back to article Don't like the new Windows 11 Start or Taskbar? Don't worry – Microsoft's got your back

Microsoft's efforts to shed as much glory as possible with its Windows 11 release have continued with the sudden breakage of the Start Menu and Taskbar for its happy band of Insiders. The cock-up happened in the latest preview build of Windows 11, 22000.176 for Beta Channel users and build 22449 for those lucky enough to still …

  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Thanks for your loyal unpaid service,

    now f**k off and buy a new computer so we can ream you for the price of a Windows 11 licence too.

    1. martyn.hare

      I’m fairly sure Microsoft said for unsupported enthusiast PCs that…

      Hardware checks would be optional (if you clean install with an ISO) even after GA but that Windows Update would not allow upgrading from 10 to 11..This seems pretty accurate to the previous statement, as Windows 11 was still reporting 10.x version numbers if you’re an Insider last I checked.

      Its likely the updated code sees this as a blocked upgrade path, which can be bypassed with a clean install as promised.

    2. JassMan

      Re: Thanks for your loyal unpaid service,

      Just bought my new laptop with a Ryzen 9. Discovered that the UEFI wouldn't let me repartition the hard drive while it was in the computer. This means Windows now has no chance of ever running on the lappy because I stuffed in a new M2 2TB drive and live USBed Mint onto it. I am now a happy bunny with a spare external half gig drive.

      Shame Mint20.2 still doesn't support 5.11 kernel but I am hoping it will arrive with the xmas update. The only things that don't work are the keyboard backlights, some screen modes and the stupid leds on teh lid which I can well do without.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Childcatcher

        Re: Thanks for your loyal unpaid service,

        "Shame Mint20.2 still doesn't support 5.11 kernel"

        You can still install it yourself and you won't void the warranty. You do realise you have bought into a world of choice?

        I suggest you look at the Mint forums. Start here - the Beginner forum: https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewforum.php?f=90

        Otherwise you basically download the kernel source. Unpack it in say /usr/src/linux. Wave gcc over it. Copy the compiled lump to somewhere in /boot. Fiddle around with your boot loader and hope for the best. I've been a bit vague here but why not find out how to do it from first principles? If you sort this out you will never fear a computer ever again - I promise!

        Cheers

        Jon

        1. RAMChYLD Bronze badge

          Re: Thanks for your loyal unpaid service,

          You missed out one crucial step: Creating the init ramdisk. No ramdisk usually means no boot since the system can't get to the kernel modules needed until it has booted enough to get the root filesystem mounted, this creates a catch-22 scenario where the system needs the module for the SATA/NVME controller as well as the modules to recognize the filesystems but couldn't get to the modules until the root fs is mounted- which requires the missing modules to be loaded.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Thanks for your loyal unpaid service,

        Mint 20.2 does support the 5.11 kernel, I’m running it on a 2020 Ryzen 3 Thinkpad. Follow the guide below you can’t go wrong:

        https://www.makeuseof.com/upgrade-kernel-linux-mint/

        1. JassMan

          Re: Thanks for your loyal unpaid service, @AC

          Thanks for the info about the kernel. I have been using Mint since 2012 (and Ubuntu since 2006) and had in fact used the method explained in your link. It is just that as I am now getting old and doddery, I had completely forgotten about using the kernel tab of Update-Manager.

          Thanks also to all the contributor's other helpful (but failed on my new laptop) hints as to how to get it working.

    3. Snake Silver badge

      Re: Thanks for your loyal unpaid service,

      The entire experience is turning very frustrating. 7th gen Kaby Lake CPUs are not supported by anything earlier than Windows 10...and now Microsoft has guaranteed that 7th generation Kaby Lake CPUs will also not be supported by any Windows *beyond* 10.

      They are intentionally locking Kaby Lake owners into a single OS.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Thanks for your loyal unpaid service,

        Is it perhaps that MS can compile Windows 11 with fewer time-consuming Meltdown-type mitigations if they abandon pre-8th Gen?

        1. Snake Silver badge

          Re: pre-Meltdown

          If that were true then Micro$haft wouldn't have announced Windows 11 support for their 7-gen equipped Surface 2.

          With careful reading you find the problem: one of Microsoft's Windows 11's limit is skipping any system that can't handle DCH drivers. Which most Kaby Lake systems and older current don't. Asus is rolling out BIOS updates on older Kaby Lake & Skylake parts, probably updating some parts of the UEFI BIOS to fix those incompatibilities.

  2. DJV Silver badge
    Facepalm

    To err is human...

    ... to totally fuck things up requires Microsoft.

  3. PeeKay

    Adverts ALWAYS ruin everything!

    It was due to them feeding adverts to the desktop. Sigh.

    You can find the fix for this particular borkage here:

    https://blogs.windows.com/windows-insider/2021/09/02/announcing-windows-11-insider-preview-build-22000-176/

  4. karlkarl Silver badge

    Its always the same in every release. But us plebs still seem to buy it and support it anyway. With mentally challenged upper management seemingly convincing themselves that the next Windows is great!

    1. Kevin Johnston

      Sadly the reason people stick with Windows is inertia and assurances from Microsoft that nobody makes business products to their standards

      Which for all the wrong reasons in an accurate statement

      1. a_yank_lurker

        Standards

        The Rejects of Redmond have standards? I thought they are below the bottom of the barrel.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Standards

          bottom? what bottom ? there is a hole that is reaching the earth's core now.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Love the reddit coments

    "something i found out on acsadent is that if you open a folder from your desktop it will eventually word as the normal file explorer and you can search threw files on the hard drive"

    Checked post history. Can confirm not non-English speaker. I'm guessing Windows insider turns people to liquor.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Why are people so incompetent nowadays?

    Same thing with the story of the top software guy for the military wwho quit

    because the DOD suks at hiring the right people, implementing SECOPS,

    etc etc.

    WTF is happenning? China aint sucking like we do. they get stuff done.

    People who do the hiring at all these places need to get fired RIGHT AWAY.

    Beccause thats where a big part of the problem is.

    1. Lorribot

      You would need to fix the criteria from promoting people from "lets get rid of them to some other department/of course they are brilliant and understand the tech" to promoting people who actually understand the tech and can actually manage and hire people who also undertsand the tech (a lot scarcer than you would expect), unfortunately most of the people promoted only have one skill and that is managing upwards and thus are managed by those that they "manage".

      1. David 132 Silver badge

        Personally I call the vapid approach of modern management The Péter Principle. And yes the acute accent in that is deliberate. It’s French, look it up.

        1. Sub 20 Pilot

          Meme merde, jour difference.

        2. Tom 7

          I believe the Soviets managed to fill Eton,Oxford and Cambridge and most MBA courses with agents who secretly gave the most incompetent students the highest pass rates so for the last 40 years or so the upper echelons of management worldwide have been filled with people who will bring about the fall af pretty much anything. AI will reach singularity soon and melt all silicon in the world to help save humanity.

          1. ThatOne Silver badge
            Devil

            ... while the most competent students were reduced to comment on The Register?...

        3. Trigonoceps occipitalis

          The "noblest of all dogs is the hot-dog; it feeds the hand that bites it."

          Professor Peter

          He was born in Vancouver, was his family Francophone? Serious question, I always assumed the French speakers were in Quebec.

    2. LybsterRoy Silver badge

      Maybe we need positive discrimination in favour of those competent to do the job.

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Rock the Casbah

    Don't mind me, I'm just here for the subheading!

    1. Tom 7

      Re: Rock the Casbah

      Ooooh err missus!

  8. Red Ted
    FAIL

    They deserve the car crash that is coming

    This all sounds too familiar…

  9. Pascal Monett Silver badge

    "Windows team's [..] apparently slipshod approach to quality"

    Apparently ?

    I didn't know it was Christmas already. You are being way too kind to this band of borkers.

  10. redpawn

    I want to be a cool kid!

    I'll spend anything to be the first on my block running Windows 11. What I'll do with it other than show off the screen saver and run benchmark software is another matter.

    1. stiine Silver badge

      Re: I want to be a cool kid!

      Rainbow themed BSODs?

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    This lazy programing

    It's time MS starts firing managers who sign off on updates that BORK the computer when installing. The automatic update BORKED my computer when the update was forcing TEAMs into my locked taskbar. Spent 5 hours getting access to settings to do a rollback. Shocked that CMD and PowerShell "start ms-settings" generated "File System error (-2147219200) Calls to Microsoft resulted in (1) denial of a problem, and( 2) suggestions to reinstall Win 11 as the BORKED computer had no access to Google & No access to settings so could not download/re-install Chrome. Win 11 is beta, so have back-ups and do not test on a production computer. My System: Dell XPS 8930, i9CPU, 64GB RAM, 4 TB SSD& TMP 2.0; so it was not a failure to meet the hardware requirements, just lazy programmers and lazy management leadership.

    1. ThatOne Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: This lazy programing

      > It's time MS starts firing managers who sign off on updates that BORK the computer

      Whoa cowboy! They can't fire their whole management because of such minor issues!

      Remember, customers can take their custom elsewhere, but users are forced to keep using the service no matter how bad it becomes. Windows users are just that, they can't escape. Companies worldwide have and will continue to adapt to whatever Microsoft dishes out, they can't afford to switch to - what? Elitist Veblen good Apple? Linux, elusive, uncontrolled nebula of independent devs?

      Microsoft knows they can afford to break anything they want, people can't (and don't want to) leave.

    2. Phil Kingston

      Re: This lazy programing

      So ran beta software, got beta-d then

  12. Steve Davies 3 Silver badge
    Big Brother

    Got my back?

    I turned my back on Microsoft when W10 arrived. Not going back. That ship has sailed.

    I look back at the 20+ years I spent developing software mostly for the Windows platform and wonder why I bothered. Don't answer that. It put money in my pocket but I never really enjoyed it after we got royally shafted with Silverlight. That was the start of the end for me.

    MS is looking more and more like big brother. Forcing ads into the start menu with W11 is just stupidity gone over into delirium. No one wants this apart from a few deluded Ad biz wankers.

  13. FuzzyTheBear
    Boffin

    Tired ? Older hardware ?

    Unless you absolutely need windows for an obscure reason .. why not give Linux a serious shot.

    You just may learn something in the process

    1. Sub 20 Pilot

      Re: Tired ? Older hardware ?

      Like most people who say the same thing time and time again, the answer is quite simple. I am not against using Linux, indeed I have run several different distributions on a spare PC over the yers mainly to check if I can actually migrate to it.

      I need my PC to be able to do my work. There is no alternative for 4 pretty expensive software packages I have to use and emulators / virtual engines etc DO NOT work with them. Main one is AutoCAD. Others are specific BEMS, building energy efficiency programs and structural calculation software. There are no alternatives so Linux does NOT work for me.

      Please accept the fact that while you may be able to use Linux for all your needs that others can not. Simple fact. This is the one thing that pisses me off with all the smug 'why are you still using windoze' brigade.

      1. a_yank_lurker

        Re: Tired ? Older hardware ?

        My company work box is a Bloatware box which reminds why I stopped using it at home after 7. It is supplied by my employers. I mostly use Linux or a Mac for photo editing (Mac was inherited). I could do everything I need at home on Linux.

        Most who say they cannot switch are often talking about work not personal use. For many they do not own the work box anyway so in reality have no say about what is installed on it.

        1. Zarno
          Linux

          Re: Tired ? Older hardware ?

          I tried using Freecad, didn't work out for me, back to Inventor.

          I've heard DraftSight is good, but haven't used it.

          Is there a proper linux CAM processor that supports 4 axis milling, and is at feature parity with HSM or Mastercam?

          Only very recently has KiCad came close to EAGLE or OrCAD, and we can thank CERN for kicking in much needed dev time.

          TunerStudio does have Linux support, but Hondata, mazdaEdit, and a few other packages I use do not.

          Magix stuff doesn't work on linux.

          I do use open source video/audio editing suites where they make sense in my workflow.

          Most of my games don't have linux support, except the original DOOM, DOOM 3, Quake, and a few others.

          I ran Borderlands 2 in Linux, but it was a pain dealing with the shim layers back then.

          This is all home/personal hobby stuff, so I have full control of the OS and software.

          A few years ago (pre windows 10...) I found I was running Linux as a host for a virtual machine running Windows more than anything else, and the open source stuff I liked in Linux ran in Windows without much effort.

          That lead to a decision to dual boot Windows/Linux, and keep a linux VM handy for anything that Windows couldn't do easily.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Tired ? Older hardware ?

        The solution is simple! Just change your profession to software developer (/s), then (*almost*) all the tools you need will be available on Linux. (*Almost, because if you are developing software to run on Windows then you probably at least need access to Windows for testing purposes, although a VM might do it.)

    2. Francis King

      Re: Tired ? Older hardware ?

      I've enabled WSL on Windows 10, and run Ubuntu Linux on top of that.

      It's not an entirely awful experience & it runs within Windows so you don't need to dual-boot. You don't get a Ubuntu desktop, though.

      I was able to download the Firefox browser, and then downloaded Portacle (Common Lisp) from that.

      1. Anonymous Kiwi

        Re: Tired ? Older hardware ?

        Yes, but s l o w. Windows apps often run faster in wine than on Windows, then there's the horrible boot times to deal with.

  14. Michael 27

    Been part of the dev build as soon as it was available and have had no major issues so far..

    Its basically just a re-skinned Win 10 with some additional features added on.. I am pretty sure this was just going to be one of the standard Win 10 feature updates until a Marketing guy seen it and went ooo lets call it Windows 11.

    But it runs fine, mainly use it for gaming and not had issues with any games either. I do have a brand new system tho so don't have to worry about old hardware.

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Joke

    Progressive ring animation

    > including a ditching of the ring of dots in the boot screen in favour of a progressive ring animation

    Do NOT Google for that. I repeat: do NOT Google for that.

  16. ForthIsNotDead
    Coat

    As a Linux user, can I just say...

    ... you're welcome to all this shit! Bye!

  17. Elledan
    Meh

    You mean QA-siders?

    Ever since MSFT disbanded dedicated QA teams for things like Windows and Office, things have been sliding downhill quickly. You don't need to be a genius to realise that asking developers to test their own code (and that of their colleagues, natch) is a terrible idea, and 'Insiders' (AKA unpaid testers) are not a replacement for a QA department.

    I predict Win11 will remain a painful sequence of embarrassing and data/career-destroying bugs, just like Win10 has been so far.

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Devil

    heh

    take out and windows decorations too, make it like cwm :)

    1. Anonymous Kiwi

      even more heh

      Leave them there, just put them at the bottom of the window to satisfy those people that put their taskbar on the right.

  19. Potemkine! Silver badge

    Who gives a damn anyway?

    What's the point to buy a new computer to install Windows 11? Having windows with rounded corners? A centred taskbar?

  20. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Once they stop shoving updates my way I'm going back to the old W10 start menu (there's a registry hack of course). using typing to search for apps is soooo slooow, and for the love of god, please can I have my old context menu back? I need those custom options to not be buried another level deep in the menu!

    Yes, yes resistance to change and all that, but W11 is a significant backwards step in some respects (forget usability, lets change the way it looks shall we...)

    And since when should an OS overstep its bounds into the realm of choosing what applications get installed? takes ages to delete the screen clutter vomit...

    1. Anonymous Kiwi

      > since when should an OS overstep is bounds into the realm choosing what applications get installed?

      Since apple released the iPhone in 2007 if I'm not mistaken.

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