Amazon overcharges shoppers with Buy Box algorithm, fresh lawsuit claims Amazon has been sued by two customers in the United States who claim the internet titan artificially inflates prices, hitting shoppers in the wallet. Each product listed on the gigantic e-souk usually has a so-called Buy Box on the right-hand side of the page encouraging folks to put items straight into their virtual carts. …
TIL: if you buy a brand-name charger on Amazon, and when it arrives it turns out to be fraudulent, and you say so in a review and then return the product..... Amazon will claim "we unfortunately could not verify that your account purchased this item on Amazon." Even though I have all the Ordered, Shipped, and even the "Your review is live" emails. A friend comments: "inneresting way to protect makers of shoddy merch."
Yes, and the same thing if your stuff has counterfeit chips.
I bought a couple of OBD-II -> Bluetooth devices, which are driven by ELM-327 chips. The brand name one worked. The cheap Chinese POS... sort of worked.
I did the procedure on elmelectronics.com and sure enough it was "known counterfeit mfgr'd by Chinese company xxxx"
I described this all to Amazon and they "investigated" and came back and said "the seller says it's not counterfeit" which apparently made it all fine!
So I lodged an FTC complaint. Amazon emailed me and threatened to cancel my account, so I filed another FTC complaint.
"Don't know if you are in the UK or across the pond, but here, the retailer is responsible for the quality of the goods. So it is themselves who they are protecting, not the manufacturers."
Actually the way scAmazon protect themselves in the UK is to insist they are a "marketplace", and although you buy stuff through their web site, and they take payment, they insist some third party is legally the retailer.
That loophole should be quickly and firmly closed in respect of both product safety and consumer rights, but do you expect this government to do anything about it?
I've been caught out with that. Bought an electrical item through Amazon marketplace that failed after a couple of months. The third party vendor more or less said tough luck as it was outside the 30 day return period. I complained to Amazon and they totally ignored me. Since then I make a point of buying such items from the high-street. Amazon have already lost out on a couple of grands worth of purchases. My relationship with Amazon has really soured over the last few months.
As to "Amazon is only the marketplace", for stuff not actually sold by them it is quite correct and not a loophole.
As to faulty goods, if the seller is outside of the UK then in practical terms you have no rights. If they are UK based then you have the sale of goods and services act (or whatever has replaced it). Of course, if they turn out to be a fake business then that's tough, and something you might claim Amazon is guilty of enabling.
Since I've cancelled my Prime subscription most items I look at now will cost £4.99 for shipping if the order value is less than £25, with very, very few items having any option of free 3 or 4 day shipping. In most cases though, eBay will have the same item listed at the same price with free shipping anyway so Amazon lose out on a sale.
It's taking a while, but I am weaning myself off Amazon and it's instant gratification business model.
Still far better than ebay or Google's retail shop Paystore credits/gift cards they'll insist are fraudulent, and then when proved they are not, they claim there is a 'problem with your account' and thus the gift card should be discussed with retailer.
Which large international (mostly USA) sellers are not arrogant chancers that ignore the local laws?
Amazon don't make it easy to compare different sellers of the same product. Sometimes it's not until you get to the checkout that you find the real delivery costs.
Due to their sneaky pricing practises and reputation for knock-off goods I'm rarely clicking on an Amazon link in search results anymore.
In the musical 'Oliver' there is a well known song 'I'll do anything'.
That seems to be the game that AMZN are playing these days.
Then there is the Prime Scam. Something that says 'eligible for Prime Delivery' before you add it to your basket suddenly becomes 'delivery extra' when you get to the checkout.
Then there is their 'dynamic pricing' model that is based upon your IP location. Use a VPN and see for yourself. If they think that you live in a rich address then the prices go up a bit. Not much but a but.
If you don't buy and come back later you may find that the price is higher even though there are thousands available.
All tricks to relieve you of as much money as possible.
The Bezos Tat Boutique is only used by my family as a last resort these days because of this sort of thing.
have ceased to be my go-to company for buying stuff. To use the new word, I'm sick of the "enshitification" of their service. Constantly shoving the suggestion of a Prime subscription in my face at each and every opportunity, to giving poor search results and poor customer service if you need to return anything, especially from a third party vendor. They ignore the UK's 12 month warranty laws and just won't respond to complaints. So feck you Amazon, I've gone back to buying stuff from the high-street, at least I can take things back if faulty and not be ignored.
"Enshitification" of the tech sector really has become a thing. I'd had a Google account for a number of years but only used the gmail account for non-important stuff and remembering my music taste on YouTube, but now they refuse to let me log in unless I give them my phone number, claiming it is for my own benefit for security purposes, bollocks, it is so you can associate more of my online activity to the profile you hold for me. Tough luck, you're not having my phone number, so my Google account will be left to rot.
Facebook can't tell the difference between legitimate posts and spam. So I got loads of shit in my feed for crap like crypto currency traders, investment scams, relationship scams, and magic incantations and spells to bewitch a lover, yet some of my own normal, group specific posts were rejected by their bots for reasons unknown. I gave up and deleted my Facebook account in the end.
As for X/Twitter, that is just an open sewer of shit from top to bottom, though I'm sure the leadership will find even more ways to increase the shit content.
Unfortunately that won't work as Google say they will verify the number given either by sending a text message code to it, or in the case of a land line, a spoken code. I'm not overly concerned, I never trusted Google enough to use gmail for anything serious. They burned me with that once before a number of years ago after I set up POP3 on my then Gmail account and they suspended it shortly afterwards claiming it had "unusual activity". Any "free" service can be rescinded at any time, so can't be relied on.
-- but now they refuse to let me log in unless I give them my phone number, --
I had something similar. A number of accounts set up over the years and generally used when I HAVE to give an email account to enable me to give some company my money (just in case and we won't tell anyone else honest). These accounts have been accessed by Thunderbird since the advent of Oauth2 and one day I couldn't open one of the accounts, either via Thunderbird or online. I disabled checking it on Thunderbird and just left it to fester. Couple of months later I'm allowed to access via Thunderbird again.
Its happened to one of the other accounts. Same process.
So if you can be without the account for a while just stop trying and let it fester and Google may, after a while, decide its OK to use it again. No idea why though.
I suppose the Buy Box thing is a bit opaque and deceptive. But on my short list of vile ideas perpetrated by retailers and marketing creeps, it's right around entry number 1043 or 1044. And unlike Amazon's diligent and persistent attempts to persuade/trick me into signing up for Amazon Prime, I suspect any bias/unfairness might be inadvertent rather than deliberate.
I must say that on the whole, my experiences with Amazon have been positive. It has proven to be a pretty reliable source for stuff that isn't readily available locally. The one screwup I experienced -- ordered blue jeans. got a red womans bathing suit. (Doubt it would fit. Hate swimming pools. And red's not my color) was handled expeditiously by an adequately intelligent, English speaking, human. And they didn't route my phone call through some badly designed voice recognition system with poor comprehension, an IQ of about 30 and an attitude problem.
So, I think I'll continue to use them. At least until they do something a lot worse than this.
> But on my short list of vile ideas perpetrated by retailers and marketing creeps, it's right around entry number 1043 or 1044
You beat them with the stick you have.
They specifically tailor their shady practices to skirt the law as close as possible, so it's really hard to do anything effective about the really vile stuff.
I'm not defending Amazon, but based on the blurry "evidence" screenshot posted in the article - the other sellers price is higher anyway.
And Amazon do make the effort to show alternative sellers prices for a specific product, as well as comparable products, after you've selected a product from their (crap) search results.
(I mean, search for hand SANITIZER, then select a hand SOAP displayed in the "featured" results?)
I have experienced good and bad. Whats definitely bad is the amazon search function and it gets much worse when you set a price limit. The "buy box" imprecision however is much less enfuriating than the hidden shipping costs that only pop up at checkout, so to really find the cheapest option you need to go through the hassle to proceed to ckeckout for each option and thats just poor and lazy design that never changed.
The "adaptive" pricing also isnt nice. so theres another bit of unneeeded hassle, find the thing you search for without logging in, then login for the same thing with a non prime and a prime account to compare the level of RipOffiNess.
> so to really find the cheapest option you need to go through the hassle to proceed to ckeckout for each option
Amazon prime seems to resolve that little problem (on Amazon.co.uk) just remember the goods that can be shipped via Prime aren’t necessarily the cheapest or fastest delivery. Prime also seems to skew the buy box to favour Amazon products.
That someone can start a lawsuit based on the fact that they have no comprehension of the principle of caveat emptor is a sad reflection on how increasingly stupid mankind is becoming. It seems to fall in nicely with the modern trend of being unable to take responsibility for your own actions. "It's not my fault I pressed the 'Buy now' button and got ripped off!" Actually, it is.
Amazon often have prices which are 30% higher, or more, than other web shops. Unless the Prime free shipping makes it worthwhile, I don't buy from Amazon if they cost more. Anyone who doesn't check is either too well off to care or lacking some grey matter. I don't see anything deceptive about Amazon listing some deals in preference to others, even when the preferred listing is more expensive. They are a merchant, and should be regarded as such. I certainly don't trust any merchant to act in my best interests and if that's hard to understand then you probably need adult supervision.
>They are a merchant, and should be regarded as such.<
Amazon itself insist on being a marked place provider only unless you buy from them directly. The issue is that Amazon is not providing an even play field for all participants in that market but (unsurprisingly) shows a preference for Amazon making the sale.If the market place is big enough to distort the competition regulators have to do something.
In my opinion AMZN should have been forced to split off the market place as an independant company that sells its services using the same rules for Amazon and other merchants in that market place.
Anyone have an idea why the phrase "regulatory capture" keeps popping up in my mind?
Their on-time delivery is only about 90%, not the "98.9%" type levels they claim. (98.9% is what they claimed for 2019.) We've been tracking their on-time delivery rate at my work for a couple of years. They also often change the "promised by" date after receipt the order from what it was when the "Place your order" was displayed which makes their on-time delivery rate look better.
Yup. I had that. I came to order something on a Friday with guaranteed Saturday delivery. At the order page, it promised the next day delivery. After the order had been accepted and validated, guaranteed delivery on Monday.
Went to chat with somebody, and to my chagrin I did it in English because the "I need help in English" was a lot less of a nightmare than trying to find the relevant "Contact us" for an order...
...and they tried to tell me that their stock control system hadn't been correctly updated...yet this update mysteriously happened between looking at my shopping basket and paying? Pull the other one, it has bells attached.
Really, Amazon, treating your customers like complete twats, not a good look.
In order to sue someone you need to prove that you've been damaged in some way. I can't see how "artificially inflating prices" is a tort -- its Standard Operating Procedure for businesses, especially if they have market power. You see it everyday -- where I live I see it in inflated prices for food and fuel, for example.
Obviously that doesn't mean that its morally right but then this is capitalism for you. The job of an enterprise is first and foremost "to enhance shareholder value" or, to put it more succinctly, "to make as much money as possible from as little investment as possible". The Econ 101 view that its all about competition, supplying the best possible product at the lowest possible price, is the stuff of unicorns and rainbows, it can happen but generally these are small businesses who are struggling in the same environment as you and I. Still, it does say something about the mindset that would even contemplate such a lawsuit -- 'weird', maybe?
It's not the inflating prices, it's the deliberately deceptive trick of showing a price that people might assume is the best price and deliberately making better prices less easy to find. It cuts both ways - from what's written, it's clear that it's a shakedown of sellers as well - nice online shop you have there, pity if your products were hidden from buyers, you'd better pay us to make sure that doesn't happen.
Amazon lets you keep items of interest in a holding area known as "Cart". Have noticed a disturbing phenomenon: the cost of some items moved into the 'Cart' somehow, mysteriously, tend to increase in price once they've been placed there (and, yes; as a test, I've removed items from the 'Cart', and placed them into the "Save for Later" area. The price went back down within a week).
> the cost of some items moved into the 'Cart' somehow, mysteriously, tend to increase in price
The price (not the cost).
Over at eBay (a den of different snakes), twice this month I had the opposite experience. Put a 'vintage' buy-now blanket on WatchList, two days later I get an "offer" for 20% lower price. Two out of three tries.
Amazon also plays a game of stuff in Wishlist. Prices go up and down randomly, usually just a few pennies. One item has dropped 38% in 2 years but is the kinda item which does that.
Apple openly overcharging for everything vs Amazon in this case. But quite a fewer commentators here dislike Apple. Maybe Amazon should open a separate luxury e-store just for those who enjoy parting with their money and be proud of it.
Name idea: Amazing.com or just Prime.com, which seems like a right move into a separate customer category.
Thieving bastards do it based on who you login as too. I was logged in as my normal user and said why not check the save up to 15% savings with business account. So I log into that account the price went from $345 to $405 and the $40 coupon to clip disappeared as well. I had already clued into the scam of the what page you land on depends on the price you pay they do. You damn well better make sure you use different search than theirs for the lowest price offered the scummy parasite bastards. I make certain to buy nothing from them except when it the best possible price doing it. Oh and the missing link to cancel the free Prime shipping they have started to pull as well, had to use that other parasite corporation Google to find that page.
This is old news.
I have noticed another Amazon scam, look around at a product a few times over a few days... and suddenly its not available locally but available from somewhere like Germany, I live in AU, with a postage cost even though i have prime. If i buy it mysteriously gets here in a day or two which is obviously too fast as i dont live in a big city...
I would much rather Amazon list their own price with a note beside it saying that alternative vendors may offer a better price, and if they don't carry an item, to redirect you to the list of sellers rather than promoting one picked according to undisclosed metrics.
Why? Simple...
Sent from France (I live in France), okay.
Sent from Germany, good (and quick).
Sent from Italy? 50-50 whether it'll ever arrive.
Sent from the UK? Be wary, if they mess up the customs form there could be duty involved.
Sent from the US? Okay, but takes forever (what the hell does USPS do that they're slower than the rubbishy free postage from China?).
Sent from China? Takes ages, don't expect any sort of aftersales support.
So just show me the list and I'll decide for myself.
> what the hell does USPS do that they're slower than the rubbishy free postage from China?
USPS "subsidizes" China Post.
Historically the rich countries support post from poor countries. In days of actual Mail Order, it often balanced. And China was always one of the poor countries.
USPS has its own problems, not entirely self-inflicted. Is a terrible place to work. Meanwhile China worked cooperatively to boost export sales, including taking advantage of historical Postal Union agreements.
China's sweetheart deal will be trimmed at some future Postal Union vote. Meanwhile China ships for free. And its workers incentivized to move the mail quickly.
If there is a seller selling something for less than Amazon, my assumption is always that there is a serious potential for fraud. Especially if it is something that would be easily faked.
I love these lawsuits. "I'm too stupid to look for the best price, Mr. Government, please punish the seller for my stupidity!"
IT was like the TurboTax lawsuit! I couldn't have bene any more obvious what you needed to qualify for free! People just did not bother to read and understand. So, the government sues and wins to protect the stupid!
Why doesn't someone go after the dietary supplement industry, now these people are scum! Or these apparel companies (Many are owned under the same corp) that trick people into a $60 monthly fee if they don't spend money every month!
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