back to article Muted HAMR blow from Seagate: damp squib drive coming in 2016

Seagate R&D bigwig Jan-Ulrich Thiele says the first Seagate prototype drives built with heat-assisted magnetic recording (HAMR) will arrive in late 2016 and have just 4TB capacity, according to Heise.de. This is not quite right as what Seagate says is: "Seagate anticipates shipping a small number of HAMR qualification units to …

  1. Efros

    He shortage

    I wonder how much the predicted shortage of He will affect the price and availability of He filled drives. Admittedly the amounts involved on a per drive basis is very small but for the industry overall it must have some impact.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: He shortage

      There is no impact. A party balloon could supply helium for hundreds of drives.

      There isn't a lot of empty space inside a hard drive enclosure.

  2. Steven Jones

    The slow death of the HDD

    No amount of increasing of bit density is going to resolve the fundamental problem with HDDs, and that's IOPs and, of course, latency. Indeed the higher the areal bit density, the worse (in relative terms) the problem gets. I suppose if HDDs are just to end up as a semi-archival repository for very rarely accessed data then price/capacity is the only advantage left, so it makes sense. It might well be in five years time HDDs are reduced to a niche product.

    Helium filled or not, the fundamental issues with HDDs remain as they are dictated by geometry and materials and engineering can only make marginal improvements in ameliorating the issues. Adding caching helps to a certain level (whether device, array, system or application based) helps, but at a certain point it hits the law of diminishing returns. The future looks bleak for the makers of spinning stuff of all sorts of storage, whether it's HDDs, CDs, DVDs or anything related.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: The slow death of the HDD

      You don't need tens of thousands of IOPS for a media drive or cold storage tier. Price per TB is still unmatched. A 15 terabyte SSD is nice but it will cost thousands of dollars for now.

      If HAMR can knock HDD prices to below $10/TB and boost capacity up to 100 TB, there is still some life for the hard drive.

      1. Ian Michael Gumby
        Boffin

        @AC ...Re: The slow death of the HDD

        The costs of the chips will go down. How long that takes depends on demand and their ability to create the chips.

        With non voltile resistive ram (NVRe Ram) on the fringe ... we can see the end of the spinning rust.

        I remember starting out with my Ohio Scientific 3A and 2 double sided drives that stored 256K per 8" floppy back in the late 70's. So sorry, I will not miss the spinning rust, but welcome the advancement of new tech. smaller, faster and using less energy.

    2. Ammaross Danan

      Re: The slow death of the HDD

      You are making the mistake of assuming HDDs are trying to compete on IOPS. They're not (at least since SSDs went mainstream). They're large data drives. Your new 30GB game (most games are large indexed archives), multi-TB video collection, TBs of photos, etc. You don't get 8TB of spinning rust to put your OS and apps on.

      Hard drives are still excellent with the one thing they're good at: large sequential writes and reads. HAMR will even improve the other thing they're good at: offline (or nearly so) data storage, as NAND requires data refresh cycles (similar to RAM, but with a larger timeframe between refreshing), which means data on an SSD that's tossed in a drawer will (most likely) not be readable in 3 years.

  3. DanceMan

    Helium

    I question the long-term viability of a helium filled drive due to inevitable leakage over time, meaning over years.

    1. Steven Jones

      Re: Helium

      There is no inevitable leakage. At least not at any rate that will matter during the lifetime of a drive. The engineers who design these drives will be aware of the issues. These aren't party balloons.

      If you doubt helium can be contained for very long periods, consider how the stuff is actually extracted. It's from separation from natural gas reserves where it accumulates over millions of years from the radioactive decay of uranium and thorium. The same conditions that trap natural gas also trap the helium. If helium can be trapped over millions of years (under pressure), there won't be any problem in containing a small amount in an aluminium casting. I suspect it's the gasket which is the only real problem.

      1. Aitor 1

        Re: Helium

        Helium diffuses in aluminum

        http://www.newenergytimes.com/v2/library/2007/2007SchultheThesisExcerpts.pdf

        Here, have a thesis on it.

        1. Alan Brown Silver badge

          Re: Helium

          "Helium diffuses in aluminum"

          Yes and that thesis is about when it's pressurised. Hard drives aren't, so diffusion rates are extremely low.

          You don't have to prevent helium diffusing out indefinitely, just make sure that it takes at least 7-8 years to do so to any noticeable extent.

      2. Gavin King

        Re: Helium

        Helium doesn't just diffuse through aluminium either; when studying I learnt that photomultiplier tubes (essentially a glass vacuum-tube with a metal suitably susceptible to the photo-electric effect inside, and some clever, if simple, amplification) shouldn't be stored where helium is present. The helium diffuses through the glass and ruins the vacuum, if given enough time.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Boffin

          Re: Helium

          Ummm, you do realize that glass is not a solid? Helium is just one example of things that diffuse through that liquid we call glass.

          1. Nigel 11

            Re: Helium

            Glass is a solid, for any meaningful definition. It's just not a crystalline solid. It's a class of solid matter commonly referred to as amorphous, or often just as a glass.

            Another class of solid is made of long tangled chain molecules, such as rubber or some plastics. There may be further categories.

          2. Degenerate Scumbag

            Re: Helium

            Where I come from, liquids aren't capable of shattering.

            1. Adair Silver badge

              Re: Helium

              You need to get out more. Try stirring a viscous solution of corn starch---do it fast enough and it will shatter.

    2. PleebSmash

      Re: Helium

      Helium-filled drives from HGST come with 5 year warranties.

      1. roytrubshaw
        Linux

        Re: Helium

        "Helium-filled drives from HGST come with 5 year warranties."

        Not really viable for long-term archival storage then. :)

        Does it have to be Helium? Wouldn't Neon do? It's about as unreactive - unlike that dangerously volatile Xenon character!

        Perhaps we could make the drive casings out of "transparent aluminum(sic)" and have dual-purpose devices: data-storage and illumination?

        1. Alan Brown Silver badge

          Re: Helium

          "Does it have to be Helium?"

          Yes.

          "Wouldn't Neon do? "

          No.

          You could use Hydrogen, but it would probably ruin the internals in short order.

    3. Phil Koenig

      Helium and longevity

      Besides the "helium leakage" issue, I don't suppose enough people realize (and the industry isn't going around telling them, of course) that flash memory has this annoying problem of just getting amnesia over time.

      One of the scariest aspects of SSDs and flash memory in general, to me, is the fact that data can just start randomly disappearing while they sit on the shelf, with no voltage applied.

      Someone at Seagate who also is a member of the JEDEC standards-body wrote a highly publicized paper on this which was published last May, but the issue of offline flash/SSD data retention has been known-about for years.

      1. Nigel 11

        Re: Helium and longevity

        One of the scariest aspects of SSDs and flash memory in general, to me, is the fact that data can just start randomly disappearing while they sit on the shelf, with no voltage applied.

        You think that can't happen with a hard disk drive? Or with tape? I've seen both suffer bit-rot in storage. With a hard drive it can be utterly catastrophic (the drive won't spin up again, possibly because its bearings have siezed).

        FWIW I've not yet experienced a DVD-R stored in a dark cupboard going bad on me. OTOH it's probably just a matter of time, and that's not a practical way of storing Terabytes in any case.

        The only "safe" long-term storage is a continuously running and monitored storage system with multiple redundancies, data-scrubbing, and prompt replacement of any failed or failing disk drive followed by data regeneration. Which costs.

        1. harddrive1

          Re: Helium and longevity

          I think what the person was saying is correct. HDDs unlike flash are still non volatile. Even is the drive won't spin up the data can still be recovered as the data is still written onto the media.

  4. Nigel 11

    Only 4Tb?

    I'm guessing, but I expect it's a one-platter 4Tb drive. Once the technology has been sufficiently tested in that form, multi-platter should get them to 20Tb.

    Possibly, it's a one-surface prototype, in which case that's 8Tb/platter.

  5. YARR
    Stop

    If HAMR drives need a larger gap between platters to accommodate a laser in the read-write head assembly, how can Helium reduce the gap if the fundamental problem is the head size? To solve the head size problem, either the lasers must be shrunk in size, or they must be moved outside the platters and the energy transferred to the head via some kind of a heat resistant optical fibre.

    On the issue of hard drives v high capacity SSDs, the primary issue is cost, not data density. Multi terabyte SSDs cost thousands of pounds because they comprise many, perhaps hundreds of layers of silicon, each of which have to individually etched. Unless the cost of the chip fabrication process can be reduced through automation, then large capacity SSDs will remain expensive. Also current SSD technology is approaching a limit, so don't expect capacities to continue increasing for long, until a new memory technology replaces it.

    1. Nigel 11

      If HAMR drives need a larger gap between platters to accommodate a laser in the read-write head assembly...

      That would be such a major and fundamental design problem that the proposed technology would never have gotten off the drawing board.

      Well, probably. You can cite the Austin Allegro, the DC10, and Windows 8 as exceptions that prove the rule.

      I'll give Seagate the benefit of the doubt for now. It's their company on the line ....

    2. Mark Hahn

      right. people who rave about flash being the death of hdd always seem to forget that litho and hd platters are both 2d, and therefore follow the same moore's-like law: shrinks give exponential effect.

  6. Conundrum1885

    Re. drives

    What about using 3.6mm lasers and optics located on the side of the platter?

    The idea here is that the beam can be set to fixed focus and with some clever design and a simple on-chip waveguide be turned to hit the platter where needed.

    Plus the advantage with this method is that if the laser diodes start to weaken they can be replaced without affecting anything else in a cleanroom.

    Bonus points for including laser powering of the head amplifiers so more than one head can be on a given head arm for increased IOPS.

  7. gwangy

    Thank god, its Hammer time at last (ask your dad)

    or lets hope these are not Hammer horrors (ask your g/dad)

  8. Deckard_C

    Helium diffusion

    Don't you just need to stop the diffusion of other gases into the drive. As I can't see the helium diffusing out to leave a vacuum.

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