back to article BOFFINS: Oxygen-free, methane-based ALIENS may EXIST on icy SATURN moon Titan

Scientists believe they have come up with a solid model for a new type of methane-based, oxygen-free life form that could thrive in the harsh, icy conditions of Saturn's mysterious freezing moon, Titan. The researchers at Cornell University reckon they have come up with "the first concrete blueprint of life not as we know it …

  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    bad units

    It should be 180.00ºC or even better would have been 93.150K, but 292 degrees below zero is just wrong when used in any technical field.

    1. Jim Lewis

      Re: bad units

      Minus 180 C of course...

      Given that these conditions are achievable in the lab how feasible is it to actually create their theorised cell? Coming soon I'd say, totally synthetic 'life'.

    2. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge

      Re: bad units

      but 292 degrees below zero is just wrong when used in any technical field

      You better chill out...

    3. wdmot

      Re: bad units

      Agreed, AC, even in technical journalism. Kelly Fiveash should at least stick with the units the study's authors used (K) and not the archaic units which the American university used in its news release.

    4. John 98

      But they are yanks!

      What did you expect?

      1. Martin Budden Silver badge

        Re: But they are yanks!

        I don't know who down-voted John 98 but come on: Americans do this sort of thing with units really really really often, so it is to be expected. John 98's comment was spot on.

  2. Snerdguy

    It's just a theory. Which means "maybe". We just don't know what is possible in those conditions because we can't accurately simulate the expanse of time and we barely know just some of the chemicals that exist on Titan. We will eventually send probes there that will give us a more detailed understanding. But, then we run into the real threat of contaminating the areas we explore. Nobody really knows what to expect. So, lets just say "maybe" and be very careful about how we explore these places. We have already left a considerable mess on the moon in our haste to get there. Do we really want to trash up every place we go?

    1. Bleu

      How much of a mess has been left on the Moon as of now?

      Serious question. Descent stages for six Apollos, the buggies for the later ones, Lunokhod, Ranger impact, etc. Any more?

      If people are ever to visit the place as tourists, they will be among the prime sites. The vacuum will also ensure that any visitors behave a little better than, say, immigrants do in National Parks on Earth.

      I agree with your sentiment, though, it does look as if all too many people can't resist treating any place as a garbage dump.

      1. the spectacularly refined chap Silver badge

        How much of a mess has been left on the Moon as of now?

        Serious question. Descent stages for six Apollos, the buggies for the later ones, Lunokhod, Ranger impact, etc. Any more?

        There's actually a surprising amount of stuff up there, much as I hate quoting Wikipedia they do have this list which lists some of them, although for many there are in fact several objects for each listing - random pieces of wreckage for the crash landings and assorted litter and equipment from the Apollo missions.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Don't forget Alan Shepard's golf ball!!

        2. Captain DaFt

          "How much of a mess has been left on the Moon as of now?"

          Quite a lot, actually.

          There's a better list list here:

          http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/12/the-trash-weve-left-on-the-moon/266465/

          That includes such niceties as 96 bags of urine, feces, and vomit, empty food containers, and wet wipes, among other trash. The article even has a nice map showing Apollo 11's garbage dump.

          We're a very messy species.

          1. Bleu

            Thx. Captain

            ... and the earlier OP. Here was I imagining it was only the left-over vehicles and crash debris.

            You get a double bonus in my book for citing a source that is not Wikipedia.

        3. Bleu

          Thx to you, too

          I knew of a few of the flags and plaques, the golf ball (shame it didn't go into orbit). What really rather shocks me is the biological waste and plain dumped stuff.

          Whoever is next to return there should be able to turn a profit on 'Apollo flier's faeces'and so on.

          1. NumptyScrub

            Re: Thx to you, too

            If we scooped it all up, it would probably all fit inside 1km2, out of a total 38 million km2 surface area. Also, lifting off with a toilet full of poop requires more reaction mass, I can't say I am surprised that they flushed before setting off ^^;

            We apparently have a giant floating mass of plastics larger than Texas in the Pacific, in that context a few broken landers, lunar rovers and some bags of effluent seem pretty tame.

      2. Rich 11 Silver badge

        The vacuum will also ensure that any visitors behave a little better than, say, immigrants do in National Parks on Earth.

        Immigrants? Your carefully considered use of stereotype will no doubt make you popular with your local branch of UKIP.

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    So...what?

    Wasn't this a plotline from space 1999?......let me guess....are they now going to ask for funding to send a probe to Titan, thus keeping their pension pots topped up?

    1. Little Mouse

      Mork & Mindy too

      Mork being "all membrane" was a key plot element in one of the later, less funny episodes.

      1. Michael Wojcik Silver badge

        Re: Mork & Mindy too

        Mork being "all membrane" was a key plot element in one of the later, less funny episodes.

        It was two of the later, less funny episodes. The storyline was a two-parter.

        God, the rubbish that persists in my memory. I can still picture Robin Williams wailing "Oh, Mandy1 Mandy Mandy!". I am certain I haven't seen that since it originally aired. In 1979, according to IMDB (which also shows that it was the season opener for the second season, so "later" apparently means "after the first season" in this case).

        1"Mandy" was the name of the subatomic-alternate-world Mindy clone. Obviously.

    2. Voland's right hand Silver badge

      Re: So...what?

      No. The plotline is Puppet Masters. If in doubt, read Heinlein, you will find what you are looking for in there.

      In the last paragraph a spaceship is being launched to Titan.

      In any case - the membrane is an important part of the story, but not the most important. The most important is a source of energy and something which can participate in a redox reaction to produce enough of it. There is nothing in a methane atmosphere to do that. You are more likely to find life "not as we know it" in a place with let's say hydrogen chloride (the has, not the aqueous solution) than in a pure methane environment.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: So...what?

        No, the most important is data processing (DNA/reactions to the environment etc). With just a membrane and energy processing, you still just have a chemical process or a "dead" crystal. Be it a very complicated one though, it would not fit much of the definition of "alive".

        Without something similar to DNA and without a massive number of processing, construction and regulating equipment in the cell, it would be unable to do anything.

      2. Bleu

        What does

        'the has' mean?

    3. Turtle

      Re: So...what?

      "Wasn't this a plotline from space 1999?......let me guess....are they now going to ask for funding to send a probe to Titan, thus keeping their pension pots topped up?"

      You are one cynical son of a bitch. Not, however, as cynical as I am....

      1. John 98

        Re: So...what?

        only a probe? - they may pose all sorts of threats. Obviously there should be lavish funding to hack their networks and monitor potential terrorists seeking to operate from Antartica.

  4. Bleu

    I hear there are sirens on Titan.

    Srsly, there is always the chance of life not as we know it, kudos to these people for demonstrating a workable cell membrane for cryogenic worlds.

    I suspect that there is nothing more there than an interesting geology (based on water ice) and weather, but it would be lovely and very poetic if the place also hosts cryogenic life.

    Personally, I would never be surprised if Jupiter, Saturn, or Sol itself were homes to life not as we know it.

    I would be equally surprised if we ever have the means for detection.

    Maybe after re-emergence from the approaching new dark age.

    Re-emergence will take a lot of time, and most resources will be in rubbish dumps, nothing much near nor on the surface.

  5. Pascal Monett Silver badge

    "a colourless, poisonous, liquid organic compound"

    So, acid for blood then ?

    If we set foot on that moon, we're screwed.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "a colourless, poisonous, liquid organic compound"

      The worst part is that instead of face-huggers, Titan's residents might hug some other orifice! Ouch!!

  6. Graham Marsden
    Unhappy

    "It's life, Jim...

    "...but not as we know it."

    Such a shame we've just lost Leonard Nimoy :-(

  7. Sarah Balfour
    Devil

    Cheers, Graham, have an ear worm.

    http://youtu.be/7ZS2-4-iUJ4

    1. Lord Lien

      Re: Cheers, Graham, have an ear worm.

      "We come in peace. Shot to kill!"

  8. Dharma

    Aliens?

    Seems to me they'd live there, and we'd be the aliens.

  9. DoubtingThomas

    Perhaps the title to this article should have been: "Buffoons: Oxygen-free...." Please tell me that hard-earned taxpayer dollars are not being expended to fund such cognitive idiocy.

    1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge

      No, hard-earned taxpayer dollars are being expended to fund the homeland security which just issued "OMG! Thermite on Planes! It's UNDETECTABLE" surpriso-research.

      Problem?

    2. Anonymous Blowhard

      @DoubtingThomas

      Sounds like someone's brain may have been "oxygen-free" for a few minutes...

      Why would anyone criticize chemists for research into chemicals? It's only abstract knowledge until someone smarter figures out what to do with it!

    3. Michael Wojcik Silver badge

      So what crawled up your methane-hole and died, DT?

  10. Wombling_Free

    If this follows the plot from 'Titan' by Stephen Baxter

    we all have only about 11 years to live.

    One of the highlights to look forward to are carving statues of oneself out of ones own sh1t using ones teeth.

    Oh, we've grounded the shuttles already? Just the statues then, not the sweet oblivion of a Chinese asteroid to the Atlantic.

  11. John Sawyer

    May I exist too please, sir?

  12. Stoneshop
    Pint

    Oxygen-free

    Should be a nice environment for making the Audiophoolest Interconnects, handManipulative-Appendage-Crafted by Skilled Titanic Craftsbeings, and Pre-Cryogenically Treated for your Personal Listening Pleasure.

    If that doesn't sell, I don't know what would.

  13. hi_robb

    May I be the first

    To welcome our new Oxygen-free, methane-based overlords.

    D

  14. Ashton Black
    Joke

    @hi_robb

    Have an upvote. I despair at the standards of El Reg. In my day the "I for one..." obligatory comment would be at least in the top three comments.

    1. Michael Wojcik Silver badge

      Re: @hi_robb

      In my day the "I for one..." obligatory comment would be at least in the top three comments.

      The editors could save us all some time by adding them when the story is posted. It wouldn't be hard to automate.

      1. hi_robb

        Re: @hi_robb

        Thanks kindly Sir. And I know exactly what you mean about the comment. In ye days of old there would have a race to be the first person to say it.

        El-Reg is full of young whippersnappers now!

        D

  15. Faux Science Slayer

    Saturn's moon Titan...never had a dinosaur....or a fern.

    Hydrocarbons exist throughout the Universe....on Earth as fission byproducts...

    "Fracturing the Fossil Fuel Fable" at the FauxScienceSlayer site....

    1. NumptyScrub

      Re: Saturn's moon Titan...never had a dinosaur....or a fern.

      Hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe, and carbon is a natural by-product of the stellar fusion process. Methane is found in interstellar clouds (apparently) so having a planetary body with a high proportion of it is easy to explain just by aggregation from the protoplanetary disc...

  16. Unicornpiss
    Joke

    So, based on their chemistry..

    ..If there are evolved life forms on Titan, they should find eating our sweaters and blankets delicious, with the chemicals that make up epoxy for a hollandaise..

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