China floats strict screentime limits and content crimps for kids

The Chinese government has floated a plan to limit the amount of time minors can spend using electronic devices and the content they can access, plus a plan to ensure the nation's entire content ecosystem produces age-appropriate material. The plan, outlined on Tuesday by the Central Cyberspace Affairs Commission, proposes …

[Pascal Monett]

"parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

I seriously doubt that because apparently parents everywhere are quite happy foisting screens into the hands of their sprogs in order to keep them quiet.

Limiting children's screen time would apparently mean taking up parents' time occupying said children and we can't have that, now can we ?

Of course, there would be the option of raising children to be capable of occupying themselves, but that's silly talk these days.

[Joe W]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

The other parents would like the screen time limit for those kids as well... I have a feeling that those "cellphone babysitter kids" have a weird attention span, are more... hyperactive (or whatever you would call that), among some weird social behaviour, because how would you learn that without interacting with other humans. Plus this screen time limit would basically instantly close at least some of the gap in reading and listening comprehension that all lament about. Seriously, those kids are lagging their classmates as they enter school already, and no program will close that gap. Ever. They also tend to be less interested in things, they tend to have stopped asking "why this?" "why that?" early on, because apparently nobody bothered to try to answer those questions, and being curious is discouraged. Which is a shame, and not the kids' fault (and thus a subject that triggers me - c'mon, don't neglect your kids!).

I'm not sure about the two hours for 17-year-olds, I know I was gaming and programming more than that. The other numbers I can see, from my own experience with my (and other people's) kids. After exceeding the time allotment they tend to start behaving really.... weird (and not in a good way). I cannot recall how much TV we were allowed to watch as kids, there was a (similar?) limit.

[ChoHag]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

> I'm not sure about the two hours for 17-year-olds

Do you want to sew the seeds of a revolution? Because this is how you sew the seeds of a revolution.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

Do you want to sew the seeds of a revolution?

Haberdashers of the world, unite! You have nothing to lose but your chain stitches!

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

The 17 years old, locked out of their devices for all but two hours a day, grew increasingly restless.

Egged on by their fellows, they started to leave meet together, many seeing their screen time friends face to face for the first time. As they found common cause, the meetings grew in volume, forcing them to gather outside their parents' flats: they found long-abandoned youth centres and sports halls. This was becoming A Movement. To hide their true intent, the teens took advantage of the equipment in the halls and started sports teams, arranging tournaments across the city, across the region and then across the entire country, allowing The Word to be spread without fear of communications being intercepted.

Sympathetic parents left out books on politics, rhetoric, planning, engineering: the youth devoured these, fining in each nuggets of helpful knowledge. Evening discussion groups brought together all the subjects and synthesised strategy.

Within a year, The Movement was unstoppable. The teens were fit, strong, disciplined, educated, organised. They went public.

The only dissenting voices were heard from the manufacturers of mobile devices and the vendors of services on same: with all their time spent in the meetings, from half a dozen at a time to a sports audience of thousands, the teens no longer used their devices for anything beyond texting dates and times.

The New Revolution was complete.

[GruntyMcPugh]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

Yeah, two hours for 17 year olds? It took us that long to type a game into my mates BASIC compiler. Yes, type, he had a Sharp MZ80K, games on tape were like Unicorn poo.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

"raising children to be capable of occupying themselves"

Apparently that's a lost art. I haven's met lately any children capable of surviving over a minute without being actively entertained, and a simple book (even comic book) won't cut it, it takes at least bloody gladiator fights to mildly entertain them, for a couple minutes.

We're raising generations of unimaginative, absent-minded, drama-starved psychopaths. No wonder they're tethered to "social media" and readily adopt any silly conspiracy theory out there: They're junkies, they simply can't live without being fed a constant stream of drama.

[DS999]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

Whither are the manly vigour and athletic appearance of our forefathers flown? Can these be their legitimate heirs? Surely, no; a race of effeminate, self-admiring, emaciated fribbles can never have descended in a direct line from the heroes of Potiers and Agincourt…

[catprog]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

Yep. The moment kids are let out of the parent's sight the child protection service come down hard. (only slightly exaggerated)

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

Interesting hypothesis. However, my anecdotal evidence is that all the conspiracy theorists I know are 60 year old or more, the result of a purely bookish education. Also, as far as psychopaths go, history has proven that cell phones aren't needed to have them. Maybe if those of old had had phones, they'd been so absent-minded as to be unable to complete their crimes?

Not to mention of course that what you're blaming phones for today was decades ago quite literally blamed on those comic books you think kids should read now.

I can easily imagine that in your next life, you'll be posting something like "what with the kids today and their gurglezoids, they're addicted, a simple phone (even the latest iPhone SUX+) won't cut it"

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

Only older conspiracy theorists are vocal, actively proselytizing. Young believers just believe the "truth", so you don't spot them easily, unless that specific theme gets somehow mentioned, in which case they go nuts just like the old ones.

Also I don't remember claiming that phones create psychopaths, that's a fallacy. What I say is that the lack of proper socialization of young teenagers, and its replacement by angry internet memes and blind resentment is what does it.

One thing you're right about though, I am a bitter old fogey...

[WereWoof]

Re: "parents everywhere might just welcome the Communist approach"

There are times when I think The Human race is heading the ay of the Solarians. (Asimov - The Naked sun).

[msknight]

Microsoft have been floating parental controls also...

...however they've been sending the notices to the e-mails of the accounts... in other words, the notices have probably gone to the kids instead of the parents. Microsoft probably don't care... box ticked from their point of view, and the regulator is probably clueless as to what's happened.

I have tried e-mailing a copy to el-reg but apparently my e-mails have been blocked, so, meh.

[doublelayer]

Re: Microsoft have been floating parental controls also...

And how would you like them to identify the parents? If a child sets up an account and has control of the email address, what option does Microsoft have to identify them and then locate their parents to provide suggestions to them? The only method I've seen that works is to require proof of identity every time an account is set up, which I oppose for privacy reasons. Children also don't need to learn very much to understand that pretending to be adults can be more helpful. I had that figured out early in my youth: if I register on this site and say I was born in 1963, then they are fine with it, so why not do that? It also helped because my parents were clear with me about being careful about entering my birth date or other personal information on random sites.

A workable alternative is for parents to help their children set up accounts and are honest about the risks. Parents can also put on their own controls. Yes, there's more work involved in doing that rather than assuming that someone will make a one-click method that perfectly handles everything, but being a parent involves taking on some work.

[rajivdx]

Re: Microsoft have been floating parental controls also...

Umm... Microsoft sends emails to both the parents and the kids. This is good because the kids know exactly what their parents are being told - namely how long, what apps, what websites and what they searched for on google. Works like a treat across all Microsoft devices including the now defunct phone. Microsoft has experience doing this for almost 30 years with Active Directory and their implementation is somewhat better than Apple and Google's.

Apple particularly has lots of loopholes, where my 8 year old found that if she puts Youtube into card view, she can continue to watch videos for hours and hours bypassing any time limits - she also found she could access camera and photos from always allowed apps like iMessage simply by trying to attach an image.

Google's implementation is the worst I have seen.

[Anonymous Coward]

"We're raising generations of unimaginative, absent-minded, drama-starved psychopaths."

The return of dumb phones? Teens ditch easy internet access for mental health [May, 2023] Is dumb the new smart? Young people are starting to ditch their smartphones as they look for new ways to unplug. Spurred by a desire to "digital detox," there's a growing movement among Generation Z to do away with smartphones and revert back to "dumb phones" like old-school flip or slide phones.

[DS999]

Re: "We're raising generations of unimaginative, absent-minded, drama-starved psychopaths."

Its another counterculture thing like goth or punk or previous niches among younger people as far as back history was written who don't want to follow the masses and instead be seen to be stand out as "different" from their peers. Presumably it is the kids who had already rejected social media, this is just a visible manifestation of it they can make sure others will see.

[Mockup1974]

Sounds like computers are exempt? Good. Maybe kids will learn some tech skills then like us 30 year old boomers did (like touch typing, file management, spreadsheets, maybe even Linux or programming)

[Anonymous Coward]

For most Chinese people, smartphones are all they have to run applications. Computers are sometimes used as a second device by middle-class families that can afford them, and the middle class is still a minority in China.

Smartphones have become a necessity of life in China, everything revolves around their apps. One more recent development are smartwatches, that many of those middle-class families are buying for their kids to be able to locate them in real time and call them.

[vtcodger]

It'll be interesting

It'll be interesting. I'm not sure how much how much experience the folks proposing these controls have with kids.

The controls probably won't work any better than most things digital. There will probably be ways to get around the controls. Probably lots of them. And even with a remarkably low birthrate, there are a lot of kids in China. Hundreds of millions of kids in China. Some of them will be pretty clever. So I reckon we can expect that some kid somewhere in the Middle Kingdom will quickly figure out how to bypass the controls. And I can pretty much guarantee that within 48 hours of that happening, half the kids in China will know how to bypass the controls. It might take as much as a week for the knowledge to diffuse out to most of the rest.

[GruntyMcPugh]

Re: It'll be interesting

Indeed, my initial thought was I spent most weekends with my best mate when I was a teen, so if we'd had a two hour limit, we'd have pooled resources, and spent two hours streaming or whatever on one device, then two hours on the other. Just like we used to pool resources when we were 17 year olds and we each rented a VHS then settled down for a sword and sorcery cheese fest many Saturday nights.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: It'll be interesting

we'd have pooled resources

Innovation training. Here we go. Maybe parental controls should involve infinite number of obstacles to motivate their kids to think.

[Dan 55]

Re: It'll be interesting

I assume it'll be more difficult to bypass if parental controls must be built into the social network by law.

[Doctor Syntax]

Re: It'll be interesting

The parents will probably ask the kids how to bypass those.

[Howard Sway]

many parents reading this article would find China's approach appealing

I guess they must REALLY want to make sure that their kids don't end up working in IT then.

Of course, once their "screen time" is limited, they'll probably just go and watch TV instead.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: many parents reading this article would find China's approach appealing

their kids don't end up working in IT

Maybe the opposite is true. From personal experience, young persons spending time playing games sometimes have zero knowledge of Excel, Word, or other useful tools. Also they have no patience to dig deeper, using brute force to solve a problem.

[doublelayer]

Re: many parents reading this article would find China's approach appealing

And some people who are great at IT don't use Word very much if at all because they're doing things other than writing prose. Not playing games is no guarantee that they'll learn something else, and using Word is no guarantee they'll become IT literate. A lot of office workers know how to use Office, at least the basics, but if you've ever worked in office IT, you know how that doesn't translate into other knowledge.

In addition, I know several people who got into technology, often software development, by playing and modifying games. That wasn't my path into it, and I'm not that into gaming now or in my youth, but I know enough people who are good at it who started that way that I have to argue against your generalization. Depending on what they're doing, games can also be used to teach IT skills. Consider, for example, the many Raspberry Pi projects which are based around games of some kind, and that in order to get those into a playable state, the person will have to learn some Linux commands and IT basics, and then they'll still have a computer on which they can continue to test those skills. This is no guarantee that everyone who likes videogames will get IT skills out of it, but you can't really guarantee any of the related behaviors. People who like to read books may not become great at writing or the artistic use of language. People who enjoy music may never gain the ability to play or compose it. However, the potential is still there for some to gain those skills by starting with something they enjoy.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: many parents reading this article would find China's approach appealing

Chinese TV is guaranteeing a very harmonious and educative program, now matter what channel you pick.

[Anonymous Coward]

Coinciding interest with the West

Thought-through detailed policy takes time and effort to develop. It is much more than political talk and promises.

To save time, such policy could be translated and copy-pasted with minor changes. This will also simplify the task for Apples and Googles.

[Doctor Syntax]

Re: Coinciding interest with the West

"Thought-through detailed policy takes time and effort to develop. It is much more than political talk and promises."

By definition policies come from the politicians. Don't count on them getting any further than that.

[martinusher]

Meanwhile, the Guardian angle.....

....is that these proposals have "hit tech shares".

We have a collision between what's good for business (shareholders) and what's good for society. It will be interesting to see who wins.

[DS999]

Re: Meanwhile, the Guardian angle.....

China's leaders don't care if the share price for the parent companies for WeChat etc. take a hit from proposals like this, because there is no opposition party to paint it as their fault and hurl complaints of "anti business policies".

[Cuddles]

What's actually new?

Isn't this all already available in stock Android? Parental controls already allow setting max total screen time as well as preventing use at specific times, is locked behind a separate password to prevent it being disabled, and is part of the OS settings so it can't be hidden or uninstalled. There are also a variety of "wellbeing" options like bedtime mode that do things like restricting use at certain times or giving reminders to take a break. I assume iPhones have similar options. The problem isn't that these tools don't exist, it's that people either don't care about them or actively don't want them - sticking kids in front of a screen to keep them quiet is a deliberate choice by many. Since the whole proposal appears to be optional on the part of the parents, what makes anyone think they'd decide to use this new mode when they don't currently use the virtually identical options that already exist?