back to article Uber responds to Waymo: We don't even use that tech you say we stole

Uber has filed its response to Waymo's trade secret suit, arguing it does not even use the self-driving car technology described in the complaint. In a filing [PDF] to the California Northern US District Court made Friday, the dial-a-ride app builder says the LiDAR sensor technology at the heart of the suit is not employed in …

  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Not using it

    Is this why the Uber self-driving car needs user intervention every mile while the Google one only needs it every 5000 or so?

    I hold no brief for either company but the results announced so far suggest that one is enormously more advanced than the other.

  2. Your alien overlord - fear me

    Is Uber LIDAR designed to find the long way around items? See the other posting about them being sued if you don't get it.

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Given Uber's history

    I'd examine their response for perjury.

  4. GreggS

    Judge

    I note the judge has slammed Uber for relying on Mr Levandowski's pleading of the fifth. He's also questioned why he is still employed by them.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Judge

      The 5th amendment shouldn't be applicable here. The relevant part of the amendment says "No person ... shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself" But, this is a civil case, not a criminal one.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Judge

        If forced to testify in this civil case, and that testimony reveals criminal behaviour, without immunity that testimony could later be used against him in a criminal trial.

        1. Charles 9

          Re: Judge

          Correct. Fifth Amendment can be invoked anytime the answer to a question can in turn be used against him/her in any future criminal proceeding. It's even been used (infamously) in Congressional inquiries (and those aren't trials, either).

  5. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Unhappy

    He's downloaded 14 000 file off the company server and he's pleading the 5th.

    Obviously he is innocent until convicted by a jury of his peers but let's be honest his behavior has been what a lot of people might consider a tad suspicious.

    Not that I'm sure he has a complete explanation for these (apparently) suspicious actions.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: He's downloaded 14 000 file off the company server and he's pleading the 5th.

      So far the 14000 DL's are only alleged to have been purloined. And even if true it sure didn't help Uber's tech very much, given its poor performance to date.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: He's downloaded 14 000 file off the company server and he's pleading the 5th.

      > let's be honest his behavior has been what a lot of people might consider a tad suspicious.

      Backing up his porn collection?

      1. John Smith 19 Gold badge
        Unhappy

        "Backing up his porn collection?"

        Hmm. Yes I like that. Very plausible. And he's taken the 5th because some of them are quite nasty (but legal). I'm sure his lawyers can supply a list of suitably distasteful topics.

        Sadly I suspect that this being Google they may have a little more intelligence on the files contents than just the number and size.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Uber - doesnt matter what they say, they will be lying.

    So full of shit they should be writing 'policy' for the presidiot

  7. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    Google wins this one

    It starts to make sense when you lay out the timeline, which is as follows:

    t=0: Levandowski works for Google. He does their self-driving car stuff. He downloads 14 THOUSAND files from Google. I somehow doubt these are cat videos, and the fact that Google are suing suggests they have evidence that it was more meaningful. A git repo maybe?

    t = 30 days. Levandowski quits and starts his own self-driving car company. I somehow doubt that this was a decision made between t=0 and t=30

    t = few months. Uber buys Levandowski's company (Otto).

    I can well see why Mr L has taken the fifth. He's looking remarkably like he stole IPR from Google, got Uber to unknowingly pay for it via the acquisition of Otto, and now must have be enjoying some serious lawyerly arm-twisting from his employer, who stand to lose a heckuva lot of Google's claims against him are proven.

    1. kain preacher

      Re: Google wins this one

      If that is true then Mr L could be looking at criminal fraud charges.

      1. Richard 12 Silver badge

        Re: Google wins this one

        That would explain the 5th.

    2. potatohead

      Re: Google wins this one

      Unlikely to be a (just) a git repository, the allegation is that the files were 9.7gb of stuff.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Google wins this one

        > Unlikely to be a (just) a git repository, the allegation is that the files were 9.7gb of stuff.

        Would you believe TWO Git repositories?

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Fashionable to hate Uber

    I hate how it's fashionable to hate Uber, simply because they stole the jobs of lazy taxi drivers with a better, customer friendly business model.

    However this does seem like Uber's defence here is that they didn't steal the tech, they just employed (and continue to employ) the guy that did steal Google's tech... Not much a defence really....

    1. Hollerithevo

      Re: Fashionable to hate Uber

      Uber has certainly woke traditional taxi services up, but perhaps only Black Cab drivers were complacent -- mini-cab drivers have always been at the edge: poorly paid, no security, etc. But Uber exploits its drivers, puts its passengers at risk (insurance, no proper vetting of drivers etc) and is shown to be an all-around cum-bag.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Fashionable to hate Uber

      > I hate how it's fashionable to hate Uber, simply because they stole the jobs of lazy taxi drivers with a better, customer friendly business model.

      May it be perhaps that their questionable ethics and business practices, immature corporate officers, and poor decision making, are also a factor?

  9. nautica Silver badge
    Boffin

    Howzat again?

    "...We don't even use that tech you say we stole."

    "...I didn't say all them things I said..."--Yogi Berra

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    For those of us who

    a. Are not American,

    b. do not tend to watch Hollywoodesque legal dramas, and

    c. cannot be arsed to look up "fifth amendment rights";

    could you please clarify what that's supposed to be?

    From the context, I gather it's similar to Article 10 of the Andorran Constitution, but that's just a guess. Please keep in mind you are writing for an international audience.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: For those of us who

      You had our sympathy until point c.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: For those of us who

        > You had our sympathy until point c.

        For who else do you speak?

        Not my case, but not everyone is free to browse at will. For example people using work or public connections may be reticent to do searches where they are uncertain about what sort of results may pop up.

    2. Ben Tasker
      Joke

      Re: For those of us who

      For those of us who can't be arsed, could you tell us what Article 10 of the Andorran Consituation says?

      5th Amendment is the right against being compelled to incriminate yourself by testifying.

      1. Allan George Dyer
        Joke

        Re: For those of us who

        "Article 10 lays out a citizen's rights before the courts, specifically, the right to obtain a decision from the court that is firmly based in law, the right to have a lawyer in court, and even the right to have free legal representation in cases where this is necessary.", according to Wikipedia, so fairly similar to Article 35 of the Basic Law of the Hong Kong SAR. OK?

  11. kain preacher

    I'll bite.

    No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Funny

    I didn't think Uber did the 'law thing'.

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