back to article Voyager 1 starts making sense again after months of babble

Engineers are hopeful the veteran spacecraft Voyager 1 has turned a corner after spending the past three months spouting gibberish at controllers. On March 1, the Voyager team sent a command, dubbed a "poke," to get the probe's Flight Data System (FDS) to try some other sequences in its software in the hope of circumventing …

  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Perspective

    That puts my current system down in perspective. The fix:

    Log into the VM Host, restart VM and it all starts working again ...

    1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge

      Re: Perspective

      They'd have done that. But the bloke with the big reset-hammer had his credit card rejected, when he tried to fuel his van to get out there.

      Apparently there weren't enough noughts on the diesel pump.

      So they tried swearing at it. But in space, nobody can hear you scream, "work you bastard thing!"

      So now they've been reduced to debugging it. I must say I'll be disappointed if they're analysing their newly downloaded data on computers, rather than massive stacks of fanfold paper as God intended. Was that an earhquake in California? No, just JPL's daisywheel printers...

      1. jake Silver badge

        Re: Perspective

        Line printers, Shirley.

        I dunno 'bout all y'all, but my daisywheels haven't been ostracized to lead-foam lined boxes.

        1. Roger Kynaston

          Re: Perspective (OT as well)

          Many years ago before I ascended to the heady heights of systems administrator I had a job driving taxis in Taunton where Debenhams had their data processing facility. A daily job was for one of us to go round to their place with a van at four AM and pick upreams of fandfold paper for transport to the head office on Oxford St. Goodness knows what happened to it but I struggled to imagine the eighties equivalient of the C-suite wading through it all.

          1. Headley_Grange Silver badge

            Re: Perspective (OT as well)

            My mate used to take a box of used fanfold home every so often - his wife was a primary school teacher and used it for art. The boss saw him carting a box out one day and went mad when he found out the reason. He was worried that it contained confidential stuff, so my mate let him look through it. Neither of them had a clue what was on it - just the usual meaningless rows of numbers with lots of asterisks I bet. The school contintued to get its art supplies.

      2. rafff

        Re: Perspective

        "massive stacks of fanfold paper as God intended. "

        That brings back memories - of hours spent with a red pen in hand. Who still remembers what still remembers what all the the 0Cx codes mean?

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Perspective

        Maybe they could have hitched a lift on Elon's space launched Telsa Roadster. It must be approaching Voyager 1 anytime soon.

        Talking of fanfold paper that takes me right back to my days debugging PL/1 system dumps.

        1. waldo kitty
          Alien

          Re: Perspective

          Maybe they could have hitched a lift on Elon's space launched Telsa Roadster. It must be approaching Voyager 1 anytime soon.

          ummm... the Roadster and Starman won't ever leave the Sol system... their trajectory takes them just past the orbit of Mars where they loop back, go around the sun, and back to Earth's orbit.. they never had the speed needed to leave the star system... the Voyagers used planetary gravity assist flybys to gain the necessary speed for leaving...

          currently, Roadster and Starman are 5.25 light minutes from Earth and approaching at 3.6 km/s... together, they have completed 4 orbits around Sol and are at the beginning of their 5th orbit in the 6 years since their launch...

          https://www.whereisroadster.com/

          1. Chris Evans

            Re: Perspective

            For comparison:

            Voyager 1 i 15,134,324,455 mi, 162.81208868 AU, 22:34:04 Light hh:mm:ssi from Earth, moving AWAY from the Earth at a Velocity of 38,026.77 mph

            Elon's Telsa Roadster. is: 58,606,261 miles, 0.630 AU, 5.24 light minutes) from Earth, moving TOWARD Earth at a speed of 7,719 mi/h (12,422 km/h, 3.45 km/s).

  2. BenDwire Silver badge
    Boffin

    V'Ger

    I guess we don't need to worry unless it turns around and starts heading towards earth ...

    1. Stuart Castle Silver badge

      Re: V'Ger

      Maybe in a couple of hundred years, it will come back as part of a massive space ship that essentially absorbs everything it encounters?

      1. spuck

        Re: V'Ger

        I keep hoping for the episode where we learn that it was Wesley Crusher's nanites that got sent back in time and became the Borg.

    2. WonkoTheSane
      Headmaster

      Re: V'Ger

      In the movie, we learn that V'Ger started out as Voyager 6.

      Fun fact - The Voyager program originally planned for 6 spacecraft launches.

      1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

        Re: V'Ger

        Spoiler alert!

        1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge

          Re: V'Ger

          Spoiler alert!

          If I were being harsh, I'd say that the people that spoiled Star Trek the Motion Picture, were the ones who made it.

          There's even a joke about how only the even numbered ones were good. Which is odd (if you'll pardon the pun), because the Wrath of Khan is, but I'm not sure about many of the rest. Maybe some of the later TNG ones?

          And then JJ Abrams turned Kirk into a hyperactive whiny teenager in search of a bloody good slap. Although I did like the opening scene of his first film.

          1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

            Re: V'Ger

            I his defence (and I don't think Abrams wrote the script, BTW) it is about the early years of Kirk. And it sort of fits with his general demeanour in the first gen.

            But I can barely distinguish the later prequel movies from each other, and I'm not even sure if I've seen (slept through) some of them.

    3. John Brown (no body) Silver badge
      Alien

      Re: V'Ger

      Well, the article does state "Engineers are hopeful that the veteran spacecraft Voyager 1 might have turned a corner", so it's either found a new fuel source and figured out how to top up the tanks, it slingshotted around a previously unknown gravity well, or aliens! :-)

    4. jmch Silver badge
      Trollface

      Re: V'Ger

      At some point Voyager 1 will reach the edge of the giant simulation we're in and will just start approaching Earth from the opposite side of the screen!

      1. Luiz Abdala
        Pint

        Re: V'Ger

        Well, the screen is 94 billion lightyears wide, so it will take a while to travel 47 billion of those and pop on the other side...

        We won't be around to see it looping back, though. I hope it evolves past our Universe as it does.

        I'll drink to that.

      2. Doctor Tarr

        Re: V'Ger

        Chased by ghosts?

      3. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

        Re: V'Ger

        "and will just start approaching Earth from the opposite side of the screen!"

        Either that, or a memory access violation screws us all...

        We'll never know that we did it to ourselves.

  3. Mike 137 Silver badge

    (Sighs)

    They just don't build kit to those standards any more.

    1. user555

      Re: (Sighs)

      Well, Boeing for sure.

      1. DoctorNine

        Re: (Sighs)

        They just need to change the name to 'Boing' and be done with it.

  4. Flak
    Go

    Real Time

    Not real-time communication in computing terms, but communication that takes real time!

    I take my hat off to the team that still supports this wonderful piece of equipment which just keeps on giving.

    1. Chloe Cresswell Silver badge

      Re: Real Time

      Not just the team who supports it, but the ones maintaining the big dishes and their equipment that are needed to talk to them. I know the 70metres are due to be decommissioned next year though.

      1. jake Silver badge

        Re: Real Time

        The Stanford Dish will work into the foreseeable future.

        1. Brett Weaver

          Re: Real Time

          Few will understand.. but remember the delay between the coding, peer reviewing, punching and testing.? Was over 45 hours...

          1. Aging Hippy

            Re: Real Time

            Plus 24 hours on a Wednesday as that was when payroll was run.

          2. This post has been deleted by its author

        2. Chloe Cresswell Silver badge

          Re: Real Time

          The DSN doesn't have a site at Stanford though, It's 3 sites are at Canberra, Madrid, and Barstow (California). Those are the 70 metre dishes used to talk to the Voyagers

          1. JDC

            Re: Real Time

            Robledo de Chavela, not Madrid itself.

            1. Francis Boyle

              Since we're doing pedantry

              The Canberra site is not in Canberra but at Tidbinbilla (I love that name), still in the ACT but a good long walk from Canberra itself.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Since we're doing pedantry

                Well it would have to be given the thermal noise floor if it were anywhere close...

              2. Spherical Cow Silver badge

                Re: Since we're doing pedantry

                A long walk yes, but a short drive. I live in Canberra and I've been to the deep space complex many times. They have a great visitor centre with lots to see, and plenty for the kids. I've touched a real moon rock there, and seen one of the space suits used by Apollo astronauts to walk on the moon. They also have the telescope used to receive the footage of Neil Armstrong's one small step (it's been relocated there from Honeysuckle Creek where it was at the time).

          2. jake Silver badge

            Re: Real Time

            The Stanford Dish has been used to talk with the Voyagers (and the Vikings) in the past. All the necessary kit is still available (or was, last time I looked). Presumably, it can be configured to talk with the Voyagers again, if needs be.

          3. Wzrd1 Silver badge

            Re: Real Time

            Those DSN dishes are scheduled to be retired after the Voyager program ends, which will be after the final processor finally goes titsup or the RTG finally gives up its last gasp from its thermocouple (the RTG will continue to heat, the most common failure in RTG's is the thermocouple).

    2. Arthur the cat Silver badge

      Re: Real Time

      Not real-time communication in computing terms

      This means a 45-hour wait to see what a given command might have done.

      That's a lot faster than getting an appointment with a GP these days.

    3. ProfessorLarry

      Re: Real Time

      And hats off to the original software developers. The software for the Voyagers was developed by early adopters of then emerging modular programming techniques for reliability and ease of maintenance and modification. It's paid off with the many successful mission changes since over the extended lives of the Voyagers.

  5. Oh Matron!

    If ever there was a use case for LLM

    Create a VM using existing documentation

    Train a LLM on the syntax

    etc, etc....

    1. alain williams Silver badge

      Re: If ever there was a use case for LLM

      But when the LLM has a hallucination resulting in a command being sent that trashes Voyager - then what ?

      V1 is priceless, irreplaceable - handle with extreme care!

      1. Bowlers

        Re: If ever there was a use case for LLM

        'V1 is priceless, irreplaceable - handle with extreme care!'

        Nothing is really priceless. When V1 finally dies it could be auctioned off to some billionaire. Give him 'stificate' to prove he owns it just in case it does return.

    2. Lee D Silver badge

      Re: If ever there was a use case for LLM

      That is the singularly most awful idea I've ever heard.

      You know that all such "AI" just collapses into a heap of nonsense the second it has to think for itself, receives unexpected data or strays outside its training boundaries, right?

      1. ThatOne Silver badge
        Devil

        Re: If ever there was a use case for LLM

        Yes, b-but AI is the solution to everything! Everyone says so!

        /sarcasm

        1. vtcodger Silver badge

          Re: If ever there was a use case for LLM

          "AI is the solution to everything!"

          AI is the long sought Universal Solvent of legend and fable? Could be I suppose.

        2. Not previously required
          Trollface

          Re: If ever there was a use case for LLM

          Artificial intelligence and artificial insemination are both abbreviated to AI. Only one of those technologies can you leave you right royally screwed.

      2. Munchausen's proxy
        Pint

        Re: If ever there was a use case for LLM

        You know that all such "AI" just collapses into a heap of nonsense the second it has to think for itself, receives unexpected data or strays outside its training boundaries, right?

        Well, sure, just AI alone won't do the job. You need to add some quantum.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: If ever there was a use case for LLM

      Create a VM ...

      Train a LLM on the syntax ...

      Don't be daft ...

      And please stop using whatever it is you put in your cuppa this morn.

      .

  6. Caver_Dave Silver badge

    Just a thought

    If I was in charge I would put the 'digital twin' on the web so that Joe Public could have a crack at fixing it.

    With so many people in parallel tinkering, someone must come up with the answer fairly soon.

    And of course, you don't have the long turn around time to try your changes.

    1. benderama

      Re: Just a thought

      Do you want to teach the public how to take over a satellite? You know there’s at least one nutbag with the tools to sniff the traffic who will try to run Doom on V’ger

      1. Lon24

        Re: Just a thought

        But does he have the dosh to rent a dish?

        1. Munchausen's proxy
          Pint

          Re: Just a thought

          You know there’s at least one nutbag with the tools to sniff the traffic who will try to run Doom on V’ger

          Carmack probably could

          But does he have the dosh to rent a dish?

          And probably does.

      2. A. Coatsworth Silver badge
        Boffin

        Re: Just a thought

        well, that idea wholesomely almost worked for the ISEE 3 probe

    2. Mike 137 Silver badge

      Re: Just a thought

      "With so many people in parallel tinkering, someone must come up with the answer fairly soon"

      The million monkeys and Shakespeare? The big problem is knowing when you have the right answer so you can stop, and that takes the expertise (genius, or whatever) that's intrinsically missing from a crowd source, as it's an individual capacity.

      1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

        Re: Just a thought

        Didn't you need an infinite amount if monkeys for that?

        1. Richard 12 Silver badge

          Re: Just a thought

          You can use a finite number of monkeys if you set your sights a little lower.

          Sure, you probably won't get Shakespeare, but maybe Twilight?

      2. Wzrd1 Silver badge

        Re: Just a thought

        Million monkeys and Shakespeare, the biggest problem being how many people cannot ascertain the difference between the output of either group of primates and the singular primate.

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Infinite lives in Jet Set willy

    Fine, until you fall in from the top of the screen a die infinite times.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Poking Jet Set Willy

    Some people are alleged to have used pokes to bypass the copy-protection in Jet Set Willy. Being an honest, upstanding memeber of society, *I* would never have done that.

    1. Michael 66

      Re: Poking Jet Set Willy

      I'm afraid I don't remember doing that. I must have been poking some other Willy then.

  9. Sam not the Viking Silver badge
    Pint

    Decoding Voyager

    I don't recall who originally posted this link to decoding Voyager 1 data but this is it: https://destevez.net/2021/09/decoding-voyager-1/

    Hats off to the original designers and the ongoing skills which contribute to our continued fascination on this project. And publicising/distributing the processes. Have one of these ---->

  10. Sartori

    Great news

    It's almost Friday and we get some positive news on Voyager.

    Never ceases to amaze me that it's still going. I know one day it will stop, but always brings me some joy to know it's still out there, talking back to us after such an incredibly long time. Well done space boffins, I salute you!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Great news

      It won't stop until it hits something. It might stop talking to us though.

      1. Lord Elpuss Silver badge

        Re: Great news

        "It won't stop until it hits something."

        Yes so one day it will stop. Not any day soon, but one day.

  11. Howard Sway Silver badge

    An engineer with the Deep Space Network (DSN) was able to decode it

    Did it say "All your base are belong to us"?

  12. Philo T Farnsworth

    The saddest part of this story. . .

    "Many of the engineers who worked on the project - Voyager 1 launched in 1977 - are no longer around,. . ."

    May I meet all of you in "Nerd Valhalla" when I finally shuffle off this mortal coil. Thanks for bringing knowledge, inspiration, and beauty into this life.

    1. fnusnu

      Re: The saddest part of this story. . .

      The "eternal datacentre" surely?

      1. bartsmit
        Facepalm

        Re: The saddest part of this story. . .

        You could have said 'The Big Datacenter in the Sky" but then those cloud hipsters stole that concept

    2. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge
      Devil

      Re: The saddest part of this story. . .

      I don't wish to upset anyone with this idea, but what if you have been insufficiently nerdy in your life? What if you aren't sent to Nerd Valhalla - but you're sent to the "other place"?

      And this is too horrible to contemplate...

      You could be sent down to The Helldesk

      Where the phone never stops ringing, and the daemons' whips never cease to lash.

      1. Lurko

        Re: The saddest part of this story. . .

        You could be sent down to The Helldesk

        Possibly, but I suspect IBM have long ago visited Satan and persuaded him to offshore the Helldesk to India, or worse still South Africa. So presumably if you go to the Helldesk you're being reincarnated in one of those locations.

  13. A Non e-mouse Silver badge

    Elsewhere, it was mentioned that the original plan for the Voyager probes was for this grand tour. Then the US Senate cut the funding and the engineers had to sharped their pencils. It's looking like the Voyager probes might outlast the humans who tried to shorten its life.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      On the assumption that the senators of the early-mid 70's were probably around 50-60 y/o, then I think we can be confident that Voyager has already outlived them. It may well outlive me, and I was rather young when I remember the talk of it being launched.

  14. martinusher Silver badge

    Ah! Memories!

    >...and the team that remains is faced with trawling through reams of decades-old documents to deal with unanticipated issues

    I remember 'documentation' -- I'm about the same vintage as the Voyager originals (but still upright, more or less) and how we used to have to write reams of it as part of the process of designing software. So old fashioned, so quaint. These days you're supposed to clone a project from GitHub and watch a couple of ad-hoc videos. (There's nothing inherently wrong with GitHub, of course, apart gnawing misgivings about corporate parentage / patronage but a quick video doesn't have the same 'je ne sais quoi' of actual documentation -- many videos are surprisingly content-free!)

    For those who don't quite get it, actually writing documentation is an important step in the design process. We're not talking about user manuals or repair documents, that stuff is best left to professional writers, but being able to crystallize out your ideas and get the straight before writing any code can shorten the actual coding and testing phases dramatically. (....and yes, I've had to do this in the dark days before word processors....)

    1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

      Re: Ah! Memories!

      "many videos are surprisingly content-free!"

      That's how most of our ongoing training is delivered. The best way to deal with it IME is to blast through as quickly as possible and do the test while it's still fresh in the mind. The real training happens when you are on site in front of the broken kit and have the service manual open :-)

      1. ChoHag Silver badge

        Re: Ah! Memories!

        Service manual? That's not how we do things these days. If you're lucky you might find a tutorial describing one of a product's more useless features.

        Can we get a "this is not a joke" icon?

        1. aks

          Re: Ah! Memories!

          here's one

          https://www.voicesofyouth.org/blog/mental-illness-not-joke

          1. Lord Elpuss Silver badge

            Re: Ah! Memories!

            Sorry, is that just a random plug? I fail to see the link.

        2. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

          Re: Ah! Memories!

          In my job, the kit we service has excellent online, free[*], searchable service manuals for all of the (well known) OEMs we deal with. Compared with 10-20 years ago, I find them much improved not only in terms of availability but in terms of being current, with links to fault finding and all sorts of resources I'd previously have to hunt down or even pay significant money for, if they even existed. This may not apply across the industry, or in other industries, or to consumer grade kit, but my experience can only be described as positive :-)

          * not always freely available to all, I admit. Most offer at least the service manuals to all, some restrict some information only to authorised "partners" and "service techs", but it is all there but generally, it's not hard to find the teardown info, f/w, drivers and all the stuff you need for 95% of the work, even if not an "authorised" technician. Few offer the circuit diagrams mind, but 99% of the time, you don't want or need that level of detail unless you are working to a tight budget and the kit is out of warranty, which doesn't happen in my job :-)

  15. DJV Silver badge

    Re: Voyager 1 starts making sense again after months of babble

    Can someone ask NASA to take a look at Elon Musk next? Or is he now a totally lost cause?

    1. Bebu Silver badge
      Windows

      Re: Voyager 1 starts making sense again after months of babble

      《Can someone ask NASA to take a look at Elon Musk next? Or is he now a totally lost cause?

      Long beyond the Kuiper belt, head well and truly lost in the Oort cloud.

      Hard reset required.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Voyager 1 starts making sense again after months of babble

      Needs heavy application of clue-by-four.

  16. Michael Hoffmann Silver badge
    Pint

    POKE, CALL

    Ah, the memories, looping through a huge (for the time) DIM and POKE the values into sequential memory, finally a CALL to the first one, thereby running a machine language program on my Apple 2.

    Beers to the V1 team and all those who also remember those days!

  17. Cruachan

    Kudos as always to the NASA engineers keeping Voyager alive, and kudos also to the author for the mention of Jet Set Willy which means once again that In the Hall of the Mountain King is living in my head in all of its 8-bit glory.

    1. Toastan Buttar

      Sound on the Speccy was only 1-bit glory!

  18. jake Silver badge

    Not quite the POKE we all remember so fondly ...

    A lot of the code for Voyager was initially put together for the Viking program's CCS (Computer Command System) computer, which Voyager shared for cost reasons. The CCSs were hand-built by JPL.

    The code for the CCS was initially developed in Fortran IV, then ported to Fortran 77. These days, they mostly use C.

    Strangely enough, I have never seen the braying fanbois calling to port it all to Rust. I wonder why ...

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Are they using any modern tech? Such as Digital Twinning it and using GenAI/LLM on the documets and code?

    Suspect there isn't the budget for Voyager.

    1. Lord Elpuss Silver badge

      Digital twinning is a useful concept (and I'm sure they're doing it, or something very similar) - but using genAI/LLM on such an incredibly failure-sensitive and risky project would be beyond madness. For once the reasons for NOT doing this aren't budget.

  20. pip25
    Happy

    Memory dump

    That someone at the design team actually thought "okay, if this component misbehaves and we can send stuff normally, dump the whole memory and transmit that instead as debug info" is something I find truly amazing and impressive.

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    45 Hour response to a command?

    That's a bit like talking to my boss!

    1. Wolfclaw

      Re: 45 Hour response to a command?

      Still quicker than a response from Crapita support desk.

  22. Forget It
    Coffee/keyboard

    TS Eliot:

    ...

    Not fare well,

    But fare forward, voyagers.

    from /The Dry Salvages/

  23. navarac Silver badge

    1977

    We should be grateful that it was launched in 1977 (4 years pre-MSFT incorporation). Otherwise Voyager 1 would not have lasted longer that the first update.

  24. bernmeister

    POKE command

    To set the record straight, POKE is a BASIC command and writes a byte of data into any memory location. If you POKE a number into the wrong part of memory you could crash the computer by corrupting part of a program. Remember the Sinclair ZX81?

  25. Grumpy633

    What frequency does it use for Comms? What power is the transmitter and how is the dish steered to face earth while it spins at 1000mph?

    Sounds like nonsense to me as it was hard to get a microwave link setup for 70miles between base and mountain in the 90s...

    1. david 12 Silver badge

      Control channel is in the 2-4 GHz range. Telemetry is somewhere around double that. Regarding aiming: I imagine that the beam is considerably spread out by the time it reaches earth from voyager. From earth, I imagine they just boost up the power until voyager can hear it -- something you aren't permitted to do on microwave base links.

    2. Grumpy633

      Down votes but no answers

      What I expected - you all just faithfully and unquestionably believe everything they tell you as NASA and space are your religion.

  26. osxtra

    Earth to V'Ger, Come In, V'Ger

    Drats, here I was hoping it was just Spock doing a mind meld...

  27. staringatclouds

    45 hour turn round

    "This means a 45-hour wait to see what a given command might have done"

    Takes me back to the days of submitting a job to the datacentre as a student only to find out a day or so later I'd missed a semicolon

  28. david 12 Silver badge

    "endured far longer than anticipated "

    I remember the prediction that some of the scientific instruments would continue to operate "at least until 2020". You may argue that 47 years is far longer than 43 years, but I'm unconvinced.

    In any case -- little of all we value here | Wakes on the morn of its (47th) year | Without both feeling and looking queer. -- (pace Oliver Wendell Holmes)

  29. Palladini

    That is good, that spacecraft is way out there and still talking to the folks on Earth, one has to find that amazing. The question is, when will the USA send another one of these up in another direction? Hell, if it were me making the decision, one would go up every year, and in every direction, that way you have more ways of contacting other life out there. And no question of is their life out there, if you say there cannot be, you are wrong

    1. ThatOne Silver badge

      > ways of contacting other life out there

      The question is, does "other life" really want to be contacted by humans? I'm sure they'd rather pass.

      Unless of course we're considered as potentially useful in some way (food comes to mind, although personally I wouldn't eat that)

    2. uccsoundman

      Well, the trouble is that "Scientific Inquiry" is no longer a sufficient reason to launch any spacecraft. These days there has to be a ROI within this quarter, or it will not get done. I predict that nothing on the order of the Hubble will ever get done again because there is no immediate profit in it. After all, who cares if the universe is 13.1 or 23.2 billion years old? How does that get me any goodies? It doesn't? Well never mind then. Nobody was interested in revisiting the moon until they found minerals they could mine for $$$$. Now there is a mad rush to the moon.

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