Hold up world, HP's all-in-one print subscription's about to land, and don't forget AI PCs HP Ink recorded its seventh quarter of shrinking revenues as enterprise customers voted to sweat their assets for longer amid economic uncertainty, but with a new all-in-one print sub coming and AI PCs it is feeling bolder. The world’s number one print vendor and second largest PC maker said revenues for its Q1 ended 31 …
but saying that looks so good in the annual shareholders' report!
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The world is simply an AMAZING place. Stupid people constantly in denial, quite flatly lying to both themselves *and* their shareholders into believing that, in a world full of competition, a good majority of users will simply beat a path to their door to sign up for by-the-copy ink subscription pricing.
:shakes head:
This is what happens when you let a MBA-graduate (MBA from ESADE Business School) know-nothing beancounter run things - they assure themselves of their 'trained' righteousness. I'll remind you again, an MBA graduate is nothing but a pre-programmed idiot who only looks at quarterlies and 'past performances' for ideas; planning an ambitious growth pattern based upon actual, new ideas - like IBM's Mr. Watson - is too much of a leap of faith for them. "The market knows best", give the stockholders their quarterly dividends, and pretend that you know what the flack you're doing.
I think a lot of them will. Of course there will be complaints, but when push comes to shove, they will pay up, grudgingly, rather than change to a different product. Maybe this is a characteristic of Windows users or something; if they will put up with Microsoft, what else won’t they put up with?
It is simply that not every Windows user is sophisticated; read, a large majority of Windows users aren't computer savvy. They know "HP" on the label and will certainly buy it - what does Canon and this 'Epson' know about printers, anyway?? (we can certainly have a discussion that Epson doesn't know much about printers after their switch to dye-based inks decades ago yet kept a permanent head!)
Most Americans will consider an HP product to be a 'reliable' buy, even if reality is exactly the opposite. I've been burned by HP myself, never again thank you, but legacy reputation (hello, MB and BMW! :waves:) still goes a long way in today's consumer market.
Unlike Microsoft, HP do not have an effective monopoly.
If the printer in the (mostly empty) office changed from one beige box to another, nobody cares. Or even notices.
That said, a lot of corporates have always rented their printers so perhaps HP are safe to do that.
Hold Up World -- I initially misread that as, "Hold Up the World" (as in, to threaten to shoot someone if they don't give you their money).
HP management believing that ink subscriptions are the best way to profitability means they also believe all of, most of, or at least enough of, HP's customers are bad at, or don't do, math.
"Printed on my Brother 5250DN Laser Printer."
It's self-fulfilling prophecy though. Subscribers wouldn't subscribe if they weren't happy with the subscription. (well broadly anyway, there will always be some idiots merrily continuing)
Now, if they were to measure subscriber satisfaction past and present, that might be a different score. But equally probably still higher than the people who'd look at this service and laugh at it before moving along.
My 1973 HP45 is still working, though the batteries died decades ago. Single digit LaserJets also had the reputation of lasting forever.
I bought a HP tank printer for the wife, part of the paper feed crapped out on the original unit, being under warranty HP shipped a new printer. The wife has printed out thousands of pages, and so far I've oly spent $19 for a refill of black ink.
The pick-up rolls failed early and required replacing too often. HP even offered a free one-time DIY cardboard fix for every model.
Not picking up papers / picking several papers at the same time were the typical problems.
The redheaded stepchild in otherwise all right LaserJet 5 family.
Actually all upright HP models have been shite, perhaps because they naturally gather dust inside them. After 6L they came up with Laserjet 1100 - shite for the same reasons.
Even better, for multifunction devices, the scanner stops working if you're "out of ink"[1], and even better, now requires a login to some HP site supposedly for image optimisation or other such nonsense, but who knows exactly what they're doing with the stuff you upload for no damned practical reason. And, of course, there was the hell of trying to get HP's own Linux drivers to behave. If I was going to buy a home printer for office stuff[2], I wouldn't even consider HP crap. I'm pretty sure that I wouldn't accept one for free unless it was some antediluvian laserjet that *didn't* ever phone home.
[1] And obviously, that's when the DRM chips decide when the cartridge is out, irrespective of how much actual ink is left.
[2] If I do ever buy a printer, it'd be for art photography which HP was always crap for anyway, so they'd not even be in the running if they weren't enshittified to all hell.
Useful to know, although I hope I'm never dealing with HP stuff again. The only printer I have my eyes on right now is one of Epson's dye-sub ones for art, and if I needed an office printer I'd either get one of their "Ecotank" models like I did for my mother or a Brother laser, probably second-hand.
get one of their "Ecotank" models like I did for my mother or a Brother laser, probably second-hand.
And as it happens, we have a Canon bottle-fill multi-function printer and an aging Brother mono laser that,though not exactly second hand, was bought for student daughter about 11 years ago, then used by my late sister, and now sits USBd to our main PC doing all the routine print jobs, on cheap 3rd party toner.
But our experience with HP was dire* and I 'll never buy anything from them again, ever.
*Hardware was OK. Software was so poor it effectively bricked the machine on an update by making it impossible to install the drivers
Yeah, my recollection is that the software was a dog. At least, the one I got for my mum had a lightweight install for the scanner side (and no needing an account/online crap) and came with 4oz (US)/~118ml bottles for the colour inks and the black looked about twice as big[1]. Of course, when ordering the thing, I didn't see that it came with a full set, so I took the liberty of getting another full set of inks for $25 US per bottle and promptly forgot to fill out the rebate for those. My only complaint is that it does seem more prone to paper jams, though they're at least easy to clear entirely, and could just be that the tolerances were off for that unit. Only laser I had was an Apple Laserwriter that I found on the corner[2], and wonder if I had kept it after the move if I could still keep the thing working. Some of those old printers do refuse to die.
[1] Don't recall the precise volume
[2] In SF, at least at the time, people would leave serviceable whatever that they were replacing out for anyone to take. I acquired some coffee tables/chairs/houseplants and a vinyl sofa in that manner. Of course, I wouldn't take anything discoloured and still cleaned and disinfected the hell out of it.
You havent read the T&Cs, have you. It gives HP pretty much unfettered access to your data, and they can share it with their partners, whom in turn can share it with theirs
It also requires the printer to be connected to the Internet
So a data breach in the making aided by a security breach in the making.
Sounds just like MS Windows. Then there is the EU made Vending Machine that had a camera fitted to scrape data from people using it. (University of Waterloo, I believe). It is getting out of hand to the extent that connectivity is getting to be a total menace. All the for sake of advertisers. F**K then all.
Even better, for multifunction devices, the scanner stops working if you're "out of ink"
The last HP product I bought was an F300 MFD, which decided it was "out of ink", even though the (HP-branded only) ink cartridges were not empty. And then I learned the scanner refused to work.
"Printed on my Brother HL-5250DN Printer."
Hey Satnad,
How about dropping all support for HP printers other than the current ones? (list attached) with the next release of W11. That means W10 as well going to an early grave which is what you want isn't it?
We are fed up spending money updating old drivers so we are going to purge our website of all old stuff.
Do we have a deal?
Yours HP.
My elderly neighbor bought an HP printer thinking it was a good deal. Refused to print, so RTFM and called me.
Step 1: Download & install bloat ware
Step 2: Give your network wifi credentials to HP.
Step 3: Go brain dead and dumbly give them your credit card info too, as a requirement for the 'Next' button.
Step 4: Connect printer to your now compromised wifi credentials.
Step 5: Use the crapware to turn on the USB port.
Step 6: Print out your bank statements to watch your accounts get drained for unwanted ink cartridges.
> install bloat ware ... network wifi credentials to HP...... give them your credit card info too, .... crapware to turn on the USB port. ... watch your accounts get drained for ....
So who IS decent today? My Brother MFC-J825 has given me no crap, but I notice it is over 10 years old and only an HPLJ 2P lasts that long. (Or a Diablo......) And a cursory glance tells me Brother is all over the Subscription idea.
Epsom used to be wretched software, and I hold long grudges.
Had a gov-spec Lexmark once, horrible experience.
There aren't that many brands in the consumer printer racket.
Light duty TROUBLE-FREE duplex color, prefer La$er or a very waterproof ink. $400??
Subscriptions are great for delivering a continuous stream of new and interesting things. I'll subscribe for maps, news, movies, music, and entertainment. I'll subscribe to things that need external upkeep, like my fiber optic line.
Subscriptions for mundane features that never change after purchase? That proven plan for failure is so old that no investors should still be buying into it. Customers don't.
HP does everything possible to mine gold from sale of its inkjet cartridges, with cartridge expiration dates and refusal to allow 3rd party cartridges. Why would anyone in their right mind buy an HP inkjet device? Ignorance? Some nonsensical brand loyalty? Nothing HP can do for its shabby treatment of customers and its effect on HP's reputation as a printer vendor, except change, treating customers like real people. And you know that will not happen.
Fun Fact: HP is 10s of BILLIONS in debt, but they've "restructured" the debt to hide it from the generally available company status reports. (it's hidden in shell companies and "affliliates" which used to be HP departments)
Company is collapsing fast, and is in fact poised to be split up into smaller units and sold to whoever-will-buy-it.
Printers are a dead end. Even the UK Government has ended its HP printer contract, (mainly due to the 'analysis' clauses..which means HP takes a copy of everything printed over the compulsory network/internet connection) and 1000s of printers won't be renewed as they're expensive, generally unused and pointless.
...and the otherwise fine 3rd-party cartridges stopped working
I've never bought another HP product, either printer, laptop, or whatever else they make
"Install this important security update to protect your printer from hackers" => "Nice cartridges you had, pity something 'happened' to them".
I worked for Xerox when they led the world and where are they now? They knew more about paper handling and printing than most but they did not pick up on the treads. Oddly they said the paperless office could happen but it was people that had to accept it first.
Not long before I retired I still had a company that printed emails for the users ...
After 30+ years in the tech industry, and now owning and running my own small IT support business, I was an HP fan for a long time. But no more. I went off them a bit during Carly's shenanigans, but thought they'd learned their lesson, but apparently not.
I used to recommend HP printers and computers (desktops and laptops), as they used to be bullet proof and reliable.
I don't recommend either to clients anymore. Especially HP printers.
The printers themselves aren't that bad (physical quality-wise) but the software nowadays is total trash and their data harvesting under the guise of 'security' is bollocks.
Then there's the PCs and laptops. They used to just work and last for a long time. Their consumer hardware is now mostly cheap crap and a lot of the lower-end business machines seem to heading the same way. And don't get me started on their bloatware.
I have to admit, that I'm typing this on my 4 yr old HP Spectre 13" x360, which is a great 2-in1 laptop. But, HP have never provided driver or BIOS updates for Windows 11, so I just have to hope it'll continue to work with Windows into the future as well. For a laptop that cost so much when new, I was hoping they'd provide more than 12 months of driver/BIOS updates. If it stops being Windows compatible, I'll probably drop Linux on it instead.
I've now moved onto ASUS as my preferred brand of computers, as I've found them to be as good, if not better, quality-wise to the HPs of old. They seem to provide a good range of hardware, both in the consumer and business markets, at pretty good prices. When it's time to replace my Spectre, I'll be looking at something from ASUS to replace it with.
I have also completely switched my printer allegiance in the last 5 or so years as well. I used to hate Brother printers due to appearing to be flimsy and poorly made. And I used to love HP printers. Bit that all changed too. Their software/apps are very simple and easy to use as well.
Brother is now my preferred brand. Their quality has improved greatly, and I just find that their software generally just works. Not like HP, where, for some reason, they now have numerous different methods of installing the printer and it's associates apps etc. And I usually end up having to try at least two of their methods, before the printer will actually be installed and work. Then there's all the bullshit of needing an HP account and the other HP nonsense with the built in expiry chips etc.
As a personal consumer ho is the last printer I would buy based on my corporate experience. While corporates are essentially pushing the snooze button on complaints and prices, at some point they will wake up and ditch hp. HP is thinking like Kodak and Swiss watch makers.
Far better to copy the pharma model when generics become available. Either cut your prices to a smaller premium or set up their own cheaper alternative and keep the market with a better product. We all have had experience of cheap ink.
Holding people to ransom is not a long term strategy for success.
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