Musk and Trump take slap fight public as bromance ends Fire up those popcorn makers. The bromance between tech mogul Elon Musk and US President Donald Trump has come to an ignominious end as the billionaires feud on their respective social media platforms. The messy interpersonal drama of attention-crazed public figures isn't the usual El Reg fodder, but these two definitely merit …
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Fun pedantic fact, you could be a naturalised US citizen and run for president - but only if you had become a naturalised US citizen at the adoption of the constitution (Article II, Section 1, Clause 5). So no, I don't think Musk qualifies.
It's how George Washington became president - he was born outside of the US at the time.
He also needs to be older than 35 years old, which also seems to exclude him currently, behaving as he is like my toddler. XD
"It's how George Washington became president - he was born outside of the US at the time."
Not quite. Washington was born inside Virginia, which meant he was considered a native-born American as Virginia was part of the US. The same is true of all the presidents who were elected. There were some people who were possible candidates under that rule, though, most famously Alexander Hamilton, who didn't run for election but considered doing so. He was actually born outside of the land that became the US but qualified under that rule.
Washington was not considered a "natural born citizen" because there was no US when he was born. He was a citizen at the time of the adoption of the Constitution, and was therefore eligible to be POTUS.
The first 9 and the 12th POTUS' were eligible due to that part of Article 2. All others were born in the US.
I get what you're saying, but it is not matched by the way citizenship law worked at the time. I know that the US did not exist at the time of the birth of these people. Theoretically, that means that there were no "natural born citizens" until the first birth post-independence. That was not how it worked. The relevant portion of the Constitution reads:
The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.
Could that be clearer? Yes, but although it later needed to be expanded, it meant that being born in the territories that became the states was enough to make you a citizen, and the laws upheld this. For example, when naturalization laws were passed quite quickly, those laws imposed race and religion restrictions, but those did not apply to people who had been citizens in British America before it became the US, who by law remained citizens. The presidents you are referring to were born in the colonies that became the US.
As I said in another comment, the distinction is mostly irrelevant; they didn't care at the time, and nobody alive has any effect from it now. Citizenship law is a bit more complex to "no country at the time, therefore no citizenship". You can see many more recent examples with countries emerging from colonialism, splitting, or coming under other governments that reset the laws. There are a lot of more complicated parts.
What's the deal with people who were born in territories that only became part of the US after they were born?
They're citizens by birth (not naturalized), but they weren't citizens at birth.
Here's a thought: the constitution says you must be "a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution" - but it doesn't specify what it means by "Adoption". When a new territory accedes to the union, it may reasonably be said to "adopt" the constitution at that date. So that clause could affect people alive today.
The Northern Mariana islands became a US territory in 1986, so there are about 40k people potentially affected.
(Guam is much older)
American Samoa is unclear as they are legally "nationals", not "citizens". That one will probably end up in the Supreme Court eventually as I doubt Congress will bother.
Philippinos born before independence from the US explicitly lost that right in 1946. The US acquired the Philippines from Spain in 1898, so there will have been a lot of Philippinos who were born without the right, (maybe?) gained it and then lost it again!
Plus Lynch holds that Boris Johnson is still eligible. I'm sorry.
"American Samoa is unclear as they are legally "nationals", not "citizens". That one will probably end up in the Supreme Court eventually as I doubt Congress will bother."
Congress only works for a few days each year so taking up a matter that isn't a current problem would be difficult to get on the schedule. If somebody from Samoa wanted to run for an elected office with citizenship restrictions, it could be argued then. As a territory, I don't believe they are represented in Congress so no seats there. Certainly none in the Senate. Local elections are open to anybody in the territory.
When John McCain ran for president against Barack Obama, there was some question as to whether he was eligible due to having been born outside the borders of the USA:
From Wikipedia:
John Sidney McCain III was an American statesman and naval officer who represented the state of Arizona in Congress for over 35 years, first as a Representative from 1983 to 1987, and then as a U.S. senator from 1987 until his death in 2018. He was the Republican Party's nominee in the 2008 U.S. presidential election. Wikipedia
Born: August 29, 1936, Coco Solo, Panama
He was born to US citizens, and was granted citizenship at eleven months of age.
Incidentally, that was the last U.S. presidential election in which I thought, "no matter who wins, we'll be OK."
Weirdly complex. For example, some of the territories have the concept of legislative citizenship, meaning that they are not considered normal citizens, but a law was passed saying they are. This means, theoretically, that if that law is repealed, they would lose their citizenship. If that happened, most likely some courts would have to look at whether that violated the constitution, which it might but it's also unclear. If the territory concerned obtained independence, it could probably work in the same way that most colonies did post independence, but if the territory was still a territory, depriving its inhabitants of citizenship could be considered a violation of the Universal Declaration on Human Rights. For the moment, it's a lot like an old server that is running, so nobody wants to try poking at it in case it doesn't come back up.
Citizenship is really complicated. Determining who is a citizen and how can be a much harder process than it appears. That is why my explanations on 18th century US citizenship appear to be quite unpopular. Either people think I'm wrong, but haven't tried to explain why, or they don't like the fact that citizenship was already defined by colonies* and the replacement government attached its definition to those definitions, creating an ugly mess of contradictory definitions that were only cleared away with time and a complete rewrite of the citizenship definition eighty years later, doing plenty of damage to people in the meantime. These things are not limited to that time either. There were confusing aspects to what happened to citizenships when countries divided, for example Pakistan, Czechoslovakia, or Sudan. It was a bit easier when countries like Germany or Yemen united, but not one sentence definition easy.
* And by the way, it wasn't just the US. The same colonial citizenship regulations and need to redefine them for the new country, often inheriting the data from the one thing they had, was true of all the British colonies. And the French colonies. And everyone else's colonies.
"It's how George Washington became president - he was born outside of the US at the time."
But when Washington was born, the US didn't exist so he couldn't have been. But tell me this, one criterion to eligibility to be elected is a "natural born citizen". What does that mean? Does it exclude anyone delivered via a C-section? Is that 'natural born'?
Why not elect the 'best person', irrespective of where they happened to be born?
Why not elect the 'best person'...
Because you don't know how good or bad they'll be until they gain power.
No matter how well intentioned a politician may be, they all change a bit on gaining high office. Also the type of character needed to fight all the way to the top is often not the best type of character to run a country. It's almost as if the system itself is broken.
Because when the people were writing the rules, they were nervous about foreigners, and nobody's bothered to change them yet. Nothing says that rule is the best one, it's just what's written there and will be the rule until enough people decide to change it. A lot of the rules those guys wrote have aged badly and either been replaced or should be, although some others have worked out well enough, so perhaps this is one of them.
And what "natural born citizen" means is that you have to have been a citizen at the time of your birth. That means that being born in the country or to citizens counts, everything else doesn't. The complexities of 18th century US citizenship law which decided who was a citizen when the country was founded are not very important nowadays since they no longer affect anyone alive.
Why not elect the 'best person'
We sure as hell haven't been doing that even amongst natural born citizens. Opening it up to nazis like Musk isn't likely to improve upon the super low standard of candidate voters have been picking for my entire life.
If we were going to try something different I'd suggest electing a woman before we change the constitution and elect foreigners. But given that voters both in polling and at the polls have demonstrated they're more willing to vote for a non-white man than for any woman of any color I'm not gonna hold my breath on that.
> I do not believe that Musk could run for president as he was not born in the US.
True. And nothing of value was lost...
Honestly, given the shitshow he pulled with DOGE, his sociopathic tendencies and the number of fanatic fans he commands, he'd transform the U.S. into a dystopian cyberpunk setting much faster than Trump is able to.
Trump is an idiot who surrounds himself with other idiots and a few intelligent sociopaths.
Musk is an intelligent sociopath who surrounds himself with other intelligent sociopaths and a few normal people. No idiots involved.
He'd achieve his targets much more efficiently - I just believe Musk reaching his targets would result in an even worse outcome for the general population than another 3.5 years of $Trump
Musk is an immigrant who has been naturalised.
There are some serious questions surrounding whether he is legally naturalised or not. It seems to boil down to having illegally worked while in the US on a student visa and not declaring that infringement.
Whatever the truth, last week Musk could have relied on Trump, and probably the Supreme Court, to protect his naturalised status. I doubt he can today.
I'm wondering if Trump now hates Musk so much he'll have him shipped off to El Salvador's death camp. Trump should force him to take his sink with him.
Demolition Man quote:
Lenina Huxley: I have, in fact, perused some newsreels in the Schwarzenegger Library, and the time that you took that car...
John Spartan: Hold it. The Schwarzenegger Library?
Lenina Huxley: Yes. The Schwarzenegger Presidential Library. Wasn't he an actor when you...?
John Spartan: Stop! He was President?
Lenina Huxley: Yes! Even though he was not born in this country, his popularity at the time caused the 61st Amendment which states...
John Spartan: I don't wanna know. President...
This is standard "Pro wrestling" tactic : both contestants needed to create the illusion of a close alliance to further their agendas. Now that is growing old and hampering their individual progress they must appear at odds, Musk to further his agenda in non-US-friendly countries (Starlink and Tesla come to mind) and Trump to reinforce his US-based support which is dwindling. Hence the very public bitch-slap match akin to a former "temmate" smashing a chair on his former ally in the middle of a wrestling ring. I believe it is called a "beef" in the Land of the Great Again, and it benefits both parties.
It also serves to mask the fact that they both worked together to pass measures that will durably harm their respective supporters : the Bidden did it all" excuse was wearing thin, they both needed a diversion.
"The electric vehicle pioneer has been the worst performing large-cap stock in the world so far in 2025" ... " Tesla shares losing more than 20 percent of their value this year."
As entertaining as the epic fall-out is and will uncertainly continue to be, the recent stock price is a misnomer really. What's actually happened is the Tesla stock has come back to the pre-October '24 love-fest where it overinflated by nearly 100% due to the expectation its CEO would have some sort of omnipotent power due to having such Trump favour. Even with the corrective crash, it's still sitting 20% higher than the start of the bromance.
It's the weird thing about stocks and relative increases/decreases. If a stock went from £1 to £2 overnight, it would have grown 100%. If it fell back down from £2 to £1 the next day, it would be a 50% drop. Gives the impression the stock is up over two days, when in reality it's the same price. It's also the reason market cap is a terrible measure - it's not like the company had an extra £1 to spend for the day.
...it's not like the company had an extra £1 to spend for the day...
Unless they sell a shedload of shares at the higher rate.
Which is exactly what all the board members of Tesla have been doing while at the same time advising shareholders to stick with them because they will be selling a billion trillion humanoid robots next week - or some similar stupid lie the fanboys still lap up.
"It's also the reason market cap is a terrible measure - it's not like the company had an extra £1 to spend for the day."
They company would still have to have retained stocks they could sell to take advantage which they usually don't. This means that a tremendous rise in stock price doesn't improve the financial health of a company nor hinder it directly either. It can do indirectly which is why they don't just ignore it. Executives will also receive options to buy stock at a really nice discount so it's in their interest to keep the price up.
The market cap of a business can be $1tn, but the worth/value much much less. P/E (Stock price/ earnings) is one of the main indicators used but also not the entire picture. This is why one can use "market cap" and Value/worth interchangeably although it's done all of the time. You don't want to get that into your thinking so you can avoid making poor investing decisions.
I want them to set it up like Thunderdome- two men enter, one man leaves- but with one fewer men leaving.
(Which is quite plausible anyway, as the most likely outcome is that they try to slap each other a few times then both die of heart attacks from the exertion on their out-of-shape bodies...)
I want them to set it up like Thunderdome- two men enter, one man leaves- but with one fewer men leaving.
Maybe that's the true purpose of the "ballroom" Trump is building - The one no president or anyone else has been able to figure out how to build in 150 years - LOL.
I thought it would be the venue for where foreign leaders were forced to come to kiss Trump's backside but it could be dual-purpose.
Triple if someone can fill it with tigers and entice Trump through its entrance.
Trump ballroom: for me the throne room arch at Ctesiphon was always the perfect real world osymandias 'Round the decay / Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare, / The lone and level sands stretch far away', but give it a few years and the ruins of mar-a-largo will do as well. Or the us economy
I've noted there seem to be about 3 voters who are truly persistent.
Fanbois of the FOCF? Leon? Bots? Trolls (paid or unpaid)? General SEL (left or right pond)?
Not sure.
Look for the ones whose downvotes greatly outnumber their upvotes perhaps?
They'd likely be angry at the world for, well, being the world.
And the closest most people get to mercury is either sucking on it or stuffing it up their posterior in the form of a thermometer. But the thermometer is only symbolic of what happens when a billionaire or purchased politician is around and you're not pulling in a 7-digit income...
"And the closest most people get to mercury is either sucking on it or stuffing it up their posterior in the form of a thermometer."
It was also used as a laxative suppository. The Lewis and Clark expedition camp sites can be verified by Mercury deposits being found.
A nice finale after a five month brom-com.
On behalf of the world, I'd like to thank those US citizens who voted for the Orange Felon and brought us this comedy gold. Even overlooking the Musk shitshow, TACO himself is inherently comedic: His persistently poor choices, his stupid, crudely formed rhetoric, his pompous arrogance and total absence of any shred of self awareness, the arse-licking imbeciles he surrounds himself with, and his obsession with gaudy gold bling (rather like a dollar-shop version of Auric Goldfinger). Obviously there's the matter that US education, healthcare, science, your military, proper government process all are being ripped apart as the Hillbilly Crusade brings its book burning economic illiteracy to DC. And that the only beneficiaries here are billionaires getting some much needed tax breaks, or investment banks able to put big money on the stockmarket gyrations as Flump flip-flops on his own policies.
My question is, are the people who voted for this laughing with us? Anyone who voted R care to put their hand up and share their thoughts on how this is making America great again? There's 77,248,118 of you, surely there's some who read The Register, and can string a few words together.
My question is, are the people who voted for this laughing with us? Anyone who voted R care to put their hand up and share their thoughts on how this is making America great again? There's 77,248,118 of you, surely there's some who read The Register, and can string a few words together.
Codejunky seems to have gone veeeery quiet. Perhaps they are overwhelmed by all the winning.
We the non-MAGAs are making the same mistake as always, namely assuming there is any rational rhyme or reason behind all this, which can be used for meaningful analysis or extrapolation.
Keeps the pundits in bread and us non-pundits entertained, but forgets that within the next 30 minutes the opposite might be said and done by either of the allegédly "fighting" parties.
They'll do this phone call, it was all just a little misunderstanding, blown up out of any proportion by the LUNATIC LEFT RADICAL FAKE NEWS PRESS!!!
(And somehow Joe Biden is to blame. They'll find a way, trust me.)
And 48 hours from now it'll all be forgotten. Or eclipsed by the next Executive Order.
You read it here first.
While a lot of these things get blown over, the infighting is one of the few things that did have lasting effects in Trump's first term. It doesn't happen every time, but Trump does jettison people who are too troublesome or are seen publicly disagreeing with him. He can't throw Musk out like a press secretary, but there still could be some harm between them.
Trump and Musk are both attention-seekers. Trump in particular has spent his life bombastically cosplaying an idiot's parody of a "dealmaker" and despite his failings at that (*) it certainly got him attention as a "personality" and ultimately led him to the White House.
So I'm quite willing to believe that they'd both go along with a manufactured spat if if didn't make either of them actually look bad.
But they're both also highly egotistical, thin-skinned and- especially in Trump's case- vindictive and there's no way Trump is *ever* going to tolerate someone making him look bad, insulting his economic competence and telling him he wouldn't have won the election without Musk's help.
Musk accusing Trump of being named in the Epstein files certainly *isn't* the sort of thing one does if they don't seriously want to threaten someone, and similarly, Trump isn't likely to take being threatened well.
While I'm sure the ego-driven Trump would ultimately forgive Musk if he flattered his ego by capitulating, arselicking him and agreeing with everything he says in future, I can't imagine someone as equally egotistical as Musk being able to do that, let alone while a failed businessman much poorer than him drives his business into the ground.
(*) No richer than he would have been had he stuck daddy's inheritance in a tracker fund.
it's rather difficult to predict with 2 insane lunatics
it's possible orange shit stain would get one of his cronies to remind musktwat that the supreme court said it was fine for him to use seal team six for assasinations
musktwat being the alpha coward would start kissing the ring again. (note how musktwat has already started the backdown!)
...the Trumpian leopard he helped elect wouldn't eat *his* face too.
The same person who thought that telling an individual as pathologically narcissistic, think-skinned and vindictive as Donald Trump- someone infamous for turning on loyal "friends" and colleagues in a heartbeat and throwing them to the wolves as soon as the flow of flattery is tempered with the slightest hint of criticism- was going to take being told that "Without me, Trump would have lost the election" at all well.
I heard a Trump supporter on the radio today saying that he thought Musk should leave the country. *That's* how quickly they turn on you when you upset their cult leader. He's fucked around and he'll find out very quickly that MAGA only ever loved him when he went along with everything.
Even when they were friends it must have rankled with Trump that Musk is *far* richer than him. And as someone suggested, since his ego will never accept that this is due to his own incompetence (*), he'll most likely find a way to rationalise this a Musk having "taken advantage" of the US and see him as the foreigner he was, and once again is.
And it musk rankle with Musk that while he clearly *is* richer and more successful than Trump- despite having had a leg-up from *his* daddy's money too- he's not the guy in charge and knows at the back of his mind that he's subject to the whims of this idiot.
But his anger and arrogance- and the increasing air of someone who sees himself as a rival (**)- are also most likely blinding him to the danger that, he *isn't* the guy in charge and that, for all his money, isn't as powerful- and has a lot more to lose- than the guy in the White House when the corrupt power he'd hoped to take advantage of is turned against him by a vindictive Trump.
Trump is, of course, notoriously capricious and ego-driven, and that has seen him embrace and become friendly with those who have insulted or disagreed with him in the past if they "repented". But how do you expect that to work with someone as equally egotistical as Musk, especially when Trump keeps doing things that lose him money and he's expected to keep his mouth shut and sacrifice himself for an ungrateful Trump?
I don't think so.
And I can certainly see us ending up in the position where Musk is the first white Afrikaner that Trump wants to evict and send back to his homeland.
Edit: This was before I remembered that, as someone else mentioned, Musk has also linked Trump to the Epstein case. True or not, this isn't the work of someone doing this as part of a a for-show manufactured spat (as Musk's Dad tried to suggest it was). It's very much someone playing with fire *and* deciding to pour petrol on top of that and thinking they can get away with it.
(*) Let's never forget that, while Trump *is* very rich, this is only because he inherited a *lot* of money from his father and that he's no better off than he would have been had he invested all that in a tracker fund and done nothing. In short, he's a failed businessman that used daddy's money to cosplay his entire life as an idiot's idea of a "dealmaker".
(**) Not, let's be honest, that he ever didn't, but in the short term it's easy to be "friendly" when you're both getting what you wanted. For a while.
"A senior White House official confirmed to The Register that Trump had no plans to speak to Musk today."
Considering that Musk basically called Trump a 'pedo guy' by accusing him of being in the Epstein evidence and that is why the US government won't release it, I don't see the bromance ever getting rekindled. As that's a pretty hard one for Musk to row back from. And no doubt those who take everything that Musk posts on Twitter as gospel will believe their is something to the accusation.
So its going to be a hard choice for all the hardcore MAGA and also Elon worshipers to pick a side in this one.
> Considering that Musk basically called Trump a 'pedo guy'[1] ... I don't see the bromance ever getting rekindled
What, not even after Elon shows Donald a copy of the US court ruling that calling someone 'pedo' isn't defamatory in any way? So it was just a bit of joshing, like how best buds jokingly insult each other.
[1] it would be a great popcorn moment if Musk actually did use that precise phrase in reference to Trump
"Considering that Musk basically called Trump a 'pedo guy' by accusing him of being in the Epstein evidence "
Jeffrey Epstein wasn't just a pimp renting out teenage girls on an island with lots of CCTV and a private jet. He was a "mover and shaker". He got to know many powerful people through working at Bear Stearns and his own financial firm. Pimping was just a side hustle and a way to keep some of his clients on a leash. Not everybody that's in a photo with Jeffrey had been supplied with lovely young things.
I did work on a house of a Hollywood business manager that represented many noted performers and turned out to have a thing for young boys (In Hollywood, who could have guessed). He had lots of photos in his home of him with many famous people as those sorts of people often have. If I did something of note and was invited to the White House for some sort of recognition, I'd likely have my photo taken with the President. It wouldn't mean anything and I expect that happens many times each week. The best I have managed is a photo with Charlie Bolden when he was the NASA Director and Dr. Michelle Thaller when she was the Assistant Director for Education. I have photos of me with several of the men that have walked on the moon from when I was an aerospace journalist. You won't find me hanging out with Buzz, though. I haven't seen him in years.
I went to a couple of secondary schools with Dr. Thaller, and imported her to the UK to be the 'Best Lady' (i.e. Best Man except for the obvious contradiction) at my wedding. But the one I'll kick myself for was at an astronomy conference in Tucson, where Dr. Phil Plait (The Bad Astronomer) was talking, and I got this guy who was hanging around with him to take a picture of us, and later when that other guy was presenting learned that 'that other guy' was Don Pettit, of photographs-from-the-ISS fame, and who just recently returned to Earth after yet another extended stay up there.
Why, yes, I do have some lame claims to fame.
"I went to a couple of secondary schools with Dr. Thaller, and imported her to the UK to be the 'Best Lady' "
Dr Michelle is a special lady. I met her at a JPL open house and we kept in touch for some time, but after she moved to work at Goddard, I only got to see her once when I was in DC to receive an award. Her husband was really cool too and was in the right place at the right time to get her under contract. I remember his story about first meeting Michelle thinking that "oh, great. another grad student to supervise before she showed up". I used to see Phil at least twice a year when I was working as a space journalist. I think I met Don once, but maybe not. I'd have to go through my photo archives to see.
I was an extra in several movies! My mom did one and got her union card, grrrrrr. Although, she's never seen the movie as it's scary and she doesn't like scary movies.
Proof positive that anyone who makes a deal with Trump is a colossal f’ing idiot. I mean, Musk was never over endowed with brain - and if he (like Trump) hadn’t inherited a ton of money then he’d likely have been under qualified even to flip burgers.
So yes, I want Trump and the entire sorry edifice of what the Republican Party has become to collapse. But I won’t be sorry if he eviscerates Musk in the process.
As for everyone else, if (after observing all this) you still think it’s a good idea to place your trust in a nationalistic or far right wing political party (like the Conservatives or Reform in the UK) then I seriously doubt your intelligence too.
There will be the same cognitive dissonance in in GB with RefUK.
"R Nige" has generally proved himself to be an egotistical twat time and time again - just look at his history with UKIP/Brexit Party/RefUK and the amount of people he had a petty falling out with. People still fall for his weird "man of the people" schtick though, when in truth he's a remora-esque grifter akin to Boris Johnson who will simply agree with the last person that offered him money.
You think that Trump would be tolerated any more if *he* was just an ordinary guy but otherwise behaved in exactly the same way?
Musk may well be an "ADHD-Aspie" but he *is* high-functioning enough to run a company.
In commond with Trump, he hasn't learned how not to be a fucking asshole (to put it exceptionally charitably) because he hasn't *had* to learn. He's someone who was born into privilege and will almost certainly never have to experience or deal with life on the level that 99.99% of human beings have to.
I have no more sympathy for him than I do for Trump, and I'm tired of behaviour like his- and piece-of-shit human beings like him- being blamed on or excused by ADHD or Aspergers.
That would make him worth what, 10 million dollars in US-style "billions"?
Unless - can it be, El Reg is going back to its roots, using Proper, Full-Fat, High-Protein, British Billions? Then a centibillion would be translated into meagre yank "billions" as ten thousand million, or as they would say "ten billion".
Still a bit short of his reported wealth - maybe "just" what he'll have left after he pays a few of his outstanding bills?
With all the dodgy things that DOGE did to government departments, that were considered highly haram up until recently, one wonders whether Elon might be up for some jail time or even deportation.
Not that Trumps reps are a beacon of good government, but I guess some ought to be toying with the idea.
Trump will maintain the fiction that DOGE saved billions, as it's a core tenet of his claim to be 'saving' the American economy.
Whatever Musk went in believing, the wilful destruction of various departments was very much the goal of the current Republican leadership.
Lol.
Surely you know that the idea that SA is like Miami for the international mercenary community is just fake news produced by the Woke-Extreme-Left-MSM ?
OTOH some say Britain is a world leading centre if you're looking for proper thugs*.
*Or depending on their role you might call it "Proactive healthcare"
"Trump will maintain the fiction that DOGE saved billions, as it's a core tenet of his claim to be 'saving' the American economy."
Elon "saved" a bunch of money when he sacked the entire Supercharger team. He saved money when he fired all the people at the San Fran Twitter office that included everybody that had access to the badge-lock system of the building after ordering that everybody was to be locked out on one Friday (I think it was a Friday).
GM could save all sorts of money if they shut down those really expensive production lines.
"Are people really this stupid these days ?"
Yes, unfortunately more than 50% of the American electorate thought Trump was a Good Thing, and much evidence suggests they still do. Cue famous quote - see https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/mencken-white-house-quote/
Incidentally, that quote used to be on Wikipedia under Mencken (not a great chap, but an ace quote), but that site's trust rating has been plummeting, with barely disguised partiality breaking out all over.
Some of us know this , either from the media, or from US people we know who'll be affected by it.
And everytime medical stuff comes up on thei social media sites I look at (both left, right and magaloonies) I post something along the lines of 6 months medical treatment for 2 serious illnesses resulted in a bill of $0.00, (and no extra to pay for 'pre-existing' or worrying if I could get insurance on changing jobs/my employer going bust)
"We can hope. It depends on what happens to the Tesla share price."
Right now there's still lots of robotaxi hopes that I don't see as being well-founded. If others come to the same conclusion, stock price could drop. If the next earnings report in a month is also painfully bad, the bottom could fall out. I suspect that Elon has the CGI rendering teams working OT (without pay) to come up with the new "low cost" Tesla vehicle that they'll deliver in the second quarter of next year. He'll hold a presser on it the day after the miserable earnings report to derail the news cycles.
Tesla's shares have, for years now, been propped up by Elon's reality distortion field, which rivals that of Steve Jobs in his prime.
I'm not totally sure, but I think it very likely that his ability to project said field will have taken a severe blow from recent events. And so we might see Tesla's stock decline to a level that actually reflects its accomplishments as a business.
"Tesla's shares have, for years now, been propped up by Elon's reality distortion field, which rivals that of Steve Jobs in his prime."
Steve's famous line was "and one more thing", after which he'd unveil a new product and usually announce it was available in stores and could be ordered online immediately after the event. I can recall an announcement for something that was a few months out, but he didn't do that very often. A good indicator was when a product was draining out of distribution lines in preparation for the new thing. Reporters started looking for that as major events were close. In days past, John Sculley would announce new items and stick the company with inventory nobody was going to buy unless pressed for something right now. Lessons learned.
OTOH, Elon makes promises for things way in the future to keep the investor wheels grinding and lots of mentions in the press. Where is that Roadster 2.0 and the Semi that was promised in 2017. In 2019 as promised, the Semi would have had very little competition. Now it has heaps from companies that know how to build trucks. The Electric Trucker on YouTube has shown loads of special equipment that's needed beyond a cab, drive and battery for plenty of differing applications. Things such as auxiliary hydraulics to operate mechanisms on trailers. They aren't always needed, but are often bolt-on options from other manufacturers. There's also power connections to run/charge things on a trailer such as a mountable forklift. None of these things are mentioned as options from Tesla. A good application is delivery truck that take forklifts and other equipment to job sites. The trailers can have hydraulics to help lift and lower to get those things on and off. An electric truck sounds like a really good option for those sorts of deliveries if there's versions fitted with the hydraulic pumps needed. Range isn't a massive need.
This shamefull display is to take the people's attention off the budget which is a catastrophe. Simple. They're back to the old tactics of distracting people from the important matters with trivialities. The people living in the USA are getting it the backside and should have expected it to be so when they voted but the memory of Americans is really short. Remembering the last Trump disaster , they should have voted for anyone but him , but no. Trump is just a bully that knows nothing about economics or international relations or politics. I hope Americans will wake up come midterms and put an end to the circus running the USA. Meanwhile , the rest of ther planet is just wondering why the hell you let that circus go on and not drag the clowns out ti a conveniently located guillottine and put an end to this sinister farce of a government.
"Surely they could have picked someone more capable"
You could ask the same of American voters. But instead they chose a lying, tax-dodging, orange-hued, misogynist, bullying, think skinned, vindictive, incompetent felon with multiple bankruptcies to his name and a fondness for foreign dictators.
American presidents have been doing the same for a long time.
Just ask the people in South America, how they have been treated. You can do a bit further back and ask the black people of America how their presidents treat them. The same goes for American indians.
Its sad that Americans think and continue to make gods out of their presidents and refuse to believe who they really are.
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