Co-founder of coronavirus vaccine biz holds in-person tech event... 20+ attendees later test positive for COVID-19

Attendees of the Abundance 360 Summit in January paid $15,000 or more to attend an in-person event that arguably shouldn't have happened under California's December 5, 2020, stay at home order. And for that price, 12 of the 30 who showed up left with a COVID-19 infection. So too did four of the nine A360 faculty and five of …

[Anonymous Coward]

Not me

There is a growing attitude that while COVID-19 is a problem that needs to be addressed, it's really a problem for other people but not for me.

The attitude is not confined to anti-vaxxers or mask protesters. We see it in demands that schools or restaurants or bars or whatever reopen. That travel is bad except for my travel. That I don't need to isolate.

It could be the death of us.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Not me

It's a trade-off, risk/reward, as with many things.

Opening bars & restauarants clearly makes no sense, they are places where masks won't be used and alcohol will affect peoples' judgement. Owners of such businesses need to be supported, of course, but that's part of the overall government response.

School are different. You have to trade off the damage done to the next generation by missing classes against the very low risk of harm to a group of people who rarely catch the virus, and who are at very low risk of even moderately severe consequences.

Sheilding the vulnerable while minimizing the damage to society is not an easy calculation, which is why we need to follow the data and not get carried away by social media panic. It is also essential to remember that the death rate for most people who catch this is still very low. It isn't the Black Death, or even close.

[Occasional Comentard]

Re: Not me

"School are different. You have to trade off the damage done to the next generation by missing classes against the very low risk of harm to a group of people who rarely catch the virus, and who are at very low risk of even moderately severe consequences.'

One word : Teachers.

[iron]

Re: Not me

> One word : Teachers.

And their families. Covid may not be particularly dangerous to children, although we have no idea if there are long term effects for them, but it can be very dangerous for teachers and their families. My sister is a university lecturer, she caught Covid from her students and passed it to both her husband and two adult daughters who live at home. That was 5 months ago, her husband still can't breathe properly and can't return to work because he has no energy.

So sure Covid may or may not be a big risk for your kids but it definitely is a big risk for teachers and their families.

[NullNix]

Re: Not me

Also the families of everyone at school. Just because children are almost entirely asymptomatic doesn't mean they can't pass it on. Members of five families in my sister's daughter's class caught covid-19 in the same week: obviously this means they almost certainly caught it from their children.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Not me

One word : Teachers.

Yeah, I have 4 in the family. Two are retired, two have been teaching right through. If they are in a vulnerable category then of course they should be shielding, otherwise it doesn't change the overall situation.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Not me

Spot the difference:

A neighbour's kid is at private school. The school has arranged to continue much as before except the kid is at home. School day is the usual hours, kids must wear uniform, teaching is online (but not all day, there are offline tasks). Parents go to the school once a week mostly to pick up teaching aids but can also drop off work for marking where that's a better choice than email.

Another neighbours kid is at state school. Mother is grumbling that the kid is home all day needing constant attention and the teachers aren't providing much support.

Private schools risk going bust if their income dries up, can't afford teacher salaries, school and teachers strongly motivated to innovate and to do everything they can to keep providing a quality service.

State teachers get paid regardless

[ComputerSays_noAbsolutelyNo]

Re: Not me

The major side-effect of the pandemic: a total loss of empathy in wide sections of society.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Not me

a total loss of empathy in wide sections of society.

Loss of empathy for whom? Those whose lives are being damaged by the virus, or those whose lives are being ruined by the response?

It's called pragmatism. Balance the damage caused by an excessively strict response against that caused by an excessively lax one. Somewhere in the middle is the right path, one that adapts to the risk for each part of the population, and doesn't unnecessarily destroy lives for years to come.

[ComputerSays_noAbsolutelyNo]

Re: Not me

Think of all the arguments you come across when it comes to testing/measures/vaccination and apply them to other fields.

When the pandemic started, all the just-a-flu people remarked that death is a fact of life.

So, no recalls for faulty cars that kill its drivers, since death is a part of life?

When wide-spread testing was mulled, people argued that a test is just a single data point in time.

So, no more breathalyzer tests searching for drunk drivers, since it is only a snaphot.

When wide-spread testing was mulled, people argued against mandatory tests.

So, no more breathalyzer tests, since they are evil mandatory ones.

In my country, refusing a breathalyzer test gets you into the books with an assume 1.4 promille alcohol.

Guess what, being tested positive for Corona has mild implications compared to a driving under the influence.

When vaccinations were mulled, people argued against using allegedly unproven technology on the public.

So, no more "self-driving" cars. In contrast to vaccinations, the "self-driving" has killed people.

I find what has been going on during the pandemic is more than just pragmatism.

Disregarding quarantine, calling a mask-wearing mandate tyranny, etc. goes way beyond anything that I have considered acceptable prior to the pandemic.

Politicians arguing agains lock-downs, citing death being a part of life, are in my eyes bare of empathy.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Not me

Well, that's a long list of non-seqiturs, and how do you get from "schools should stay open where possible, to avoid damaging children's futures" to "calling a mask-wearing mandate tyranny," ???

Oh, and I'm not "arguing agains lock-downs, citing death being a part of life", I'm pointing out that lockdowns do harm as well, and it is important to balance that harm against the extra risk to life from the virus.

[Yes Me]

Re: Not me

" Somewhere in the middle is the right path "

Not really. As far as I can tell, the evidence from many developed countries is clear: sooner and stricter lockdowns do less economic damage and destroy fewer companies. The right path is not in the middle at all. The business community has this wrong.

[Zolko]

Re: Not me

"It could be the death of us."

yes, the mountains of dead corpses lingering on all street corners is frightening. Wearing face-masks isn't enough, 2 masks is a stop-gap, we should go directly to 5 masks, that'll teach that virus some lesson :

https://www.theonion.com/fuck-everything-were-doing-five-blades-1819584036

[Allan George Dyer]

More data required...

So, what sort of masks were the production crew wearing? Assuming the level of interaction was roughly the same as the participants during the event (possibly a bad assumption, if some stayed in the control room the whole time), the masks appear to have been completely effective at protecting their wearers. We know even improvised masks are highly effective at protecting other people if the wearer is infected and asymptomatic. Were the crew wearing N95 masks, or something less effective?

[Notas Badoff]

Pre-learning - it's a thing.

"As an M.D. and scientist, I have a special responsibility to learn from mistakes, ..."

“Only a fool learns from his own mistakes. The wise man learns from the mistakes of others.”

Otto von Bismarck

Learn? You failed. You learn by the observation of mistakes and avoiding those mistakes. You do not repeat time-worn mistakes and call it 'instructive'.

"Lessons have been learned" was never said by anyone who paying attention to begin with.

[Potemkine!]

Re: Pre-learning - it's a thing.

The same Otto von Bismarck whose policies and actions led to WW1?

[ComputerSays_noAbsolutelyNo]

Re: Pre-learning - it's a thing.

Well, he left office in 1890. So, one could argue that WW1 wasn't his immediate fault.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_von_Bismarck

[Potemkine!]

Re: Pre-learning - it's a thing.

So you think the creation of the Reichsland of Alsace-Lorraine whose annexation was asked by Bismarck was not a root cause of WW1?

[Claptrap314]

Re: Pre-learning - it's a thing.

No, it was the abandonment of his policies, specifically the refusal to renew the treaty with Russia, and giving England the cold shoulder. This drove the Russians into the arms of France, and encouraged reapproachment between England & France. Sound familiar?

If you are going to blame anyone, blame Wilhelm. Bismark was a master of grand strategy & he created a Europe which, for the very first time, was safe for Germans.

[Potemkine!]

Re: Pre-learning - it's a thing.

The annexation of the two French provinces was a guarantee there would be another war between France and Germany, whatever the attitude of UK. Note also that as long Bismarck was in power, these provinces elected massively anti-annexation deputies to the Reichstag.

Bismarck's "three emperors" policies was going to be doomed anyway because two of these empires were so fragile they would have end by collapse. Bismarck sow the seeds of WW1 with his annexation policies, as the Polish Corridor sowed the seeds of WW2 by separating Germany in two.

he created a Europe which, for the very first time, was safe for Germans

He created a Europe so safe for Germans that it led to two World Wars, over 6 millions german deads, and the total annihilation of the country, who ceased to exist in 1945.

[Claptrap314]

Re: Pre-learning - it's a thing.

Let me get this straight. His chancellorship ended in 1890. From 1871 until 1914, there were a total of ZERO European wars in Germany. That's forty-three years. And again, the alliance system that led to WWI was created in response to Germany abandoning his policies.

Look, if you don't like the guy personally, that's fine. I certainly do not. But I'm not going to blame him for the results of actions he opposed.

[Kevin McMurtrie]

"virtually all have fully recovered"

The people excluded by whatever "virtually all" means probably aren't liking that cheerful statement on their 20+ day of illness. I hope they recover soon.

[don't you hate it when you lose your account]

Coughs and sneezes

Spread diseases.

Me parents taught me that. Didn’t take multiple degrees to learn it.

[Andre Carneiro]

"immunity boosting" from intravenous vitamins and minerals, and "regenerative immunity-boosting therapies, known to boost COVID resistance."

This from a Harvard MD and clearly a brighter/than-average guy? Wow.

[Anonymous Coward]

> "immunity boosting" from intravenous vitamins and minerals, and "regenerative immunity-boosting therapies, known to boost COVID resistance."

> This from a Harvard MD and clearly a brighter/than-average guy? Wow.

Perhaps we should write to Harvard and ask if they will be rescinding his degree? Oh, wait, he's a rich entrepreneur and therefore future potential donor, if not already. As you were then.

[Pete 2]

Only a matter of time

> 12 of the 30 who showed up left with a COVID-19 infection.

ISTM that the sort of person who would attend an event like this and therefore ignore all the advice, guidelines and laws is going to be in the front line of Covid-catchers. If they hadn't caught it at this event, then they would only have caught it somewhere else, given their unconventional approach to avoiding infection.

As for the other 18 attendees: you have to wonder whether they had already had Covid.

[katrinab]

"immunity boosting" from intravenous vitamins and minerals

I just ....

I have no words

I mean there is some evidence that vitamin D deficiency can increase the severity of symptoms, and given that vitamin D deficiency is a bad thing anyway, and there are no risks from taking reasonable levels of vitamin D supplements, you should do it, and I am doing it.

Just don't expect it to be a magic bullet though. I still take all the other precautions, and once they get to whichever priority group I'm in, probably group 28 or thereabouts, I will take the vaccine.

[Sceptic Tank]

NOVAXX

So the COVAXX didn't work, or could he not be bothered to be vaccinated with his own vaccine?

[PeterM42]

So.....

... The organiser has "..an undergraduate degree in molecular genetics, a graduate degree in aerospace engineering from MIT, and an MD from Harvard Medical School"

And, presumably, a Professorship in STUPIDITY in the University of Life.

[khisanth]

Too many people seem to find wearing mask as being a HUGE inconvenience,pain,affront to their sensibilities,infringement on their "rights" or offensive to them for some reason. Here in the UK most people do wear a mask when out/in shops etc , but STILL there are people who either dont bother, "forget" , "have a condition" or have one but it doesnt cover their nose or face.

and THEY get annoyed/angry if anyone says something! So the potential spreaders of a virus that could KILL you and your loved ones are the ones getting annoyed?