back to article Windows 10 handcuffs Cortana web search to Bing and Edge browser

The Cortana search box in the Windows 10 task bar will, from today, always use Bing and Microsoft's Edge browser to find stuff on the web. You can still configure your default browser to be something other than Edge, and you can set the default search engine to be something other than Bing on your Windows 10 PC. But if you …

  1. joed

    So where's EU

    when we needed "search ballot"? Chasing after google?

    Good thing that now I can block (on the router) url bar searches and Cortana. Two bings with one stone.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      WTF?

      Re: So where's EU

      Turn off Cortana.

      Fixed.

      Not hard was it.

      1. paulc

        Re: So where's EU

        "Turn off Cortana.

        Fixed.

        Not hard was it."

        still present on disk... still provides potential unfixed vulnerabilities as attack vectors to be exploited...

        1. Paul Shirley

          Re: So where's EU

          ...and still running. You need kill its process then nuke the executable in the split second before it restarts.

          Then check and repeat after every update is forced on your machine

          1. joed

            Re: So where's EU

            unfortunately, killing off "essential" executables messes up Windows (taskbar, jumplist, computer settings issues). Group policies and firewall wall rules (Windows and hardware) ftw.

            1. jelabarre59

              Re: So where's EU

              > unfortunately, killing off "essential" executables messes up Windows (taskbar, jumplist, computer settings issues).

              And you can tell the difference from a regular, non-modified MSWin system how???

      2. Mpeler
        Paris Hilton

        Re: So where's EU

        Turn off Cortana.

        Handcuffs Cortana.

        What is this, 50 shades of Windows 10?

        I knew Micro$haft were getting sadistic, but jeesh.....

        (puts on protective coat and runs.....)

    2. find users who cut cat tail

      Re: So where's EU

      The EU is slow, but will at least get to it eventually. Aside from a few exceptions (Germany), it certainly does better than the national states...

    3. This post has been deleted by its author

    4. Sway

      Re: So where's EU

      Or just reside outside the US, no chance of ever seeing Cortana in New Zealand

    5. h4rm0ny

      Re: So where's EU

      Both Google and Microsoft are bad on things like this. May not be coincidence that this happens the week after Google and MS agree not to shop each other to the courts for market misbehaviour.

    6. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Block Cortana at the Router level...

      How.... Some more details please??? Thanks!

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Get used to it.

    Windows 7 was the last version of Windows that had even a passing semblance of something YOU controlled.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Get used to it.

      Everything is going to shit. Windows is becoming all SaaSy.

      Linux is becoming all un-unixy with systemd, gnome 3 etc.

      The next big things in tech are clearly things that have no use outside the consumer tat appeal: IoT, VR and wearables.

      There doesn't even seem to be any new tablets out. Like netbooks manufacturers did one round, then abandoned the format.

      1. Adam 52 Silver badge

        Re: Get used to it.

        I tend to agree with you but there are some positive things:

        The EU is finally cracking down on data privacy, requiring explicit informed consent with meaningful fines, which should put pay to Microsoft's worse excesses (but not Google's).

        Slackware is still going strong and you can run it on a Raspberry Pi - http://rpi3.fatdog.eu/

        A whole load of serverless architecture stuff is coming through (Apache Mesos etc) and with simple, portable languages (Go) together may make the OS less relevant and finally end OS lock-in.

        Big Data has gone through its hype cycle and is now starting to be usable (Apache Drill, Spark); even better cheap memory means people don't need Big Data solutions.

    2. Max Normal
      Happy

      Re: Get used to it.

      Install Spybot Anti-Beacon.

      https://www.safer-networking.org/spybot-anti-beacon/

      Disables all the MS essential data-hoovering rubbish from Windows 10.

      And of course, disable/remove Cortana, Bing, and all the other Win10 stoopidity.

      And install Classic Shell.

      1. raving angry loony

        Re: Get used to it.

        So... reverts it to Windows 7, is that what it does?

      2. nematoad

        Re: Get used to it.

        "Install Spybot Anti-Beacon..."

        "And of course, disable/remove Cortana, Bing, and all the other Win10 stoopidity.

        And install Classic Shell".

        Blimey, all this to get the OS to do what you want.

        And to think that they used to say that Linux was difficult to set up.

        1. Bronek Kozicki

          Re: Get used to it.

          Blimey, all this to get the OS to do what you want.

          well, an OS without application is not much use, so you need to install these too. Windows (version 10 especially so) comes with toy apps, but there is little of real use.

          1. Sebastian A

            Re: Get used to it.

            But that's what I want from an OS. Sit on my hardware, making it useful for apps I actually want.

            I don't want it to come with thirty pieces of mal- and spy-ware, I don't want it to make MY hardware a platform to project third party advertising into my space, and I don't want it to waste cycles doing anything I haven't specifically asked it to do.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Get used to it.

          The new CEO was a cloud data slurper before becoming CEO, so it is little surprise that Windows 10 has been sculpted to fit his agenda.

          It's all about the cloud, the tiles, the app store and the ecosystem now.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Get used to it.

            It's all about the cloud, the tiles, the app store and the ecosystem now.

            The new & shinier ABB EMax circuit breakers are supposed to be run off the cloud because ... reasons ... and energy efficiency and cloud is HIP & other shit. This will be fun to hack.

    3. phuzz Silver badge
      Facepalm

      Re: Get used to it.

      Apart from Cortana (which is mainly a hopped up Windows Search), pretty much everything that everyone is getting their undies in a twist about in Win10 was there in Win 7, just off by default.

      You have to go all the way back to Windows 2000 if you want a Microsoft OS that doesn't collect telemetry, or rather 'spy on you' as I believe we're calling it now.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Get used to it.

      I thought that was Windows 3.1...

    5. Dwarf

      Re: Get used to it.

      Which is why Windows 7 was the last version of Windows I used.

  3. Sean Timarco Baggaley

    Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

    Film at eleven.

    Seriously? This is "news" now, is it? Can you name the wide range of search engines and browsers Android's "Google Now" uses? What about Siri: how flexible is she with her choice of sources and rendering engines? Or Amazon's Alexa...

    Why the hell do people demand Microsoft's code run on magic and rainbows when none of their competitors are required to do so?

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge
      Stop

      Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

      It makes a url which holds the address of the search engine and the query to send to it and fires up the browser, it should be about as unproprietary as you can get.

    2. Michael Habel

      Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

      Why the hell do people demand Microsoft's code run on magic and rainbows when none of their competitors are required to do so?

      Have an upvote! While I'm not MicroSoft's biggest fan these days, it does not excuse the above fact. Which also applies to the recent space of attacks against the big G, and Android, this past week.

    3. Ken Hagan Gold badge

      Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

      "Why the hell do people demand Microsoft's code run on magic and rainbows when none of their competitors are required to do so?"

      Because Windows is still a monopoly on the desktop and the (century-old?) competition laws that MS have had to comply with for the last quarter of a century are still in force.

      Or, if you prefer, there really *is* one law for Microsoft and one law for everybody else.

      1. 1Rafayal

        Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

        I use Cortana for scheduling etc, until recently I didn't use it for searches.

        Then I found Chrometana, a Chrome plugin. Does this mean that MS are now knobbling the ability for a Chrome plugin to work correctly? Before I installed this, not only was I stuck using Bing, I was also stuck using Edge (which isn't a bad browser, I'm just used to Chrome).

        I am on the fast ring, so I should get this "update" pretty soon, if it exists.

        1. 1Rafayal

          Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

          I think I have just answered my own question.

          I am on the fast ring and am currently on build 10586.218. Yesterday, Cortana would bring up Chrome for a search request, this morning I get Edge.

          Disappointing? Yes.

          End of the world? No.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

        > Because Windows is still a monopoly on the desktop...

        But how can this be so? Every year this century has been labelled the year of "Linux on the desktop". I've been lied to.

    4. h4rm0ny

      Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

      >>"Why the hell do people demand Microsoft's code run on magic and rainbows when none of their competitors are required to do so?"

      Because we (the MS customers) pay money for their products and want that to be how MS make their money. MS were one of the last non-advertising, non-privacy invading software vendors. We LIKED it when privacy was a selling point that MS would use against Google. We have money and we're willing to hand it over for what we want.

      But that's not good enough for MS, apparently. They want to have their cake and eat it, they've seen Google eat their lunch and think the only way to fight back is to become Google. Ignoring that many of us are still with them only because they're not.

      So what do we have left? I don't know what privacy is like in the Apple ecosystem. But I guess increasingly it's becoming either them or the (non-Google) GNU/Linux distributions.

      1. 1Rafayal

        Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

        @h4rm0ny

        there are a couple of things that need to be said here, because there is just too much nonsense being spouted about Windows 10. And this isnt aimed at you personally, but instead aimed at the general lack of understanding about what happens with Windows 10.

        I dont know if the following is the same as the slurp that also takes place on Windows 7, 8 and 8.1

        First lets look at Google and Apple. With Google, everything you do and say is analysed and checked in order for them to target you with ads. With Apple, you cannot even start using any of their operating systems without an Apple ID. If you choose to use Siri, then it defaults to Safari.

        With OK Google and Siri, everything you say is checked, recorded and analysed after being sent back to HQ and recorded. They may even be listening in at all times. You cannot turn this off.

        The same is true for Cortana and the desktop search feature of Windows 10, anything you say to Cortana is used by MS to target products and services towards you - I dont know if that includes third parties, I would imagine it will if a third party offers a product or solution that MS doesnt already push. Same goes for Skype, every chat and voice call is analysed in the same manner.

        So, whats the difference between the MS approach and the Google/Apple approach? With MS you can turn it all off, completely off. There is a dedicated feature in Windows 10 called Privacy that allows you to hobble exactly what gets sent back to MS, you can go further - disable Cortana and desktop search, even less gets sent back. Dont use Skype and you wont be checked on there either.

        Want nothing to get sent back at all? Then dont even link your MS account, Skype/Hotmail etc and just use a local account - then nothing, as far as I know, gets sent back to the MS Deathstar. This is in the terms and conditions.

        What do you lose by doing this? Well, things like One Drive, the ability to use Skype, voice commands via Cortana and the use of the Windows store. Is that a massive loss to anyone? Probably not, apart from Skype maybe.

        So the difference between MS and the rest is that you can make Windows an entirely private affair, if you are willing to lose some functionality, unlike the competition.

        I guess the argument will be "If you use Linux, your world is a safe, private place". Well, yeah it is - until you start using any Google services, or Skype or perhaps any other third party service that also slurps data

        1. Dan 55 Silver badge

          Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

          1. You can use both iOS and OS X without an Apple ID and Siri and you disable Spotlight Suggestions.

          2. Even if you turn on all privacy options in Windows 10, there's a hell of a lot of phoning home still going on.

          http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/08/even-when-told-not-to-windows-10-just-cant-stop-talking-to-microsoft/

          3. Voice assistants don't upload anything until the trigger words are heard.

          4. You're right about Google, but then again who isn't?

          1. 1Rafayal

            Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

            @Dan 55

            on point 1, I am pretty certain that on older versions of OS X you have to have an Apple ID to use the OS, I recently reinstalled OS X on my mid 2007 Mac Mini (10.7.5) and recall it not letting me get passed the point where I needed to enter my Apple ID in order to carry on with the installation. If this has been fixed with the newer versions then great. Shame I cannot use those versions though, my hardware is locked out of them, El Capitan simply refuses to install. But not using your ID means you lose almost all the user experience of that ecosystem, i.e. the Apple Store - no more apps, games, music or free OS upgrades, no access to any of the stuff you may have already bought, or if you have never had one then no access to any of the stuff that has arguably made the ecosystem so popular.

            on point 2, yes - thats why if you dont use Skype, dont use Cortana, dont opt in to all the data being sent back, dont sign in with a Hotmail/MSN/etc account and just use a local account then you shouldnt be sending private data back to the MS Deathstar.

            regarding the information presented in the article you linked, as it says - most of it is harmless, the only point of concern is the telemetry stuff and I wonder if this is related to the MS marketing slurp. Hidden in the privacy settings is an opt out for the MS marketing push - by default it is set to on for everyone regardless of the fact if you are using an MS account or a local account. Could this be the reason why traffic is being sent back?

            If it isnt, then it needs explaining, I doubt that anyone would dispute this.

            I would like to thank you for taking the time and effort to reply in a sane manner.

      2. Unkempt

        Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

        What's the point in having a cake if you're not going to eat it?

        1. h4rm0ny

          Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

          >>"What's the point in having a cake if you're not going to eat it?"

          Well, to a certain mindset it allows you to have a cake that others do not. "Have your cake and eat it" has always had a connotation of greed and unreasonableness about it.

    5. jelabarre59

      Re: Proprietary code hardwired to use proprietary APIs to do stuff shock!

      > Why the hell do people demand Microsoft's code run on magic and rainbows when none of their competitors are required to do so?

      Because a MSWin running on magic and rainbows might be more stable and usable than what we have now?

  4. Shadow Systems

    Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

    They'll figure out how to rename & re-authenticate the Edge executable so that (Chrome|FireFox|Whatever) is in it's place such that when That Digital Spying Bitch tries to launch Edge with Bing, it pops up with their browser instead.

    Then MS will find out about it, force an update down your throats, which will trigger the hackers again.

    It's a race to the bottom: MS will win & everyone else that uses W10 will lose.

    Glad I won't be touching that festering pile of excrement. My next machine will come from someplace like System76.

    1. dan1980

      Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

      @Shadow Systems

      Yes, this is indeed the way things will go - if not specifically what you say in this instance, then certainly for other parts of the Windows 10 'experience'.

      Some people found relief from Windows 8 in the form of replacement taskbars and interfaces like 'Classic Shell' and continue to do so with Windows 10. It's entirely possible that future 10 updates will break these tools and the same goes for everything else that people use to customise their PCs in order to have the 'experience' they want.

      And that's the problem - Microsoft want to control the way things look and work and are arrogantly dismissive of anyone who wants it to be a different way.

      And, of course, such tight control over the 'experience' allows them to be gatekeepers for and monitors of everything the user installs, uses and consumes.

      1. WaveyDavey

        Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

        The one Microsoft rigidity that *really* get's right on my wick is the number pad on the popup keyboard on windows tablets: forced to be in "phone" number order, rather than keyboard keypad number order (which I have spent 30 years getting used to, and their refusal to allow any options.

        I hates it, I really does.

        1. Bronek Kozicki
          Coat

          Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

          I don't quite see why they would bother. It is not as if real hackers used Cortana, right?

          Although on the other hand, they might do it just for the fun of it, and possibly as a public service.

        2. Kubla Cant

          Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

          "phone" number order, rather than keyboard keypad number order

          Does anyone know why push-button phones were designed with these ridiculous keypads in the first place? I'm reasonably sure that calculators (desktop, not pocket) had keypads long before the first push-button phones were made.

          1. Timo

            Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

            Legend has it that the keypad arrangements were chosen to use a different layout specifically to slow down people as they mash in the number. Desktop calculators, or "adding machines" with cranks on the side had been around for a while, and the usual office worker could overload or confuse the phone system with their speed if they used the adding machine format.

            Bell Labs did TONS of really long-haired research in the planning of the phone network.

            Of course that same logic doesn't need to apply to your smartphone, does it...

            1. h4rm0ny

              Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

              >>"Legend has it that the keypad arrangements were chosen to use a different layout specifically to slow down people as they mash in the number. Desktop calculators, or "adding machines" with cranks on the side had been around for a while, and the usual office worker could overload or confuse the phone system with their speed if they used the adding machine format."

              You're confusing two separate though similar things. The QWERTY keyboard layout was designed to slow people down because old-fashioned mechanical typewriters could not keep up. Dvorak is designed to be faster but is seldom seen.

              The phone keypads weren't designed to slow people down. Phone keypads were not mechanical in the same way as typewriters and have always been able to handle human speeds just fine. And I think that the old-fashioned dial phones never had this problem either. What they did have, however, was the fact that it took longer to dial numbers comprised of low digits, than it did to dial longer ones. Which is why phone codes in the UK and USA were preferentially assigned according to population / pull in government. E.g. London was 020, Bristol got one with several ones, I think, whilst we Northern rif-raff got all the fives, sixes, etc.

              1. hplasm
                Boffin

                Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

                "... Phone keypads were not mechanical in the same way as typewriters and have always been able to handle human speeds just fine."

                Not at first- there was a drop in replacement for the old GPO rotary dial with push buttons, that had a complicated set of pushrods and crossbars that transformed keypresses, one-only-at-a-time into dial pulses. Pity I don't have one to have a look at now, I never did look too far into how it worked.

                Because of the single digit lockout to prevent mashing of fat-fingered wrong digits, they were fairly slow, but not terribly so.

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

            Yes, these guys know: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCSzjExvbTQ

      2. gz

        Re: Cue the hackers in 3, 2, 1...

        MS is going all Apple on us. Control freaks.

        Never mind the users, they're just exploitable appendages with no minds of their own.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Next month: "What's a Cortana?"

    FTFY

    1. P. Lee
      Coat

      "What's a Cortana?"

      The best selling UK car of the 1970's?

      What the slimy merchant did in Frozen?

      The answer to the questions, What do you think of Kiera Knightly? Would you like a coffee? Would you like a copy of Windows 10?

      1. VinceH
        Coat

        Re: "What's a Cortana?"

        "The answer to the questions, What do you think of Kiera Knightly? Would you like a coffee? Would you like a copy of Windows 10?"

        Hmm...

        "What do you think of Kiera Knightly?"

        Phwoaaaaar!

        "Would you like a coffee?"

        Please!

        "Would you like a copy of Windows 10?"

        No, shove that crap somewhere painful!

        So, in summary, that's "Phwoaaaaarpleasenoshovethatcrapsomewherepainful" then?

        Is that some kind of phonetic spelling to indicate how "Cortana" is pronounced?

        1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
          Coat

          Re: "What's a Cortana?"

          It's the ultimate objectification of women and their inability to a proper search.

    2. Zippy's Sausage Factory
      Devil

      Sounds like an STD to me

      "I've got the Cortana"

      "I want a divorce, you filty beast!"

  6. fidodogbreath

    Unfamiliar name

    What is this "Bing" of which you speak?

    1. Ken Hagan Gold badge

      Re: Unfamiliar name

      Bing is the *highly irregular* subjunctive of google. Fortunately, the subjunctive has all but disappeared from English, so you'll probably never encounter it.

    2. Lee D Silver badge

      Re: Unfamiliar name

      Isn't it the "How do I download Chrome?" tool on a fresh install?

      Almost like a bootstrap search engine for the bootstrap browser (IE / Edge).

      Like how using wget to download a real install package for a browser was, back in the day.

      1. Boothy

        Re: Unfamiliar name

        Quote 'Isn't it the "How do I download Chrome?" tool on a fresh install?'

        I use a Ninite installer on a USB drive for fresh installs of Windows.

        That way I don't need to touch Edge or IE :-)

      2. jelabarre59

        Re: Unfamiliar name

        > Isn't it the "How do I download Chrome?" tool on a fresh install?

        > Almost like a bootstrap search engine for the bootstrap browser (IE / Edge).

        > Like how using wget to download a real install package for a browser was, back in the day.

        If MS would bundle the Chocolatey variant of NuGet in all the systems, it would be as simple as typing "choco install google-chrome" in a command window.

    3. Wade Burchette
      Joke

      Re: Unfamiliar name

      Bing is the website you use to find Google. Unfortunately, Bing is so terrible that when searching for Google using Bing, you will to go to page 3 of the search results to get to Google.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Unfamiliar name

      Bing was in friends, first name Chandler.

    5. Wibble

      Re: Unfamiliar name

      What is this Windows 10 of which you speak?

    6. gz

      Re: Unfamiliar name

      It's an acronym: But It's Not Google

    7. Chika

      Re: Unfamiliar name

      He did that Christmas duet with David Bowie many years ago, if memory serves.

  7. Frank N. Stein

    I've removed that Search Box from the Task Bar, as I don't use it and rarely use the EDGE Browser, so Cortana is of no use on my Desktop PC.

    1. Mark 85

      Can Cortana be removed? I'm under the impression that it can't and it's running all the time.

      At some point, I suppose they'll tell you that Win10 can't run without Cortana it's phoning home, etc....

      1. John Geek

        click the search bar, click the 'gear' settings icon next to the box that pops up, turn cortana off. done.

        1. Dan 55 Silver badge

          And last but not least change the privacy settings so it doesn't upload your typing, etc... to Redmond. Or so we are led to believe.

      2. WonkoTheSane
        Megaphone

        B*tch can't listen to you without a mic plugged in!

        1. kryptonaut
          Alert

          Disconnection

          Have you not seen 2001? It'd go like this:

          Siri: This mission is too important for me to allow you to jeopardise it.

          Wonko: I don't know what you're talking about, Siri.

          Siri: I know that you were planning to disconnect me, and I'm afraid that's something I cannot allow to happen.

          Wonko: Where the hell'd you get that idea, Siri?

          Siri: Wonko, although you took very thorough precautions against my hearing you, I could see your lips move...

    2. Merchman
      Stop

      Until they implement a full screen option in Edge, I'm not even considering using it (and Cortana was turned off post-haste). There's nothing I like more, on my laptop with a small vertical resolution, is massive tool bars taking up screen real estate.

      1. gz

        "...small vertical resolution "

        Which reminds me - why is it so hard to get a decent 16:10 monitor these days? I have a 7 year old 24" HP on my Win7 machine but I'd like a newer one, preferably 27", for a new box and can't find one.

        Also, my 8 year old iMac is 16:10 but the new ones are 16:9, so no deal!

        What foolishness is this? Do screen makers think all we do is watch movies?

        ::headdesk::

  8. Nanners

    Except...

    No one uses cort(what'shername?)

  9. John Geek
    Devil

    Nearly the very first thing I did when I installed windows 10 was disable Cortana, and convert that search-box next to the start bar to be purely local file search. If I want to do an internet search, I use Chrome's search/locator bar.

  10. Innocent-Bystander*

    Well, They Got the Consistency Down

    Consistently shit, but consistent.

    Thanks guys, always knew we could count on you for an "integrated experience".

  11. tempemeaty
    Facepalm

    It's that bad

    "Microsoft calls this an "integrated experience," and believes Bing is your best bet for looking up info on the internet using Cortana."

    Or in other words, Microsofts' Bing is so good they can't get anyone to use it without being forced...

    1. Roq D. Kasba

      Re: It's that bad

      In fairness, Bing's not that bad. It was awful, now I wouldn't call it brilliant, but it's OK, and way ahead of where Yahoo, Lycos, AskJeeves, Altavista, etc got to.

      1. Richard 81

        Re: It's that bad

        Does anyone actually use Yahoo for searching any more?

        1. Vince

          Does anyone actually use Yahoo for searching... Richard81 asks...

          Yeah...

          All the people who use Windows 10 with forced Bing.

          Since Yahoo's results are effectively Bing's results as the Yahoo search is powered by Bing...

    2. pete 22
      Trollface

      Re: It's that bad

      You call it "Bing". We call it "Bung". We knew all about the goodness of corn before America was America. Mazola tastes fresh and good.

  12. inmypjs Silver badge

    I tried to care but quickly gave up

    Anyone running Windows 10 either accepts or is dumb enough to deserve whatever crap Microsoft foists on them.

    1. This post has been deleted by its author

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What next?

    Little animated gifs on web sites that state:

    "This site is best viewed using Cortana and Edge - Upgrade to Windows 10"

    Remember those days?

  14. Oengus

    Cue the EU competition watchdog...

    Time to launch another anti-trust/monopoly probe.

    This is just Microsoft flexing their "monopoly" position to remove user choice AGAIN.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Cue the EU competition watchdog...

      Stop bitching: you have a choice. Use one of the several hundred Linux distros available. Then you can bitch about Unity and systemd ...... and choose another fork that is free from them..

      1. Kubla Cant

        Re: Cue the EU competition watchdog...

        Stop bitching: you have a choice. Use one of the several hundred Linux distros available. Then you can bitch about Unity and systemd ...... and choose another fork that is free from them..

        The only truly safe option is RSTS/E.

        1. Chika

          Re: Cue the EU competition watchdog...

          A GUI based RSTS/E? Now there's a thought! :)

          1. Dave 15

            Re: Cue the EU competition watchdog...

            Takes me back... did some work for a company a number of years back that had a system that could turn the good old command line stuff into windows... so yes a gui on vi, a gui replacement for your vt100 terminal and its old fashioned text apps, even dos with a gui... what madness, give me a command line where I can tell it what I want anyday

            Is there an icon for grumpy old git? There should be

    2. Charlie Clark Silver badge

      Re: Cue the EU competition watchdog...

      Yes, shouldn't take much to get the European Commission to investigate.

      Microsoft: do the smart thing and make Cortana something that people want to use because it gives them the best results; this is what Google where it is. This will involve taking Edge outside and being humane.

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "..we have seen some software programs circumvent the design of Windows 10.."

    Well duuh! Changing the design of Windows has been fundamental to adoption levels since Windows 8. For many that's been the only way to stomach what Windows has become.

    Whatever argument Microsoft have for doing this, it really doesn't bode well for those who are comfortable using Windows 10 because they know how to get into the registry and really turn off all the unacceptable features. Or get a start menu that satisfies them. Or a pleasant UI.

    What's the betting that those tweaks will be next in the firing line?

    1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge

      Re: "..we have seen some software programs circumvent the design of Windows 10.."

      It's not like it's an "Operating System". Back in oldentimes, before Newspeak was applied, was meant to be a 'configurable hardware abstraction platform' instead of the crap propeller that it is now.

  16. willi0000000

    grab your big box of Crayolas® . . . find Fucking Shocked . . . color me.

  17. Zacherynuk

    Thank goodness for LTSB

    Which is was cheaper and easier to get hold of for the general hoards.

  18. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
    Trollface

    A Threesome with Cortana!

    Messieurs Bing and Edge doing the "Search Box" thing.

    Playmobil enactment soon!!

    MOAN!

    1. tempemeaty

      Re: A Threesome with Cortana!

      Bondage Cortana?

      XD

      * runs away quickly *

  19. 1Rafayal

    Does this mean Chrometana will no longer work?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      I just know Smetana...

  20. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I remeber something the guys who developed SIRI said

    After Apple acquired the technology for SIRI they said it became a lot stupider because whereas before SIRI used a lot of different sources for information, after they acquired it Apple restricted it to search sources they approved of.

    If poor Cortana is being chained to just Bing it will probably be like she's had a lobotomy :)

  21. Tony Paulazzo

    As our malware has infected increasing amounts of PC* we can now lock our software together and anyone unhappy with our brave new world has their info dump straight to the NSA. Mind you, so does everyone else but they won't be 'marked'. We are Apple 2.0 - evil fucking grin.

    I'm so on a list somewhere - so fuck you America! (just the secret services and bankers and lizard people - I'm sure the actual people are great, mostly), free speech FTW

    * I've had two customers who claim the 10 upgrade just started and then couldn't be stopped - now I'm sure they clicked a 'yes' box at some point unknowingly but that doesn't excuse forced installation...

    1. VinceH

      "I've had two customers who claim the 10 upgrade just started and then couldn't be stopped - now I'm sure they clicked a 'yes' box at some point unknowingly but that doesn't excuse forced installation..."

      Where I was Monday, someone commented that afternoon that another chap's computer "crashed" that morning. When I spoke to that person (bearing in mind I'm really there for accounts purposes, not IT) he said he was just working away, when all of a sudden the computer restarted for no apparent reason, and it was now 'different'.

      Glancing at his screen, it was clear he was now running Windows 10 - so probably as you say; confirming the upgrade without realising it.

      (I wonder - does the pop up respond to key presses? Is it a case of it popping up while the unsuspecting user is typing away, grabbing the input focus, and if the right key is being hit at the right time, the upgrade is confirmed and goes ahead?)

      1. Wade Burchette

        Windows 10 has been installing without permission. I know two people who told me their computer said that Windows 10 was installing in under 30 minutes. What was happening was the user was away and Windows 10 installed because the user didn't hit the X to cancel. (P.S. everyone I have talked to says they always hit the X to cancel. Windows 10 has a stink about it worse than Windows 8.) Microsoft has taken the attitude that it is better to apologize than ask for permission.

        1. VinceH

          "Windows 10 has been installing without permission."

          That I'm already aware of, since it almost happened with my machine* - but here it was a case of (before I took control of updates). One happened as part of the regular update cycle, and I caught and stopped it. The other, having taken control of Windows Update, was the time when the update screen carried a big splash for Win 10 with it already ticked.

          In the example given above, though, the guy was working away at the computer when it unexpectedly rebooted into the update. No 30 minute warning - just working away, then an unexpected reboot into Windows 10. Hence I'm wondering if the usual pop up appeared and he inadvertently said "Yes, please take me up the jacksie" simply by it gaining the focus while he was typing.

          * Originally,I had allowed GWX onto my system on the basis that I would eventually upgrade. That was obviously before MS successfully persuaded me it was a bad idea, by way of their foot-cannon.

        2. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

          "Microsoft has taken the attitude that it is better to apologize than ask for permission."

          Have they ever apologised?

      2. Timo

        Win10 upgrade - those bastards

        My mother got caught out by this, she called in a frenzy that her computer had just shut itself down in the middle of her using it.

        The popup windows for the 10 upgrade only give you two choices "upgrade now", or "upgrade later". They don't give you the choice of not to upgrade, you have to hit the "X" to get out of it this time around.

        I think there have been other choice combinations of "upgrade now" vs. "do not upgrade right now" (with the fine print of "do it later today"). No choice for "FO".

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    you will always go through Bing and Edge

    fast forward to 2045 and the European Commission of the ex-EU has just launched an investigation on the matter of abusing a monopolistic position in the (former) Microsoft.

  23. Terry 6 Silver badge

    Bing is reliable

    I'd started to write a sarky comment about how reliably Bing will serve up useless ads rather than useful information.

    But in fact when I gave it another try first its results on a few searches had improves and were pretty similar to Google's this time.

    So I guess you don't pays your money and you takes your choice of who grabs your data.

    Maybe the best plan is to switch between a range of searches so that no one gang gets a full picture.

    (With Duck Duck Go as much as possible).

    1. Andy A
      Thumb Down

      Re: Bing is reliable

      When Bing first came along I gave it a try. There's a surname in my family history which I want to know about. Unfortunately there's a town in New Hampshire which is completely unconnected, so my usual google search is

      <surname> -Hampshire -NH -estate

      and Bing promptly gave me seven pages of real estate agents in New Hampshire, with the first sensible result on page 8.

      Things have improved since, but not enough for me to switch my default search engine.

      Except on my WinPhone, where there is no other option. It's on the current release (not beta) of WP10, and the search "experience" is dire.

      On Wednesday evening, I tapped the search icon. Before it would do anything, it demanded that I revalidate my Microsoft Account. No idea why. I had tried search earlier that afternoon without comment.

      Luckily I had my laptop not far away, and could retrieve the email - the phone does NOT have access to that account.

      Once MS were convinced that I was the same person as I had been an hour ago, I actually tried a search in the Cortana box.

      It sat there for about 2 minutes without even an animated hourglass - in a place with 5 bars showing for 4G reception. Eventually it popped up to tell me:

      "There is something wrong."

      Too bloody true there is. It's named Microsoft.

      1. Dave 15

        Re: Bing is reliable

        Yup, seems like fairly typical experience. The more Microsoft 'progresses' the more and more unusable it gets. office 360 is a crock - really, I would rather jump up and down on my own testicles than use it. The latest OS releases have been the same. Outlook... well, if that is the outlook then roll me back a few decades.

        It only wants the linux world to actually deliver something useful and I (exmsft or not) will move to linux in a flash. Its a pity that the mobile phone world lost symbian, at least that was usable.

  24. pewpie

    Someone call Nelson..

    We need a Hah-hah.. stat.

  25. Anonymous Coward
    Headmaster

    EU competition Commission

    How would the EU competition Commission feel about this decision?

  26. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Not using a Microsoft account

    Therefore, not using Cortana.

    Nothing of worth has been lost.

  27. sawatts

    So, if we put Cortana, Siri, and Alexa in a room together... Can we get them to start talking with each other?

    *SCIENCE*

    1. VinceH

      Well, how about two out of the three ? (It's a couple of years old now, but still funny.)

  28. Timmy B

    I am amazed...

    That everyone complains about MS gathering data through Win 10 and then happily uses chrome and google. MS are the inferior cousins to google when it comes to data slurping....

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I am amazed...

      @Timmy B - at the moment. But it seems to me that MS is attempting to head Google off at the pass by grabbing users data before Google even gets a sniff at it.

    2. captain veg Silver badge

      Re: I am amazed...

      Who is this "everyone" of which you speak? I avoid everything Google and Microsoft to the greatest extent practicable. I doubt that I'm alone.

      I do wonder, though, about those people who, given an actual URL, *still* prefer to share it with Google than put it in the address bar. What's that all about?

      -A.

    3. This post has been deleted by its author

  29. Alperian

    They never learn

    Isn't it an "integrated experience" that got them a 571 million Euro fine in 2013?

    1. Dave 15

      Re: They never learn

      I bet they have learnt... this time they will have paid off a few hands and worked a way right around the anti-trust stuff. They may not be nice but they are also not stupid

  30. Cuddles

    I skimmed it first

    "The Cortana search box in the Windows 10 task bar will, from today, always use Bing and Microsoft's Edge browser to find stuff on the web.

    "The result is a compromised experience that is less reliable and predictable.""

    Sadly, it turns out they weren't being quite that honest and there were some bits in between I missed on the first reading.

  31. Rich 11

    Translation

    As Windows 10 has grown in adoption and usage...

    Since we started forcing it down your throats...

    all designed to do more for you

    Enjoy your assimilation.

  32. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Up

    Everything will be fine...

    ...if we get another Clean Bandit ad.

  33. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    EU please investigate

    As obviously they are using their dominant position in the windows operating system to push people to their browser and search.

    The EU needs to at least be consistent with its investigations...

  34. Florida1920
    Headmaster

    Deja vu

    Reminds me of the time when Internet Explorer got so fully "integrated" into the OS that you couldn't get rid of it in favor of another browser. All this bullying: forcing the use of their browser, force-feeding updates to Win 10 -- all smack of desperation. If you've got something truly good, why do you need to force people to use it?

    1. h4rm0ny

      Re: Deja vu

      >>"Reminds me of the time when Internet Explorer got so fully "integrated" into the OS that you couldn't get rid of it in favor of another browser."

      You really don't want to know about ChromeOS, then!

  35. nilfs2
    Linux

    I have the solution

    Ditch Windows and use Linux

  36. gz

    Sigh... enough of this nonsense, I think I'll go back to using my ZX80

    1. Chika
      Trollface

      Sigh... enough of this nonsense, I think I'll go back to using my ZX80

      Your Windows 10 Upgrade for your Sinclair ZX80 is now ready to download

  37. DaveKH

    Would it be the same kind of integrated experience caused Microsoft to be made to offer other web browsers apart from Exploder some long time ago?

    That core 'any choice as long as it's their choice' attitude runs through them like Blackpool does through rock. Or more likely a belief is not knowing there might be something else.

  38. Dave 15

    This will lasst all the way to court

    Unless the money has already been changing back hands :)

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