Microsoft pulls Windows 10/11 installation websites in Russia Microsoft has blocked the installation of Windows 10 and 11 in Russia from the company's official website, Russian state media reported on Sunday. Users within the country confirmed that attempts to download Windows 10 resulted in a 404 error message. pic.twitter.com/DRzrr3922Q — Monsterjeep (@monsterjeep) June 19, 2022 …
Russians like things made in Russia. Who knows, 10 years from now when the Putin stupidity is finally over and things get back to normal... well how DO you say 'Windows' in Russian? (it could be a legit fork of something like ReactOS that actually WORKS)
(Right now it's Putin that's the problem - Russians are pretty smart and will not just put up with this)
Russians like things made in Russia
I just said this to my Wife and she laughed.
Not sure how many Russians you know, but I'm married to one and have spent lots of time in Russia. This is not my experience at all. Most of the Russians I know are deeply cynical of all things made in Russia and drive Western (or Eastern) cars, have Hotpoint and Samsung washing machines and fridges and a house that is chocked full of Ikea furniture. And those who can't afford the Western made car or the Ikea furniture are deeply jealous of those who can. Made In Russia is the last thing they look for when purchasing anything (except maybe food produce).
well how DO you say 'Windows' in Russian?
Окна (pronounced Okna)
I'd like to see an OS called 'Okna'. Be interesting to see what MS would do about it!
Russians are pretty smart and will not just put up with this
This is exactly why I support these sanctions even though they have a direct impact on myself, my wife and my extended family. Most Russians I've met just want a quiet life, so they keep their heads down and try not to get noticed. They absorb the state media without question. The overriding opinion seems to be that the Government knows best, so if they say Ukraine must be invaded for the good of Russia, then so be it. Although it's not their fault in any way, maybe impacting their lives a little will shake them into doing something. My wife however is not convinced this will work and I bow to her better knowledge of the country and the population. It's the younger generation who grew up in post Soviet Russia we have to put our hope in. Most of my Wife's friends still in Russia are anti Putin and anti war (the ones who engage in politics to any degree anyway), so there is hope. But in the current climate, actually doing anything about those beliefs carries a great deal of danger.
"(Right now it's Putin that's the problem - Russians are pretty smart and will not just put up with this)"
The smart Russians are either in jail or under threat of arrest if they speak up against a tyrant.
The obvious next step is for VPN companies to block Russian source IP's from using their services. Blocking Chinese ones as well will stop my firewall from overuse.
Its like pulling McDonalds; its actually doing them a favor.
When you look at the list of stuff they can't get from us and compare it with the stuff that we can't get from them you realize that someone didn't quite think things through before starting this (and it wasn't the Russians). Because our popular start time for history is now late February we forget about the steady drip, drip, drip of sanctions that's been building up for literally years, giving the Russians ample warning and time to take precautions.
There is very little, apart from oil and gas, that we really need from Russia. We might struggle for a couple of years, we'll probably have to burn coal here in Europe again, and keep nuclear stations running. There will also be an even bigger incentive to move to renewable energy. It's much quicker to deploy solar panels at domestic and commercial level, and generate power close to where it is needed, and where no planning permission is required.
Russia might cause some economic pain to western Europe for a year or two. But it is a drop in the ocean compared to the pain they're going to experience. They will try to source from China where possible, but Taiwan, Korea, Japan are all on side with sanctions, as is the US, Canada and western Europe. They will simply not be able to get a lot of the electronics they need, as well as a lot of sophisticated machinery. Parts for aircraft and cars are already a problem there.
Fossil fuels was already a doomed industry, with perhaps a couple of decades left at most in developed countries. Russia has just moved that timescale forward, it is destroying its own market. The africans and indians might still be buying fossil fuels in 20 years time, but the market will be more than oversupplied, and the Russians and the head choppers will be competing to drop prices to silly levels.
The Russian economy is smaller than Italy. There is no way they win a trade war with the west. They might be able to keep making something approximating a big mac, but they ain't going to figure out how to make complex machine tools, semi-conductors, etc. and certainly not in the next few months.
They can probably survive, but they'll be effectively back where the soviet union was in the 1980s, with backward technology, a planned economy, restrictions on freedom and travel and fighting a war they simply cannot afford.
Dodgy governments, you say?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opposition_Platform_%E2%80%94_For_Life
On 20 June 2022 the Eighth Administrative Court of Appeal banned the party.The property of the party and all its branches were transferred to the state. The decision was open to appeal at the Supreme Court of Ukraine within 20 days. At the time Opposition Platform – For Life was one of two of the 20 March 2022 suspended parties that was subject to an attempt of getting banned in court, Opposition Platform – For Life was the only party to defend and participate in the case. (The other party was the Progressive Socialist Party of Ukraine.)
Zelensky probably shouldn't be giving BoJo ideas. No idea how much Labour has in the way of assets though.
But another example of interesting times. West says 'No McDonalds or Gucci for you!' and Russia just creates domestic alternatives. Which I guess it could also do with software. It's the country that gave the world Tetris after all. Then it'd be a trust issue, ie would RusOs contain all the 'telemetry' and spyware that Windows and Android include.
Ukrainian politics is weird like that, but again from wiki-
Opposition Platform – For Life was one of several political parties suspended by the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine on 20 March 2022, along with Derzhava, Left Opposition, Nashi, Opposition Bloc, Party of Shariy, Progressive Socialist Party of Ukraine, Socialist Party of Ukraine, Union of Leftists, and the Volodymyr Saldo Block
Nothing says free & fair democracy quite like banning opposition parties, and charging political opponents with 'high treason'. Or jailing / attempting to charge your predecessor with the same 'crime'. Although perhaps Ukraine copied the US on that one.
But it's also a name that perhaps translate very well. Did they always intend just to be in opposition, never in power? And why would they be opposed to life? But such is politics. Meanwhile, in other not news, Ukraine attacked an oil refinery inside Russia, and also a gas platform off Crimea. Suprised the Bbc hasn't mentioned the potential catastrophe from fossil fuel leaks into the Baltic. Or that attacking purely civil infrastructure is of course a war crime. Or just a waste of missiles that Ukraine claims to be desperately short of.
The rest will become history. Pretty much every time we've attempted to sanction an enemy into the stone age, the enemy's responded by becoming more self-sufficient. Meanwhile, the same sanctions have tended to expose reliance on the stuff we're sanctioning. So no Win11 upgrades for Russia. Ohnoes. No market for MS, no revenues, and no adverts. China seems to be trying to transition away from MS, if India and other BRICS nations do the same thing, that's MS, and it's dependents shut out of a large chunk of the global population.
> Nothing says free & fair democracy quite like banning opposition parties
...when those parties are closely allied with the invading enemy the country is at war with?
Yeah, as I noted elsewhere, you're clearly trying to make out Zelenskyy to be a hypocrite and as bad as Putin (and in general you appear to be apologist for Russia, whatever your motive (*)), but most people understand the circumstances your case depends upon ignoring.
(*) Generally pro-Russian or simply "My enemy's enemy's enemy is my enemy" (an extension of the equally-flawed "My enemy's enemy is my friend")... I'm not sure which.
Yeah, as I noted elsewhere, you're clearly trying to make out Zelenskyy to be a hypocrite and as bad as Putin (and in general you appear to be apologist for Russia, whatever your motive (*)), but most people understand the circumstances your case depends upon ignoring.
But Putin has been demonised by the West for being a tyrannical dictator, restricting the press, locking up political opponents etc etc. Ukraine's been doing all that since their 2014 coup. The hypocrisy should be obvious to anyone. It is to the EU, ie the conditions that will apply to Ukraine prior to EU accession. Zelensky's just an actor reading his lines. Even though he's also done other curious stuff, like put one of his school mates and TV production partners in charge of Ukraine's secret police.
...when those parties are closely allied with the invading enemy the country is at war with?
I think I missed Ukraine's declaration of war. Russia's been very keen to stress that what it's doing isn't war. Which might be just as well given Russia's only committed around 10% of it's potential combatants. NATO and the EU also haven't declared war. At least not in the conventional sense. In the unconventional/economic sense, that war is certainly on though.
> Ukraine's been doing all that since their 2014 coup.
The case we were discussing- the one which *you* originally brought up and used as an example- was, in your own words:-
> Opposition Platform – For Life was one of several political parties suspended by the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine on 20 March 2022 [i.e. one month after the invasion]
Now you're trying to shift the ground? I'll bet you are.
> I think I missed Ukraine's declaration of war. Russia's been very keen to stress that what it's doing isn't war.
Did you *seriously* just try to imply that it's not a war purely because Russia hasn't declared it as such?!
I'm genuinely unsure whether you think you're arguing that on the basis of smug pedantry, pro-Russian propaganda, blinkered support or idiocy. A mixture of all four, I'm guessing. The question is why you expect us to believe it.
And yes, the West is waging an informal economic war against Russia because it's not in a position to do so directly. Duh- that's hardly a secret.
Fuel supplies are not "purely civilian". Therefore, they are valid military targets / not inherently a war crime.
Also, the oil (or gas - there seems to be some uncertainty as of the moment I type this) platform attack is so far an unverified claim by the Russians. They have been known to lie.
(Also, it's the Black Sea, not the Baltic).
Fuel supplies are not "purely civilian". Therefore, they are valid military targets / not inherently a war crime.
Kind of. So POL is needed for the war machines. Gas is needed to generate heat, electricity, cook etc etc. Not military. See for example-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crime
Under the law of armed conflict (LOAC), the death of non-combatants is not necessarily a violation; there are many things to take into account. Civilians cannot be made the object of an attack, but the death/injury of civilians while conducting an attack on a military objective are governed under principles such as of proportionality and military necessity and can be permissible. Military necessity "permits the destruction of life of ... persons whose destruction is incidentally unavoidable by the armed conflicts of the war; ... it does not permit the killing of innocent inhabitants for purposes of revenge or the satisfaction of a lust to kill. The destruction of property to be lawful must be imperatively demanded by the necessities of war.
So what's the military value from attacking civilian owned & operated infrastructure?
...is so far an unverified claim by the Russians. They have been known to lie.
Sure. But it's been confirmed by the 'Ghost of Keef' and via ouija board from the heroes of Snake Island. It's a war, every side lies.
(Also, it's the Black Sea, not the Baltic).
Yep, my bad. Was pondering Kaliningrad. On which note, I'd read this-
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/54211065-2034
a while ago that predicted some of these events. In it's future, Ukraine had already been assimilated and Russia was helping itself to a land route to Kaliningrad. And NATO was being somewhat hampered by pesky hackers who somehow were able to do things like remotely pilot F-35s. Message perhaps being that the West has become too reliant on technology, which our enemies could exploit. So the downside to sanctions again. Non-West nations will have been watching the sanctions war and figuring out their own ways to avoid the West's compliance tactics in the future.
So some good may come from this, ie a useful OS that isn't controlled by MS/Google.
You mean like how- during WWII- the British government banned the British Union of Fascists and interned Oswald Mosely even though he wasn't actually convicted of any crime in the conventional sense?
But I think you'll find that most people understand that things change under a state of war (or "special military operations", cough) and that those closely allied to the enemy- and as such, a potential huge risk- are frequently restricted in such ways during wartime.
But I suspect you know all this, and simply want to make Zelenskyy out to be a hypocrite and as bad as Putin, as "they're as bad as Russia" drag-them-down-to-Russia's-level apologetics/whataboutism seems to be a common strand in your comments (and- probably no coincidentally- has been Russia's dominant tactic during the Putin era).
Oh you mean you lot in Russia built tons of infrastrusture on a product supplied from a nation you decided to piss off and now they took their ball and went home? Putin mate grow up and stop being such a pathetic, spolit brat! You have all this talent in Russian universities, you have a ton of cash from selling oil and gas to the west and Linux is free, there you go mate, solution ready you go nuts my son.
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They now have the bloody annoying grammar checker in Outlook for Androiod which, if you don't like or want its "suggestions", gives you an option to tap on "Ignore"..... Which it then... IGNORES!!!
And can you turn the f*****g off? NO, not without completely disabling the Microsoft Editor which also kills spell checking which is infinitely more useful.
Another spectacular own goal by Microsoft.
And the Android Remote Desktop client (just updated) STILL won't connect to AD joined machines (error 0x2407)...
While I feel bad for the 400 or so people getting laid off who likely had nothing at all to do with any of this, it's hard to compare that against the mass graves of people who were tortured and killed in Ukraine and the indiscriminate shelling. If anything, Microsoft is moving too slowly to cut Russia off.
What they've done is good but I wonder if they could do more.
How about suspending all logins to Microsoft Office apps?
As far as the 400, Microsoft paid them full salary from the time they ceased operations to the time they let them go and gave them three months of salary when they were let go. Something they had no obligation to do.
Putin has already defeated SWIFT the means by which the USA controls the European Economy. I recall a Dutchman who purchased Cuban Cigars from a German Vendor and the US intervened in the transaction and confiscated the Dutchman's $25,000 US Dollars used in the transaction. The reason given by the US was that Cuban Cigars could not be purchased with US Dollars. Wonderful to see the US watching all the Children of Europe. Wonderful too that the US still has WWII standing armies in Germany.
Russian oil is now available in exchange for Rubles and Yuan and Euros.
As for win 10, which has no less than 30 means of breaking and entering into your computer without your direct knowledge, it is essentially a backdoor spying scheme. During the Trump failed trade war, China's military, one of the former largest subscribers of Windows, dumped Windows for Linux. All nations should do this. It is vastly more secure.
Decoupling from Windows is a step in the right direction. For God's sake stop feeding into the USA Nancy Kerrigan Kneecapping foreign policy.
You're not entirely right and he's not entirely wrong.
China would be dangerously stupid for not paying attention to what happens with Russia and something tells me they're working on a good DR plan right now. Unless they don't care about Hong Kong and Taiwan.
I am rather surprised his name is not Ombomby Jesus Mbekellili from Nigeria, given his expertise in Russian affairs. All the experts on international affairs and economics these days are from Africa, don't you know. Every western news site now has hordes of Africans in the comments helping us Europeans to understand complex matters that we might otherwise struggle to appreciate.
This will most probably also include virus definitions for the baked-in Windows Defender.
Best would be to switch over to Linux, but that is easier said than done.
Wonder which tech company will be next on this particular sanctions bandwagon?
From the article
"Russia is also preventing the export of millions of tons of wheat from Ukraine, an action EU foreign policy chief Josep Borrell condemned as a "real war crime" and an action that weaponizes hunger. ®".
So are all the rest of the warcrimes somehow less real ? And this Borrell chap is a hypocrite. Like he is every going to experience real hunger.
Cheers... Ishy
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