back to article Airbus A380 flew for 300 hours with metre-long tool left inside engine

An Airbus A380 operated by Australian airline Qantas clocked over 290 hours of flight time despite a tool having been left inside one of its engines, according to a report from the Australian Transport Safety Bureau. The 1.25 metre nylon rod, a "turning tool", was used during an inspection of the left outer engine's …

  1. DS999 Silver badge

    "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

    I imagine within seconds after first starting that engine either the tool would disintegrate into hundreds of tiny harmless (we hope!) pieces and/or the engine would exhibit some serious symptoms that would trigger a few alarms in the cabin if not on the ground to the ears of nearby engineers, so it could never have passed through when passengers were on board let alone during flight.

    1. Richard 12 Silver badge

      Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

      Nope. The damage would happen when it got dislodged and said hello to high speed rotating components.

      The most likely times for this to happen is when the aircraft bounces or the engine radically changes thrust demand.

      So that'd be during landing, turbulence, or an abort. In other words, when the pilots have the greatest need of working engines.

      1. ITMA Silver badge
        Devil

        Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

        Is there is scale for meauring the strength of items ingested into commercial jet liner engines?

        Maybe "Bird Equivilant"?

        1. Fursty Ferret

          Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

          You test, but the test stipulation is 13 small birds (starlings or similar). It’s much safer to fly through a flock of birds and continue to land than it is to try to avoid them or perform a go-around.

          1. ITMA Silver badge
            Devil

            Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

            So does that make this nylon rod a 6 starling object or a full "frozen turkey"?

            1. TeeCee Gold badge

              Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

              Probably more a capon or a small duck.

              1. This post has been deleted by its author

              2. spold Silver badge

                Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                You would use a PARTridge surely? (assuming someone has a spare one)

                1. ITMA Silver badge
                  Devil

                  Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                  No no no no.

                  The PARTridge is a networking metric used in evaluating performance of the Pear Tree Spanning Algorithm,

                  1. Korev Silver badge
                    Coat

                    Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                    Partridge? Aha!

                    1. Apocalypso - a cheery end to the world

                      Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                      According to the article, the tool was distorted by its unscheduled "holiday", and a distorted PARTridge is a PTARmigan.

                2. Montreal Sean

                  Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                  Sorry, the partridge is busy in the pear tree.

              3. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                Fresh or frozen?

          2. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

            Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

            African or European Starlings ?

            1. StinkyMcStinkFace

              Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

              a DUCK!

              1. Zarno

                Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                Photo shows something that's not twisty enough to be a duck.

                Oh Paris, where for art thy icon?

                1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

                  Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                  >Photo shows something that's not twisty enough to be a duck.

                  Perhaps just a very well endowed duck

                  1. Paul Hovnanian Silver badge

                    Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                    "Perhaps just a very well endowed duck"

                    Damned multiplicity of British Thread standards!

                    1. Zoopy

                      Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                      Wouldn't that be British Urological standards?

                      As required by the BDA? (Acronym expansion left as an exercise to the reader.)

                      1. collinsl Silver badge

                        Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                        What, the British Dental Association?

                        Lemming, Lemming ... Lemming of the BDA .. Lemming, Lemming ... Lemming of the BD ...Lemming of the BD ... BD, BDA!

                2. Adam Foxton

                  Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

                  Ah, but remember Ducks float. And therefore are made of wood, and are therefore witches. Which have gnarled, twisty features.

                  So twistyness alone cannot determine if something is a duck or not, because the science above says that Witches are Ducks, and witches are twisty.

          3. damienblackburn

            Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

            Yep. CFI told me if they're small birds let the prop mulch them. Big birds like vultures and hawks I should avoid as those would damage the prop or, worse, smash through the cockpit and do damage/injure/kill us.

            1. the Jim bloke
              Black Helicopters

              Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

              puts a different twist on the saying "the vultures are circling..."

      2. imanidiot Silver badge

        Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

        Depends on where it was left. If it had been left directly in front of the LP compressor it would have been sucked straight into the blades on startup. I doubt that would have happened without noticeable effect. If it did somehow hang on during start and taxi, I'd give it a good chance of getting sucked in during run op to take-off power, at which point it would probably result in an abort well short of V1 with minimal risk.

        That is not to understate the risk of this incident, leaving tools in engines is a very big no-no. But things would have to line up astoundingly badly for this to have resulted in a crash. (Loss of a single engine shouldn't result in a crash either, but it's still one more engine than you'd be wanting to lose)

    2. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

      Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

      Not a good place to play roulette...

      1. Zoopy

        Re: "as it would pass through the rotating blades during flight"

        Especially when the roulette wheel is spinning at 10 trillion RPM and has a bunch of machetes sticking out of it which could come loose.

    3. herman Silver badge

      Tools all round

      Looks to me like a bunch of tools looking for the tool, with nobody else around to wield a clue stick.

  2. An_Old_Dog Silver badge
    Alert

    Multi-Fail

    1. "...it was dark and an engineer didn't use a flashlight." This person should never have been hired/should have been fired for lacking common sense, or, if you will, lacking the ability to recognize problems ("I'm searching for something in the dark.") and solve them appropriately ("I should compensate by using a bright, non-flame-based light source.").

    2. "...at least some of the engineers didn't even realize what part [should be, "tool" --AOD] they were looking for..." This is an organizational communications failure.

    3. "A missing tool report was lodged ... but the required follow-up never happened." / "Qantas personnel ... requested removal of the report as it was causing problems ..." This is an attitude failure of Qantas and contracted-maintenance-company (if any) personnel.

    I learned this lesson as a youth. I had been doing some maintenance on my parents' car while chatting with a friend who was a helicopter crew chief in the Marines. After putting everything away and closing the bonnet, I started the engine -- and heard a horrible clattering sound! I shut off the engine, opened the bonnet, looked around inside, and found a box-end wrench I'd mislaid and forgotten. My friend gave me a look, and said, "Always count your tools."

    From then on, I always have.

    1. MachDiamond Silver badge

      Re: Multi-Fail

      The tool being left in place when the mechanic left for their medical issues since it was still needed was the first of the multi-fails. If somebody else needed it, THEY could check it out of the tool crib and be responsible for it. There's a really good reason for the procedures regarding tools used around aircraft. Mechanics are required to have all of their tools "shadowed" with a full inventory posted on/in their tool boxes. The paperwork has boxes to tick in the procedures where mechanics must check their tools before signing off the aircraft.

      A missing tool at the repair facility should have sent up flares and sounded sirens, not been glossed over. Especially one used internally on an engine.

      I would have expected that engine monitors would see reduced performance in the engine looking at where the tool wound up.

      1. werdsmith Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        Terrifying for a light aircraft pilot, the thought that a tool floating about inside could tumble when the aircraft manoeuvres and lodge in a control rigging. At that point a pilot can only attempt secondary effect control and if that doesn’t work, the plane would go into a dead man’s zone and the pilot and passengers would spend a few terrifying seconds knowing their imminent fate.

        https://aerossurance.com/safety-management/c208-flying-control-tool-fod/

        https://www.flightsafetyaustralia.com/2021/08/forgotten-tool-led-to-rejected-take-off/

        1. seven of five Silver badge

          Re: Multi-Fail

          Doesn't have to be in an aircraft to relive this. Was innocent(-ish) trundling along the NC500, maybe possibly perhaps a wee lil tad above national speed limit, with an unsecured spare wheel in the boot of my station wagon. bridgecornerflatoutcompressionBUMP - huge impact to the back of my seat, breaking my zen. spare wheel made its way from the back of the car to rear passenger footwell. Obviously no one on the back bench, even my kids puke when I go that fast.

          Still .. uncomfortable. A smaller object could easily have made its way into the windscreen, onto my lap or even down to the brake pedal.

          Very uncomfortable.

          screwed some proper eyelets into the boot that very evening.

          1. werdsmith Silver badge

            Re: Multi-Fail

            In fact loose objects finding their way under pedals has caused motor accidents. Imagine something beneath the brake pedal preventing it from moving and not enough time to use the gearbox or handbrake.

            1. Fruit and Nutcase Silver badge

              Re: Multi-Fail

              loose objects finding their way under pedals...

              One of the many Tesla Cybertruck recalls...

              https://www.theregister.com/2024/04/22/tesla_accelerator_fix/

      2. jdiebdhidbsusbvwbsidnsoskebid Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        "The tool being left in place when the mechanic left for their medical issues since it was still needed was the first of the multi-fails. If somebody else needed it, THEY could check it out of the tool crib and be responsible for it."

        I agree, but from the article, it doesn't say why the tool was left there, only that someone was told to leave it. Who knows what the medical reason was, it could have been a serious life threatening condition that needed immediate attention. Perhaps someone said "wait until I remove the tool" while someone else (who was suddenly an emergency first responder) replied "leave it, I'm doing CPR, you get an ambulance!"

        Just speculating. On the face of it, this reads like a classic "Swiss cheese" incident, where any one of the things mentioned would have resolved it. I hope the engineer is ok.

        1. MachDiamond Silver badge

          Re: Multi-Fail

          "I agree, but from the article, it doesn't say why the tool was left there"

          The article does say it was left as it was still needed after the mechanic that had checked it out had left. All that's said was the mechanic had left his shift early for medical reasons. If it was by ambulance with vigorous CPR being applied, I'd expect that would have been mentioned. Whatever the issue, there was a question raised and answered about the tool.

          1. YetAnotherLocksmith

            Re: Multi-Fail

            It was presumably serious, as the employee didn't return to work until after the plane was falsely declared ready!

            I mean, how easy would it otherwise have been to ask the person who signed the tool out?

    2. My-Handle

      Re: Multi-Fail

      I've never consciously done this, but I have a feeling I've been doing this unconsciously ever since I started working on cars. It feels like common sense to make sure your socket set is complete, your spanners are accounted for and any other tools are back where they came from before starting up. Even then, I'll still have a thorough look around the engine bay both before and immediately after starting the engine, just to make sure everything is clean and running freely.

      I will admit, I don't quite go to the lengths of a physical checklist.

      1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        It's one of the things you notice with properly trained tradesmen: they will always take the time at the end of a job to check that they haven't left something behind, which is one of the aims of cleaning up after themselves. Yes, this will mean going through an apprenticeship that comprises of endless rounds of making the tea, being sent on quests to find spotted paint, etc., but also the chance to make mistakes, learn from them and learn how to avoid making them. Then the MBAs come along with their time and motion studies and ask for those tend minutes at the end of the shift could be used more productively…

        Managers and customers also need to appreciate this. Or learn the hard way.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: properly trained tradesmen

          But I got a nice extra long screw driver and nice channel lock pliers from a less than properly trained repairman at my hose one time. ;-)

          1. jake Silver badge

            Re: properly trained tradesmen

            Channel locks and an extra long screwdriver to work on a HOSE?

            He certainly was untrained, wasn't he?

            1. MachDiamond Silver badge

              Re: properly trained tradesmen

              Posted AC to prevent those tools being reclaimed, I'm sure.

            2. Zoopy

              Re: properly trained tradesmen

              I'm sure there are some niche trades where people pay for that kind of work on their... "hose".

              I'm not judging.

            3. My-Handle

              Re: properly trained tradesmen

              Last hose I replaced required me to take apart the engine intake manifold and injector assembly just so I could get to it. Bloody annoying, as the replacement hose only cost a few quid and was only held in with spring clips. Would have been a ten second job if I could only get to it.

      2. jdiebdhidbsusbvwbsidnsoskebid Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        I once list a pair of pliers that turned up six months later when I stopped them sitting on one of the axles - nicely polished. I also lost a 10mm socket in the engine bay that despite looking hard for, never found.

        1. Korev Silver badge

          Re: Multi-Fail

          I once lost a nipple into the rim whilst replacing a spoke on a bike wheel. No matter what I tried I couldn't get it out. A few months later said rim cracked, I wonder if the stray nipple caused the damage.

          1. Montreal Sean

            Re: Multi-Fail

            That must have hurt!

            Do you now wear a shirt when working on your bike?

        2. Proton_badger

          Re: Multi-Fail

          10mm sockets don't count, they behave in undeterministic ways, like quantum particles that spontaneously appear and disappear. If you listen very carefully in the darkness of night in your garage you can sometimes hear 10mm sockets pop in or out of existence in random places.

          1. MachDiamond Silver badge

            Re: Multi-Fail

            "If you listen very carefully in the darkness of night in your garage you can sometimes hear 10mm sockets pop in or out of existence in random places."

            If we could tap into that, I bet it would be even more powerful than vacuum energy. We need another Hawking to work on that. Extend the virtual particle pair hypothesis with black hole radiation (Hawking Radiation).

        3. MachDiamond Silver badge

          Re: Multi-Fail

          "I also lost a 10mm socket in the engine bay that despite looking hard for, never found."

          10mm sockets are the exact size to slip through where the universe gets thin. The best advice is to buy in bulk and keep them in multiple places so they don't all disappear at the same time.

      3. DS999 Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        I will admit, I don't quite go to the lengths of a physical checklist

        If you have a complete set of tools with places for everything I suppose you don't need that. Those of us who don't have that, and have already lost pieces of sets that do come with places for everything (like socket sets) don't have that luxury. Fortunately I don't work on my car, or very often anything with any high speed parts so the chances of that biting me beyond "what happened to that damn 5/16" socket I know I had it when I last used these tools a couple months ago".

        1. My-Handle

          Re: Multi-Fail

          My socket set is complete apart from one 5mm socket that seems to have departed this universe when the whole box got spilled into the guts of a camper van conversion. Found the rest of the set, but never that socket. Said van has since been written off in a motorway collision, so that socket is well and truly gone.

          My other tools are a mish-mash of inherited pieces that don't have a set home, so with those I have to be more careful.

      4. MachDiamond Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        "Even then, I'll still have a thorough look around the engine bay both before and immediately after starting the engine, just to make sure everything is clean and running freely."

        I didn't do that once. Now when I work on the car, I don't set anything down on the engine, but a cart I have next to where I'm working. I try to form good habits with things like that so it's an automatic thing. The adage, "a place for everything and everything in its place", is a good one. I'm not perfect so I run into issues like knowing I have some thing, but either didn't put it away properly or hadn't decided on where it should live. Having to dash to the hardware store several times in the course of a project is a problem, but if you need to have it done before the sun goes to bed, at least you know where in the store that thing you need lives. There's a price for them being so organized and me not so much. Of course I'll find that thing not too long after buying another.

      5. Sub 20 Pilot

        Re: Multi-Fail

        I have always done the same with my parachute repacking. A set number of tools, straps, weights at the start then the same number at the end. Not good to need a reserve chute or an issue with your main canopy because there is a holding strap keeping the risers together.

        Darwinism in a way - you only ever make this mistake the once..

    3. ITMA Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: Multi-Fail

      "My friend gave me a look, and said, 'Always count your tools.' "

      And it's standard operating theatre practise - you count everything (instruments, swabs etc) before starting and count everything at the end to make sure you've not left anything in the patient.

      Though people being people, mistakes do happen.

      This Qantas incident, however, is a classic example of how a string of simple errors can produce a situation with a potentially catastrophic outcome. Thankfully it didn't on this occassion.

      1. Richard 12 Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        The most serious failure was at the end, when they started trying to cover up the loss.

        The most senior manager involved in that needs to be fired.

        1. ITMA Silver badge
          Devil

          Re: Multi-Fail

          Starting with the Qantas manager who requested the "missing tool" report be "removed/downgraded" because it was "causing problems".

      2. Bebu sa Ware
        Coat

        Re: Multi-Fail

        "count everything at the end to make sure you've not left anything in the patient."

        Kidneys - 2, livers - 1, spleens - 1, ...

        Forgive me ... it's Friday. Bit of a bugger though if you left the gall bladder behind and it was supposed to be a cholecystectomy.

        1. ITMA Silver badge
          Devil

          Re: Multi-Fail

          And don't forget...

          "Ok, so that is one left leg successfully amputated.

          Erm - the notes said the RIGHT.

          Oopps".

          1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

            Re: Multi-Fail

            I've experienced that going into theatre… fortunately, I was still awake enough to say "LEFT HAND!"

            1. Marcelo Rodrigues
              Alert

              Re: Multi-Fail

              "...I was still awake enough to say "LEFT HAND!"

              I was going to have a procedure done on mu right eye.

              They asked me twice, and both times I tapped my head, beside the eye in question, and said "this one".

              Because I will surelly NEVER trust this kind of answer to something like "the left one".

              1. WanderingHaggis

                Re: Multi-Fail

                Then they draw a big cross on your forehead above the correct eye. At least they did for me.

                1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

                  Re: Multi-Fail

                  That's what they did with my hand but they were getting ready to draw on the other one! Mind you, you also need to treat what patient's say with some degree of professional scepticism because most of them have less than no idea but want to be helpful.

              2. RockBurner

                Re: Multi-Fail

                Yep - always double check.

                Just this month I've had an ulcerative eye lesion and was horrified to receive a letter cc'd to my GP from one of the dr's I've seen (never the same person twice... oh how I love the NHS), which was discussing my right eye.

                The lesion is in my LEFT eye.

                1. heyrick Silver badge
                  Coat

                  Re: Multi-Fail

                  "The lesion is in my LEFT eye."

                  Your left or his left?

                  Okay, okay, I'm going...

                2. Evil Auditor Silver badge

                  Re: Multi-Fail

                  "The OTHER left!"

                  Same when I drive and missus navigates - I don't compute left nor right.

              3. MachDiamond Silver badge

                Re: Multi-Fail

                "Because I will surelly NEVER trust this kind of answer to something like "the left one"."

                Sharpies are cheap and come off eventually. Nice big arrow.

              4. MJI Silver badge

                Re: Multi-Fail

                Had mine on local, swilled it in anasthetic, was big arrow on my forehead

                Both times.

                Anyway cannot phacoemulsify an IOL

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Multi-Fail

            Don't they actually mark the leg to be amputated?

            1. Wellyboot Silver badge

              Re: Multi-Fail

              The surgeon really should be going over 'no return' operations with patients before they're wheeled into the theatre.

              Liberal use of marker pens will provide peace of mind for all involved.

            2. Dave@Home

              Re: Multi-Fail

              From experience with my son getting a cataract op, they draw big arrows on with a marker - which is very funny when you look back at the photos

              1. C R Mudgeon

                Re: Multi-Fail

                A different medical use for marker on skin.

                A few years ago my foot was badly swollen and painful with some kind of infection. The doctor prescribed an antibiotic. He then took out a marker and drew an irregular line on my foot -- basically a contour line. His instructions were to expect the swelling to increase a little more over the next day or so (I think; it's been a few years) -- "but if it goes past the line, get to Emergency". (In fact it didn't; all was well in the end.)

          3. I am David Jones Silver badge

            Re: Multi-Fail

            “My right or your right?”

            1. PJD

              Re: Multi-Fail

              I'm sometimes asked when teaching people how to sail why they have to learn new terms like 'port' and 'starboard' "when everyone already understands 'left' and 'right'". They usually get it when I point out 'port' and 'starboard' are *always* relative to the boat, whereas 'left' and 'right' could be relative to the speaker *or* to the boat, and give the example of someone at the bow facing back to the helm and shouting "rock to the left', and the poor bugger on the helm having to make an instant guess whether it's their left or the boat's left, with a 50/50 chance of a nasty crunch sound.

              1. C R Mudgeon

                Re: Multi-Fail

                Indeed.

                The "vessel's left" term used to be larboard, but that led to a different sort of confusion, and so a word that didn't sound like starboard was chosen instead. For those interested, here are the etymologies of all three terms, including the specialized sense of port.

                1. This post has been deleted by its author

          4. 42656e4d203239 Silver badge

            Re: Multi-Fail

            Sadly my cousin experienced that, only it was the wrong lung... they were aiming for one of them and got the other. The one they were aiming for had cancer, the other didn't. She didn't last long.

          5. Dan White

            Re: Multi-Fail

            A neurosurgeon once said on a podcast* that it was drilled into them at medical school to always answer, "correct" for this exact reason:

            "So we're amputating the left arm?"

            "Right"

            <1 hour later> "Oh, oops."

            *Skeptics Guide to the Universe"

            1. Allonymous Coward

              Re: Multi-Fail

              Aviation phraseology is standardised & precise for this reason too.

              For example, “takeoff” is only used when takeoff clearance is given. At all other times “departure” is used. This was apparently a response to the Tenerife disaster.

              1. MachDiamond Silver badge

                Re: Multi-Fail

                "For example, “takeoff” is only used when takeoff clearance is given. At all other times “departure” is used. "

                Radios can still be horrible and people don't always articulate distinctly so aviation has evolved to have standard phrases where the sound "shape" is distinct. If you reply to Air Traffic Control incorrectly, they don't need to hear the words, but that the sounds are wrong for the expected response.

          6. Jean Le PHARMACIEN

            Re: Multi-Fail

            Yes, I know of a vascular/renal transplant (now deceased) surgeon who did this. Also removed healthy kidney not cancerous one. Somehow escaped disciplinary

          7. NorthIowan
            Facepalm

            Re: notes said the RIGHT

            They now try to eliminate that by marking which one they are operating on, but once in awhile they mark the wrong one.

        2. jdiebdhidbsusbvwbsidnsoskebid Silver badge

          Re: Multi-Fail

          https://www.newspapers.com/article/daily-sitka-sentinel-the-far-side-surg/926901

          Safe for work.

        3. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Multi-Fail

          You know you've got a problem when you're running the list on a kidney donor, and you come up with "Kidneys - 3"...

      3. Charlie Clark Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        Hang on… has anyone seen my watch.

        1. ITMA Silver badge
          Devil

          Re: Multi-Fail

          It may have been YOUR watch (says the surgeon).

          It is now MY watch LOL

          1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

            Re: Multi-Fail

            Oh, so that's where the ticking is coming from.

            Stevens! You can call off the bomb squad now.

            1. ITMA Silver badge
              Devil

              Re: Multi-Fail

              As long as it is not coming from a crocodile... Peter....

      4. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        "And it's standard operating theatre practise - you count everything (instruments, swabs etc) before starting and count everything at the end to make sure you've not left anything in the patient."

        A week ago after dental treatment. Dentist & assistant counting the instruments. Me, sitting up but looking down: "There's on of the floor".

      5. Mage Silver badge
        Unhappy

        Re: Surgery

        The controls on that sometimes fail and the missing swab, clamps or whatever are inside the patient.

      6. MachDiamond Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        "And it's standard operating theatre practise - you count everything (instruments, swabs etc) before starting and count everything at the end to make sure you've not left anything in the patient."

        There will usually be a nurse that's tasked with keeping track of instruments used. Definitely worth the expense.

        1. Sherrie Ludwig

          Re: Multi-Fail

          There will usually be a nurse that's tasked with keeping track of instruments used. Definitely worth the expense.

          A friend was that nurse, especially for the long (fourteen hour or more) orthopedic operations, that sometimes entailed a shift change among the support staff of nurses and techs. She scrubbed in as the second shift on one of these marathons. The first shift had made a proper mess of the sponge count. These little items are very easy to miss, once they are blood soaked and deep in the patient. They are brought to the ER in bags of ten, and the count is frequently updated, as more are used. The used ones are supposed to be counted as removed, and noted in groups of ten as well. SOMEHOW the first shift person had screwed up the count.

          My friend could not make the count of sponges in and sponges out come out equal, but could not find the error, or where it had occurred (in the requisitioning of new packs? In the counts of used ones?) After the surgery, the head surgeon and she re-counted all the used sponges, ripping open the many used sponge bags to see if the miscount was there, a disagreeable and difficult task, as they stuck together and were hard to separate. They both signed off when they thought they had the right count, best efforts and all.

          Long story short, at least one sponge was missed, the patient died, and as usual in US malpractice lawsuits, everyone who was anywhere near gets named in the suit, out to the guy mopping the corridor. That's when I found out that getting a metal instrument, a clamp, a needle, is bad but not always fatal, the body walls it off and continues on. A sponge is a focus for infection and much more likely to kill you before it can be found.

          I don't think she was held liable, but it haunts her still, into retirement.

    4. simonlb Silver badge

      Re: Multi-Fail

      This is even more important when the engine you are working on currently costs in the region of $25-million.

      1. ITMA Silver badge
        Devil

        Re: Multi-Fail

        Not to mention the lives of (in the case of a Qantas A380) upto 486 passengers and 25 crew.

        Viewing it in terms of the $ value of the engine is, I would argue, part of the problem.

        1. Richard 12 Silver badge

          Re: Multi-Fail

          The strict liability appears to be $925,000 per passenger, so it starts at about $500 million and goes up.

          Not sure what the insurance value of a second-hand A380 might be.

          (Australian dollars, of course)

    5. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: Multi-Fail

      "found a box-end wrench I'd mislaid and forgotten."

      Embarrassed garage owner: A few hundred yards after collecting my car after a service it developed a loud rattle from the front O/S wheel. Returned to garage where the hub-cap was removed along with the socket spanner that had been left on a wheel nut.

    6. Herring` Silver badge

      Re: Multi-Fail

      There is a dent in the top of a front wing on my car. To the uninformed, it looks a lot like the sort of damage that would occur when the owner - having diagnosed and fixed a tricky intermittent fault - slams the bonnet in triumph* without checking for spanners in the way.

      *Skoda.

      1. Wellyboot Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        That's one you usually learn very early in car ownership.

        1. Herring` Silver badge

          Re: Multi-Fail

          Well, when I did have a Triumph, the whole bonnet, wings etc. hinged up as one unit from the front. Which was great as you can sit on a front wheel and tinker. And if you do need to change the engine (for instance) you undo three bolts, lift the whole body assembly clear and you can get at everything.

          1. I could be a dog really Silver badge

            Re: Multi-Fail

            Ah that takes me back. My first car, a Mk II Spitfire - as you say, a delight to work on in terms of access to stuff. Just a pity about their "interesting" handling where cornering would change from "all's fine here" to "why am I facing the wrong way" in what seems like a negative period of time and no intermediate steps. They were awesome for autotests though.

    7. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      Re: Multi-Fail

      >1. "...it was dark and an engineer didn't use a flashlight." This person should never have been hired/should have been fired for lacking common sense,

      Their toolkit probably doesn't include a flashlight because one isn't required for that service.

      Or do you propose that they just have a spare flashlight in their pocket, along with a multitool and a few spare parts. Of course that would require them to have a system for ensuring that none of the spare tools from their pockets were left in an engine - but what are the odds of that !

      1. Jason Bloomberg Silver badge

        Re: Multi-Fail

        Or do you propose that they just have a spare flashlight in their pocket

        I always carry a small flashlight and would happily carry a spare as well. You never know when the lights may go out or you find yourself in the dark trying to find or check something. And I get 15 minutes of super hero fame when turned on as others are moving towards panic in unexpected and unwelcome darkness.

        You might think there's little chance of it being useful but you'll be surprised.

        1. Richard 12 Silver badge

          Re: Multi-Fail

          In this situation, the flashlight needs to be checked out and back in.

          It's no use to find and remove a plastic stick - and leave a flashlight in there instead.

      2. Doctor Evil

        Re: Multi-Fail

        "Or do you propose that they just have a spare flashlight in their pocket [...]"

        Everyone carries a cellphone these days - so everyone has a flashlight ready to hand.

  3. jake Silver badge

    My first full-sized pickup truck, bought used ...

    .... started developing an on-again, off-again loud clattering noise at about the 120K mark after I had been driving her for about 60K miles. Poking around with a large screwdriver as a stethoscope, I pin-pointed the noise as coming from somewhere around the lifters, so I figured it was time for a rebuild (what we used to call a "ring and valve"). The dismantle started with the intake manifold ... where I found a half-inch drive Craftsman ratchet with a short extension and a 9/16 inch socket nestled in the valley.

    Removed the tool, and replaced the intake, and all was well for another 80K miles, when I dropped in a 460 (needed the extra torque for logging work).

    I still have the truck ... and the ratchet, extension and socket, which still smell of used engine oil some 50 years on ...

    1. PerlyKing
      Unhappy

      Re: large screwdriver as a stethoscope

      Some engine work on my car was delayed because the mechanic was using a large screwdriver as a stethoscope. The tip slipped, contacted a moving part, and the blunt end fractured the mechanic's eye socket. Let's be careful out there.

    2. C R Mudgeon
      Pint

      Re: My first full-sized pickup truck, bought used ...

      I once picked up my car from being serviced and found a case of beer in the trunk that hadn't been there when I dropped it off that morning.

      I didn't complain about the unauthorized use of my car -- I just drank the beer.

  4. Pascal Monett Silver badge
    FAIL

    "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report"

    Typical administrative response. Oh, this ticket is a nuisance, let's get rid of it and the problem will go away.

    1. Benegesserict Cumbersomberbatch Silver badge

      Re: "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report"

      Fifteen years ago it absolutely would not have been the typical Qantas administrative response. Amazing how much damage a culture of no motivation but the dollar sign can to do an organisation once famous for its maintenance and safety record.

      1. Woodnag

        Re: "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report"

        Q remains the only time I've requested a chargeback on a credit card. During early Covid, or course, and Q cancelled the flight so the law is clear. No, we have lovely vouchers to offer you or you can go through these amazing phone-in hoops to get the refund. Oh, and separate hoops for the base ticket price and for the extra cost for seat upgrade, despite being bought at the same time and part of the same ticket charge. They didn't dispute the chargeback. I'm sure people have similar Air Canada tales of woe too.

    2. Andy Non Silver badge

      Re: "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report"

      Yes, what a tool.

      1. Bebu sa Ware
        Windows

        Re: "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report"

        Yes, what a tool.

        I was just thinking what was so amazing about flying with a 1.25m tool in it when aircraft normally fly with more than a few 2+ metre tools inside them.

        Have to wonder whether septic mechanics would have located the tool if they were looking for a 50 inch one.

    3. Richard 12 Silver badge

      Re: "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report"

      Gross misconduct, fire the most senior requestor.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report"

      AIUI standard practice for TalkTalk

    5. bazza Silver badge

      Re: "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report"

      Shows how easily the pressures of conducting business can override safety.

      That aircraft should not have been allowed to move 1 inch until that tool had been accounted for. That it did and flew 34 cycles speaks volumes about the motivations in play.

      It also speaks volumes about the thoroughness of "walk arounds". That location where the tool was found is visible between the fan blades, if one makes the effort to look. I doubt they took the fan off to take this photograph! If one enlarges it one can clearly see that we're looking through the engine and out the other end of the bypass duct, with the tool stuck at the bottom of it. It means that, in the walk arounds before each one of those 34 flights, no one really looked "in" the engines from the front. Most likely they simply looked "at" the engines, which to be frank is ****ing pointless. I also think that it'd have been visible from the back end of the engine too, had anyone looked forwards through the bypass duct.

      Granted, the engines on an A380 are pretty high up and you'd need a ladder to have a proper look. However, considering there was a tool missing you'd think that someone would have made the effort.

      Qantas likes to pride itself on never having had a crash. Well, they came far too close to having one on this.

      Fortunately, the risk of this being ingested by the engine core (where it could cause real damage) was pretty low. The flow of air through there tends to move things outwards. To have reached the engine core, the tool would have to have migrated inwards against the flow of air. One of the issues facing engine designers is actually getting air to flow into the engine core in the first place, when it doesn't want to. It's largely why the fan blades themselves have a twist - starting nearly straight at the root to let the air reach the inlet for the core itself, and twisting further out to have a shape that'll actually generate thrust.

      What would have happened eventually is that the tool would have disintegrated, probably on take off (peak thrust), blowing lumps of nylon all over the runway, probably without harming the A380 in any noticeable way (unless there are any delicate sensors jutting out into the bypass duct further back). However, the next aircraft to take off could be hitting that debris, maybe suffer a bunch of tyre blow outs, and have itself a take off crash. That is the risk I think Qantas ran.

  5. Anonymous Anti-ANC South African Coward Silver badge
    Thumb Up

    "...it was dark and an engineer didn't use a flashlight."

    It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a Grue.

    cue yammering and whomping sounds, then the sounds of bones crunching, then silence...

  6. Ian Johnston Silver badge

    This really has nothing whatsoever to do with Boeing.

    1. Richard 12 Silver badge

      No, but it Boeing are a clear example of what happens if this behaviour is allowed to exist.

    2. Sceptic Tank Silver badge
      Angel

      Nothing whatsoever to do with Boeing

      Well spotted. But the very first word of the title gave it away a little bit.

    3. Bebu sa Ware
      Windows

      Not Boeing

      This really has nothing whatsoever to do with Boeing.

      Assuming these engineers weren't, at some point in their careers, "trained" by Boeing.

      I remember hullabaloo when Qantas first outsourced some maintenance on their then all Boeing fleet (to Bangkok I think) foreshadowing these sort of failures.

      Enshittification is incredibly contagious and global both in scope and geographically but at an altitude of 10km this is not a comforting thought.

    4. Ken G Silver badge

      I know, amazing isn't it?

    5. heyrick Silver badge
      Joke

      "This really has nothing whatsoever to do with Boeing."

      No, but if it had happened to a Boeing it would have fallen right out of the sky...

  7. Michael H.F. Wilkinson Silver badge
    Coat

    Very lucky escape for all involved.

    A question remains: will Rain Man scratch Qantas from his list of acceptable airlines to fly with?

    1. Lily2905

      Re: Very lucky escape for all involved.

      And how long before MentourPilot (YouTube) covers this incident?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Very lucky escape for all involved.

        I'll give it until Sunday.

  8. Headley_Grange Silver badge

    Mansearching

    "..first because it was dark and an engineer didn't use a flashlight, and the second time because the inlet cowl where it sat was not examined."

    That's what the missus calls "mansearching"

    1. drand

      Re: Mansearching

      Not exclusive to men either. I can report my teenage daughters suffer from the same affliction.

    2. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: Mansearching

      That's what the missus calls "mansearching"

      Which is why it's always so satisfying to find SWMBO's glasses, car keys etc.

  9. SnailFerrous

    There is a similar culture of counting everything used, in and out in surgery. For obvious reasons. Though people are less likely to explode than jet engines if you accidentally leave FOD inside.

    1. ITMA Silver badge
      Devil

      Depends what you leave inside....

    2. bazza Silver badge

      Yep, and it's very simple concept. You count the tools out, reason says you should have the same number back when you're done. Tools do not evaporate, or melt, or get spirited away by the little tool pixies.

      It's absolutely horrifying that Qantas fooled themselves into acting as they did. Clearly they considered the "ah, Barney must've taken it home" scenario type to be far more likely than the "we've left it somewhere where it oughtn't be" scenario. If they were prepared to consider that it was possible for a tool to go missing in a "safe way", then their whole mindset was wrong. That in turn means that in fact they never had a tool counting culture in the first place - not a real one - and that they have been operating dangerously for a long time. This time, it actually went wrong, and they're just lucky it wasn't a disaster.

      If one has a safety measure - such as tool counting - you have to exercise the safety measure. What they need is an inspector who - during the course of work - nicks a tool and then times how long it is until the maintenance crew notice. If they change the work shift without noticing, fail. Depending on the tool, if they don't notice within a few minutes - fail.

  10. HorseflySteve
    Mushroom

    Bad comms as well as bad practice =

    Why didn't they just ask the engineer who checked it out where he left it before they signed off the plane, unless his medical appointment turned out to be with a pathologist?

    Do they not record who checks tools out?

    Even then, the guy that told him to leave it in place should have been aware of where "in place" was...

    1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: Bad comms as well as bad practice =

      the guy that told him to leave it in place should have been aware of where "in place" was

      And become the one responsible for checking it back in.

    2. MachDiamond Silver badge

      Re: Bad comms as well as bad practice =

      "Do they not record who checks tools out?"

      Yes, they do and also the job number so they know what aircraft it's being used on (or most places do).

  11. Sceptic Tank Silver badge
    Devil

    Specialisation

    This is always the problem when you are reliant on other people not doing stupid things for your continued well-being. Saw a story in the week of a chap in the Netherlands who stored 800kg of fireworks in his house. Imagine living next door. Or that time(s) when scrap metal scavengers did not understand what a radiation hazard warning looks like and proceeded to open discarded x-ray radiation sources, with lethal consequences for many unsuspecting victims around them.

    1. ITMA Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: Specialisation

      A couple of very sad/tragic cases of this:

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c51y1g08d3lo

      A guy who was scavanging metal from a derelict site unaware that 11KV switchboard he was attemtping to recover metal from was live!

      Or this very tragic one:

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cd6vw5nz961o

      It makes one wonder, what went wrong for a person who is in the back of a police car - for what ever reason - to be able to let themselves out on the side of a motorway?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Specialisation

        Both are examples which proves Darwin was right.

      2. MachDiamond Silver badge

        Re: Specialisation

        "It makes one wonder, what went wrong for a person who is in the back of a police car - for what ever reason - to be able to let themselves out on the side of a motorway?"

        In the US, nearly all police cars have "child locks" that don't allow the door to be opened from the inside. Whiles there's generally a switch in the jam to set or defeat that function, police departments have found it prudent to remove those switches since clever criminals will find a way to flip it while getting in the back.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Specialisation

      My initial thought, when reading the starting sequence of events (somebody going off-shift) and ineffective handover, goes back to the Piper-Alpha tragedy. There were multiple failures there, too, but the initiator of the subsequent chain of events was due to a flange not being tight at the end of a shift, with a presumption that it would be checked and the job finished by others. PTW (permit to work) rules were tightened up across the N Sea - a lot of frustration with all the extra admin and paperwork but N Sea O&G installations are, whilst presenting very serious hazards, are nowadays some of the safest places to work. Aviation has often been help up as an example of an industry with sound H&S practices but, from my experience during audits and assessments, there is scope for a lot of improvement. Unfortunately, the commercial side has to be considered and people want to fly.

      Oh and the photo in the article looks as though the rod is against the LP compressor vanes, not the blades. Vanes are stationary and direct air onto the blades (that rotate on their discs).

      Anonymous for, what I hope, is seem as good reason...

  12. Dwarf

    Maintenance procedure

    So, he was half way through a procedure and left the tool in there.

    I guess this means that that remainder of the procedure wasn't completed then ?

    After all, if someone else came in with another identical tool to finish it, then they would have found the first one still in place. However, since they didn't then I can't see how they would have finished the procedure. Similarly, if they continued with existing tooling, presumably a step on their procedure is to remove the tool at some point ?

    I wonder what was left disconnected / removed / not in its normal operating condition ???

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    " The odds of a tool such as this causing a catastrophic engine failure would be quite high,"

    What's amazing to me is that the rod wasn't shredded during engine start-up and that it rotated into a position 90 degrees to the direction it was probably inserted.

    Given the strength and toughness of nylon, if it hadn't bent round, it would have been an interesting fight between the power of the APU used to start the engine, and the shear strength of the nylon rod. (i.e. without rotating the rod round 90 degrees, it would have likely caused a failure during engine start up, and not a catastrophic failure during flight.) Either way, modern jet engines are tough beasts, capable of ingesting thousands of golf ball sized hailstones in a few seconds, and sometimes surviving ingesting quite large birds...

    1. ITMA Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: " The odds of a tool such as this causing a catastrophic engine failure would be quite high,"

      "Either way, modern jet engines are tough beasts, capable of ingesting thousands of golf ball sized hailstones in a few seconds, and sometimes surviving ingesting quite large birds..."

      And the occasional member of airport ground staff....

  14. tip pc Silver badge
    Holmes

    sounds like those searching for the tool didn't know what it looked like

    sounds like those searching for the tool didn't know what it looked like or what it was used for,

    also seems like they didn't know why it was missing.

    the story of why they where searching should have been shared.

    Something like: a tool that looks like this & is used to do x is missing. It was checked out by x on x day to do x job but was never checked in. X had a medical emergency during his shift. Can you go find X tool, start by looking at x part of the plane where x was working and would have used the tool.

    Also sounds like the engineer who was taken off shift did their best to ensure the tool was removed. Whomever knew X hadn't removed it should have told the shift supervisor that X mentioned about removing the tool but was told to leave it as their medical emergency was being dealt with.

    This is an all too common occurrence when things are outsourced. common sense goes out the window & important information is lost due to procedures that force the round peg over the square box slicing off the edges of the peg and leaving gaps in the box.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: sounds like those searching for the tool didn't know what it looked like

      Doesn't need to be a problem with outsourcing. Place where I work, getting one manager to talk to another is a massive struggle. The number of times I've had to follow up myself because managers can't fucking manage...

      I swear I have no idea how the company manages to function like that, and sadly the most incompetent of them are the ones pulling the strings so it's not like they can be culled for their attitude of complete and total indifference to anything that doesn't directly concern them.

      Anonymous for obvious reasons.

  15. Stu J

    Crashes?

    Neither Southwest nor United have had any recent _crashes_ due to engine failures...

    Yes they have had engine failures that have warranted emergency landings. Yes, in one case the debris caused a window to break and the poor passenger seated next to the window died as a result. But none of these cases could be classed as a "crash" - so why try to sensationalise those incidents?

    Two-engined aircraft are designed to be able to continue flying with only one engine - potentially for as long as 5 hours, and engine shutdowns/failures in flight are relatively common in the grand scheme of things - 5 or 6 times so far in November, no injuries, no major damage to anything on the aircraft...

    1. spold Silver badge

      Re: Crashes?

      Yes, planes don't crash often from this type of thing, usually just the once.

  16. disgruntled yank Silver badge

    counting

    A long-ago co-worker, then in the USAF reserve, explained that one always counted tools before and after working on a plane. A missing tool, if not found, could mean that the facility would X-Ray the plane looking for the stray tool. I assume that crew who let things get to that point were handed a broom and sent to sweep the runways.

    1. MachDiamond Silver badge

      Re: counting

      "A long-ago co-worker, then in the USAF reserve, explained that one always counted tools before and after working on a plane. "

      Common practice now is for mechanics to have "shadowed" all of the tools in their tool box. Special tools are often on carts with shadow markings with the entire cart coming to the aircraft rather than the one or two tools needed being taken from the cart while leaving the carts where it's stored. The really swank way to manage tools is to have precision cut foam. A quick visual inspection is all it takes to see that a tool is missing. If the tool is intentionally missing, a note is put in place to explain its absence. The job order will have a tick box that all tools have been accounted for as part of the sign off.

  17. Tubz Silver badge
    Trollface

    Thats nothing, we've had a massive tool for Liebour PM now for 133 days and counting, with lots of things being broken, mostly election promises!

  18. Ken G Silver badge
    Coat

    I have a metre long tool

    but I don't use it as a rule.

    I'll get my coat

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    No report, no problem

    "Qantas personnel in Sydney even requested removal of the report as it was causing problems – in response, the tool's status was downgraded."

    Oof. I've been on the other side of a few requests like that-- luckily at the time I had a boss willing to back me up when I said things like "so tell me the whole story of why you need this change" and "what no we are not going to 'help' you with that."

  20. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Stupid American spelling - again

    What kind of meter? Fuel flow? Oil pressure?

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Frying tonight!

    Is there a 2 metre tool someone could leave in a rocket engine?

  22. Eponymous Bastard

    Rainman

    because

  23. veti Silver badge

    Appropriate

    Somehow I'm not surprised this happened at LAX. If ever an airport deserved its code, that's the one.

  24. rcxb Silver badge

    Photo of the incident

    I expect the missing-tool incident went something like this:

    https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71dmyRCtkTL._SL1500_.jpg

  25. Emjay111

    Back in the days when TV sets were living room furniture (aka, large wooden boxes on legs), I lost one of my favourite long, flat bladed screwdrivers whilst on a field service call. Annoyed, I replaced it and thought nothing more of it. Until a year later, when I attended said TV set for another call, removed the back, and to my delight, found the lost screwdriver.

    On another occasion, I was servicing the car, and must have put a 13mm socket down on a windscreen wiper arm. Didn't realise it was there until it started to rain on the subsequent test drive, and I turned the wipers on. I watched the socket fly off into a farmers field. Didn't get it back.

    1. MachDiamond Silver badge

      "I watched the socket fly off into a farmers field. Didn't get it back."

      Wow, usually 13mm sockets are quite safe. It's the tenners you have to keep an eye on.

  26. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

    Its good that Q rewards the ceo for playing games and moving service all over the world ... we never heard of these things when they did service in AU.

  27. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

    You would think there would be a procedure when engine work was completed, to verify all tools were returned to their right place.

    THe cost of this far outweighs the cost of losing an engine worth more then ten million and a plane worth hundreds.

  28. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    When the tool hits the fan(s)

    QANTAS eh?

    Oh yeah, that’s the airline that likes to book phantom flights, then cancel but take 8 weeks to arrange a refund.

    Dead to me.

    1. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

      Re: When the tool hits the fan(s)

      Yeh they goto whore every last cent and fuck everyone up, because they wasted millions on bonuses for legions of management

  29. Chipwidget

    Once when working on a car window mechanism I reassembled the door only to find, on counting tools, I had left a spanner inside. My sympathy is with the mechanic

  30. ChaosFreak

    Fatherly advice

    As my aircraft mechanic dad used to say, never write your name on your tools.

  31. Andrew Scott Bronze badge

    tool left behind

    could have been worse, at least it wasn't an employee. they check tools in and out, do they do a head count?

  32. Dabooka

    Here's an idea

    Bright pink or fluorescent green might help in the future.

    I await my cheque in the post

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