Beginning of the end.
This post was brought to you by a JavaScript trademark encroaching phone OS
Oracle, claims developer Zhongmin Steven Guo, has demanded that Apple remove an app he created because it contains the trademarked term "JavaScript." The app in question, published by Guo's Tyanya Software LLC – which appears to be more a liability shield than a thriving software business – is titled "HTML5, CSS, JavaScript, …
FWIW, the official, standardised version is known as "ECMAScript", though whether it's technically correct to use that name to refer to a specific implementation itself or merely to the standard it implements is open to question. Also, "ECMA" and "ECMAScript" are still themselves trademarked.
While I'm here, it's also worth remembering that Oracle (and predecessor Sun) don't own- and didn't even create- JavaScript itself. They merely own the rights to the name because Netscape licensed it from them, renaming what was known as "LiveScript" in early betas to "JavaScript" to piggyback on the hype surrounding Java in the mid-90s. (#)
The confusion this marketing-led decision would cause between Java and JavaScript- two technically-unrelated languages- over the years should have been obvious even at the time, and deserves condemnation for that reason alone, even if they didn't have the benefit of hindsight on the licensing issues.
Live Script was a much better name. The marketing morons at Netscape, as usual, were out of their f*ing minds. Since ECMAScript (proun. ek-mah-skript) doesn't exactly roll off the tongue, why not just use "ES" (ee-ss) instead? So the latest version, ECMAScript 6, would become ES6. Why not go further and phase out the .js filename extension and migrate to ".es"? After all, nothing says freedom like pushing Oracle a little bit further into irrelevance.
As I mentioned above, Oracle still owns the name JavaScript. Netscape licensed the rights from (what was then) Sun in order to benefit from the hype surrounding Sun's Java language.
Following the commentard tradition of not actually looking anything up, I ask whether affirming that JavaScript(TM) is a trademark of Oracle sufficed? (I agree that this is a typical case of overzealous lawyers creating a cottage-industry. Remember the patent-marking cottage-industry that was finally squashed by the AIA?)
What a brilliant way to ensure that nobody ever talks about your product ever again.
And the "trademark enforcement" nonsense? Just rubbish. You can use trademarks so long as you're not passing off. Otherwise every product called "... for Windows" would be in breach of trademark (yes, Microsoft tried it, they failed). And you'd be able to sue someone for saying, say, "DVD Collection Organiser".
Sorry, but Oracle are just setting out to destroy every possible reason to ever go near one of their properties, and I can't fathom why. Everything they touch dies, forks, or is something everyone runs from. The whole Java/Dalvik thing, MySQL/MariaDB, OpenOffice, the whole Sun brand, etc. etc. etc.
Windows isn't a trademark. Word isn't a trademark. They are generic descriptions that describe the type of product.
Microsoft Windows is a trade mark. Microsoft Word is a trade mark. Excel is a trademark whether prefixed with Microsoft of not as it isn't a generic description of a spreadsheet program.
Whatever one thinks of Ellison, it's clear he isn't the type of guy who cares if people think he's a dick, nor likely to be upset by "LarryIsAnArseScript" or "OracleSucksBallsScript".
No... if you *really* want to hit him where it hurts, you should call it "Larry-Ellison-Still-Isn't-As-Rich-As-Bill-Gates-Script".
As far as I can tell, this is an issue surrounding the use of the "JavaScript" name that Netscape licensed from what was then Sun, i.e. a trademark issue and (I assume) entirely separate from any legal issues that might or might not relate to the JavasScript language itself.
But merely mentioning a trademarked name is in itself not a problem. The problem is in *naming* some product after the trademark.
Somebody at Oracle's law firm did a grep over an easily-available list of software products, thereby satisfying some minimal level of "policing" effort so as not to lose the trademark.
Because Oracle are jerks, even the people who define that standard can't call it JavaScript. So what we're left with is ECMAScript (catchy name, I know) and a bunch of legacy leading people to call even the new standards "Javascript".
Maybe if they could just come up with a new, catchy name we could be free of Oracle entirely. I mean, who wants to go along shackled to the boat anchor that Java is turning into under Oracle's leadership?
...the standard on which JavaScript is based, the ECMAScript programming language.
Shouldn't that be "...ECMAScript, the standard which is based on the JavaScript programming language"?
JavaScript was created between May and December 1995. ECMAScript didn't show up until 1997, and it was based almost entirely on Netscape's submission of JavaScript.
Perhaps you could say that future versions of JavaScript were specifically aligned with ECMAScript from there on out, but JavaScript was the original.
So in the interest of forgetting any and all associations with Oracle, why don't we just call it ECMAScript, then? Even if that's clumsy? Most colloquial references seem to talk about it by framework anyway - "This site uses Angular", "The service is written in Node".
The app just changes its description to "HTML5, CSS, ECMAScript, HTML, Snippet Editor" and carries on being a hobby project with the accidental reference to the pointless bloatware dead-man-walking that is Oracle left consigned to the dustbin of history.
If Oracle want their trademark, let them have it. And thus, let it die.
JavaScript may be the worst ever case of bandwagon jumping in terms of naming, and a source of eternal confusion for people who can’t tell the differences between Java and JavaScript, but ECMAScript is an even worse name (sounding as if it is an unfortunate medical condition somewhere between eczema and acne).
Since JavaScript is, de facto, •the• client side scripting language of the web, why don’t we just rename it to WebScript and be done with both the language confusion and inane trademarking?
"If Oracle want their trademark, let them have it. And thus, let it die."
This is what Oracle would like and, strangely enough, I find myself in their camp on this occasion.
Start calling it ECMAScript and people stop confusing Java with JS. Publishers get to re-issue old wine in new skins (yes, I know that's the wrong way round) merely by search and replace on all their JS textbooks. Oracle keeps all references to Java-anything to itself. Oracle's lawyers have to find another way of being annoying.
Could it be that this is a red herring? Apple taking down a dodgy app (perhaps after complaints) and asserting the TM thing as an excuse? Or even the purveyor of the dodgy app inventing the whole excuse?
Just a thought. It would explain why JavaScript is just fine in other places[1]. If I google, apple's app store tops the results, but their page wants me to open it in itunes (sod that) and I don't see any review pages.
[1] That is, the word is just fine. The script itself - well, the less said, the better.
All together now
Repeat after me
Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript Javascript
First the obvious oneliner: Gee, I really wonder why Oracle has become so massively unpopular with geeks and other techies.... I knew it was bad news the very moment I saw my support subscription for Sun Solaris triple while I got a lot less service in return (note: mostly referring to SunSolve access which was Sun's hardware database on everything they ever made,it was awesome).
But this is just cringe worthy.
Oracle's definition of open source: "It's free as long as you're not making any money from it, but if you do we'd like our 55% cut please..". What a bunch of hyena's!
I really hope more and more geeks will come to realize that using (wh)Oracle products isn't the best of ideas and are therefor best avoided. I don't do this often because I truly believe in "the best tool for the best job" and I dislike zealous bias. Because of that I can honestly enjoy both Windows and FreeBSD. I enjoy tinkering with PowerShell just as much as I enjoy messing around on my trusty FreeBSD Korn shell. I don't discriminate. Heck; my Apache webserver is backed by both Tomcat for Java servlet pages ("jsp") as well as mod_mono ('Powered by Mono') for ASP.NET support. I admire both environments and enjoy using them.
But ever since (wh)Oracle started throwing weight around, this is yet another example, have I been very keen on moving myself and my company away from Oracle best as I could. MySQL has mostly been replaced by PostgreSQL but one instance remains for some specific web applications and we're even looking into what to do next. Can we do without the webapps or shall we move onto MariaDB...
Totally ridiculous if you think about it but what other choice do they leave you? The way I see it you'll always be at risk for those hyena's to come knocking at your door because they want their cut of your money. And for doing what? Apparently owning the rights to some name or some product.
I really hope more feel the same as I do and that eventually this is going to backfire on them. Never forget that bigger things always start slow. My endeavors probably don't harm Oracle at all, but me sharing them every chance I get and even pointing others to solutions such as PostgreSQL (personal favorite) and/or MariaDB can leave a mark over time. One that can only get bigger, and once that happens you never know what might happen next.
But this is just cringe worthy.
It would if it were true. Oracle has very little chance of asserting copyright over Javascript, not least because Sun hardly bothered. But if Oracle were to go after anyone it would probably be the browser makers, most notably Google, because V8 powers node.js.
Oracle didn't become as big as it is by making bad products. I'm not a fan but for many years companies were happy to pay Oracle whatever it took to run their services. The Sun deal was poorly handled but at least Oracle understood that Sun had assets it was doing nothing with, which was a disservice to shareholders.
I've never liked MySQL and the Sun deal was one of the best things to happen to Postgres as developers switched from MySQL to Postgres. However, since the takeover, as far as I can tell, Oracle has taken quality in MySQL seriously, something that used to be an oxymoron. But it seems to be more interested in buying up the competition and dreaming up ever more licensing systems than development. And if it continues not to invest in its own products, it will lose market share and money faster than any of its patent trolling can make it.
This is a trademark issue. It has nothing do with copyright. (#)
Netscape created a language known in early Betas as "LiveScript". They licensed the *name* "JavaScript" to capitalise on the mid-90s hype for Sun's otherwise unrelated "Java" language. Hence Oracle still owns the *trademark* "JavaScript".
Oracle has zero chance of asserting the *copyright* on the language itself for the simple reason that they don't own it and never did. End of story.
(#) Despite aspects of the two being often confused, they're completely different. For example, you don't have to "defend" copyright as appears to be being suggested above- that's trademarks. (Though if we *were* talking about copyright I'm not sure how it would affect damages if it could be shown that a given party had tolerated or implicitly endorsed through inaction particular uses of their tech covered by copyright).
Will everyone know what a "HTML5, CSS, 'Coffee' Script, HTML, Snippet Editor" is? And what does it do that Microsoft Windows Notepad doesn't, or vice versa?
I'm under the impression that long, vague, buzzwordy company and product names are or were a Chinese thing, and that their own government was cracking down on it - there was a news story a while back. So you're lucky if it's Oracle shutting you down instead.
Just received this email from Apple about my app(Html, CSS, javascript snippet editor). Looks like you can't use "Javascript" because Oracle owns it!
Does anyone have any idea how to fight it or just give up?
"As you are likely aware, Oracle owns US Trademark Registration No. 2416017 for JAVASCRIPT. The seller of this iTunes app prominently displays JAVASCRIPT without authorization from our client. The unauthorized display of our client's intellectual property is likely to cause consumers encountering this app to mistakenly believe that it emanates from, or is provided under a license from, Oracle. Use of our client's trademark in such a manner constitutes trademark infringement in violation of the Lanham Act. 15 U.S.C. § 1125(a)(1)(A). In order to prevent further consumer confusion and infringement of our client's intellectual property rights, we request that you immediately disable access to this app. We look forward to your confirmation that you have complied with this request."
Hope you’ll get your answer.
Thank you!!!
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