked at me in shock. My stock response is, "I know a look more Motorhead than Mozart, but that doesn't mean I'm pig-ignorant."
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Thursday 14th March 2019 19:22 GMT Chris G
Re: Not surprising
Speaking of Motorhead, my brother and I were.on the door at one of their first gigs in London at the Saxon Tavern the in the '70s.
Lemmy and the band were as nice as pie, the only trouble we had were fans who were so far out of it on barbs they kept falling down the stairs.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 20:29 GMT Rich 11
Re: Not surprising
Lucky for me that wasn't the club where I, um, acquired a souvenir stack of all 250 collected tickets from the box office after the gig, else I expect you and your brother would have kicked me into the middle of next week!
I think I swapped numbers 201-250 with a mate for one of Philthy's drumsticks, but after all this time I can't clearly remember.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 10:01 GMT GruntyMcPugh
Re: Not surprising
@Pavel.Petrman
I'm a metal fan, and I've been to the opera more times that I've been to football matches. IE, I've been to the opera several times, and football,.... never.
Back in the day, I used to know some of the guys from the band 'Sabbat', the lead singer, Martin Walkyier had opera singing lessons to improve and extend his range.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 15:19 GMT CrazyOldCatMan
Re: Context please.
Snivilisation
But, on the upside, people like me would have died before birth in a less medically-advanced world
(Rhesus incompatibiliy isn't fun - having to be born 6 weeks early by emergency c-section and given a whole blood replacement wasn't the best start. Mind you, that was 50+ years ago..)
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Thursday 14th March 2019 09:04 GMT Teiwaz
insane laughter...
When you hear death metal when not in the mood for it, it's merely a racket your brain refuses to process, contrarily when you hear a jaunty happy upbeat track when not in the right receptive mood, it's a smarmy get, rubbing your nose in the putrid excrement of your own lousy life.
If you are unfortunate enough to have said latter track stuck in your head, like the band, in all their smirky annoyingness have set up a studio in the spare bedroom of your mind and are on a constant repeat like a particularly tactless radio station well paid to make a single a hit.
At that point, you've no choice but to start imagining violent imagery. I've generally had good results from imagining gunning down the band members with a 30's style tommy gun, often puts a stop to musical repeats.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 12:52 GMT drawoC esuomynonA
Re: OMFG factually-accurate death metal references!
Manson isn't even that good.
I've seen both and Manson annoyed the hell out of me by announcing the title of every song before performing it, it's not like the audience haven't already heard them you annoying git! To be honest I was there for Rob Zombie anyway, who put on an amazing show.
Alice on the other hand... I've seen a lot of acts but I recently saw him with Hollywood Vampires (inc. Joe Perry and Johnny Depp) and I have never seen the rest of the band, stage etc so completely become merely background to the main artist - he owned that stage from the moment he walked on, not bad for a guy in his seventies.
People talk about "stage presence" - he has it in absolute abundance, if there was any way of converting it to electricity we could likely shut down every power station on the planet.
The strangest thing about all this? I'm not even a big Alice fan, only ever bought one of his albums back in the nineties.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 21:34 GMT FozzyBear
Re: OMFG factually-accurate death metal references!
Alice Coopers shows cannot be considered concerts. They are more akin to musical theatre. Yet that description pales in comparison to the performances.
I still remember an interview with Alice when he was asked about Mason. His response
The guy has a girls name, he puts on makeup, sings and has a theatrical show. Wonder where I've seen that before....
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Thursday 14th March 2019 09:26 GMT hammarbtyp
Its all an act
I live close to a site of major heavy rock festival. During the 4 days we often have festival goers pop into town for breakfast, beer (and quite often unfortunately wellies and new rain coats).
Generally they are really nice bunch of people, who cause far less trouble than the usual Friday night lot and are a pleasure to be around. However this is because the average heavy metal fan nowadays seems to be roughly 40-50, and are often here to take time off from their family responsibilities, relive their youth and let their hair down (those who have any left).
While initially intimidating, once you dig past the thin veneer of leather, chains, dog collars and offensive t-shirts, you find IT technicians, middle ranking managers, shoe salesmen etc. They are as likely to cause issues as you average COS play super villain is to blow up the universe.
(Disclaimer - I have no direct evidence on the behavior of Pharrell Williams fans, its just that generally most of the people who are happy all the time seem only one step away from either joining a cult or serious mental breakdown)
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Thursday 14th March 2019 09:54 GMT Big_Boomer
Carcass had the most disgusting song titles
Yes, I know, I've been told I'm "old school" but I've been a fan of Death Metal since way back in the late 80s when everyone else was into Hair Metal. Thrash is fun too, but Death is where the meat is :-) Nile make for a good "earworm" killer. No matter what pop twaddle gets in my head, a quick blast of "Rameses -God of War" soon sorts that out. For me the same holds for Bolt Throwers "World Eater".
There are A-holes in any group of people, but I reckon that Death metalloids get their anger out of their system vocally rather than physically :-) I know that every car that gets in front of mine gets treated to non stop descriptions of their drivers dubious ancestry and sexual deviations. Ya can't beat seeing the expression on someones face when in a traffic jam they pull alongside my Lexus limo-barge and look across at it's grey haired, overweight driver while he is singing along to Grave's "Into the Grave" and headbanging. <LOL>
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Thursday 14th March 2019 10:06 GMT E_Nigma
True in My Experience
A buddy of mine worked at a popular place which catered to various tastes, though mostly rock (from "folk rock" to proper metal and gothic stuff). His experience: the darker the music, more polite the people ("They actually say please!"). I've noticed the same thing, bug guys in black leather and spikes apologizing if they slightly bump into me, the crowd breaking up a mosh pit to search for someone's contact lens... :D. On mainstream events, stay the whole night and you will see at least one incident (a fight, a bottle thrown...).
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Thursday 14th March 2019 10:37 GMT Anonymous Coward
Not quite death metal but at the end of "Flight 666" (film of Iron Maiden's world tour) in the credits they listed various stats on the tour and one was a list of the numbers of drinks served on the flights - number 1 by some margin was tea, followed by Baileys - thats rock'n'roll for you!
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Thursday 14th March 2019 12:02 GMT Kevin Lomax
I remember some national newspaper doing a piece on Slipknot where they got hold of their backstage rider requirements - no doubt looking for something to justify some hysterical headline about metal being the devils work...3 live goats, some black candles and a couple of sacrificial virgins maybe.
Instead they got a list like "cold bottled water" and "organic natural yoghurts"!!
Shocking!
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Thursday 14th March 2019 15:32 GMT CrazyOldCatMan
number 1 by some margin was tea
The first time Genesis went to the US[1] on tour, the US tentacle of their record company hired a team of private investigators to follow them just in case they went a bit mental..
Final report: "nothing to report, two investigators have died of boredom, one on final life support"..
[1] Early 70s - the records companies were used to the behaviour of the early metal bands and wanted to make sure their liabilities were covered. PG apparently caused the most concern because he had an odd haircut..
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Thursday 14th March 2019 11:57 GMT Tom 7
I have an album by a band called Extreme Noise Terror.
If it has lyrics I've never understood them. But that's probably because I saw them live in what is best described as a concrete bunker with Hotblack Desiatio's PA in the room. They were nearly as loud as The Q-Tips who managed to solve the CO2 problem by making micro-diamonds from the air in the auditorium.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 13:20 GMT JimC
Unconvinced this is great science.
I dunno. I'm not sure how one would devise a good experiment for this, but I'm not sure that's the one.
Of course its only one person's experience, but in the 90s I stopped reading violent thrillers because I didn't like the effect it was having on me. I definitely felt that exposure to that material all the time was affecting my way of thinking with more aggression in my behaviour than I liked, although it never actually got physical.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 15:17 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: good science
Having read similar stories from decades ago I'm sure it isn't about science, truth or having a good experiment. It's another, repeating, Man bites Dog story we like to hear and read about. At least that's why I read it, don't judge a book by it's cover confirmation.
Which reminds me of an incident with Punks in London back in the day. For some it's just a fashion for others it's a lifestyle. Lifestyle stabbed fashion and people wondered what fashion expected.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 13:32 GMT Hans 1
That Swedisk music DIY kit act sound a lot like Napalm Death to my ears, but yeah, the lyrics are a bit, well, silly ... Phraell Williams, totally unbearable, ultra-repetitive, like a vinyl with a deep scratch.
Metal head, here, but not only, even like classical stuff (aka serious music) and/or alternative rock/pop/shoegaze ...and I am a psychopath, maybe it's the shoegaze or pop ? Naaa, must be Karajan, no Kempff, Kempff ...
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Thursday 14th March 2019 13:35 GMT Valerion
Metal = friendly
In my yoof I used to hang around a lot at the legendary Cartoon club in Croydon. Always full of rockers, metallers, big scary looking guys covered in tattoos and everyone getting hammered.
2 doors down was a "normal" club playing dance music. There were always fights outside and the police were pretty much guaranteed to be there every weekend.
But in the Cartoon there was never - ever - any trouble. Partly due to the self-policing attitude. If anyone did anything out of line, Animal the bouncer (I suspect not his real name...) would sling em' out as he was bigger (and nicer) than anyone else.
Happy days back then.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 13:53 GMT MJI
Metal
Brings back memories, never a thrash fan, but did like NWOBHM.
As to earworms, somebody at work commented that another colleague was paranoid.
Luckily I do like Black Sabbath.
Night clubs, the staff love metal nights as there is a lot less trouble, boring nights usually have shirt and trouser wearing tossers taking lumps out of each other.
And I have just discovered that I can fit in jeans again!
I knew a few bands then, no named ones, just local but decent local, but two of them were really good.
So my car CD changer is half full of bands who knew/know the owner of the car.
I could link to some but it would fully identify me.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 15:02 GMT imanidiot
My theory on the matter
The average metal fan recognizes he is not perfect and acknowledges he has rage inside him/her. Instead of denying those parts they let it out in non destructive ways. The "sunshine pop" listeners are all so busy being perfect and happy (and usually have their head far up their ass) they never realize they have issues, because if something happens the other guy must be an asshole right? These cockwombles think they're flawless so it can't be their fault if they get in a fight. And thus they always end up in a punch out because they feel justified.
The metal-heads on the other hand are not afraid to realize when they fuck up and buy the other guy a beer instead of letting it get to violence. Thus they're only a danger if you actually are a total shithead.
I'm personally not usually a death metal sort of guy, I like thinks a little more melodic, I'm perfectly fine listening to the likes of Disturbed or Sabaton.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 15:14 GMT David 18
Boring Pigeonholes
Too many people listen to certain genres of music to project a persona. Then there are the bores (a few in evidence here) who are all about desperately trying to appear more knowledgeable about their chosen genres, delighting in pointing out the minute differences between sub-genres and prattling on about how x genre or artist is not "real" music, because it is not to their taste, or "call that cheese-grater-mousetrap metal! Kuh, any fule knows that's INDUSTRIAL-cheese-grater-mousetrap metal!"
I say to all of them, grow up and just appreciate what moves you. Music and art are to be enjoyed for so many reaosns but mainly they make you feel something - and that will be different for everybody. What you listen to does not reflect who or what you are, but might provide a glimpse of what is going on in your head at that time, if you are clever enough to interpret it and know the listener well.
I am just as likely to be listening to Slipknot to wind down on my commute if angry (it helps get the frustration out) or some nice Baroque music to soothe it away. But I am equally as likely to be listening to a bit of SRV, Albert King, JJ Cale, Pink Floyd, Count Basie because I like it and it moves me in different ways. I'm not so keen on Pop, because a lot of it does not move /me/, I suspect most of it is not intended to. There are exceptions, I like "Happy" for example and many Abba tracks - well constructed. Even some Rap, Hip-Hop, trance etc is excellent.
Just enjoy music for what it is and stop trying to read crap into it.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 18:15 GMT Jacob's Elevator
'Science says' ...
77 of 79 scientists (95%) agreed with a pole on AGW/CC; 'gave the correct answer' and kept their jobs.
That's actually where the official 95% came from.
The death metal fans I've met were bankers from Germany.
Convivial and perfectly nice chaps ... but I was sharing the room with them to go see 'Prince'.
Not really my thing, Nihilism.
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Thursday 14th March 2019 19:33 GMT Scott 26
Timely - going to Slayer & Anthrax this weekend....
(Not 'death' metal, I know....)
Even the new generation of metallers coming through are (apparently) 'nice' (eg Alien Weaponry).
As for death/black metal, I was the one in our little group of like-minded individuals to import Grindcrusher (Earache Records compilation record)... I was the only one to like it though - bit too extreme even for Slayer fans
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Friday 15th March 2019 12:37 GMT Kiwi
I've looked at many songs over the years.
Nothing seems to meet the standard set by Motorhead's "Sweet Revenge".
But them maybe I've been unfortunate to have met "the right people".
So sweet to see you,
Writhe and crawl and scream for life,
But I can't listen now,
I'm too busy with the knife,
(In light of recent events, this may be a song the whole nation will understand tomorrow :( ).
Biting the hand that feeds IT
