back to article China claims it has stolen a march on 6G with colossal patent portfolio

China's State Intellectual Property Office has proclaimed the nation already dominates the world in development of patents pertinent to sixth-generation mobile networks. The Office (CNIPA) chose World Intellectual Property Day (April 26th) to assert China’s 6G dominance, telling state-controlled media that its analysis of …

  1. Snowy Silver badge

    Just ignore

    Just ignore their patent like they did in the past if it become to much of a problem.

    1. Mark Exclamation

      Re: Just ignore

      Not sure why you consider this a joke. It's actually true. The rest of the world should play the game China has been playing for years, and just ignore their patents, or just use them without payment.

      1. sanmigueelbeer

        Re: Just ignore

        I agree with Snowy about why this is a "joke": Because if he doesn't someone will take offence and downvote his comment.

      2. Tom 38 Silver badge

        Re: Just ignore

        Not sure why you consider this a joke. It's actually true. The rest of the world should play the game China the US has been playing for years, and just ignore their patents, or just use them without payment.

        What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

        1. Mark Exclamation

          Re: Just ignore

          Oh Tom, you could have picked a better Western name. But I suppose Xi would have been a dead giveaway!

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    How many were actually developed

    And how many were stolen...

    1. Mark Exclamation

      Re: How many were actually developed

      As with most things China has, they're mostly stolen.

      1. Mark Exclamation

        Re: How many were actually developed

        I see the CCP team has started with their downvotes. No problem, at least Pres Winnie Xi is aware of our opinions. Or maybe not, as anyone telling him what we think of him and his government will likely "disappear".

        1. prismatics

          Re: How many were actually developed

          Why can’t we simply have a region lock where readers from the US cannot see the comment section. /s

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: How many were actually developed

            Region lock? Isn't that an MPAA thing?


            1. TeeCee Gold badge

              Re: How many were actually developed

              Extra! Extra! Man gets joke! Pictures at 11.

          2. Mark Exclamation

            Re: How many were actually developed

            What makes you think I'm from the US? Oh yeah, Chinese supporters are targeting them. Chinese targeting system missed.

    2. IGotOut Silver badge

      Re: How many were actually developed

      Well considering Huawei's R&D budget is bigger than most of silicon valley, I'd say developed.

      Thus and the fact the Chinese plas a high emphasis on maths and science in education it's no surprise.

      1. Mark Exclamation

        Re: How many were actually developed

        "Thus and the fact the Chinese plas a high emphasis on stealing whatever they can from the West it's no surprise." TFTFY.

        1. RobThBay

          Re: How many were actually developed

          I read a book about rise and fall of Blackberry (RIM) a few years ago. When the RCMP were moving into a couple RIM's former research centres they discovered all kinds of spy stuff hidden in the building. They think it was feeding back to China and helped them accelerate their "research".

          1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

            Re: How many were actually developed

            Yes but it did enable cheap Chinese Blackberry phones allowing Blackberry OS to become the dominate platform today and leaving RIM as the global trillion $ business.

  3. jake Silver badge

    Have we even ...

    ... finalized the 5G spec yet? Last time I checked, the answer was no. Remember the 56K modem fiasco? Let China have their WinModem patents. Who cares?

    1. sanmigueelbeer

      Re: Have we even ...

      Better yet, let China have 6G and the rest of the world "skip" to 7G.

      Everybody WINS!

    2. Charlie Clark Silver badge

      Re: Have we even ...

      Well, as developments over the last decade have shown: in order to have an industry, you need to be involved in developing the technology. Remember Nortel, Lucent, Motorola? Huawei, ZTE and others have been producing great equipment for years – Huawei particularly should be singled out for developing low power base stations – that we nearly all use.

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Diminishing returns...

    I barely noticed the "upgrade" from 3G to 4G. At some point people must realise that this stuff is just a data pipe.

    The limiting factor is "how much are you going to charge me for this?" It's not a technology problem.

    Apple, Microsoft and Google should get together and agree on replacing phone numbers with Skype/Facetime/whatever. Then phones will be dead and 6G just another Internet protocol.

    1. katrinab Silver badge

      Re: Diminishing returns...

      I didn't notice the upgrade from 2G to 3G, or 3G to 4G. What I did notice is the improvements that later revisions to the spec brought, and I think 5G will go the same way.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Diminishing returns...

        Do you have examples? There was a speed boost in my data, but I suspect that may have been an "early adopter" phenomenon that went away as more people upgraded.

        I think there was more gained by websites building mobile versions, and battery improvements...

    2. Proton_badger

      Re: Diminishing returns...

      A lot of people won't notice the upgrade to 5G and after the fact in cities they will never realize that if they hadn't upgraded to sub-6 5G they would have suffered more and more congestion.

  5. Chris G

    I don't see the point of 6G, after we have all been infected with 5G borne covid, had our brains riddled with 5G borne cancer and then operating smoothly under the 5G mind control system, what is 6G going to be for?

    Maybe it can reach the last hold outs by penetrating their tin foil hats and Faraday suits.

    Can't wait to see what the tin foil hatters have to say about 6G.

    1. vtcodger Silver badge


      6G will be wonderful! The wolf will live with the lamb, the leopard will lie down with the goat, the calf and the lion and the yearling together. And all the cops will have wooden legs. And the bulldogs all will have rubber teeth. And the hens will lay soft-boiled eggs. And the farmers' trees will be full of fruit

      And yes, there will be hookers. And blackjack.

      1. TimMaher Silver badge

        Re: Hookers and blackjack.

        You forgot to mention hangover free alcohol.

      2. Danny 14

        Re: 6G

        and covid will make your farts smell like roses rather than infect your lungs.

        1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

          Re: 6G

          If you combine 5G and 6G you get 11G which is obviously better, it's one faster for a start

      3. adam 40 Silver badge

        Re: 666G

        That's it.

      4. Chris G

        Re: 6G


        I wasn't aware of any of that, I'm in!

        I like blackjack and a nice young lady at my shoulder while I am playing is always nice.

        Will there be any decent bourbon at the tables?

    2. Disgusted Of Tunbridge Wells Silver badge

      6G is just 5G but without the covid

  6. Binraider Silver badge

    Given China's long standing and utter disdain for intellectual property rights, why should anyone here give two hoots about patents held out there too?

    Shipping costs and rising wages (even with an artificially suppressed currency) mean that producing in China isn't as appealing as it used to be anymore.

    1. vtcodger Silver badge

      Our house, our rules

      Given China's long standing and utter disdain for intellectual property rights, why should anyone here give two hoots about patents held out there too?

      It's we in the West who put our faith in "Intellectual Property". The Chinese are surely well aware that the wheels started to come off the patent system in the late 19th century and that it is now a vast swamp of (intentionally) incomprehensible documentation presided over by hordes of vicious and insatiable lawyers.

      The Chinese want to sell to us stuff. A lot of stuff. Patents are one of the things they will need. So they have patents (in our system BTW). Lots of patents apparently. quelle surprise

      1. Disgusted Of Tunbridge Wells Silver badge

        Re: Our house, our rules

        and they mean nothing if the civilised world says "your patents are all invalid"

    2. codejunky Silver badge


      I think your two sentences are related pretty strongly. China didnt care about patents when it was a basket case from the good old socialism days, but in a short amount of time it has managed to catch up to a more civilised and world participating country.

      When they didnt actually create anything intellectually valuable it didnt care about stealing and was too poor to be creative. Now is a very different country.

      *Btw good comment, upvote from me

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: @Binraider

        “to procure all such machines as are known in any part of EuropeAmerica.”

        Eventually we will write a musical about him

  7. Dr. G. Freeman

    So how many Gs to go until we get to H ?

    1. Danny 14

      that would certainly be a handful.

  8. StrangerHereMyself Silver badge


    The West should simply define its own 6G standard, where we shuffle the bitfields around a little bit and patent the resulting standard.

    I mean, that's what China used to do with their own digital TV standard, so why shouldn't we do the same?

    1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      Re: 6G-W

      Texas should have it's own separate 6G standards to stop any of that Commie/Yankee/Liberal data getting in.

  9. A. Coatsworth Silver badge


    The $0.25 army is on a roll today defending the Middle Kingdom's honor!

  10. steelpillow Silver badge

    Crystal balls

    So the West will develop its own competing 6G standards with its own patent portfolio to provide the gravy train.

    An intellectual-property-free global open standard for talking to each other is just gonna have to wait.

    You know, if China ate more of its own dogfood I might buy into a bit more this taking-the-Western-capitalist-bastards-down-a-peg-or-two shit.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Oh yes, please, I want a nuclear plant in my pants

    Has anyone noticed just how much battery increased mobile data rates take, and for what?

    When I'm travelling and possibly not near a power supply for a while I limit my phone to 3G. Email and messages still come through fine, but battery life increases dramatically. I wonder if with 6G you would actually make it out of the room where the charger resides. Hence the titel of this, er, œuvre :).

    However, what I AM a big believer in is the demise of roaming data limits other than for people taking the mick by piping torrents. I am presently using a subscription with unlimited EU calls and roaming data, and it really changes the way you work.

    So let's fix some fundamentals first before we give mobile phone companies yet another excuse to up their rates for "investment", especially since 4G is as yet not everywhere, let alone 5G.

  12. Anonymous Coward

    Face it, we're lagging

    The anti China comments, while justified in other cases, here seem akin to the old conspiracy theories that Ancient Egyptians couldn't have built the pyramids without outside help.

    The reality is that Chinese companies and the Chinese government invests a lot more on research than Western companies and governments. In the West we tend to focus on more concrete results (figuratively and literally).

    In the West, 6G is mainly viewed by companies as a new product opportunity by manufacturers and a marketing point and justification for rate hikes by telecom providers.

    1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      Re: Face it, we're lagging

      But they can't possibly have invented 6G ahead of us.

      How many really first class MBA / PPE graduates do they have running their industry?

      1. Mark192

        Re: Face it, we're lagging

        "But they can't possibly have invented 6G ahead of us.

        How many really first class MBA / PPE graduates do they have running their industry?"

        This is dripping with sarcasm in the same way that Niagara Falls is dripping with water :-D

    2. jake Silver badge

      Re: Face it, we're lagging

      Those conspiracy theories about the pyramids were/are only propagated by loonies. Nobody with any kind of real scientific background believed/s them.

      "The reality is that Chinese companies and the Chinese government invest a lot more on "borrowing" research from Western companies and governments."

      FTFY (Or perhaps you can point out several new innovations made by the Chinese in the last couple years? Personally, I can't think of even one, unless you include new ways of selling schlock to idiots "innovative marketing".)

      "In the West, 6G is mainly viewed by companies as a new product opportunity by manufacturers and a marketing point"

      Of course. That is what companies do. Even Chinese ones.

      "and justification for rate hikes by telecom providers."

      Assumes facts not in evidence. In the roughly half century that I have been making money in this field, the trend has always been faster and cheaper.

  13. DS999 Silver badge

    What's the point of 6G?

    The only real improvement of 5G over LTE is reduced latency. Given the same spectrum, 5G is no faster than LTE, and even if you use denser QAM constellations the improvements at this point are marginal (and you'll pay for it with range, because Shannon's Law)

    The only reason 5G is (or rather will be, eventually) capable of achieving the very high speeds its backers bragged out is by using very wide swathes of spectrum - which means going way up in frequency where range is short and almost anything can block it. That's fine if you want to outfit a stadium or Times Square with fast cellular, but it is useless in most places.

    From the sound of the article, 6G will go even higher in spectrum into terahertz range, to find even bigger swathes of spectrum to enable even higher speeds. So what's the use case for that, given that 5G using mmwave will be able to exceed 10 gigabits? Nevermind who the hell can use that in a phone, no one could ever use that much to their home. Heck, most office towers probably couldn't use that much even if everyone is on a Zoom call at the same time.

    1. jake Silver badge

      Re: What's the point of 6G?

      "So what's the use case for that"

      Well, I can create documents and spreadsheets and databases to run a business using Wordstar and Lotus and dBase on DOS 3.3 and a 486DX33 + dial-up modem easier (and quite a bit faster!) than on more modern Office 355 and the latest Tiger Lake processor + 5G. Imagine what improvements Redmond and Intel will bring us in the next 30 years!

      Mom says I'm entirely too sarcastic. In this case, I think I lowballed it.

      1. David 132 Silver badge
        Thumb Up

        Re: What's the point of 6G?

        Jake, I'm inclined to agree with your sentiment, but think about your analogy for a moment. Creating documents and spreadsheets is a baseline capability these days. How would your DOS-based 486DX33 fare, say, playing a 1080p video stream, or transcoding that stream to h265? Go ahead, try it, I'll wait :)

        Or to put it another way... "I don't see the point in these new cars. I can trundle the mile-and-a-half once a week to the village store at 15mph just as well in my Model T Ford as in any new car..."

        1. jake Silver badge

          Re: What's the point of 6G?

          My businesses don't require transcoding 1080p to h265. Do yours? If so, purchase the correct tool for the job. If not, save your money.

          Most of my vehicle fleet is pre 1971, and I intend to keep it that way. The Model T and Model A can both do considerably more than 15 MPH. See this post from ten years ago. If I want to go into town at a leisurely pace, I'll take the Buckboard. Clyde (the Percheron) enjoys it, too. If you care, he gets around 35 miles on 3 flakes of oat hay and one of alfalfa, plus all the spring greens that he wants to eat and unlimited fresh water. (Note that he's a 14 year old, and in really good shape. Your horse's mileage may vary.)

          Life's short. Step off the treadmill once in a while. Relax, have a homebrew.

  14. Claptrap314 Silver badge

    And just yesterday...

    There was an article warning that China was working to shape the landscape...

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Patents, in this case, are less "original practical inventions", and more "techincal standards". But the standards can only become standards when agreed upon but sufficient number of players. The whole concept of patenting technical standards is absurd. (In fact China did not start that absurdity.)

    If China domestic infrastructure commits early to a certain standard of 6G, that only makes it easier for a competing group of countries to standardize to a slightly different standard leaving China in the lurch having to manufacture to two different standards. I believe something like that happened to various Japanese technical standards back in the day.

    On the other hand China is much bigger and more aggressive player than Japan ever was. If China keeps accumulating manufacturing capacity in high tech while the west sheds its own, then maybe everybody will just go along with it, because high tech manufacturing is so much less important than manufacturing financial instruments.

  16. Tempest

    The Ignorant Speak - How Many of Them Have Actually Visited China?

    Upfront: I am Canadian, white. and widely traveled. That said, I do not agree. or support, the political regimes in many Far Eastern countries. Sure, China imprisons prisoners of conscious, I have seen the many daunting prisons in NanNing - but the USA is the world leader in prison populations.

    Back in the day everyone CLAIMED the Japanese exploited world markets by copying designs, then it was TaiWan - now the world's leader in semiconductor production - doing the same. Now it is China!

    True, all three were / are guilty of plagiarism but the truth is all three have put other, Western, 'leading' countries to shame by their own efforts, home grown efforts.

    And, I presume, Western entities don't copy other Western companies or Far Eastern companies? I have worked in Western companies where competitors products were torn apart looking for ideas.

    The fact is the Western world couldn't enjoy it's high standard of living without Far Eastern countries. India sources almost ALL the generic pharmaceuticals of the world. Where could Apple, et al, assemble their products in the West.

    Why is it that Foreign-born individuals are sought after by Western countries? The WOMAN leading the US Mars lander program hails from Burmese (Myanmar) heritage. And who is running Microsoft? Foreign-born Nadella from Hyderabad, Andhra Pradesh, India. Yet more Foreign-born talent from Chennai, Tamil Nadu, India runs Alphabet (Google) .

    If it isn't racism, it must be elitism causing all these accusations. Jealously, too. The fact is certain cultures are better suited for certain types of work than others.

    I design electronic devices for government and commercial use but most every design is reviewed by optimization companies in China, the physical design and the circuitry are analysed by separate unrelated companies, to avoid copying. I know our products are great.

    If the commenters are so talented, let them produce products in the West!

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