back to article DXC Technology seeks volunteers to take redundancy. No grads, apprentices, and 'quota carrying' sales folk

DXC Technology has opened a voluntary redundancy programme for staff across its operations in the UK and Ireland - though graduates, apprentices and quota-carrying sales folk need not apply. Less than a month into the new financial year, and Maruf Majed, DXC’s boss for the UK, Ireland, India, Middle East and Africa, yesterday …

  1. Aristotles slow and dimwitted horse Silver badge

    I give them two years...

    I give them two years and then they'll be a deader duck than the dead'ish duck they already are. Their cloud strategy won't save them.

    I hope all of the hardworking folks on the front line that have been caught up in this management and executive disaster all are able to see themselves right.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I give them two years...

      Agreed - two years is probably about right for DXC's denouement.

    2. TonyJ Silver badge

      Re: I give them two years...

      Do they have a cloud strategy? I was there (when it was still HP/HPE) about 7 years ago and they pumped serious cash into their offerings putting front and centre of their whole enterprise only to drop the whole thing about 12-18 months later.

    3. fredesmite2

      Re: I give them two years...

      But he still keeps his two homes so HE WINS

    4. we_could_be_right

      Re: I give them two years...

      Possibly due to criteria cited possibly if this means experienced older staff then it could fall under the Equality Act 2010 - age discrimination UK

    5. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I give them two years...

      Very unfair to get rid of older experienced people and talent who possibly built up some good experience and connections with the clients.

      Also based on ML speech stating "we're bringing Kids in" and on the criteria on this article - possibly open up to multiple cases of ageism under the equality act 2010 - if judge unfair... ?

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "Overarching strategy"?

    DXC has never really had a strategy, as in the steps they are going to take to achieve a specific medium term goal. "Sell more digital stuff" is not a 'strategy'

    When I was there the informal strategy seemed to be to cut costs until the clients threatened court action whilst offshoring every role it possibly could.

    This is not destined to end well. Sad for those involved.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "Overarching strategy"?

      A strategy is what a general (straturgos in Greek, a war worker) thinks up in order to either win a war or avoid defeat,

      DXC seems not to have got beyond tactics.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: "Overarching strategy"?

        Ahh.

        That's because the people in charge of this mess looked up the meaning of tictacs and not tactics.

        Wikipedia (the fountain of all knowledge):

        Tic Tacs are bad for you, as they contain ingredients that can wreak havoc on the body. Although popping a Tic Tac into your mouth every now and then shouldn't hurt, doing so every day may result in more harm than good.9 Mar 2016

        Seems vaguely in line with their policy.

  3. Cartimand

    Ever decreasing circles

    Before this Ouzelum Bird of a company finally disappears up its own fundament, I expect Mike Ashley to offer to buy it for £1.

    He could replace those ageing HP servers with racks of tacky tracksuits and plimsolls.

  4. trevorde

    What this really means

    Get rid of older, more experienced, more expensive people.

    1. nematoad Silver badge

      Re: What this really means

      "It is clear that we cannot rely solely on training our staff with new skills..."

      Or in other words:

      "Peanuts are cheap, therefore we are going to employ monkeys."

      You get out of a company what you are prepared to put in. Judging from this all the top brass are looking for is a way to squeeze the most out of the company before driving it into the ground.

      1. Saint
        Facepalm

        Re: What this really means

        Related.... "DXC also said it had hired 2,000 people with “digital capabilities,” including data scientists and security engineers, but hadn’t seen steep wage inflation in hiring those heads because they were “much earlier in their career”."

        Having contracted there pretty recently, I can confirm this means employing young graduates that havent got a clue, and even less experience

        1. Kabukiwookie Silver badge

          Re: What this really means

          Which sane experienced IT professional would want to work for DXC?

          Even contracting with DXC is more hassle than it's worth.

    2. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: What this really means

      The saddest thing of all about this is that they don't expect clients to notice that there's something hopelessly wrong about it. They must assume that client managements are looking at this, nodding sagely and saying "Good Idea". Given that those managements have already decided that outsourcing critical* components of their operations was a Good Idea the assumptions may well be right.

      *whether they realised it or not

      1. neilo

        Re: What this really means

        Yeah; except clients DO notice. When I left for greener pastures, two clients followed me. Other clients are looking closely at the situation as the practice bleeds talent faster than can be recruited.

    3. hottuberrol

      Re: What this really means

      Not sure an extra month's pay will achieve that outcome. Wont there still be legacy SDS, Phillips, government, Compaq etc people on the books, with nice fat grandfathered employment terms ?

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What this really means

      "Get rid of older, more experienced, more expensive people."

      Discrimination based on age is illegal in the UK.

      However, paying older workers less than they've been accustomed to is not. They know where the door is and no one makes them leave.

    5. circusmole

      Re: What this really means

      "Get rid of older, more experienced, more expensive people." another way of saying get rid of the people who actually know what they are doing.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Motivation?

    DXC is struggling. Struggling in every way and all they can do is further demotivate their employees.

    Anyone sensible would be looking to inspire greater effort and innovation, but no, its just another bucket of vomit poured over the workforce.

    Cheers Mikey.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Motivation?

      It hasn't changed in the last 25years. Not long after HP bought Compaq (inc Dec and Tandem) the culling started. I was 'transformed out' less than a year after that.

      They are still way too top heavy. Too many men in suits who know sod all about life on the ground.

      They are clearly doomed like all headless chickens.

      My only concern is when (not if) they go under, they take my pension with them.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        If you're worried about your pension...

        Get some professional advice on moving it somewhere else.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Motivation?

        Ahhh this is different now. The "management" no longer have any power whatsoever, they are micro managed from the very top (CEO) and no ability to do anything else. Their position is simply to pass on direct orders (usually just layoffs) and then be fired for not having achieved whatever unachievable financial targets they were handed down.

        Driving it into the ground is directly attributable to this practice.

        Anyone with any sense would delegate the success to mid level managers and let them operate as they see fit whilst being accountable for their success or failure, but thats not this place.

        It really is like that final scene from the movie "Downfall".

        1. Fatman
          Thumb Up

          Re: Motivation?

          <quote>It really is like that final scene from the movie "Downfall".</quote>

          I gave you an up vote for the `Downfall` reference.

      3. Lotaresco Silver badge

        Re: Motivation?

        "They are still way too top heavy. Too many men in suits who know sod all about life on the ground."

        That was also CSC's major problem. A bunch of lightweights who enjoyed swanning around at "The Pavilion" with lattes (or rather "LAR-tays") in hand fatuously repeating some buzzword they had just heard. When it came to understanding the customer and how to meet the customer's needs they were clueless. They also had a policy of side-lining or getting rid of real talent. This was because real talent could spot the glaring holes in the "plans" and pointed out things like "You're not going to build a datacentre like that for that budget." and "The customer isn't able to accept commercial cloud delivery because they are a government agency constrained to using G-cloud, they told us that in the tender."

        There were nuggets of talent at CSC, but they were like pea-sized gold nuggets in a dump truck full of pig poo.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    DXCers I've spoken to are looking forward to leaving with a better-than-usual pay off. Years and years without pay rises (at HPE/ CSC and then at DXC), some people have had enough.

  7. Anonymous South African Coward Silver badge

    Automation? What automation? If there's only salespersons and n00b techies in the company, who's gonna care about automation?

  8. Lotaresco Silver badge
    Flame

    How F***ing Much?

    They are offering a whole one month's pay to take early redundancy? That's mean by anyone's standards. I wonder how many takers they will get? I'm contrasting this with the 1990s when the tech. firm I was working for collapsed and the minimum pay out to employees was six months' pay.

    1. Saint

      Re: How F***ing Much?

      One month over and above the standard deal

      1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: How F***ing Much?

        But what's the standard deal?

        1. rmason

          Re: How F***ing Much?

          @Doctor Syntax

          The standard deal,all anyone is obligated to pay, is one weeks pay per year of service. Once you're past the age of 22.

          (edit - in the UK)

          1. Mr Humbug

            1.5 weeks per year over the age of 41. Only the most recent 20 years' service counts (so if you're 63 with >20 years' service you get 30 weeks' pay). Pay for one week is capped at £525 (I think it's a bit higher in NI). so maximum statutory payment is £15,750 (which is tax free).

            Presumably the additional month they are offering is not capped.

            I forget the exact details of ROI calculation, but the cap is higher and the number of weeks pay is greater

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: How F***ing Much?

          Depends on your contract, DXC is made up of several entities due to the various mergers (speaking from HP side of things)

          Digital Staff

          Compaq Staff

          HP Staff

          EDS Staff

          HPE Staff / CSC Staff = DXC

          Current Staff on newest terms

          All have different contracts and terms and the further back you go e.g Digital, the better terms you have, believe they get a month for every year up to a max 12 years and capped at £30,000 tax free, anything above and you pay tax on that. The more recent the higher, the worse the deal.

          Current staff have the shittiest deal and are on essentially Government statuary minimum, if out after 2 years you would be getting just around £1000 if your lucky.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: How F***ing Much?

            I asked UK HR for a copy of the terms and conditions of any voluntary redundancy. They sent me a copy of the EDS terms that carried in to HPE and I have an email confirming that they apply for DXC. Only concern is the word discretionary:

            -------------------------------------

            The following information sets out the company’s current discretionary practise regarding redundancy payments for all legacy EDS employees on EDS Standard Terms and Conditions.

            The enhanced redundancy payments referred to below are inclusive of any statutory entitlement. These payments are offered at the company’s discretion save for any statutory entitlements, and payment may be conditional on employees entering into a compromise agreement with the company.

            Notice Period

            Less than 5 years service: 1 month

            5 - 6 years service – 5 weeks

            Each additional year over 6 years service – 1 extra week up to a maximum of 12 weeks

            Redundancy Calculation

            Employees will receive a redundancy payment based on the following:-

            1 weeks reference salary per year of service between 18 – 21 years of age

            2 weeks reference salary per year of service between 22 – 40 years of age

            3 weeks reference salary per year of service between 41 – 65 years of age

            Redundancy payments will be capped at a maximum of 12 months salary

            1. And with one leap...

              Re: How F***ing Much?

              The payments are 'discretionary' in that they are not 'contractual', i.e. made in accordance with terms included in the employees contract of employment. However, the payments are quasi-contractual based on precedent, i.e. that the legacy companies have always offered redundancy on these terms in the past. If in future, the company offered different terms, then in the event of legal challenge in a tribunal or court, the tribunal / courts would generally enforce the pre-existing terms established by precedent. (However, if the new terms were not challenged and employees accepted redundancy on the new terms, then this could establish a new precedent and the company could be able to apply these terms to future redundancy rounds). Without the word 'discretionary', the company risks accepting that this is a general, albeit unstated contractual term.

      2. The Pi Man

        Re: How F***ing Much?

        If that's one month plus statutory minimum then it's sweet FA.

    2. paulf Silver badge
      Alert

      Re: How F***ing Much?

      When I was first made redundant (electronics) I got the legal minimum in the UK plus a bonus of £75 for every *complete* year worked. 4.5 years service got me an extra £300 - certainly not even close to a month's salary (or even a monthly mortgage payment TBF). Subsequent redundancies I've been close to, or heard about, at the current paulf&co have involved the legal minimum and not a penny more. I also heard, anecdotally, they were timed to ensure everyone was out the door about a month before the annual bonus qualifying date - so very much a fuck you with knobs on.

      In the circumstances an extra month's pay (tax free up to £20k if it's a redundancy payment, and not pay in lieu of notice, AIUI) can only be described as salubrious generosity compared to what some companies do.

      1. This post has been deleted by its author

    3. And with one leap...

      Re: How F***ing Much?

      The redundancy policies (including how much is paid) specific to the various legacy companies are available on the company intranet. In so far as you do not have specific terms written in to your individual contract of employment - be they more or less generous than the general, legacy company terms - then these terms will apply. In the UK, even if not formally recorded in your contract of employment, these are quasi-contractual terms, established by precedent in the legacy companies. The terms currently on offer (at least to legacy HPE staff) are CONSIDERABLY more generous than what is suggested by most of the posts here. Whatever else there might be to fairly complain about, the redundancy terms in the UK is not one of them.

  9. storner
    Holmes

    I only have two words for CSC/DXC employees:

    Get out.

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    what who where?

    I lost track quite a few years ago. All l remember is there was once a company called eds. They seemed to model themselves on ibm or the cia I forget which. I think the staff thought it was the cia anyway. So mostly horrible people then.

    Once sat in a presentation by some hp blokes around 2012 talking about what I would describe now as a cloud platform. Never heard anything more over the next few years.

    Whats gone on after that? Who works for who now? Have they all been arrested yet?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: what who where?

      They were more likely modelled on the KGB.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: what who where?

        The KGB were pretty competent. And contrast how well its one time head has done compared to, say, Fiorina, Hurd or Apotheker.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    My wife wishes to know...

    ... when they'll extend that offer to employees down under, so she can grab the money and run.

    And down here, the statutory package would be quite nice with her tenure anyway. Probably why they haven't offered her one: they're hoping to wear her down so she quits. :( Bastards.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: My wife wishes to know...

      They are axing people in Australia too - people I know have been told to go. No idea about packages though.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: My wife wishes to know...

        Yeah people in Aus went earlier in the month around the time of the mass US WFR, not a lot though.

        Doesn't seem to be a UK equivalent programme there yet though I have a few colleagues in Sydney who'd quite like to leave with a nice package if they can.

  12. FlossyThePig

    Sage Advice

    Many years ago the company I worked for were looking for volunteers to take redundancy. My boss from a previous company had moved into the recruitment game so I gave him a call. The advice he gave me was:

    Never volunteer for redundancy. If your name's on the list you'll get the brown envelope anyway. If it's not on the list you've told management about your desire to leave, so why should they give you a redundancy package when you'll probably leave within a few months for free.

    I got the brown envelope and moved on to pastures new. Most who voluntered and were turned down left within 6 months.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Sage Advice

      "Never volunteer for redundancy. If your name's on the list you'll get the brown envelope anyway. If it's not on the list you've told management about your desire to leave, so why should they give you a redundancy package when you'll probably leave within a few months for free."

      This is very good advice.

      This is from the 'IBM playbook' and has been used by other similar sized companies.

      You get a nice handy list of all the discontented people and you can use the list to plan your 'next' phase of realignments etc :)

      If you are particularly 'nice':( you can announce that the idea [Voluntary Redundancies] has been scrapped after further thought and then 'work' on pushing out a selection from your 'list' without having to pay any redundancy pay or extra financial incentive.

      (This is a IBM tactic of old which works quite well !!!)

    2. Erik4872

      Re: Sage Advice

      "Never volunteer for redundancy. If your name's on the list you'll get the brown envelope anyway."

      It depends on the situation. If you're a long-tenure person and you're being offered a better deal than you would get if they fired you later...then you should probably go for it. Of course, this is US-based advice...maybe the UK and Europe are a little more civilized about throwing people out when they're done with them?

    3. And with one leap...

      Re: Sage Advice

      This is not necessarily sage advice.

      1) By law, the company cannot subsequently discriminate against employees who volunteer, but are not accepted for VR, and tribunals are often sympathetic to employees who bring such cases forward under 'constructive dismissal' or the like;

      2) If you volunteer, but are not accepted for VR, this is a de facto acknowledgement by the company that the role is not redundant. If they then try to force you out later on CR, they would have to show what had changed between the time of the VR being refused and CR being imposed. Refusal of VR is also likely to be taken as at least highly suggestive of adequate performance in the role, which would make any subsequent attempt to 'get somebody out' under a PIP (Performance Improvement Plan) more difficult.

      If you are ultimately willing to contest your case at an employment tribunal if necessary, or at least fight your case to the point where the company thinks it's not worth the effort and backs down (i.e. offers a Compromise / Settlement Agreement) then applying for VR can put a marker down which can be useful later.

  13. smudge
    Facepalm

    See foot, take aim, fire!

    VR is how to get rid of your best staff.

  14. MickeyTheMoose

    DXC Troubles

    I just read this and found it quite amusing.

    There is an ongoing major issue inside the DXC Wynyard and Doxford sites. Seems their redundant core switches were playing "I'm Spartacus" with their failover protocol and now both are TITSUP. All our hosted services (websites, file servers and SAP HANA) went down around 11.40 this morning and are still dead...

    1. tin 2
      Coat

      Re: DXC Troubles

      you mean their *redundancy* protocols?

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Redundancies...

    One might have to question just how Mike Lawrie is still in a job.

    On the merger of CSC and HPE he stated 'We are a $26bn pure play IT Services provider....'

    And in under 2 years he's managed to reduce that to around (at this point in time) at $13.5bn company.

    How are the board and the shareholders not holding him to account and asking for his head?

    How inept does someone really have to be, after all, it's alleged he's being paid $10m a year with stock options and other crap on top of that!

    1. Fatman

      Re: Redundancies...

      <quote>How are the board and the shareholders not holding him to account and asking for his head?</quote>

      It reminds me of an old saying:

      IF you can't dazzle them with brilliance, then baffle them with BULLSHIT!!!!

    2. son of sam

      Re: Redundancies...

      In 2018 Mike earned $32 million in salary and stock options. Not a bad haul for the CEO of a failing corporation.

  16. grazer

    How is it that in recent years, everything carrying the touch of HP seems to go badly ?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      The ghost of Carly Fiorina is why

  17. tallenglish

    Company commits hara-kiri

    Company wants employees, just not the experienced and paid kind.

    Here is an idea, get rid of the overpriced and over paid execs at the top and work your way down, not start from the bottom working your way up.

    This just shows the selfish way of execs and management that is ruining business in the west. The get paid extorsionate rates, while treating those that do the most for the company as cattle.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Company commits hara-kiri

      There's relatively few execs at the top and getting rid of them wouldn't save THAT much money. Besides, companies do need a Board, even if they are ineffective.

      Where there is big money to be saved is in the middle management layers - they are thousands of L4/L5/L6s earning large amounts and I'm sure DXC wouldn't miss them.

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Times they are a Changin...

    In lieu of all the venom and negativity here I'm going to make a couple of comments in opposition. I joined CSC in early 2016 - just before the HPE merger was announced. I was not an intern nor recent college graduate. I have 35 years of experience in the industry. My first day on a conference call, a group of people were digging through emails trying to find the latest version of some spreadsheet. I suggested we put up a SharePoint site to store and track documents for the project.

    This suggestion was met with the type of responsiveness of the comments herein this thread. "SharePoint is a tinker toy!!", "SharePoint is not Secure!", "We use Lotus Notes here!!!!". It was at this very point I understood the challenge in needing to re-tool - not just with newer technologies but more importantly with newer mindsets. The move to digital transformation has been extremely painful as a result. It is not unlike Microsoft itself having shed thousands of employees in their massive shift from package products to cloud based services and products that occurred circa 2007-2010.

    So yet this is painful, and yes people are getting hurt and some very unfairly. But the best way to survive at DXC is to re-tool yourself and get engaged in building revenues in some fashion. We are doing impressive things around the world and I see a growing and healthy pipeline emerging. The primary challenge is being able to deliver the disruptive technology engagements we are building and those who are not embracing the need to change and reinvent themselves in some situations are setting themselves up to be shown the door. There are massive training programs here and it's to everyone's advantage to utilize such. I know I'm over simplifying the situation somewhat, but it's really challenging to change and the shift to digital is a good one for the future.

    1. DonL

      Re: Times they are a Changin...

      "This suggestion was met with the type of responsiveness of the comments herein this thread. "SharePoint is a tinker toy!!", "SharePoint is not Secure!", "We use Lotus Notes here!!!!""

      "those who are not embracing the need to change and reinvent themselves in some situations are setting themselves up to be shown the door."

      It seems you didn't embrace the need to change and reinvent yourself to use Lotus Notes if you ask me. :)

  19. Miss Lincolnshire

    Embrace it and move on

    I left this abortion of a company two years ago but instead of feeling sorry for myself I got my head down to get contract work.

    I've got all but a month's worth of my payoff in the bank and in my pension and I've been fortunate enough to have contracted continuously which builds on that. You'll be amazed how quickly the Stockholm Syndrome dies away when you are working in a role outside of DXC.

    If they send you the black spot, just get your head down and apply for jobs or contracts and you'll be fine. It is absolutely all about ageism but to be honest I don't care. Working for them was destroying me intellectually.

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