Voda-Three name post-merger top team, keep schtum on layoffs

Vodafone and Three have detailed the exec line-up taking the reins of post-merger UK biz, yet there is no word on when the deal will close, what name it will take, or how many staff face the chop to cut role duplication. The proposed amalgamation of Britain's third and fourth biggest mobile networks was given the all-clear by …

[Anonymous Coward]

Seeing that Three is the company who price gouged my humble PAYG tariff by 500 percent "because they could", I'd trust them about as far as I could throw their corporate HQ building to have any honour in employee dealings.

I'd use the expression two faced thieving scunner bastards, but I don't want to upset any genuine two faced thieving scunner bastards by comparing Three to them.

[Michael Strorm]

How about "Three-faced thieving scunner bastards"?

[ChrisElvidge]

I have a directly opposite experience with 3.

When it came time to renew my unlimited calls/text/data contract, I got a reduction from the "advised" price by asking for a PAC.

[Rob Daglish]

I think that's pretty standard for any mobile operator. All the best deals are for "new customers only" until you say Ok, I'm going elsewhere, and then they'll fall over themselves to give you stuff. See also: Sky TV, Insurance Companies.

[Anonymous Coward]

Strangely, having been with Vodafone since the last century, I can't recall ever failing to get a good deal at every renewal (without having to ask for a PAC). Rather than take the deals offered online (or in the app) I phone and talk to a real person. Whenever my monthly cost has increased it's because I've added something extra - quite often, renewing for 24m with what I currently had would actually lower the cost.

But then, I've always had good service from BT (EE) for my home phone and broadband - perhaps I'm more realistic in my expectations, or just lucky. Everyone's mileage may vary...

[Harald]

Three is plagued with low network capacity. The most emblematic place is Stansted Airport, notorious for full bars 4G signal, but transmission speed zero.

This is result of building network on cheap, with large cells, to fulfill coverage obligations without bothering to provide actual access.

Next example of Three approach to customers is retention of old tariffs. All networks announced that tariffs with EU roaming will not be offered after Brexit, but customers already using it will be still able to enjoy free EU roaming as long they keep their tariffs.

As a result:

I'm still using my EE tariff with free EU roaming.

Member of my family month later received call from Three saying "your tariff has been discontinued, you need to choose another one" - without EU roaming of course.

To add insult to the injury, I still remember how Three (and other EU mobile networks owned by Hutchinson) were bragging about EU roaming months ahead of legal RLAH requirement. As a result, number of Three sims in my family equals zero. And there was a time when we had not less than four.

[Greg D]

In the UK it is honestly 6 to 1, half dozen to the other.

I've been on Three, Voda, EE, O2. All of them are crap in London. All of them are crap where I live. None of them were good from a billing perspective (actually with the exception here being Three!). Voda even double billed me for 3 months before I noticed it and had to request a refund.

Conversely, I went to New York for a business trip and 5G was actually good there. London is utterly awful for any of the frequencies - 3G was decent before it was over-saturated, same with 4G. 5G started off rubbish and has gotten worse due to the ridiculously short range and number of masts required (which you just cant get approval for in London, hence why its so bad).

Try getting a mobile signal anywhere around London Bridge. Exact same issue - over saturation, 5-bar signal, no throughput whatsoever. Thats on 3G, 4G and 5G.

Three were genuinely (from my anecdotal experience at least) the least worst of all of the mobile operators.

[Fara82Light]

EE's service in London is now excellent. Claims about it being otherwise do not standup to inspection.

[Dan 55]

You are aware that when you roam abroad you usually have more networks available to roam on than the usual one network you have at home, so coverage abroad usually looks great.

[Nematode]

Three have been the best we've found, or at least the least worst.

In deepest Aberdeenshire, we were with Vodafone as they had their plug-in 3G Suresignal box for calls and SMS via the broadband. Wifi calling was impossibly hopeless. Voda's "customer support" was the worst experience I'd ever had.

They then forced matters by withdrawing their Suresignal (3G=old hat even if perfectly ok for voice) and we switched to Three as they still (just about) had their own equivalent box and a neighbour had reasonable experience with them. We could even get a signal at our local Tesco, which Voda never did. Three had us try wifi calling first, and it sort of worked, so we never went on their femtocell. 3 have improved the Wifi calling over time as the SMS-over-wifi-calling wasn't reliable, but it is now (2FA codes & such), though call quality can be anything from absolutely fine to absolutely rubbish. I would agree 3 have been hiking their PAYG, but the others are even worse.

So you can imagine our dismay at being forced back to Voda.

[Anonymous Coward]

"I'd trust them about as far as I could throw their corporate HQ building to have any honour in employee dealings."

So I was a Three employee (non retail) Back during the failed O2 merger in 2015. I can tell you from personal experiance that you'd be 100% right in this.

As a result of the failed merger Three did a Firesale of outsourcing everything they could.

Customer service before that was literal award winning and full of passionate people who escaped the outsourcer were notoriously horrible, who did O2s customer service. Then 1 day senior management took them into a large meeting and excitedly told them the great news, they were being TUPE'd back to the same outsourcer. Somehow then CEO Dave Dyson was surprised someone launched a chair right at him over that news. This outsourcer was used cause Three knew they couldn't meet SLAs so meant the outsourcer had to pay fines to Three so even more money.

A while later, the day after they made a huge deal about World Mental Health Day, bringing in special guests and doing several workshops for their employees talking about the importance of mental health, they announced a large chunk of people were being made redundant by Xmas. I'm sure that helped with people's mental health.

I myself was made redundant a different time, and it was a long drawn out process, which made it so much worse. We lost people jumping ship who weren't replaced, so alot of us ended up off sick due to burnout with the extra work we had for months. There was an agreed severance packages Three would pay but after everything was signed they tried to renegade on some stuff as they took away weekend and oncall work. That one bit them on the arse as we went to ACAS who reviewed the deal and then not only said we were legally due that money and would easily win any legal fight with a literal baby being our solicitor, but despite it not being in the contract, we were legally entitled to more money due to bonuses being left out, and at the enhanced rate Three initally promised (4x the statutory severance package) so that backfired badly for Three.

I was literally told by someone I was being made redundant because "We can get 3 people in India for the same cost as your salary". I later found out they got 1/6th of my output from those 3 employees combined.

Oh and the way they did layoffs was sneaky AF. To avoid being in the new about layoffs Three didn't lay people off. They TUPE'd us all to outsourcers who would lay us off instead. The outsourcers tried to make us make statements to Three saying how great life was with one saying "It's so great cause they gave us beds in the office so we can work longer". When they tried it with my team everyone bar me told them to GTF, apart from me. I already told them GTF several times already so somehow they grew a braincell and knew to avoid asking me.

It was a horrifying and mentally damaging experiance and I fear for the Three staff who aren't senior management cause duck them. Infact during consultation the senior manager I was working under (who is still at Three) said he felt our stress cause he didn't know if he could keep his huge home where he hosted office wide parties, or if he could keep sending his kids to private school, whilst some of us were struggling to pay mortgages for tiny homes. So I hope the senior management team gets screwed over badly, but I do sympathise with everyone else, I particular retail staff who will be hit the hardest.

[Alex 72]

This helps vodaphones profit I mean all of us

As Vodafone UK and three UK said separately their outage prone aging networks cant begin to inconvenience UK consumers like BT/EE and VM/O2 do, sorry cant compete with them. Bigger Vodafone, sorry MergeCo will take two networks which show at least some competence at times and add the complexity of organisational and technological integration so the misery inflicted on consumers reflects that inflicted by the other players, sorry will provide sufficient scale to allow bigger Vodafone, sorry mergeco to compete on a level playing field with the other scoundrels, sorry the competition in the UK market.

But don't worry Vodafone shareholders will likely do well out of it.

[Like a badger]

Re: This helps vodaphones profit I mean all of us

"But don't worry Vodafone shareholders will likely do well out of it."

Maybe, but historically Voda have been infamous for huge "exceptional items" costs due to botched M&A. I see no reason to expect any improvement, especially since this is effectively a Voda takeover, and it was Voda who had the crappest 5G coverage due to their refusal to invest.

[Nematode]

Re: This helps vodaphones profit I mean all of us

"But don't worry Vodafone shareholders will likely do well out of it."

Not half as well as the directors will. I'm convinced most M&A action is to do with windfall bonuses.

[Roj Blake]

The New Name will be...

Vodafon3, pronounced as Vodafone.

[Marc 13]

Re: The New Name will be...

Nah, it will be Threeone, pronounced "Freon", 'cos it freezes every few seconds and leaves you cold.

[Nematode]

Re: The New Name will be...

Nice. I once contracted to XYZ Oil & Gas Ltd, who were bought in a "joining of equals" by British Secretname Ltd. To demonstrate the equal nature of their marriage, the new company was called British Secretname Oil & Gas Ltd. No trace of the XYZ company name anywhere.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: The New Name will be...

During the time of the Irish Life and Irish Permanent tie up, there was a cartoon in a newspaper with the chiefs of the two groups, where the Irish Life chief suggesting to the other...

We take "Irish" from Irish Permanent and "Life" from Irish Life

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: The New Name will be...

Throdafone. Because you will.

[Anonymous Coward]

Layoff?

I'll wager that it is mostly from Three staff.

I'm writing this within the boundary of Vodabury (aka Newbury, Berks) which is near where I am working for the next couple of weeks

Yes, I did work for them at one point. Meetings about meetings about the possibility of having a meeting to make a decision that should have been made months earlier.

I got out after 6 months and still won't go near their crappy network. OTOH 3 was pretty good for me until I moved to my present home in West Wales. Half a bar of 4G on 3 so went to GiffGaff. 4 bars at home.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Layoff?

Not sure about that.

The press release suggests a new company that people are applying for roles in.

Voda has a lot of long-time staff who be happy with a payoff to see them into retirement. They may not bother applying.

OTOH there are a lot at Three who would take a payoff to avoid exposure to the Vodafone culture you mention.

[AndrueC]

Re: Layoff?

The press release suggests a new company that people are applying for roles in.

Voda has a lot of long-time staff who be happy with a payoff to see them into retirement. They may not bother applying.

I think TUPE would have something to say about that. You can't be laid off just because your company is merging with another one and if they wish to continue employing you it has to be on the same contractual terms as you had prior to the merger.

They can declare you redundant during the merger process but if you are outside of your probationary period they have to have a good reason for it just like they would have prior to the merger. And if you are made redundant after the merger completes you are entitled to everything that you would have been had you been made redundant prior to the merger.

The law is clear. Your employment contract remains valid and applies to the resulting company just the same as it applied before the merger.

[Anonymous Coward]

Layoffs

Vodafone have shafted their inhouse teams since the day the merger was announced.

This week Social Media were on the block, a mix of hybrid UK workers, to be reshored to India because "this is what customers want".

The Social team were played a pre-recorded impersonal message... Which just about sums up the post Nick Jeffery world.

Anyone remember Nick going to the Daily Mail saying he was hell bent on making things right - beginning with bring essential care functions to the UK.

Some short memories at VFUK as they'll have mountains of complaints in 18 months, fines from regulators, and customers abandoning by the Calais sized rafts.

[Fara82Light]

The merge will be for the better and will allow the three remaining mobile operators to concentrate on the premium customers via the rebalancing of the sector.

[Anonymous Coward]

Translation Services Message:

"The merge will be for the better and will allow the three remaining mobile operators to concentrate on the premium customers via the rebalancing of the sector."

You mean the 'Cheaper' Customers who do not pay 'lots' per month will be expected to move to the cheaper operator and the other 2 can boost their prices for the people who need to use mobile services BUT cannot afford to experience the 'crap' service the cheaper operator WILL provide.

The reduction of competition will ALWAYS allow more money to be wrung out of the captive audience, so to speak !!!

:)

[Fursty Ferret]

I don't want to be cynical but the only way this merger got approved is down to the traditional brown envelopes stuffed with used, non-sequential, £50 notes. Three has the worst customer support of any major operator ("Live Chat" with Indian-based representatives who don't have access to billing systems) and average coverage. Vodafone has a great customer service team and mediocre coverage. I'm willing to bet a leg (either leg, your choice) that the Throdafone merger results in an entity with Three's customer service team and Vodafone's network.

If they were serious they could have instantly enabled roaming across their paired networks, but haven't. There's a good reason for this: when they start cutting back on any areas of overlap, the combined quality will be worse than either.