T-Systems and Google Cloud building 'sovereign cloud services' for Germany

Google Cloud and T-Systems are to create what the companies call a "sovereign cloud offering" for Germany, though details are sketchy and it may not be digital sovereignty as the term is normally understood. The project involves T-Systems playing a role in managing "a large spectrum of next-generation cloud solutions and …

[Potemkine!]

If Google is involved (or MS, or Amazon), I can't believe the services will be 'sovereign'. IIRC, the US laws mandate them to provide data if asked, even if they are stored outside the US.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes - it's an interesting matter if the CLOUD Act applies in this case or not. As long as Google only is a supplier maybe not, but if Google actually owns and runs parts of the infrastructure I'm afraid it can apply.

[Anonymous Coward]

T-Systems used to do exactly this for Azure but it was canned in 2018 because it inevitably ended up a distant second-class citizen to full-fat Azure, and because of the reality that the main thing stopping Germans from going to the cloud is not German Privacy Law, but German Privacy Paranoia.

Which is of course commendable, but ultimately that paranoia will be overcome by a combination of time, certifications, key management and ultimately: discounts.

[Anonymous Coward]

Here 'cloud' have our commercial secrets... we totally trust you... signed.... world's third largest exporter.

After the NSA + Denmark spied on Merkel, I doubt they would even like to use non-German servers.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/31/denmark-helped-us-spy-on-angela-merkel-and-european-allies-report

I have zero trouble explaining to Germans how to protect their democracy from foreign influence they must necessarily protect their privacy. It's like a 'duh!' to them.

[Anonymous Coward]

"T-Systems used to do exactly this for Azure but it was canned in 2018"

I came here to mention exactly that.

However this T-Systems/Google "solution" appears to be a half-hearted attempt at what was previously done for Microsoft's German "cloud" - in the previous situation Microsoft had no access at all to the T-Systems data centres (and so theoretically avoided Cloud Act issues - theoretically as I don't know if T-Systems have a presence in USA, if so then they can be "forced" by US Gov to do "stuff"). T-Systems ran the previous Microsoft Germany "cloud" via documented and agreed service definition(s).

[Anonymous Coward]

>in the previous situation Microsoft had no access at all to the T-Systems data centres

This isn't true. The arrangement was purely contractual. MS staff had loads of access.

[renke]

already dead

Google will cancel the product before T-Systems starts to implement it, looking at the modus operandi of the two companies :)

[Anonymous Coward]

Can happen in Italy as well....

The Italian government is asking proposal to build the cloud system to consolidate all public administration software and data in. One of the bidders is a group involving TIM - which signed also a deal with Google to offer cloud services in Italy. I didn't heard of bids from groups involving AWS or Azure, yet. The other group is made of Almaviva and Aruba (the Italian cloud provider).

Anyway "digital sovereignty" IMHO means you can keep running your datacenters even when you have to cut ties with some or all the suppliers (at least for a while), and those suppliers can't put their noses into the data, especially if they are foreign ones.

[Anonymous Coward]

The name of the sovereign begins with G

And it won't be Germany.

[Robert Grant]

T-Systems tried this years ago (2014?) using OpenStack. I think they planned to partner with Hetzner, but my memory's foggy there.

[Anonymous Coward]

At around the same time as the EC were ordering ESA to remove British personnel from Galileo and other EC funded programmes for security reasons, ESA's IT folk blithely announced that they were moving everyone's documents (including all the classified stuff) into the cloudy version of MS Office. They were soon reset by Galileo's security team but it is funny how such things can get as far as implementation without anyone considering national security legislation.