Russian court fines Google $20,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 A Russian court has ruled that Google owes Russian media stations around $20 decillion in fines for blocking their content, and the fines could get bigger. To put that into perspective, the World Bank estimates global GDP as around $100 trillion, which is peanuts compared to the prospective fine. Google would therefore have to …
One penny on the first square, two on the next...et.c
Not too long until bankruptcy.
eighteen quintillion, four hundred forty-six quadrillion, seven hundred forty-four trillion, seventy-three billion, seven hundred nine million, five hundred fifty-one thousand, six hundred and fifteen give or take a few pennies whilst counting. Oh shit, I have to start a-fucking-gen. One, two, three...
Wasn't the googol invented especially just for this type of insanity?
10 days ~ ×1000 (210)
In one year (365 days) that's 2365 ~ 10110 so with the usual interminable litigation typical of US corporations they will need googolplexes (or is it googolplices?)
At some point if the respondent were to drop the accumulated fine in nickels and dimes on Moscow it would probably cover that part of the Russian Federation to a depth of several metres. A worthwhile result all round - if only!
Anyway, I was thinking about this, so to put just *quite* how much money- and how big 10^19 is- in perspective...
If the yearly output of the world economy was represented as the volume of a grain of sand (assume a cube with a typical value of 0.5mm per side) then a cube representing something 10^19 times that amount/volume would be 1077m (*)- i.e. just over one kilometre or two-thirds of a mile- tall. (**)
That's a cube taller than the world's tallest building- the Burj Khalifa which is "only" 830m high- yet, unlike the Burj, just as wide and deep as it is tall.
(*) Alternately you can think of that as 1177 yards or 3533 feet.
(**) Working; cube root of 10^19 is 2,154,434, therefore each side will be 2,154,434 * 0.5 mm = 1,077,217 mm = 1077m
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"Russian Federation will have officially taken its place in the dustbin of history."
Like Germany under Hitler was taken to the dustbin of history? Oh no, wait, their scientists were sought after by both Russia and USA, and Germany today is a bedfellow with North American folks, and quite well in assets and technology - thinking here of Siemens and the like...
"Russia has already been in the dust in of history for a long time."
Wrong. Russia has a lot of energy. Germany had a lot of profitable business because of Russian gas. Angela Merkel was wise to confront USA folks and keep Nord Stream pipeline flowing.
Not anymore.
And Germany business are suffering enormously.
It's a lot of money and not going to be paid. I do know of a interbank payment in the late 90's of about $23 trillion US dollars that was made in error. As this was also a multiple of global GDP it fortunately bounced. At the time the exchange rate was around 500,000 Turkish Lira to the dollar, so getting the currency code right on SWIFT payments was particularly important.
I don't think Russia actually expects to actually get any money from this. I think it's just a way of saying F you google and to make the rest of the world especially Americans aware of the truth being sensored to fit a certain narrative. Russia has just as much freedom of speech as we do here in America. The best solution that I have found to finding the truth about what is really happening is to watch several news outlets from different countries and taking the bits of truth from each and making your own conclusions. It's very important to see the issues from other countries perspective and if you do this you will soon see that not very many people view the USA the same as we Americans do. We're made to believe that we are on the side of Good fighting evil in hopes of world peace and nothing could be farther from the truth and we are to blame for almost all the conflicts in the world and even if we arent responsible we are at the very least involved in them in one way or another. Laugh now but Russia's economy is growing thanks to the sanctions America has put in place and we're going to regret using the dollar as a weapon and btw you can also kiss NATO good bye as the new world order is taking over right now and America will be lucky to be in the top 5
They were all so preoccupied with the Dollars, that they neglected to account for the cents.
As any self-respecting accountant will tell you the cents are important. So the real total is:
$20,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.97c
Or, converted to the Inter-Galactic Pound, it amounts to the more realistic IG£27.17.11d
I don't think it counts unless collected. Otherwise, the fine I imposed of triple that amount, doubling every hour, for stealing my information would count. That fine now has more zeros than there are atoms on Earth.
Naturally, I have 0 to the 110th power squared chance of collecting a penny of that fine.
"Otherwise, the fine I imposed of triple that amount, doubling every hour, for stealing my information would count. That fine now has more zeros than there are atoms on Earth."
Silly awards like this don't even work to make a point.
The same thing happens in the US when juries ding somebody for more money than they've ever had or will earn in their lifetimes. Good luck on the plaintiff collecting. It also means there will be all sorts of appeals, motions for re-evaluation, ad nauseum.
If you wind up suing somebody/company, you want a decision that compensates you for damages and is also reasonable enough that there's a good chance it will get paid and paid quickly. If the attorneys on the other side tell their client, who is guilty as sin, that fighting the decision is just going to add heaps more billable hours at "partner" prices, the only smart move is to concede, pay up and move on.
Russian court happy to lay sanctions on western businesses, and yet the irony of the reasons behind the sanctions - Russia being sanctioned - appears to have been completely wasted on them.
I think it's more the irony of sanctions. Various states have imposed sanctions on Russia making it illegal to do business there. Sanctions may be illegal-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collective_punishment
Collective punishment is prohibited by treaty in both international and non-international armed conflicts, more specifically Common Article 33 of the Fourth Geneva Convention and Article 4 of the Additional Protocol II
But might makes right and the problem with 'international law' is it doesn't really exist, or isn't enforceable. Which sometimes makes a mockery of the claim for 'international rules based order', whatever that may mean. But assorted national and international laws continue to exist, so businesses that had operations in Russia would still need to pay taxes etc. Sanctions mean they can't, so Russia can (and has been) seizing those assets. Which will be accelerating after the EU and US decided to seize Russia's foreign reserves and make loans to Ukraine secured by interest due on Russia's money, which may in itself be illegal. Plus also a bit of a ponzi scheme, ie new $50bn loans are to repay existing Ukrainian debt. Then if the interest seizure is ruled illegal, and Ukraine can't repay the new loans, US, EU and UK taxpayers are on the hook for that $50bn.
But collective punishment should also apply to Russia, so Russia can't seize assets, or exploit assets of companies or individuals that aren't really party to the conflict.. But could foreclose and seize assets if taxes aren't paid. So a collosal mess. Ford or GM etc might lose a factory in Russia due to sanctions, then want compensation, but from whom? The EU or US for imposing the sanctions and collective punishment, or Russia for foreclosing due to non-payment of taxes, rates etc.
It's the kind of international legal mess that's going to enrich lawyers for decades.
Despite what whining Russian propaganda has to say, sanctions are not illegal. Let's look at the laws that you quote from the Geneva Conventions of civilised warfare:-
https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/en/ihl-treaties/gciv-1949/article-33Article 33 - Individual responsibility, collective penalties, pillage, reprisals
No protected person may be punished for an offence he or she has not personally committed. Collective penalties and likewise all measures of intimidation or of terrorism are prohibited.
Pillage is prohibited.
Reprisals against protected persons and their property are prohibited.
A "protected person" in the meaning of the Geneva Conventions is a civilian present at a battlefield (usually because that battlefield is in their town rather than a field).
Summarily, this says that during a war an army cannot and must not shoot civilians, pillage them or have tantrums and execute civilians under their control in revenge for losing on the battlefield. All of which Russia is actually doing beyond any reasonable dispute given that examples of all of these have been (and still are being) caught on video and posted on the internet. Along with threatening to alternately invade us, or nuke us.
In response, the west imposes sanctions saying that we will no longer sell you anything that you can conceivably use against us, and have moved services (eg google) out of Russia so that the laws of "might makes right" in force inside Russia no longer can be made to apply.
What Russians call collective punishment anybody with a functioning brain will see as a logical consequence of saying you hate us and want to destroy us and being caught committing atrocities that were even below the Nazi party. Your frankly quite lucky that it would trouble our conscience to watch you lot starve, because that is the only reason Russia still has food and booze in abundance, even if Russian import taxes and decisions from the Russian government to feed a war of choice is making imports and therefore food much more expensive for you.
Also, those companies like Google that your threatening? Alphabet owns Google. Check out it's market capitalisation relative to Russia's GDP; it's about the same. The stark reality is that single western companies (not countries, companies) are as rich and powerful as Russia is as a country.
All of which Russia is actually doing beyond any reasonable dispute given that examples of all of these have been (and still are being) caught on video and posted on the internet. Along with threatening to alternately invade us, or nuke us.
Equally Ukraine has also been videoing itself committing war crimes, or convention breaches, eg drone executing soldiers attempting to surrender, or wounded and hors de combat and firing PFM-1 mines into Donetsk. Any evidence of war crimes should be investigated and prosecuted by any party to this conflict. Justice is supposed to be blind after all. Russia also hasn't been threatening to invade or nuke us. Most of those threats have been made by our 'leaders' to either escalate, or justify the continuing killing of Ukrainians. Russia has a clear nuclear doctrine, ie if it is attacked, it will respond, just as other NATO members do.
Most of the threats and posturing have been coming from our 'leaders', ie most recently the hype around Russia and the DPRK. Russia has a sovereign right to do whatever it wants within their own territory, so if they want to allow DPRK forces to join in repelling Ukraine's invasion in Kursk, so be it. If they're used inside Ukraine, then DPRK becomes party to the conflict and life gets more interesting. Especially as we have limited options given we've sanctioned pretty much everything regarding both countries. We could put 'boots on the ground', as Ukraine wants but that would be a major escalation and invitation to WW3.
In response, the west imposes sanctions saying that we will no longer sell you anything that you can conceivably use against us, and have moved services (eg google) out of Russia so that the laws of "might makes right" in force inside Russia no longer can be made to apply.
But sanctions have gone way beyond this, and are very much "might makes right". So for example yachts owned by oligarchs have been seized and sold off because their owners have some tenuous connection to Putin, or supply steel etc to the Russian military. That has very much been collective punishment given the intent has been that oligarchs might rise up and somehow overthrow the Russian government and bring about regime change.
Plus there's another great example of western hypocrisy ongoing at the moment. So a President complained about potential voting irregularities in Georgia. That lead to ongoing litigation, cries of 'dictator' etc etc. Meanwhile, in another Georgia, elections were held, their French President refuses to recognise the result and stuff like this happens-
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgej9vyld8qo
US President Joe Biden has called on the Georgian government to respond to international concern at the scale of violations in Saturday's election and repeal recent Russian-style laws.
The Georgian Dream government in the South Caucasus state, which borders Russia, claimed a fourth term in power after election authorities said it had won almost 54% of the vote.
Nobody has presented any clear evidence regarding the 'scale of violations', and the 'Russian-style laws' are pretty much a carbon copy of the US FARA laws. Which obviously the EU and US don't want because it would show the extent of foreign interference in Georgia's affairs. It looks like we wanted another Maidan, but the 'popular uprising' was extremely limited to a few people waving EU flags. Curious how that works and how many normal people would actually own those flags. Plus the usual tell that photos of the 'crowds' consisted of tight shots showing only a few people. But because Georgians didn't vote the way we wanted, they're now being threatened. Which is 'democracy', Western style.
Your frankly quite lucky that it would trouble our conscience to watch you lot starve, because that is the only reason Russia still has food and booze in abundance, even if Russian import taxes and decisions from the Russian government to feed a war of choice is making imports and therefore food much more expensive for you.
Oh great, you're another Anonymous Coward who's deluded about who they're actually talking to. But you're right, it won't and doesn't trouble our leader's conscience to watch us lot starve, or suffer the consequences of sanctions and other economic policies. Russia's defence budget and spending is pretty tiny compared to us, ie NATO members and especially the US. But that's why this proxy conflict has been so great for some sectors of our economies. Ukraine loses a $1bn Patriot system, great, we'll buy them a new one. Nobody really asks why that system costs $1bn, or why Russian S-400 systems cost far less, and seem far more effective. That's mostly a BRICS thing, so now nations have had a chance to observe the performance of NATO wunderwaffe, they might decide to buy Russian kit instead.
But you may also be living in the past. I remember news showing USAid grain shipments being delivered to feed starving Soviets. That was very much the past. Now, the reality is this-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wheat_production
Russia's been producing more than double the US wheat production, and has half the population. Russia's modernised their agricultural sector and now produces and exports a lot of products. Of course countries that abide by Western sanctions aren't allowed to buy it, so food prices have been rocketing in the West. And of course grains are easy to turn into booze, so Russians can still drink. They may not be drinking French champagne or cognac any more, but that's France's problem.. And why sanctions have been harming the West more than they have Russia. Plus has lead to other oddities like the amazing growth of India's oil industry. Despite no obvious increase in production, India is now one of the biggest suppliers to the EU. That isn't Russian oil, it's Indian, and our 'leaders' don't want people protesting about rising fuel costs due to their self-imposed sanctions.
Also, those companies like Google that your threatening?
I'm not threatening anyone. Russian courts have imposed a ludicrous fine on AlphaGoo for breaking Russian law. Good luck collecting on that one. But until the dispute (and sanctions) are resolved, they're pretty much locked out of the Russian market. Yet Russians are still able to buy Apple and Android phones. Funny how that works. Sanctions though are much like the Internet and sanctioned nations just find ways to route around the problem.. Which is all the more easy given most of that kit is made in China, Taiwan, Vietnam etc that are pretty much ignoring the sanctions.
Russia has a sovereign right to do whatever it wants within their own territory
Which we entirely support comrade. Along with any efforts to retard expanding the borders of that territory into territory held by democracies that Russia has declared intentions to subjugate.
By all means withdraw to your own territory and build a new wall to forcibly keep your people in and we'll get along fine. Alas, your leaders can't do that because living next to countries that started off with your level of wealth and freedom 30 years ago, and are now doing much better without your leaders and their leadership ideas keeps giving Russian serfs ideas about how they could do that too if they weren't hindered by their glorious leaders.
Nobody really asks why that system costs $1bn, or why Russian S-400 systems cost far less, and seem far more effective.
They probably seem more effective if your bosses don't let you watch the videos of S400's tossing off all of their rockets trying to shoot down a single incoming missile, and then being blown up by that missile. I'd suggest looking on youtube if your bosses hadn't blocked it in Russia.
Russia's been producing more than double the US wheat production, and has half the population.
Despite which, Russia can't produce basic foodstuffs like eggs, milk etc let alone safe to eat meat products before considering that the booze production of Russia is orders of magnitude below the consumption of it, and hence it requires imports from the decadent west if you don't want to rapidly revert back to the starvation level diet of a North Korean peasant.
By all means withdraw to your own territory and build a new wall to forcibly keep your people in and we'll get along fine.
You really do seem to be a very confused and very ignorant troll. It's actually us that have built a wall to keep Russians out. We don't want those evil Russian tourists or businesses spending money and boosting our economies. We don't want their exports either. Some of our business and industries might, but deindustrialising Germany is a small price to pay for defeating The Putin. If you're a German VAG worker losing your job because they're closing 3 factories, just know that your sacrifice is to support our 'leaders' vanity. Oh, and of course our 'leaders' can't keep illegal immigrants out of the EU, even though some EU nations are trying to rebuild their own walls to try and manage that influx.
Despite which, Russia can't produce basic foodstuffs like eggs, milk etc let alone safe to eat meat products before considering that the booze production of Russia is orders of magnitude below the consumption of it,
And your evidence for this is.. where? Also rather bad timing given McD's just had to stop flogging burgers due to E.Coli contamination. Oh the humanity! Or just compare the price of staples like eggs, milk, bread etc in Russia and the West. Especially they way those prices have inflated here thanks to our 'leaders' insane energy policies. Our late stage capitalism has somehow massively increased energy and food poverty, and our 'leaders' have helped create new terms like 'food deserts' as a consequence.
Yet apparently Israel can collectively punish the Palestinians with impunity and still claim to be the wounded party .....
Yes October 7th was terrible but killing 40 times as many people doesnt make it right
Bombing hospitals doesn't make it right
Flattening virtually all of Gaza isn't right
Arresting doctors enmasse isn't right
Starving civilians isn't right
You can't claim the moral high ground by breaking the law
Can't believe I'm going to quote Piers Morgan of all people, in response to Israeli supporters approving of collateral damage against civilians.
"When the IRA were murdering people in England, we didn’t drop 2000lb bombs on Belfast because the terrorists were living among civilians."
Hamas, backed by the population in Gaza, started a war.
They should not have done that.
If the population in Gaza want to end the war, they need to get rid of Hamas. At the moment it seems they still demand that Israel capitulates and cease existing as a nation. So continued war seems inevitable. (nobody on the outside wants war, but have you seen anyone offer any alternative other than "let us agree to a ceasefire and repeat Oct 7th in 15 years when Hamas have had a chance to rebuild"?)
But certainly, if e.g. an airstrike turns out to have specifically targeted civilians (rather than a bunch of Hamas terrorists hiding behind a bunch of civilians), take the responsible people off to Hague.
If you compare to e.g. WWII, many cities in Germany were flattened (with civilians buried underneath), the country disarmed and split in half for several decades. War isn't pretty, and few countries would accept having Hamas as neighbors.
Here's an idea. Try taking your tongue out of Mad Vlad's bumhole before posting.
Here's a couple more ideas.
-Try and debate like an adult.
-If you want one of those 'special' piano duets with Elensky, just contact his manager Andriy Yermak and make him an offer.
Jellied's response there, and similarly on several other occasions, suggests that even if they can't get their pro-Russian spew taken seriously, they still enjoy the attention and responses that brings, whether positive or not.
Or put another way, Jellied's attitude seems to be less "better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt" than "better to be thought a fool than to be ignored".
Or put another way, Jellied's attitude seems to be less "better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt" than "better to be thought a fool than to be ignored".
Oh look! Another Anonymous Coward leaping right in with some ad-homs! Again making my point. You remove all doubt by virtue-signalling as an AC rather than adding to the debate. If you think my comments are foolish, I welcome corrections and attempts at proper debate. If you just post ad-homs or play the fool, I'll happily mock you. And you could, of course just ignore me and not post blatant insults..
> virtue-signalling as an AC
How does posting as an AC have anything to do with "virtue signalling" then?
> If you think my comments are foolish, I welcome corrections and attempts at proper debate.
If you're making foolish comments, I'm not obliged to pander to your desire for them to be taken seriously or deserving of "attempts at proper debate" when they're not.
> you could, of course just ignore me
If you don't like the responses you receive, you're free to not post here.
> I'll happily mock you
And yet, you're the one near-universally downvoted and mocked, not me. :-)
> Elensky
I know you want to think that this is a clever and amusing mockery of the guy (one, for those unfamiliar with it, which is apparently based on this fake Photoshopped "Time" magazine cover).
But to anyone who isn't already a full-on guzzler of Russian state propaganda aimed at culture warriors like you, aside from being rather childish and pathetic, it's simply a constant reminder of how blatantly partisan you are.
I know you want to think that this is a clever and amusing mockery of the guy
Well, he's easily mocked. As are people that rely on Snopes for their 'fact checking'. The meme actually came about after news of this kinda stuff spread-
Latvia passed a similar law, and Germany is considering legislation that would make the public display of the letter "Z" a criminal act.
and Ukraine had already passed that legislation. They still won't ban nazi imagery though..
Your wiki article only talks about the rules of war, as in the Geneva and Hague conventions. Most of it is about the duties of an occupier. None of that bears on international trade.
So your point is as irrelevant as one of the nutters trying to serve writs of Magna Carta against lockdown - the video I saw was of a very confused, but surprisingly polite, policeman at Edinburgh Castle.
Your wiki article only talks about the rules of war, as in the Geneva and Hague conventions. Most of it is about the duties of an occupier. None of that bears on international trade.
No, it doesn't. I just picked an example that had specifics when applied to armed conflicts. Which gets kinda interesting given there are the two official beligerents, plus 30 or so unofficial ones waging economic war against Russia and their civilian population. But such is politics, especially with the Twitter generation who can't read or process more than 140 characters. But if you followed the links, you'd find this-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nulla_poena_sine_culpa
Nulla poena sine culpa (Latin for "no punishment without fault" or "no punishment without culpability") or the guilt principle is a legal principle requiring that one cannot be punished for something that they are not guilty of. It is recognized as a human right by the Court of Justice of the European Union and all Council of Europe member states. Under this principle, a person can not be punished if he or she is not guilty. Cases of force majeure or necessity are exempted from criminal responsibility. Furthermore, it establishes that no one can be liable for the crimes committed by another person.
Russia invades Ukraine, so let's punish Russian athletes, musicians, ballet dancers etc etc because they're guilty of being Russian.. Which isn't a crime because ethnicity is a protected characteristic under EU law. But if they've got a yacht, just seize it and flog it because this is how 'International rules based order' works. Might makes right. Challenge the decision to deprive people of property in court if you want, but sanctions prevent you from doing that.
Democracy just ain't what it used to be.
Jellied Eel,
You appear to be making things up. Your point about collective punishment not being allowed in the rules of armed conflict is correct - but it's just that collective punishment doesn't mean what you think it means. The problem with laymen looking at law - all the words have specific meanings and "I don't think this is fair" isn't a legal argument or basis for a legal doctrine.
Equally your new link, having been shown to be wrong in your last post, is to a Wiki page that has a single source and a warning at the top that it has multiple issues including references that aren't specific to its arguments.
I cliicked on the other reference, as it was a link to the CJEU - and that's a link to a judgement of the court that has no reference to your legal principle or collective punishment. So appears to be a random link to give the article some whiff of credibility.
I've not come across any principle of international or human rights law that forces any country to trade with any other country. I can't prove it isn't true - but the nice thing about argument is that I don't thave to. You have to prove your point - and you have so far failed. Just stick to you not liking the policy and try to make arguments on why it might be a bad policy choice.
It was also rather ironic you quoting the rules of war against collective punishment of civilians in defence of Russia's war in Ukraine where Russia have repeatedly used unguided rocket artillery on cities full of civilians from day one of the war. You really ought to be ashamed of yourself.
I cliicked on the other reference, as it was a link to the CJEU - and that's a link to a judgement of the court that has no reference to your legal principle or collective punishment. So appears to be a random link to give the article some whiff of credibility.
Your credibility was pretty much shot when you couldn't find the origins of the 'slava' thing, and from memory pounced on some uncited claim that it originated in the 14th century when Ukrainian didn't really exist. Your credibility further suffers with your thinking that punishment can and should be applied irrespective of guilt, which... isn't the usual legal definition, or how justice is supposed to work. The article cites the following-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_6_of_the_European_Convention_on_Human_Rights
1) In the determination of his/her civil rights and obligations or of any criminal charge against him/her, everyone is entitled to a fair and public hearing within a reasonable time by an independent and impartial tribunal established by law...
2) Everyone charged with a criminal offence shall be presumed innocent until proven guilty according to law.
And once again..
Nulla poena sine culpa (Latin for "no punishment without fault" or "no punishment without culpability") or the guilt principle is a legal principle requiring that one cannot be punished for something that they are not guilty of.
So someone sanctioned may have property seized, then sold and be deprived of that property without being convicted of any crime. Plus to add insult to injury, can't challenge the decision because as sanctioned individuals, they can't access or pay for legal representation unless (in the UK) their legal representatives can get permission from the Home Office to challenge the seizure. Which some individuals have managed and the seizures have been found unlawful.
I've not come across any principle of international or human rights law that forces any country to trade with any other country.
And yet again, you play with straw. I have never made this claim. There are however international laws that cover trade disputes, along with mediation. You're probably not aware that one of the issues behind Ukrainian-Russian relations was a long running dispute regarding stolen gas, which lead to Russia and the EU routing around the problem and building new pipeline routes that avoided an unreliable and kleptocratic partner. Which is also going to be one of the long-term problems for Ukraine because they're losing those transit fees.
...in defence of Russia's war in Ukraine where Russia have repeatedly used unguided rocket artillery on cities full of civilians from day one of the war. You really ought to be ashamed of yourself.
As should you. I have no idea why you're such a staunch defender of the Kiev regime, but you're either woefully ignorant about what lead up to this conflict, or intentionally dishonest. This conflict started in 2014 with Ukraine's coup, and then civil war. During which the Kiev regime regularly and repeatedly used airstrikes, regular artillery, rocket artillery, air-launched mines etc on civilians in Donbas. Plus as an example of more classical collective punishment, cut off the water supply to Crimea. This is why I don't support the Kiev regime. Most people in the West are ignorant of those events and that's largely as a result of propaganda... Focus on 2022 and the 'full scale invasion', not the events that lead up to that invasion.
But that doesn't necessarily justify some of Russia's actions. It's using some very destructive weapons like FAB-3000s, TOS-1 & 2 thermobaric systems etc etc. But that's 'war' for you. It isn't pretty. It's also quite striking how, after nearly 3yrs of fighting their have been relatively few civilian casualties. Especially compared to our 'wars' against Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan etc etc where we killed and displaced civilians in the millions.
But the real shame belongs to our 'leaders' and useful idiots who support continuing to kill Ukrainians (and Russians) in this proxy conflict, and the lack of any serious efforts to bring about peace.
"Russia invades Ukraine, so let's punish Russian athletes, musicians, ballet dancers etc etc because they're guilty of being Russian."
This illustrates the difficulty of sanctioning a country. There just isn't a way to punish "Russia" without punishing the Russian people and companies. If the country is "of the people", those people should demand a voice so they can be relieved of those sanctions and just get on with life. Where is Putin going with his fresh wave of empire building and how does this represent the citizens of Russia? If it does represent the wishes of the citizens, those ballet dancers, artists, musicians and athletes are valid targets.
Some Russian Athletes were visibly supporting the Russian War against it's neighbours. Many Russian Athletes are employed by Russian Military for propaganda (public functions & school visits in uniform) & state funding them to be professional athletes. There's big conflict of interests. Russian sports committees/federations & State funded agents were also caught repeatedly hiding & tampering drug tests so their athletes could get away with cheating. If you don't play by the rules, you don't get to play. Some Russian athletes have been allowed to compete but not as "Russian" athletes from Russian sports committees/federations.
Winter sports athlete with "Z" in big bold print while collecting his medal like Nazis. Russian Skiers & spectators making big "Z" at the ski event, just like Nazis. When the population clearly supports their government/terrorists & fails to act against it, then they share some responsibility for the consequences. Full trade with Russian would've helped Russian fund the war & makes total nonsense why you would've expected UK & it's allies to have continued trade with the Nazis after Nazis invaded Poland, Belgium, Holland, France...
Russia has used global trade, diplomatic service & tourists to cover it's spying & clandestine attacks against the West. The Berlin wall & Iron curtain were made primarily to keep people IN not to stop USSR from being attacked. Many states like the Baltics knew how Russians behaved as "friends", they hurried to leave USSR & hurried to join NATO as soon as they could for very good reasons. Countries now in NATO were never attacked nor invaded by NATO, no NATO tanks in the streets, no NATO soldiers holding them at gunpoint to vote. Even France chose to leave and was allowed to leave. Turkey chose to limit USA/NATO activity in/over it's territory. Most NATO forces in each country are it's own & locally paid for. You don't see cities like Mariupol after Russian attacks in other countries who joined NATO.
Russia requested gallantry medals for the return of Crimea in December 2013, the contract signed in Jan 2014 to be ready before the 20 Feb 2014, they were made with the campaign start date of 20 Feb 2014. The Ukranian president (VY) abandoned his office/duty late 22 Feb 2014 & officially confirmed by the Ukranian national government (Rada) by way of majority. The Rada members were still as they were democratically elected (bar 3 resignations, I think). Some members & most former party members of his own party voted against him to create the opposition majority. The Rada was not occupied by protesters, not held at gunpoint. They voted for new elections which were held within 4 months despite Russian interference (couldn't vote in some areas, Ru militias attacked ballots & polling place before the vote).
Compare that with Igor Girkin et al who used false names, false passports, were there in Crimea ready to act on/before 21 Feb 2014. Girkin & others admitted that the Crimean gov/officials were going to stay with Kyiv (until Russians came to change that). Girkin admitted to leading a militia to take Crimean gov by force, held its members at gunpoint to vote (opposition members held under house arrest) for the changes Russia wanted to legitimise the Russian military invasion & annexation that had already occurred (retrospective). These methods were repeated in parts of Luhansk & Donetsk regions (in 2021, Russian held only a third of this area) and failed in several other places that Russia had attempted. Russia paid separatists since 2005. Russia paid people to be protesters & provocateurs - this was obvious from their accents, the busses, those asking for directions, those attacking the wrong building & those getting lost. Many of those who opposed Russian annexation in this area primarily spoke Russian, including the Ukr soldiers. Many videos of Russian led militias with guns taking control of buildings while officials, police/soldiers & citizens were outside & unarmed. The Ukr military were inside their barracks with no orders to deploy, no tanks outside, no bombing, no gun battles when Russian led militias came to surround them. Some Ukr soldiers were off base with no weapons, when they arrived for their next shift/duty they were blocked by Russian led militias so they couldn't enter their base & they didn't have any guns to fight/defend so no shooting each other. (this is how it started). Russia denied any & all involvement until partially admitting it several months after Minsk2. Russia never negotiated in good faith & never held itself to be bound by those agreements (not signed as a belligerent).
Fmr president VY was not arrested when he attempted to fly away, he wasn't held at gunpoint when he chose to leave. He tried to find support in his home city/region but companies/VIPs didn't want him to visit. His party held a conference and VY was told not to come. At this, all but 1 from Crimea said they didn't want to split from the rest of Ukraine, they didn't want to be annexed by Russia. Protesters supporting of Kyiv soon outnumbered those supporting Russia in the East. The KIIS polls in 2013-14 before 22 Feb 2014 never had any region with a majority that wanted to be annexed by Russia. Claims that because they primarily spoke Russian meant they supported Putin was FALSE. Ask people in USA & many other countries that primarily speak English (eg former colonies of England) if they want to be annexed by England today. NO WAY !!! Even Australia has it's own constitution & governs itself, our laws are not made by England/Queen/King, we chose our members of government, England/Q/K don't pick our PM.
They don't like it up them, Jellied Eel, all those anonymised disliking a post down voters, but whenever it is realised that they be essentially impotent to effect any change in their current seriously misundereducated and easily misdirected state, is the path forward for progressives cleared of any obstacles and/or opposition that they may have imagined to exist for them to position and/or wield, either presently or in the future, near or for forward.
They don't like it up them, Jellied Eel, all those anonymised disliking a post down voters, but whenever it is realised that they be essentially impotent to effect any change in their current seriously misundereducated and easily misdirected state
Yep, it's really rather sad the way politics has become so divisive, especially when that's intentional. Keep the useful idiots ignorant and don't look at the policy costs or consequences. Case in point for us in the UK at the moment with our budget, and enforced 'austerity' and £40bn in tax increases. Things ain't looking great for the grand experiment in 'globalisation'. Our 'leaders' will only be able to blame The Putin for so long, especially as the consequences of our self-imposed sanctions are becoming ever more obvious.
The problem with sanctions is that it is encouraging dedollarisation, where countries try to find alternatives to networks such as SWIFT where countries do not need to involve the US. It's longer term effect is to reduce the ability of the US to influence the foreign policies of those countries it (the US) does not like.
The problem with sanctions is that it is encouraging dedollarisation, where countries try to find alternatives to networks such as SWIFT where countries do not need to involve the US.
I think it's worse than that. Mira has been pretty successful in locking out Mastercard & Visa, and if that gets wider adoption, BRICS covers a very large population. Plus announcements for alt-nets for grain and other commodities trading that could have a huge impact on the West's service economy.
That is not necessarily a bad thing... Why should a country's commercial entities be fined for doing business with a country that is not sanctioned by their home country, but rather by the country 'owning' a de facto global currency? Put simply, if my country and your country are on good terms, but your country and Bob's country aren't, why should businesses in my country be fined/prosecuted by Bob's country for doing business with your country, just because Bob doesn't like it. What happens between your and my country is none of Bob's, or Bob's country's, business!
Yes, I do see the irony in this, although going to war with a country over political differences is a different level to just sanctioning a country over political disagreements and tends to not play well with those with a vested interest in peace. And yes, I see the irony in that too. That's why international politics is somewhat more protracted and complex and many shades of grey compared to the layman's often black-and-white world.
Why does there have to be a reason?
"Hey, we're at war with our neighbor. You can trade with them, or you can trade with us, but not both."
Replying with the question "Why?" is a possibility. I'm not sure how productive that question is.
One could argue that such sanctions might encourage the decision makers to end the conflict sooner and thus save countless lives. But there really does not have to be any reason other than "because".
No matter what the reply is, you won't be as happy as you were prior to the ultimatum.
"The problem with sanctions is that it is encouraging dedollarisation, where countries try to find alternatives to networks such as SWIFT where countries do not need to involve the US. It's longer term effect is to reduce the ability of the US to influence the foreign policies of those countries it (the US) does not like."
On one hand, removing some of the US influence from SWIFT is not a bad thing. On the other hand, it needs a replacement that isn't the same thing dominated by somebody else (Russia, EU, whoever). If the worldwide payment mechanism fractures into many small pieces, it will make international trade and cooperation much more difficult.
Debts that can't be paid won't be paid, but it doesn't matter. It was never the plan that the Ukraine could pay for their weapons. The uncollectable collateral creates jobs and weapons, by the time the debt is due the weapons have already been used, the debt will be written off. But not before accepting all of the Ukraine's natural resources as a down payment.
The Western businesses losing business in Russia can't sue Russia for the sanctions that were imposed on Russia, but they can sue the governments that cost them the opportunity. Russia can seize their fallow assets in the meantime, and maybe put them to use, for not paying their due taxes.
If the war ever ends, whoever will have "won" will demand reparations. If the West wins, they can sue Russia for what they had to pay, and if Russia wins, they may demand the remaining outstanding debt.
Of course there won't be anything left to actually pay it with. But Haïti managed to pay off France after a few centuries, so who knows. Or it might set the stage for WW4. If there's one thing we learn from history, it's that we are doomed to repeat it.
There will be no reparations. Did WW1 teach you nothing? Demanding reparations is what gets you a Hitler.
The better way is to rebuild the losing nation while under your thumb, then slowly pull the thumb away. If done right, you get modern day Germany, Japan and Italy.
"But might makes right and the problem with 'international law' is it doesn't really exist, or isn't enforceable. Which sometimes makes a mockery of the claim for 'international rules based order', whatever that may mean."
When countries start lobbing these things back and forth, it's a sign you should evaluate your position and run for cover if you need to. You aren't going to hold up under the barrage and it's a risk you've taken whether you realized it going in or not when you operate cross-border and especially between two historical antagonists.
I've got a Russian friend who left when it became obvious Vlad was Mad. He correctly predicted that Putin would install himself as a dictator and would at some point try to recreate the Soviet Union.
My friend says this has about as much chance of success as the mandatory consular registration for Russian citizens living abroad. Everyone he knows is planning to just ignore that and doesn't think he'll come home to a door handle covered in a Chemical Weapon, or fall out of a window, die of a mysterious illness etc. Doesn't think he's that important.
Putin has made it very clear in interviews before that the fall of the Soviet Union was a tragedy and that he would do everything in his power to reverse that. That was the moment that everyone should've sat up and paid attention. Instead no-one did.
He also said that the fall of the soviet union was a sad event but that anyone who wanted it brought back was mad.
So don't necessarily take him at his word, look at his actions. Which currently align with the theory that he has indeed gone completely gaga cuckoo pants.
This is some delusional nonsense by Putin BUT it will be used to enable any Google assets in Russia to be seized.
This is a way to 'acquire' some tech/property/etc which will top up Putins coffers & possibly gain some 'Tech' that is no longer getting into russia because of sanctions.
Google will lose *any* russian assets that Putin can lay claim to !!!
Not too surprising and appealing to any higher court as per SOP for Google will NOT work as the courts are in Putins pocket.
:)
The challenge will be whether Russia can get other countries to respect the "judgment". Obviously, no one cares about North Korea, but I suspect Google has a few assets in China (albeit not many in the whole scheme of things), India and Vietnam, as well as other Russia-aligned, Russia-leaning or Russia-friendly countries, including Hungary and Turkey, UAE, Saudi, Qatar, etc...
Those other countries won't go along with the judgment unless they want Google to pull out of their country entirely. China does (Google Play has long been blocked there) so they probably don't have a bank account there to confiscate. Hungary would face legal problems with the EU if they tried to enforce Putin's judgment. The rest of those countries don't care about Putin, they're just happy to take his money for selling stuff to him others won't.
Those other countries won't go along with the judgment unless they want Google to pull out of their country entirely.
Some might consider that a GoodThing. But IANAL and AFIAK it isn't that easy to enforce judgement in 3rd party countries, ie I think you have to get the judgement recognised in that country before you can use their enforcement laws to collect on it. Which might be a tad tricky if that country doesn't have the same laws as Russia's used to get that judgement. Plus Russia would be up against AlphaGoo's Army of Darkness.. I mean Lawyers, who regularly argue with countries (and the EU) that what AlphaGoo does isn't illegal. Which gets a little weird when AlphaGoo and some of the other tech titans have more money than most countries anyway.
"Which gets a little weird when AlphaGoo and some of the other tech titans have more money than most countries anyway."
Not just money, but more importantly, economic control.
I'm weird in that I don't use Google for much if I can help it. Certainly not for searches and never for things like email. That said, vast numbers of people have based themselves using Google products. I'm astonished to see people that have their own URL list a gmail account or I find out they have Google as the backend for their mail. If Google were to suspend services in a country, the next day would be madness as people find out how subservient they are to the greatest incarnation of evil that has yet come into being.
No country with any power cares about Russia. Their closest allies are neutrally standing carefully aside to pile on after Russia demonstrates its strength by capturing Kyiv and ... well here we are two years later and fields behind us are littered with broken red lines.
It's posturing. Nobody with any clout has done anything for Russia since the war started and all of the countries poor or desperate enough to want to try have had to hide what they're doing lest everybody, including Putin's so-called best buddies, turn on them like a rat.
There's no challenge. They might be a little wary of serving his arrest warrant (and how much has he travelled since?) but that's a far cry from helping him.
But they're happy to take advantage of him now that he's weak and in need of help. Iran is suffering from sanctions and needs money so they're happy to take his money in exchange for missiles, which they have many of. India wants cheap oil so they're happy to buy his oil at a discount (though that "floor price" set by sanctions which was really low when set is now only a few dollars below the market price, so they aren't getting much of a discount anymore) so Putin gets around the oil sanctions. North Korea needs money and food, and has lots of cannon fodder so they get one or both from Russia and Russia gets more cannon fodder to die in Ukraine.
Hard to imagine those North Korean soldiers will fight very hard for a Russian commander in a country they probably never heard of until they arrived in Russia. Who knows, maybe they will surrender en masse and ask for asylum in South Korea under a new name (because they have to be "dead" as far as Kim Jung Un is concerned or their families will be killed) It would be worth Ukraine's while to have some notes suggesting that translated into Korean and dropped by drone over them when they arrive.
But they're happy to take advantage of him now that he's weak and in need of help. Iran is suffering from sanctions and needs money so they're happy to take his money in exchange for missiles, which they have many of.
Problem with sanctions is that it isn't always about the money. Sure, Iran is getting cash, but there's also technology transfer now between Russia and Iran, China, DPRK etc. This conflict has very much been a drone war. Ukraine had been fairly successful in jamming drones, now they're much less so. Some of that is also due to Russia developing FPV drones controlled by fibre rather than radio. Russia's also extended range and payload, along with creating electronic intelligence and warfare variants.
India wants cheap oil so they're happy to buy his oil at a discount (though that "floor price" set by sanctions which was really low when set is now only a few dollars below the market price.
The EU also wants cheap oil, so it's buying it from India.. and then pretending it isn't Russian oil. Biden's just announced more sanctions on India, which might drive India closer to Russia and BRICS.. And there were already defence deals between Russia and India, along with technology transfer deals.
Hard to imagine those North Korean soldiers will fight very hard for a Russian commander in a country they probably never heard of until they arrived in Russia.
They'll probably follow orders given DPRK indoctrinates its population from birth. Plus it's much like with the jihadis and there's further indoctrination fighting agains a common enemy. And we've also been demonising China, and both China and Russia had been acting as a moderating influence on DPRK. Our foreign policy geniuses have succeeded in uniting the Axis of Evil. Assuming DPRK forces are actually present, they may get actual combat experience of modern warfare, which most NATO forces just don't have. That could be bad, if DPRK decides to unite Korea, especially if the tech transfer deals give them better weapons.
And it's much the same with Iran. The neo-con warhawks like Bolton have been itching to have a go at Iran, either directly or indirectly via Israel as a proxy. Tehran's been preparing for this for years, and may also have new toys to play with, or share with the Lebanese. For any serious escalation, there's also the problem of geography given Iraq's in the way, plus Iran has a larger military than Israel. So that would probably be limited to lobbing missiles and drones at each other. Iran so far has been relatively restrained, and there's been conflicting reports regarding how effective attacks by both Iran and Israel have been so far. If Israel decides to strike Iran again in response to.. err.. Lebanon yeeting a drone at Bibi's holiday home, Iran may respond by striking Israel's military/industrial infrastructure. A lot of that is clustered around Haifa, which also includes companies like Elbit, Intel, Google(?) and pharma companies who's staff and facilities won't take kindly to drones or missiles. Iran's already warned if Israel escalates, it will expand their target list. Or perhaps Hezbollah will hit those instead.
But such is politics. We've dropped a rather large monkey wrench onto the balance of power and are giving countries like Russia, China, Iran, DPRK all the more reason to harm our interests, either directly or indirectly. Our 'leaders' have been hell bent on regime change in Russia. Our 'shock and awe' sanctions have, as expected backfired. Now, to salve our 'leaders' vanity and egos, they're still determined to sacrifice Ukrainians. Alternatively, they could just accept this move in the Great Game has failed and negoiate the best peace deal they can, and attempt to restore relations. Otherwise we've kind of shot our bolt(on). Sanctions haven't worked. Putin's position is stronger than ever. If our 'leaders' could manage to think beyond the next election cycle, they may have realised Putin's 72 and might want to retire at some point.
Then it's just the small matter of who his successor might be, who could be someone worse. It's not as though we've been making friends with Russia after all.
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"Those have already been looted - hopefully by the former staff, as they desperately needed it when those offices were shut down."
Other than office furniture, what would there be? Anything of value for a company such as Google isn't tangible and is everywhere and nowhere at the same time.
no, your perceptions are incorrect
Trump would just end their war, sell oil and natural gas at a lower price than Russia can, and let Google and Russia work things out on their own. Aside from losing half of their economy, Russia might be forced into a position where THEY have to beg companies like Google to come back. UK and EU get cheaper energy, USA starts paying off national debt, Iran can't fund Hamas any more, all good.
"Trump would just end their war"
I wonder if his orange eminence would care to share the secret of doing that with us? Because if it's inviting Vlad to roll his tanks into Kyiv unopposed, he may run into one or two teensy diplomatic issues with that.
The problem with simple answers, is that they appeal to simple people. To others, they are simply wrong.
Trump would just end their war, sell oil and natural gas at a lower price than Russia can, and let Google and Russia work things out on their own.
That's an idea that's been floated recently, ie Trump's solution would be 'drill, baby, drill'. Reversing Biden's anti-oil & gas initiatives might help US consumers get lower fuel prices and help reduce US inflation and cost of living.. But there's a minor snag. Russia has pipelines to customers, the US does not. Plus there'd be the small matter of OPEC to deal with who might naturally object to Trump trying to manipulate their market. On the plus side, it might help refill the US strategic POL reserves, emptied after Biden's strategy to try and win votes.
Russia might be forced into a position where THEY have to beg companies like Google to come back. UK and EU get cheaper energy
Err.. nope. There's that whole 'decarbonisation' nonsense and shipping oil & gas from the US would still be more expensive than the UK producing its own, or buying from an existing supplier that already has pipelines. As Germany has discovered. But as for AlphaGoo, Russia has about as much chance of recovering fines as the EU has collecting taxes. So why would Russia want AlphaGoo back? It never really did much. It's an ad slinger, search engine and collector of kitteh video. Other alternatives are available.
USA starts paying off national debt
The current US national debt is growing.. rather rapidly and has almost as many zeros as AlphaGoo's fine.
"Russia has pipelines to customers, the US does not. "
For gas, that's a huge advantage. For oil, Russia is at a disadvantage in that their reserves are mainly heavy/sour which takes much more energy to process as well has having more noxious byproducts. The US doesn't have refining that can process much of what gets produced in the US as no refineries have been built in ages and all are slowly being forced to shut down over time as they catch fire and burn to the ground. That leave a lot of "intermediate" crude to sell. The Middle East does well due to their oil being mainly "light/sweet" and easy to process into transportation fuels.
It's a good goal to switch from gas to electricity, but only over a time span that makes sense and only things that can easily be switched first. Politicians know nothing about science and engineering as a group so they'll thrash about passing useless legislation and subsidizing even worse things until there's a time when having a law degree is a disqualification for public office.
If Google paid the fine, Wolfram Alpha tells me Russia could buy 2 sextillion 222 quintillion 222 quadrillion 222 trillion 222 billion 222 million 222 thousand and 222 super AIs by 2035.
Another example might be that, "in order to compensate for his tiny penis the conference table was truly Putin-Sized".
Theres only one way to stop the war by Russia. Some country needs to give him a home to retire.
THe problem is he has no exit strategy because the moment he walks out of the Kremlin and tries to retire, he can be sure one of his old buddies will push him out a window.
I appreciate he needs to rot in hell for his crimes, but its the lesser of all the other evils and will end the death and destruction.
Without an exit stragegy for Vlad, he personally has no other option he must continue and he will until the day he dies, because he personally has no other option.
Your statement is true... Vlad knows no matter where he goes, no corner is too far from his mates, because thats the Russian way. It will be the Trotsky in Coyoacan thing again but the names will be Vlad.
THis is why the war continues, because like all world leaders from any country, Vlad is an arsehole of the worst kind, and he has no problems sending thousands and millions to their death. Unfortunately for all humans, the people who are the rulers are also the people who should never be rulers.
This could have been done in 2021-2022, but Putin got painted into a corner because the USA and many other nations were being run by IDIOTS who were more focused on getting Putin assassinated or ousted in a Coup d'etat than to simply offer him a way to back out of his delusional goals of "taking back" Ukrainian land and heading towards a new USSR.
But Putin was painted into a corner. So Putin walked on the wet paint.
I could go on about the REAL motivations, which include promoting SLOW escalation of war over YEARS (no you can't attack there, no you can't have planes, no you can't have these weapons, ok NOW you can have/attack/etc. but you cannot XXX - sound familiar?), a twisted form of money laundering, and the Military Industrial Complex.
[Don't ya hate it when conspiracies turn out to be RIGHT?]
Wow, you have been watching too many lotto ads and actually believe 1 in 100 are a good odds.
In this century they have terminated none of their bad leaders. In the 20th century, more than half their leaders died in office, only the tsar Nick was executed, none of the Soviet leaders were executed, most died in office.
Thats something like 1 in 15, i wouldnt call them very good odds. If someone gave me 15 glasses of fanta, and 14 had shite in them, i wouldnt be trying to drink any.
Russia and everything Russian should be made a pariah throughout the world. No sports. No travel. Foreign assets seized. This is the only way to exert any influence on the country. Hurt it enough that the people rise up.
And for those that say sport shouldn't be political, cast your minds back to apartheid and South Africa. Worked just fine banning them from world competitions until they did something about it.
And don't get me started on Israel..
"Russia and everything Russian should be made a pariah"
The majority of the Russian people already have enough to cope with, without stupid sentiments like that.
Hate on Putin and his government all you want, but everything Russian? No. Many Russians despise him as much as the rest of the world but can't do anything about it.
Don't blame the citizens of a dictatorship for what their despot is doing. They are his victims too.
Would you want to be held accountable for all the things the corrupt, arrogant low life who run your country do?
I don't need to know where you come from. Politicians are all corrupt, arrogant low life.
We get to have global trade, tourism and a global internet for bit. Then they decide that their nation state thing is becoming obsolete, so they set up tribal borders, lock the gates and start wars.
The 'nation state' is a crime against humanity.
Carrot and stick approach works better than getting a bigger stick.
Your proposed solution stinks of CANCEL CULTURE...
Keep the stick, but offer a carrot, giving Putin a "way out" [whether perceived or real] and human nature will take over.
(You just need the right carrot)
The only alternative, if things continue as they are, is "see icon". You cannot expect a megalomaniac and slightly deranged dictator like "Pootie" to just BEND OVER AND TAKE IT. What do deranged dictators do when no other alternatives exist?
What about Israel ?
You might want to actually study the stats of who actually treats the Palestinian people worse.
Every year, Hamas & Hezebollah tortures and kills hundreds or thouands of suspected collaborators. Only a few days ago, some Hamas or was it Hezb leader missed attending a meeting in Lebanon in the same building targetted by Israel, and now all his mates want to get him.
Yeh the real enemy of the Palestinian people are their leaders.
"By a remarkable coincidence, 1 OVER 20,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 is approximately the chance that Russia will ever see a dime of the 'fine'. Or, you know. Survive in general much past 2026 or so.
El Reg - can we add 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 to Reg Statutory Units as a Putillion?
"The deadliest genocide since WWII?"
I'd reckon Pol Pot might be in the running there. :(
The "Cultural Revolution" wasn't to shabby an effort either.
But I agree with the ghastly assymetrical treatment meted out by the US to various other offending states and the encouragement Israel has received for equivalent atrocities.
What goes around come around and history is not notable for its kindness.
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'You seem to have misspelt "invasion of Ukraine" as "special military operation".'
My theory is that Russian is actually English transcribed by a vodka soaked dyslexic (cyrillic) and spoken by an equally intoxicated dolt attempting to pronounce the transliteration.
Don't suppose the USSR was too taken by the special military operation Barbarossa? No?
Putin waited until the useful idiot was out of power because he recognized Biden as a competent opponent?
Okay. That is one way of interpreting current events.
Meanwhile, go and edit https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nord_Stream_2. Currently that wikipedia article strongly hints at neglect at the hands of the BIden administration. By lifting nordstream sanctions they signalled weakness to Putin and provided him more leverage against Germany. I am confident you can find a better framing for that story.
If they keep up at this level of compounding interest, before long Putin will need to re-orient the entire Russian economy around producing mathematicians and supercomputer capacity, just to calculate Google's debt. It could bankrupt the country even faster than waging senseless wars, but just think of the pay off when the debt finally comes due!
"I am sure that our friends in Moscow are aiming to get enough money together to aquire one Trigantic Pu or 3 Ningis."
They can have the Sirius Cybernetics Corporation but I suppose if they were to get Alphabet it amounts to the same thing. ;)
Curious that the £IG (IGP?) mentioned in article was clearly predecimal* - appears that UK Reform, Faredge and fellow travellers hold the reins of the intergalactic banking system which supports the conclusion that the GFB is bunk.
* for septics and the young: before HHGTTG the British pound was divided into 20 shillings which were further subdivided into 12 pennies, a derangement that also applied in many of the colonies but was generally remedied in those earlier than in the UK.
I did wonder if there was something to look forward to, so looked up Putin's age, he is 72.
I am disappointed to report that according the UK's ONS a 72 year old's average life expectancy is 86 years/
"However there's a chance you might live longer. There is a 1 in 4 chance you will live to 92 years.There is a 1 in 10 chance you will live to 96 years.There is a 2.8 percent chance you will live to 100."
So no comfort there, I do wonder if he keeps away from windows and balconies...
Come on, Register. The worst thing about the internet is people lazily reposting the same old mistakes and lies. There is absolutely no evidence whatsoever that Einstein ever said that compound interest is the eighth wonder - no record, none. Yet this nonsense is repeated over and over again.
"hmm, that number is about 33 billion moles. This doesn't help, I was never able to grasp the scale of 1 mole, anyway."
Ask Jasper Carrot about his mole.
Well it sounds like either Russia somehow seems to think that they're going to fund their entire country and military off of Google's budget. Or I don't know maybe they think Google is just going to hand them the rights to the world? It's absolutely ludicrous, they know it's ludacris. But they're still going for broke to ask because - when you're drunk on vodka what else do you ask for? Now it's also possible they think that Google's just simply going to go bankrupt and give them whatever they want (but then if they go bankrupt they get nothing anyways. I mean who's going to keep the servers running) or maybe Russia thinks they'll sell out and Russia will end up owning Google. But in the end we all know they're going to get nothing. And they're going to kick sand and everyone's face and they're going to cry, and then they're going to start attacking and bombing neighbors and they're going to blame it on everybody else like every bad guy doe. They will say 'it's your fault that I'm hurting you, if you had just done what I told you to do I wouldn't have to hurt you.' That's not just the mark of a bad guy it's the mark of a sociopath. Their country is slowly drifting into the dark. And it didn't need to be that way. The government is making that happen. Its also where we are headed if our politics keep sliding in the same direction.
If I was to choose the lesser of evils I would pick Russia over Google, quite frankly the US has created most of the problems that we are encountering in the world, I'm a US citizen paid into the system for many years and watch the system crumble before my eyes ran a successful business for many years raised my kids, paid my dues. Google should be held accountable not only for these actions but for others in regards to violating people's privacy, they lure you into these things systematically when buying phones and using other resources online when you click on something and you're not aware you are validating their Network. Google is part of all this the sad reality. I in California should be held accountable for their actions this is just my opinion, the bloodshed is on the US government's hands. No matter how you slice it or how you guys it if you look at it as a trickle down to the beginning you may understand what I'm writing.
The mess in IQ is 99% the fault of the IQ people. They were given a gift, the removal of Saddam, but unfortunately they returned to their stupid islamic ways of killing each other.
You cant blame the West for the IQ people killing each other. You can only blame the IQ people and their culture for that.
I understand that Russia's invasive intrusive invasion of the Ukraine is "illegal". Your writers remind me regularly.
However they fail to preface the United States/UK/EU providing material support to Israel and its clearly illegal invasion/terror attacks of Gaza/Lebanon/Syria when speaking of those nations.
Nor do you remind readers of the US illegal occupation of Syria and a myriad of other nations as they see fit.
Its time for the propaganda to end or be more accurate.
Anything less lends credibility to the Global South's assertion that it is the collective wests crimes that are the driving factors in their defensive actions.
Before you mention Israel, can you provide the stats for the thousands of Gazans killed and tortured by Hamas every year for the past 40 years.
Its hardly a shock Israel has locked them up in Gaza, no sain country would want Hamas in their neighbourhood, and we can see that everywhere including the arab world, where nobody invites Hamas into their country.
DO you want Hamas to live in your local neighbourhood ?
Before you mention Israel, can you provide the stats for the thousands of Gazans killed and tortured by Hamas every year for the past 40 years.
Nope, and I doubt you can either. But although the genesis of Hamas began 40yrs ago, it was part of the Palestinian Parliament and a rival to the PLO and Fatah. Then with some 'help', Hamas defeated Fatah and took control of Gaza.
Its hardly a shock Israel has locked them up in Gaza, no sain country would want Hamas in their neighbourhood, and we can see that everywhere including the arab world, where nobody invites Hamas into their country.
Except Hamas leaders who live happily in Qatar, who provide a lot of support for Hamas. But it's good you accept that Israel has largely created the Hamas problem due to their creation of an open-air prison camp. Along with regular lawn mowing to help Hamas with recruitment. But then Palestinians currently occupy some very valuable real estate that Israel is now clearing for future redevelopment, along with mineral rights to some very lucrative off-shore oil & gas. Israel wants Palestinians to leave their homeland so it can annex the Gaza strip again, and we're supporting that ethnic cleansing, just as we are in Ukraine.
DO you want Hamas to live in your local neighbourhood ?
Israel does, and Gazan's would have a legitimate claim for asylum in the West. Unless of course it could be proven they were Hamas members, or members of one of the other radical Sunni groups that are proscribed terrorist organisations. But then Sunnis living outside Israel might become radicalised as a result of Israel's actions and start attacking Jews, Jewish businesses or synagogues even though many Jews don't support Israel's actions either.
So it's all a collosal mess with many innocent civilians being killed or injured on both sides. It, like Ukraine has also had wider geopolitical implications, eg this-
https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/10/1156316
The UN General Assembly on Wednesday once again urged the United States to end its economic, commercial, and financial embargo on Cuba, renewing a demand it has made annually since 1992.
The resolution, titled “Necessity of ending the economic, commercial and financial embargo imposed by the United States of America against Cuba,” passed with 187 votes in favor, two against (Israel and the US), and one abstention (Moldova).
Which shows how the US is becoming isolated. Unsuprising Israel voted with the US given the UN does similar votes calling for an end to Israel's embargos on Gaza and Palestine. A little more suprising that Ukraine voted against, or didn't abstain. After all, Ukraine very much wants to keep the embargos against Russia.
But such is politics.
jelly: Nope, and I doubt you can either.
cow: yes exactly.
Why are so dishonest and pretend taht Hamas and Hezbollah are somehow caring for their people ?
~
jelly:
The resolution, titled “Necessity of ending the economic, commercial and financial embargo imposed by the United States of America against Cuba,” passed with 187 votes in favor, two against (Israel and the US), and one abstention (Moldova).
cow: I agree the US treatment of Cuba is shameful, but we are not talking about Cuba here and thats a completely separate discussion and changes nothing about how evil Hamas and Hezbollah are.
~
jelly: So it's all a collosal mess with many innocent civilians being killed or injured on both sides
cow: Problem is many of those "innocent" Gazans actively voted for Hamas, so at least all those voters are not exactly innocent. They are actvely supporting Hamas. Sad but true.
Why are so dishonest and pretend taht Hamas and Hezbollah are somehow caring for their people ?
Why are you so dishonest and using strawmen arguments? Nowhere did I say that either faction is caring for their people. Hamas deliberately and cynically provoked Israel with their attrocities, knowing full well how Bibi the baby bomber would respond. But under international law, people are entitled to use arms to resist occupying forces.. Which doesn't justfiy the methods Hamas use.
I agree the US treatment of Cuba is shameful, but we are not talking about Cuba
Yep. We're supposed to be talking about Russia, Google, and how automatic escalators for non-payment of fines can lead to ludicrous situations like this one. Russia is by no means the only country to use this process to coerce payments. The UK uses this a lot. Pay your speeding ticket now, get a reduced penalty. Pay late or try to appeal the charge, as should be your legal right and the penalty increases.
Problem is many of those "innocent" Gazans actively voted for Hamas, so at least all those voters are not exactly innocent.
I.. see. So voting for the nasty party gives Israel the right to drop a 2,000lb bomb on your apartment building? A little harsh don't you think? Luckily Labour hasn't adopted this one in the UK. Yet anyway.
Jelly: Learn to write like an adult and prefix each quote with the name. in case you havent figured it out when there are multiple levels of replies it becomes confusing which text belongs too whom. Identation doesnt cut it.
Jelly: Why are you so dishonest and using strawmen arguments? Nowhere did I say that either faction is caring for their people. Hamas deliberately and cynically provoked Israel with their attrocities, knowing full well how Bibi the baby bomber would respond. But under international law, people are entitled to use arms to resist occupying forces.. Which doesn't justfiy the methods Hamas use.
cow: Exactly you didnt ONCE say a negative thing about Hamas, you selectively only criticize Israel. You also fail to acknowledge the problem that is Hamas, they are the worst and you want to ignore the fact its a real problem that no government can allow in their land, including Israel.
~
cow: I agree the US treatment of Cuba is shameful, but we are not talking about Cuba
jelly: Yep. We're supposed to be talking about Russia, Google, and how automatic escalators for non-payment of fines can lead to ludicrous situations like this one.
cow: I didnt mention Cuba, i simpy mentioned this because *SOME* people like to change the subject...
~
cow: Problem is many of those "innocent" Gazans actively voted for Hamas, so at least all those voters are not exactly innocent.
jelly I.. see. So voting for the nasty party gives Israel the right to drop a 2,000lb bomb on your apartment building?
cow: The Gazan people are actively support Hamas with their vote and money and sons. THey are part of the problem, by feeding the monster.
If they dont want to be bombed they shouldnt tell their sons to be soldiers for Hamas.
~
jelly :A little harsh don't you think? Luckily Labour hasn't adopted this one in the UK. Yet anyway.
cow: No.
If they dont want to be bombed, tey shouldnt tell their sons to play soldier for Hamas, like they have done for a long time and how thousands participated in the breakout and kidnapping of israeli citizens a year back.
Whats next ?
Police shouldnt shoot back if someone robs a bank and starts shooting at everyone ?
Youre basically crying because the police shoot back at some nut shooting random peopl ein the crowd...
Your fucked in the head. Dont want to get shot by the police, dont shoot other people.
cow: Exactly you didnt ONCE say a negative thing about Hamas, you selectively only criticize Israel. You also fail to acknowledge the problem that is Hamas, they are the worst and you want to ignore the fact its a real problem that no government can allow in their land, including Israel.
Wut? I didn't realise I had to start ever comment with a condemnation of Hamas. You're also conflating Hamas and Palestine and ignoring the whole reason for this particular shitshow. Both Palestinians and Israelis are claiming the same land. That goes back to the British Mandate in Palestine, the Balfour Declaration and then terrorist attacks on British forces by Zionists who wanted more land. The Mandate was for a 2-state solution, but then we ended the Mandate in 1948 because we had other things on our minds. But a bunch of conflcts later and the Green Line came to pass, along with a bunch of UN resolutions attempting to divide territory between Israelis and Palestinians. Israel's ignored any 2-state solution and been busily seizing more land. Naturally that helps assorted Palestinian factions recruit, and the killing continues.
If they dont want to be bombed they shouldnt tell their sons to be soldiers for Hamas.
And if their parents or friends are killed when Israel bombs apartment buildings, the sons may just take up arms against Israel. It's how people become radicalised and get recruited by terrorist groups.
Youre basically crying because the police shoot back at some nut shooting random peopl ein the crowd...Your fucked in the head. Dont want to get shot by the police, dont shoot other people.
Not me guv. But a bad analogy. In this case, it's the police shooting random people in a crowd because someone fired a gun, missed and ran away. Or calling in an airstrike on the crowd. But Israel is merrily bombing apartment blocks in Lebanon, Gaza and for good measure, Syria as well. Not to mention yeeting missiles into Iran because Iran retaliiated against Israeli attacks on Iranians in Syria, or assassinating Iranian officials in Tehran. It's an odd legal situation where a right to retaliate is declared by the party that fired first.
But it's also hypocrisy and cognitive dissonance. Israel annexed the Golan Heights, and this is fine. Russia annexes Crimea, and it isn't. Russia 'illegally invades' Ukraine and the world goes mad. Israel illegally invades Gaza and Lebanon and we send them more bombs. A Russian missile hits a Ukrainian apartment building and it's a war crime. Israel drops a 2,000lb bomb on an apartment building and we send them more.
And then we wonder why the world is turning against the West, and terrorist groups are finding it easier to recruit radicalised people who might be persuaded to attack our interests. In theory it should be easy to bring about peace in both conflicts. Ok, sanctions against Russia haven't worked, but sanctions against Israel would because Israel's economy is far more fragile. But for some reason, our 'leaders' just don't seem to want peace and an end to the bloodshed in both conflicts.
Jelly: Wut? I didn't realise I had to start ever comment with a condemnation of Hamas.
cow: Your reply is clearly dishonest. At best this is a very complicated situation and only mentioning Israel and asigning all blame to them is not fair or honest.
Jelly:
You're also conflating Hamas and Palestine and ignoring the whole reason for this particular shitshow. Both Palestinians and Israelis are claiming the same land. That goes back to the British Mandate in Palestine, the Balfour Declaration and then terrorist attacks on British forces by Zionists who wanted more land. The Mandate was for a 2-state solution, but then we ended the Mandate in 1948 because we had other things on our minds. But a bunch of conflcts later and the Green Line came to pass, along with a bunch of UN resolutions attempting to divide territory between Israelis and Palestinians. Israel's ignored any 2-state solution and been busily seizing more land. Naturally that helps assorted Palestinian factions recruit, and the killing continues.
cow:
Your history is missing a few very important points.
There are many Arabs (incl Palestinians) living in Israel and by Israel i mean not gaza or west bank.
The problems started because the P started to fight and blow things up. After this happened Isael was forced to create the Gaza and West Bank enclosures for safety reasons. No government would allow what Hamas and other similar group have done w/in their country.
THe UK government had to put troops in NI because they could not allow what the IRA was trying to do, and Israel was no different.
THe problem you completely skip is that the P people before the terrorism thing were better off than basically all other arabs in all other arab/muslim countries.
Just ask their muslim brothers in Syria, IQ, Iran, the list is very very long.
~
cow:
If they dont want to be bombed they shouldnt tell their sons to be soldiers for Hamas.
jelly:
And if their parents or friends are killed when Israel bombs apartment buildings, the sons may just take up arms against Israel. It's how people become radicalised and get recruited by terrorist groups.
cow:
This is a lie.
There are millions of P in Gaza, Israel has prior to this. year, killed barely a few thousand, thats barely a few hundred in the worst year.
Most P have their parents, its a lie to say that a large portion of the country are missing parents because I has killed them.
Go look at the protests, you will see most families have both parents and they also all have babies. You cant bullshit and tell me that Israel killed their father last week, that doesnt make sense and is practically impossible.
~
Youre basically crying because the police shoot back at some nut shooting random peopl ein the crowd...
Your fucked in the head. Dont want to get shot by the police, dont shoot other people.
Jelly
Not me guv. But a bad analogy. In this case, it's the police shooting random people in a crowd because someone fired a gun, missed and ran away. Or calling in an airstrike on the crowd. But Israel is merrily bombing apartment blocks in Lebanon, Gaza and for good measure, Syria as well. Not to mention yeeting missiles into Iran because Iran retaliiated against Israeli attacks on Iranians in Syria, or assassinating Iranian officials in Tehran. It's an odd legal situation where a right to retaliate is declared by the party that fired first.
cow;
BUllshit.
Everybody in Gaza and Lebanon knows where their local Hamas and Hezbollah buildings are and they know Israel is going to bomb them. If they dont they are idiots.
Its on the fucking news every day, only a complete idiot would stay next door knowing Israel is going to bomb that building because people who meet there bombed israel.
> Learn to write like an adult and prefix each quote with the name
Stop obsessively trying to impose *your* pet scheme for conversation threading/quotations on as if it's an accepted standard when it's anything but. I've been on the Internet for decades, and off the top of my head, I can't recall the last time- if ever- I saw it done that way. It's not remotely normal.
(It's also flawed as your version with its nonstandard lack of any indentation doesn't make clear which one is the reply unless you check the poster's name. It also doesn't account for a reply-to-a-reply situation between two people.)
> Youre [sic (*)] basically crying because the police shoot back at some nut shooting random peopl ein the crowd [..] Your [sic again (*)] fucked in the head. Dont want to get shot by the police, dont shoot other people.
FFS, hell must have frozen over- or it's the time of day when a stopped clock is coincidentally right- when I agree with Jellied Eel on something. But they already said what I would otherwise have said here- this is a shite analogy.
It's more akin to the police randomly shooting back in the general direction of that "nut", killing numerous civilians in that crowded area in the process and treating that as collateral damage because they really don't give a fuck about those people.
(*) In this situation, the correct version is "you're". It's perversely impressive that for some reason you decided to write it two different ways and *still* managed to be wrong both times.
AC: It's more akin to the police randomly shooting back in the general direction of that "nut", killing numerous civilians in that crowded area in the process and treating that as collateral damage because they really don't give a fuck about those people.
cow: No country is going to send multi million dollar missiles to kill crowds, because there are cheaper ways to kill crowds.
What you are claiming is nonsense and has not happened.
Putin is doing this mostly for home propaganda consumption, although there may be some erstwhile allies of Russia who will attempt to seize Google's local company assets. If Russia and China and the other BRICS members ever manage to overthrow the current Western dominated financial system, these fines will be the least of Zuckerberg's worries.
I dont understand how so many Russians can actually believe any of this bullshit.
There have been so many levels of lies, its beyond a joke. Then again Russia is the country with millions of drunks and i suppose they could have brain damage. The later would also explain the poor performance and coutnless mistakes of the Russian forces.
Putin is doing this mostly for home propaganda consumption, although there may be some erstwhile allies of Russia who will attempt to seize Google's local company assets.
Russia has already said it was to draw attention to AlphaGoo's censorship. And it's worked with many 'news' sites running stories. Most focusing on the size of the fine rather than the reasons for it.
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