back to article HP won't ship PCs with Windows 10 preinstalled until mid-August

The big picture of how Microsoft plans to debut Windows 10 for its customers remains murky, but more details are starting to emerge, courtesy of the software giant's hardware partners. Redmond certainly isn't giving PC makers much time to test their kit with the new OS. It's due to ship on July 29, which is just over two weeks …

  1. SimonF

    Omnishambles coming...

    They are forcing this update, but most users *really* don't want it.

    1. The FunkeyGibbon

      Re: Omnishambles coming...

      Most users? Interesting. Can you link to the survey that shows this?

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Omnishambles coming...

      My PCs' register for Windows 10 alert was removed - and that update was then marked as "hidden". Lo and behold! this week's updates apparently introduced a new "Get Windows 10" alert for the System tray.

      There was nothing in the updates' obvious descriptions to say that was going to happen. Puts me right off moving to Windows 10 - they are being just too eager and underhand.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Omnishambles coming...

        @ac I agree, a bit too much of the double glazing sales tactics that make me deeply suspicious of accepting a trojan horse. Just can't help thinking of Richmond Valentine from Kingsman and his free SIM cards.

    3. Archaon
      Facepalm

      Re: Omnishambles coming...

      They're not 'forcing' anything. Whether opting in for an upgrade straight at launch is a good idea is up for debate, but the key point here is that users have to 'opt in' if they do want an upgrade, not 'opt out' if they don't. They're certainly not 'forced' to do anything.

      1. Roland6 Silver badge

        Re: Omnishambles coming...

        >They're not 'forcing' anything.

        Yet...

        The fact MS keep re-re-re-issuing KB 3035583 (GMX) without any real explanation, and have reclassified the Windows 10 nagware patches, KB 2952664 (now on it's 17th release) and 2976978 (now on it's 12th release), as 'Important', indicates MS are either determined that as many people as possible upgrade and/or are worried the W10 take-up will be worse than Vista or W8...

        It does look as if the only 'safe' way to do updates from MS will be via WSUS, as presently these KB's aren't in the WSUS list...

        1. Stephen Leslie
          Meh

          Re: Omnishambles coming...

          Yawn.

  2. jonnycando
    Linux

    I wont have to worry.

    Not a windows box anywhere in the house. And we sure aren't missing it.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I wont have to worry.

      <troll>

      Can they all run Far Cry ?

      </troll>

  3. Gray
    Trollface

    Gives new meaning ...

    to the term "Doomsday" I'd think.

  4. Mikel

    What a mess

    I bet hardware partners are really starting to feel the love now.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Get Windows 10

    Widget status: Disabled

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Sensible

    I know they're going through a reorganisation so wouldn't be ready to ship anything anyway at the beginning of August, but this is a very sensible plan.

    Windows 10 has to improve a lot from the last released build in order for it to be reliable enough for shipping in new PCs. Waiting (I reckon until mid-September) for the fallout to settle after 29th July is the best move. Assuming the upgrade horror stories haven't in the mean-time put the buyers off, that is.

    I wonder what manufacturer is going to have the courage to ship any earlier?

    1. Roland6 Silver badge

      Re: Sensible

      >I wonder what manufacturer is going to have the courage to ship any earlier?

      Well, it will be interesting to see what the MS store does on the 29th and when MS actually ships a Surface running W10 to a paying customer.

    2. Mikel

      Re: Sensible

      Oh yeah. Give everybody plenty of time to get their automatic update to W10 before back to school season hardware launch. That way new OS version compatibility won't be a sales driver and OEMs can launch their new designed-for W10 hardware competing not only with their cutthroat competitors, but their own installed base that already has it as well. Fabulous!

  7. The FunkeyGibbon

    Dell?

    Given that Microsoft spent $2 Billion on helping Dell go private again I'm surprised at the lack of a Dell 'built for Windows 10' PC launch.

    Dell themselves could do will the boost and having a platform built to make the most of the OS would have made sense for Microsoft I'd have thought.

    The free OS update approach is odd from a company who makes money from software. It always made sense for Apple for who shifting hardware was their goal but for Microsoft it seems to be a desperate attempt to restore credibility which may work if Windows 10 is good but ultimately puts them in a difficult position because doing this sets a precedent and users are going to expect future updates to be free too.

    I can only imagine this is to keep users on Windows so that they can continue to sell Office 365 subscriptions.

    1. This post has been deleted by its author

    2. Wade Burchette Silver badge

      Re: Dell?

      Just because Windows 10 does not cost money to upgrade from W7 or W8.1 does not mean it is free. Microsoft's credibility had nothing to do with the decision to make Win10 a no-cost upgrade. If it did, why is the most requested feature, Aero, still not available in Win10? Why are programs called "apps" in Win8 and beyond? Why is a Microsoft store link constantly being placed in Win8.1 and Win10 taskbar? Why does OneDrive and Cortana not work unless you surrender your privacy? Why does the search bar even search with Bing at all even when Bing universal search is properly disabled? Why is the new start menu nothing but a compact start screen from Win8 complete with "apps" (really, programs) you purchase from the Microsoft store?

      Microsoft is trying desperately to make money on you after the initial sale. Everything else is sacrificed for that goal. Everything else includes such things as Aero, F8 support, a customizable start menu, and a proper backup program. All of these most important features is not to be found in Win10. (I realize some people hate Aero. The point is: in Windows 7 you had a choice.)

  8. Mystic Megabyte
    Linux

    Fragmented

    Windows should be renamed Barriers. Too many versions that by default arrive empty of basic utilities. A "Media Player" that thinks that an iso is an unknown file format! I could go on..

    On the island where I live a computer builder has for years been offering Linux on new builds. Now about 50% of desktop computers here run Ubuntu, the Windows users are those trapped into MS Office. The majority of other devices are a mix of Chrome Books, Android tablets and iPads. So it is only the business users who will need Windows 10, everybody else will get along fine without it. I run Linux and my VM of XP has not been fired up for over a year now.

    <sorry if this is a bit rambling but the caffeine has not yet kicked in>

    1. Robert Grant Silver badge

      Re: Fragmented

      Don't forget the gamers.

      1. hplasm
        Meh

        Re: Fragmented

        "Don't forget the gamers."

        Don't worry, they'll remind us themselves.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Fragmented

      Why a perfectly sensible and interesting comment like this has got 5 down votes astonishes me.

      Maybe some of the marketing money for Windows 10 is being spent on employing down-voters?

    3. Stephen Leslie
      Linux

      Re: Fragmented

      What an island. I suppose the native women wear straw skirts and are topless too? It would be sexy but they point straight down at their tablets running Linux. My feeling is "ugh"; but I suppose for Linux users this is another success story.

  9. Dan 55 Silver badge
    Paris Hilton

    So how's this going to be reviewed then?

    New devices will get it mid-August. Windows 10 will be rolled out to existing devices when MS wants, not immediately, not even if you pre-reserve special download it with the Get Windows 10 Trojan horse.

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    They just need to get Windows 10 devices in the channel for Thanksgiving Day, no-one will be buying new kit until then

    1. Stumpy Silver badge

      * other countries and public holidays are available.

  11. Denarius Silver badge
    FAIL

    if the hell of getting Windows 8.1 going

    in a recognisably usable state was any indication, I will be relieved the crap network access will not allow me to get the next OS failure from M$ at any price. Once they made stuff that was buggy, insecure and consistent. Scratch consistent. Thank $DEITY I only use it for getting stuff off phone since despite best efforts, not found any way to get linux talking to a dumb phone.

    What is it with the fondle slab UI designer generation ? Avoided everything previous generations of UI designers had learned. BTW, hasn't HP downsized itself to oblivion and split the ruins ?

  12. Bob Wheeler
    FAIL

    WIN10 Compatibility Checker

    A little while ago, I downloaded the MS Win10 compatibility exe.

    After letting the utility run, all it came back with is “x number of applications on your PC will not work with WIN10”

    The trouble being it did not give me the list of the which applications on my machine would not work. If it had, then I could have had something I could work on getting upgrades/replacements or discard etc.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: WIN10 Compatibility Checker

      “x number of applications on your PC will not work with WIN10”: notepad.exe, calc.exe, paint.exe, clock.exe, winword.exe, excel.exe, powerpnt.exe, outlook.exe, onenote.exe, lync.exe, ...

      1. Boothy Silver badge

        Re: WIN10 Compatibility Checker

        Oddly I have a lot of crap software installed on my main Win 7 PC, and the only thing that got flagged up was a couple of ancient games, and VMware Workstation.

        The games, would likely either run in a compatibility mode, or being old so not very demanding, under a Win XP or Win 7 VM. I've played other Win XP only games under a VM on Win 7 without any real issue.

        For VMware Workstation, it just stated I needed to re-install after the upgrade. My guess would be it didn't like the virtual network that VMware creates.

        Either way...

        * Leave it a month for other people to be the first adopters.

        * Full system backup (already do this anyway).

        * Run the update, and see how it goes, restore if needed.

        1. Roland6 Silver badge

          Re: WIN10 Compatibility Checker

          >* Full system backup (already do this anyway).

          I'd make that a full disk image copy (including boot sectors and all of Windows 'special files') - Clonezilla comes to mind as a suitable tool (although getting it to create an image of a W7 system HDD that could be restored as a fully working system, did take a few attempts and some fiddling).

  13. D@v3

    chalk and cheese

    Microsoft are preparing a global advertising campaign in the works and is planning "celebrations" at retailers.

    We are preparing a statement for our users saying if you chose to update your home PC and it breaks, we are not responsible for fixing it.

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I tried the W10 pre-release and oh dear.....

    Dreadful was the polite view I took.

    Not sure how good W7 has become but most folk prefer extreme stability than a constant change of look and feel and extra features that will never be used.

    so XP became good. Good platform to keep.

    Vista - Oh dear....avoid

    W7 - nearly ok

    W8 avoid

    w9 ???

    W10 avoid (my prediction)

    Thankfully Unix derivatives have become a really good experience !

    1. Archaon

      Re: I tried the W10 pre-release and oh dear.....

      I find it somewhat ironic claiming that people don't want change while stating that "Unix derivatives have become a really good experience!". Saying 'have become' implies that they didn't used to be. Implying that it changed. Unless that change was an overnight switch one could make the assumption that the change in question has been constant. So...where were you actually heading with that?

      As far as I'm concerned there has only been 2 real 'paradigm shifts' in the Windows interface. The first was Windows 3.x to 95. The second is Windows 7 to Windows 8. Even with the UI changes from say 98/ME/2000 to XP, the most dramatic thing about it was that it defaulted to blue! Most other changes are incremental tweaks to appearance, small changes in layout or changes to programs (the layout of Explorer, for example).

      So that Windows 8 change, yes it quite major. Yes for many people it was a pain in the ass (although most can live with it or - god forbid - even end up liking it). Before they added a power button to the Start screen in 8.1, my first experience with Windows 8 included having to Google how to turn the damn thing off. At the end of the day though, the only reason Windows 10 is changing the interface is because of all the bitching and whining about Windows 8's interface.

      And for the final downvote magnet: Clearly Windows is just so important to everyone that as soon as Microsoft change the Windows interface everyone suddenly forgets the monumental outcries surrounding the likes of KDE 4 and Unity? Or are all the *NIX'ers following the example of the local cat (the one that likes to bury his deposits in my greenhouse) and pretending memories like that never happened?

  15. The Quiet One

    Not a surprise

    All that HP Bloatware takes some time to get just right....

    I mean, what's the point in having Windows 10 if i can't have a live tile that helps me order printer supplies......

  16. Jess

    I tried W10 on an a couple of old Dells

    On a ten year old Dell Power Edge it works rather well, and and the latest release didn't leave me screaming for classic shell.

    On a much more recent XPS laptop, it didn't work very well, it kept locking up.

  17. andy 103

    You don't have to use it

    I don't understand why so many people feel they have no choice about whether to use this?

    If you have a PC running Windows 8.1 now, you don't *have* to download Windows 10. In the same way that you can still run a PC using XP, 7, etc.

    Equally, if you buy a Windows PC in the future, why would you expect it *not* to have Windows 10 installed? If that's the latest, in-use, release what else do you think will be installed? Nobody is going round selling new hardware with XP on it. The same applies here.

    Basically, you don't have to use it. So if you don't like it, don't use it. Am I missing something? What's the issue? It'll be crap when it comes out and they'll patch it. That's what they've done historically, nothing new.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: You don't have to use it

      I would suggest that as "the majarity" of windows users will take the bait and "upgrade" to windows 10 then "the minority" will discover the "support" for other windows becoming uneconomically viable.

      If w10 was MS being nice then it would be free to everyone just like linux however getting every existing windows user onto an OS they do not own allows MS the right to hide whatever they want to run without your knowledge in the background and say "well it was never free how do you think we can 'give' it away and still be in business".

      Oh and "windows is the PC Gamers OS"

      Yeah thats why steam are getting off the ship before it sinks

      MS want to continue making money out of windows users, is there any limit to what they consider 'below the belt'?

      1. Mark Eaton-Park

        Re: You don't have to use it

        Microsoft are changing their business model, all referenced to the word "user" to be replaced with "livestock".

        You are no longer a customer you are now a source of revenue

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Unhappy

    Taking Windows upgrades now must be like...

    ...hearing a knock at the front door and not knowing whether it's your partner returning from work, a pushy charity mugger, or a psychotic crack-addled maniac escaped from the local 'facility' come to play.

  19. Roland6 Silver badge

    Non-Story!

    "It will be a minimum of two weeks after Windows 10 ships to Windows Insider members and as possibly as long as a couple of months before HP product running the OS becomes widely available."

    There is nothing new, only those who think they should be able to rush out and buy something the moment a product is launched will be disappointed.

    I'm surprised that it will be that soon. Given various reports about the status of the builds MS have been releasing, it does seem that MS will be working on W10 until the last minute. In fact it would not surprise me to see that the version unveiled on the 29th is for launch purposes only, because the team is still working on features and bug fixes...

    So HP, as a major OEM, the last thing they will be wanting to do is to risk releasing a duff PC, for whatever reason as they will not be wanting the publicity that results, nor the costs of fixing all the 'broken' systems and dissatisfied customers. The only way they can prevent this is to take W10, as released and test it on a system for real, which will take time.

    Also for all those "back-to-school", "off to college/university" purchases that will be made in August/September I suspect that most (sane) people will be playing safe and buying W7 or W8.1 systems running Office 2013/365 etc. - all of which will still be in support when the student graduates in a few years time.

    1. Boothy Silver badge

      Re: Non-Story!

      ^^^ This

      HP will have their own junk software to install on their boxes.

      They probably want to test on the release version of Win 10 before actually putting the image onto their PCs.

      They probably also need to make sure their help desk scripts are updated to match the released version, as well as providing some training for their staff.

    2. illiad

      Re: Non-Story!

      aaaand then, there will be all the 'busy households' that never read the reg, all they see about computers is on tv and adverts... they just goto BBC websites, etc...

      And they believe the ads, that the new windows is 'best' (yes, very short memories!!!)

      some will return their PCs and demand something 'usable' on them, some will just knuckle down and learn, just like they 'had to' with win8.... I am astonished at the amount who just will not seek help....

  20. Loud Speaker

    August? But wont Windwoes 13 "Nightmare edition" be out by then?

  21. Harpoon

    I've just been sent details of HP ProDesk with Windows 10s which will be ready to ship out (from distribution) on the 29th July. Good to see HP's PR department is on the ball.

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