O2 cranks prices mid-contract, essentially telling customers to like it or lump it

Britian's comms regulator has criticized O2 for hiking prices beyond what customers agreed to, exploiting a loophole in rules designed to end unpredictable mid-contract increases. Millions of subscribers to the O2 network – now merged with Virgin Media as VMO2 – could face bills rising up to 40 percent more than expected from …

[may_i]

How delightfully Freudian

...plan their household budgets," Ofcome told us. ...

[Like a badger]

Re: How delightfully Freudian

Another classic Ofcom failure, but it's only part of a wider pattern of regulators who are plodding "Arms Length Bodies" and that dramatically limits their authority (compared to being part of a government department) and weakens the link between experience of how regulation works in practice and how policy (made by government departments) then needs to develop. Look at the miserable and dysfunctional state of energy supply, telecoms, post, water, and the single common theme is that the regulator is an ALB.

ALB exist for two reasons only - firstly so that shit head politicians can distance themselves from the regulator and pretend that the outcomes are not their fault, and second to pretend that ALB workforce isn't part of the civil service, thus pretending that they've made some reduction in the size of the civil service.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: How delightfully Freudian

They did try and ban it, but the terminology was nerfed by lobbying.

They banned mid contract price rises *linked to inflation*.

The spirit of this ban was to prevent mid contract price rises...but instead of linking to inflation, price rises are now just arbitrary because of the loose terminology.

Thats why they mean by "the spirit" of the rules.

[Roland6]

Re: How delightfully Freudian

Ofcom were negligent when they removed the inflation link they also removed the 3.9% cap on real-terms increases.

Net effect has been that for many the new annual mid contract price increase has been more (both as a percentage and in monetary terms) than it would have been under the old formula.

[low_resolution_foxxes]

Re: How delightfully Freudian

This strikes me as "just about legal, but ethically dubious"

I hope Ofcom returns to challenge this, just to avoid other companies getting into the habit. This decision clearly went through the legal and commercial teams and it just smells bad all around

If you can leave O2, please do. I'm not clear how this works with regards to the device ownership...you can apparently leave without penalty, but they presumably will stick to their "pay for the device" option

Frankly, O2s webshop seems entirely focussed on selling high-cost/high-profit Apple (yuk), Google and Samsung phones. I much prefer buying brands like the Xiaomi POCO X and F range (good prices on Amazon). Perfectly great Android smartphones for £150-£250 with the faster charger and high capacity batteries.

In comparison to iPhones that seem to think £300-1200 is a sensible price for a pocket computer

O2's website seems primarily arranged to sell "premium" (yuk) iPhones to marketing executives for £50+ pm

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: O2's website seems primarily arranged to sell "premium"

Isn't that the same as Voda and all the rest? Those premium phones are where they make the most money.

Personally, I would not touch any product that runs software from Google or Microsoft. My current iPhone (SE-3) was bought for £180. It was brand new, boxed. You don't have to pay Apple prices. The same goes for paying the likes of O2 vastly over priced contracts for phones + connection. I use GiffGaff £5.00 a month and EU roaming included.

[low_resolution_foxxes]

Re: O2's website seems primarily arranged to sell "premium"

Good work, I can see that's a good price and deal

[carguy143]

Re: How delightfully Freudian

What many don't realise is these new phone plans where the phone and airtime are seen as two separate entities mean the network wins because the terms usually state that to hage the phone agreement, you need an active airtime plan so yes, technically you can leave the airtime plan due to the new price change, but, you'll lose your phone after doing so as you'll need to give it back.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: How delightfully Freudian

A number of US Cell Companies are offering 5 Year Fixed contracts…..

https://www.techradar.com/phones/iphone/t-mobile-just-announced-a-five-year-price-guarantee-on-all-its-5g-unlimited-plans

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: How delightfully Freudian

I read that as "Arms Length Buddies".

Which would explain a lot.

[Roland6]

Re: How delightfully Freudian

If Ofcom were really concerned about consumers having certainty they would have banned mid-contract price increases, for all contracts of 36 months or less.

This would also encourage the mobile providers to “plan their household budgets”…

[Pascal Monett]

"telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

If only the market were truly free, they'd have one big surprise the next day, when all of their customers went somewhere else.

And that's all they deserve.

[abend0c4]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

O2 also do 30-day rolling contracts both directly and, at a modestly reduced cost, via giffgaff. However, their 24 month contracts are significantly cheaper on a monthly basis than either: of course they'll recoup some of that from people who fail to act promptly at the end of the contract when the prices jump.

I'm not, in principle, against the idea of fixed-term contracts, but it seems to me that the permitted maximum contract period is far too long: a lot can happen to prices in 24 months. I suspect if the maximum contract period were 12 months people would feel a lot less aggrieved.

I'm sure I've mentioned before that recent aggressive competition in Portugal (where 24 month contracts were the norm) has brought typical contracts down to 3 months as well as significantly lowering costs. This has largely been delivered through no-frills operations (often subsidiaries of the traditional operators) that have largely eliminated the highly-incentivised sales staff and "free" TVs and tablets that were previously required to get people to sign up to long, expensive contracts against their better judgment. I've been surprised at how long phone shops have persisted in the high street when we no longer expect to find an Electricity or Gas Board selling cookers and fridges. It might be useful if Ofcom were to separate the network operators from their other commercial activities.

[Charlie Clark]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

No, the real problem was allowing the market to consolidate to the degree it has. In a competitive market service is quality is much a differential as price or type of product; in consolidated markets the need to differentiate is removed as is, therefore, customer choice.

In regulated markets, price increases related to inflation should be possible – you can have chronic underinvestment where this isn't the case. However, the rise in company costs will rarely be the same as retail price inflation (RPI) and price increases should, therefore, require approval by the regulator on a pre-agreed basis. RPI will certainly be a factor – many pay deals include a link – but other costs will be the same or may have fallen.

[Like a badger]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

"In regulated markets, price increases related to inflation should be possible"

Not for short term contracts they shouldn't. Multi-billion pound companies have the competence and resources to forecast their costs ahead, to hedge risks like FX and power costs, and if the Ofcom were not a chocolate teapot then they would have mandated fixed price within minimum term contracts. There is no sector as loosely and ineffectually regulated as communications, that could be changed, but it won't because government don't give a shit.

[JT_3K]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

"There is no sector as loosely and ineffectually regulated as communications"

[Water industry has entered the chat]

[Charlie Clark]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

Define short term? Most utilites have contracts that allow price rises at least once a year.

I guess what you're talking about are the standard "fixed term" contracts, typically two years for mobile phones. They nearly all have the option to increase prices at some point – because they're supposed to be renewed – with the option to cancel. But the problem is, in an uncompetitive market there little or no incentive to switch provider for a lower price/better service. That said, many industries have been faced with extraordinary price rises in electricity. If, in such cases, at least part of the price rise can't be passed on, bankruptcy and/or state bailouts may be necessary and who does that help?

[I ain't Spartacus]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

abend0c4,

The problem with 12 month contracts is that they become incredibly expensive when tied to buying a new phone. Plus most people are now keeping their phones for 2 years, at least. It would be better if people bought their handsets themselves, and bought SIM-only contracts, because you then don't have this problem.

It's not like we're being horribly ripped off though. My Mum has a contract for £6 or £7 a month that gives her unlimited calls and texts and 5GB of data a month. Admittedly that's with Lebara, not one of the actual providers. We just renewed the company contract and I think we're paying more like £12 a month per handset - but get more data, and we're with EE direct. I also did the calculation and if we'd taken the deal that got us all new iPhones for 2 years, then I think we were paying about £20 extra - which is effectively interest on a hire purchase.

On the other hand, some companies clearly take the piss.

[Hugo Rune]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

o2 do a £8 / Month tarriff on Mr Lewis' website, currently 32GB. I always switch to the latest version when the April price hike happens. Only worth having over Lebara or Smarty if you have VMo2 Broadband as it doubles your 32GB to 64GB and ups your internet speed a bit.

[Donchik]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

Interested in the detail of the email I got.

It includes a comment about being on Volt, effectively both O2 and Virgin broadband.

Indicated that if you were on Volt this allows you to get out of Both contracts without penalty.

"Because you have a Volt bundle, this right to cancel also applies to your Virgin Media package"

Perhaps good opportunity to try and screw down BOTH parts of the business for a discounted service?

[Charlie Clark]

Re: "telling customers to leave if they don't like it"

I agree that £7 a month for 5GB is okay – I pay a little less than that here and get a bit more data, but don't really need it. I'm more interested in network coverage and reliability for when I need it.

Many contracts rely on inertia to make more money from customers over time – banks were infamous for doing this and continually creating new account types to do so and it's similar for fixed line services, which can be more cumbersome to switch.

The switch to PAYG and thence to separate contracts for the service and the device started about 20 years ago in Europe and quickly became the majority. It's really the best option for anyone who does not intend to buy a new phone on hire purchase every two years. But I think it's safe to assume that many people cannot be bothered to check every two years, so some regulation is necessary.

[katrinab]

I took the opportunity to cancel the contract and move elsewhere. It was going to expire next month anyway, and I was gonig to move then anyway, because the renewal prices were rubbish compared to what I can get elsewhere.

[Anonymous Coward]

Sadly not everyone has this option, phone signal for other providers around here is terrible. I live in the heart of NIMBY land, so getting masts rolled out is difficult.

The real fix here is to prevent local interference with mast installs. This country needs to grow up and understand that local NIMBYs have a lot to answer for when it comes to being part of the general decline of this country. Immigration is a problem, sure, but we have problems with our own people as well.

Quite a lot of legislation needs to be fixed...not least rules around road resurfacing...if a councillor decides the road outside their house needs to be fixed, and only that piece of road...they should be forced to resurface everything within a minimum radius for that to happen.

My previous local council was made up mostly of a local residents association, plus a sprinkling of conservatives...and you could tell where they lived because the patches of road and the lamp posts out side their houses were always perfect...but everywhere else was loaded with dead lamp posts, pot holes etc.

They've gone now, replaced by the Lib Dems no less...and as a result, things are now getting done that benefit the whole area not just the select spots outside of councillors homes.

We need to put a stop to cross authority bail outs as well...if a board of councillors drives a local authority into the ground, they should be ousted and banned from standing again...it's that simple...they should not be able to go cap in hand to the next authority over and beg for a bail out.

My local authority has spent a lot of money in the past bailing out other failed authorities which has led to less spending in my area using my tax money...lots of local authority funded services and schemes were shut down because we were spunking money elsewhere.

[katrinab]

There are MVNOs that run on the O2 network, you could switch to one of them.

Moneysaving Expert lists GiffGaff which is a subsidiary of O2, Sky who are probably just as bad, and Tesco.

My requirements were to avoid Vodafone and Three, because my other phone is with IDMobile which is on the Three network, and I want both of my phones to be on different networks so there's a better chance that one of them will have a signal. I also want included European roaming because I travel abroad frequently, so I've switched to Spusu which is on the EE network. Only signed up yesterday, and the transfer hasn't happened yet, so I can't comment on what they are like.

[Anonymous Coward]

Unpaid Promo :)

I transferred to SPUSU approx 4 months ago ... it works so well !!!

The app is good and works properly, unlike the EE app I had. [Yes, I know yet another app BUT this one works !!!]

Your monthly invoices etc are all available via the app, as are your Call/Data[Home & Roaming]/SMS logs.

The availability via EE is the same as of old, unfortunately I can ONLY use EE due to being in a 'No reception zone' (Too many customers, not enough cell towers).

Cheaper than EE and works better than I previously had (with the same phone) ... WiFi calling works as well as far as I can tell.

(Outgoing Calls are working better than I had with EE, no dropouts or variable quality in a call, no known cell tower upgrades etc.)

Unlimited Calls & SMS + 20GB Data [10GB if roaming] == £6.90 per month.

Very impressed and will never use EE again.

It takes a lot to get me to plug something for free but SPUSU seem to have got the balance of good service and good pricing right.

P.S.

Signup & transfer from EE worked perfectly, no loss of phone access etc ... Given window of the transfer which worked as specified.

:)

[Danny 14]

lyca mobile is cheap with rolling contracts, an mvno of EE

[gryphon]

3.9%

I have never understood where that 3.9% came from and why they were allowed to make it 'inflation + 3.9%' rather than 'inflation or 3.9% whichever is higher'.

Latter obviously isn't great either but at least makes more sense.

I seem to recall reading, probably here, that some of the telco's, ISP's etc. would also base the total rise on the 'non-discounted' contract price so you'd be thinking the rise would be say 10% on £10 a month but was actually 10% on £30 a month because you were getting a £20pm 'discount'. Shady practise.

[StewartWhite]

Re: 3.9%

The extra 3.9% is necessary as the C Suite wouldn't be able to afford another yacht without it - the ludicrous idea that O2 et al and Ofcom state that "it's for investment" is manure of the highest ordure; witness Thames Water and the endless "investment" that ended up in the pockets of Macquarie rather than being spent on something useful like a working sewage farm. Clearly the latest scam mid-contract price rise is because those at the top of the O2 dung heap now also need another Ferrari.

The wringing of hands at Ofcom is truly pathetic. "Those nasty mobile networks have added yet more to their profits beyond the 3.9% + inflation limit. If only there was a regulatory agency that had responsibility for overseeing them. Oh wait, that's us isn't it? In that case, here's a slap on the wrist and, to all the other networks, please don't do this as well (wink, wink)".

[katrinab]

Re: 3.9%

It is because they were taken over by Virgin Media, and they need to "repay" the aquisition cost.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Virgin media

Please use their real name

VERMIN

Their customer service sucks.

[Korev]

Don't give O2 the Oxygen of Publicity

[Lunatik]

"If only there was some agency or body which could do something to prevent this or punish trangressors" said Ofcom

Toothless and/or meek regulators are worse than none at all.

[Dan 55]

"We're very disappointed indeed" - that'll bring the multinationals to heal.

[ITMA]

Gary Oldman puts it very well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84zY33QZO5o

[TonyJ]

Ofcom are useless.

I'd been with EE for years (out of contract, SIM-only) but at that time they didn't do unlimited data plans and so I made a very temporary move to Three (terrible coverage back then).

When I went back to EE, I signed a 24 month contract. It was for two numbers - my own and one for my son.

For his, I took only 25GB of data, because on the call I was assured I could gift 100GB a month of my own allowance.

Except:

1. You can't. You can only ever gift a maximum of 99.5GB - it won't let you gift the last 500MB - that's potentially a lot of data they are stealing from customers.

2. Because they have such antiquated systems, they have to add a "100GB pot" onto your unlimited data - and it's from this "pot" that you can gift.

3. Except - any data you use is first taken from that pot, so unless you remember to gift it at the start of each month, you lose out what you can gift

Nowhere on EE's site or in my contract were these terms noted.

Nowhere was it explained during the time I took out the contract.

No one I spoke to at EE in their support teams knew this was the case except for one person in their (I think) third line who I was put through to because "Oh I know someone who can explain this"

So I complained.

Ofcom were utterly useless.

The kept saying "It clearly states you can gift up to 100GB of data" - without listening to the root cause of my complaint.

They then - and this is the kicker - referred to the contract uploaded by EE. Not a copy of my signed contract. Oh no. An updated one that was more descriptive and dated some months after the version I signed. And refused to listen when I explained it. They just kept saying "but it's in the contract".

Fucking pointless entity.

[Anonymous Coward]

Sword in the stone

Sounds about right for a bodge from EE when it comes to price plans. These anecdotes bring me back to the days of when I used to be in the phone business working for the Kevin Bacon toting operator. All of the plans used to be a system called Excalibur and you used to have to effectively "build" a package with lots of said bolt-ons or bodges, and it had lots of quirks, so even the most easy thing (in theory) could be a pain in the backside to do. I wonder if they still use this?

[Danny 14]

99.5 is "up to 100"

[Anonymous Coward]

Why does OFCOM not have the balls to suggest legislation that gives them the power to force a contract rate on a mobile, internet connection etc to be fixed?

Lengthy contracts would vanish and companies would have to provide quality services to keep customers. It would improve competition and investment. Thus benefit everyone.

[Like a badger]

"Why does OFCOM not have the balls to suggest legislation that gives them the power to force a contract rate on a mobile, internet connection etc to be fixed?"

They could suggest it, but policy responsibility for making legislation rests currently with DSIT although for most of the past twenty years it was DCMS. DCMS endured 14 years of appalling quality ministers (eg Hunt, Hancock, Dorries, Dowden) and they spent about 14 months in post before being replaced. DSIT aren't much better, another minor government department in which none of the ministers understand their portfolio or the sectors they cover.

[45RPM]

What with this price rise, and O2s announcement of a contract signed with StarLink, I’m switching provider.

I’m not prepared to be a Nazi enabler by putting any of my money, even indirectly, in Elon’s pocket.

[Anonymous Coward]

Would you care to suggest a non-Nazi sattelite ISP with the same or lower prices?

Thought so.

[Anonymous Coward]

Relax man, he's just another lost leftie...hopefully they will eventually return to what the left wing actually stood for and we can have balance again.

They don't seem to understand that they need people like Elon Musk in order to have something to collectively moan about, he's their anti-christ, they just don't know it yet. For a long time we've had virtue signalling corporations and inclusion policies...so the lefties couldn't complain about the corporates anymore...ever since they've been on a search for that one thing they can all moan about...but it turns out they all have different whacky ideas and can no longer even agree on one collective thing to moan about...so they moan about everything and consequently they've lost sight of exactly what it is that they stand for. They fought the corporate overlords, the overlords gave them what they wanted, the left fragmented under the weight of their own hubris, the corporates are starting to wind everything back and the left is a mess because the needle keeps skipping on calling everyone a nazi...the corporations won.

If Elon plays his cards right, he could become the focal point of all the left wing angst...if he pulls that off, he'll be able to control left wing anger like a cat with a laser pointer.

[PinchOfSalt]

Cats with laser pointers?

Is that like Sharks with freakin' lasers on their heads?

[LVPC]

>> Would you care to suggest a non-Nazi sattelite ISP with the same or lower prices?

Since when is a satellite internet connection a "must - have"?

[Anonymous Coward]

Musk as a lot of shortcomings, but you can't deny that Starlink is a shockingly good service.

I came in contact with it twice this year on two holidays in extremely remote areas and it was just excellent. Had none of the shortcomings I expected from satellite broadband. I'm a network engineer and you can bet your ass I tested the fuck out of it and approached it with a level of skepticism. Is it perfect? No...no it's not...is it a better experience than say...5G or ADSL...absolutely. It's not as good as a fixed line fibre connection, but it's better than everything else and for what it is, it's reasonably priced. The routers could be better, they are a bit cheap...but the connection itself...insane.

I had a 150mbps connection slap dab in the middle of the ocean and I didn't have to pay stupid maritime network roaming fees. It was expensive, but not extortionate as maritime roaming usually is.

Being on a cruise ship with nothing but ocean in every direction for hundreds of miles with a blazing fast internet connection made me feel like my first Compuserve disk had arrived again. It's that good. That feeling that you are so remote and yet still connected everywhere.

Where politics are concerned...you can't really avoid the "bad guys" since there aren't actually any "good guys"...the left has lost it's way. The left has become so inclusive and diverse that it doesn't represent anyone or anything in particular. They are so detached that they've essentially decapitated themselves.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/ze10S-PCH2M

At the very least, at least "bad guys" like Elon actually build things and do things. As much as I'm sure it pains you to do so, you have to give credit where it is due. I don't particularly like the guy, but I can't deny that he's built something solid.

[katrinab]

For sure, if you pay your money to Starlink, what you receive in return is a very good product.

However, it is just not sustainable as a business model, as they are losing vast amounts of money, and the satellites only have a working life of about 5 years before they fall out of the sky and need to be replaced.

[LVPC]

>> Being on a cruise ship with nothing but ocean in every direction for hundreds of miles with a blazing fast internet connection made me feel like my first Compuserve disk had arrived again.

You're on a cruise ship in the middle of the ocean and what floats your boat is an internet connection? Couldn't find ANYTHING else to do?

[ChoHag]

I thought that having nothing to do was the whole point in being in the middle of the ocean? In any case I'd hope it wasn't an internet connection that's keeping the boat afloat.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why not cut out the bullshit entirely and go fully off grid. You could be Unabomber 2.0.

[Dan 55]

Lots of Musk fanboy ACs about today, they might even be different people...

[WolfFan]

Somehow, I doubt this.

[45RPM]

Yes. But you have to feel sorry for all the Musk fanbois, Faragistas, Magaists and so forth. They’ve been played, and most of them aren’t prepared (despite the evidence) to admit that they screwed up. So they fall back on their last resort - which is always along the lines of “well, it was worth it to own the libs”.

Deep down, if you mine the reason that they voted the way they did, I think you might even find a genuine seam of discontent. And if you really poke away at it, you’ll find that the real cause of their discontent is the same as the discontent that fuels all of our ire. There are real concerns about the quality, availability (and, in the US, cost) of healthcare, education and social care. There are real concerns about crime and policing, maybe even geopolitics, and the wellbeing of ones friends and family. These are universal concerns. And if you stop for a moment to think about it, the problem isn’t immigration (it’s a convenient scapegoat, but if handled correctly it could be part of the solution. There are qualified engineers, medics, builders, farmers and so forth in the diaspora coming to the shores of the wealthy “first” world. Rather than using taxpayer money to pay for them to live in crappy accommodation, we could house them in custom built immigration centres for a few weeks whilst work is found for them - and then let them pay their way whilst their immigration claim is processed.). The problem is the billionaires to refuse to pay their way. The Musks. The Trumps. The Farages and so forth. And guess what? They’re pals with the media magnates like Murdoch who also don’t want to pay their way. The owners of the social media networks who are similarly tight, and able to weaponise and amplify this discontent, directing the anger away from the real source of the problem (the super rich) and scapegoating those who have nothing at all.

And the evidence that these con men are selling a con is plain for everyone to see. Remember how Trump said that he’d make America Great Again - but instead is turning it into a tin-pot dictatorship, increasing the divide between the rich and the poor? Remember how Brexit was going to be brilliant - but instead is ruining the British economy and, er, increasing the divide between rich and poor?

So yes. I feel very angry with the people who are genuinely responsible for the ills of society, and who make enemies out of those who most need our help. But I also feel pity for those who lack the ability to think critically, to recognise that they’ve been played like a cheap fiddle. Many of whom, it seems, are on this very forum - and posting as Anonymous Coward. And if you’re wondering if you’re a poor, dumb, mark, there’s a simple test. The people who post on the forums of the Register are, on the whole, highly educated and rather good at critical thinking. So if, on balance, you have more upvotes than downvotes then you are probably not a dumbass. But if you regularly find yourself being downvoted into a smoking hole, that you’re in the red over all on the register, then yes. You should probably think twice before voicing any opinions. And make sure that you learn to think critically before you next vote.

[Dan 55]

Your post seems to chime a bit with this:

Michael Burns: When did everyone go crazy? (33 mins)

which takes a philosophical view of the problem. He argues it's about how people react to lack of resources and how the commercial Internet takes that and shapes society.

[Anonymous Coward]

For ALL industries that require a regulator, it's a fairly safe bet that every company in that industry is a bunch of sharks, ripping off their customers to the maximum extent allowed by the regulator. Most, if not all, of those companies will have a compliance department whose job it is to work out exactly how far they can bend the rules before the legal penalties exceed the profits available from doing so. Honest and decent companies cannot compete in such an environment.

Therefore always assume you are being borderline scammed when dealing with a company that is subject to a regulator.

[Anonymous Coward]

This is the problem with regulation...it always fails to regulate and ends up being a "paint by numbers" guide on how to optimise a scam.

Regulation only works when there is a threat of intervention, not just oversight.

OFCOM needs the power to be able to shut down a company if compliance isn't to their liking. Because fines and court action are all just part of the game to large businesses. It's all operational cost which gets loaded on to the customers.

If OFCOM could actually intervene with actions such as reversing direct debits, firing CEOs etc etc the threat to these companies would actually mean something.

What the current system produces is executives that wear court outcomes like medals..."Dave Jones, CEO, brought down a fine from £100m cash down to £250k in service credit over 5 years".

What they're less likely to wear as a medal "Dave Jones, CEO, brought O2 to it's knees for 6 months because they couldn't take payments until the court hearings were over, worst annual figures since the business began".

[Anonymous Coward]

They're far too busy trying to enforce fines on an American website owned by a Japanese bloke because people say mean things on it.

Because either of those countries actually give a fuck what this little island with delusions of grandeur thinks.

[Anonymous Coward]

> "For those still paying off their device, they can only cancel penalty-free if they pay that bill off in full – which many won't be able to afford to do either within the 30-day time limit or on top of another monthly plan elsewhere," the post states.

You can buy a new basic smartphone for 75 quid that will do everything you need it to do. It runs exactly the same OS and Apps as a 1500 quid model. I cannot fathom why anybody would take out a mortgage in order to get a top of the line phone that they cannot afford.

[A Non e-mouse]

I cannot fathom why anybody would take out a mortgage in order to get a top of the line phone that they cannot afford Or need.

But the crux is: Keeping up with the Kardashians. (The modern verion of keeping up with the Jones)

[jdiebdhidbsusbvwbsidnsoskebid]

" I cannot fathom why anybody would take out a mortgage in order to get a top of the line phone that they cannot afford."

People are free to spend their money on whatever trinkets they want.

I don't understand why a contract where the bulk of it is spreading the cost of some hardware, should rise with inflation anyway. A house mortgage or washing machine credit deal wouldn't, so why can phone contacts? Maybe the service provision part of it, but just that, nothing else.

[Anonymous Coward]

"I don't understand why a contract where the bulk of it is spreading the cost of some hardware, should rise with inflation anyway. A house mortgage or washing machine credit deal wouldn't, so why can phone contacts? "

Because they can. You can even track in the company's accounts that their costs don't go up by CPI each year, but that doesn't matter. Weak regulation and market concentration allows them to do this, so they do it.

[Fonant]

Cancel and keep the phone?

Perhaps the rules should be that if the contract price increases, the customer should be able to cancel the contract without exit fees, and without needing to finish paying for any phone that was included in the deal.

That would focus the minds of the mobile companies suddenly hiking bills beyond reason.

[I ain't Spartacus]

Re: Cancel and keep the phone?

I'd have thought you could argue this. Since they've unilaterally changed the terms of the contract, I'd argue that in order to cancel it you should be able to hand them their phone back with no extra payments. Since the hire purchase on the phone is rolled into the data contract, you don't sign two separate ones. So giving you the right to cancel one, should cancel both. I can't see how they can enforec making you pay for the handset, and I'm pretty sure they'd lose in county court if they tried.

[Kane]

Re: Cancel and keep the phone?

"Since the hire purchase on the phone is rolled into the data contract, you don't sign two separate ones."

I hate to be "that guy", but akchewlee...

They now do two separate contracts, one for the data plan, and one for the phone. They're quite clever about it as well. The device contract is over the course of 36 months. But the data plan is over the course of 24 months, thereby ensuing you're likely to stay with the provider to keep things "tidy", i.e not having two separate contracts with two different providers.

[I ain't Spartacus]

Re: Cancel and keep the phone?

I hate to be "that guy", but akchewlee...

They now do two separate contracts

Makes sense. I've not bought a handset on contract for a while. Although, in that case, you don't have to pay the phone off in one go. If you've got two contracts that are not tied together - then you simply keep performing the HP on the phone, i.e. paying it off monthly - while you terminate the airtime contract - which they've violated. They can't have it both ways. If they're linked, then they've broken one, and there's no legal reason you should be punished on the other. If on t'other hand they're not linked, then you pay the HP off over the next few months and carry on as normal. If you can't get them to unlock the phone until youo've fully bought it, then you're forced onto one of the MNVO's on the same network. Which I think is GiffGaff if you're on O2?

Unless there's a big thing on the front page of both contracts, in big letters, saying that they can put the price up of one, and force you to maintain the other.

This used to the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts, then the Distance Selling Regulations, I think it's now been consolidated into a new consumer rights law - but it's a while since I've had to look it up and write snotty legal letters based on the exact terms. I won both times without even having to go to small claims court.

I've never seen a phone contract on a different timescale to the airtime contract though. That sounds hard to adminster for them, as well as for you.

I remember the time I signed up to Sky (for satellite telly not phones), and the two other times I nearly did, on each phone call they said there was an annual inflation rise in their contracts. Said up front, so I had no way to cancel when it happened - because I'd been given fair warning. Not quite sure what their justification for putting an inflation price rise in a one year contract could possibly be! But all 3 times, that price rise just happened to be 1 or 2 months after the start of the contract. So it was a clear way of nickle and diming you for an extra £1.99 on the price that didn't show up when you first searched for it.

The problem is that it's hard to ban emergency inflation clauses, if you get a sudden 10% inflation spike in a year - otherwise if you make it illegal then you risk causing inflation as every time it looks like it might happen, then companies will pad their bills beforehand. That makes the fear of inflation more likely lead to the actual thing. But if it's just 3%, that's in the predictable margin of error, and then it shoudn't be allowed in a two year fixed price contract. Quite hard to right legislation to cover both cases.

[Henry Wertz 1]

Re: Cancel and keep the phone?

Yeah that's how they do it here in the states too. Used to get a phone 'included' with the contract on the postpaid phone service, as companies moved away from this (a stealth price increase, same cost service but no 'included' phone), a few companies THOUGHT they would just make you pay off the phone but pretend they could penalize you for cancelling phone service, but the FCC did tell them "No, you can't have it both ways." Of course Nutjob Trumps FCC will probably try to let companies do as they wish, but who knows.

I was at a store that sold both Verizon and AT&T devices -- it was rather shady (I mean, the terms were clear but most people don't look at the fine print), AT&T had all these phones listed for like $1 a month less than Verizon -- but the Verizon phones were on a 24 month payoff while the AT&T were 36, so in reality you were paying like $200-400 more for the AT&T phones, not $24 less.

(Side note -- one reason Verizon for one did the "new every 2" on phones back in the day, it turned out the CDMA and EVDO technology was improving so much between one generation of Qualcomm chips and the next, increasing call and data capacity using the same amount of wireless spectrum and hardware on Verizon's end, they ran the numbers and found they were actually saving money replacing customer equipment and getting free capacity increases compared to having to install more cell sites, put more equipment (like going from a monopole or a 4-way sectorization to 6 or 8-way sectorized antennas), etc. on the phone company end of things.)

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Cancel and keep the phone?

That's not the problem here, if you have a problem with the price increases and complain, they usually reverse the increase...but they know most people won't do that.

My Virgin Media bill has always been within +/- 5% of the new customer rate because I phone up and deal with them. It's stressful and hard work but it's possible...it's mainly difficult because you have to penetrate the fortress like call centres to speak to someone who can actually change something and aren't reading from a script.

I don't want to kill my golden goose here...but my usual way in is via a formal complaint. I keep a graph of my connection speed over the period of the contract, as well as latency, downtime, customer service interactions etc...I keep it ready to go in case I wish to push a "formal complaint"...I present myself a potential persistent and angry scrotum rash to the call centre folks. There is nothing in the call centre scripts that explains how to handle someone that comes to the boundaries armed and ready...so they escalate...they don't expect you to challenge their "average service levels". It's also a blindspot for them because they don't monitor your average service levels they can't prove your connection wasn't shit 8 month ago for 2 weeks...but they can see that you logged a ticket and their dumb fucking customer service robots did nothing but follow the script...their one system designed to keep the rabble at arms length is the one thing that can come back and make them bleed from their arsehole. They have nothing to counter your claims with. It's their cheapness coming home to roost...because they could monitor everything, at some expense, but execs need their cars and yachts...and what are the chances someone might actually do it themselves?

If you don't log and monitor your own internet connection and hold ISPs to their service levels and contract terms, you deserve to pay every bill they shovel at you. You can and should hold them to account...the more people that do it, the better...because it's more time wasted on the side of the ISP dealing with vaste swathes of logs and graphs and bullshit...each time they don't take the time to look at your logs and reports, it's another complaint to OFCOM...along with the data you sent the ISP.

As techies, collectively, we have the power to hold them to account...if we could just focus this, as in, everyone submits their performance reports to their ISP and OFCOM on exactly the same day at exactly the same time, preferably the same day CPI/RPI figures are announced...it would send quite the message and perhaps we could hold them to account.

If all anyone does is grumble and threaten to leave because of a price hike and they never held the ISP accountable...then...

https://imgflip.com/i/6tzk5a

[gryphon]

Re: Cancel and keep the phone?

I had all this to hand before because I had a SamKnows box monitoring the BT connection on behalf of Ofcom and giving me service reports. On the very few occasions I had a problem and mentioned that I had one of these so I knew they were lying and could prove it things mysteriously fixed themselves rather quickly.

Unfortunately the SamKnows box is no more because they've apparently rolled the functionality into the normal routers.

What would you suggest for monitoring the connection?

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Cancel and keep the phone?

I use a variety of tools and custom scripts. It mostly comprises of the speedtest CLI tool and Smokeping though.

https://oss.oetiker.ch/smokeping/

https://www.speedtest.net/apps/cli

Graphs etc I use custom scripts for.

That combination though allows you to see your speed test results over time as as well as latency spikes and outages.

Always do your tests wired...don't do your testing and monitoring from a wifi connection...if you do, you'll get spiel from them about how wifi performance can go up and down and is affected by blah blah blah...if you hit them hard by telling them up front you're wired in and you tell them your setup, they will dispense with the bullshit pretty quickly...they will know you can't be fobbed off.

First thing you'll notice, probably, is your latency all over the place...this is because a lot of ISP routers have no kind of SQM enabled on them and you can't enable it. Virgin Media folks tend to refer to this as "jitter" when really it's "buffer bloat".

You can test for that here:

https://www.waveform.com/tools/bufferbloat

You can deal with bufferbloat, but it requires you to switch to your own router (which on Virgin means you have to use modem mode)...I run OPNSense which has SQM settings available...it's not the easiest thing to setup, but once you do it, the difference is night and day...you need a fairly beefy router to cope with it though...plenty of RAM and a decent CPU.

I use an N150 based router with 2.5G sockets on it...so on my "Gigabit" package, I actually average around 1.2-1.4gbps.

It's quite important to get your connection tuned in as best you can with as few local bottlenecks and config issues as possible. Because they will question your setup, give you bollocks about unsupported equipment etc etc...but if you can prove that your configuration is sound, your kit is performant etc...you give them nowhere to hide.

Just always keep in mind, as fucked up as it is, the burden of proof is on you. If they can cast any doubt at all on your claims, they will wipe their hands of the problem. Their scripts are full of traps and dead ends...they are designed to put the emphasis on it being your fault or some environmental factor outside of their control.

[Goodwin Sands]

Re: Cancel and keep the phone?

>What would you suggest for monitoring the connection?

DSLstats. Get googling!

[Aladdin Sane]

Cunts

Gonna cunt.

[Jason Hindle]

Emboldened...

"The big concern, as Lewis states, is that other mobile providers will feel emboldened"

I wouldn't mind if EE did this. When I left BT Broadband earlier this year, I ported my number from the BT Mobile MVNO to EE without reading some of the small print*. It was the path of least resistance, but now it feels rather silly of me. As such, I wouldn't mind the opportunity to port out.

* 5G speeds capped unless you pay for an absurdly priced plan (and that's with SIM only), plus the daily charge they levy for roaming in Europe.

[A Non e-mouse]

Re: Emboldened...

I've also discovered that EE have now removed the ability to change your tariff online: You have to contact their call centre and suffer the hard sell on numerous up-sells.

[BadRobotics]

Giff Gaff anyone?

I have been using GG for several years now and their prices have gone up once I think. But I guess if your phone is part of the contract, changing out of O2 might be more tricky.

[gryphon]

Re: Giff Gaff anyone?

I still don't understand why anyone wanting an iPhone wouldn't simply get the interest free option from Apple themselves over 2 years?

Not sure if you still must get AppleCare but I know it's a separate payment these days.

Are combination airtime and phone contracts so much cheaper?

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Giff Gaff anyone?

Apple finance is actually Barclays, who are a bit stingier than the mobile networks.

[cookiecutter]

what are these OffThings for

Id genuinely be embarrassed working got any of these fuckers!

Ofwat are happy to let thanes water dump shit into the water AND increase prices to cover their debt payments! Theyv even look like letting them off any fines for a decade or so.

The competition commission will let anyone buy anyone regardless of national interest or consumer protections!

Ofcom are fucking useless, why bother having rules b of companies can just skirt around them like this?

every penny is being scammed out off the british consumer & shoved upwards to the wealthy while the public drool in the rain waving chinese manufactured british flags at the biggest tax bludgers of them all!

[Blue Screen of Bleurgh]

Quote - "Britain's comms regulator has criticized O2 for hiking prices beyond what customers agreed to, exploiting a loophole in rules designed to end unpredictable mid-contract increases."

So when OFCON (sic) made these new rules and regulations back in January, they didn't think through the possibility of operators exploiting this loophole, and now here we are with OFCOM shrugging its shoulders with one of those "whatever!" moments while not admitting to this gaping oversight and leaving customers up a creek without any paddles!

Well done, ofcom, you really are not fit for purpose!

[Stu J]

Just totally ban mid-contract price rises

You literally don't need to add in mid-contract price rises. If you decide you want to effectively put it up by £2/month after a year, just put the entire 2 year contract up by £1/month.

Treat it like you would a currency hedge - you don't get to wait-and-see and then say "oh actually we want a bit more from you". Put your cards on the table on day one and stick to it. If after 12 months you need more cash, raise prices for new contracts.

It's really not hard, if everyone is forced to play by the same rules, and the rules aren't so full of loopholes you could drive a truck through them.

[Alan Brown]

Why is Ofcom doing things that are the CMA's remit?

[Goodwin Sands]

You couldn't make this stuff up ..

Looks like Nick Clegg is positioning himself to be the next Ofcom boss ..

https://order-order.com/2025/10/31/nick-cleggs-name-floated-for-ofcom-chairmanship-bid/

[Dwarf]

Priorities

Perhaps if Ofcum was to stop worring about implementing things such as the unworkable porn regulations, then they could focus on the mobile operators and get that fixed, then move onto the next clusterfsck.

Whats the point of a regulator without any teeth ?

[tin 2]

Pretty simple isn't it?

A contract is a contract. The idea is that the customer locks in for a deal, and the provider locks in a price. This bollox that they can change the prices in the middle of it is not what a contract is supposed to be!

Perhaps for much longer terms and b2b you might say that price rises are inevitable and they need pricing in, but not for a 1yr or 2yr phone contract. If forecast rises need factoring in, then make the initial price accordingly higher.

And again - it's a contract. So if the provider wants to change the price mid-contract - they can't. None of this customer can cancel then BS. End of discussion. Cos it's a FUCKING CONTRACT!!!

THAT should be what ofcom is enforcing, not this faffing around the periphery nonsense.