back to article Scary Trans-Pacific Partnership trade treaty signed off

The Trans-Pacific partnership, a 12-nation trade treaty negotiated in secret and thought to contain copyright nasties, is all but done. Australia, Brunei Darussalam, Canada, Chile, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore, the USA and Vietnam have successfully concluded negotiations on the provisions of the secret …

  1. Your alien overlord - fear me

    If the wordings secret, who in each country is going to sign it off? I doubt Pres. Obama has read every word so is he going on blind faith that someone in the USA has read it fully or is it some junior lackey who's job is to be the fall guy if it goes tits up?

    1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      The people who paid for it ( or at least the politicians signing it) have read it

      The pharma and agro companies, the RIAA , the MPAA etc

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        @Yet Another Tinfoil Hat

        There isn't anything about stronger copyright enforcement in TTP/TTIP, and pharma patents have been shortened.

        Don't let facts get in the way of your dingbat freetard conspiracy theories, though. It sounds like you need them.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      In the US, treaties have to be ratified by Congress.

      As of yet, the members of Congress don't know what is in the treaty - it's secret.

      For those not in the US, there was a major bill that passed Congress, nick named ObamaCare.

      The Speaker Of The House told the House: "We have to vote for it to see what is in it"

      And so they did.

  2. jonnycando
    Mushroom

    No lackey needed

    If he did readit he made plenty sure it would cost the usa as many jobs as possible. Got to have everyone sucking the government teat after all. The only way it could be bad in his eyes is if Americans prosper. But he will pretend to be overjoyed.

    1. Jon Arden

      Re: No lackey needed

      Got to love American politics.... So, you think your current President only went for the position to destroy the country. R.I.G.H.T......

  3. Steven Roper

    Any politician signatory to this sham has intentionally and knowingly sold his country's sovereignty to foreign corporate powers and should be charged and tried for high treason.

    1. Voland's right hand Silver badge

      My exact thought

      The article missed the fact that the treaty is rumored to establish "corporation can sue a state for lost profits due to changes in tax and environmental legislation" procedure.

      So the concept is not entirely new - there are some cases of international corp vs state arbitration. The treaty supposedly streamlines it and makes it nice, easy and one way street for the corporations.

      The opposite - states clawing back compensation for tax evasion, environmental disasters, etc from corporations in other countries signatories to the treaty is surprise, surprise - not supported. Same as the similar deal with the Eu.

      1. Dylan Byford

        Re: My exact thought

        Why does it feel like all that dystopian cyberpunk I read in the 90s is gradually becoming reality?

        Democratic government is dying. Welcome to the corporate plutocracy.

        1. Dan Paul

          Re: My exact thought

          Dylan,

          You need to read the Unincorporated Man series...

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Unincorporated_Man

          It is an interesting and apropos concept (more so than cyberpunk) and written much more recently.

    2. Adam 1

      Oh don't be like that guys. Come on, a few exercises to help clear your mind. Everybody, stand up. Great! Now bend at your waist and touch your toes. Wonderful. You are now in the Hello TPP position. Feel better now?

    3. Dr Stephen Jones

      "Any politician signatory to this sham has intentionally and knowingly sold his country's sovereignty to foreign corporate powers and should be charged and tried for high treason."

      Why?

      You sound like David Icke.

  4. Mark 85 Silver badge

    The articles are starting to come out in the mainstream media and this thing isn't boding well for anyone... Tariffs on everything from dairy products to autos, IP, copyright, and slew of other things including patents on tech and pharmaceuticals. Here in the States it's being predicted at this early stage that it's not going to happen. Some Repubs say it didn't go far enough and the others say it went too far. The Dems at the moment, are strangely quiet.

    I'm not holding my breath in this. From what's been released, it looks like people, but not the corporations, world round will be screwed one way or the other.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Nothing to see here...

      Mark 85 says: "I'm not holding my breath in this. From what's been released, it looks like people, but not the corporations, world round will be screwed one way or the other."

      David Bryne & co say: "Same as it ever was."

      1. Mpeler
        Big Brother

        We Won't Get Fooled Again...

        Meet the new boss...

        Same as the old boss...

  5. FozzyBear
    Devil

    Why do I get the feeling that yet more of my rights and freedoms have yet again been brutally raped. A generous kick back to the Pollies will make sure that those rights and freedoms are sold cheaply in the pursuit of even more profits

  6. Barry Rueger

    More of the Same

    "Free Trade" agreements invariably wind up meaning one thing: someone no longer has be follow the rules that you have in place to regulate business.

    The minute a government signs one of these things some of the rules that protect people will be removed or gutted.

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    For some reason

    My arse is sore?

  8. Christoph

    The legislatures MUST vote against this.

    This must be voted down regardless of the actual contents.

    If this is passed then the various legislatures are voting for themselves to be reduced to rubber stamps passing whatever is put in front of them.

    This isn't in any doubt whatever - it is entirely blatant. The treaty has been drafted in total secrecy by only the parties that benefit from it, and presented as "Here it is, you may not change it in any way, just sign it".

    Whatever the text of the treaty, the drafting process is entirely illegitimate.

    The only possible response is to vote it down on the spot, and make clear that this process is not acceptable and any future attempt will similarly be dismissed out of hand.

    Don't debate it, don't try to justify it, just kill it.

    1. CrazyOldCatMan Silver badge

      Re: The legislatures MUST vote against this.

      > Don't debate it, don't try to justify it, just kill it

      The thing is - most of the legislators are owned by the very same corporations that so wanted the treaty.

      Welcome to the NeoFeudalist future.

  9. DocJames
    Unhappy

    Learnt helplessness

    Copyright extensions, biological drugs costing more (though the rumours are that it's not as bad as feared), investor-state courts (corporation sues govt if they pass legislation that hurts the company - like Australia being attacked in court for its plain packaging cigarettes at present)... *some* trade barriers seem to be coming down, which is probably a good thing but as mentioned above it's hard to know.

    Ironically the politicians have been complaining about all the opposition to the TTP, saying it's misinformed. If only there was some way to counter this misinformation, like information.

  10. heyrick Silver badge

    "All that remains is to finalise the wording and for the signatory nations to to sign it off in their respective legislatures."

    ...and for the electorate in each country to try the people who signed off on this for treason; preferably punishable by public hanging.

    1. g e

      Punishable by...

      Making them poor.

      They don't care about getting hanged.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Copyright trolling field day

    For me, the scariest thing (at least in the drafts leaked so far) is the extension of the DMCA's takedown provisions to all signatory nations and to allow any legal person (i.e. a citizen or corporate entity) of a signatory nation to file the takedown notice if they believe the copyright of something from one signatory nation has been infringed in the same or any other signatory nation.

    Surely this will lead to copyright trolling on a massive scale, as the copyright owner doesn't even have to complain themselves. They may not actually consider it a violation, or may even turn a blind eye to it, as happens frequently in Japanese doujin culture, but that won't matter. Lawyers can fight the action on your behalf whether you want them to or not.

  12. Eddy Ito

    Election pending warning

    At least here in the US there is an election coming up next year. As a result we can expect one of three outcomes. Either it will pass swiftly in the hopes that the public will forget about it come the election, it will be rejected nearly as swiftly or it will get shelved and die as it only has 90 days to live. Clearly one of the latter two is preferred with a swift rejection being ideal as we won't have to sweat for a whole quarter but there is solace in delay as it brings the election closer and raises the congresscritters political risk.

    Keep in mind that the US isn't calling this a treaty but an agreement, specifically a congressional-executive agreement which requires a simple majority of both houses of Congress. A treaty in the US requires action only by the Senate but it requires a 2/3 super-majority to ratify it and it can often sit indefinitely waiting Senate advice and consent. Treaties are somewhat less politically risky in that only 1/3 of the Senate is up for reelection every two years which currently gives the other 2/3 of the Senate 3 years for memories to fade.

  13. AbeSapian

    Of All The Things...

    Republicans have made an eight year career out of blocking everything Obama has tried to do, and this obscenity they're going to pass without so much as a glance. If I only had a flame thrower.

    1. Mark 85 Silver badge

      Re: Of All The Things...

      Go read the political news websites. The Repubs approving this is certainly NOT a sure thing. I pointed out earlier... some are saying it didn't go far enough and others are saying it went too far. The difference in opinion can probably be traced to whatever lobbyist has them in their pocket be it carmakers, banks, movie studios, music industry, dairy, etc.

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Luckily this is hated by both the extreme left and extreme right in the US

    So its chances of passage here are reduced over what they would have been a decade ago before our politics became so polarized, should other countries fail in their duty to shitcan this POS.

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