back to article Linux Mint to go DIY for multimedia

The Linux Mint project has decided version 18, scheduled for June 2016, will end out-of-the-box installation of multimedia codecs. The reasoning is straightforward: shipping with codecs involves a lot of work that other mainstream distributions don't bother with, instead leaving users to choose what they want post-install. As …

  1. Criminny Rickets

    Bummer

    Not happy to read this. The built in codecs is one of the main things I like about Linux Mint, and one of the things that makes it stand out from Ubuntu and other distros. It is also one of the things that helped its reputation as a Windows alternative. Install it, and it just worked. The developers should be making it more Windows like, not the opposite, to make it easier for people to convert.

    Edit:

    What the article fails to state, which I just read in the latest Linux Mint blog -

    Multimedia codecs can be installed easily:

    From the welcome screen, by clicking on “Multimedia Codecs”

    or from the main menu, by clicking on “Menu”->”Sound and Video”->”Install Multimedia Codecs”

    or during the installation process, by clicking a checkbox option.

    1. stizzleswick
      FAIL

      Re: Bummer

      "The developers should be making it more Windows like"

      Er... NO!!!! Most definitely not! Windows is why I use Mint! (and several other distributions, and a couple of flavours of BSD...)

      1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

        Re: Er... NO!!!!

        Well, unfortunately, yes. If we are to generalize a robust, stable OS for most people to use, it would be good if said OS had the user-friendly features of Windows without the abysmal collection of cheese holes in security that go with the original.

        But that doesn't mean that everyone would have to use it. Linux is the paradise of choice, so you could go on using the Iron Penguin version while Joe User would use Fluffy Ballmer (for example).

        1. stizzleswick

          Re: Er... NO!!!! @Pascal Monett

          Agreed, there, up to a point. To me, "more like Windows" through long experience means less user-friendliness (that's starting with Windows 1.0 here, as a sysadmin). I strongly prefer an OS where I have a choice of features I can enable (and not a bunch of "features" that I need to dis-able (hello, Ubuntu!) to protect my privacy).

          For a highly user-friendly GUI (most Operating Systems could run it easily, what most people see from any OS is the GUI and they tend to confuse both, due to Microsoft marketing Windows as an OS while it actually is a GUI running on top of NT...). I am still highly impressed with IBM's Workplace Shell as demonstrated on the OS/2 v. 4. Clean, lean, and to this day not improved upon.

          1. IsJustabloke
            Facepalm

            Re: Er... NO!!!! @stizzleswick

            You are not the target user when the op stated that it should be "more windows like"

            Typically you are assuming that all users want to "fiddle" with their installations and that is a wrong assumption.

            The vast majority of users want to install something and do "stuff" because that is how the vast majority of users use their PC's. It really doesn't matter how much you wish it were oherwise, it isn't and never will be, get over it.

            For the vast majority of users their experience is with windows and they don't really care one way or the other all they want is to "do stuff" within an environment they mostly recognise.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Er... NO!!!!

          What to do when the twats at Microsoft change the UI again?

          Does the whole world have to do an about turn too (again)? Develop a quality product that does what most people want easily for free. Good documentation is the answer to get people to use it.

          [ok, so maybe I'm being a pedant here, but I hate the term 'folder.' It is a directory -- ie an object that lists its contents. To use the term folder means to have just given in to the twats.]

          Anonymous, because I haven't a good thing to say about Microsoft.

          1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

            UI changes

            Personally, I cannot abide OSes that force a UI upon me and leave me no choice (which is why I stick to Win7).

            The many distros of Linux have amply demonstrated that the UI is easily configurable and has no real ties with any background process. We have today computers that are a million times more powerful than what we had last millenium, but Linux has had configurable UIs since way before Y2K.

            There should never be any "change in the UI". There should only be "new options for the UI" that I can enable or not. That is a lesson that Microsoft still has great pain to comprehend.

            1. pmartin66

              Re: UI changes

              Oh, and you can replace the shell in ANY windows, even dating back to Win95.... what, you mean you guys didn't know this already?

              If I install a user desktop, after install, all my hardware had better work, or there is something very wrong and indicates to me laziness and not caring. This is another one of so many reasons Linux will never make it as the predominant desktop OS and is relegated to a minority of users.

              1. John 110

                Re: UI changes

                "If I install a user desktop, after install, all my hardware had better work"

                I know I talked about grannies up there a bit, but I have to leap to Linux's defence here. When I installed Mint on a new PC a couple of years ago _all_ my hardware worked out of the box except an ancient samsung scanner/printer, which worked after I installed the correct driver from the Samsung website. Oh and the new install didn't spend all day rebooting itself and downloading updates (all the updates were downloaded in one go and didn't require a reboot.)

                1. Chemist

                  Re: UI changes

                  "When I installed Mint on a new PC a couple of years ago _all_ my hardware worked out of the box except an ancient samsung scanner/printer, "

                  When I installed OpenSUSE on a new i7 laptop a couple of years ago _all_ my hardware worked out of the box including an ancient Epson scanner/printer

                2. AlbertH
                  Linux

                  Re: UI changes

                  Exactly. Everything "Just Works"™ with Linux. I have NEVER installed Windoze and had all the hardware work. Even worse, many of the drivers supplied by major manufacturers are unsigned, so Windoze whinges about them. Canon are particularly bad in this respect (and don't provide Linux drivers for their hardware........).

                  Windoze is now just an irrelevant, slow, buggy, unstable proprietary client for a Linux / Unix world.

                  1. Pompous Git Silver badge

                    Re: UI changes

                    I have NEVER installed Windoze and had all the hardware work.

                    A bit harsh blaming MS because hardware manufacturers haven't provided drivers for the version of Windoze you are installing. This was worse in the days of WinNT when they wouldn't supply drivers for NT, only for Win9.x. When I was a beta tester for NT5 (Win2k), MS wrote drivers for some popular hardware because the manufacturers weren't interested. They were pretty basic, but functional.

                    Yes, Canon are among the very worst in this respect. My FS 2710 slide scanner was purchased when Win2k was current and it refused to work after the WinXP upgrade. Canon ignored my support request (faxed because they didn't publish an email address). I figured out how to make it work under WinXP and received many thanks from owners when I published how to do this. Never purchased anything from Canon since!

                  2. Pompous Git Silver badge

                    Re: UI changes

                    Windoze is now just an irrelevant, slow, buggy, unstable proprietary client for a Linux / Unix world.

                    That's as silly a remark as any in this thread. So where is the equivalent of The Oxford English Dictionary, The Routledge Encyclopaedia of Philosophy, InDesign, CorelDRAW! Suite etc for Linux? It's a multi-OS world for those of us who need the right tools for the job. Get used to it!

                  3. Anonymous Coward
                    Anonymous Coward

                    Re: UI changes

                    Everything "Just Works"™ with Linux ... Canon ... don't provide Linux drivers for their hardware

                    Small consistency problem there, no?

                3. Unicornpiss
                  Flame

                  Re: UI changes

                  Agreed. All my hardware works well under Linux with occasional hiccups with Bluetooth. (which also is a bit flaky under Windows) My (now gratefully long gone) HP printer would never work in duplex in Windows 7, but worked flawlessly under Linux. Maybe MS could someday explain the mystery of why Windows has to search the online driver database for 5 minutes or more sometimes just to install a no-frills wired USB mouse (which sometimes fails), while the same mouse just works instantly when I plug it into a Linux box.

                  For those that mentioned Canon, my Canon color laser works great on both Win and Linux. The Linux driver was available on Canon's site and was very easy to install, though I'd agree you may have a struggle with older models.

                  1. Pompous Git Silver badge
                    Paris Hilton

                    Re: UI changes

                    you may have a struggle with older models

                    Less so than with younger "models" when you are as old and ugly as me. A bit of cash seems to reduce the struggling significantly...

              2. Pompous Git Silver badge

                Re: UI changes

                If I install a user desktop, after install, all my hardware had better work, or there is something very wrong and indicates to me laziness and not caring. This is another one of so many reasons Linux will never make it as the predominant desktop OS and is relegated to a minority of users.

                My W10 install didn't work due to incompatibility with my video adapter, a fairly recent ATI based card made by ASUS. I attempted to discover if my spare was compatible, but MS appears to no longer make an HCL available. Apparently you are now expected to purchase and install video adapters in order to use a compatibility tool. It occurred to me that this might be a very expensive proposition. Yes, MS are lazy and incompetent!

                I don't need to run an OS merely because it's run by the majority of users. I do need an OS that works with my hardware.

              3. Manolo
                FAIL

                Re: UI changes

                "If I install a user desktop, after install, all my hardware had better work, or there is something very wrong and indicates to me laziness and not caring"

                Better not install Windows then, where after install you still have to hunt around for drivers for most of your hardware (sometimes even the motherboard).

          2. John 110

            Re: Er... NO!!!!

            I don't think we actually mean the GUI when the phrase "more like Windows" is bandied about. I think we mean something that your granny can use without having to phone you every two minutes.

            1. Lars Silver badge
              Linux

              Re: Er... NO!!!!

              "I think we mean something that your granny can use without having to phone you every two minutes."

              The interesting thing is that your "granny" gets along very well with a modern Linux distribution, the old PC gets a new life and speed and granny is not forced to compile kernels or learn Emacs, it just works.

              I have friends who actively do this with their "grannies" just because they have found there are less phone calls then.

              1. Pompous Git Silver badge
                Joke

                Re: Er... NO!!!!

                I have friends who actively do this with their "grannies" just because they have found there are less phone calls then.

                I have friends who just use duct tape. It's cheap and very quick!

            2. hplasm
              Gimp

              Re: Er... NO!!!!

              "...something that your granny can use without having to phone you every two minutes."

              Not Windows, then.

            3. dajames

              Re: Er... NO!!!!

              I don't think we actually mean the GUI when the phrase "more like Windows" is bandied about. I think we mean something that your granny can use without having to phone you every two minutes.

              So ... NOT like Windows then?

              The Windows GUI isn't actually all that easy to use if you're not familiar with it, as grannies tend not to be, and it's getting worse with each new release. We in the IT industry tend to forget that what is familiar to us may seem to be dark magic on first exposure.

          3. Terry Cloth
            Thumb Down

            ``I hate the term 'folder.'''

            My wife ditto. She says ``I don't put files in folders; I put folders in files!'' (as in file cabinets). So I've told her the ``folders'' are really directories. That she can live with.

        3. Innocent-Bystander*

          Re: Er... NO!!!!

          Well, unfortunately, yes. If we are to generalize a robust, stable OS for most people to use...

          That's no longer a technical problem. It's a marketing problem. If you want market penetration on the desktop you have to pre-install it. Plain and simple. Mint is good enough for most home users but very few care enough to go through the trouble to switch. That's mostly because Windows is also good enough.

          I personally don't care for the whole "Linux desktop success" theme. It works for me, does what I need it to do, it's successful on my end. End of story. What everybody else uses is everybody else's problem.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Bummer

      If the process of installing the codecs is just ticking a box post-install, why is this "very costly" for the developers?

    3. Criminny Rickets

      Re: Bummer

      When I say more Windows like, I am referring to Windows 7, not 8 or 10.

    4. buzzrobot

      Re: Bummer

      Yes, it's essentially the same thing Ubuntu and pretty much every other Ubuntu derivative have been doing for years. But, "the sky is falling!" is better click bait.

  2. Mark 65

    And there was me thinking that, pre unity, the shipping of a distribution complete with working codecs was always one of its main plus points. What is there now but "it doesn't have Unity"? (I'm presuming it will end up with Systemd)

    1. stizzleswick

      "And there was me thinking that, pre unity, [...]"

      Unity is Ubuntu's failure to create its own GUI, (and the reason I no longer use Ubuntu -- for a power user, Unity just sucks: like Windows 8, a smartphone GUI on a workstation). Mint is based in part on the need to have something with the out-of-the-box-ity of Ubuntu with a GUI people can actually use. Do not confuse these two projects, even though Mint is derived from Ubuntu. But there's a very good reason why it is derived...

      1. Dave Bell

        Last year, after getting horribly messed up by a failing drive and the need to re-install Windows, I switched to Linux Mint.

        It does all I want.

        For a few things I depend on WINE to run an old Windows program.

        If Linux has a particular weakness it is that, more than Windows (but not maybe much more), programmers tend to be better at telling computers what do do than they are at telling things to people. And they don't seem to cope well with people not reading the manual. Perhaps they need to pay as much attention to debugging the manuals as they do to debugging the programs.

      2. Mark 65

        Sizzles I think you misunderstood me. When I say pre unity I am talking about why use mint vs Ubuntu and the chief reason was installed codecs out of the box - it just worked. Post unity, and without codecs, the chief selling point is just it doesn't have unity. They are undermining their advantages.

  3. Youngone Silver badge

    Nooooooo!

    It will probably be really hard to install the codecs, I might have to click, like, twice or something!!1!!

    Probably won't let me upgrade to Windows 10 either.

    Useless.

    1. VinceH
      Alert

      Re: Nooooooo!

      "Probably won't let me upgrade to Windows 10 either.

      Useless."

      Look on the bright side. It also won't try to 'accidentally' force you to upgrade to Windows 10, either.

      Until Microsoft develop a GWX equivalent for Linux, and craftily release it as part of something else for Linux.

      1. PNGuinn
        Megaphone

        Re: Nooooooo! @ VinceH

        DON'T GIVE THEM BLOODY IDEAS!

        1. VinceH

          Re: Nooooooo! @ VinceH

          Sorry.

          Wrist duly slapped.

  4. 4d3fect

    Back to Hardy.

  5. DainB Bronze badge

    Who cares

    If you consider that Mint is around 25% of all Linux desktop installation then according to nemarketshare.com there are roughly as many users of Linux Mint as Windows 3.1

    Butthurt of Mint evangelists to follow in 3..2..1

    1. frank ly

      Re: Who cares

      I've been using Mint for three years and it never occurred to me to find out how many other people use it. You must be interested in it, deep down inside, you know, (wink).

      1. DainB Bronze badge

        Re: Who cares

        It's just the most extreme BDSM fantasy of mine. You know, something so bizarre that average people won't even consider it in their lifetime.

    2. Supa

      Re: Who cares

      And many Mint/Windows users that dual boot will probably admit to having 99% uptime for Linux Mint for general computing and the remaining 1% simply for Windows games that can't run on Linux (yet) and maybe a slap of Photoshop editing. Got to love statistics. Everyone has them. :)

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Who cares

        I'm dual booting between Win 7 and Mint on my gaming rig.

        Probably about 95% of the time in Windows currently, but I only installed Mint a few weeks back (probably the easiest OS install I've ever done, no issues at all, and as I was dual-booting, I had to deviate from the defaults, but still no issues).

        I'm also playing a lot of Vive VR games atm, which are current Win only, but Linux support is due for the Vive (HTC and Valve are not exactly MS fan boys).

        I'm gradually moving things over from Windows to Mint, so far without any real issues. So I expect the % will gradually move to Mint over time.

        Of the 180 or so games in my Steam library, about 75 of them run under Linux natively, including some AAA titles such as Tomb Raider (2013).

        Granted I expect some publishers (especially from the likes of EA etc), might never produce Linux versions, but I don't really care too much about the mega publishers. Most of their games are just rehashed games from 10+ years ago, with way too much focus on mutiplayer (for my taste), a trend into micro-payments, and totally unimaginative, so no great loss as far as I'm concerned.

        Mint just works, is easy to use, has no 'bling' unless you add it yourself, and imho nothing beats the Linux package management method of OS and software updating, rather than the complete inconsistent mess that Windows is! (Windows update, programs with their own update services running constantly in the background, automated checks for updates on launch, manually having to download and update yourself! Just horrible!).

    3. pmartin66

      Re: Who cares

      LOL. Nice. I could feel the retribution too.

    4. TheVogon

      Re: Who cares

      "Butthurt of Mint evangelists to follow in 3..2..1"

      Now that's a collective noun I hadn't heard before. This sort of nerd-ville springs to mind:

      https://gallery.confuzzled.org.uk/main.php?g2_itemId=57338&g2_imageViewsIndex=1

    5. Roo
      Windows

      Re: Who cares

      "If you consider that Mint is around 25% of all Linux desktop installation then according to nemarketshare.com there are roughly as many users of Linux Mint as Windows 3.1"

      Personally I don't care about market share, I am happy that I have a desktop OS that works very well for me - much better than the alternatives I've tried so far. It's not perfect, but each release has rounded off a few more rough edges and added a bit more useful functionality so it's the best I've tried so far and getting better. The only butthurt from my point of view is that there may be folks who won't give another OS a shot because of comments from insecure numpties.

      No one wins when a single vendor owns the market, you should be cheering the alternatives on because without decent competition there is no reason for a vendor to improve their product.

      1. Pompous Git Silver badge

        Re: Who cares

        No one wins when a single vendor owns the market, you should be cheering the alternatives on because without decent competition there is no reason for a vendor to improve their product.

        Very true. But that begs the question as to why Windows installs still suck big-time when Linux distros showed how slick an install can be a decade or more ago.

        1. Roo
          Windows

          Re: Who cares

          "But that begs the question as to why Windows installs still suck big-time when Linux distros showed how slick an install can be a decade or more ago."

          The example that I had in mind was NTFS. Slow and sad and obsolete when released in the early 90s, and nothing changed apart from the gap to the competition growling larger for over 15 years.

  6. jake Silver badge

    ::shrugs::

    Sticking with Slackware on the desktop in these here parts.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: ::shrugs::

      Well done for sticking with Slackware.

      "There is always a choice of Linux Distro's that don't have anything to do with Ubuntu"

      (As the parent to Mint).

      Slackware way my intro to Linux way back in the days of V1.1.

      Now I turn to Debian or CentOS as my Linux Distro's of choice.

    2. keithpeter Silver badge
      Pint

      Re: ::shrugs::

      @jake's downvoters

      You might want to have a look at the Slackware live DVDs.

      http://bear.alienbase.nl/mirrors/slackware-live/

      The 14.2 release is very near now and for the kind of people who hang out here installing Slackware is a question of reading a document, clicking enter a few dozen times, and logging in 15 minutes or so later.

      Beer icon: for *anyone* involved in the development, testing, and publishing of any Linux or BSD distribution. 48 release events x arches percycle is still really hard work.

      1. jake Silver badge

        @keithpeter (was:Re: ::shrugs::)

        "@jake's downvoters"

        Please avoid mentioning the concept. Don't give 'em any press. That's all they are looking for. Kids these days ...

        (Side-note: "thumbs" here on AOL ElReg are completely meaningless.)

  7. Steve 114

    Lifeboat

    What I want is a rescue disk that just runs, without installation. So I'll use an old one with codecs (can an expert tell us how to 'slipstream' codecs to a new one?) It's probably a software patent issue, really.

    1. keithpeter Silver badge
      Windows

      Re: Lifeboat

      @Steve 114

      Debian based distros have various scripts for producing a live image from a given installation. A quick google revealed the page below specifically for Mint. The page author seems to be doing it the 'use basic Unix tools and chroot' way. There are other suggestions in the comments.

      https://community.linuxmint.com/tutorial/view/1784

    2. Bodge99

      Re: Lifeboat

      Rescue disks:

      What I don't understand is why more people don't just boot the live iso from a flashdrive.. You then have the best of both worlds.. a rescue system that you can also install from.

      I've started a guide covering 64-bit installation on 32-bit UEFI systems.

      See: http://linxtablet.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=2024 if interested..

  8. Neil Barnes Silver badge

    No Evince or Gedit?

    First installation then...

    (Actually, as what I have on this Acer works fine out of the box with 17, why would I change it? And on the Tosh Chromebook II, it was quite hard to get it all working so I think I'll leave that alone, too.)

  9. EvadingGrid

    The bigger issue is that it will be forced into adopting SystemD . . .

    If Mint choose of its own free will to ship SystemD, that would be fine by me. Its the draconian forced adoption that raises the hairs on the back of my neck.

    1. Gordon 10

      Define forced in this instance.... if by forced you mean inherit it from the upstream distro's Mint is based on then you mean "forced by our earlier design choices"

      Besides if there is anything more than a few moaners I would guess we might be seeing a version of LMDE based on Devaun some time soon.

      Me, I suspect its a storm in a fairly small teacup. If either version of Mint (U vs D) continues to function I guess most users will shrug their shoulders and go "meh".

    2. Tromos

      "draconian forced adoption"

      For some strange reason, Mint doesn't come up as the first OS this brings to mind.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      systemd

      I knew this day would come. I'll stick with Mint 17.x until either Mint or someone else releases a no-bullshit distro that's not based on systemd. Or at least until systemd solves more problems than it creates for me.

      And if every OS is utter crap by the time Mint 17.x reaches its effective EOL, it's time to get out of this business (again).

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Unhappy

    Themes?

    From the blog :

    We decided to join the new trend and jump on the bandwagon (as people say) with a new “flat” theme called “Mint-Y”

    Oh god no, no, no. One reason I use Mint is because it hasn't yet joined the modern UI bandwagon.

    I guess I'm just an old legacy fart - the comments on the blog reveal many who think this style is just so cool and they can't wait for it. Still, apparently I can choose the existing theme if I want to.

    1. Gordon 10
      Thumb Up

      Re: Themes?

      Agree. Lets face it most OS UI designers wouldn't understand UX if it came up to them and hit them round the face with a rancid kipper.

      I think secretly they all go to the same conferences and agree a plot to foist this shite on us regardless of OS choice.

      Nothing says mature technology like pointless masturbatory design changes on something that just works. Get a new job OS UI guys/gals, you're obviously bored.

      1. PNGuinn
        FAIL

        Re: hit them round the face with a rancid kipper

        Yup, that'd be TIFKAM etc, Gnome3, Unity et al.

        Me, I just want an intuitive stable fast GUI that lets me get work done - MY way.

        Fortunately, in Linux there are still other options for us unusual old farts ...

        Hey, "UI Design" Kids - It's MY bloody computer. I built it to get work done - not waste half the processor cycles pretending to be "pretty".

        And BTW Mozilla, I'm looking ....

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Themes?

      Umm, Moka (main icon theme they're using) is not really that flat, heck It's more of a 3D-ish icon theme. And if you don't like the paper-style icons for folders and other file related stuff, the icon set can be replaced by pure Moka rather than Moka/Paper hybrid.

    3. RoundDuckMan
      Linux

      Re: Themes?

      Well Moka (one icon theme used for Mint Y) is not really that flat, and Arc (at least its dark version) looks a lot better than other "flaties." The bottom bar ain't flat either. The only thing not so great for some (like you) is that some of the icons are based on the Paper theme, which... is flat.

      *gulp*

  11. RonWheeler

    If

    ..it is a two click installer, why don't they make it a de/selectable install option? Because it isn't going to be as simple as that or they wouldn't have removed it in the first place. Another win for painful overcomplexity for the sake of it.

    1. frank ly

      Re: If

      There may be some legal subtlety at work. The existing versions with codecs can only be distributed in certain countries (such as the UK) where it's legally possible to distribute these codecs. These versions with codecs can't be distributed in Japan and the USA (I think).

      If, after installation and logging in, a user takes positive voluntary action to install codecs, that's the user's responsibility. If it's done as part of the system installation process then it's the distributor's responsibility.

      1. This post has been deleted by its author

    2. Fibbles

      Re: If

      This is already how it works with other Ubuntu based distros. The codecs aren't on the live CD though, they must be downloaded during installation. That's OK for most people but if you don't have a net connection then you're stuffed.

      1. frank ly

        Re: If

        Now that I've actually read the linuxmint.com latest blog/article:

        "Multimedia codecs can be installed easily:

        From the welcome screen, by clicking on “Multimedia Codecs”

        or from the main menu, by clicking on “Menu”->”Sound and Video”->”Install Multimedia Codecs”

        or during the installation process, by clicking a checkbox option."

    3. Lars Silver badge
      Linux

      Re: If

      Yes, I have seen the text "install proprietary codecs? yes/no". What I haven't seen for ages is a PC without an internet connection.

  12. phuzz Silver badge

    What are these codecs needed for?

    Don't Mint users use VLC like everyone on Windows and Mac?

    1. Oh Homer
      Black Helicopters

      Distributing libavcodec (i.e. FFmpeg) is "a lot of work"?

      I call bullshit.

      This isn't about "work", it's about patent trolls.

    2. Criminny Rickets

      Personally, I prefer Banshee over VLC. I will use VLC for one off's to check out an individual song, but for my music collection library, Banshee works much better.

      1. phuzz Silver badge

        Oh well, when it comes to playing music I still use Winamp*, but the only non-Free codec there is for mp3. I'd assumed that most of the non-Free codecs were for video. I agree that VLC is not really set up as an audio player.

        * because it does what I want and still works

    3. Pompous Git Silver badge

      Don't Mint users use VLC like everyone on Windows and Mac?

      Er... no! On Windows I use Foobar 2000. On Linux I use Audacious. Of all the music players I've used, Foobar 2000 eats the others for breakfast.

  13. Reg T.

    Since Mint routinely

    finds their servers compromised, who in their right mind would actually give a crap about their codec difficulty? Their website, their servers - always something. My guess is that "legal" had a chat with them about the codecs since so many Minters are in the USA.

    The binary crowd, the Windows brain-dead who fled to Mint, will panic over the wrong issue.

    In fact, I soon will release a new distro for such folk - StickIT - as in up yours . All binaries with no wasted storage for source.

    Oh, second thought - that is already in circulation - Win10.

    1. CAPS LOCK

      @Reg T

      "Since Mint routinely finds their servers compromised, who in their right mind would actually give a crap about their codec difficulty? Their website, their servers - always something."

      Low quality trolling. Nought out of ten. Must try harder.

  14. pyite

    The end of Mint is complete

    Mint was the best distro for a decade because it removed the painful aspects of Linux setup. This was the original reason it was created.

    The first Mint version I used (Bianca IIRC) was a winner because it shipped with Sun Java and multimedia codecs. It was jaw dropping that you could take a fresh install and simply insert a DVD and play it without hours on Google.

    Not long after, they had a menu system that was very Windows-XP-like -- perfect for introducing people to the Linux desktop. I was the most hard core Mint evangelist imagineable.

    The ease-of-install aspects have slowly gone away, sadly. Now that Ubuntu re-introduced Gnome 2 and Mint is dropping codecs (having dropped Java years ago), there is no reason to use Mint anymore.

    It was a good run, though. Thanks, Clem!! Good luck on your new adventure.

    1. Criminny Rickets

      Re: The end of Mint is complete

      Mint is not dropping codecs,

      From my original comment...

      What the article fails to state, which I just read in the latest Linux Mint blog -

      Multimedia codecs can be installed easily:

      From the welcome screen, by clicking on “Multimedia Codecs”

      or from the main menu, by clicking on “Menu”->”Sound and Video”->”Install Multimedia Codecs”

      or during the installation process, by clicking a checkbox option.

      1. FatGerman

        Re: The end of Mint is complete

        > Multimedia codecs can be installed easily:

        The problem is not with the ease or otherwise of installation, but that a proportion of the user base - and a much higher proportion of the user base Mint was getting good at attracting - don't know what 'Codecs' are. Or indeed 'Multimedia'. These people used Mint because everything they asked it to play, it played. The vast majority of people, when a video won't play, won't spend hours googling to make it work, they'll just say "This is shit" and play it on something else - like Windows. Or a tablet. Something very much not running any 'distro' at all, anyway.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          @FatGerman - Re: The end of Mint is complete

          Make a system so simple that even a total idiot can use it and soon... everybody will use only Windows.

          1. Pompous Git Silver badge

            Re: @FatGerman - The end of Mint is complete

            Make a system so simple that even a total idiot can use it and soon... everybody will use only Windows.

            Well, it seems to me that Linux has become much easier to use over the last decade and that Windows has become harder to use since Win7. Rather the reverse of what you seem to be saying...

          2. FatGerman

            Re: @FatGerman - The end of Mint is complete

            Nah you've missed my point, although in retrospect I didn't make it very well.

            Apparently there's now a menu item to "Install Multimedia Codecs". Yeah great. The people who need this won't actually understand what it means and won't therefore use it. It needs to be something like "Why won't my video play?". This is something the web worked out about a decade ago.

    2. Innocent-Bystander*

      Re: The end of Mint is complete

      Mint was the best distro for a decade because it removed the painful aspects of Linux setup. This was the original reason it was created.

      Was it? Mint always had exactly the same installer as Ubuntu... OK, it was green highlights, not puke brown but regardless, setup was always identical.

      I was under the impression it was created because the creators had a decade long WTF moment when they looked at Unity and Gnome 3.

  15. dmacleo

    I like mint and one of its best points for me was codecs being in iso as I have really slow dsl here.

    oh well I understand their reasoning and would probably make same choice in their position.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Again, a lot of people here are confusing

    technicality (one click to install, compiling, downloading etc.) of doing things with legality (like in will there be lawyers going to knock at your door). Unfortunately, codecs are being covered by patents and Linux crowd can't do anything but comply to IP laws.

    I know, codecs are nothing but mathematics and should not be patentable but at least in US, it is too late now.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Facepalm

    Not Nan friendly!

    How am I supposed to hand-hold Nan installing codecs on Mint, especially now she has problems with the 'water works'?

  18. TVU Silver badge

    "I like mint and one of its best points for me was codecs being in iso as I have really slow dsl here.

    oh well I understand their reasoning and would probably make same choice in their position."

    I agree with this and I think it is a shame but like they said, they have to go through the labour intensive process of producing 18 different ISOs all because of different regulations in different countries.

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