back to article British boffins build diamond battery capable of working for a millennium or five

The UK Atomic Energy Authority (UKAEA) and the University of Bristol have built a diamond battery capable of delivering power, albeit a tiny amount, for thousands of years. The university had an idea for a battery powered by carbon-14, the longest-lived radioactive isotope of carbon with a half-life of around 5,700 years. For …

  1. Primus Secundus Tertius

    Low power

    Clever stuff but: other reports quote the power output as microwatts. That should be quoted here.

    1. 45RPM Silver badge

      Re: Low power

      Seems to be a deficiency in El Reg standards. I can’t find any units for power. So I don’t understand how much power this is - nothing to compare to, see?

      1. diodesign (Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

        Noted

        We'll be sure to include more specific power output next time we write about batteries, novel or otherwise. We were focusing on the design, TBH.

        C.

        1. uv
          Coat

          Re: Noted

          But I think that the distinguished commentard noted that there seems to be no standard El Reg unit of measure for power output, as "Watt" is for strivers... Humble us, who come here regularly, expect something along the lines of "how much ant-power it delivers?" or "how many such diamonds are required to run Crysis in Full-HD, 4xAA, 120 FPS?".

          1. Homo.Sapien.Floridanus

            Re: Noted

            About 1x 10 -9 energy output of a drunken elephant, asleep on a hammock while on a Caribbean vacation.

            1. Jimmy2Cows Silver badge

              Re: Noted

              I see you've met my brother-in-law.

            2. Claptrap314 Silver badge

              Re: Noted

              African or EuropeanIndian?

          2. cyberdemon Silver badge
            Terminator

            Re: Ant Power

            Incidentally, there is an archive copy of a deleted Wikipedia page which claims that an Antpower is approximately equal to 15 microwatts

            Apparently it is also possible to harvest several antpower out of the modern RF-noisy environment, using little more than an antenna and a Germanium diode..

            The question is I suppose, would a robo-ant prefer to carry a leaf-sized dipole antenna or a diamond-encased radioactive source? Probably, the former. Unless it was hunting down a queen ant from the past which was to give birth to its future nemesis, in which case it might need a self-contained, hardened power source.

            1. Homo.Sapien.Floridanus

              Re: Ant Power 15 microwatts

              Depends on the type of ant. The largest variety, the eleph ant, is capable of much higher output, especially while stomping out flaming ducks.

            2. Bebu sa Ware
              Windows

              Re: Ant Power

              Apparently it is also possible to harvest several antpower out of the modern RF-noisy environment, using little more than an antenna and a Germanium diode..

              The crystal set lives! ;) Had one when I was a kid and AM was still king - even had a chunk of galena which worked but not as well as a Ge diode.

              Having only one local station I listened to a lot of Garner Ted Armstrong's slightly ridiculous prognostications in his The World Tomorrow only offset by a fair bit of classic Brit radio comedy.

              For powering a satellite I would have thought there would be far more radiation up there (cosmic rays, etc) than in the ant testicle's worth of C14 embedded in the synthetic diamond.

              If this diamond battery had a few more antpower,* wrist watches might be an application (Citizen Eco-drive & Seiko Solar watches are fairly popular.)

              * or gnats-sweat.

        2. This post has been deleted by its author

        3. alain williams Silver badge

          Re: Noted

          You want some energy units for small amounts of energy. One that you might want to use is the energy stored in a molecule of ATP -- used by biological systems. This is between 20.5 and 45.6 kilojoules per mole. Dividing by 6.02x 1023 means one molecule produces between 3.4×10-20 and 7.6×10-20 joules. Pick the average: 5.5×10-20 joules.

          But that is too boring for the discerning El-Reg reader. An bacterium flagellum uses some 6.6 × 104 ATPs per second or 36×10-17 joules per second.

        4. Jedit Silver badge
          Angel

          "We'll be sure to include more specific power output next time"

          Well then, how about using this diamond battery as the El Reg standard unit of power measurement?

          Broke: measuring energy in joules.

          Woke: measuring energy in jewels.

      2. cyberdemon Silver badge

        El Reg Standards

        I think the basic problem here is that the Reg Standards Bureau does not cover Power or Energy well..

        The closest I can find in terms of derived units would be 0.2715 Norris-Linguine per Truss?

        1. find users who cut cat tail

          Re: El Reg Standards

          Power is force × speed. So Norris-%sheep would be also an adequate unit (but I am too lazy to do the conversion).

          1. cyberdemon Silver badge
            Pint

            Re: El Reg Standards

            approximately 10^-14 Norris-sheep by my estimation

          2. Bebu sa Ware

            Re: El Reg Standards

            Norris-sheep sounds like a generic term for a commons' backbencher who are definitely not known for their energy* (or intelligence.)

            1 Norris-sheep = 12 rees-moggs/parliamentary-term? :)

            Poking the Reg unit calculator it appears the max velocity of a sheep in vacuo appears to be .01×c. Can't you give the bleaters enough welly to get their mutton up to lightspeed or does the wool snag on the vacuum fluctuations? Found the explanation... something to do with wool drag, Welshman and interstellar space being slightly denser than the space between a Hollywood starlet 's ears.

            * like a static magnetic field... exerts a force on a moving charge but doesn't do any (useful) work.

    2. diodesign (Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

      Re: Low power

      Ah yeah, oops, we should have mentioned that, and now added - it's microwatt level. We did say it was devices that require very little power but we can be more specific than that.

      C.

      1. jake Silver badge

        Re: Low power

        I've done some poking around, and can't find any real data.

        Simple question: Can anybody put actual numbers on the term "microwatt levels"?

        There's not a hell of a lot of energy in the decay of C-14 ...

    3. This post has been deleted by its author

  2. Mentat74
    Joke

    "But the team also envisaged the technology being implanted in humans"

    Yeah right... When my lifeclock runs out I'm NOT going to renewal !

    1. Yorick Hunt Silver badge

      Re: "But the team also envisaged the technology being implanted in humans"

      Runner!!!

  3. vtcodger Silver badge

    Battery?

    Strictly speaking, isn't this device a petite nuclear reactor rather than a chemical battery? Although I can see why the PR guys might want to soft-pedal the nuclear part.

    "You want to implant a nuclear WHAT? ... in MY chest?"

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Battery?

      Old hat.

      The History of Nuclear Powered Pacemakers

      http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2015/ph241/degraw2/

      1. Benegesserict Cumbersomberbatch Silver badge

        Re: Battery?

        Multiple layers of shielding? Probably asbestos and lead, just to be on the safe side.

      2. Zippy´s Sausage Factory

        Re: Battery?

        I mean Pink Floyd even wrote an album called "Atom Heart Mother" back in 1970, how much clearer do you want it to be?

        (For pedants: the title was inspired by an article about one of the first nuclear powered pacemakers - I'm unclear if the title was the headline)

    2. Empire of the Pussycat

      Re: Battery?

      In the good old days there were plutonium powered pacemakers...

      https://www.orau.org/health-physics-museum/collection/miscellaneous/pacemaker.html

    3. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: Battery?

      "isn't this device a petite nuclear reactor"

      It's a long time since I dealt with this but memory says that every gram of carbon in your body contains enough 14C to tick along at about 12 beta emissions per minute. It's as much a nuclear reactor as you are.

    4. John Brown (no body) Silver badge
      Thumb Up

      Re: Battery?

      And if we are being pedantic, it's not a battery either, it's a cell. A battery is made from multiple cells :-)

      1. jake Silver badge

        Re: Battery?

        Shirley a battery is made of one or more cells?

        1. Brewster's Angle Grinder Silver badge
          Joke

          Re: Battery?

          Or zero cells. For large values of zero.

        2. John Brown (no body) Silver badge
          Happy

          Re: Battery?

          "Shirley a battery is made of one or more cells?"

          No, because a cell is...err...a cell. A group of two or more becomes a battery. Similar with an artillery battery. One is a gun, many are a battery. It's a collective noun :-)

          Although, to be fair, so many people just call everything a battery these days, whether it be a 1.5v "D" cell or a collect of small cells in a single package making up a 9v PP3 battery.

    5. John Robson Silver badge

      Re: Battery?

      "a petite nuclear reactor"

      I'd suggest not, it's simply using decay energy, it's in no way affecting the rate of decay, and certainly isn't using a nuclear reaction - just a natural decay.

    6. CountCadaver Silver badge

      Re: Battery?

      Someone commented on the wiki talk page that this is just another form of betavolatics that has been around for decades

    7. Andrew Scott Bronze badge

      Re: Battery?

      Believe there are still plutonium powered Pacemakers implanted in peoples chests. Most have been disposed of as their users have since died, but a few still running in living people.

    8. annodomini2

      Re: Battery?

      It's a RBG, Radioisotope Beta Generator.

      Carbon 14 is an Beta source.

      Beta radiation (electrons) can be stopped relatively easily, usually with a sheet of aluminium foil, or other metals.

      It's Neutron and Gamma you need to worry about as they are much less easily stopped.

  4. Andy_bolt

    Unlikely to assist with cochlear

    Agree with the premise of assisting in some implants but with cochlear implants and similar hearing implants they’re powered wholly from the external processor and the power demand is such that the batteries only last a few days at best. (I’ve got a cochlear branded hearing implant where the internals are powered by magnetic induction from the external processor)

    1. Richard 12 Silver badge
      Boffin

      Re: Unlikely to assist with cochlear

      I wouldn't write it off entirely.

      The microphone and processing is certainly doable at that kind of scale, but not sure about the stimulator. With 'normal' hearing aids, a 312 zinc-air cell is 160mAh and lasts 7-10 days, so 1400uW - most of which is for the speaker/transducer. A cochlear stimulator must require less than that.

      Back in late 1990s it seems that the cochlear stimulator part itself consumed around 1mW (1997 paper), which was over an order of magnitude improvement on previous designs.

      The induction itself is very inefficient. It's used because it ensures there's no break in the skin, but if that was avoided by having a 100 year battery pack instead?

      It'd only need about three orders of magnitude improvement in stimulator power consumption since 1997. That seems surprisingly plausible.

      1. John Robson Silver badge

        Re: Unlikely to assist with cochlear

        So you're no longer using induction for power... how are you transmitting the audio?

        1. John Robson Silver badge

          Re: Unlikely to assist with cochlear

          That was a genuine question - because you've got to get the audio communicated somehow, and it's going to be wireless, so.. what's the protocol you're going to use that's low enough power to be supplied by a beta decay battery?

  5. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

    First catch your carbon 14

    The report I read elsewhere said vaguely that the source was irradiated graphite blocks from old reactors. Even so I'd have thought that the concentration wouldn't have been enough. Presumably they're enriching it somehow.

    1. Boris the Cockroach Silver badge
      Mushroom

      Re: First catch your carbon 14

      Nitogen in the atmosphere hit by cosmic rays is the real source,

      So for more C14 we need more cosmic rays...... someone fly to Sirus and make it go supernova and that will provide us with all the C14 we need. briefly .

      1. Arthur the cat Silver badge

        Re: First catch your carbon 14

        Nitrogen in the atmosphere hit by cosmic rays is the real source,

        Open air nuclear tests did their bit when they were allowed. Totally buggered up radiocarbon dating for future archaeologists.

        1. jake Silver badge

          Re: First catch your carbon 14

          "Totally buggered up radiocarbon dating for future archaeologists."

          Go far enough into the future and it provides a calibration point.

          1. Denarius Silver badge

            Re: First catch your carbon 14

            along with other elements the atmospheric tests are a calibration point now they are sufficiently old. BTW, a nuclear decay power source is not a reactor. See nuclear powered space probes use of decaying uranium. However a great idea. Sometimes when I think the Poms are technologically spent something like this pops up.

        2. CountCadaver Silver badge

          Re: First catch your carbon 14

          Hence why sunken ww2 warships became valuable....the steel in them predates nuclear tests so isn't contaminated

          1. collinsl Silver badge

            Re: First catch your carbon 14

            And WW1 ones. Scotland had a thriving industry cutting up the German High Seas Fleet where it had scuttled itself in Scapa Flow after WW1 ended. It was a great source of material because:

            1. The ships were scuttled rather than being sunk so they weren't a war grave, and thus could be disturbed (not that that's stopped less scrupulous people from other nations, especially in the Far East)

            b. They were in relatively shallow and protected water in a harbour so could be dived on more easily than other sites

  6. MachDiamond Silver badge

    EEVblog busted 3x

    Just search EEVblog for "diamond battery"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEmO8DcOap4

  7. MachDiamond Silver badge

    More power/energy, less time

    I'm having a hard time thinking up a case where a low power supply useful for 1,000 years has any application. The Voyager probes have been going at it for decades, but they are having more and more issues as time goes by and it might not be long before they can't even respond to a ping. They use a Radio-Isotopic Thermal power source (RTG) that converts decay heat from a Plutonium isotope into electricity very inefficiently, but for a long time. Perseverance and Curiosity rovers on Mars use a similar type of power supply which means they don't have to worry about dust on solar cells and seasonal insolation. Even if Spirit and Opportunity were RTG powered, their mechanics were limping along and both finally gave up well past their best-by dates. Drills were dull, the sources for the Raman spectrometers were fading, etc. Even if they could still drive, the science they could do would have been very limited so it would be pointless to have fitted them with a power source that could last centuries even if it were possible.

    This sort of thing is interesting, but hardly ground-breaking or of immediate use. The claims of longevity are very difficult to demonstrate since there can be so many additional variables that can't be measured in the short term and only accumulate enough in a few decades to be measurable. Constant bombardment of the materials by Beta particles might make the cells completely useless in 100 years as the structure on an atomic scale is changed.

  8. _Elvi_

    Obligatory Pink Floyd ..

    Atom Hear Mother?

    1. jake Silver badge

      Re: Obligatory Pink Floyd ..

      I think you need a cup of t.

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