back to article The incumbent President of the United States of America ran now-banned Facebook ads loaded with Nazi references

Facebook has removed online ads and posts by President Trump's reelection campaign for violating its rules prohibiting "organized hate," a step the ad biz has been reluctant to take. The ads, which are said to have been circulating on Facebook since June 3, 2020, claimed that dangerous mobs of left-wing groups are running riot …

  1. ratfox Silver badge
    Devil

    Waiting for the Trump campaign to claim they were using it as a symbol of family planning.

    1. Snake Silver badge

      I'm waiting for the conservative snowflakes to complain that it's all a liberal conspiracy.

      Count to 3. 3, 2, 1...

    2. TheMeerkat Bronze badge

      The Left knows they are going to loose the election after thugs from BLM provided them with the voters who are now very weary of the alternative.

      So they try to invent excuses to block the president’s campaign inventing random meaning to symbols and then blaming the supporters for using them

      1. sabroni Silver badge

        thugs from BLM

        They didn't turn up, remember? Our thugs protect statues by attacking the police.

        Try and keep up.

      2. Rameses Niblick the Third Kerplunk Kerplunk Whoops Where's My Thribble? Silver badge

        "So they try to invent excuses to block the president’s campaign inventing random meaning to symbols and then blaming the supporters for using them"

        Given as the red triangle symbol was provably used in concentration camps by nazis, does this comment count as holocaust denial?

        1. itzman

          Golly. RED trangles?

          I never realised I've been carrying Nazi symbols in the boot of my car AS REQUIRED BY EU LAW

          1. Rameses Niblick the Third Kerplunk Kerplunk Whoops Where's My Thribble? Silver badge

            Re: Golly. RED trangles?

            I never realised I've been carrying Nazi symbols in the boot of my car AS REQUIRED BY EU LAW

            You may be carrying all sorts of nazi paraphernalia around in your car, that's your business. There is no EU law mandating that you do so.

            However, for the hard of thinking, lets be clear:

            One of the nazi symbols is a red triangle. That DOES NOT mean all red triangles are nazi symbols, including the red warning triangle you allude to in your post. (triangle outline usually, points upwards when erected as opposed to the solid red downward pointing triangle shown in the twitter post referenced in the article)

            Lets try another: The Ford logo is a blue oval. Not all blue ovals are Ford logos!

            Again: The Reg logo is a vulture. Not all vultures are Reg logos

            Another: The US president is a lying orange shyster with stupid hair. Not all lying orange shysters with stupid hair are US presidents.

            1. Someone Else Silver badge

              Re: Golly. RED trangles?

              Another: The US president is a lying orange shyster with stupid hair. Not all lying orange shysters with stupid hair are US presidents.

              Probably true in the abstract. However, how many other lying orange shysters with stupid hair do you know that aren't US presidents?

              I know, I'm asking you to prove the negative....

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Golly. RED trangles?

                Probably true in the abstract. However, how many other lying orange shysters with stupid hair do you know that aren't US presidents?

                Um, Boris Johnson?

                1. Someone Else Silver badge

                  Re: Golly. RED trangles?

                  Point taken. Well done.

            2. caradoc

              Re: Golly. RED trangles?

              What a masterful putdown. Do you give lessons? I am a little worried about traffic signs though. Does an inverted red triangle mean give way to fascists in 50 yards, or social justice warriors?

          2. James O'Shea

            Re: Golly. RED trangles?

            Red triangles, _point down_, are Nazi symbols. Red triangles, usually hollow red triangles, _point up_, are traffic safety symbols. I know what I think about those who can't tell the difference.

            1. Jemma Silver badge

              Re: Golly. RED trangles?

              Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

              20% of the entire human race (that are considered "normal" and not mentally disabled etc) is too mentally feeble to pick up a bolt action rifle, load it and point it in the right direction. EVEN AFTER WEEKS OF BEING TRAINED. They are literally too dumb to grasp the concept of throwing something to hit a given target. "When Mr Safety Catch is not on Mr Crossbow is not your friend" is PhD level thinking to these people.

              This is deeply scary.

              What is more scary is that these people can get driving licences, hold gun licences, and are allowed to vote in elections. Has it not occurred to anyone else to wonder why the Conservative Party gets elected or Donnie Dickwit or how it is that the Poles OF ALL PEOPLE are embracing right wing sociopaths as we speak?

              Driving should be privilege, not a right, and anyone who tells me "ooh, I deserve a licence to drive on the road despite being unable to control my body/see/etc - because self driving cars" can piss off because self driving cars don't work, will never work and are inherently unsafe.

              Voting should also be a privilege because if you are too utterly dumb to even understand what you are being promised (let alone understanding that you are being lied to every time) you shouldn't be allowed to corrupt the signal by voting. Voting should be compulsory for anyone at or above the average IQ.

              Now all I will get is wails of horror or accusations but think on this. The climate change deniers are typically members of the retard ratio. The people who vote for a candidate because "I like his hair" or (in these days of equality) "she's got really big Bulgarian airbags" aren't only dribbling idiots, they are destroying the value of the votes cast by people who aren't dribbling idiots (ie potentially YOU). Electric cars are an unnecessary stupidity - we can already make ersatz fossil fuels from air pollution and sunshine in solar reactors (demonstrated in 2010 on fucking Top Gear for heavens sake) - and they will always be less efficient in totality - but look - 20% in a recent survey would buy an electric car.. That figure sounds familiar. Hmm keep our current infrastructure and constantly recycle our petrol and diesel fuels using sunlight or give Musky-boy a BJ, build a whole new infrastructure and watch our electricity prices go through the ROOF, along with the odd fatal fire because the home electrics can't cope with a muskretinwagen trying to pull power at 300kw.

              This is what the retard ratio has cost you and will continue to cost you. Thatcher, Major, Gormless Gordon, Reichsfuhrerin May and Bubonic Boris. Then we have Reagan, the Shrubs, Clinton and the highlight Il Douche/Darth Dumbass... And a financial crisis every 5 years or so.

              And because of Darth Dumbass we got "I see no virus" Bolsonaro and I will say again - the POLES, you know from Poland, yes THAT Poland, fielding a election candidate that is so far to the right Reinhard Heydrich would be having night terrors and Magda Goebbels would be applying for a divorce to marry him!!

              If that doesn't scare you silly, don't come crying to me later*.

              * I'll be hiding in the climate change and nuclear proof bunker with 50 years worth of French MRE. Not that one, the other one with the big sign over the door saying...

              "I told you so"

              In every known language (including Elvish, Klingon and Vulcan). Maybe we could cosplay having radiation sickness - too soon?

              1. sabroni Silver badge

                Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                Well, would you do us a favour and remove yourself from the gene pool then?

                1. Jemma Silver badge

                  Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                  My recorded IQ is 143. Top 1.5% or thereabouts on the PLANET if I remember correctly. What is yours may I ask, mein herr?

                  I get very tired of what Disney might call "the circle of fuckwits" - because its just round and round in ever increasing levels of dribbling stupidity - the same gormless ideas popping up out of the sewage like uktv re runs of Klepto & Sons and Last of the Summer Whine - of the evergreen "Waiting for Covid" and "Some Mothers Should Have Had Their Tubes Tied" - which is a perfect illustration BTW - Frank Spencer would vote Tory, drive a Nissan Leaf and think climate change involves Barbados once a year...

                  There are 13.4 MILLION of these people in the UK alone. 13.4 MILLION pathologically gormless idiots on our roads, both driving and as pedestrians, voting for our politicians and brexit, responsible for the upkeep of the No Hope Service (which incidentally explains a lot).... You really want people who could shoot themselves with a Bazooka (seriously I'm not kidding) or might even manage to shoot themselves with a PAK 8.8 while standing behind it (there is actually a way) - you really want them involved in your elections, in cars around your family...?

                  Just actually THINK about that for a while..

                  1. sabroni Silver badge

                    Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                    What makes you think an big IQ gives you more right to life?

                    It's your complete lack of emapthy that makes me think your genetics are flawed.

                    1. Warm Braw Silver badge

                      Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                      I've usually found that people who volunteer their IQ as a preemptive strike know there's no other reason anyone would take them seriously.

                      1. CrazyOldCatMan Silver badge

                        Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                        people who volunteer their IQ as a preemptive strike know there's no other reason

                        Well - I took the Mensa test just to see if I could beat my brother. I did. He is now a professor in the US (1st class honours from Oxford, masters and PhD).

                        Me? I didn't even complete my HND. IQ tests sre not an indication of ability, it's being able to use pattern-matching to solve a puzzle. I'm very good at some things (technology being one of them) but useless at anything that requires long-term concentration *unless* it's related to technology.

                        And I'm one of the few techies that can explain technology to non-techies because I have (IMHO) good people skills (and cat skills. And dog skills - anything that needs empathy). My brother, on the other hand...

                        All of which is a very long-winded way of saying that succeeding at IQ tests measures your ability to pass IQ tests and very little else. The one year I was a member of Mensa I came to the conclusion that, as a group, members of Mensa are some of the most boring people around and, in the main, not good at the whole empathy thing. So I didn't bother renewing.

                    2. Jemma Silver badge

                      Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                      I've plenty of empathy - but you are confusing empathy with "suffering fuckwits gladly". We have 10 years to solve climate change - or we miss the boat. That is a HARD LIMIT. We MIGHT make it without the retard ratio, electric cars, and all the other unmitigated bullshit - but I can guarantee we won't if climate denier politicians get in ANYWHERE...

                      Retard denialism is as bad as climate denialism because it allows the latter to continue. We cannot afford either.

                      We cannot afford another Bubonic Boris or Donnie Dickwit/Jair Bullshitnaro but we'll have them because the retard ratio will vote every time and WILL win every time because currently they're the biggest voting block. It's election fact that the higher the education and IQ of a given individual, in a situation where the person can make a personal choice, the LESS likely that person is to vote.. Which gives the retard ratio effectively higher percentage voting power per "85".

                      Depressingly better healthcare is partly to blame for this because previously if you did something monumentally stupid on a regular basis it'd eventually kill you off preferably before you contaminated the gene pool - nowadays retards get put back together and sent on their dribbling swaying way - staring at their phone as they cross the road on the blackspot blind bend on the 60mph limit at 3am in January...

                      Test EVERYONE. If they are average or above they get to vote - else they spend the day in Gerry Daycare(tm) watching Short Circuit II on repeat. They probably won't even notice - they'll be too engrossed in cataloging their ear hairs by length (or stamp collecting).

                      1. Terry Barnes

                        Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                        Can you stop using a term about developmental delay to describe uneducated people please? It’s pretty offensive to those of us with disabled children.

                  2. onemark03

                    "Some Mothers Should Have Had Their Tubes Tied"

                    The trouble is that some mothers should have their tubes tied before they become mothers.

                    After is too late.

                    Bring on the downvotes.

                  3. John PM Chappell

                    Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                    "My recorded IQ is 143. Top 1.5% or thereabouts on the PLANET if I remember correctly."

                    You don't remember correctly, and we don't believe you, anyway. Happy to help with that.

                  4. Anonymous Coward
                    Anonymous Coward

                    Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                    >My recorded IQ is 143. Top 1.5% or thereabouts

                    Meaningless without reference to the test.

                    However, given British Mensa use the Cattell test, your score is too low, as you need to have scored at least 148 to be accepted as being in the top 2%..

                    1. Anonymous Coward
                      Anonymous Coward

                      Re: Eugenics - Sometimes a good decision - is what I think.

                      > scored at least 148 to be

                      I got 165. And I'm only good at two things - technology and passing IQ tests.

              2. phuzz Silver badge
                Devil

                Re: Golly. RED trangles?

                Has bob registered a new account?

                One way to check; Hey Jemma, what's your thought's on Windows 10's GUI design?

              3. tfb Silver badge
                Alien

                Re: Golly. RED trangles?

                It's hard to keep up with the stupidity here (almost the only reliable thing you can say about eugenics and IQ is that people who believe in them are not terribly smart), but

                Hmm keep our current infrastructure and constantly recycle our petrol and diesel fuels using sunlight

                So, if that was easy, people would be doing it, right. Or is there a conspiracy to stop them? Who runs the conspiracy?

                Oh, right, there is no conspiracy, it's not easy, Top Gear is not a reliable source of information on this, and instead of making petrol you can just pump power into batteries and it's better. Who knew?

      3. Nameless Faceless Computer User

        Spoken like a true FOX news viewer

        The question should be, What was the inspiration of using an inverted red triangle? Did he make it up because he liked the shape? Was he inspired by transportation safety symbols? Or, did he see this symbol in the book sitting on his own coffee table?

        1. bombastic bob Silver badge
          Unhappy

          Re: Spoken like a true FOX news viewer

          What was the inspiration of using an inverted red triangle?

          because it's shaped like the down button on an elevator/lift ?

          there's a lot of missing context here... and a LOT of unnecessary overreacting.

          Strangely, this triangle-thing is being said about one of the most Israel-supporting U.S. presidents EVAR.

          1. Androgynous Cupboard Silver badge

            Re: Spoken like a true FOX news viewer

            Using a symbol used by the Nazis to indicate left-wing or anti-nazi sympathies, to attack a group that has left-wing and anti-nazi sympathies? While it's possible it's because someone just liked triangles, I think it's likely to be either deliberate, or ignorant and stupid. Both should concern you.

            (edit: Rush Limbaugh? Hannity? Dearest irony, I see bob is unaware of your presence as always)

            1. tfb Silver badge
              Alien

              Re: Spoken like a true FOX news viewer

              'One comforting thing about the Trump White House is that you aren't forced to choose between malice and incompetence. It's always both. ' – Gary Kasparov

          2. Mike Moyle Silver badge

            Re: Spoken like a true FOX news viewer

            "there's a lot of missing context here... and a LOT of unnecessary overreacting."

            Running an online ad 88 times isn't that many impressions, but running an ad 88 times that talks about the evils of other political groups AND uses a symbol that was used to identify political enemies in concentration camps is pretty much guaranteed to have the press repeating and amplifying the ads, while being ju-u-u-u-ust vague enough that anyone who draws that connection can be derided as being paranoid, irrational, etc.

            While I can't say for sure that that was the plan with these ads -- really, as a way of amplifying a message while maintaining (semi)plausible deniability, all without paying for the ad time, it's pretty brilliant!

            1. Jaybus

              Re: Spoken like a true FOX news viewer

              Please! the 88 thing is ridiculous conspiracy theory bs.

      4. bombastic bob Silver badge
        Facepalm

        According to Media Matters...

        Title is a short quote from the article, a 'reveal'.

        That particular organization (and its funder) are well known for political bias and related activities.

        Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, and others have exposed them many times for who they are, what they do, how they operate, and so on.

        big FACEPALM icon since it's *THEM*

        1. Steve Knox
          FAIL

          Re: According to Media Matters...

          If you're excluding sources because of "political bias" and not excluding Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity, then you're doing it wrong.

      5. Someone Else Silver badge

        The left may loose the election, but the right will not win it.

  2. redpawn Silver badge

    Lying Sack of Trump

    Time to resign.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Coup 50-50 Success

      I'd put their odd of a Republican coup at 50-50 currently.

      The coup plot has been clear for months, keep the virus going, reduce polling stations in Democrat districts to concentrate voters in one place, close those polling stations 'for safety', skew the vote, claim a Republican victory, push Republican Supreme Court to rubber stamp victory 'for sake of unity', clamp down on subsequent protests with extreme force.

      So far Republicans have:

      1) They successfully reseeded the corona virus in Republican states. Florida looks like a death trap right now.

      2) They shot down attempts to reinstate the Voting Rights Act terms that prevented a lot of Republican voter suppression methods.

      3) Republican states have closed lots of polling stations in Democrat leaning districts. This is the key to the success of voter suppression, if you physically cannot park all the cars and buses needed for people to stand in line for 4-6 hours to vote, then they will not vote.

      4) Republican governors will close these overloaded polling stations during the election, citing Coronavirus risk. Claiming 'safety'. A skewed election rigged to be a Republican win will be put forward to the Republican controlled Supreme court and the wavering judge Roberts will be forced to agree to Trump victory 'for the sake of unity'.

      5) The resulting rioting and protests will be tackled with widespread police violence and mass killing of protestors.

      But

      6) Judge Roberts has ruled strongly against Trump twice now, he's clearly sending a signal that he will not go along with this coup. I assume it must be obvious to him, as it is to others now. Republicans you cannot count on that rubber stamp from the Supreme Court for your coup.

      7) Ex Republicans can clearly see what you're planning and are ganging up against Trump.

      8) The military has not backed Trump's use of troops against protestors and Republican Senators outside the coup group have expressed support for the Generals. Republicans, you cannot rely on the Generals and military defying the constitution and slaughtering Americans.

      9) William Barr has tried all sorts of militias, obviously looking for a force he can use to aggressively kill protestors, and so far has failed to find it. Nobody wants to risk prison time for Trump. Nobody wants to open fire and risk getting shot themselves. Trump has not successfully shown he can suppress the resulting backlash. You see how shaky he is now? Unable to even hold a glass of water steady enough to drink? You can see that he has no confidence in his coup, so why would you, Republicans?

      10) Trump's been reaching out to extremists, 'Second Amendment Republicans' and the Nazis in this story, but all he's got so far are a few confederate hillbillies waving guns. So far they have killed 6 black men in lynching/hangins across the country, this is nowhere near enough to suppress the protests that would follow from this Republican coup.

      So

      So Republicans, why not back down? This coup has failed, and you will have killed an extra 100k+ people with Covid19 unnecessarily. Sunshine is glaring on your plot and every act you do to further that plot is noticed. So why do it? You will lose.

      There is not 'team Trump' you would not gain by installing Trump permanently anyway. The people around him get screwed over. That's you. You'd get screwed over by Trump. He's a backstabber, he stabs your backs. You don't want this coup, you don't want this.

      Support mail-in ballots, spread the voting out across more days, go with the democracy. Support mask wearing and social distancing and basic virus prevention methods.

      You don't want to have an obviously fake election, with Trump's Nazi's shooting people on the street. That wouldn't be good for you. It wouldn't result in your happiness, or your wealth, or your security. The best outcome for you is Trump loses, and you help that happen and go on with your career in politics.

      Pencils have erasers.

    2. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

      Re: Lying Sack of Trump

      I have a question about US politics. Does an incumbent President still have to win the party nomination for the next presidential election or is that an automatic shoe-in? If it's a shoe-in, is that just tradition or some sort of legal requirement? If tradition, has an incumbent ever been rejected by their party before?

      1. RandomFactor
        Black Helicopters

        Party Nomination

        They do, and there are always a few challengers that run hoping for some long-shot miracle, but actual chances of it not happening approach nil.

        Even an unpopular president tends to have a better shot at defeating an unpopular challenger than some other pick.

        Also bear in mind that -ANY- nominee of either party will get similar treatment by the opposition. All that changes is the name on the mental mail-merge.

      2. John PM Chappell

        Re: Lying Sack of Trump

        Essentially a shoo-in (that's the spelling by the way, it's a horse-racing term), but technically might face some opposition. It's possible but unlikely for a party to withdraw its support of their previous candidate when he stands again for another term.

        1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

          Re: Lying Sack of Trump

          "(that's the spelling by the way, it's a horse-racing term)"

          Ta for that. I knew it didn't look right. Still, horse have shoes too :-)

          Thanks to both for the political info though.

  3. A-nonCoward
    FAIL

    I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

    88 is "hate"? Because H from *itler is the eight letter?

    I find it to make a joke like that to be in very bad taste. I am sure that the ADL and others have much better to do than to police the use or misuse of the number 8

    BTW, it used to be that a license plate that said "8" could get a very high return during State auctions, "8" being considered the most lucky number in Chinese culture, and would go attached to a Rolls Royce or better. And now you're telling me that perhaps a car with "8" is not an indicator of some Chinese maffia boss, but a white extremist besides?

    at the very least, that is rather weird...

    1. Cederic Silver badge

      Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

      Apparently everything's a dog whistle. I guess I'm just not a dog, I don't get it either.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

        That's because it's not aimed at you. Coded references aren't effective if everybody outside the target group knows about them.

        That's why they're called "dog whistles". Because only the targets can hear them (in theory)

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

          The thing about "coded references" is that when you go actively looking for them, you see them *everywhere*. It's why things like numerology, and "the bible code" exist. Given enough random data, and flexible enough matching criteria, anyone can be found guilty of dogwhistling.

          1. diodesign (Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

            "you see them *everywhere*"

            Cool, that's not what's happening here. It's pretty blatant. If there were 101 types of far-right coded references, I could see where you're coming from. But there aren't, there's 2 (or 3 if you include HH as well as 88).

            Denial isn't a river in Egypt, friend.

            C.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: "you see them *everywhere*"

              > If there were 101 types of far-right coded references, I could see where you're coming from. But there aren't, there's 2 (or 3 if you include HH as well as 88).

              2 or 3? The Anti-Defamation League lists 15 individual numbers, plus 9 number-pairs, and 2 percentages (including "100%"), as symbols of hate. And that's just the numbers: https://www.adl.org/hate-symbols

              Not your arbitrary benchmark of 101, but good luck never ever writing any sentence of 12, 13, 14, or 18 words.

              1. Someone Else Silver badge

                Re: "you see them *everywhere*"

                You can tell tRump didn't himself write the ad copy, because he is incapable of forming a sentence (coherent or otherwise) with 12, 13, 14, or 18 words.

            2. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: "you see them *everywhere*"

              I'm afraid I have to agree with the original poster. I can understand the red triangles being a clearly intended Nazi reference, and that is quite justly getting slammed. But having 14 words in a sentence? That's statistically quite common. Or happening to have 88 of something.

              The Anti-Defamation League lists 28 different number-based hate symbols (https://www.adl.org/hate-symbols). While having one of those as a tattoo, or printed by itself on a shirt, bumper sticker, etc. could reasonably be indicative of racist leanings, simply having one of those numbers (whether printed directly or especially as a count of something else) isn't at all a reliable test. One excellent example is the list itself - 28 different number-based symbols, and the number 28 is one of them.

              Just because a nasty group commonly conceals a number in what they write or do, doesn't automatically mean that every time that number shows up it's related to that group!

              1. Stork Silver badge

                Re: "you see them *everywhere*"

                On its own perhaps not, but this is not on its own. The red triangle is the primary evidence, the rest supports.

          2. bombastic bob Silver badge
            Black Helicopters

            Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

            "when you go actively looking for them, you see them 'everywhere'"

            Just like conspiracies.

            To a hammer, everything is a nail. etc.

            icon, because, nothing says "conspiracy" like black helicopters

            (if it had been 666 we'd be laughing at it)

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

      It's been very common in Germany for decades. Since outright SS symbolism is banned there, "88" has been often used as a coded reference by Neo Nazis. The authorities are aware of this, though obviously realise it's stupid to ban a number. But they do for instance not allow you to have '88' on a vehicle number plate.

    3. IGotOut Silver badge

      Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Column_88

      https://www.adl.org/education/references/hate-symbols/88

      Also

      "NS88 Video Division White Power Skinhead CDs DVD Movies Flags Patches ...'

    4. AndrewCappo

      Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

      14 88 is a two-fer foghorn which you either decided to play dumb about or didn't care to Read The Flaming Article.

      14 for the fourteen words, the neo-Nazi creed most infamously recited by Canadian nazi Faith Goldy at Charlottesville, a close friend of Lauren "Feast Replacement" Southern. (Lauren went on to attempt mass murder and inspired at least ten mass shooters who quoted her at length in their manifestos, including the New Zealand Shooter.)

      88 stands for Heil Hitler.

      This number shows up in a lot of alt-right and mainstream American right publications and social media postings. Jack Posobiec, Trump's favorite twitter propagandist, routine makes open references to the numbers 14 and 88.

      ICE put out a press release last year fessing up to losing a bunch of detained children. The number in their public statement and quoted by the spokesperson? One thousand, four hundred, and eighty eight. (The number of lost minors, according to internal ICE figures, was 1502.)

    5. diodesign (Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

      It's not a joke

      References involving 88, HH, and 14 have been used for years and years to signal white supremacy support to other white supremacists. It's a code, a wink, a nudge to an ideology touted by the likes of Nick Griffin, Richard B. Spencer, and others.

      C.

      1. Arctic fox
        Headmaster

        @diodesign Re: "References involving 88, HH, and 14 have been used for years and years "

        It has also been noticeable for years and years that the outside right's below the line defenders have memory difficulties or have no knowledge of their own history. The existence, for example, of Column 88 has been known about for decades (as you alluded to).

        1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge

          Re: @diodesign "References involving 88, HH, and 14 have been used for years and years "

          There's also "Combat 18", where 18 => AH => Adolf Hitler.

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combat_18#Name

          1. Triggerfish

            Re: @diodesign "References involving 88, HH, and 14 have been used for years and years "

            Oh is that we're they 18 came from? I remember them being prominent years ago. Disappointed on the wiki to see they're still going tbh, thought they had faded away.

      2. Louis Schreurs Bronze badge

        Re: It's not a joke

        >The President of the United States is campaigning for reelection using

        a Nazi concentration camp symbol. <

        Speedreeding the thing I read:

        The Nazi of the United States ......

        only to realize my mistake when I come to Nazi again !

    6. bombastic bob Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

      Yet, 8 is perfectly symmetrical. It can be cut 4 different ways to produce perfect symmetry.

      (those who do not get the reference, you're missing out on something awesome)

      And don't forget how many CPUs have had 8 bit words (including microcontrollers), along with the standard 'Byte'.

      I've also seen '88' used a LOT in COBOL code, in the DATA section.

      It sure is a stretch to make a big deal out of 8 and 88... it's almost like you HAVE to be WANTING it to "mean something" that can THEN be used for UNDO CRITICISM.

      (and pointy-down triangles are OFTEN used for elevator/lift buttons and indicator lights... "going down")

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

        If it was just the 88 thing it might be possible to play it off as a mere coincidence...but the red triangle as well?

        No. They know damn well what they're doing.

      2. timrowledge

        Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

        Context is as important in political matters as it is in computational.

    7. tfb Silver badge

      Re: I'm still not sure how much of this is pulling our leg

      Yes, 88 is used by people to mean this: often in usernames used by unpleasant people. But this doesn't mean all occurrences of it mean that (not even in usernames), or that this occurrence did.

  4. b0llchit
    Stop

    to News or not to News

    Only no news is bad news in the eyes of politicians.

    This is classical trolling and trapping to get attention. Then you can alter the narrative to your own liking and "blame" someone else. Which war was it now? The one with east Asia or the the other one we've always been involved in?

    The more attention we give to the "outrage" the more we feed the troll. Not that we should ignore it, but you need to tackle the problem and not the symptom(s). The symptoms are easily mutated and redirected by the troll and can (will) be used to alter the narrative. Tackle the problem and you remove the symptoms without feeding the troll. You simply have to starve the troll of possible narratives.

  5. The Dogs Meevonks

    They actually have a plan...

    I firmly believe that this is a deliberate ploy by aspects of the Republican party to lose the next election... they see the tide turning against them and the global recession coming... and they don;t want to be in charge whilst it's happening. That way we'll just see another wave of hate and bile blaming those 'socialist/libtards' for everything that's gone wrong in the country.

    I don't think they've bothered to actually inform Trump of this though.

    Me... cynical... who saw the exact same thing happen in 2010 in the UK where Labour seemingly threw away their chances to win by portraying their leader as a bigot... Coincidence... maybe not. :)

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: They actually have a plan...

      Trump won't yield so easily. And if Bolton's kiss 'n' tell is only half true then I'm sure Donald is trying to figure out how to strike down the 22nd Amendment.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: They actually have a plan...

        Nope, he'll go.

        He may not go quietly, but no matter what he wants he does not have the ability to prevent Biden's election, he does not have the ability to postpone the election, he does not have the ability to stop Biden from taking office at noon on January 20. And once Biden is president, having the orange shitgibbon dragged out of the White House is just a formality.

        He's weakened our institutions. He hasn't destroyed them.

        1. Louis Schreurs Bronze badge

          Re: They actually have a plan...

          I WANT it to be true!

        2. Stork Silver badge

          Re: They actually have a plan...

          I hope you are right about all counts, but on the first the Economist's modelling gives the tweeter-in-chief something like 15-20% chance of winning. That is unlikely but possible to me.

        3. Someone Else Silver badge

          Re: They actually have a plan...

          Actually, tRump may well be able to postpone the election. That said, on January 20th at noon, Eastern Standard Time, his current term (and that of his lapdog Veep as well) ends. Per the Constitution, the next in line to succeed (in the absence of a duly elected President and Vice President) is the Speaker of the House.

          So tRump cancelling the election might well result in President Nancy Pelosi...his ostensible worst nightmare.

          Irony can be so ironic!

    2. Blank Reg

      Re: They actually have a plan...

      This wouldn't surprise me, The few smart individuals left in the Republican party are likely aware that another 4 years of trump's complete incompetence could result in the Republicans being shut out for a generation once the full extent of the damage becomes apparent to even the dimmest trump supporter.

  6. WillbeIT
    Headmaster

    What is scariest..

    ... is that I'm so numb to all this shit now.

    1. Mark 85 Silver badge

      Re: What is scariest..

      Many of us are. Once upon a time, we would be appalled at a pile of lies coming out of the Oval Office, but there's been so many and iin rapid fire succesion that it's impossible to keep up with them. We've become jaded to it.

      1. codejunky Silver badge

        Re: What is scariest..

        @Mark 85

        "Once upon a time, we would be appalled at a pile of lies coming out of the Oval Office"

        This is why I like Trump being in office. There is still the spewing of lies but he is unvarnished. Its like having a politician but without the stinky politician parts.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: What is scariest..

          Most politicians at least try to cover their stink. He seems intent on flinging it.

          1. codejunky Silver badge

            Re: What is scariest..

            @AC

            "Most politicians at least try to cover their stink."

            That is precisely my point. Obama, Bush and so on all polished public front yet not much different behind the scenes. It didnt matter which side you voted for it still had slime being covered up until Trump who was opposed by both and still won.

            He has had success and failure. He has done things positive and negative. The opposition to him not being about what he achieves but the noise he makes.

        2. timrowledge

          Re: What is scariest..

          I think you mean “with only the stinky parts”. At least, I hope so, since anything else makes you look bad.

          1. codejunky Silver badge

            Re: What is scariest..

            @timrowledge

            "I think you mean “with only the stinky parts”. At least, I hope so, since anything else makes you look bad."

            Nope I ment what I said. Obama stank. Bush too. And so on. Trump is far less filtered. He hasnt been groomed to say something other than what he means. He doesnt have the diplomatic slimy shine to deal with people who screw up or take advantage. Instead he just removes them or the resources from the US they rely on.

            His private opinions are more public because he doesnt bother to hide them while other politicians have the two faced approach.

            I dont care if you think it makes me look bad because I dont turn off my brain and shout 'orange man bad'. He wasnt the one I was hoping would win until mine got knocked out of the race. And I didnt want him to win because I thought he was good or whatever, just that he was better than the slimy suit alternatives he was against.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: What is scariest..

              "He wasnt the one I was hoping would win until mine got knocked out of the race. "

              Rick Santorum. Am I right?

              1. codejunky Silver badge

                Re: What is scariest..

                @AC

                No, Rand Paul. I was particularly impressed with his desire to reduce burden on people such as complex tax returns and also his desire to reduce regulatory burdens. Unfortunately libertarians do have a tough run.

    2. Triggerfish

      Re: What is scariest..

      It's like working on a cow farm, eventually you stop smelling the bullshit even though it's still all around you.

  7. Claverhouse Silver badge
    Meh

    Apathy Rules

    Don't care.

    .

    a tell-all book by a former advisor this month claimed the President once said journalists should be "executed,"

    Even a broken clock is right twice a day...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Apathy Rules

      Then what the F*CK are you doing here? Are you not aware that this is a news site, run by journalists?

      Do you REALLY want our Reg writers murdered? If so, what the F*CK is wrong with you? If not, stop trolling, you ignorant piece of garbage.

      1. chuckufarley
        Pint

        Re: Apathy Rules

        This @Claverhouse you are talking about. Read his post history.

        Telling him to stop trolling is like telling Jell-O not to wiggle when you hold it. I have never seen a single post by him that could be called positive, let alone uplifting. He would have been banned long ago if he were not so skilled at toeing the line.

        He is his own sock puppet.

        1. chuckufarley

          Pro Tip...Again

          I have received another down vote with no reply. Who could do such a thing? Could it be...

          ...SATAN?

          Pro Tip: If you down vote and don't reply then you are implicitly admitting that your arguments have no merit. Which is even better than up voting my post. You are much better off if you either do not down vote or at least leave your flawed and shallow arguments in reply.

          1. ratfox Silver badge
            Happy

            Re: Pro Tip...Again

            I downvoted your second post, and I wouldn't normally have bothered to say why I disagreed; but I'll make an exception this time: Downvoting is a fast and easy way to say I disagree, but I don't see the need to explain every single time the details of my opinion and how it differs from yours. The voting system is a useful way to measure sentiment for and against posts, but second-guessing the meaning and value of each vote is at best a waste of time, and at worst masturbatory.

            Feel free to downvote my post without replying to it.

    2. Intractable Potsherd Silver badge

      Re: Apathy Rules

      A free press is one of the cornerstones of democracy. If journalists are annoying the government, they are doing their job properly.

      Just out of interest, Claverhouse, how would you keep decision-makers honest without journalists?

      1. Someone Else Silver badge

        Re: Apathy Rules

        Honest decision-makers? Shirley, you jest.

  8. beast666

    Trump will walk it in November

    See the implosion of the left in the UK.

    1. Intractable Potsherd Silver badge

      Re: Trump will walk it in November

      Unfortunately, I agree to an extent. From what I read, Biden doesn't have the backing or personality to galvanise swing voters. However, I don't think Trump will walk it - it is only going to be a tiny amount again, and down to the electoral colleges.

    2. sabroni Silver badge

      Re: Trump will walk it in November

      Only if he gets the military to clear the peaceful protesters out of the way with pepper spray and rubber bullets.

  9. chuckufarley

    SHOCKED! I am shocked! Shocked, I tell you...

    ...No, wait, I am not shocked...

    ...Let me start again...

    Shot! I will be shot, I tell you! My mind and my speech are too are to free to survive in The Country Formerly Known As The Land of the Free. I'm not important enough to be the "The First Up Against the Wall" (al la Night of the Long Knives) but I don't have much hope for my future if he gets re-elected. People like me can't help it. When he opens his mouth we have an instinctive imperative to piss in it. It's not the kind of thing that goes unnoticed.

    1. Ken 16 Silver badge

      Re: SHOCKED! I am shocked! Shocked, I tell you...

      Allegedly some people are into that sort of thing. There are even videos available.

  10. Winkypop Silver badge

    Trump. A master baiter

    He lets out the rope, others get caught in his noose.

    Attack his lack of ability and his poor policies, disregard his circus acts.

    1. DemeterLast
      Trollface

      Re: Trump. A master baiter

      Don't you mean a "main baiter"? Or are you, like git, a crypto-racist?

      1. Someone Else Silver badge

        Re: Trump. A master baiter

        tRump ain't the "main baiter", but he's certainly a Master at it....

    2. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

      Re: Trump. A master baiter

      "Attack his lack of ability and his poor policies, disregard his circus acts."

      Maybe it's the cynic in me, but I do wonder if his reaction the BLM protests is designed to inflame things to distract from his Covid-19 performance, It's clear when he gives press conferences that one of his prime weapons is distraction, ie turning "awkward" questions back on the questioner and then not letting them speak again so he gets the last word.

  11. Sanguma Bronze badge

    FTFY

    s/The incumbent President of the United States of America/The recumbent President of the United States of America/g

    There FTFY.

    1. Sanguma Bronze badge

      Re: FTFY

      Further corrigendum:

      s/The recumbent President of the United States of America/The recumbent Federal Secretary of Silly Tweets of the United States of America/g

      There! FTFY! Cant' go wrong with calling it like it is, can you, innit?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: FTFY

        I've just been saying "Current Resident of the White House" for awhile now.

        1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge

          Re: FTFY

          Or "Resident Rump" for short.

          1. Sanguma Bronze badge

            Re: FTFY

            Resident Rump is what you get when you subtract the P T (Barnum) from him. There's one born every minute, P T Barnum prophesied, and Resident Rump is that One! Except he's dialed back the "born every minute" to save his dear deceased Mom from wear and tear, back to "born yesterday". I wish he'd man up and show us his LaLa Land Birth Certificate and Passport, though.

  12. abubasim

    In a plutocracy where the leader is still elected by the population, how to make the poor vote for you?

    1. Version 1.0 Silver badge

      He was elected by the electoral gerrymandered college, he lost the popular vote, but in the US they don't try and get the poor to vote "for" them, they are busy making sure that the poor can't vote against them (or even vote at all).

      1. codejunky Silver badge

        @Version 1.0

        "but in the US they don't try and get the poor to vote "for" them, they are busy making sure that the poor can't vote against them (or even vote at all)."

        That is where Hillary went wrong. She not only got the poor to vote against her but for her opponent by insulting them all. Apparently she still doesnt know why she lost

        1. Stork Silver badge

          Re: @Version 1.0

          No, Hillary didn't play it well. She still got the most votes, though.

  13. deadlockvictim Silver badge

    Incumbency

    The incumbent president is almost always elected. Only Bush 41 and Carter spring to mind of presidents not re-elected for a second term in the last 40 years. I expect that Trump will be narrowly re-elected for a second term. A weak Democratic candidate helps his chances. The election is Trump's to lose, as far as I can make out.

    What interests me more is the 2024 election. Who will run then on either side? It will be a much more open contest with an electorate possibly tired of 8 years of Republican government and 8 years of geriatric nominations.

    If a firebrand like AOC [1] takes the Democratic nomination, will the Republications match her with someone old & grey or someone more youthful, possibly even not white and possibly even female?

    [1] I like the TLAs that American politicians get: FDR, JFK, MLK and so on. Is it only a Democratic thing?

    1. chuckufarley

      Recumbency

      I don't wish to appear any more negative than I feel. So I will ask you honestly:

      Why do you think there will be an election in 2024 if he is re-elected in 2020?

      As an incumbent his policies and his actions have been off of the rails. Can you imagine him as a "Lame Duck?" If you think you can then I am scared of you as well.

      1. deadlockvictim Silver badge

        Re: Recumbency

        There will be elections well into the future. Even Trump voters would be upset if the elections in 2024 were cancelled. Bear in mind that Trump only reigns because he is protected by the Senate Republicans. The System is too important.

        A virus/war killing tens of millions of people might postpone it though.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Recumbency

          There's elections in Russia too, they're not real elections. Putin's Senate is a rubber stamp, if anyone opposes him, he has them killed.

          As to Senate Republicans protecting him, he's putting in loyal Trumpettes not loyal Republicans into office.

          Look at his latest attempted appointment, General Anthony J. Tata, he tried to appoint as the Pentagon #3 slot. Tata is a rabit racist and rabid Trumpette. Someone who claimed Obama was not American by birth, and called him a terrorist. He went on a massive tweet deleting spree to try to hide it, but failed.

          https://talkingpointsmemo.com/fivepoints/pentagon-nominee-tweets-anthony-tata

          Obviously if you're trying to put a racist in charge of a military oppression of the anti-racist protests, you want a massive kill there. Obviously Trump was hoping for a lot of dead American protestors killed by the military under this racist General.

          That includes those old-white-catholic-civic-volunteer-men, that get their heads cracked open on the curb.

          Do you think Trump would think twice about killing Lindsey Graham? Or Ben Carson? or John Bolton? Or any of those old-white-catholic-men?

          Do you imagine, he planned a massive kill and somehow would then go all good and allow elections?

    2. disgruntled yank Silver badge

      Re: Incumbency

      A few of us boomers remember RMN. Interesting point, though. I can think of only TR and W among Republican presidents who were known by their initials.

      As for AOC, she needs a few years before she is eligible for the office.

      1. deadlockvictim Silver badge

        Re: Incumbency

        disgruntled yank» As for AOC, she needs a few years before she is eligible for the office.

        Does she? She was born in Oct. 1989. She will be 35 years' of age in Oct. 2024. The elections for president are in Nov. 2024 and the new president assumes office in Jan. 2025. Or have I got my sums wrong?

        1. disgruntled yank Silver badge

          Re: Incumbency

          I had not looked her up. You do have your sums right.

      2. RandomFactor
        Black Helicopters

        Re: Incumbency

        Don't remember RMN being referred to by his initials, but I was mostly just pissed off that Watergate interrupted my cartoons at the time.

    3. Col_Panek

      Re: Incumbency

      You thought it couldn't be worse. 2024: Cuomo/AOC.

      God Help Us.

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

    But I can't see why the ADL are in such a state over a red triangle, from wiki:

    Red triangle – political prisoners: social democrats, socialists, communists, anarchists, gentiles who assisted Jews; trade unionists; and Freemasons.

    Although, whomever edited the wiki obviously inserted "socialists" to try and distance the aforementioned from The National Socialist German Workers' Party

    Down vote away, sigh

    1. John H Woods Silver badge

      Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

      Nazis hated Socialists. It's a fact.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

        Nazis _were_ socialists. They've beaten the communists because they were their competition in the same side of political spectrum. In fact convincing the word that Nazis were right wing is the biggest political victory of socialists in 20th century.

        1. Intractable Potsherd Silver badge

          Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

          AC troll - don't feed.

          1. Jemma Silver badge

            Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

            Sigh - then tell me why the NSDAP has socialist slap bang in the middle of the title if they aren't socialist? Especially given that in the 30s most people didn't react well to Socialism.

            Tell me why they ran social programmes including the KdF and the KdFwagen (a rip off of the Tatra T97 btw) as well as employment benefits and social housing.

            The difference between Russian socialism and NS is the Russian type groups it by social stratigraphy (workers vs middle class vs rich) - the NS grouped people by RACE stratigraphy ("Aryans"* vs pretty much everyone else except a few European countries). Ironically the effects were pretty much the same in both areas with the same "undesirables" getting knocked off, just it wasn't a point of government policy in the USSR - just widespread incompetence and sociopathy.

            *Aryans technically exist they just come from a mountainous area of Persia/Iran and are most definitely not blond and blue eyed (unless possibly their mother got knocked up by a bewildered backpacker).

            Look up Blitzed by Ohler

            Vampire Economy by Tooze I think

            There's various others

            1. sabroni Silver badge

              Re: then tell me why the NSDAP has socialist slap bang in the middle of the title

              The same reason Social Science has science in the name, to make it sound like something it isn't.

            2. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

              Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

              "Sigh - then tell me why the NSDAP has socialist slap bang in the middle of the title if they aren't socialist?"

              <sigh>I bet you think the Peoples Republic of China is a republic just like the good 'ol USA too? After all, it's right there in the name, right?

              Likewise, you think the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is both a republic and democracy because, hey, it's right there in the official name of the county, right?

            3. Stork Silver badge

              Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

              As usual, working on one axis only is too simple.

              Take a look at https://www.politicalcompass.org

              Economically, Germany in the 30es was fairly centrist (as in role between the state and private sector) and a lot of policies were what Keynes (who's ideas were since abused) would have agreed to - public works to get the economy going. This is of course ignoring the ban on jewish activities and ownership.

              But had Hitler and Stalin avoided economic issues they would probably have found a lot to agree on regarding the importance of a strong and firm leadership.

        2. Champ

          Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

          Seriously? You think this sort of tragic trolling will work here?

          You should probably go back to plying this shit on Facebook

        3. bombastic bob Silver badge
          Devil

          Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

          "Nazis _were_ socialists."

          Correct (government takeover of businesses is one of the characteristics that defines socialism).

          I expect that if Nazis hate socialists, they hate themselves, but they hate OTHERS MORE (like Daleks) and so "EXTERMINATE! EXTERMINATE!"

          (there should be a Dalek icon. Cybermen are their 'rival enemies' and so I can't really use the terminator icon, now can I?)

          1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge
            Headmaster

            Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

            > (government takeover of businesses is one of the characteristics that defines socialism)

            "Socialism is when the government does stuff, and the more stuff it does the socialister it is" - Carl Marks

            No, the only common characteristic of *actual* socialism is the social ownership of the means of production. It's useless to argue about this with Americans as they can't even properly define the things they object to.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism

            1. EvilDrSmith Bronze badge

              Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

              Uncle Slacky,

              I'm a little wary about relying on wiki for a subject like this, but from your link:

              "While no single definition encapsulates many types of socialism, social ownership is the one common element"

              and

              "Socialist politics has been both internationalist and nationalist in orientation; organised through political parties and opposed to party politics; at times overlapping with trade unions and at other times independent and critical of them"

              (Obviously, yes just selective quotes to suit my purpose).

              So it does seem that 'Socialism' is all things to all men, or at least, can be variably defined.

              What I didn't see on the Wiki page (from an admittedly very cursory viewing) is what percentage of social ownership is required to be a socialist state/society/economy. If the state owns the railways, but not the car maker, is that Socialism? what if it's reversed? or does the state (or the workers of each industry in relation to just their own industry) have to own everything for socialism to exist?

              Which in turn leads to what is the definition of the 'means of production'? The services provided by the NHS in the UK, for instance, would not seem to fall within any classic definition of 'production', yet the idea of a state health service is accepted as social ownership within a socialist outlook.

              Since socialism in the form of social ownership allows the option of employee ownership, there would seem to be no problem with privatising the NHS, as long as the companies involved were all partnerships, where all the employees of the private company shared equally in the profits. And I'm guessing I'm already getting downvoted for even discussing the idea that the NHS could be privatised, because any form of privatised health care is against socialist principles - except strictly, by your Wiki definition, it appears not to be.

              So if I may be so bold, I'd politely suggest that you are quite sure that you can fully define what you mean by such terms as 'social ownership' and 'means of production' before you challenge others on their understanding.

              1. codejunky Silver badge

                Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

                @EvilDrSmith

                Not sure if this is of interest but this is a very interesting book on the definition of socialism-

                https://iea.org.uk/publications/socialism-the-failed-idea-that-never-dies/

                That a country is trying socialism until it fails and then it is redefined as not real socialism, but while the idea sounds nice they end up at the same destination.

                Of course some people mistake the nordics for socialism but then people arguing that dont seem to want that.

      2. EvilDrSmith Bronze badge

        Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

        No, not really.

        The short answer is Nazis hated whoever Hitler told them to hate (and it's not a short list).

        First and foremost, Nazi's hated Jews.

        They hated Communists - because Communists were a viable threat, using the same violent techniques to seize power as the Nazi's and with the same contempt for democracy. Also, because they were internationalist, not nationalist, and because Hitler considered Communism to be associated with Jewish people.

        Beyond that they hated Marxism (for much the same reason/not really distinguishing it from Communism)

        They hated anyone deemed weak or feeble

        They hated Parliamentary process, and therefore anyone that supported or defended parliamentary democracy, which included 'liberal socialists' and 'democratic socialists'.

        However, the Nazi's were, in their own opinion, Socialist. Hitler was clear in his contempt for the bourgeois masses and for the need to carry the support of the working class, and the German economy under the Nazis was a state-directed economy (all those autobahns made great civic works to give jobs to the workers).

        The Nazis did not hate socialists, because they thought that they themselves were socialist.

        They just hated everyone that wasn't a Nazi.

        1. chuckufarley

          Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in French Riviera

          The Nazi Party even had special Holiday Resorts that were built and run by the government so their most productive workers could go there with their families to relax. If you had access to one to one and didn't use it you were looked down on because you were not socializing with other "good" Nazis.

        2. Uncle Slacky Silver badge
          Headmaster

          Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

          There's a good collection of links and info on the subject here if you're interested:

          https://old.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/wiki/faq/europe#wiki_how_socialist_was_national_socialism.3F

          From there:

          "First of all, here's Hitler's understanding of socialism from his 22.07.1922 speech "Freistaat oder Sklaventum" (translation from Shirer, The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich):

          Whoever is prepared to make the national cause his own to such an extent that he knows no higher ideal than the welfare of the nation; whoever has understood our great national anthem, “Deutschland ueber Alles,” to mean that nothing in the wide world surpasses in his eyes this Germany, people and land - that man is a Socialist.

          That is simply not how socialism is defined, therefore appealing to the mere use of the term is not an argument."

          In short, no, they weren't. What Hitler meant by "national socialism" bore no relation to the actual definition of socialism.

    2. Uncle Slacky Silver badge
      Stop

      Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

      If you think Nazis were socialists, I presume you also think North Korea (the Democratic People's Republic of Korea) is democratic?

      1. Androgynous Cupboard Silver badge

        Re: I didn't know of the triangle badges in the prison camps

        Or, for that matter, that the USA is united.

  15. Potemkine!

    Briatain a nuclear power?

    US making the Trident system, I doubt about that. When your nuclear deterrence is made by somebody else, you can't be 100% sure that you've got total control on it.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Briatain a nuclear power?

      Harsh, but fair.

    2. John Jennings Bronze badge

      Re: Briatain a nuclear power?

      US making the Trident system, I doubt about that. When your nuclear deterrence is made by somebody else, you can't be 100% sure that you've got ANY control on it.

      Fixed it for ya

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Briatain a nuclear power?

        It's fine. I mean it's not like it's something important like critical 5G communications infrastructure.

  16. itzman

    Golly. Without Hitler.

    There never would have been an EU!

    What is the 27th letter of the alphabet? Or is it 26 since Brexit? ZZZZZZ

    Do people REALLY believe in numerology?

    AHAHAH. Oops. I must be a neo Nazi! Too many AHs.

    Hard pencils are now BANNED.

    BLACK LEAD MATTERS!

    No more 18SWG sheet metal for sale!

    Oh what a gay day! Here in my little cottage! Oops. I can't say that, it means something else now.

    Talk about dog whistles. The Left is one huge echo chamber tuned to dog whistles. Blown by seriously large corporate interests pretending to be democrats and liberals, who are - gaspo - actually BELIEVED by the useful idiots of the suburban middle classes!

    1. sabroni Silver badge

      Re: Golly. Without Hitler.

      Read as a bit of free prose that's actually quite moving, in a "documenting my mental breakdown" way.....

  17. tony2heads
    Coat

    88

    Surely 'Two fat ladies - 88'

    BINGO!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: 88

      88 looks more like BB badly hand-written.

      And on this forum we KNOW who BB is...

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: 88

        Yeah. Brigette Barbot. Another extreme right-winger with some truly vile views.

  18. Packet

    Posting here with just one line:

    I did Nazi that coming

    1. sabroni Silver badge

      I too will post a single line

      A single line I posted

      to post more wouldn't be a single line

      so just one for me

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Wow. The cluelessness is strong across the pond.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      You just spotted who you made president?

  20. Packet

    In an attempt to add some seriousness after my initial attempt at levity (which still makes me giggle)

    this inverted red triangle is not on the Anti-Defamation League's list of hate symbols.

    Link: https://www.adl.org/hate-symbols

  21. dncnvncd

    New World Order?

    Interesting conclusions about some disjointed events. But, we have had Presidents in the recent past refer to a "New World Order". A term often used by the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei(National Socialist German Workers Party) as they stole the swastika, a sign of male virility, from the Hindus and the Catholic order where Hitler attended school. How could a bright person with the capability to accrue a massive fortune like Zuckerberg be so ignorant as to fall for the "hate speech" argument. Especially since his fortune is riding on the first amendment to the Constitution? When China rules America with the help of all the Quislings, the Quislings will be in for a rude awakening much as the recent world-wide health supply shortage.

    1. Packet

      Re: New World Order?

      I do hate to be pedantic, but the first amendment to the US Constitution just prevents the govt from suppressing your freedom of speech (among other things).

      (and yes, i know there are exceptions for certain scenarios in the world today, like say, yelling 'fire' in a movie theatre, or saying 'bomb' in an airport)

      A private (ie, non-govt) company can choose to censor as they wish.

  22. Drew Scriver Silver badge

    Yes - it's a concern. But issues exist in both camps.

    While the symbolism may indeed point to some level of fascist involvement, couldn't it just as likely be ignorance or coincidence?

    Remember the when a UK shoe manufacturer introduced a sneaker/trainer called "Zyklon"? Also, Americans tend to be pretty callous about Nazi-references. I was rather shocked when I attended a summer camp in the US and they sang a campfire songs in different mock-accents while using gestures. You guessed it: with the German accent the heels came together, a Nazi salute was given with one hand and with the other hand a fake Hitler-mustache was formed.

    Even today it is not uncommon in the workplace to hear somebody being called the "office Nazi" - usually referring to a person who goes by the book. When I asked why they thought "office Nazi" was acceptable but "office klucker" was not they didn't quite get the point.

    When a recent political campaign employed overt Communist symbolism/verbiage and many supporters sported T-shirts and flags with the likeness off Che Guevara the media were silent.

    Some of the more prominent forces in the current protests are openly advocating for Communist ideas (based on Lenin, Marx, and Mao), the demise of the nuclear family, the marginalization of fathers, and segregated communities based on "race". You'd be hard-pressed to find any reports about this in the media. I also found it puzzling that one of the prominent speakers at George Floyd's funeral has openly made antisemitic remarks.

    The (Democrat) governor of Virginia apparently had his picture taken years ago while either dressed up as a "black man" or as a KKK-member. He has admitted that he is in the picture, but he can't remember whether he dressed up as the former or the latter... The current Democrat presidential candidate made some rather disparaging racist remarks when he ran back in 2012.

    While I do believe that a possible effort from the official Trump-camp to reach out to fascist groups should be examined, it would be prudent to extend the same level of scrutiny to all parties.

    What troubles me is that both sides are quick to point out how terrible the other side is - and that they're both right.

    It's a mess. I'm not optimistic that it will improve.

    To boot, John Adams (one of the Founding Fathers, first Vice President and second President of the US) stated that the US Constitution is "wholly inadequate" to govern what the US have become since it was written for a "righteous and moral people". To be sure, I believe that re-writing the Constitution in today's climate would be far worse than keeping the current one, but Adams' statement does explain part of the problems we're facing.

  23. Kev99

    Since he tries to emulate the tactics of Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Tojo, Kim and others I'm not at all surprised.

    1. Drew Scriver Silver badge

      I do not know if this is necessarily the case, but I do know that quite a few people on the left have a soft spot for Stalin, Mao, Che Guevara, and others.

      - The founders of the BLM-movement have stated that their economic views are based on Marx, Stalin, and Mao.

      - A high-placed official in the Obama administration stated at the time that her heroes were Mother Teresa and Mao Zedong.

      - One of Obama's press secretaries adorned the walls in his house with Soviet labor posters.

      - Left-wing event tend to feature people with placards and T-shirts with the likeness of Che Guevara.

      - Flags/posters are not uncommon on the walls of Democrat officials.

      - Democrat campaigns frequently feature Soviet/Socialist imagery and slogans.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        >>- A high-placed official in the Obama administration stated at the time that her heroes were Mother Teresa and Mao Zedong.

        Well I'm convinced. That Mother Teresa was pure fucking evil.

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Brave, actually?

    Don't tell me that Facebook is growing a pair at last!

  25. timrowledge

    “My recorded IQ is 143.”

    I’m pretty sure your quality of argument demonstrates that any such claim is wildly inaccurate.

  26. sprograms

    The accusation about the upside-down red triangle was simply wrong. It has been use since the early days of German Antifa as one of their symbols. The red triangle on Nazi concentration camp patches was specifically to indicate that that prisoner was a communist, anarchist, or "other politically undesirable." Antifa was/is proud of the symbol. For a Trump add to bring up that linkage is reasonable. As for Antifa being "anti-fascist," that really isn't their history -they were in fact anti-capitalism, and that is where their violent efforts were directed. It's no different with Rose City Antifa today, judging by the rallies and violence they produce.

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