Is that a serious offence, e.g. automatic jail time?
Florida man pretending to be police pulls over real police, ends badly, claim cops
A Florida man has been arrested for impersonating a police officer after pulling over an actual police officer, cops have said. Lee County Sheriff's Office in Fort Myers, Florida, said one of its off-duty sheriff's deputies was driving down Interstate 4, which connects Orlando and Tampa, when a black Ford sedan – a Crown …
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Monday 8th July 2019 14:16 GMT Anonymous Coward
Is that a serious offence
I would hope so. You can't allow a situation to develop where a citizen drops a cop in the belief they are a fake because a lot of fakes have gotten away with it.
Generally any offence which undermines confidence in the legal system - from impersonating a police officer, to perjury, witness and jury tampering etc - should be treated as serious with automatic no-questions-asked jail time. After all, lose that, and you are basically back to medieval anarchy.
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Monday 8th July 2019 15:23 GMT Tikimon
Re: Is that a serious offence
"Many states have a rule that you don't have to stop for an unmarked police car and don't use unmarked cars for traffic stops - precisely because the response of some Americans is to shoot first and ask questions later."
Wrong, you ignorant ass. That's so a woman doesn't have to stop for a possible rapist with a flashing light on his dashboard. She can legally drive to a more public area or a police station before stopping. You'll also never find a police force without unmarked cars for the simple reason that traffic stops are a great moneymaker.
Back in the 80's some creep was doing just that a few miles from where I lived. Women quit stopping for unmarked cops for months. I'm a little surprised people still try this now that everyone has a mobile phone and can call for help (with location!).
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Monday 8th July 2019 17:31 GMT Yet Another Anonymous coward
Re: Is that a serious offence
>That's so a woman doesn't have to stop for a possible rapist
Depends whether state law makers care more about a women's sexual health or the police union. I suspect that is a strong function of state.
>You'll also never find a police force without unmarked cars for the simple reason that traffic stops are a great moneymaker.
Yep, having a line of cars all doing exactly the speed limit behind a marked car car earns them nothing. Here they even go so far as having 'N' plated and customised (lots of stickers, aftermarket body kit etc etc) unmarked cars. On the other hand nobody has guns here, the local police don't even have a homocide unit.
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Tuesday 9th July 2019 08:09 GMT Prst. V.Jeltz
Re: Is that a serious offence
(lots of stickers, aftermarket body kit etc etc)
really? or you just want to believe that. I never seen that on the constant parade of reality shows.
The police rarely seem to go to the trouble of disguising the unmarked cars by as much ,say, taking their bright hi vis vests off, so pimping the car seems a little unlikely
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Monday 8th July 2019 19:18 GMT Alan Brown
Re: Is that a serious offence
"You'll also never find a police force without unmarked cars for the simple reason that traffic stops are a great moneymaker"
It has a lot more to do with being able to spot people doing shit they won't try if they can see a marked car around - and in most cases you'll never know an unmarked car was there.
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Monday 8th July 2019 20:49 GMT sprograms
Re: Is that a serious offence
Approx. five years ago a fake cop pulled over a woman on a major highway. He raped and murdered her. The highway ran along a very upscale suburb near Philadelphia, US.
If the FL creep had found, as he pulled alongside, that the guy was not a guy, but an attractive female, something similar could have happened. The "slow down" verbal warning was a dead give-away that the faker simply hadn't stopped the desired sort of victim.
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Monday 8th July 2019 15:06 GMT Mike 16
Undermining confidence in the legal system?
So, pretty much anybody working in the police, courts, legislature, or executive branch has a better than 50% chance of being due for a long-term extensive study of the inside of a detention facility Too bad those would be closed, or more likely the inmates would be running the asylum, as usual.
Not to minimize the problem of impersonating an officer. Many police are competent and as honest as the next person, and they are put at risk by this crime. But, just as with banks with online systems that seem designed to train us to be phishing victims, a bit of professionalism on the part of all police would not be amiss.
I am really tired of hearing the usual "A few bad apples.." without the rest of the sentence "..spoil the barrel".
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Monday 8th July 2019 22:04 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: Is that a serious offence
In my community I have seen an older gentleman drive around on a golf cart with "COMMUNITY POLICE" on it. (I do not want to give away too much, but the actual words on it are what the community is known as; I am leaving the actual community name off on purpose.) I have only seen him twice, but the next time I do see him, I will call the real police on him. There are few things worse than a busybody who has nothing to do but meddle in your affairs. The sad fact is the area is not a high crime area. I do know there was a drug dealer in the area, but she died of a heart attack after using her product. That was it. So there is no need for a community watch. You better believe I want all pretend police to taught a lesson, even if it is just to scare them straight.
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Wednesday 17th July 2019 19:17 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: Is that a serious offence
Generally any offence which undermines confidence in the legal system - from impersonating a police officer, to perjury, witness and jury tampering etc - should be treated as serious with automatic no-questions-asked jail time.
I agree - William Barr and his psychotic overlord should be in jail.
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Monday 8th July 2019 15:33 GMT jake
Its up to the induhvidual State.
Impersonating a police or other law enforcement officer is a misdemeanor under California Penal Code 538d ... What this means in the RealWorld is that if nobody gets hurt and you are caught, a first offense is a slap on the wrist at most. If you are stupid about it[0], you'll see a year in jail and/or a $2,000 fine for each offense.
You can read California PC 538d for yourself here.
On the federal side of things, impersonating a federal agent is defined as "falsely pretending or assuming to be an employee or officer acting under the authority of the United States, agency, or department". That'll get you fined up to $1,000 and/or up to 3 years for a first offense. You can wade through chapter 43 of Title 18 if you want the details.
[0] Yes, I know, that's my opinion, too ...
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Monday 8th July 2019 15:35 GMT Anonymous Coward
Falsely Impersonating an Officer is a Third Degree Felony in Florida and is punishable by up to 5 years in prison, 5 years of probation, and a $5,000 fine. So no, not automatic jail time. I would say that he has got of lightly so far as he is still alive. That's probably because he's white though. (Only marginally sarcastic and very jaded).
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Tuesday 9th July 2019 09:27 GMT Robert Moore
I have a friend who has, for reason that baffle me, reproduced the car from The Blues Brothers movie in mind numbing detail. In as much as the car in the movie was an ex-police cruiser, he gets stopped and checked out by the REAL cops frequently. It is a good thing he is a fine upstanding citizen because cops take "Impersonating a police officer" extremely seriously. He has been "taken in for questioning" several times, although most of the time it is just a quick check, and usually some admiration from the real cops.
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Monday 8th July 2019 16:20 GMT John Brown (no body)
Re: Questions
"3. Does Hastings get time off his sentence for not being very good at impersonating an officer?"
Judging by the description of the car and colours of the flashing lights, I suspect he knew the law and was attempting to create plausible deniability but once drawn in to conversation by his "victim", fell into the trap of either having to admit to being a private citizen or lie. He chose badly. I would guess that most civilians, on assuming he was a cop, would have slowed down as told and then felt relieved that they "got away with it".
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Monday 8th July 2019 14:45 GMT Anonymous Coward
Same in the UK... except they are employed by the police themselves (police community support officers (PCSOs) aka. Plastic Plod) or the local council (jumped up <insert name of dept> enforcement officers)... they are generally armed with a never-ending book of tickets that needs to be filled in by the end of the week
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Monday 8th July 2019 21:45 GMT ICPurvis47
Re: Chris Evans
I was stopped once on the M6. I had been attending a breakdown on the hard shoulder, and after replacing the damaged tyre, I was returning to my base. I forgot to turn off the yellow rotating beacon on the roof of the breakdown truck, and was pulled over just a few hundred yards before the off ramp to my destination. The cop threw the book at me, and I ended up at Coleshill Magistrates Court. I pleaded guilty, but under extenuating circumstances, as the beacon was not visible from less than several yards away, as it was located in the centre of the flat roof, and there was no indicator bulb on the switch that controlled it. The Magistrates went into a huddle, and eventually awarded me a £10 fine and one point on my licence. The cop, who had had to spend an entire morning in court, was disgusted by so light a sentence, and showed this disgust by storming out of the court before the Magistrates had risen. I do not know if there were any repercussions to his action, but I was relieved that I got off so lightly.
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Tuesday 9th July 2019 15:11 GMT BrownishMonstr
Re: Chris Evans
Some cops are twats. Would have been best just to leave you with a warning.
My brother got a warning from a copper on his way to work. He stopped at a red light, and just before it was to go green he started to creep his car forward. Copper pulls him over and argues he didn't stop at the light. My brother argues he did stop, so the copper said "well, you went over the line" and asks for ID.
My brother argues he didn't go over and realised he only has one type of ID on him, which he is reluctant to show. He figures since the officer had asked for the ID he doesn't have a choice but to show it. Once my brother shows his warrant card, since he himself is also a police officer and on the way to the police station, the officer who pulled him over takes the body-cam off and starts acting different. "Oh, I was only going to caution you", to which my brother said "well, I didn't go over the line so there wasn't any reason to caution me anyway".
So yes, some officers can be knobheads, except to their own.
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Monday 8th July 2019 15:11 GMT jake
Summer silly season.
Similar report from Upland, California on June 19th.
Known colloquially as "wannbees", these sad losers apparently are on the uptick nationwide ... For whatever reason(s) it seems to run in cycles, so I guess this too shall pass.
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Monday 8th July 2019 23:44 GMT Ashentaine
Re: Summer silly season.
"Wannbees"? Around this part of the country we call them "whackers". Many of them are kinda sad but actually fairly harmless, just thinking if they get an old cruiser from a police auction and drop an amber/white service lightbar (usually non-working) on top people will mistake them for actual cops and get out of their way on the freeways, but never really taking it beyond that.
Misguided nitwits like Florida Man and the total dirtbags that are impersonating police officers for malicious reasons are still thankfully rare, for now at least.
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Monday 8th July 2019 15:44 GMT Simon Harris
The Bill
Living in South West London, back in the day they used to film The Bill a lot around my way - once I woke up to TV floodlights shining through the window while they were filming outside the house.
When not filming, they'd drive the show's police cars to and from location with 'Police' taped over with black masking tape. When I was still new to the area and didn't know about the filming, my first reaction seeing those was 'that's a piss-poor attempt at an unmarked police car'.
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Monday 8th July 2019 15:55 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: The Bill
There was an episode of "The Bill" specifically about a pair impersonating police officers.
It was just after "on the spot" fines had been introduced, and the Great Thickish Public managed to miss all the information about how you NEVER gave money to a police officer.
The scam in the program was that a couple of "likely 'uns" had bought a couple of uniforms and were stopping motorists and "fining" them for various traffic offences.
It allowed for a dramatic plot line where the internal investigation "bastards" were called in (because it was originally thought they were real cops) which really did set the cat amongst the pigeons.
If only I could remember where I put my car keys ....
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Monday 8th July 2019 16:24 GMT John Brown (no body)
Re: The Bill
"The scam in the program was that a couple of "likely 'uns" had bought a couple of uniforms and were stopping motorists and "fining" them for various traffic offences."
I just caught an episode of Autobahn on tv the other day. German Police have credit/debit card machines with them to take payment at the roadside. I wonder if there's an issue with fake police there?
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Monday 8th July 2019 17:04 GMT Anonymous Coward
calling 911
Calling 911 will ensure:
* Immediate response (versus waiting for a non-emergency line to be answered, "his boss" or "the station" to log in to a dispatch system, etc.)
* Proper accounting of the issue (assuming 911 creates an incident report automatically)
* Immediate location information (assuming E911 is enabled on the system there)
* Proper agencies dispatched (the cop in question was a Sheriff's deputy, the incident probably had to be handled by the Highway Patrol)
* Proper timestamping and recording of the initial complaint.
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Monday 8th July 2019 17:52 GMT MonkeyCee
Re: calling 911
Agree with AC here. By calling an emergency number you are giving consent to various things, such as handing your location over. Calling your boss once your safe, sure. but if you're worried about your safety, calling the emergency services is your best panic button.
Same for a fire or medical. Sure, tackle it, help people, make your own call. But call the emergency services FIRST, or make damn sure someone is.
Personally if I ask a cop for their ID and they don't comply, I'll call my equivalent of 911. They might sigh, or be a bit tetchy about it*, but they'll do it. Any time I've been asked questions in a formal capacity (ie I'm not in trouble) they've always started by introducing themselves, showing their ID and giving me their card.
* there's a local law school, so lots of smart ass students
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Monday 8th July 2019 17:30 GMT Danny 2
Fake Pigs (Facon)
I remember four or five cases of fake cops in Scotland, the most recent in August 2018. Some of them were Walts (Walter Mitty), some scammers, but some were rapists/murderers.
A healthy distrust for authority is advisable. One woman who was pulled over by a sole fake cop late at night had the common-sense and awareness to ignore him and instead drove to a police station. [Not this case but similar]
https://www.scotland.police.uk/whats-happening/news/2018/august/warning-over-men-impersonating-officers-in-cowdenbeath
Sergeant Paul Cochrane said, "The woman did the absolutely right thing in this instance by removing herself from these men and contacting police to report her concerns.
"I want to stress that if you are stopped by genuine police officers at any time, they will produce identification and explain fully the reason for you being stopped.
"Members of the public should remain vigilant and should they also be stopped in a similar manner by anyone claiming to be an officer, but not in uniform, or in possession of appropriate ID then leave the area immediately before reporting the matter to police immediately.
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Tuesday 9th July 2019 00:04 GMT Nick Kew
Re: Fake Pigs (Facon)
"I want to stress that if you are stopped by genuine police officers at any time, they will produce identification and explain fully the reason for you being stopped.
Which is all very well if you can tell genuine police ID from fake police ID.
Or even from someone's completely unconnected work badge. Or library card. Or ...
... at a glance, and in a situation of some stress.
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Monday 8th July 2019 18:37 GMT Danny 2
F_the_CIA
This is unrelated to the article and only tangentially related to my previous comment of distrust authority. It amuses me though so maybe it'll amuse you.
I was a teenager at an American blue-chip in "Silicon Glen" in the early eighties. I'd designed (with a great deal of help from my mentors) a high end computer board. A high speed relay board on the VMEbus spec. It sold for thousands of pounds, but it was our most basic product. Basically it opened 16 switches at high speed, big deal, but I was proud of it and my name was all over it.
A few months later I got a call at my desk from the CIA telling me it was breaching US sanctions because it was being exported to Hungary and I'd be arrested if that didn't stop because the relays were restricted technology. Cold war and all that. I called BS, said, "Fuck off and die, you are not the CIA" and slammed the phone down. I was sure it was a prank played by my fellow apprentices using one of their Tucson colleagues.
A couple of minutes later the same American phoned me up with the same spiel and I responded, "Aye right, do you know Hungary has developed it's own super-computer, why would they possibly be interested in these cheap relays?" I got that info from reading the precursor to this mag, Electronics Weekly or something similar - the BOFH is older than most here know. The CIA guy said, "Don't hang up again, can you give me your managers extension?"
Turned out it was the CIA.
Wasn't the worst mistake I made with that board. I did it all, including the CAD, and the CAD component was inverted so the prototype had to have it's relays fitted on the rear side. Plus when I was doing testing it burst on fire, well smoking at least, because I was pumping ten times more current through it than it was designed to take. Faulty multimeter, and I didn't think to use another multimeter because mine had just been calibrated. I burst into a boardroom meeting to warn them my product was dangerous, and it wasn't.
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Monday 8th July 2019 19:16 GMT Anonymous Coward
Long story......cops hate impersonators
To set the scene this story is set in the UK and a very long time ago.
I knew a guy who sold nothing more dangerous than weed or hash.
His apartment was above a shop so when you entered the front door there were stairs up to his space.
Someone leaving had deliberately left the front door open and soon there were guys pretending to be police officers with a handgun (later found to be a starting pistol) and a search warrant (later found to be stolen). They took all the money and drugs and promptly left the building! Apparently this gang had been targeting dealers but no-one had reported it. My "pal" was a man of principal, quite a philosopher and also a Buddhist so he rang the cops to complain. Well it turns out that the police hate anyone impersonating them so they gave my "pal" immunity and protection. I won't reveal the whole story but this snippet is funny. My "pal" became friendly with one of the detectives who would come around his house for a coffee. My "pal" had told him that "Any day that you want to bust me I will have some hash here". So over coffee $name opens his tobacco tin to roll a cigarette but inside is also a lump of hash. The detective says "$name, could you please put the lid back on your tin". LOL
Anon for obvious reasons
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Monday 8th July 2019 21:51 GMT Anonymous Coward
Long story......cops hate impersonators (2)
When you do lots of weekly commuting, you get to hear a few interesting stories from the hotel staff...
One time the plod had come round to the hotel mid-afternoon to book one of the function rooms for their annual shindig. The receptionist called the events person who was at the other end of the hotel so she asked the receptionist to show plod through to the function room and she'd meet them there. So far so normal but one of the police absentmindedly leaves his radio on the desk, which is now unattended. Inevitably a cleaner comes down looking for the manager, finds no one, and picks up the radio thinking it's one of the hotel's walkie-talkies. Cue amusing conversation where confused cleaner can't understand why the people on the other end of the walkie-talkie keep demanding to know where she is and why they don't know where the reception desk is.
Apparently a police car arrived very quickly. :-)
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Tuesday 9th July 2019 00:46 GMT GBE
Florida Man is slipping
I must say that in the ongoing adventures of Florida Man, this was pretty lame.
No explosives or firearms, no dangerous wildlife, no injuries, nobody had to call an ambulance, the fire department, or even the state conservation officers.
C'mon Florida Man, you can do better!
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Tuesday 9th July 2019 01:40 GMT antman
Legging it
A long time ago we were returning from an evening out when I could hear a siren (it might have been a bell) nearby. A glance in the rear view mirror revealed it to be the car behind as is started to flash the headlamps (no blue lights). I could see from the silhouettes of the driver and passenger that they had long hair, didn't look like cops, and the car wasn't a marked police car. I felt somewhat in fear for our safety so put my foot down and accelerated away. About a mile or so later we ran into a police road block! "why didn't you stop?" said the uniformed officer. I explained my fear of what I thought were villains in the unmarked car and how would I know they were cops. He stepped away, muttered something to his colleagues and after a quick breath test we were on our way. No idea what that was about; perhaps they were looking for a particular face.
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Tuesday 9th July 2019 15:25 GMT Anguilla
A Policeman's lot is not a happy one: "The Pirates of Penzance" Gilbert & Sullivan.
I recall, something like 60+ years ago, a UK man who'd fitted up his car with a bell [well I did mention it was a looong time ago] - Belled a car in front as it was driving through Thornton Heath in South London.
His choice of "prey" wasn't very good - for he'd chosen to "gong" an undercover Police car.
I don't think it turned out very well for him!!
Here in Hong Kong, during recent weeks, the "Fuzz" have been accused of failing to display their rank & numbers whilst beating up marchers against the Hong Kong Government's attempt to force extradition laws to fling ALLEGED criminals back to Communist China.
It was put about by the "Fuzz" that Warrant cards need only be carried by one member of the squad tasked with beating up violent (& not so violent protestors) on the streets.
Needless to say, I rather chuckled when the protestors surrounded the Police HQ in Wanchai all day and into the early hours of the next day - so it was effectively "sealed off" !!
I think I can say that any "goodwill" towards this in-Disciplined Service has rather evaporated if one questioned the majority of the Hong Kongers - apart from the Commie Running Dogs that infest HK.
Biting the hand that feeds IT
