Skin tattoo will tell your phone when you've had a skinful

Drunk driving costs thousands of lives every year and, as El Reg tests have shown, personal breathalyzers aren't that reliable. But now government-funded boffins think they've cracked a way of stopping people driving when they've had a skinful. The National Institute of Biomedical Imaging and Bioengineering (NIBIB) has …

[Anonymous Coward]

Um, no.

Most drink drivers are morning-after drivers. That's where this device would have an impact.

[Martin Summers]

If you have to rely on a sensor to tell you you're too drunk to drive then you shouldn't be driving. As you've pointed out, morons who drink and drive don't care they are doing it just like those who casually break the speed limit excessively or hold their phone. These kind of people are a special breed who think they're more important than the rest of us and have a God given right to do what they like on the road and their lives are of course much more important than the rest of us. These kind of people will continue to kill, they don't give a toss.

This kind of gadget unfortunately (nanny state) needs to be built into a car to prevent them being used when drunk. That tech already exists. Although I'm sure there may still be ways round even that it would help.

[Anonymous Coward]

This tattoo is for more nuanced cases than those who drive after a skinful.

So you have a good few pints one night, leave your car in the pub carpark. You don't drive the next morning because you're not a moron, but you've got to get the car at some point. Are you ok in the afternoon?

There's no way to know, which results in people just winging it.

Also, lumping in people who exceed the arbitrary speed limits with intentional drink drivers is a bit sanctimonious, don't you think?

[Martin Summers]

@disgusted

If you're not sure, don't risk it. Simple as that.

As for lumping excessively speeding drivers in with drunk ones yes I am. I was in an accident with a speeding driver, me and my family were nearly killed, I suffered a serious leg injury. So if giving a shit and bitter experience makes me sanctimonious then so be it. The speed limits are hardly arbitrary and its not up to you to decide what you think is safe. That's your opinion, not law.

[Anonymous Coward]

The only way to be absolutely sure is to wait another day. That's most likely completely unnecessary. I've previously tried to buy a breathalyser for this occasional situation, but I couldn't.

There's a difference between breaking the speed limit and driving like a maniac. The speed limits *are* arbitrary. There are loads of side roads that aren't really save to be doing 30mph down, but there are a lot of main roads that are safe for 40mph or even 50mph that are limited to 30mph.

I don't advocate driving at a hundred miles an hour round blind bends, but I also don't stick to speed limits when they are clearly unnecessary.

If the green party takes over your council and reduces all the roads to 20mph, will they still be correct? Would they previously have been wrong? What if somebody sensible raises those main roads to 40mph?

[Anonymous Coward]

There's a difference between breaking the speed limit and driving like a maniac. The speed limits *are* arbitrary. There are loads of side roads that aren't really save to be doing 30mph down, but there are a lot of main roads that are safe for 40mph or even 50mph that are limited to 30mph.

Some of it is raw revenue generation: speeding fines mean extra income.

However, there's also a flipside to speed limits: sometimes the limit is not the speed you should be driving. The inner city speed limit may be 50 kmh or 30 mph, but if you do not slow down when you see a school or playing children you have no idea of safe driving and risk management and should at least be sent to advanced driver training where they teach you to think ahead.

Conversely, 70mph limits on a straight, empty stretch of motorway at 3am is a bit silly too (also because on the continent there are more and more countries raising it to 130 km/h (80 mph) where appropriate. France has been doing it for ages, Holland has implemented it a while back, Belgium is apparently discussing it and in Germany it's AFAIK the advised cruise speed.

[Joe Harrison]

Cue all the "above average drivers" who are above all this rules and regulations nonsense and are more than capable of deciding for themselves what speed to do. You'll probably spot them easily but in case you don't they will self-identify using a special series of hand signals.

[rdhood]

Setting the speed limit on a road is arbitrary.

The requirement to obey the arbitrarily set speed limit is not.

[Anonymous Coward]

Some sort of alcohol-activated kill switch? I can get behind that. If we could do it with drivers who use their phones too, that would be great.

The worst part about people who text etc. while driving is that it's easy to spot even if you can't see in through their windows but nowhere near enough of them are prosecuted or even pulled over, especially in the UK.

[Martin Summers]

I was told by a police officer that texting while driving is massively hard to prove. Apparently if you say you are using the phone to play music and are changing the track then that isn't an offence under the law and you get off with it. I'm saying this knowing that any idiot who wanted to text and drive will do so anyway regardless of me giving them a cast iron get out. They probably already know that one anyway.

[wikkity]

massively hard to prove?

Not really, in cases of a crash it's common nowadays for mobiles to be examined and checks with service providers. It's probably OTT to check during all car related incidents but if they suspected you of doing it they would. There was a case not so long ago where a woman who caused a fatal crash deleted her sent text messages and was surprised they found out.

[Anonymous Coward]

Some sort of alcohol-activated kill switch?

That's a bit drastic? Oh, wait, kill switch. OK, carry on.

[JDC]

Good for a lot of potential drunk drivers.

I bet a fair number of drunk drivers just have no idea they're over the limit - "I've only had a couple, officer" - for that kind of driver this kind of warning is ideal. Also for the morning-after drivers, unaware that they're still over.

[Steve Davies 3]

How long before your insurance company

starts making this mandatory otherwise your premium doubles/triples?

Place your bets please!

{see icon}

[alain williams]

Re: How long before your insurance company

I think that this will come in for drivers who have a previous DD conviction and who want to get insurance. I'm not someone who like Big Brother, but this is one case that I would not complain about.

[Jedit]

"otherwise your premium doubles"

If you've had a round of premium doubles, you're definitely not fit to drive.

Beer, because WHY ISN'T EVERY POST IN THIS THREAD TAGGED WITH BEER?

[Lotaresco]

Have you had a drink sir?

No officer, I've had a skinfull.

[Roj Blake]

The police don't need gizmos to tell if you're over the limit...

- Would you like a kebab, Sir?

- Oooh, yes please officer

- You're nicked, son

[James 51]

I can see this tech ultimately being used for work place drug/alcohol policies. Not willing to be implanted and tested remotely at random without warning, no payslip for you.

[Pen-y-gors]

Which government, what country?

El Reg has a wonderfully international readership, but we assume that in general it's written from a UK viewpoint, unless noted otherwise.

Could the authors of articles make it clear which country they're writing from the perspective of? Eventually I worked out that in this case the 'government' that did the funding is the US government, and the National Instituter of whatever is the US National Institute of whatever, which makes more sense of the wild numbers of 'Drunk driving costs thousands of lives every year' - which is rubbish in a UK context. Over the last five years road deaths in the UK attributed to drink driving have been a pretty consistent 240 per year. The UK has some of the safest roads in the world.

But, whinging apart, looks like this could be a useful and effective tool to get that even lower, provided they don't cost an arm and a leg. Issued free by pubs perhaps?

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Which government, what country?

Over the last five years road deaths in the UK attributed to drink driving have been a pretty consistent 240 per year. The UK has some of the safest roads in the world.

Source? Not just because that number looks suspiciously low, but also because I'd like to see if that includes what the Americans like to call "collateral damage".

By the way, I'm happy that UK's roads are safe. I'm more worried about the people who drive on them..

[Big_Boomer]

Selfish

Sorry, but if you are going to drive, you shouldn't be drinking at all, regardless of the quantity involved. Sitting with a friends bleeding head resting on my lap, having pulled him out of a rolled over car that was t-boned (I was also a passenger in the car), I saw the driver of the car who t-boned us stagger out of what was left of his car and stumble up to a tree and puke his guts up. When the police arrived he was found to be 300% over the limit, was eventually prosecuted and got a 2 year ban and a big fine. The police believe he passed out at the wheel and blew straight through the red light. We also learned in court that this was his 5th drink driving offence but the first in which he caused a crash. My friend got 70+ stitches in his head, had concussion for a week and is scarred for life.

[James 51]

Re: Selfish

The few times I have been over to the US for work the people I was working with had a far more lax attitude to drink driving and saw a lot more erratic driving than anywhere in the UK. A car I was it was almost hit broadside by a drunk driver who then went off the road and staggered out of his car. People not drinking and driving would be the best solution and this might stop people in the morning after but it won't stop people who think they're better drivers after they've had a few.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Selfish

Having a skinfull and driving is different to being borderline. Am I ok to drive, I'm not sure.

It's especially true the day after you leave your car in a pub carpark. Can I pick it up yet, or am I still over the limit? Who knows? Nobody will sell me a breathalyser that will actually work.

[Bilious]

Useless technology.

This seems like a useless showoff of technology. If it is for morning-after diagnosis ("am I sober enough to drive?"), then saliva testing would be easier and cheaper and a lot quicker. If it is for quantifying blood ethanol during drinking, the results are likely to be _very_ variable because the alcohol needs to pass a number of barriers before reaching the detector. Even blood alcohol measured with state-of-the-art equipment is variable dring drinking. It is unlikely that a number from the instrument will be reliable, and it is unlikely that even a sober expert will be able to interpret it. So if the instrument shows a number for blood alcohol, it can only be taken to mean that the alcohol has been absorbed. No need for an instrument to show that.

[Unep Eurobats]

Could help bring peer pressure to bear

On the one hand I think this encourages people to try and game the system. On the other, if you've got a glowing tattoo on your arm it gives people a reason to point out you shouldn't be getting behind the wheel.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Could help bring peer pressure to bear

Could be cool if you could have the glowing happening in your eyes so you couldn't see where you were going anyway. More effective to stop people from driving as they wouldn't even be able to get out of the car park :).

[Anonymous Coward]

I remember being on holiday in Ireland some years ago. I was about to have a pint with my evening meal when it occured to me that the drink-drive limit might be different to the UK. So I asked the waiter what the limit was in Ireland. He didn't know, so he asked the manager. The manager didn't know so he asked around the bar if anyone knew. Nobody in the bar knew if there was a limit or how much it might be. It seemed to be a completely foreign concept to them.

[Anonymous Coward]

What people don't realise...

is that this, and all the other technology like it, such as home breathalysers, etc, are simply enabling and encouraging people to drink and drive as they now have ways (flawed) to measure their levels, and I have seen people test themselves and go "Yep! Okay to drive!" after a couple of beers and wander off to their car.

Also:

"That's still too long for police doing roadside stops"

Not necessarily. Right now, if someone has had a drink within 20 minutes of being stopped and breathalysed, we have to wait 20 minutes before we can test them due to residual beer breath throwing the Alcometer. This sounds like this would fix that. I've spent two and a half hours processing someone through for the full test which they passed, only for them to tell me they'd lied when I asked if they'd had a drink in the last 20 minutes, hence why they failed the roadside test.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: What people don't realise...

Yeh. And in that 20 mins road side wait I could have been safely home and back at least twice. It's a wait to guarantee you get the result you want.

[astrax]

Looking forward...

...to when they release an API so we can control little Micro Bots that automatically hides your car keys if you have had too much to drink.

Or simply don't be a completely selfish **** and drink and drive.

[You aint sin me, roit]

The psychology of drinking...

Give a youth a tattoo that shows how much over the limit he is and he's bound to see it as a challenge...

"Just another couple of shots and I can push it over the 500% mark!"

Even better if you can push your reading to FaceBook (or similar social media)...

"Look how pissed I am! And it's only midday!"

Not too sure if I want my sweat details blurted out via (hopelessly insecure) wireless to all and sundry though.

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: The psychology of drinking...

"Just another couple of shots and I can push it over the 500% mark!"

That would be OK as that method simply involves Darwin. Once a few have reduced the risk of drunk drivers on the street by vacating this planet earlier than planned the others may decide to forego forced natural selection by self poisoning, at least for a while. It may end up being a slightly cyclic thing, like changing from summer to winter time.

[Zog_but_not_the_first]

Re: Drunk?

Get in the van!

[teebie]

Is this snake oil?

How many factors can affect the conductivity of sweat? Does it naturally vary from person to person? How far can we trust someone who puts that image on the abstract of their paper?