back to article Linus Torvalds tells kernel list poster to 'SHUT THE HELL UP' for saying COVID-19 vaccines create 'new humanoid race'

Linus Torvalds has used some of his strongest language in years to smack down a Linux Kernel Mailing List poster who made some odd remarks about COVID-19 mRNA vaccines. The incident started in a Linux Kernel Mailing List thread titled “Maintainers / Kernel Summit 2021 planning kick-off” that commenced in April 2021. Event …

  1. Snake Silver badge

    Wonderful

    Can we have Torvald's reply eternally enshrined in a memorial plaque?

    1. Blackjack Silver badge

      Re: Wonderful

      Even better, include it on the Linux Kernel.

      1. aqk
        Linux

        Re: Wonderful

        Hey- why not embed the statement on those tiny Windows chips that Bill Gates has injected into you with those devious vaccine shots.

        Or does the vaccine contain a chip running Linux? Then we KNOW why Torvalds is getting so nervously angry.

        1. Maximus Delfango
          Facepalm

          Re: Wonderful

          I don’t get how the whole Bill Gates covid thing got traction.

          I mean, if you wanted to develop a small, reliable, repeatable, bug-free and useful piece of hardware, that worked first time and just did its job to spec, whatever its purpose, surely Gates and Microsoft are the last people you’d ask or trust to deliver.

      2. DoctorNine
        Pint

        Re: Wonderful

        With a little ingenuity, we could encode it as a checksum, and use it for a security key...

  2. Mark 85 Silver badge

    Linus seems to have been holding back. I wonder what is response might have been if he hadn't held back.

    1. Arthur 1

      Probably just a photo of little Linus and a lifetime ban.

      1. ShadowSystems

        At Arthur 1, re: "Little Linus"...

        Would that be a micro kernal then? Would the bugs need a patch or a full STDebugging?

        *Runs away as fast as possible*

        1. bombastic bob Silver badge
          Coat

          Re: At Arthur 1, re: "Little Linus"...

          you forgot your coat...

    2. oiseau Silver badge
      WTF?

      If he had not held back, that illiterate braindead asshole would have gotten a more suitable reply than the one he got.

      Sometimes holding back is really not the best thing to do.

      Go Torvalds !

      A.

    3. Dave K Silver badge

      I thought that too. Quite a restrained response knowing how Linus used to respond in the past. Still, he's absolutely spot on here.

      (applause)

      1. Someone Else Silver badge

        I dunno

        Sometimes a restrained, technical verbal dismemberment can be more effective than turning on the blue spigot. In Enrico's case, however, it is entirely possible that a scholarly admonition might have gone completely over his (pin)head.

      2. bombastic bob Silver badge
        Linux

        equally appropriate if it had been SPAM

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Code?

        I hope there's no code in Linux from "Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult". He's proven he can't construct logical processes.

        1. jake Silver badge

          Re: Code?

          I've known some wonderful coders that were batshit crazy about certain completely illogical things (pyramid power, crystals, the existence of god(s)/aliens/ghosts/whatever, left or right wingnuts, etc., you know the drill.

          Didn't affect their coding skills whatsoever, although a few of the more vocal examples managed to alienate the rest of the staff pretty quickly.

      4. Chronos

        On days like this we need Old Linus back - after he's explained messenger RNA in a calm, scientific manner and questioned exactly what "the illuminati" want us producing a spike protein for, of course. Perhaps he could delegate taking down clowns to mjg59? He's another one with a pretty good record of not suffering fools at all.

        Had my first AZ jab last month. If I grew another head or changed any of my opinions (sorry to disappoint) it was for a very short time. AdBlock is still there in the top right, I still won't let anything I haven't compiled myself on a router and I still enjoy cancelled 1970s BBC sitcoms.

        Maybe it was a bad batch...

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          “ Maybe it was a bad batch..”

          No, it’s because you’re already an alien!

    4. CountCadaver

      something that would have made the castle bravo test look like a sparkler in comparison?

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Bravo

      More people need to stop mollycoddling these halfwits, the charlatans that push this crap online need a meeting with a judge and a labour camp and parents who go down this rabbit hole should lose their kids until they smarten up (if they are capable.....)

      Long overdue we stop tolerating these idiots as they are dragging down our collective intelligence and progress....

      Just lost a long term friend to this claptrap so I'm more than a might *touchy* about this right now (initially was going to take the vaccine, then her anti vaxxer friend went to work, she was then unsure and 2 days ago was the convo that killed the friendship where she sent a link to a "personal wellness guru" pushing various anti vaxxer tropes (a rebuttal from a virologist was sent to no avail) with her then going on a rant about it being "poison", "you won't be saying that when people are dropping in droves from this experiment", "I know doctors and nurses who've told me to avoid this" "I've been suspicious of this vaccine for years" (funny its only been out for months), so I ended the friendship and cut off contact....particularly as she's well aware my wife is immunosuppressed and covid can and might kill her if she contracts it....instead she chooses to listen to kooks online and kooky "natural living" fanatic friends....

      1. Adrian 4 Silver badge

        "More people need to stop mollycoddling these halfwits, the charlatans that push this crap online need a meeting with a judge and a labour camp and parents who go down this rabbit hole should lose their kids until they smarten up (if they are capable.....)"

        They'd see that as martyrdom and be encouraged. Better to admonish them gently as Linus did, and then ignore them.

        1. CountCadaver

          I was thinking more akin to leasing Camp X-Ray from the Americans and turning it up a few notches - no mail, no visitors, no lawyers.....in a few years no one will have a clue who these idiots are.....

          That or chuck them down a disused mineshaft and backfill with c50 concrete

      2. Sgt_Oddball Silver badge

        Part of the problem though...

        Is we voted in these kinds of people they somehow assume they're smart because of some narrow gauge of intelligence (sort of like how AI isn't wise.)

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    In this case I think he would have been justified on falling back to he previous method of speech, instead of this very restrained post.

    1. jake Silver badge

      IMO ,,,

      ... his previous method of speaking to fucking idiots on the LKML was restrained.

      Frankly I'm surprised that Linus was as tolerant as he was all those years ... If it was my name attached to the project, I'd have really lit into a few of the fucking idiotic prima donna drama queens.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Justified? Maybe. But I like to hope that his actual reply — calm, considered, reasoned — will be more effective. Not just for the person who instigated it, but for others who might’ve been on the fence.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        re: Justified?

        Depends on what you're trying to achieve. Are you hoping to change someone's mind or do you just want everyone to know how right you are?

        1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

          How about wanting everyone to know the truth ?

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

            If you care about that then you care about how the message is delivered. People won't listen to a dickhead, however right they are.

            Check my downvotes above for proof!

            1. jake Silver badge

              Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

              I'd be happy to check your votes, up and down, but I can't tell you nameless, faceless cowardly blobs of grey goo apart.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                @Jake

                Ah......Jake.....I see that you make a distinction between the truth (as told by Jake)......and the truth as told by "nameless, faceless cowardly blobs of grey goo".

                *

                A pity really, because there are people out there who think that "truth is truth"....quite independent of the speaker. Oh well.....maybe you can try another comment or ten!

                *

                Signed: AC (aka NFCBOGG)

                1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

                  Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                  The truth is always unavoidably subjective.

                  1. Lars Silver badge
                    WTF?

                    Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                    "The truth is always unavoidably subjective.".

                    No it's not.

                    1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

                      Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                      It is and shouldn't be confused with facts.

                    2. Michael Wojcik Silver badge

                      Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                      Both of these statements are meaningless without a definition of "truth".

                      There are strong, sophisticated arguments that "truth" in a technical sense can only accurately refer to formal truths – that is, tautologies under a formal system (a logic) that express sentences reducible to the axioms of the system under its production rules. Even there, of course, it's extremely easy to accidentally introduce a contradiction, rendering the entire set of statements inconsistent and therefore useless. (See Gödel, Chaitin, Kolmogorov, Löb, etc.)

                      Theories of "truth" which attempt to extend it out of the formal realm, even the ones that may people think are obvious such as naïve realism, quickly run into problems.

                      Charlie's proposition is supportable under various arguments, such as solipsism and Descarte's Evil Genius. In short, any human perception of truth has to begin with an assumption of trust in the individual's cognitive processes – that what you think is logically consistent in fact is, and you're not being deceived by mental defect or manipulation. Any realism has to begin with an assumption of trust in the evidence of the senses; even with technological instruments at some point the human reasoner has to perceive and interpret some report of the evidentiary data. Those are both subjective assumptions.

                      Realists posit that natural "truth" exists in the universe independent of human perception and cognition. That's a position you can hold and defend, but ultimately it's an act of faith, as is the belief that the universe is anything other than a construct of your own mind.

                      1. jake Silver badge

                        Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                        During the meanwhile, the traffic light is green. Pedal on the RIGHT, you fuckin' fuck!

                2. jake Silver badge

                  Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                  I stated nothing about TRVTH.

                  What I stated was (after being asked to compare downvotes for a particular AC) that I can't tell you nameless, faceless cowardly blobs of grey goo apart. Do try to read for content before replying next time, there's a good blob of grey goo.

            2. Pascal Monett Silver badge

              So, basically you're calling yourself a dickhead ?

              Well, you know best.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Oh, how clever of you to spot the meaning of my statement, think I made it by mistake, and explain the joke.

            3. Chris G Silver badge

              Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

              "People won't listen to a dickhead, however right they are."

              It seems to be quite clear that you are aware of that.

              1. Michael Wojcik Silver badge

                Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                Unfortunately it's not true. A great many people (quite possibly all of them) are on occasion more than willing to listen to, and even be convinced by, dickheads. I dare say both history and recent events are ample evidence of that.

                1. jake Silver badge

                  Re: re: How about wanting everyone to know the truth

                  CLAMS GOT LEGS!

          2. bombastic bob Silver badge
            Alien

            the problem with saying "the truth" is that both sides of an issue often make claim to exclusive ownership of it, often with no proof other than "feelz" and "wantz" and "afraidz". On BOTH sides.

            science demands peer review and repeatability and modified theories when the results do not come up as expected (and there were no lab mistakes that might have caused it). Over time, something close to "the truth" becomes possible. I would expect this to be true with a LOT of things. Over time, the truth will eventually be known. June 15th comes to mind on this one... (see icon)

            But of course mRNA had nothing to do with kernels and so Linus was 100% right.

          3. Michael Wojcik Silver badge

            How about wanting everyone to know the truth ?

            We don't have a protocol for achieving that. But, hey, rhetoricians have only been studying the problem for a few millennia. We're likely to crack it in the next ten years.

            1. jake Silver badge

              Who needs a protocol? The keyword in that line is "wanting", not "truth".

        2. Charlie Clark Silver badge

          Re: re: Justified?

          It doesn't matter what the fuck it is or whether the person is right or wrong: it doesn't have a place on the kernel mailing list. But if it was my list I'd just treat it like spam and remove the user.

        3. jake Silver badge

          Re: re: Justified?

          Or perhaps you simply want to stop off-topic bullshit getting out of hand before it starts.

  4. Joe W Silver badge

    At a phsician's

    you don't have to vaccinate your kids -

    only those you would like to keep.

    And a virologist bluntly said that the notion of herd immunity comes from closed herds of cattle, which humans surely are not - they trave too much and have too much exchange between localities. Thus it is not applicable and if you are not vaccinated or already had CoViD you are more or less sure to get it in the future. Good luck.

    1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

      Make no mistake, COVID is here. It's not going away. Countries are celebrating their vaccination schemes, and hell, I'm raring to get back to going to restaurants and being in public without that godawful mask, but you can be sure that, from now on, every year we'll have an updated COVID vaccine, just there's a flu vaccine.

      COVID is here to stay.

      1. Logiker72

        I am sure this is the line of thinking behind William Gates' pharma investments.

        1. Steve Button

          Why all the thumbs down?

          Despite all his philanthropy work, Bill Gates does seem to keep getting richer and richer. So much for giving away all his money.

          1. sabroni Silver badge

            Re: So much for giving away all his money.

            It's almost like the system is rigged in favour of the wealthy.....

            Bears shit in woods, news at 10.......

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Why all the thumbs down?

            The way the US laws are skewed to protect the rich, it seems actually difficult for them to voluntarily reduce their worth.

            1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

              Re: Why all the thumbs down?

              Difficult to educe their wealth, certainly. Worth is a different matter.

          3. Glenturret Single Malt

            Re: Why all the thumbs down?

            He's got a divorce to pay for.

        2. Richard Jones 1

          That Should Be Farming Investments

          @ Logiker72 Bill is one of the major investors in farming in the USA. He realises that having people who are still eating drinking and eating is better than piles of rotting, bloated corpses that will not need feeding.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: That Should Be Farming Investments

            .. nor are in any further need of Microsoft products..

            1. Col_Panek
              Linux

              Re: That Should Be Farming Investments

              We have a huge garden, and also have no need of Microsoft products.

              1. jake Silver badge

                Re: That Should Be Farming Investments

                "We have a huge garden, and also have no need of Microsoft products."

                I also have a huge garden, and I give away my excess to people who need it. I approve of Mr. Gates doing the same ... why would anyone think otherwise? Do you have something against poor people eating? Or do you have something against people eating without supporting Safeway/Tesco?

                1. ghp

                  Re: That Should Be Farming Investments

                  "Mr." Gates is one of those opposed to releasing patents, meanwhile setting up joint ventures in China. Weren't those patents obtained with funding from the tax payers (to which the same "mr." may not belong)?

            2. jake Silver badge

              Re: That Should Be Farming Investments

              The product of Bill's gardens are not, in any way, shape or form "Microsoft products".

      2. Blank Reg Silver badge

        Interestingly I recently read that according to the latest data there is a chance that we may have lost a couple of strains of the flu as there have been no reported cases anywhere in the past year.

        It may just be that the people getting those strains weren't tested, but regardless flu infections have plummeted due to all the Covid measures. And I expect them not to rebound to normal levels right away as people are likely to stick with the extra hygiene measures for a while yet.

        1. Robert Carnegie Silver badge

          I couldn't get a doctor to see me for flu in 2019. I was trying to get signed off work. So I had to go to work, but fortunately I evidently looked so close to death that my taking a week off wasn't questioned.

        2. Chris G Silver badge

          @Blank Reg

          What that probably means is that sooner or later, without exposure to those strains of flu and without relevant vaccination, if people relax their hygiene and become exposed there could be an epidemic of a flu that was formerly less of a threat. Possibly it could also pose a much greater threat than before because of reduced immunity.

      3. keith_w Bronze badge

        Masks and the Flu

        Over the past year, the reduction in the rate of deaths as a result of the flu have plunged, indicating that masks are a more effective anti-flu resource than flu vaccines. Maybe we should keep the masks, at least through flu season.

        1. Spanners Silver badge
          Holmes

          Re: Masks and the Flu

          Masks will be around in 2121 - just like Chinese people were still wearing them over 100 years after the Manchurian Flue of 1910!

          In some places, perhaps including Manchuria, wearing a mask is seen as good manners to protect other people, not the wearer. As an NHS worker who had had Covid at least twice, that seems right.

        2. DS999 Silver badge

          Re: Masks and the Flu

          Sure if we all wear masks, socially distance, and limit gatherings we can make the flu nearly nonexistent. But as the flu is THREE ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE less deadly than covid (which killed 600K in the US vs the flu killing fewer than 600 over the past year) it doesn't make a lot of sense to go to such extremes.

          The good news is that mRNA vaccines can be developed for the flu, and due to the much shorter manufacturing lead time they won't have to "guess" which strains are circulating so it should be more effective as well.

          1. Blank Reg Silver badge

            Re: Masks and the Flu

            Pre-covid there were at least a couple of universal flu vaccines in clinical trials. If they pan out then we'll always be ready regardless of which strains becomes most prevalent each year. But covid probably slowed down the clinical trials, it must be hard to test when there are so few people getting the flu.

            1. DS999 Silver badge

              Re: Masks and the Flu

              I hope the universal flu vaccines pan out. I've read that "universal" vaccines that target all nine strains versus the common three (trivalent) and four (quadrivalent) of current vaccines have not been feasible in the past because they'd leave people feeling too shitty. i.e. they provoke such an extreme immune reaction from targeting so many strains at once you are left feeling like you have a bad case of the flu for a few days. You won't get too many takers for something where the cure is almost as bad as the disease and most people won't get the disease.

              If they could develop a vaccine that targeted some part of the influenza virus that is common to all strains it wouldn't have this problem, which is what I assume the universal flu vaccine(s) under development are doing.

              There is talk of doing the same with a universal vaccine that targets all coronaviruses. Since we've had one pandemic and two near misses with coronavirus in just the past couple decades, this would be a pretty big win.

        3. cornetman Silver badge

          Re: Masks and the Flu

          I heard an interesting comment on this very question here by some doctors in the field of influenza on the radio.

          They said that the reduction in influenza was largely down to the restrictions on travel. Apparently, a lot of the new strains are incubated in some of the more tropical climes and we bring them back with us when we holiday.

          Here in Canada we have only had a handful of cases of the 'flu this last year, presumably because of it.

          1. jake Silver badge

            Re: Masks and the Flu

            I suspect that it's more because kids were pulled out of schools. Kids are, in general, filthy little germ bags who share everything they come into contact with with all and sundry.

            If you are fortunate enough to hang out with kids, chances are you are generally in good health because you have a nicely functioning, well exercised immune system.

            1. Michael M

              Re: Masks and the Flu

              Also, kids on holiday are far more likely to mix with strangers (i.e. kids their own age) than adults.

          2. swm Silver badge

            Re: Masks and the Flu

            When 9/11 hit all of the planes were grounded and infection rates went down as a result.

            1. runt row raggy

              Re: Masks and the Flu

              [citation needed]

          3. DS999 Silver badge

            Re: Masks and the Flu

            They said that the reduction in influenza was largely down to the restrictions on travel

            That explains the absence of the flu season in the northern hemisphere, but not so much the absence of the flu season in the southern hemisphere last summer. Travel was pretty normal up until late March in the US, and in central/south America didn't start getting severely restricted until a month or two later since it didn't hit them as quickly as it did the US.

            Despite that countries like Brazil went from a normal start of the flu season to a quick 99% reduction (compared to other years) in flu cases after they locked down and started wearing masks.

            The travel to other countries helps bring in different flu strains, but it doesn't do anything to stop the strains that already in the country from continuing to circulate. Staying home and wearing masks does.

        4. jake Silver badge

          Re: Masks and the Flu

          Might want to compare and contrast causation and correlation there, keith w.

      4. anothercynic Silver badge

        Pascal is not wrong, although the good news is that the vaccines (both classic and mRNA) all show pretty good efficacy on the new variants that are starting to show themselves. It's when the virus eventually starts significantly changing the spike protein, which has so far been largely untouched in all the variants, which then makes vaccines ineffective, that we will then possibly see a repeat of lockdown waves or at the very least increased restrictions until the changes are rolled out in boosters.

        This is one reason why I strongly believe that CEPI and COVAX (and the Gates Foundation) are wrong in insisting that TRIPS waivers are not given. The EU (and particularly Germany) are also on the wrong side of history on this. Yes, BioNTech and Curevac are on the bleeding edge with COVID vaccine patents, but the human population in developing countries deserve having the vaccines too, at a price they can afford, or even free, under licence by local vaccine manufacturers (primarily in West, North and South Africa).

        South East Asia primarily has India (and even India is stuggling with churning out enough stuff to give its own population and their contracted customers in other regions), Japan and possibly China. More needs to be done, and it's the posh folks who've now got their jabs and couldn't care less about the other 6 or so billion who let their governments get away with token gestures like 1 million jabs here or 20 million jabs there. I see the G7 have pledged (but pledges mean nothing unless actually executed) to donate 1.6 billion vaccine shots, of which 600 million come (primarily) from the US and the UK.

        This is *far* from over.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      In a stockyard...

      Something I'm trying to figure how to boil down to a T-shirt message ...

      If COVID were a cattle disease, it would have been stopped cold in the first half year. Just like for other livestock, there's money at stake if the disease isn't stopped.

      But with people involved, and *FREEDOM!* the excuse, we just let 'em keep dying.

      Guess we're not worth enough even for Soylent uses...

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: In a stockyard...

        We tend to stop cattle diseases by culling infected herds. Tricky to do that with people. The anti vaxxers might succeed in some self culling though.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Tricky to do that with people.

          No it's not. Just send the disease into care homes.

          1. claimed

            Re: Tricky to do that with people.

            I'll try and bring this back to the article. Why don't you SHUT THE HELL UP

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Tricky to do that with people.

              My previous comment was deleted by a moderator. I can only assume this was because I had suggested that the UK government had planned something that lead to deaths. I profoundly apologise if anyone was offended by my suggestion that Johnson government actually had a plan. I now realise how foolish this was.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Tricky to do that with people.

                Just as a follow up to this, this is the first comment I have ever had removed. I didn't personally think it was that bad, but somebody obviously reported it and it was taken down. If anybody was offended by it then I do sincerely apologise, as it wasn't my intent. Oddly, the first reply quoting the entire comment in full is still there.

                Again, sorry if I upset anyone.

          2. This post has been deleted by a moderator

            1. Adrian 4 Silver badge

              Re: Tricky to do that with people.

              "There wasn't any disease in care homes though until the sick were sent in, so no cull necessary. Seems more like an attempt by UK govt to solve the pensions crisis in typical Tory caring fashion."

              Amusingly, cutting their own throats - since it's thought that the 'grey vote' is what keeps them in power.

            2. NullNix

              Re: Tricky to do that with people.

              This is counter to their own best interests. Old people are Tory voters: they don't want them to die! I'm willing to chalk this one up to a lack of capacity, stupidity and panic, followed by a pile of increasingly implausible lies as they try to make it seem that the UK govt never made any mistakes whatsoever throughout the whole course of the pandemic. (This is flatly unbelievable to anyone who's read any news at all in the last year, but it doesn't stop them trying.)

            3. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

              Re: Tricky to do that with people.

              The last info I saw stated, with evidence, that most of the care home infections came from staff and visitors coming and going. There was some from hospital discharges, but that wasn't the cause of most of the secondary infections. Even when visitors were banned, staff were still going in and out every day. And even today, after what we've been through for the last 16 months, there are still care home staff who are not vaccinated and may never be if they choose to refuse. That's an infection vector that can't be ignored, especially considering that none of the vaccines are 100% effective. And remember, those people refusing to be vaccinated or refusing to wear masks are those least likely to be taking any other precautions.

              1. swm Silver badge

                Re: Tricky to do that with people.

                In New York it was policy to send COVID patients back to their nursing homes!

            4. Mog_X

              Re: Tricky to do that with people.

              The NHS made the reasonable assumption that they would be needing as many hospital beds as possible, so sending 'bed blockers' back to their care homes was one of the main ways of doing this.

              At the time there wasn't much evidence to believe asymptomatic spreading, but of course hindsight is a wonderful thing.

              Also as John Brown mentioned, a lot of the cases were brought into care homes by the staff which probably happened within hospitals as well.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Tricky to do that with people.

                > a lot of the cases were brought into care homes by the staff

                Evidence? I would be telling the court exactly the same as Hancock if I'd killed 30,000+ old folk.

                1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

                  Re: Tricky to do that with people.

                  Evidence as requested.

                  Note that it's NOT in anyway a defence of the low figures quoted by Hancock and includes a link to the report.

          3. Richard Jones 1

            Re: Tricky to do that with people.

            You care home suggestion will not work, they do not reproduce any more anyway.

          4. Col_Panek

            Re: Tricky to do that with people.

            That was working well in New York until people caught on.

      2. Tom 7 Silver badge

        Re: In a stockyard...

        I find it interesting that it was the people short-sightedly trying to save money that caused the virus to become endemic and will have cost most of them far more in the long run. Its actually still possible to eradicate the disease - indeed it would be the cheapest option in the long run - but it would take worldwide co-operation. NZ, Taiwan, Vietnam and Thailand showed they could reduce the infection rate by a factor of over 1000 in a couple of months by a proper lockdown with financial support for everyone. That would bring levels down to less than 1000 a day worldwide which should be controllable tending to 0 in the 21st C. As it is we'll need to control new variant breakouts every few months as the thing mutates and or crossbreeds until we get a vaccine that can protect against anything resembling a coronavirus.

        1. JetSetJim Silver badge
          Black Helicopters

          Re: In a stockyard...

          > I find it interesting that it was the people short-sightedly trying to save money that caused the virus to become endemic and will have cost most of them far more in the long run

          Turn that around and look at the UK govmt, for example - they seem to have been actively trying to make money (on the side)

          1. Adrian 4 Silver badge

            Re: In a stockyard...

            > Turn that around and look at the UK govmt, for example - they seem to have been actively trying to make money (on the side)

            Although at an abysmal ROI. The fact that it was somebody else's money that was invested is the only reason they could do it.

        2. Chris G Silver badge

          Re: In a stockyard...

          Viruses do not cross breed although they are sometimes able to exchange genetic information.

          Aside from that, seeing the end of anything looking like a coronavirus is unlikely to occur in the near future. Virologists have shown they are at least 10,000 years old and possibly share a common ancestor some millions of years back.

          Birds and bats seem to be the main repository and the viruse seem to have evolved along with them.

          1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

            Re: In a stockyard...

            We also have our own coronaviruses which have evolved along with us. In prehistory with small human populations with little contact between groups a newly species-hopped virus that was lethal would be unlikely to propagate far unless it evolved. In other words there would have been effective selection pressure in the past.

            What's new about this one is that it's hit us when we've got large, densely packed population centres with large-scale fast travel between them. We need to find a new way of exerting selection pressure and vaccination is one way of doing that.

          2. Robert Carnegie Silver badge

            Re: In a stockyard...

            The difference now is that a coronavirus has pissed us off and we are calling them out.

            We might not go after them in birds and bats and other critters. But we already are vaccinating badgers against tuberculosis and mosquitos against malaria, so if I was a coronavirus, I'd be scared.

        3. jake Silver badge

          Re: In a stockyard...

          "caused the virus to become endemic"

          Eh? When was that declared, and over which geographic area?

          1. jake Silver badge

            Re: In a stockyard...

            Nobody willing/capable of answering my simple questions?

            I think that pretty much says it all.

          2. doublelayer Silver badge

            Re: In a stockyard...

            They're probably using the non-epidemiological meaning, I.E. prevalent, not requiring external influence to exist. In strictly epidemiological terms, it is much worse as it is not in a steady state, but it meets all other requirements for endemism. Which area? That would be North America, South America, Europe, Africa, and Asia. Some areas do continue to require external influence, E.G. Taiwan. Australia is unclear but may be able to reach such a state. It is hoped that vaccination programs will force it out of epidemic territory into endemic territory and eventually into nonexistent territory, but that's going to require a lot of people getting the jab. To anyone reading this who can get it and hasn't, it's safe. Lots of people have verified this, myself included. Join us.

          3. Robert Carnegie Silver badge

            Re: In a stockyard...

            It's not endemic yet, it's pandemic, but what was meant is "epidemic", disease running amuck in your country.

            I think it goes:

            Outbreak: uh oh.

            Epidemic: It's spreading everywhere in one country.

            Pandemic: It's spreading everywhere in the world basically,

            Endemic: it's spread. At that point, it may be geographically limited. Or it may still be everywhere.

            At any point it ought to be stopped, but someone in authority has to get off their backside and bother people.

            To answer your question, each state is declared by the World Health Organisation, and only when it has been the case obviously for some time.

            https://www.physio-pedia.com/Endemics,_Epidemics_and_Pandemics

            covers the levels. I think I also saw a chart at WHO, or it may have been Wikipedia. This page also has a claimed WHO chart of steps towards a pandemic, but this may be specifically for a new influenza, going from birds / pigs / mink / kangaroos to person-to-person.

        4. Charlie Clark Silver badge

          Re: In a stockyard...

          You have to admire the naive optimism! Multispecies (bats, pangolins, humans, cats, minks, ferrets, etc.) viruses are notoriously difficult to eradicate.

    3. bombastic bob Silver badge
      Meh

      Re: At a phsician's

      just worth pointing out... vaccination _is_ a way of establishing herd immunity...

      (either that or do what parents did in the 60's for mumps, measles, chicken pox, etc. - expose your kids when they're young and get over it faster, whenever there's a breakout)

      I prefer vaccines, myself. Only reason I haven't gotten one (yet) is I probably had the virus in early Jan of 2020 when a co-worker came back from china and then had to leave work due to fever etc. and then a couple of weeks later I had the symptoms, which went away in a day or so, and came back just once a week later (but milder). And a relative that lives with me got similar symptoms in that time frame. And things with sugar in them taste funny, now (instead of sweet). And early on, I thought "I'll let others get it first" since I'd most likely had the virus, when it was in ultra-high demand. But eventually, when it's convenient, I'll probably get the jab(s) just to make sure I'm immune.

      So yeah I'm not even remotely close to being an anti-vaxxer, but i still don't like seeing people turn into extremists on the either side of this, especially when the arguments deviate from actual science.

    4. Lars Silver badge
      Coat

      Re: At a phsician's

      @ Joe W

      Yes that is true and we did not get rid of smallpox either by herd immunity although there was a lot of time.

      It's also possible that we will have to take the vaccine more than once.

      On smallpox.

      "The origin of smallpox is unknown, however, the earliest evidence of the disease dates to the 3rd century BCE in Egyptian mummies"."

      "Smallpox was an infectious disease caused by one of two virus variants, Variola major and Variola minor. The agent of variola virus (VARV) belongs to the genus Orthopoxvirus. The last naturally occurring case was diagnosed in October 1977, and the World Health Organization certified the global eradication of the disease in 1980."

      And on the smallpox vaccine.

      "From 1958 to 1977, the World Health Organization conducted a global vaccination campaign that eradicated smallpox, making it the only human disease to be eradicated. Although routine smallpox vaccination is no longer performed on the general public, the vaccine is still being produced to guard against bioterrorism and biological warfare."

  5. Throatwarbler Mangrove Silver badge
    Terminator

    A new human race indeed

    One with improved resistance to coronaviruses ... and improved 5G reception. What's not to like?

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge
      Joke

      Re: A new human race indeed

      The 5G receiver nanobots only run billg's software, what the LKML should be doing is porting Linux to the platform.

      1. jake Silver badge

        Re: A new human race indeed

        Nah. The 5G nanobots were first run on BSD, Redmond is attempting the usual EEE+FUD thing.

        1. Kettle3D

          Re: A new human race indeed

          I think the final plan involves a hybrid of Windows 8 for Phones and Windows CE (the msdos based one, not the nt one)

      2. Antron Argaiv Silver badge
        Linux

        Re: A new human race indeed

        I got one in either shoulder, for diversity reception.

        Only issue is it seems to be affecting my Apple iPhone...

        1. jake Silver badge

          Re: A new human race indeed

          You must be holding it wrong.

    2. jake Silver badge

      Re: A new human race indeed

      You forgot about the auto-updates from Bill Gates.

      1. James12345
        Happy

        Re: A new human race indeed

        I've just had my second dose, so I've been upgraded to 6G.

        1. Richard Jones 1

          Re: A new human race indeed

          I wish my mobile was upgradable to working when at home.

      2. doublelayer Silver badge

        Re: A new human race indeed

        "You forgot about the auto-updates from Bill Gates."

        One tried to install, but it ended up in a bootloop so I replaced it. Open source to the rescue. Now has anyone found a driver which lets me connect my vaccine bot to this USB port I had installed a while ago (XKCD)?

    3. MutantAlgorithm

      Re: A new human race indeed

      Don't forget it'll also make you magnetic! If nothing else it means we can stick ourselves to the 'fridge :-)

      https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/06/hot-new-conspiracy-theory-vaccines-turns-you-into-a-magnet.html

      1. Richard Gray 1
        Joke

        Re: A new human race indeed

        Bugger...

        I'll need to keep out of the server room or I'll mess up the spinny things with my super magnetic powers...

        1. You aint sin me, roit Silver badge

          Re: A new human race indeed

          If you're Magneto can I be Professor X?

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: A new human race indeed

            On behalf of OP i say deal, but only if you introduce me to Jean Grey. Although I should probably figure out which Xmen i want to be first.

        2. MyffyW Silver badge

          Re: A new human race indeed

          We seem to mess up the spinny things every time we patch the OS

    4. steelpillow Silver badge
      Gimp

      Re: A new human race indeed

      Yep, had my two shots. Really looking forward to sending Homo Anti-vaxxus the same way we sent the Neanderthals and Denisovans.

  6. jake Silver badge

    One should really refrain from ...

    ...watching that side of youtube. It rots the brain.

    1. This post has been deleted by its author

    2. oiseau Silver badge
      Pint

      Re: One should really refrain from ...

      ... watching that side of youtube. It rots the brain.

      There you go.

      You were on the right track but it needed fixing.

      So I fixed it for you. 8^)

      Have a beer, it's friday. ---->

      O.

      1. My-Handle Silver badge

        Re: One should really refrain from ...

        Can't say I agree.

        I fully admit that there's a whole lot of garbage and hokum on YouTube, but at the same time I've learned an awful lot about general science, astrophysics, history, DIY, carpentry, electrics, car mechanics etc from YouTube. There are some content creators out there who really do put a lot of effort into making sure what they publish is accurate.

        I'm in the middle of a van conversion which, frankly, I likely wouldn't have been able to perform without YouTube pointing me in the right direction (backed up by further research, of course).

        1. ThatOne Silver badge
          Unhappy

          Re: One should really refrain from ...

          > put a lot of effort into making sure what they publish is accurate

          But how can a person who doesn't know anything about a subject decide if the information is accurate or not? Really flagrant nonsense put aside, "sounds plausible to me" is the only way to chose, and leads to everybody cherry-picking the echo chamber of his own personal truths. That's how you get those crazy notions we all love to laugh about, but which are poison for an already quite uncultivated population.

          (You can argue Wikipedia is in the same situation, except Wikipedia is in the limelight and major misinformation is bound to be noticed much faster than on some isolated YouTube video. Also Wikipedia articles you can edit and fix, YouTube videos you can only try to persuade Google to ban.)

          1. My-Handle Silver badge

            Re: One should really refrain from ...

            But how can a person who doesn't know anything about a subject decide if the information is accurate or not?

            If the person in question is any good at research, they will try to draw information from more than one source, and also attempt to take the reputability of each source into consideration.

            Unfortunately, research is a skill that not many people seem to possess. Or even realise exists as a skill.

            1. ThatOne Silver badge
              Happy

              Re: One should really refrain from ...

              > If the person in question is any good at research

              If they were indeed, they wouldn't have to rely on YouTube (of all things) for their education. But I get your point.

      2. jake Silver badge

        Re: One should really refrain from ...

        There are bits of youtube that are useful. Some very useful. Other bits, the majority of it from what I have seen, are utter crap. If you have anything resembling a logical mind, it's pretty easy to separate the wheat from the chaff.

        Sadly, they don't teach Critical Thinking in school anymore.

        1. BeefEater

          Re: Critical Thinking

          I'm curious.

          It wasn't on the curriculum when I was at school, I only heard about it when my daughter had a course during her A level years.

          So when did it start and when did they stop?

          From the little I heard about it while she was on the course it sounded like it should be compulsory from an early age.

          1. Jimmy2Cows Silver badge

            Re: Critical Thinking

            More that kids used to be taught to question things, instead of blindly following whatever drivel is spouted.

            But that leads to older kids and adults daring to question what teachers and "authority" tell them, and teachers and "authority" figures don't like that.

            Oh, the temerity. The very idea that someone might dare question their betters!

            People are far easy to manage, manipulate and control when they are taught from an early age not to look behind the curtain.

            1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

              Re: Critical Thinking

              Questioning the betters is fine. It requires recognising the betters, recognising why they are the betters and why the answers they give are more likely to be right than the opinions of some eejit they found on the net who can't tell the difference between biology and telecommunications technologies.

              1. ThatOne Silver badge

                Re: Critical Thinking

                > Questioning the betters is fine.

                There is a flip side to it, which is becoming progressively more prevalent in our society: Automatically "questioning" those we don't like the message of.

                As in "I don't agree with you, so you must be wrong".

                IMHO "questioning" is not a good choice of word, "think about" would be much better, putting the stress on the evaluation process more than on the final judgment. Making rash judgments is easy and often quite enjoyable, but it doesn't really help any.

          2. doublelayer Silver badge

            Re: Critical Thinking

            I've seen it done in a variety of ways. Usually, the less organized and more sincere the effort is, the better it turns out. Some critical thinking exercises took the form of example documents making claims where some were obvious rubbish, which acknowledges the problem but that's pretty much it. The better ones are just pointing out logical fallacies and letting students find them in claims. I also recommend class debates where students can find those fallacies in each other, and hopefully also their own arguments to improve them. Unfortunately, as much as that approach is tried, it works best when the students are interested enough to pay attention to that lesson and keep tracking things down.

          3. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Critical Thinking

            Having previously been (briefly) a secondary school teacher of ICT in the early 2000s, I rather liked the national curriculum for ICT - it had a lot of focus on information, not just computing, like the skills of distilling important points from prose and spotting trustworthy information. Sadly, once the kids reached GCSE and A level, they were mostly taking business computing courses that taught you how to use Microsoft Office, rather than the really useful parts of information and communication technology that allowed you to function in the modern world.

            Critical thinking itself should really be taught in all subjects, and evaluation of sources is a key part of the history curriculum, but I think a lot of kids drop that boring subject about dead people as soon as they can.

        2. Bonegang
          Pint

          Re: One should really refrain from ...

          But.... I like cute kittens.

          Icon for Friday, it's beer o'clock

          1. jake Silver badge

            Re: One should really refrain from ...

            Cute kittens are on this side of youtube, not that side, as any fule no.

    3. Chris G Silver badge

      Re: One should really refrain from ...

      Reading the comments for videos from 'that' side of Youtube is entertaining.

      What amazes me is that people who are so colossally stupid are able to type ywo words in more or less correct succession.

      I love the scientific(?) assertions made in many of the videos, especially anything to do with magnets and or free energy.

      1. jake Silver badge

        Re: One should really refrain from ...

        I have plenty of things to read for entertainment. Not included in that list is the output of polluted minds vying for "subscribers" and "likes" by feeding the GreatUnwashed massive quantities of doom and gloom titillation attached to precisely zero scientific facts wrapped in glitter.

        Gene Spafford once said "Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea - massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it."

        Youtube is all of that, in spades.

        Note that I still, after all these years, read parts of Usenet. Wetware filters help immensely.

      2. Geoffrey W

        Re: One should really refrain from ...

        RE: "Reading the comments for videos "

        Reading the comments for videos is actually a pretty good measure of the video. A rule of thumb - If the idiots don't like something then it's more likely to be true; If the idiots like something then it's bollocks.

        The tricky part, though, is spotting the idiots. If one is an idiot too then other idiots can seem to be blazingly brilliant. It's a minefield. I'm sure the "Algorithms" can walk it safely though and we'll all be good in the end.

  7. Sorry that handle is already taken. Silver badge

    I'll allow it

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    The kind of craziness that was already blooming has been noticeably increased over the period of COVID.

    1. cosmodrome

      Yes. That's exactly what the voices told me.

      1. Geoffrey W

        I wish *My* voices told me that. Mine tell me to hide in a cupboard ears and don't come out until I evolve.

  9. Not Terry Wogan
    Mushroom

    Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

    ... and does Torvalds simply tell him the list is an inappropriate venue for the discussion and to take it elsewhere, and be done with it? No. He seizes upon the opportunity to indulge in his new hobby of virtue signalling and writes a competing 633-word rant of his own (in contrast to the meagre 66 words of the offending original), creating an effect somewhat reminiscent of a chimpanzee in a zoo furiously masturbating in front of a group of unhappy schoolchildren.

    Wonderful. Just wonderful. It's a race to the bottom, ladies and gentlemen, and we're all invited.

    1. sabroni Silver badge

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      That was too long winded as well, you twat!

      Something like that?

    2. hj

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      You don't see there irony of your own response, do you? (hint, what this all the diatribe after your first sentence add to the reply?)

    3. oiseau Silver badge
      Flame

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      ... creating an effect somewhat reminiscent of a chimpanzee in a zoo furiously masturbating in front of a group of unhappy schoolchildren.

      Don't be an asshole daft.

      O.

    4. Anonymous Coward Silver badge
      Facepalm

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      > "It's a race to the bottom, ladies and gentlemen, and we're all invited."

      I think you've already won that race. Congratulations.

    5. jonathan keith Silver badge

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      Not that it will add anything to this 'discussion', but Christ on a fucking bike.

      1. You aint sin me, roit Silver badge
        Trollface

        "On a bike"?

        What kind of superfluous waffle is that?

        Precisely the kind if thing that drives people who aren't Terry Wogan mad...

    6. DrXym Silver badge

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      What you call virtue signalling others might call a smart guy telling someone else to take his off topic brain damaged lunacy somewhere else.

      1. anonanonanonanonanon

        Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

        JUts using the term Virtue Signalling is virtue signalling that one has no virtues

        1. babaganoush

          Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

          I have yet to meet anyone who uses the completely redundant term virtue signalling who is not, in fact, an uneducated far-right shithead.

    7. lglethal Silver badge

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      Since when does a chimpanzee masturbating make children unhappy? It was a source of high amusement when it happened one visit when I was a youngster. The only people unhappy were the teachers who had to try and come up with a suitable PC explanation when one mate feined ignorance and asked what the monkey was doing..

      1. Phones Sheridan

        Had that and came up with a response.

        "It must be itching!"

    8. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      Whoever Terry Wogan might be (i'm central european, forgive me for not knowing), I have a feeling he's also pretty happy you're not him and made it clear.

      1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

        Footnote in the Yes Minister scripts: "Terry Wogan was a talk show host. He talked and his guests listened."

    9. Zolko Bronze badge

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      @Terry Morgan: thank-you, at least 2 people with brains (you and the other upvoter). And funny at that, I like the chimpanzee image.

      As for the 102 downvoters, I invite you to look up the story of the Diamond Princess cruise ship: of 3711 people on board, 712 got infected, 14 died all older than 70 years. THIS is scientific data, not the PCR cases that some governments throw around.

      So don't feel all warm and fuzzy about the fact that covid cases have dropped a lot around you.

      And it's because this hard scientific data from last year, confirmed by the many healthy people I know who did get the virus and recovered from it, that I very much feel warm and fuzzy about that Covid-19 panic, and not because of some lunatic videos that Linus is watching. My risks of dying from Covid-19 are lower than that of dying from a car accident ... which doesn't prevent me from driving.

      1. grizewald

        Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

        While your example of the cruise ship figures is indeed data, determining your particular risk and the risk to others on uninformed extrapolation based on a tiny sample is unscientific in the extreme.

      2. HandlesMessiah

        Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

        @zolko

        Do let us know when traffic collisions are infectious.

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

        So true so true Zolko.

        I have a cousin who fell ill with it but he did not die. And this is a fact, so it's really nothing to worry about.

        And I could tell you about several other too.

      4. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

        Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

        “ 712 got infected, 14 died”

        That’s 2%. Do you understand how bad that is?

        And now we have had several strains that are much worse than that.

        Do you think the hospitals just make up that that get overwhelmed?

        1. Zolko Bronze badge

          Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

          "That’s 2%. Do you understand how bad that is? "

          did-you, may-be, miss the "all older than 70 years " part of my post ? I've read that for elder people the mortality is ~15%, so pretty bad, there is no denying it. But for healthy younger people it's negligible, and for the <20 it's inexistant. Vaccinating the young has absolutely no medical or scientific justification. Now, of course, you'll come with "but it's to protect the elderly " .... but if the elderly are vaccinated AND the vaccine is efficient, they are already protected. So: WHY vaccinate the healthy young people ?

          I don't care if you want to shoot yourself some experimental drug into the veins, BUT do it with YOUR money, and don't try to force ME to do it also because YOU are defecating into your pants. I trust that Darwin will take care of your lot.

          1. GrumpenKraut Silver badge
            Facepalm

            Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

            > Vaccinating the young has absolutely no medical or scientific justification.

            Are you really that fucking daft?

          2. GrumpenKraut Silver badge
            Boffin

            Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

            > Vaccinating the young has absolutely no medical or scientific justification.

            Just in case you are really just uninformed: vaccinating also people to whom the disease is not life threatening (say, kids) does stop transmission to those to whom the disease is life threatening (say, old folks). Some people *cannot* be vaccinated, among them some old folks.

            Still with me? The justification you demand is: saving lives.

            Is that so fucking hard to understand? Hint: no, it is fucking not.

            1. Zolko Bronze badge

              Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

              The justification you demand is: saving lives.

              So... We now ban driving cars ? Justification: saving lives. Thousands every year.

              Also: no more beers, whisky, cigarettes... you know, saving lives. It's for your good. Mum knows what's best for you, she will check every girl for you, she won't let you fly but she might let you sing....

          3. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

            Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

            You have issues.

            You do know no one is forced to get vaccinated?

          4. jake Silver badge

            Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

            Zolko,

            Consider the behavio(u)r of your average child at the grocery store. After wiping their nose & mouth with their unwashed hands, and then smearing the results on their trousers, they proceed to fondle every piece of fruit and veg that they can get their grubby mitts on. They also touch everything displayed at or about their eye-level on or around the rest of the shelves in the store. Including you, should you get in the way.

            Now consider the adults browsing the same store, picking and choosing their fruit/veg and etc., picking up and putting down items from the display the kid just contaminated, and then smearing said contamination on items in upper shelves the kids can't reach, the meat display, etc. Followed by other adults further transferring the contaminate(s). Ad nausium.

            Are you SURE you don't want the kids to get vaccinated, ESPECIALLY seeing as you yourself refuse to get the jab?

            Yes, I'm sure Darwin will sort it all out.

            For anyone still stupid enough to poo-poo vaccinating kids, may I refer you to this classic from Mythbusters?

            Same link in plaintext for the suitably cautious among us:

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wPKBpk7wUY

            1. Zolko Bronze badge

              Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

              Consider the behavio(u)r of your average child at the grocery store

              This is actually à good point: they closed EVERY place - bars, restaurants, theatres, churches, sports évents, concerts, schools...- EXCEPT supermarkets, where every body meets every body touching everything, and we have NEVER heard about hotspots there. Also, no mortallity amongs the employees of supermarkets: how do you explain that ?

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

                Very easy to explain. Such outbreaks aren't announced as such because it would scare too many people from using the essential resource. That would lead to more depression, malnutrition, and suicides etc etc.

                Oh, and supermarket workers have definitely died through this. Not necessarily at a higher rate than anyone else (they take an awful lot of precautions!)

                Remember that the mainstream media is passed through a filter, but is generally somewhere in the vicinity of what's actually going on.

    10. Dog11

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      Any post that includes the phrase "virtue signaling" or "SJW" automatically goes into the dustbin.

    11. babaganoush

      Re: Man makes idiotic statement on a mailing list...

      Could you tell us precisely how Linus comment could possibly be conceived as "virtue signalling"? I understand of course that there is a rabble that uses this term simply to refer to things they don't like, but I give you the benefit of doubt here.

  10. Logiker72

    Linus Thorvalds and William Gates Agree

    What does that mean ? Linux now also a quick&dirty technology show ?

    1. sabroni Silver badge

      Re: What does that mean?

      It means that there's tons of data to back up vaccine science that's easily available to anyone with a rational mind.

      1. Kettle3D

        Re: What does that mean?

        Yes, well the last census revealed a one-digit number of those.

        1. Will Godfrey Silver badge

          Re: What does that mean?

          ... and some regions were using binary counting.

      2. Will Godfrey Silver badge
        Unhappy

        Re: What does that mean?

        An endangered species

      3. This post has been deleted by its author

  11. richardcox13
    Pint

    A put down that is highly informative! Have an e-one on me!

  12. Mike 137 Silver badge

    Linus missed an opportuity

    He forgot to add "you can't even spell 'protein' "

    1. KarMann Silver badge
      Headmaster

      Re: Linus missed an opportuity

      Or 'genetic' (I assume that's what was intended, rather than 'generic').

  13. Binraider Bronze badge

    Very reserved and reasoned argument all things considered. One can of course answer nonsense with nonsense and give the morons a simple #wibble

  14. This post has been deleted by a moderator

    1. Solviva

      Re: You don't need a vaccine

      Unfortunately there's no money to be made in Ivermectin, which one could simply dismiss as a paranoid argument, but why else is it being ignored?

      One argument I've seen is that it's not been tested to be safe as a COVID treatment thus can't be recommended. True, but then it has been tested to be safe for a host of other diseases and the side effects and risks when taken are fully known. Paracetamol has more side effects and risks than Ivermectin, yet in most places in the world you can freely buy it and take as you like.

      However Ivermectin is for treating the symptoms of COVID to help recovery. Vaccines mostly prevent the symptoms in the first place as well as reduce transmission, so they both have their place.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: You don't need a vaccine

        Invermectin is being ignored because there isn't good enough evidence to show it should be used. It's being talked about on the internet because, well, it's the internet and that's what people do on the internet.

        https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/tables/table-2c/

        1. Solviva

          Re: You don't need a vaccine

          There was no data that the vaccines had any effect on Covid till they were trialled. Should we have ignored them too? No, they were trialled, funded by the companies producing them.

          Ivermectin could have just as easily been trialled, but nobody had any interest in paying for said trials since what would they get from it? They could produce AstraMectin for a small premium but generic Ivermectin would still be available for almost free.

          I fully understand there's no gold standard evidence showing the effectiveness of Ivermectin on Covid. There is plenty of evidence that shows it has a beneficial effect which has been collected, it's just not strong enough by itself to earn a recommendation.

          1. Peter Gathercole Silver badge

            Re: You don't need a vaccine

            I think that you will find that all of the vaccines are derived from work that has in the past produced effective vaccines.

            Having modelled the modifications to the vaccines to allow it to mimic the Sars-CoV-2 virus, so that it will trigger a immune response, it would have been trialled in vitro (out of the body) with extracted human blood cells, before any human trials would have been attempted.

            Following that there would have been the initial human trials would have been low dose side effect trials, before finally testing for effect against the virus in live trials.

            So there was a lot of data and testing of each vaccine. Can you say the same for Ivermectin?

            Chances are that it is a drug that has been checked against other illnesses, but that does not mean that it is either effective or even safe against Sars-CoV-2.

            1. Solviva

              Re: You don't need a vaccine

              "I think that you will find that all of the vaccines are derived from work that has in the past produced effective vaccines."

              That's a bold statement when roughly half of the available vaccines are mRNA based, which has never been approved as an acceptable vaccine delivery method, and only now has been granted emergency approval. Care to name any approved mRNA vaccines?

              AstraZeneca, Sinopharm, Sputnik take already proven routes.

              I'd be happy getting any of them (although Sinopharm seems to be showing low efficacy in Asia currently). Unfortunately I just happen to be in the worst performing region for vaccine rollout in Sweden so still waiting.

              "So there was a lot of data and testing of each vaccine. Can you say the same for Ivermectin?"

              Of course there was, once each vaccine had been tested; there was no information before these trials.

              The nih.gov link posted by AC shows 11 'trials' all with various weaknesses. 7 of these report a favourable outcome compared to 4 which show no effect or unfavourable. There are plenty more than these 11 which overall show a favourable outcome more often that anything else, but none of them are gold standard trials.

              Finally the PRINCIPLE trial is going ahead testing Ivermectin which should give us a definitive yay or nay.

              "Chances are that it is a drug that has been checked against other illnesses, but that does not mean that it is either effective or even safe against Sars-CoV-2."

              Ivermectin has been proven safe when taken at specific doses. It doesn't make a difference with what you're infected with, humans can take Ivermectin with minimal side effects. All that's unknown is whether it's effective against COVID.

      2. JohnMurray

        Re: You don't need a vaccine

        Ivermectin is only useful if taken while the virus is active.

        Once the immune system over-reaction starts, it isn't.

        It may have uses as a prophylactic, but mainly I suspect as a useful source of funding for its makers

        1. jake Silver badge

          Re: You don't need a vaccine

          From what I've read, ivermectin has only been shown to be effective in killing the Covid-19 strain in a petri dish. So are gasoline and bleach and boiling water.

          I think I'll stick to using it for keeping the dawgs heartworm free and the like.

  15. John Sturdy
    Thumb Up

    Restrained and very appropriately targeted

    He very specifically targets the subject matter of the offending message, and not any inherent characteristics of the person who sent it.

  16. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

    It's as well to remember that the famed Linus outbursts were the exception after gentler attempts at persuasion had failed. If the eejit persists a more robust response might still arrive.

    1. Lars Silver badge
      Flame

      @Doctor Syntax

      Linus is Finnish after all and some management by perkele is as times needed.

      "Management by perkele is originally a Swedish expression for a Finnish leadership approach that, according to its proponents, takes required actions in a quick and swift way, instead of a prolonged pondering of all possible alternative approaches and points of view before actually getting anything done. This is specifically contrasted to the Swedish consensus decision-making, where the manager makes sure that everyone involved has been heard before decisions are taken. The name is derived from the well-known Finnish swear word perkele, and it is a reference to the repeated times this word is yelled by the top managers. ".

      1. Hull
        Thumb Up

        Thanks

        Now I can swear in Finnish.

  17. Howard Sway

    What gets me

    is that this is someone involved in kernel development, and therefore presumably knows how microprocessors work. As in, not just opcodes and clocks and transistors, but also how a semiconductor enables this, due to physics. Therefore there should be some appreciation of science in his skull. And a disinclination to believe anti-science conspiracy theories.

    After all, if I went on there and posted that Linux works by magic fairies running around inside my laptop, he would probably say that was ridiculous.

    <sorry, got to go, swarms of little winged beings emerging from my ethernet port looking angry....>

    1. Dave559 Silver badge

      Re: What gets me

      "After all, if I went on there and posted that Linux works by magic fairies running around inside my laptop, he would probably say that was ridiculous."

      That's obviously ridiculous, any fule kno that Linux (and especially also FreeBSD) works by magic daemons running around inside one's laptop… ;-)

    2. Esme

      Re: What gets me

      Ach, just because someone is rational and intellgient in some parctiular field of knowledge doesn't prevent them from being irrational in others.

      Two cases I've encountered personally were an extremely able mathematician who somehow gave credence to some nonsensical von-Daniken-eqque drivel; how her logic didnt spot the crap for what it was/is is beyond me. Another was a prgrammer I knew that didnt believe the Apollo landings had actually taken place. His main counter argument was "if we can't do that now, how could they have done it back then?". Which f course completely ignores the how and why it was ventured in the first place.

      I ctually had to point out to him that radio triangulation is a thing, and that if the Soviets hadnt seen signals going all the way to the Moon, and then come all the way back, they would have been shouting about it very loudly at the time. And that a laser reflector was left by the astronauts which has long bee used to check the precise distance to the Moon. he still wast convinced. Good programer, but not so good at applying logc outside of that narrow field.

      Sigh....

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    whose gene sequence doesn't look quote natural

    What's a "natural-looking gene sequence?"

    Your ideas are intriguing to me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: whose gene sequence doesn't look quote natural

      What's a "natural-looking gene sequence?"

      A white Anglo-Saxon Protestant gene sequence. God forbid your genes turn Latino or some such!

      /s

      1. Geoffrey W

        Re: whose gene sequence doesn't look quote natural

        Don't forget there must also be a lot of Y chromosomes. Too few of them would be awful.

  19. James O'Shea

    Go, Linus, go

    Hit 'im again. Harder. [gets popcorn].

    Silly twit doesn't know how lucky he is that Linus lit him up, not me. One of my nieces died, at only 25, of covid crap. I get VERY ANNOYED with anti-vaxxer idiots.

    At the office, we provided transport, in company vehicles, on company time, to sites doing mass vaccinations. And then we set up our own mass vaccination. Those who aren't vaccinated have been advised that they may not be allowed on premises; a lot of work is from home, but not all of it. If you need to be on prem, you need to be vaccinated. You need to work on prem but don't want to be vaccinated? Start looking for another job, mate, you're not gonna be here for long. This is a Right To Work state, and we can fire anyone, at any time, for any reason or no reason at all, so long as the person isn't one of the Protected Categories. Anti-vaxxers ain't on the list. We checked.

    We had some refuse to go when we sent the company vehicles to pick them up and take them to be vaccinated; so long as they're working from home, we don't care. They're not getting into the building, though.

  20. CountCadaver

    Then you have people like this apologising for anti vaxxer idiots and blaming everyone else for their fuckwittery...

    https://www.vox.com/2015/9/4/9252489/anti-vaxx-wife

    My BP rose about 40 points reading this drivel, guy sounds like he has stockholm syndrome, that or no self esteem.....his wife sounds like an immature narcissist ready to throw a temper tantrum

  21. Edwin

    Facebook

    ...and the reason I think El Reg should purge itself from Facebook is the (only) three comments below this story on that platform. Sadly they originate from a countryman of mine.

    For those who don't know: Lange Frans is a washed-up has-been from the dutch rap scene. He's trying to make a name from himself (or return to the spotlight) as an 'influencer' by peddling consipiracy theories and other social mechanisms that seem to exist only to prove Darwin right.

  22. Jason Hindle Silver badge

    I think I just switched from ambivalent to actually liking Linus

    No two ways about it, the man is Marmite. The numbers say it all. Late Feb, hundreds were dying ever day. Now we have the same case rate and average deaths < 10. Have been we been experimented on? Well yes, and I made my peace with that before consenting to the first jab. Now less people gasping for their last as a result. What are these bloody idiots going to do if something worse than COVID-19 comes along?

    1. Solviva

      Re: What are these bloody idiots going to do if something worse than COVID-19 comes along?

      Hopefully that will be the end of them, whilst the more rational folk get by just fine.

    2. Robert Carnegie Silver badge

      Re: I think I just switched from ambivalent to actually liking Linus

      COVID-19 also comes and goes, somewhat, as the weather changes. This persuaded Donald Trump to say in early 2020 that it would go away "like a miracle", and maybe persuaded televangelist Kenneth Copeland to "pray it away", you're welcome, now give me money, at around the same time. It persuaded the British government to re-open business with a colossally misplaced sigh of relief, last year. Then it turns cooler and back it comes.

  23. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    The echo chamber at work...

    Per comments here....

    So a genius self-publicist with zero background in the hard science let alone bio-science is now an expert on mRNA vaccines.. I dont think so.

    May he should read a standard text book on the subject like this..

    https://link.springer.com/book/10.1007%2F978-1-4939-6481-9

    ..and discover that they know diddly squat about mRNA vaccine interactions with cells and long term effects on non targeted cell.

    Thats the science folk.

    The OP was an idiot to bring up the subject on a kernel mailing list. But as usual Linus the blowhard has to do what he does best. BS.

    The actual published science is attenuated virus vaccines very very safe. Adenovirus vaccines probably safe. mRNA vaccines, remember Thalidomide...

    So the OP was technically correct but a fool to talk about it in any online echo chamber full of Guardianistas

    Remember boys and girls. R0 < 1.2, IFR < 0.2% and CFR < 2%. And for those under 70 a PSI/PORT risk score less that H1N1/H3N2..

    And yes I probably had a mild / marginal SARs CoV 2 infection in early March 2020. It was weird just like H1N1-09 in 2009 but unlike H1N1-09 did not leave me prostrate for three days almost putting me in hospital and leaving me weak for months afterwards. Pretty standard with these sort of infections. So been there, done that, got the anti-bodies.

    Those of us with serious non treatable chronic medical conditions pay very close attention to this sort of stuff. For many decades by this stage in my case. Because our lives depended on it.

    So as someone who has done the literature research I'll be waiting around for an old fashioned vaccine like VLA2001. If I have to take a de-facto clinical placebo I at least want it to be a provably safe placebo. Just like all the other ones I would gladly take. Because I trust doctors about as much as I trust lawyers. Based on many decades of direct experience with both.

    1. yetanotheraoc

      Re: The echo chamber at work...

      Your pseudo-scientific arguments hold no weight here, because this is one audience that actually does do their own reading outside of internet forums. As does Linus Torvalds I am sure.

      "The actual published science is attenuated virus vaccines very very safe. Adenovirus vaccines probably safe. mRNA vaccines, remember Thalidomide..."

      Thalidomide wasn't a vaccine.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: The echo chamber at work...

        Thalidomide wasn't a vaccine.

        Pretty sure the OP is aware that thalidomide is not a vaccine and is instead giving an example of another product pushed by big pharma that was widely accepted as being completely safe, until everyone realised it wasn't.

        The COVID Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are the first mRNA vaccines to be granted (emergency) approval for human use in history. Up till now they have performed really rather poorly in animal models. As such, no one can be certain whether or not their will be long term side effects with this technology. Vaccine hesitancy should not be seen as irrational in this particular case, especially as we're starting to see higher than expected levels of myocarditis in younger males given the Pfizer jab.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: The echo chamber at work...

          The scary thing is if you read the textbook I referenced on mRNA vaccines, the standard textbook, and plow through the various chapters about what is known about the actual mechanism of interaction with cells the current knowledge is mostly hand-waving. This is very early stage science. In 10 or 15 years it might prove to be a very power tool but now, actually quite terrifying that it is been clinically trialed on tens of millions of people.

          The equivalent textbooks on adenovirus are on firmer scientific ground but given the problems that turned up in various candidate trials (the blood clot one with SARs 2 vaccine being pretty typical) its still not quite a mature technology yet. But very encouraging.

          You just cannot beat good old attenuated virus vaccines. By this stage very well understood. No problem with those. In fact once things quieten down I need to get a Tdap booster and the new shingles vaccine looks like something worth getting. Not worth getting the flu shot most years as I have high H1N1 immunity, thanks to 2009 bout, and very good H3N2 immunity, thanks to when I was born as first pandemic exposure.

          The immune system is a weird and wonderful beast.

          1. yetanotheraoc

            Re: The echo chamber at work...

            The point about Thalidomide did not go over my head. My counterpoint was simply that you are scare-mongering about medical science, without reference to facts that matter for vaccines. All of history is full of mistakes of one sort or another. Boo!

            "Not worth getting the flu shot most years as I have high H1N1 immunity, thanks to 2009 bout, and very good H3N2 immunity, thanks to when I was born as first pandemic exposure."

            You claim to know so much and then write this. If anybody challenges you, you resort to name-calling. Bye.

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: The echo chamber at work...

            You just cannot beat good old attenuated virus vaccines. By this stage very well understood. No problem with those. In fact once things quieten down I need to get a Tdap booster and the new shingles vaccine looks like something worth getting. Not worth getting the flu shot most years as I have high H1N1 immunity, thanks to 2009 bout, and very good H3N2 immunity, thanks to when I was born as first pandemic exposure.

            What's your opinion on the Novavax vaccine? Just the spike protein, enveloped with a lipid. Perhaps safer than the mRNA and adenovirus options. Seems to be taking a while to get approved though unfortunately.

          3. JohnMurray

            Re: The echo chamber at work...

            The Adenovirus blood clotting problem was known in 2006.

            https://ashpublications.org/blood/article/109/7/2832/125650/Adenovirus-induced-thrombocytopenia-the-role-of

            Obviously, Oxford doesn't read.

            Or maybe they do: "The Oxford–AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine is a replication-deficient simian adenovirus vector, containing the full‐length codon‐optimised coding sequence of SARS-CoV-2 spike protein along with a tissue plasminogen activator (tPA) leader sequence"

            "Tissue plasminogen activator (tPA) is classified as a serine protease (enzymes that cleave peptide bonds in proteins). It is thus one of the essential components of the dissolution of blood clots. Its primary function includes catalyzing the conversion of plasminogen to plasmin, the primary enzyme involved in dissolving blood clots"

            Decide yourselves...

          4. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

            Re: The echo chamber at work...

            The link goes to a page with a 2027 copyright date on it. I've news for you. It's now 2021. A lot of work on m-RNA vaccines has been done in the interim, especially in the last year or so.

            Remember this: the best vaccine is the one in your arm.

        2. James O'Shea

          Re: The echo chamber at work...

          Thalidomide _is_ perfectly safe... if you're not pregnant. Specifically, if you're not at a specific stage of pregnancy. So it's perfectly safe for 50% of the adult population 100% of the time, and for the other 50% 90+% of the time. It's hideously unsafe for the last few, though. Or rather for the fetuses the last few are carrying.

          Seriously, look up aspirin and penicillin. If either of them had been first proposed in a modern testing environment, neither would have been approved. They'd never get past the animal testing, one kills guinea pigs and one blinds rabbits. (I don't remember which, and reading about it was too depressing so I'm not digging up the article again.) Penicillin is fatal to a small percentage of humans, and will make another small percentage very sick indeed.A lot of people have problems with aspirin (I'm one of them...) And yet both of them are still in use... (I can handle low-dosages of aspirin. Some others can't even do that.)

          There's a long list of drugs which will cause problems in a small percentage of people. A very long list. (Any diabetics out there? Let me just mention metformin. And that one is by no means the most egregious example...)

          'Vaccine hesitancy' _is_ irrational.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: The echo chamber at work...

            Thalidomide _is_ perfectly safe... if you're not pregnant. Specifically, if you're not at a specific stage of pregnancy. So it's perfectly safe for 50% of the adult population 100% of the time, and for the other 50% 90+% of the time. It's hideously unsafe for the last few, though. Or rather for the fetuses the last few are carrying.

            Make no mistake about it, what happened with thalidomide was a tragic scandal. The fact you're passing it off as a nothingburger is deeply troubling and calls into question your motives with these type of posts.

            The fact is, big pharma companies have been caught countless times behaving criminally, sometimes even contravening safety regulations. This isn't a tinfoil hat conspiracy theory, it's an established fact.

            You may peruse a selection of the biggest lawsuits here:

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_pharmaceutical_settlements

            Bearing all this in mind, some of us have come to the conclusion that we would prefer to wait for a bit more data before submitting to vaccines granted emergency approval, released in record time and that use brand new technology. If that's difficult for you to accept, so be it, but the vitriolic response meted out to those with a differing viewpoint is both depressing and hard to understand.

            1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

              Re: The echo chamber at work...

              “ but the vitriolic response meted out to those with a differing viewpoint is both depressing and hard to understand.”

              Not really. So much utter BS is spouted that make large, moronic sections of the population not get vaccinated. Which leads to thousands of extra deaths and prolonged lockdowns.

              And THOSE SAME PEOPLE often refuse masks, and congregate like idiots.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: The echo chamber at work...

                Not really. So much utter BS is spouted that make large, moronic sections of the population not get vaccinated. Which leads to thousands of extra deaths and prolonged lockdowns.

                And THOSE SAME PEOPLE often refuse masks, and congregate like idiots.

                Almost 80% of the population in the UK have received their first vaccination and presumably the overwhelming majority of those people will take their second. Couple that with people that already have antibodies and T-cells from previous COVID infections and we cannot be far from attaining herd immunity. So why the hysterical overreaction about the very small minority that choose not to get vaccinated?

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: The echo chamber at work...

        There you go, proving you are one of the echo chamber chatter moneys.. Pure gibberish.

        Everything I quoted is straight from the current epidemiological and clinical data for SARs CoV 2. Some of us have been reading the published data very carefully since first week of January 2020.

        And as the Thalidomide reference went straight above you head let me explain in simple terms you might understand.

        I know Thalidomide was not a vaccine. Duh. It was the biggest single UK medical regulatory failing of the modern era. To date. It was the big story for most of my childhood and teenage years. Some of those kids with missing limbs were locals. You saw them in the streets and one was is in my primary school for a while. The current UK regulatory framework is directly due to the Thalidomide scandal. One FDA regulator would not take the pharma companies word that the side-effects were minor so it never got approval in the US at the time.

        So just like Linus maybe do your research before making a fool of yourself in public.

    2. doublelayer Silver badge

      Re: The echo chamber at work...

      "So a genius self-publicist with zero background in the hard science let alone bio-science is now an expert on mRNA vaccines.. I dont think so."

      Nice strawman. Of course he's not. He corrected a person who knew nothing and whose statements were complete rubbish.

      Imagine what you would say to me if I wrote a comment explaining that you are a mutant cucumber plant. I'm guessing it would be along the lines that there is no such thing and that you are A) moving around, which plants tend not to do, B) have a genome typical of humans, and C) do not have cucumbers growing out of you. I think you could manage to write this rebuttal without being an expert on cucumber horticulture. When the bar's on the ground, you don't have to jump very high to clear it.

      1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: The echo chamber at work...

        But are you sure he - or maybe it - isn't a mutant cucumber plant?

    3. GrumpenKraut Silver badge
      Angel

      Re: The echo chamber at work...

      > echo chamber full of Guardianistas

      Ah..., have a downvote. You are welcome.

  24. Stuart Halliday
    Linux

    Linus :Will no one rid me of this troublesome priest?

    Moderators : Right here we go.

  25. 7teven 4ect

    those who fear evolution, demonstrate it

    But I'm not anti-vaccine, I am pro-safer-vaccines.

    I am not anti-"new humanoid race"

    I am pro-"old humanoid race"

    1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: those who fear evolution, demonstrate it

      "I am pro-safer-vaccines"

      Just so long as you don't catch something nasty and die from it while you're waiting for the safer vaccine to come along.

      1. Binraider Bronze badge

        Re: those who fear evolution, demonstrate it

        Amongst my little group, anti-vax has been replaced with the term pro-plague.

        As risk assessments go, vax versus no vax; versus probability of everyone getting COVID when restrictions are widely removed. I'll take a vaccine, thanks.

        For the rest of you that can take a vaccine, but are declining it, there is a rather famous book by Charles Darwin that explains much.

        The only other way is a repeat of the consequences that came with the Black Plague. Some might say that has advantages with respect to overpopulation; however morally bankrupt it might be. From a personal standpoint, I'd rather still be about all things considered.

        For those unable to take a vaccine, but suffer the consequences of those that wilfully choose not to; those are the people I feel most sorry for. They have no more power over your choice to decline than I do.

        We don't live in a benevolent dictatorship, but if it were me in charge I'd be mandating it for absolutely everyone that can have one to do so, because it's the right thing to do; for both yourself and everyone else.

        Gentle reminder also, that hostile intelligence agencies are known to be placing misinformation to sow distrust of vaccines (reported by many reputable news agencies, if not government branches).

        If one person changes their mind because of this then it was worth taking the 5 mins to write.

  26. anothercynic Silver badge

    For once...

    ... I have to agree with Torvalds. It's not applicable to Linux kernel development, so keep it off that list.

    Oh, and... mRNA creating a new race? Jesus, Mary and Joseph and the little donkey!

    1. Jason Hindle Silver badge

      Re: For once...

      Well thank **** it's not dRNA - the conspiracy nuts would have had a field day.

      1. jake Silver badge
        Pint

        Re: For once...

        ::snort::

  27. babaganoush

    Bravo Linus

    Title says it all.

  28. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

    Good stuff!

    Get the effing morons off the lists.

    They can satisfy Trump orally if they wish.

  29. martinusher Silver badge

    There's a Time and a Place for Everything

    Currently if you're think is anti-vaxx, anti-Covid and so on the place to play woujld be off-guardian.org . This site started some years ago back when the Guardian's "Comment is Free" facility became somewhat less free (post the Snowdon basement disk smashing incident) as an outlet for material that got censored off the Guardian site as it "didn't conform to community standards". In the last year its been taken over by the Covid Conspiracy Theory crew, there's plenty of material out there for all tastes and some of it is really well written (if scientifically dubious).

    Linus is right. The occasional tongue in cheek comment is just playfulness but overall source code is not the place to spread any kind of theories especially if they're completely off topic.

  30. PeteS46

    This post needs a 'thumbs up/down' button.

    Up!

  31. skewty

    Isn't hypocritical and disgusting how Linus' arrogance and emotional immaturity shine through when confronted an opposing view to his own. It is important to note than like the man he is opposing, Linus doesn't understand mRNA and is not educated in the matter. If Linus wasn't such a fool, he would find that there is actually tremendous support for the view this man is expressing. The views come from extremely well educated people in the matter. And no Linus, you can't find the videos on YouTube and their views are not shared on Twitter. Those platforms block opposing views by qualified scientists. One shouldn't go to Kim Jong Un's media if you want information that would make him look bad. Linus is full of disappointments. He is a great code reviewer and falls short in many other areas. He's human. Or was before he got vaccinated if one is to believe what his opposer is claiming.. lol

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