back to article ‘IT professionals increasingly define themselves by capabilities they excel at managing’ says Atlassian chap

“Historically, IT professionals defined themselves by the vendors whose technology they were good at managing,” says John Stame. “Technology consultants might have marketed themselves as experts in Dell systems, or might have advertised their deep expertise with Microsoft tools.” “But it’s increasingly more common for IT …

  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "Little of which, to your humble hack’s mind, is correct outside of a SaaS environment."

    You stole my thunder in the article. The problem is, people like him talk to the PHBs, and the PHBs seem to lap it up and apply it to 'anything in the cloud'.

    To get that high in a company to make that sort of dumb-arse leap of logic takes a special kind of stupid - which seems to be around in greater abundance the higher up the management chain you go.

    1. Peter-Waterman1

      Things get a little Fuzzy with the definition of SaaS in my opinion.

      For me, SaaS is something like O365/Salesforce. But there are a lot of services which are not SaaS but infrastructure but yet don't require patching, upgrading, maintenance. From an AWS perspective, I am talking about SQS https://aws.amazon.com/sqs/, Lambda https://aws.amazon.com/lambda/, Dynamo DB, https://aws.amazon.com/dynamodb/, S3, https://aws.amazon.com/dynamodb/. All of which don't do a lot on their own and wouldn't fall into a "SaaS" category but can be used to build applications that don't require patching, maintenance and general overhead. Azure has a similar set of Services

      1. Cederic Silver badge

        Well, there's SaaS and IaaS and DaaS (data) and 'Cloud' and sometimes it's better to ignore the buzzwords and focus on the specifics.

        I would though challenge the "don't require patching, maintenance and general overhead". Those burdens change but don't disappear, and it's important that project sponsors and business leaders understand this.

        1. Peter-Waterman1

          The services I mention absolutely don't require patching, upgrading or maintenance. They are run by AWS and you don't get access to the underlying infrastructure so you would not be able to patch it even if you wanted to!

          1. Nick Ryan Silver badge

            The point is, what you build using them requires patching, upgrading and maintenance. Often as a result of the patches, upgrading and maintenance performed by someone else, on their schedule, to the services that are used.

            1. Cederic Silver badge

              Indeed. There's also the "bugger, they've patched the infrastructure, we have to regression test the system and its integrations" overheads even where there's no obvious change.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          SaaS IaaS and DaaS

          Stupidity, Idiocy and Daft as a service ...

          Yup we supply them all.

          AC obliviously ...

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Managers tend to rise to the level of their incompetence.

      1. RM Myers Silver badge
        Unhappy

        Or above.

        1. Strahd Ivarius Silver badge

          you mean, they go into politics?

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    “In an on-prem setting, IT professionals only interact with vendors at the point of sale, after which those in infrastructure management roles are responsible"

    Hmm.. there was me thinking that as someone paid to manage infrastructure, I was an IT *professional* ... you know, on account of being PAID to work with IT!

    Maybe I should add "IT Professional" to my skills list on Li / CV etc given that I both manage infra AND go to vendor meetings?

    1. seven of five Silver badge

      You probably should not. I went fine as "sysadmin" for the past twenty years - if someone wants to know more, he can always come over and ask. Just be damn sure you can cope with the answer.

  3. Pascal Monett Silver badge

    Not surprising

    It is hardly surprising that this Stame is a high-ranking manager, he's got the knack for not saying anything useful in more than enough words.

    He also manages to contradict himself when he says that IT workers no longer define themselves by the product they're good at but by the skills they have, then goes on to say that they refer to themselves as AWS or Azure specialists.

    He calls himself a strategist, but he has clearly been working more on the sales side of the business.

    No wonder he can spout so much bull without thinking.

    1. macjules Silver badge

      Re: Not surprising

      I do not know anyone at all who describes themselves as an “IT Professional” and come to think of it I do not think I have ever heard it used outside of people who suffer from the Dunning–Kruger effect.

      1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

        Re: Not surprising

        Presumably, people who agree with him are part of the self-selecting "IT Professional elite".

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Not surprising

          That sounds suspiciously like the thoroughly out of touch members of the "Elite computer users" club, society, group or whatever at the BCS.

      2. Spanners Silver badge

        Re: Not surprising

        “IT Professional”

        Sometimes I pick that description from a drop-down list when I renew my subscription to an IT publication.

      3. rcxb Silver badge
        Joke

        Re: Not surprising

        I can think of a few IT Professionals: https://addictedtohorrormovies.files.wordpress.com/2017/08/it-vintage.jpg

  4. Magani
    Unhappy

    Here's a choice

    Do you want to manage, or actually do something productive? It would seem that some 'IT Professionals' have gone for the former.

  5. Nick Ryan Silver badge
    FAIL

    The post offers the observation “Simply put, moving to cloud releases IT teams from time-intensive maintenance of on-prem technology infrastructure. No more downtime to install updates, and no need to worry about expensive technology falling out of date.”

    This "observation" in itself makes it clear that this guy has absolutely no clue whatsoever and should bugger right off. Probably go work for Gartner or somewhere suitably useless and just more blatantly paid-for "research" that coincidendally backs up the claims of whoever paid for it.

  6. amanfromMars 1 Silver badge

    A Semantic Web Developer writes in ...... and questions an answer ?

    Is that then indicative of the rise of the consultant vapourware agent in the new age style of a financial market expert?

    I can't see that as being enormously contestable in many ways, but it is sure to be implausibly denied [:-) as may be shown with a number of down votes here on this thread comment on El Reg, although without further contextual textual clarification accompanying any disagreement is such an opportunity for the sharing of an alternate wisdom immediately lost and presently squandered]

    Some folk just have far too much time on their hands and not enough wit to use it in these spaces and media places constructively.

  7. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

    "No more downtime to install updates"

    Just unscheduled downtime when the cloud provider goes down.

    If I just leave that there some cloud apologist will be along to explain that despite the usual shtick about cloud taking care of resilience the punter has to arrange for multiple clouds yada yada yada to look after that.

    And there goes this guy's argument that IT professionals no longer define themselves by the technology they manage. They now have to manage those aspects of cloud technology.

    “But it’s increasingly more common for IT professionals to define themselves by the capabilities they excel at managing, like recruiting, marketing, finance and accounting, or sales tech.”

    It sounds more like the way HR and agency pimps want to define them.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      I remember a case when working with a cloudy Oracle product...

      Oracle applied a patch on their system, and immediately we lost the ability to upload files from our systems because the patch misapplied permissions...

      So unscheduled downtime of a few hours waiting for Oracle support to understand that their people screwed up big time, up to the moment our CEO escalated to Larry by menacing to remove his boat from the America's Cup...

  8. Cederic Silver badge

    Recruiters still want technology experts

    I was turned down for a role because my CV didn't explicitly mention a given technology, even though the role never goes hands-on with the tech, the underlying principles match multiple other cloud services I've successfully introduced to multiple organisations and I have actually brought in that vendor's software in exactly that role.

    But no, I didn't list one specific technology (which wasn't mentioned in the job advert) so no job for me. Maybe I should add 18 pages to my CV to cover all of the programming languages build toolchains, databases, integration tools, applications, services and SaaS, IaaS (infrastructure), DaaS, IaaS (integration) and other technologies I've used during my career.

    But no, foolishly I focus on the value I can add to an employer, the things I can help them achieve and do better, and the reasons they should employ me, instead of playing buzzword bingo. Sigh.

    1. Hollerithevo

      Re: Recruiters still want technology experts

      I hate to be rude, but it is definitely a foolish approach. All employers, in my experience, want the buzzwords and score by buzzwords. I have interviewed candidates and I look for all the proprietary names as an indication that the person actually did work on something real. I have had candidates insisting that they could do this and that, but when pressed, turned out they did something small in a very inexpert way.

      You can be pure and put on your CV what you feel employers should want to be looking for, or you can put on it what they are actually expecting to see. I am not sure I would want to interview someone who felt he could present his skills and experience in the way I should have wanted, if I could only be as smart as the candidate.

      1. Cederic Silver badge

        Re: Recruiters still want technology experts

        The problem comes when the technologies I've used have been bought and had their names changed. I can't honestly put SAP HANA on my CV but I've deployed Sybase, I worked for an ERP company, I've designed and governed the implementation of multiple Microsoft, Oracle and Amazon cloud database implementations, I've designed and built SaaS solutions, used dozens and, incidentally, I've selected a SAP cloud application for the business I worked for and guided its implementation.

        But no, they're filtering on SAP HANA for a role that should never actually touch the technology.

        If only recruiters could be smart enough to understand what they actually need, rather than just looking for an in-depth technology expert for a non-hands-on role.

    2. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: Recruiters still want technology experts

      You're probably well out of it.

  9. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    So...

    "Stame is Atlassian’s senior manager for enterprise architecture and SaaS management"

    Just last month he was the Dell Documentation Librarian. Then he got a title change.

    1. Fruit and Nutcase Silver badge

      Re: So...

      There is obviously a gap in the market that Atlassian can plug that helps us IT plebs make sense out of all this jargon and find our position in the cloudy world

  10. LeahroyNake

    Updated CV

    I left in the parts that stated Service and IT manager with 15 years experience of on premise IT support (lists multiple IT / Microsoft and vendor qualifications) then added design and implementation of cloud solutions. I have done a few on premise to Office 36~ migrations. It's not hard to do and I charge by the hour so I'm actually making more off the cloudy customers than with the sensible ones that have stayed on premise. Great fun when they go offline for a few hours, just had a look and is working again / send invoice. With the on site jobs I have to 'leave the house and brave the pandemic' :0 WTF leave the house ! That raid array can still function fine with 2 drives down, call me when they arrive and I will stick them in for you, just stay the hell away from me in my hazmat suit lol

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