back to article Musk's $1M election lottery raises serious legal concerns, says Pennsylvania governor

Elon Musk's plan to give $1 million each day to a random registered "swing state" voter who has signed his election petition could merit a look for election law violations, Pennsylvania governor Josh Shapiro said over the weekend.  Shapiro's comments on NBC's Meet the Press Sunday came the day after Musk's first cash prize for …

  1. cornetman Silver badge

    Pennsylvania governor Josh Shapiro, as a person in actual office, should probably keep his mouth shut unless he can determine whether or not what Musk is doing is illegal, regardless of what anyone thinks about his actions.

    Being a state governor comes with some rather important obligations. If he had concerns about legality, he should be talking to the DA quietly behind closed doors.

    1. Jim Mitchell

      If being in "actual" office compelled you to "keep your mouth shut" or else, Trump would have noticed while he was in office. Obviously, it doesn't.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        I'm not clear how Trump acting atrociously justifies others acting atrociously. Can you elaborate?

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          I'm not clear why you think that post was business sensitive, can you elaborate? Don't want that sentiment linked to your handle?

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Yes, there's craziness on both sides and, in many ways, it's more risky to speak out against your own side than to be openly in opposition.

            Now please elaborate in kind.

            1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

              So how about both - or is it all three - elaborate?

    2. Brewster's Angle Grinder Silver badge

      So Freedom of Speech™ - unless you are in office...?

      He's governor, not attorney general, so it's not in his purview.

    3. The Man Who Fell To Earth Silver badge
      FAIL

      18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

      Well first of all cornetman, Shapiro is not only a lawyer, but he used to be the Attorney General of Pennsylvania from 2017-2023. But hey, why let the facts get in the way of a dumbass comment?

      18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting

      Whoever makes or offers to make an expenditure to any person, either to vote or withhold his vote, or to vote for or against any candidate; and

      Whoever solicits, accepts, or receives any such expenditure in consideration of his vote or the withholding of his vote—

      Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both; and if the violation was willful, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.

      52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

      52 U.S. Code § 10307 -(c) False information in registering or voting; penalties

      “Whoever knowingly or willfully gives false information as to his name, address or period of residence in the voting district for the purpose of establishing his eligibility to register or vote, or conspires with another individual for the purpose of encouraging his false registration to vote or illegal voting, or pays or offers to pay or accepts payment either for registration to vote or for voting shall be fined not more than $10,000 or imprisoned not more than five years, or both…”

      1. MachDiamond Silver badge

        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

        "18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting"

        In essence, only non-tangible persuasion should be used to influence voters. Other inducements and/or threats are right out. Saying that legally takes pages and pages which, unfortunately, might lead to loopholes, the lawyer's best friend.

        If Elon were smart, he wouldn't have gone anywhere near this sort of thing, but as a political newbie, he was backing Kanye West previously. Full of hubris, he's going to make some very big errors. I supposed he better hope Mr Trump is elected and willing to pardon him.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

          Hasn't Musk already said that if Trump doesn't win, he'll likely be jailed, even before this scam?

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Hasn't Musk already said that if Trump doesn't win, he'll likely be jailed

            Yeah, he said he had a robot bartender too. And that he'd unveil Robo taxis. And that the range extender for the cyber truck would take it to 450 miles.

            Oooh, is there a pattern here????

            1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge
              Holmes

              Re: Hasn't Musk already said that if Trump doesn't win, he'll likely be jailed

              Hold on, are you suggesting that very rich people might not be entirely honest? I'm going to have to go away and think for a bit about the consequences of that...

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

        I'm not disputing the question of legality one way or the other, I'm not a public prosecutor but neither is Governor Shapiro or Trump. More specifically, they are/were members of the Executive Branch.

        Joe Biden has done, in my view, a good job in this area, while there may be question marks about him side stepping separation of powers in other fields, he's always stayed in his Executive lane when it comes to commenting on the relative legality of the actions of political opponents or on the decisions of the courts that he evidently personally disagrees with (e.g. Rittenhouse).

        So this doesn't really answer the question of why it's acceptable for Governor Shapiro to make comments that are within the purview of the Judicial branch. "Trump did it" is, in my view, a poor excuse.

        1. MachDiamond Silver badge

          Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

          "he's always stayed in his Executive lane when it comes to commenting on the relative legality of the actions of political opponents "

          Yes, but. Like more and more Presidents, he's used "Executive Orders" to circumvent congress when he knows they will take longer than he likes or won't pass the legislation he wants. He also knows that they won't take action against those orders most of the time. He's still trying to find a way for government to pay off student loans without creating a tax bill for those people. There are no saints in politics and you just have to chose the ones you think won't commit the sins you find the most grievous. Executive Orders need to be reigned in. They were put in place at a time when calling Congress to meet to declare war would take day or weeks and time was of the essence. That isn't the case anymore and it's abused more than used properly (by all of them).

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

            I don't expect or ask for spotless purity, I only object to the bunch that gives the "it's (D)ifferent" slur (more often than not used falsely) actual ammunition. It makes it difficult for the rest of us to meaningfully point the finger at the misdeeds of the right when there's an overlap.

            Who knows, perhaps many of them are actually sock puppeteering right wingers.

            1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

              Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

              It makes it difficult for the rest of us to meaningfully point the finger at the misdeeds of the right when there's an overlap.

              So does sockpuppetry. Why are so many on the far-left so afraid to put a name to their words?

              But one example of Biden's Executive abuse would be attempting to bribe voters by forgiving student loans. Which although the Supreme Court already ruled an abuse of power, could arguably be similar to Musk, ie proving beyond reasonable doubt any intent to bribe voters by forgiving loans, or signing a petition. But I'm also kinda curious if signing a petition to win a prize might also count as an illegal lottery. Different states have different laws on that one though.

              1. Jamie Jones Silver badge

                Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                > Why are so many on the far-left so afraid to put a name to their words?

                Dear Mr Eel,

                You far right chumps are funny with your projection. Every accusation is a confession, eh?

                Student loan cancellation a bribe? No one sane thinks that, Jelly. If that is a bribe, then so is every other election promise to lower taxes, reduce fuel bills, increase work pay etc.

                Even you, Jelly, can see the difference between promising something people want, and out and out cash bribes. Well, if not, Jelly, fortunately, the law does. But I guess that would be the 2 tier woke Marxist law machine right?

                Give my love to Mrs Eel, and the Eelettes. Have you explained to them why you support a fascist? https://edition.cnn.com/2024/10/19/politics/military-leaders-sound-the-alarm-trump/index.html

                1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                  Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                  Even you, Jelly, can see the difference between promising something people want, and out and out cash bribes. Well, if not, Jelly, fortunately, the law does. But I guess that would be the 2 tier woke Marxist law machine right?

                  Err.. It's the far-left that is supporting the 2-tier Marxist law machine, which is increasingly fascist and authoritarian. But the law relies on, well, law. The Bbc explains-

                  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ced0d1g5zyno

                  "It is illegal to give out money on the condition that recipients register as voters," Mr Noti told the BBC.

                  Musk isn't doing this. Entry into the lottery/competition requires people to be registered voters, but he isn't paying them to do this. It may be a bit shady, but the far-left and Musk haters have already prejudged him, even though determining legality is up to the legal system.

                  Oh, and in other news, why do you support a liar? McDonald Trump has worked in a McDonalds and generated a lot of publicity with that stunt. There's no evidence Harris ever has, despite her claims to have done so. Plus it's helped make lefties heads explode, and provided futher proof the far-left just can't meme.

                  (Also I personally think more democracies should adopt the Australian model and make voting compulsory. If people like/dislike a candidate, voting is a far better way to express opinions than ranting on 'social' media. Election may not go your way, but at least you've taken part in a representative democracy by voting.)

                  1. Anonymous Coward
                    Anonymous Coward

                    Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                    Oh the left are utterly losing their sh1t over MagaDonalds. Cries of 'its staged', 'just just a stunt' etc.

                    You want staged?

                    https://www.newyorker.com/culture/on-and-off-the-avenue/the-embarrassment-of-democrats-wearing-kente-cloth-stoles

                    Or Biden ordering ice-cream and the video from before shows his team prepping the staff on what to do.

                    Or the Italian restaurant where they cleared out all the customers and replaced them with bussed in Kamala lackies

                    1. Anonymous Coward
                      Anonymous Coward

                      Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                      > Or Biden ordering ice-cream and the video from before shows his team prepping the staff on what to do.

                      Dear god, a political set piece in public? Staged? I am shocked and dismayed. but reassured that this categorically only happens on one side of the political chasm.

                    2. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                      Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                      Or the Italian restaurant where they cleared out all the customers and replaced them with bussed in Kamala lackies.

                      I think my favorite was Kamala getting all teary and emotional, clinging to the wire at an immigration camp. Also heavily staged. Or her recent interview which had heavily chopped salad in an attempt to make her sound somewhat coherent.

                      1. Anonymous Coward
                        Anonymous Coward

                        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                        She has been taking advice from AOC on how to cry over empty car parks :)

                        The ever-changing accent is so like Hillary.

                  2. Jedit Silver badge
                    Headmaster

                    "Entry into the lottery/competition requires people to be registered voters"

                    Yes, exactly. Read the law again. One of the things specified is that it is illegal to offer a financial incentive for registering to vote. Since only registered voters can enter the lottery, offering a chance to win money if and only if you are a registered voter is such an incentive.

                    I'm with you on compulsory voting, though - and I'll add to it that election day should be a national holiday so that everyone is free to cast their ballot. But it would mean that everyone needed to be automatically registered to vote.

                    1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                      Re: "Entry into the lottery/competition requires people to be registered voters"

                      Since only registered voters can enter the lottery, offering a chance to win money if and only if you are a registered voter is such an incentive.

                      If you can prove beyond reasonable doubt, ie in a criminal trial that the intent was to incentivise registration in order to enter the lottery. But there's a lot of speculation when the reality is any determination would be up to the US legal system to charge and try, if they think there's a case.

                      But it would mean that everyone needed to be automatically registered to vote.

                      Kind of, but that goes back to some of the problems with ID cards. In the UK I remember getting my National Insurance number when I turned 18, presumably with some checks to ensure I was entitled to it. When we move, we're expected to update our entries on the Electoral Rolls, and can be fined for not doing that. But the US seems to be struggling with voting systems, and one of the fundamentals is trying to have a clean register so only the people that are entitled to vote get to vote. Which has been one of those odd Dems vs Republican issues where suggestions to clean registers, or have voter ID has been shouted down for often spurious and racist reasons. So the suggestion that it would disenfranchise black Americans, along with the implication that they don't know how to get official ID. Yet it's pretty much impossible to do a lot of ordinary things in the US without having that ID already.

                  3. MachDiamond Silver badge

                    Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                    "Musk isn't doing this. Entry into the lottery/competition requires people to be registered voters, but he isn't paying them to do this. It may be a bit shady, but the far-left and Musk haters have already prejudged him, even though determining legality is up to the legal system."

                    The requirement of being a registered voter might fall afoul of lottery laws in some places. It might be construed as an inducement to somebody to register so they are eligible. The laws are varied in the US when it comes to contests and lotteries.

                    Elon being impetuous and doing things before sorting out if they are legal or a good idea is well documented. His Teflon® track record when getting sued might have something to do with it.

                    1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                      Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                      Elon being impetuous and doing things before sorting out if they are legal or a good idea is well documented. His Teflon® track record when getting sued might have something to do with it.

                      Although there's a theory about equality in justice, being able to hire the best legal firepower can be a big help. Which makes this all the more amusing-

                      https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/labour-linked-censorship-group-plans-to-kill-musks-twitter/

                      Leaked documents thought to be drawn up by the Centre for Countering Digital Hate – founded by Sir Keir Starmer’s now-chief of staff Morgan McSweeney – have been posted on Paul Thacker and Matt Taibbi’s Disinformation Chronicle substack. The files reportedly list ‘kill Musk’s Twitter’ as one of the group’s annual priorities, with the sentiment appearing in multiple documents dating back to the early months of 2024.

                      With Musk declaring 'war' on Sweeney's Centre for Digital Hate. Plus it isn't exactly a very charitable thing for a 501(c)3 corp to be doing. And I'm sure the Labour workers flown to the US to help Harris are all correctly funded and registered. Then whether the Harris campaign is getting VFM given Starmer only managed to win on a very low percentage of the vote and a low turnout.

                      1. MachDiamond Silver badge

                        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                        "And I'm sure the Labour workers flown to the US to help Harris are all correctly funded and registered."

                        I've never looked at the visa requirements for the US since it wouldn't apply to me. The UK and many other countries strictly forbid foreign guests from participating in political activities. When I lived overseas, there were restrictions as a legal Resident. Way back when I toured with bands, we were expressly told to stay the heck away from any political events since as foreigners, we could be detained and the company was not going to do anything other than find a replacement and, maybe, wave goodbye. The same warning was issued for drugs, underage girls, etc. The last thing I wanted was to be banged up in the slammer someplace where I had little knowledge of the law and no money for an attorney. Being a good boy helped get me jobs. On the first Van Halen tour where zero-tolerance was going to be rigorously enforced, I was told I wouldn't be going out on that tour. 2 weeks later after too many techs thought it was only a guideline were sent home, I got a call, a plane ticket and 6 weeks on the road doing lighting. I also wound up doing a bunch of Presidential gigs since the Secret Service had no issue with my background checks. Boring as hell, but paid well and wasn't very hard work to set up a sound system, a couple of mics and a press feed box.

                2. Anonymous Coward
                  Anonymous Coward

                  Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                  Ah, General Mark Milley and General Jim Mattis. Both well known frothing at the mouth anti-Trumpers desperate to get some air time.

                  "In early June 2020, former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs Admiral Mike Mullen wrote in The Atlantic that he was “sickened” to see peaceful protestors who were protesting the recent murder by police of George Floyd “forcibly and violently” removed from around the White House."

                  First off, The Atlantic, LOL!

                  Hmm.. are these the same protests the Dems were egging on and asking people to donate to bail funds for?

                  I wonder if Mike Mullen was 'sickened' by these actions:

                  https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/interactive/2024/photos-violence-erupts-campuses-activists-counterprotesters-clash/

                  I doubt it as it wasn't Trump so everyone turns a blind eye.

                  The reason all the war mongers are scared of Trump is that he will stop their forever wars. Mark Milley claims he stopped Trump from starting WW3 yet here we stand with world tensions higher than ever under president drool cup.

                  1. Lars
                    Happy

                    Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                    @AC

                    "The reason all the war mongers are scared of Trump is that he will stop their forever wars. ".

                    Intersting, where did you read that, any link you could provide for us. Who wrote/said that.

                    1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                      Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                      Intersting, where did you read that, any link you could provide for us. Who wrote/said that.

                      Well, Biden's giving Ukraine another $20bn, Lloyd Austin is currently in Kiev offering another $200m(?) in weapons, the EU's giving $50bn, and the UK with our £22bn 'black hole' is chipping in another-

                      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c5y3yd22rk5o

                      The funds will be made in the form of a loan – with the UK recouping the cost from sanctions on Russian assets – "within the correct legal framework".

                      Assuming it is legal to seize £2.2bn from Russia, and if not, the UK taxpayer is on the hook because Ukraine is unlikely to ever be able to repay the debt that is being piled onto it. But Trump has repeatedly said he'll end the conflict on the day he's announced President Elect. I rather doubt he'll be able to, at least not without extracting significant concessions from Ukraine, which Ukraine is thus far very unwilling to make. They're not exactly in a very strong position to demand terms in any peace negotiations.

                      But with $200bn in <3yrs spent on Ukraine, and more weapons being supplied to Israel, the 'forever wars' have been great for business. Much, much less great for all those who've been killed, maimed, displaced etc to feed those profits.

              2. MachDiamond Silver badge

                Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                " But I'm also kinda curious if signing a petition to win a prize might also count as an illegal lottery. Different states have different laws on that one though."

                That's a good take on it. Many places require an alternate way to enter a lottery that has to be shown to have the same chances. A way that doesn't require any purchase, test or other restrictions.

                "Enter as many times as you like, so I did" Lazlo Hollyfeld, Real Genius

              3. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

                Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                You don't know what "far left" is.

                1. sabroni Silver badge
                  Boffin

                  Re: You don't know what "far left" is.

                  It's anyone who doesn't hate the people they hate. That's literally it. Far left means "not a bigot".

                  1. Anonymous Coward
                    Anonymous Coward

                    Re: You don't know what "far left" is.

                    The far left are probably the most hate filled people you will ever find. If you do not fully comply with their ever changing set of absurd standards you are suddenly outcast as a bigot. It is a mental illness.

                    1. Tom 38

                      Re: You don't know what "far left" is.

                      The mental illness is calling centre-right politicians like Biden and Harris as far-left. I agree with you about the far-left, but there are no far-left politicians on show here.

                      1. Anonymous Coward
                        Anonymous Coward

                        Re: You don't know what "far left" is.

                        Sorry, they are FAR from centre right. Hillary Clinton with her statement on abortion in that it should be 'safe, legal and rare' or Billy Clinton and his views on illegal immigration would now be classed as right, if not far right, by those who support Kamala and co.

                        The Overton window has shifted in the US.

              4. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                "Why are so many on the far-left"

                I think you need to go away and learn what the "far left" actually is, if you think there are many of them, anywhere.

                This sort of thing is the mainstay rhetorical device of people very much on the right. Their Overton window has shifted so much from the centre ground, that they can't tell the difference between public goods, like road maintenance, and gulags, and it's all "communism" to them.

                Meanwhile, they're quite happy to endorse a world where the vast majority of people work hard to earn a pittance in order to further enrich a tiny minority, whilst living in barely habitable housing and being unable to afford proper food, which is functionally indistinguishable from the very thing that they are mischaracterising the centre-left as being.

                All this, whilst steadfastly ignoring the many examples of functioning social democracies.

                It's almost as if having a tiny number of people hoarding all the wealth renders the distinction between left and right moot, but those people are still quite happy to have idiots argue about a simplified view of politics, whilst continuing to steal from them.

                1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                  Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                  This sort of thing is the mainstay rhetorical device of people very much on the right. Their Overton window has shifted so much from the centre ground, that they can't tell the difference between public goods, like road maintenance, and gulags, and it's all "communism" to them.

                  Indeed. The mainstream rhetoric has shifted from right-wing to far-right, or from 'MAGA Republicans' to 'extreme MAGA Republicans'. So basic dog-whistle politics to demonise the opposition. And naturally the further people drift to the left, the further they are away from right-thinkers. If throwing lables like 'far right' around is ok, so is 'far left', surely?

                  Meanwhile, they're quite happy to endorse a world where the vast majority of people work hard to earn a pittance in order to further enrich a tiny minority.

                  Yep, but such is politics. Get power, help your friends, help yourself, oh happy days. So take the Clinton Foundations as an example. Originally intended to fund Bill's library, but expanded its remit and collected an estimated $2bn+ from assorted donors, including foreign countries. Amazing just how much money you can make from a career in 'public service'..

                  ...whilst living in barely habitable housing and being unable to afford proper food, which is functionally indistinguishable from the very thing that they are mischaracterising the centre-left as being.

                  But that's the policy of the left. Doing little, or nothing to control illegal immigration has created housing shortages, as well as strain on public services and spending. Insane energy policies have created high inflation increasing food and energy poverty. Both could be fixed by lowering energy costs, but that would conflict with self-imposed decarbonisation targets. But lowering energy and food costs would quickly lower inflation, to the point it goes negative. But that would also affect one of the politician's favourite metrics and also lower GDP, which would show that actual economic growth has been artificially inflated by those costs. Actual growth has been shrinking as businesses go bust or offshore to avoid high costs.

                  Perhaps they could pay Jeel not to post here, on the grounds that he's turning off the sensible, sane, commenters?

                  I'm open to offers. But you demonstate one of the problems with the far-left. You don't like what I'm saying, so I shouldn't be allowed to say it.. the kind of fascist, authoritarian behaviour that Musk argues agaiinst with his pro-free speech campaigning. Or it could just be a case of projection and you not realising who the sane people are anymore.

                  1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                    Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                    If throwing labels like 'far right' around is ok, so is 'far left', surely?

                    Except the internet is teeming with far-right simps, yet the number of actual far left commenters is tiny. What is massive is the mischaracterisation of everyone who isn't a raving Nazi as far left.

                    I mean, we don't see the internet awash with morons claiming that "Stalin did nothing wrong," do we? We do see fuckwits equating basic social security with Stalinism, though.

                    1. Anonymous Coward
                      Anonymous Coward

                      Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                      "number of actual far left commenters is tiny"

                      Are you feeling OK? Have you seen the dogpiling of downvotes that happens when someone voices an unacceptable right wing opinion here?

                      1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                        I see, and you are equating "not agreeing with batshit right-wing opinions" as far left.

                        I refer you to my previous comment about the Overton window.

                        I mean, if any more evidence was required that the right-wing is populated by idiots, I'm not sure what it could be, because this is such an obvious and complete breakdown of rational though processes.

                        You are aware, are you not, that "downvoting" is the accepted method of signalling your disagreement with something? And that something being unacceptable is good grounds for disagreeing with it?

                        Only in the mind of someone deeply down the rabbit hole is a large number of people disagreeing with you a signifier of "the woke mind virus" or whatever, rather than a straightforward indication that what you said might have simply been wrong.

                        1. Anonymous Coward
                          Anonymous Coward

                          Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                          FIFY

                          "I see, and you are equating "not agreeing with batshit left-wing opinions" as far right."

                          Have to say your post does manage to include so many of the common leftie, holier-than-thou, superiority complex midwitery indicators.

                          CONSUME!! OBEY!!

                          You do know that you might actually be the one who is wrong?

                          1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                            Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                            Hello Jeel, err, I mean "Anonymous Coward".

                            How's that word salad coming along for you? Did you have a point to make, or just a bunch of trite ad-homs? A bit or armchair psychology thrown in there too, what a treat.

                            I'm pretty sure consumerism is a product of the neoliberal economic model of Reaganomics, not exactly a left-wing thing, now is it?

                            It's almost entertaining watching right-wingers demonstrating the myriad ways in which they are not clever, and have failed spectacularly to grasp the argument, whilst completely failing to realise that "not being right-wing" doesn't equate to "being left wing", and more than not being a white supremacist equates to being Chinese.

                            Yes, random stranger, I do consider the possibility that I might be wrong. It's this thing called self-awareness, and couples nicely with self-reflection. It's how you grow as a person and learn and adapt. It's how intelligent people move away from simple but wrong concepts, such as right-wing beliefs, to evidence-led centre-ground politics. It's not the fault of those to the left of you on the political spectrum that rational thought and evidence doesn't lead to your beliefs, and I'm afraid that those people only look like they're acting like they're superior to you because they're actually brighter. Do try to keep up.

                            1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                              Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                              Hello Jeel, err, I mean "Anonymous Coward".

                              How's that word salad coming along for you? Did you have a point to make, or just a bunch of trite ad-homs? A bit or armchair psychology thrown in there too, what a treat.

                              Yep, just fine. TDS induces paranoia, along with proving Popper right about tolerating the intolerant. Nazis, Simps, trolls, Putin, Stalin, the DPRK.. the hate is all in there. But I've said it before and I'll say it again. I don't post anonymously because despite the hatred from the far-left, and all the angry thumbs that can't put together a cogent or coherent argument, I'm not ashamed to put a name to my words. If nothing else, it makes following conversations easier.

                              Yes, random stranger, I do consider the possibility that I might be wrong. It's this thing called self-awareness, and couples nicely with self-reflection.

                              Now if you could add objectivity, you'd be well on your way to breaking your conditioning and becoming a rational human being again. Again the way Musk has become an object of hatred since breaking the walls of Twittter's echo chamber should be instructional. How swiftly the left turned on him and made him their target. If, as is the subject of this topic Musk has acted illegally, the correct process is to file a formal complaint, apply for a court order to stop the lottery and basically follow the normal justice process.. Except of course the Dems have been weaponising that justice process.

                              ...and more than not being a white supremacist equates to being Chinese.

                              And what does 'white supremacy' or Chinese have to do with the price of fish? Other than a bit more of the ominrant to slap more hate lables onto people with a different political view to your own. But on the subject of white supremacy, that is a legacy the Democrats are desperate to try and bury. Those good'ol boys of the Southern Democrats pretty much founded the KKK and are still using much the same tactics today as they did against those hated Republican carpet baggers who wanted to bring an end to slavery, and then segregation.

                              Which is all the more ironic given that lead to the Civil War, and part of the reason behind that was a view that the North could afford to end slavery because they kinda stole mill technology from the UK. The South instead relied on slave labour. Now the Dems are repeating this by importing illegal immigrants to serve their masters instead.

                              Oh, and on a general democracy point. Remind me how many Democrats got to vote for Harris as their Presidential candidate during the primaries? No? None? Name not on the ticket? The last time her name was in the ring she got very few votes and was knocked out in the first round. Then there were all the Democrats who lined up behind Biden to claim he was as sharp as a tack, fit for another 4yrs.. Until that fateful interview, and practically overnight poor Biden became unfit for a 2nd term. So the next President was decided by the DNC, much the same way as the old Soviet system chose their leaders.

                              Funny how history has a habit of repeating itsefl, isn't it?

                      2. Jedit Silver badge
                        FAIL

                        "someone voices an unacceptable right wing opinion"

                        Here we go again with "I have been censored for my conservative views." Let's cut straight to the end: which views? Yeah, we know the ones.

                        1. Anonymous Coward
                          Anonymous Coward

                          Re: "someone voices an unacceptable right wing opinion"

                          "I have been censored for my conservative views."

                          Never said that.

                          And the views are simply anything that goes against 'current thing'. So here the current thing is bashing on Musk. If someone defends him they get dogpiled.

                          In actuality it is often those doing the dogpiling that get their posts deleted as they use such eloquent and polite language to express the extent of their displeasure at having to read words they don't agree with.

                          The reason I post AC is because someone decided it would be fun to stalk me and downvote anything I post.

                    2. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                      Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                      Except the internet is teeming with far-right simps, yet the number of actual far left commenters is tiny. What is massive is the mischaracterisation of everyone who isn't a raving Nazi as far left.

                      And there we go with a far-left person invoking Godwin, calling people on their right 'simps' along with ignoring fascist behavious from Twitter's previous management who'd happily ban and deplatform anyone they considered 'far right'. And then the US has people like John Kerry stating that the First Amendment makes it hard to govern. Damn those plebs for daring to question mah authority! The media also has a lot to answer for given one role of journalists is to hold our master's feet to the fire. Now CNN, CBS, MSNBC etc etc just offer a nice foot massage.

                      But Musk has realised just how quickly the worms turn. Once a darling of the left for all his Green stuff, now public enemy #2 behind Trump for promoting free speech. How very dare he!

                      1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                        Call me simplistic, but people who advocate far right views are on the far right. This includes a lot of the things that both musk and Trump advocate, as well as the groups they support (such as the "proud boys"), and your best buddy there, who you're always advocating for, Vladimir Putin, too. A more obvious modern-day fascist dictator is really hard to find*.

                        I'm not going to get drawn into what is or isn't "far right" because the information is there, for anyone who actually want to go looking for it, and the term is well-defined, as is "fascism". You can keep your rabbit hole to yourself, buddy. Comparing one polical extreme with another, on the grounds that it is a binary choice is exactly the rhetoric of fascism. Mischaracterise every alternative as something terrifying to force your will on others.

                        Most people without an axe to grind are neither "far right" or "far left". The fact remains, however, that there are plenty of far-right people on the internet, and that they tend to be very vocal. If you don't identify as one, then you should probably be careful about who you are associating with, and the things you are saying, because if it looks like a goose, and steps like a goose...

                        Perhaps remove yourself from the echo chamber you seem to have found yourself in, go outside, and meet some new people.

                        *worth noting, too, that the far-right Putin likes to hang around with the nominally far-left Kim, a good indication, if any were needed, that the far-right and far-left converge on dictatorship, at which point, any political dimension is entirely moot, because the people have no freedom to exercise their political beliefs. Trump has promised American's that if they re-elect him, they'll never have to vote again. If you think any of this is good for anyone, except of those in power, you, my friend, are batshit crazy.

                        1. Anonymous Coward
                          Anonymous Coward

                          Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                          "remove yourself from the echo chamber you seem to have found yourself in"

                          Says the person in the echo chamber.

                          You use a lot of words and names in random combinations and I would hazard a guess that this is from your NPC programming. You have been programmed to get very worked up and angry at anyone who challenges your worldview.

                          You would make a fine member of the outer party!

                          1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                            Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                            The armchair psychologist is back, I see.

                      2. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                        Since you have invoked Godwin there, I feel it might be apposite to point out that Godwin himself has explicitly said it is fine to compare people to Nazis when they are acting like Nazis.

                        From the Wiki page on Godwin's Law:

                        In August 2017, while commenting on the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, Godwin himself endorsed and encouraged social-media users to compare its "alt-right" participants to Nazis

                        So now you know, it's absolutely fine to call your mates out for being Nazis, when they're being Nazis. Maybe don't be a Nazi, mmmmkay?

                        If you're having difficulty determining whether something you are saying or doing is directly comparable to the acts of one or another well-known fascists, maybe stop doing and saying them until you've checked and confirmed that you're not accidentally being a Nazi. You know, for your sake as much as everyone else's.

                      3. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

                        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                        "ignoring fascist behavious from Twitter's previous management who'd happily ban and deplatform anyone they considered 'far right'.

                        wait...what? Why would "Twitter's previous management", displaying "fascist behavious"[sic[ "deplatform anyone they considered 'far right'"? Surely by definition "Twitter's previous management" ARE "far right" if what you say is correct. I suppose, in the end, they did put it right so to speak, by selling out to Musk and depaltfoming themselves thanks to those "fascist behavious". I'm not sure the results was what they expected though.

                        1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

                          Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                          wait...what? Why would "Twitter's previous management", displaying "fascist behavious"[sic[ "deplatform anyone they considered 'far right'"? Surely by definition "Twitter's previous management" ARE "far right" if what you say is correct.

                          Huh? I am, of course referring to Twitter's management deciding to deplatform a US President. You, naturally are seizing on the modern version which conveniently overlooks most of the other characteristics-

                          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism

                          ...characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy.

                          But of course by focusing (as always) only on a 'far-right' tag, it enables people to feel good about authoritarianism, suppression of opposition, subordination of individual interests etc etc. You can't say that, or else. Plus all the dog-whistles that go together with crudely applied lables, so anyone 'far-right' must therefore be a Nazi, racist, misognynist, bigot etc etc. Oh, and of course pointing out the Greens are pretty much copying their ideology right out of Mein Kampf. Musk is pro free speech, so the fascists hate him because as John Kerry said, the First Amendment makes it so much harder to govern.

                          Can't have people thinking for themselves, or questioning the autocracy now, can we?

                          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autocracy

                          The general public is controlled through indoctrination and propaganda, and an autocracy may attempt to legitimize itself in the eyes of the public through appeals to political ideology, religion, birthright, or foreign hostility.. Autocrats must retain control over the nation's elites and institutions for their will to be exercised, but they must also prevent any other individual or group from gaining significant power or influence.

                          Any of that sounding familiar?

                          1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

                            Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                            "Any of that sounding familiar?"

                            Yaeh, sounds like Trumps "play-book" :-)

                          2. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                            Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                            So, what you've managed to do there, is describe some attributes of an autocracy, but conveniently jumped right over the definition, which is:

                            Government by a single person having unlimited power; despotism.

                            Good examples here would be North Korea under Kim, Russia under Putin, or, potentially, the US under Trump, especially if he is allowed to get away with his election interference.

                            1. Anonymous Coward
                              Anonymous Coward

                              Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                              FIFY:

                              "the US under Biden/Harris"

                              I mean there is no evidence at all that the white house has been colluding with prosecutors to go after political rivals. Nope, none at all!

                    3. Anonymous Coward
                      Anonymous Coward

                      Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                      I mean, we don't see the internet awash with morons claiming that "Stalin did nothing wrong," do we?

                      They're prevalent enough to have a term: tankies.

                      1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                        Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                        Yeah, a term that appears to have caught on exactly as well as "the left can't meme" attempted meme, given that this is the very first time I've ever seen it, and I am frequently exposed to all sorts of nonsense on the internet.

                        All you've really demonstrated there, is that right-wingers, when they have realised that whatever argument they were making was flawed and unconvincing, move straight on to name-calling.

                        Here's a crazy thought, though: Just because the far right are wrong, that doesn't mean the far left aren't wrong as well. The bit that idiots seem to keep failing to grasp, however, is that not being far-right doesn't automatically make you far-left.

                        Now, the far-right is actively harmful, and a growing force in politics, which makes it an actual threat to people. The far-left isn't. I can't think of any liberal democracy that has elected a far-left leader in recent living memory. Again, centre-left politics, which is about as left-wing as you'll ever get in places like the UK and US, isn't a threat to anyone. The idea that you should treat each other nicely and give people basic human rights isn't a threat to you, it's only a threat to those who would profit off denying people those rights, freedoms, and respect. This is exactly why you see the billionaire-owned right-wing press in the UK vilifying the most vulnerable in society; you know - that meme with Rupert Murdoch sat next to a guy with one cookie, saying, "watch out, that foreigner wants your cookie" whilst hoarding a whole pile of cookies. Except, of course, if that was proportionate, those billionaires that right-wingers love so much would have many houses full of cookies.

                        It is literally obvious what is going on here - it's no conspiracy, it's just greedy sociopaths doing what they do best: lying, cheating and stealing to get rich at every one else's expense. Again, pointing this out isn't radical leftism, it's basic observation. "Right wing" equates to giving freedom to those most destructive elements in society to continue to accumulate wealth in this way, with no oversight or regulation. "Far-left" equates to confiscating all property and distributing it evenly. Most sensible people want the middle ground, of proper regulation to prevent abuse. This is why you should never trust anyone who talks about "cutting red tape" because, although they may present his as being to your benefit, what they actually mean is that regulations that are there to protect you from them, are preventing them from exploituing and abusing you, in exactly the way that they are designed to do, and they would like to trick you into agreeing to remove them. People who think that those billionaires are instead on their side, are known as "simps," or "chuds," but I generally refrain from using those terms, except for effect, because it's better to use a real argument, rather than name-calling. Sometimes, though, you just have to point out idiocy when you see it.

                        1. Anonymous Coward
                          Anonymous Coward

                          Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                          Tankies is a term invented by other socialists to describe the Stalin apologists but do drivel on. It would be a complete waste to consider whether your lack of awareness might not be an objective indicator of the overall prevalence in every case.

                          Right wingers would have no need for the term since we're all "commies" to them.

                        2. Anonymous Coward
                          Anonymous Coward

                          Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                          "move straight on to name-calling."

                          Projection much? Have you not seen some of the posts on these forums using dehumanising language like 'MAGAt' or just going straight for the ad-homs like 'f-off putin puppet' and the such. Aerogems, ecofeco, casca, and many many ACs.

                          "Now, the far-right is actively harmful, and a growing force in politics, which makes it an actual threat to people. The far-left isn't"

                          OK, you are definitely unhinged. Please stop reading the SPLC or ACLU websites and certainly avoid the Atlantic.

                          The far left tried to burn down the apartment complex where Ted Wheeler lived as they don't like him.

                          https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/portland-protests-police-riot-mayors-home-black-lives-matter-ted-wheeler-a9698246.html

                          The looting, the arson, the smashed windows, the smashed cars, this is the trail of destruction from your 'not a threat' far left. People have been dragged from their cars, people have been beaten in the street, people have been shot and killed.

                          Racial justice doesn't actually include burning down whole city blocks and looting shops so often that they close leaving the area with nothing.

                          And from the supposedly dangerous far right? Oh, a couple of broken windows and some dropped water bottles at the capitol.

                          Anyway, I cannot take anyone seriously if they support the party that is fawning over Liz Cheyney.

                          1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                            Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                            So your argument here is "yes but someone else said this".

                            For fuck's sake man, get a grip. Take a walk outside, touch nature. Breathe. Get that blood pressure under control before you do yourself a mischief.

                          2. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                            Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                            The far left tried to burn down the apartment complex where Ted Wheeler lived as they don't like him.

                            DOn;t know who that is, didn't hear anything about that, all of which is irrelevant. The bit you've missed by cherry-picking my comment is that this was not the act of the far left government or a far left politician in a position of power was it? You've cherry-picked a single nutter doing something nutjobby, and entirely swerved my point that there are, right now, far right people gaining positions of power, and there aren't far-left ones. Neither is good.

                            Tens of millions of people in the US are about to go out and vote for a far-right politician. That politician and his allies are happy to characterise the US version of "left" (which is more like centre-right, but there's the Overton window for you again) as "far-left" and "communist" to scare you into thinking that they are the rational alternative, whilst openly espousing far-right policies. I won't bother listing these for you, because it's not my job to educate you. It's your job. Go and fucking do it. Take some responsibility for the things you think and say, learn a bit of history, and if everyone did a bit of that, maybe we'd be able to head off the emergency the western world is heading into.

                            Those people who actually understand the terms you so happily throw about are in despair about how naïve so many people are. Honestly, instead of name-calling and fighting pointless culture wars, go and fill your head with some actual learning. I guarantee you'll benefit from it.

                            1. Anonymous Coward
                              Anonymous Coward

                              Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                              Ted Wheeler is currently the mayor of Portland. A notorious far left hive of purple hair and street defecation. Ted Wheeler is also far left. He has bent the knee, pandered to the rainbows, did the virtue signalling and frothed at the mouth about the 'evil far right', was all to happy with open drug usage and basically to appease pantifa and other such far left groups.

                              But as ever they want more and more and when he finally reached his 'limit' (translation: the people that vote for him got so pissed that he feared he would lose the next election along with businesses moving away and the loss of tax revenue) and wouldn't pander any more to the baying mob. So the mob decided that the best course of action was now to burn down where he lived.

                              A very sensible and rational decision by very well grounded people... NOT.

                  2. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

                    Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

                    Oh, and you need to go back and re-read my post, because, unlike you, I didn't use the therm "far right".

                    You also, probably deliberately and deceptively, falsely equated "right-wing" with "right-thinking". The etymology of "right" as in "correct" is entirely different to "right" as in "politically right-wing", which originates from power in France being held by hereditary privilege. A little history refresher, if you've forgotten how that ended up: The guillotine; ironically, not entirely unrelated to the formation of the US as a republic, where the "republican" party is now very much the party of the political right despite the historic origins of its name.

                    History, bitches: learn some.

        2. The Man Who Fell To Earth Silver badge
          FAIL

          Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

          "I'm not a public prosecutor but neither is Governor Shapiro or Trump."

          What part of "Shapiro is not only a lawyer, but he used to be the Attorney General of Pennsylvania from 2017-2023" did you ot understand? Oh wait, you commented without even educating yourself on what "Attorney General of Pennsylvania" means. The Attorney General of Pennsylvania is the top prosecutor for the State of Pennsylvania.

          Here's a lesson: "The Attorney General is Pennsylvania’s top law enforcement official, with a wide range of responsibilities to protect and serve the citizens and agencies of the Commonwealth. The Attorney General is served by a staff of several hundred prosecutors, attorneys, investigators, agents and support staff in offices across the state, divided into four sections: the Criminal Law Division, the Public Protection Division, the Civil Division and the Operations Division." https://www.attorneygeneral.gov/the-office/

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: 18 U.S. Code § 597 - Expenditures to influence voting, 52 U.S. Code § 10307 - Prohibited acts

            I made no comment on and, indeed do not question the Governor's legal prowess, it's just not currently his job and, moreover, he is currently doing a job which sits in a separate branch. Please read up on separation of powers, given his actual response, he clearly has.

            The judicial comments Trump made weren't inappropriate because of his inexperience and ignorance, that is why they were so lacking in factual basis. They were inappropriate because of his job at the time.

            This is not, nor was it ever, a discussion on qualifications. I left your previous diverging comment alone in my previous response because it wasn't relevant.

    4. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      "If he had concerns about legality, he should be talking to the DA quietly behind closed doors."

      I suppose if he'd done that and it got leaked you'd be complaining about things not being done in the open.

      1. cornetman Silver badge

        > I suppose if he'd done that and it got leaked you'd be complaining about things not being done in the open.

        Nope. Why would I? As long as the consultation is properly documented and there is a proper paper trail, and it is all above board, then sure, go for it.

        My objection is not that the governor is opening his mouth, but that he is apparently coasting very close to slandering a member of the public. That's a clear abuse of political position. If he believes that a law has been broken, then it is up to the DA to prosecute. If it is not, then it's none of his damn business *as the governor*.

        1. sabroni Silver badge

          Re: slandering a member of the public

          What, like calling them "The enemy within"?

        2. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

          What is the governor's business? Head of (State) government or head of state? Are the two differentiated in the US? The UK situation would be that it would be dubious for the monarch, head of state, to comment publicly but it would be for the PM, head of government.

  2. The Dogs Meevonks Silver badge

    Shocked... shocked, I tell you... well, not that shocked.

    Creepy McCreepface, or the Elongated Muskrat, or one of the Musketards... does something skeevy, creepy, fascistic and anti-democratic.

    In other news... what water touches... is wet (Which, co-incidentally... is also the opposite of every woman he's ever slept with).

  3. Mitoo Bobsworth

    Waste of money.

    Shame all that wealth can't buy Musk a character transplant or personality makeover.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Waste of money.

      Normally the transplanted element may be rejected by the adopting body, but I suspect in Musk's case the to be transplanted thing would reject Musk.

      Revulsion, thy name is Musk.

      1. Bebu
        Coat

        Re: Waste of money.

        Normally the transplanted element may be rejected by the adopting body, but I suspect in Musk's case the to be transplanted thing would reject Musk.

        "Graft versus Host" is a thing. Doubtless with the cast of Trump and Musk et al. there is plenty of graft involved.

        An old joke though I recall Tricky Dicky (RMN) was said to have received an arsehole transplant but that the graft had rejected him.

        Personally I would only accept Musk's USD 1million if might have it in nickels and dimes and permission to shove the whole sum up his same orifice.

        1. The Dogs Meevonks Silver badge
          Happy

          Re: Waste of money.

          'Grift Vs Host'

    2. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

      Re: Waste of money.

      Has money ever ?

  4. Catkin Silver badge

    Seems like the smart move would be to sign up and reduce the chances of a Republican winning. Any Democratic winners could even donate their winnings to the Harris campaign.

    1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      That bears a vague resemblance to the days when anyone could join the Labour party for a few quid and vote for the next leader, thus enabling it to be sabotaged for years buy voting in Corbin.

    2. DS999 Silver badge
      Mushroom

      Everyone who lives in one of those swing states

      Should sign that petition.

      It can't legally check if you are registered to vote as a condition of being eligible for the payment, and certainly can't check who a registered vote ultimately voted for. I think half of Musk's payments going to Harris voters would be hilarious. Especially if they all posted on Twitter laughing at him for being such a moron that he paid them to vote against his guy.

      If he tried to claw back the money somehow he'd be admitting that he was trying to pay people to vote a certain way, and hopefully he'd be found guilty of that crime and get himself a nice long jail sentence so we wouldn't have to hear from the moron for a few years!

    3. Charlie Clark Silver badge

      Who says that isn't happening. But the point of the campaign, and the reason why it's illegal, is that it's a direct financial incentive designed to attract more people than it can directly beneift. Even, if say 30 not-yet-registerted voters do as you suggest, far more will be encouraged to join in.

      1. DS999 Silver badge

        Its not illegal because it is designed to attract more people than it can directly benefit. If he was paying $100 per head instead of giving away $1 million a day to one person it is no different in the eyes of election law.

        1. BartyFartsLast Silver badge

          It's a lottery, designed to make people believe they will benefit by "winning" the million. Of course it's illegal.

          1. Jellied Eel Silver badge

            It's a lottery, designed to make people believe they will benefit by "winning" the million. Of course it's illegal.

            If it is so obviously illegal, then why hasn't it been shut down already? No idea what the US version of an emergency injunction is, but I know they have ways to make people cease & desist..

  5. Brad Ackerman
    Mushroom

    The great uMthondo we Sizwe, who is famous for not paying his bills, doesn't know how to write a check? Inconceivable!

    Icon because USAF should've done it to his security clearance a long time ago.

    1. werdsmith Silver badge

      The giant cheques are symbolic only and then only for the older people because a whole generation wouldn’t have a clue about them as they virtually disappeared from commerce since the last century.

    2. Bebu
      Childcatcher

      The great uMthondo we Sizwe

      uMthondo we Sizwe had to look it up but I like it. ;)

      Presumably translates in this context as "the great[est] dick[head] of the nation."

  6. 45RPM Silver badge

    Judging by the downvotes, I’d say that the magatards and musktards are out in force today - but too busying shuffling about in the corner whilst listening to music to be able to reply verbally.

    Come on! Use your words!

  7. Brewster's Angle Grinder Silver badge

    Prediction: Musk keeps deferring payment until after the election (there are not many days to dream up excuses for) and then refuses to pay. It's cheap and gets him out of a legal hole. (Unless Florida Man wins and decides to pardon him.)

    1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

      That won't get him out of any legal difficulties relating to election law: the mere offer is sufficient to land him in court.

      1. Brewster's Angle Grinder Silver badge

        Yeah, I did think of that afterwards. (A conspiracy charge.)

        But if he's paid, it's slam dunk. If he's not paid, he's in with a chance of claiming he was never serious and it was all a PR stunt.

        (Obviously, I hope he ends in the slammer either way. The price of surrounding him by placemen rather than people who will say "no" to a stupid idea.)

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Just a prank bro..

        2. BartyFartsLast Silver badge

          Then I hope the winners sue him to oblivion for not paying

    2. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

      Its a joke, remember pedo man ?

  8. heyrick Silver badge

    Aren't there laws about what amounts to bribing people to vote a certain way?

    Sign up, register, vote for the elephant in the room, potentially win a million bucks.

    Now, d'you think people signing up now are interested in politics or Trump or rich right-wing cockwombles, or are they hoping to be one of the ones picked to win a decent pile of cash?

  9. ecofeco Silver badge
    Meh

    Add this to my Soros check!

    With this and my Soros check, I'll be rich I tell ya! RICH!

  10. Howard Sway Silver badge

    Musk's first cash prize for signing "in support of the Constitution"

    Has oh-so-pious Mr Constitution Supporter had any comment to make yet about the level of support for the constitution that the candidate he's supporting to the tune of millions of dollars showed after the last presidential election?

  11. mostly average
    Headmaster

    I'm reminded of some rich kids at uni...

    At University, there were a number of foreign students whose tuition were paid in full plus a stipend by his country. (there were no females except their wives, mind you) Those from this country loved to flaunt their wealth. Especially by driving ostentatiously impractical vehicles and parking then illegally. To them, the citations were just the fee to park wherever they wanted. Like it was a premium service just for the rich. They soon learned that some of those "premium parking" areas included "valet service" to the impound lot and a lot of paperwork to get it released. They also destroyed their vehicles when the snow started falling. And most were expelled, often after only one semester, when they learned that can't just pay peasants to do their school work for them. They got every angry because they just couldn't understand why it wasn't allowed, especially since they paid the individuals. None of them drove Tesla, BTW. Too much pride in the oily source of their wealth.

  12. Dinanziame Silver badge
    Angel

    A fool and his money are soon parted

    Of course, he has a lot of money. But then again, he is a very big fool

  13. Groo The Wanderer

    Musk is just clarifying that corporate America BOUGHT the government decades ago and that the election process is a feel good sham.

  14. trevorde Silver badge

    More important question

    Has anyone managed to cash a cheque yet? ('check' for those on the other side of the pond)

    1. Groo The Wanderer

      Re: More important question

      Knowing Musk, they're probably drafted against an overdrawn account and will bounce like a superball...

  15. EricB123 Silver badge

    Pay Me, Please.

    I think The Register should pay me $10 each time I take the trouble to post here. I mean, I feel I should be rewarded for my time and effort. Not to mention my exquisite, creative thinking.

    1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

      Re: Pay Me, Please.

      Perhaps they could pay Jeel not to post here, on the grounds that he's turning off the sensible, sane, commenters?

      A bit like the hungover wedding guests paying the piper to go away.

      1. BartyFartsLast Silver badge

        Re: Pay Me, Please.

        Would they need to pay all his sock accounts too?

    2. heyrick Silver badge
      Happy

      Re: Pay Me, Please.

      I'll do it for a fiver because I have no social life... Not to be rewarded for my sarcasm, just sufficient to keep me with a constant supply of tea and biscuits.

  16. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

    How fucking dumb do you have to be, to not wonder why Musk is supporting Trump ?

  17. Androgynous Cupboard Silver badge

    Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

    This from the same country where giving water to people standing in line to vote was a criminal offence.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

      You might want to look into this in more detail lest you continue to make a fool of yourself.

      Those handing out the water were campaign staff for one of the candidates. If it had been Trump people handing out Trump branded water you'd likely lose your sh1t over it.

      They can still have the water and food free for people to pick up themselves. The poling place staff can hand out the free water and food as well.

      1. Elongated Muskrat Silver badge

        Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

        Still an obvious double-standard there, though:

        Hand out water to promote one candidate over another: illegal

        Enter people into a lottery to win $1M to promote one candidate over another: absoluuuuuutely fiiiiine

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

          Yeah, he's not doing it within 150 feet of a polling place so its all good.

      2. Zola
        Flame

        Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

        Of course, there wouldn't have been the long queues in the first place if the Republican Party hadn't gone to court to close down most of the voting stations in minority areas, which then meant that voters had to queue for literally hours in order to cast their vote. Which created the problem of people passing out while waiting in the queue.

        So make handing them a bottle of water a f*cking crime, right?

        And then the Republicans closed all the voting stations on Sunday afternoons in minority areas, because they know that a lot of minority voters will vote after Church.

        The Republican Party is absolutely unreal. I have no idea how they get away with it.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

          "because they know that a lot of minority voters will vote after Church."

          Hold on there just a moment. Isn't one of the things the left hate about Republicans is that they go to church? Have you ever been in Utah on a Sunday??

          1. Zola

            Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

            > Isn't one of the things the left hate about Republicans is that they go to church? Have you ever been in Utah on a Sunday??

            Utah? UTAH??? I'm sorry, but does Utah have a significant minority (ie. black) population that might not vote Republican?

            Depriving Church-going black people of their vote on a Sunday afternoon in traditionally Democrat-leaning counties is but one of many legal challenges that have been brought by the Republican Party in order to suppress votes from minorities that will be voting for the other side.

            The Republican Party is absolutely f*cking horrible.

            Oh and I seriously doubt that Democrats "hate ... Republicans because they go to church". That's palpable nonsense. Republicans might claim to be the God fearing party, but pretty much only if you're white.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

              " in traditionally Democrat-leaning counties"

              Hmm.. you talking about Spalding County?

              https://edition.cnn.com/2022/05/21/politics/voting-2022-primary-georgia/index.html

              Well, got a shock for you. In 2020 they voted 59% for Trump. That ain't a Democrat leaning county.

              1. Zola

                Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

                Georgia, Texas, Florida - take your pick. It isn't happening in just one state.

                Voter suppression of minorities is now Republican Party policy. Not that it's a recent thing, but they're so utterly brazen now.

                The fact that something like this is happening across the USA but doesn't seem to concern you says it all.

        2. Jellied Eel Silver badge

          Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

          Of course, there wouldn't have been the long queues in the first place if the Republican Party hadn't gone to court to close down most of the voting stations in minority areas, which then meant that voters had to queue for literally hours in order to cast their vote. Which created the problem of people passing out while waiting in the queue.

          This is sadly normal for modern politics. Moldova just held elections and a referendum around joining the EU, which the pro-EU side very narrowly won. The EU helped set up lots of polling stations in the EU (Italy had over 20), Russia, where most of the expats actually live had.. 2.

          So make handing them a bottle of water a f*cking crime, right?

          That was the law. The law is sometimes (often) an ass. Because getting the top job is worth billions to its investors, laws get bent. Or sometimes 'reformed'. Who needs ID to vote, or measures to improve election integrity? Vote early! Vote often! This will bring about Democratcy!

    2. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

      Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

      WHy would anyone change their vote because someone gave them a bottle of water ?

      How fucking dumb do you have to be to "sell" your vote for some water ?

      1. MachDiamond Silver badge

        Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

        "WHy would anyone change their vote because someone gave them a bottle of water ?"

        So, you set the lower end at a bottle of water. Where's the other side? $5, $20, $100?

        There's no issue with giving away a bottle of water with the maker's OEM branding. That water can be provided by anybody without attribution but you don't see that and likely won't.

        It's far easier to just pass a law that says absolutely no campaigning can be done within a certain distance of a polling place which is where the law applies. There's no problem handing out bottled water with a custom label promoting a candidate at a rally as the cost isn't much as long as a person accepting it isn't doing so with a promise of a vote. I sumptuous meal is given away with money going the other way to the candidate and I wager there's fat chance that you'll see a political candidate setting out a roast dinner for everybody attending their rally as an inducement to vote for them.

        A person I know said he was going to run for city council and wanted me to vote for him. I asked him where my cigar was. In the long gone past of the US, cigars would be handed out on the campaign trail. Since he wasn't going to hand out cigars, I asked for the cash instead which would have saved him a trip to the store. Even being that thoughtful didn't get me any money. He didn't actually run either so we're even.

        1. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

          Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

          Why is handing out water even a necessity or thing ?

          If people can reemmber to bring their car keys surely they can manage to bring some water from home.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

            Remember these are also the voters who can't get ID due to it being hard to find the DMV.

            At some point you have to treat people as adults and let them work life out for themselves. Sadly a certain group wants to baby another group and this is why some inner city schools have kids graduating high school who are functionally illiterate and innumerate. Cos if we dared to make the kids do actual school work, learn what they need to learn and graded them properly it would be some sort of oppression or something.

          2. Jellied Eel Silver badge

            Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

            Why is handing out water even a necessity or thing ?

            I think that's one of those law being an ass things. It's illegal to offer inducements to vote, but it seems like a common courtesy to have water available, especially in hot weather and with long queues. I don't know the specifics of US process and laws, but have done some volunteering in UK elections. We weren't allowed to campaign outside polling stations, just collected numbers so campaigns could tell who'd turned up to vote. But not how they voted, or enter the polling station. Only mildly awkward moment was helping an elderly lady get inside the station, but just took my rosette off and the election staff and other volunteers were fine doing that.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

              Its not like this is an uncommon thing around the world. Really how hard is it for the political activist types to put on the civvies, be a normal person and STFU about their party/person/whatever for a few days? Certainly in the US, and now spread to Europe and the UK a certain section of the political class have been overcome with an active and deep-seated hatred of the opposition and they cannot let it go.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

        How dumb? Well see any of Jeel's posts, and the 5 Rubles he gets for each one is less than a bottle of water.

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

        It is not the bottle of water. The polling place staff can give out water. It was that the campaign staff were also politicking while giving out water. If it had been republican staffers doing the politicking with the people in the queue I'm very confident that the dems would have been absolutely apoplectic over it.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

          Then stop shutting down the voting stations in minority counties so that there arent huge queues at the few voting stations that remain open?

          This is a problem that is the direct consequence of voter suppression.

          In the Republican voting, wealthy, white counties there are ample voting stations that are open every day of the week, all without any queues.

          It doesn't take a genius to work out what is happening.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

            OR how about make the polling places less complex without the need for hugely expensive (and insecure) computer systems, ballot scanners etc. And make voting quicker where you don't need to vote for 20 different things all at the same time.

            The more expensive and complex the polling places are to setup and run then it is logical that they will consolidate.

            The same reason we have a few big supermarkets and all the little shops close.

          2. Jellied Eel Silver badge

            Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

            This is a problem that is the direct consequence of voter suppression.

            In the Republican voting, wealthy, white counties there are ample voting stations that are open every day of the week, all without any queues

            Or just mismanagement. That's the responsibility of the states and counties. If they can't manage a whelk stand, they probably can't manage a voting booth. See also Lizzo and her comments that every US city should be like Detroit. Democrat leaders are working on that..

          3. CowHorseFrog Silver badge

            Re: Give away a water bottle and it's jail, give away a million and it's OK.

            Is nt there a law that sets out the minimum voting stations and schedules and times for them to be open ?

  18. Omnipresent Silver badge

    I'm still surprised

    That the bros gave this russian plant 250 billion to terrorize the world with for the rest of his days.

    wait: no i'm not, i'm dealing with pure evvvvviiiiiiiillllllllll.

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