back to article Windows 8 market share stalls, XP at record low

Windows XP's demise is finally starting to accelerate, but Windows 7 and not 8 appears to be picking up the slack. Those are the conclusions we draw from Netmarketshare's latest monthly dump on desktop computer operating system market share. Here's the company's counts of what's what on the desktop, going back to October 2013 …

  1. MrNed

    Why won't they sort it out?

    Win8's been out - what - 18 months... a bit more? Surely MS must know why people are rejecting it (hell, even my dog knows), and I just don't get why they refuse to respond and put a proper shell around the Win8 kernel. I get why they may have hung in there - all part of a larger strategy etc. But hello? Smell the coffee. The strategy is bollocks and clearly isn't working (my dog knows that too).

    Surely it would only take them a couple of weeks tops to rip the TIFKAM (or whatever they're calling it this month) crap out of Win8 and put a proper desktop interface on there - in fact I'd be stunned if there weren't internal versions of such already in existence. I just don't get why, after such a woeful take-up and such dreadful figures, they would not say "enough is enough" and sort it out.

    I'm not just MS-bashing, I'm genuinely flummoxed by their lack of action when it's patently obvious what the problem is. They're welcome to consult my dog if they still don't get it.

    1. Grifter

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      For two reasons,

      1) because they are microsoft and they decide for you, it's what they do

      2) because eventually you'll end up using it anyway, it's what you do

      (perhaps not you in an individual sense, but certainly in a general sense)

      1. Michael Habel

        Re: Why won't they sort it out?

        2) because eventually you'll end up using it anyway, it's what you do

        (perhaps not you in an individual sense, but certainly in a general sense)

        The times they are a changing... And, while that credo might have had more merit not even Seven Years ago. The World has, and is moving away from the PC. Much like the Internet... MicroSoft has pretty much missed the IoT Boat again as well. While it will be the Corporates that'll clammier for the remnants of Windows 7 Licenses. The rest of the World will have moved on to Phablets and, low-power compute devices probably running some form of Android / Linux.

        This is where I see myself in due curse. I'd personally give MicroSoft one last chance to deliver a proper Windows 9 OS that does what Windows 8 doesn't.... WORK!

        But the fact remains that MicroSoft pretty much killed their own Golden Goose by nixing the stand-alone Office Suite. So assuming I wanted to actually use O365 (I don't!), why would I specifically want to access it from a Windows 9 Terminal? Adobe can perhaps get "away with it", cause quite frankly PhotoShop (amongst their other Software), is of that level where you're just not gonna find something remotely similar. Libre/Open Office however would disagree on that point however.

        I think if we look more to this so-called "Death of the PC", and examine it with more rational. Isn't more like the "Death of MicroSoft"? That's dragging the "PC" down with it? I have now clue as to what MicroSoft's ambitions maybe. But, taken the as a whole the reluctance of those to just GTFO(ff), of XP. Can be, and should be seen as a failure on their part. And its probably already to late for them to even bother trying to recover it now. Which may go a way to explain their "Mobile first, Cloud first" strategy.

        'Cause if you remove the "PC", in its historical sense. This is all that they have left....

        1. David 132 Silver badge

          Re: Why won't they sort it out?

          @Michael Habel:

          Good points. But why The random Capitalization? "MicroSoft", really? It makes It all really Difficult To read, you Know.

          Tip: Amanfrommars is NOT a good role-model.


          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Why won't they sort it out?

            But why The random Capitalization? "MicroSoft"

            Maybe it's to emphasize the Soft part? As in: Microsoft has been a bit soft between the ears. Sure we could use obvious jibes like Microstupid or Microshaft or use '$' in the place of 's' but then we're not 8 are we? It's more subtle than tHat.

          2. Pookietoo

            Re: But why The random Capitalization?

            Because German speakers (writers) do that?

      2. DaveNullstein

        Re: Why won't they sort it out?

        3.) Because you are going to use their cloud if they have to shove it down your throat.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      Given that there are "apps" that fix the issue, then clearly it would take nothing for Microsoft to fix this other than issue an update and then just call it Windows 9.

      1. king of foo

        Re: Why won't they sort it out?

        Because they've got plenty of time...

        Big volume businesses are already committed to upgrading to win7.

        I remember exactly 1 business user with a vista laptop; they were a "consultant" and bought it from PC world themselves. It only had 1gb of ram but was very shiny.

        Business users with win8 will be like that consultant; buying hardware themselves from retail stores where there is no choice other than "pc or mac". They aren't "real" business users, just consumers that happen to use their laptop for business.

        The next ms own goal will be office. "Wee don't want no steenkeeng subscreeption". Our users currently have office 2007 and some are managing to sneak through upgrades to 2010 but hell will freeze over before we allow 2013.

        1. LDS Silver badge

          Re: Why won't they sort it out?

          Maybe you failed to notice you can still buy non-subscription licenses of Office 2013 ( thta's of course not for volume licensing)

    3. corcoran

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      What kind of dog is it?

      1. VinceH

        Re: Why won't they sort it out?

        "What kind of dog is it?"

        Probably this one, because (if you watch enough episodes1 you'll conclude...) he can read, drive and all sorts.

        1. I've reached s4e18 so far. And over 30 years after first watching and loving it as a kid, I'm thoroughly enjoying it again!

        1. auburnman

          Re: Why won't they sort it out?

          They have zero incentive to sort it out while the main alternative to Windows 8 is Windows 7. They are making their money, just not with the latest windows release which is a problem to fix down the line with Windows 9.

      2. tony2heads


        A Precise Puppy maybe?

      3. TitterYeNot

        Re: Why won't they sort it out?

        "What kind of dog is it?"

        Sounds like a relative of Dogbert. And he's probably highly peeved that his human is referring to him as 'my dog'.

        (Apologies in advance for the assumption of male gender for aforesaid canine - this is due to 1.) laziness and 2.) the fact that the OP used the word 'dog' and not 'bitch', even though the use of 'bitch' might have made the post's meaning slightly ambiguous in an unfortunate hippity hoppity kind of way.)

        Speaking of which, it's heart-warming to know that Mr. Jay-Z has plenty of canine friends despite his numerous woes in life...

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      Pretty sure 9 will see a return to something more sensible. But they can't really "fix" 8 as they've stopped development on it. You don't suddenly completely change a product once it has been released.

      1. Michael Habel

        Re: Why won't they sort it out?

        Pretty sure 9 will see a return to something more sensible. But they can't really "fix" 8 as they've stopped development on it. You don't suddenly completely change a product once it has been released.

        Not unless you release a "Service Pack" for it. Which then means, an additional Five Years of support. Going by past Service Packs. Its likely why Windows 7 will never see an official SP2 update, or even just a Roll-up for that matter.

      2. Alan Edwards

        Re: Why won't they sort it out?

        Microsoft could buy out the developers of Classic Shell from the office doughnut budget and give it to everyone.

        They could probably buy the utilities arm of Stardock (who make Start8) for not much more and give everyone ModernMix, WindowsBlinds and Fences too.

        1. Missing Semicolon Silver badge

          Re: Why won't they sort it out?

          They're much more likely to buy StarDock and Classic Shell and simply close them down.

    5. Necronomnomnomicon

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      They are! Well, they think they are. There's been two major redesigns in that last 18 months. It's just for better or worse, neither of those make things look much more like Windows 7 and so it's still a huge departure from historic Windows.

    6. LDS Silver badge

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      It would mean to admit they made a huge mistake. And because they can't just blame Sinofsky, of course many others still in charge approved what was done, or didn't block it if they could, such an admission would create a lot of internal and external troubles - and among the people in charge.

      Thereby they prefer to bite the bullet, and wait for the next version to take a different direction without being forced so say "we were wrong it was a huge mistake", even if it costs money now - because executive prefer to lose company money than their well paid - anyway - jobs.

      That's how big companies works, unless they can isolate a single culprit and put all the blame on him or her, they will float on mistakes far longer than they should.

      1. MrNed

        Re: Why won't they sort it out?

        It would mean to admit they made a huge mistake. [...] such an admission would create a lot of internal and external troubles - and among the people in charge.

        But isn't it patently obvious to all that they have made a mistake? So there's nothing to admit to. If they treat it as a de-facto situation and produce a fix, then with a few well-spun mea-culpas they'd be back on track.

        But by perpetuating their mistake do MS make themselves look a) competent or b) incompetent?

        Would you consider investing money in an incompetent company?

        Would you aspire to be a customer of an incompetent company or would you look for alternatives?

        The status quo damages MS far more than acting decisively to resolve the situation. Like I said, I'm genuinely flummoxed by their refusal to sort it out.

        1. Eddy Ito

          Re: Why won't they sort it out?

          If the rumors of a 3 year major release cycle are true then with 8 having been released in 2012 that would put 9 on track for next year. Given the effort it will take, who knows maybe they will listen to the folks in the focus groups, for the next rev perhaps it's easier to just let the old 8.x wounds scab over than apply yet another bandage in the hope someone will find it attractive.

    7. Reg T.

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      Well, it is because the upgrade path is 8.1 from 8.0 and then on to 9.0.

      No upgrade discount will be offered to owners of 7.0.

      It is simply "doing bidness" - as usual, fleecing those ignorant enough to play their game.

      Support of 7.0 ends shortly.

    8. Al Black

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      That's a smart Dog you've got there!

    9. N2

      Re: Why won't they sort it out?

      Because were Microsoft & your dog is wrong.


  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

    "Microsoft likes to point out that hundreds of millions of devices now run Windows 8, but it is clear that plenty of new PC buyers have gone for Windows 7."

    Actually, and I've said this before:

    "It is clear that [almost all] new [business] PC buyers have gone for Windows 7,"

    And that's where the money is..

    Microsoft's bad move? Creating a new system, Windows 8, that makes new PC's look all consumer product friendly-shiny with bright colors, touchwiz screens and home screen Facebook updates. NEWS FLASH - business buyers (and IT admins) DON'T WANT ANY OF THAT ON THEIR DESKTOPS.

    Let's get this straight, Microsoft: You alienated your biggest market, CORPORATE BUYERS, by making an OS that looks, and acts, unprofessional, unproductive and like a home infotainment appliance.

    And then you wonder why your market share is decreasing. Why are MBA's MORONS?

    Why is Windows 7's market sharing increasing? Because businesses are buying new Win7 boxes rather than Win8. It is a no brainer. Win8 might be selling on home and personal PC's but, when a single corporate purchase can number in the thousands, it doesn't matter what a single user is doing at home - volume buyers are the key and Microsoft has lost them. My office bought new computers this year and what did we buy...yep, Win7 machines, thank you very much. Just added on another graphics workstation last month - yep, Win 7.

    Etc. etc. etc.

    The problem? Microsoft, like many big businesses, are too lost within their corporate arrogance to admit a mistake, too stuck within their own belief of their greatness to examine results with an objective eye, call for a retreat, regroup, correct the problem and try again. Like many businessmen, they immerse themselves in their own infallibility and will go down with the ship rather than say "I think we should turn here to avoid that iceberg". Didn't we just go through this with our big 2008 recession-blowup? Do people ever learn?


    1. P. Lee

      Re: Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

      > You alienated your biggest market, CORPORATE BUYERS, by making an OS that looks, and acts, unprofessional, unproductive and like a home infotainment appliance.

      While I utterly agree with you, there are a couple of things to be said in MS' defence:

      1) Business had just completed/still undergoing the XP->W7 upgrade. They would not be going W8.x no matter what.

      2) If MS does not reverse the trend for home users/small business users continuing trend away from Windows to tablet/cloud and OSX which mean cross-platform apps, they will end up letting Linux into the desktop arena which will then eat away at MS' core corporate market.

      Yes, its a bad strategy which hasn't worked, but I understand why they tried it.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        @P.Lee - Re: Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

        Everything you say sounds reasonable except for the Linux bit. UEFI Secure boot will make sure Linux will never get on consumer PCs. Ever! This is why they came up with the scheme in the first place, they feared that a failed experiment with a new OS might push consumers and desperate OEMs to - God forbid! - Linux.

        Although I am a Linux enthusiast myself, I estimate Microsoft's fear of Linux was largely unjustified because large masses of consumers were never interested in it. I'm not going to start a debate here about technical merits of one OS versus the other, the point is the only thing that Linux had to offer that could differentiate it from Windows/MacOS (no, it is not the cost) just failed to make a difference.

        1. Trevor_Pott Gold badge

          Re: @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

          "Everything you say sounds reasonable except for the Linux bit. UEFI Secure boot will make sure Linux will never get on consumer PCs. Ever!"


          1. RyokuMas

            Re: @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious


            ... which, as any IT pro worth his salt knows, is practically owned by Google - let's face it, how many other variants are out there with more that 5% of the total Android market share*.

            So we have a large corporation that has made its' money on something else before moving into the arena of a graphical operating system.

            Said operating system is built on the back of something they have obtained externally, rather than built themselves.

            Said corporation has extended the functionality of their variant of this operating system, and are now starting to use their large market share to force their will onto end users of said operating system.

            As said operating system grows in popularity among the non-technical masses, it becomes increasingly targeted by malware and the like.

            And said corporation want to track your every move and action - allegedly for the "greater good" in some manner, but more likely because they want to keep everything under their control.

            ... sound familiar?

            In a not-too-distant nightmare future where everyone uses Chromebooks and GoogleDroid (name changed after Google finally extinguished the AOSP) phones/tablets, what chance do you think Google will give us to replace BigBrotherOS with something else?

            All the diehard Linux supporters who are cheering on Google to overthrow Microsoft - read "Animal Farm", specifically the bit where the pigs send the horse ("Boxer" IIRR) to the knackers... for the sake of the OS you champion, find something other than Google to support!

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            @Trevor_Pott - Re: @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

            Your reply strengthens my argument although I am also a little bit to blame for not expressly mentioning GNU/Linux instead of just Linux.

            If GNU/Linux has an installed base of let's say (for the sake of argument) 2% of all PC (a general purpose computing device), an Android/Linux running on the same standard PC has about the same percentage of the GNU/Linux installed base on PCs. And let's not start talking about Linux on tablets and phones where the situation is even worse.

            Mr. Pott, you are a respected professional so you must know by now that the Linux kernel alone by itself is of no use and that the difference between a GNU/Linux distro of your choice and Android/Linux is big enough to allow the passage of a large sized truck.

            The only point that Linux had in its advantage was the guarantee of end-user digital freedoms. Linux will get you as closest possible to a PC that you can trust and at the same time a PC that can trust you. This point was/is thoroughly and consistently shunned by consumers and industry alike. I had my share of downvotes by now so I will leave you the exercise of trying to figure out why.

            1. Trevor_Pott Gold badge

              Re: @Trevor_Pott - @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

              Did I say "Android was currently a major desktop player?" No. I said - and I quote - "Android." No qualifiers of any kind. I let the rest of you lot fill in the blanks with your preconceptions and biases.

              I did mean something very specific with that one word comment - and it relates directly to the comment it was replying to - but so far noone has gotten it. Given the absolutely fascinating responses that have developed thus far, I'm inclined not to reveal my original meaning and simply let the lot of you fire arrows into the dark.

              I'm really curious to see if anyone gets what I meant.

              1. Anonymous Coward

                Re: @Trevor_Pott - @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

                Computing hardware + software = Personal Computer (PC). We have rafts of them here ranging from an Intel Galileo, two smartphones, seven tablets, three laptops, three desktops of which one is a extreme workstation, and a server that I'm busy building (dual-Xeon, super-sized, flashy everything). And given what I have just laying around in storage, I'm sure I can add at least three more desktops. At least. And all current.

                The favorite PC's here are the tablets, which can do everything that people do here on their desktops and laptops with the exception of the workstation. That's reserved for my simulations / predictive-analytics from hell.

                I forgot one. The PS-3. Sue me, I'm not a gamer. The point is, a smart phone or tablet, even the dirt cheap models on a slow-boat from China completely blow away most of the computing devices I spent most of my life designing, building, and operating including some mind-blowing weapon systems in use today. [Long lead times in defense contracts.]

                Sadly, it's the fact that no matter who's stack you are talking about, their efficiency just plain sucks. So people complain about the fact that no tablet/smart-phone can replace your desktop. Stat for stat, excepting software, they are light-years beyond.

                Sorry Trevor, that's an issue for me. The other is software quality.../soapbox

                1. Trevor_Pott Gold badge

                  Re: @Trevor_Pott - @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

                  "Sorry Trevor, that's an issue for me. The other is software quality.../soapbox"

                  I'm not actually sure what you intended to say. Either you were talking about "all modern computers are really inefficient and this is bad" or something I have no idea how to decipher. If the former, I lack an understanding of that connects to the topic at hand.

                  Maybe I'm too sleepy?

                  1. Anonymous Coward
                    Anonymous Coward

                    Re: @Trevor_Pott - @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

                    Android PC (phone. tablet, whatever) == PC. Rest is verbiage. Sleepy here too, 0024 PST.

                    1. Trevor_Pott Gold badge

                      Re: @Trevor_Pott - @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

                      Aha. Then you are the closest to having grokked my meaning so far! :)

        2. Flocke Kroes Silver badge

          Bye bye UEFI

          I am currently using a 1GHz armhf. It is fine for writing letters, answering email and web browsing. It is silent, tiny and under £100 - with keyboard, mouse and monitor from a dead AMD64 PC. There is a choice of these things, and none of them suffer from UEFI. (They all use forks of Das U-Boot showing various levels of hurriedness, ignorance, inexperience, lack of documentation and repair by skilled hobbyists.)

          A newly released ARM small cheap desktop comes with Android or Ubuntu. Installing the distribution of your choice requires the ability to solder on serial port so you can talk to U-Boot. Machines that are a year or two old will have instructions on the web that can be followed by anyone able to read man pages.

          UEFI is not a barrier for desktops. Just do your research before purchase just like you had to for graphics cards and Wifi last decade.

        3. Richard Jones 1

          Re: @P.Lee - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

          I think that there are two points that some might miss. Bulk buyers of business machine buy PCs or whatever, but private home users get sold their devices.

          So all most sales people need to say to a user is:

          "This is the new xxxxxx."

          Then they can take the user's money.

          Businesses know what should work with their systems and buy accordingly.

          So I Linux really wants to make an inroad one of two things has to happen, perhaps both. Business needs to decide that what is has now and coming is not good enough and needs to be replaced by a Linux box with 'this specification', or the big sales companies need to do more or less the same.

          At the moment business can upgrade their win 8 boxes to 7 while users have abundant other choices Android et al.

          If Windows (H)8 is really doing so well why is it not showing up in usage statistics, is it the down - oops sorry upgrade rights to Windows 7, or are too many people finding it a poor user experience that a Hudl and friends does better? My dog and his friends have accepted that Windows 8 is well an emaciated cat, they sit round wondering and pondering how humans get it so wrong.

          Their consumer focus groups feed back suggests that many home computers are now Android or perhaps IOS mobile devices, which see one home computers replaced by a factor of 2 ~ 4 mobile items.

          The only other discussion the dogs have is why my home still has numerous PCs all running Win 7 or other and no 'mobile toys' for them to get their teeth into.

        4. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: UEFI Secure boot will make sure Linux will never get on consumer PCs

          Total nonsense. There are Linux distros that support SecureBoot, and you can disable SecureBoot on all PCs.

        5. MJI Silver badge

          Re: @AC - Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious UEFI

          Well two dual boot PCs at hone, both have UEFI, both boot into Mint about 4 or 5 seconds after selecting the OS, Windows 7 takes more like 10 including the login.

      2. TheOtherHobbes

        Re: Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

        >1) Business had just completed/still undergoing the XP->W7 upgrade. They would not be going W8.x no matter what.

        The upgrade cycle takes a while, and business totally would be thinking seriously about W8 if it was any good. So it's the future MS has to worry about now.

        Right now there's no guarantee, and not much prospect, of Win 9 being any better. It's more likely to be a Different Kind of Annoying Crap [tm].

        >they will end up letting Linux into the desktop arena

        The slack has been taken up by OS X at the high end and iOS/Android at the low end. There's been some Linux switching, but Linux is still mostly a geek toy. (I know Reg readers all have grandmothers who are using it happily. But the stats show most of the population doesn't want it.)

        Linux is making more inroads into corporate, where the bits that don't work aren't so critical.

        MS is happy because cloud. But cloud is a lossy, competitive business, Windows is sick as a Norwegian Blue parrot, there's serious corporate interest in switching to open alternatives to Office... and there goes the MS biz model.

        Nadella badly needs less business bingo, and more Exciting New Thing.

        Breath? Not holding it here.

        1. Wade Burchette

          Re: Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

          TheOtherHobbes: "MS is happy because cloud."

          The reasons why I hate Windows 8 is not so much the lack of a start button, but it is the other annoying stuff. The cloud integration is one of the reasons. I've seen many distinct computers who log in with a Microsoft ID and suddenly they are unable to log in. Sometimes it is a laptop and for some reason the Wi-Fi did not reconnect and will not reconnect until a successful log in; but you cannot log in because the offline password is corrupted and you must find a way to connect a network wire to log in. I've seen 3 different laptops do that. I've also seen this problem on 1 wired desktop with Windows 8.1. And then the OS is tied tightly with inferior Bing and Microsoft advertising, and all that stuff is turned on by default unless you are wise enough to avoid using a Microsoft ID to log in, which Microsoft makes you go through two confusing steps to do the smart thing. I hate the cloud except for backups. I view it as something were companies want to be a part of it only because it is a buzzword. I know it has uses, but it is not as useful as people want to pretend.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

            I don't think the cloud is so much a buzzword as an ethereal concept. I don't know what subsequent generations version of it would be - a location of some video game, I expect - but in me it stirs up a vague hope of maybe one day meeting Destiny Angel there. I can't remember if she was the hottest one or just the one with the hottest name, but maybe we'll have a few good months, then go our separate ways and I'll hook up with the one that was really meant to be. But - ironically - Capt. Scarlet is dead now; whereas the possibility of me ever using 'the cloud' was stillborn.

    2. Paul Shirley

      Re: Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

      @1st AC: while completely true it's somewhat misses the real cockup. Microsoft must understand the business upgrade cycle enough to understand the relatively sluggish adoption of win8 by business so far. Wasn't going to happen for a couple of years whatever 8 was. Has allowed them to kill xp.

      Their mission was to make win8 popular with consumers ready for next years business upgrades, to establish how a cross device OS could be useful to business as their employees started bringing them to work and most important to bludgeon their way into the consumer led mobile device market. The utter failure to deliver that consumer adoption or any of the device integration the bigger plan relies on really is massively more important than the supposedly bigger failure in business. It foreshadows future failure in the corporate markets when the upgrade cycle should be happening soon.

    3. Hans 1

      Re: Obvious answer to obvious stupidity is obvious

      > volume buyers are the key and Microsoft has lost them. My office bought new computers this year and what did we buy...yep, Win7 machines, thank you very much. Just added on another graphics workstation last month - yep, Win 7.

      ROFL!!!!!!!!!! Now remind me, who makes Win7? What have they lost ? Nothing ..

      .... and, how long is support gonna last on that crap ? Security updates ? Patches ?

      Now, I think you should stick to your natural talents ... windows, surfaces, sponges, brushes, and brooms !

  3. Captain DaFt


    I would say the market has spoken regarding Windows 8, but actually, it's just blown a big wet raspberry.

    1. channel extended

      Re: Well...

      I would have called it stomach gas instead.

  4. John Tserkezis

    It's quite clear now.

    Windows 7 rules the roost. XP still doing quite respectably considering it's 13 years old and past its use-by date. And best of all, MacOS has a better share than windows 8.x. I used to make fun of them only having 5% of the market. Microsoft has certainly shown Apply how to bollocks things up.

    Now all I have to do is convince a friend that the 8.1 notebook they bought would be better off on 7. It would make my life easier, the updates would work instead of lock up, it would give me a good excuse to bypass all that bloatware, and they'd get a machine that's at least familiar with what they had (XP).

  5. Bob Vistakin

    Still, they can always look to mobile can't they?

    Oh, wait...

  6. Phoenix50

    Register Daily To Do List

    1. Write an anti-MS article stating that Windows 8 has "failed".

    2. Go home.

    1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

      Congratulations ! You've earned your fanboi cheque today.

      Go buy a Twinkie and let the adults discuss about facts.

      1. RyokuMas
        Paris Hilton

        Which one?

        Bob or Phoenix?

    2. roselan

      Re: Register Daily To Do List

      3. ...

      4. profit

    3. Moeluk

      Re: Register Daily To Do List

      and remind me again, just how Win 8 has "succeeded".

      1. N2

        Re: Register Daily To Do List

        "and remind me again, just how Win 8 has "succeeded"."

        Succeeded in pissing people off on an epic scale

        & they actually want you to pay money for this shite?

  7. Medixstiff

    What about after Win9?

    I mean the way M$ stuffs up every second OS, will they even call it Windows 10? Could you imagine the marketing failure when people come up with slogan's like "10/10 problems are from Microsoft", which with how many smart asses there are these days, is bound to occur.

  8. ÐÇÐ

    Please, pretty please, add my XP PC to your botnet.

    So my reading of that is that almost a quarter of all windoze PC present rich pickings for hackers and botnet masters...

  9. Stephen Horne

    It would probably be fairer to show the combined score for Win8 and Win8.1 - keeping them separate seems a bit like keeping original Win7 separate from Win7 SP1. That would show a slightly better picture, though only slightly.

  10. Nathan 13


    Microsoft are being shrewd and getting as many W7 sales as possible, before releasing a great W9 that will be bought again by these same people!!

    No, OK it was only a thought :)

    1. theOtherJT Silver badge

      Re: Maybe

      You might not be totally wrong. As was said upstream, the volume market (businesses) only just moved from XP to 7, so they probably wouldn't have bought 8 anyway. We certainly never intended to. I sometimes get the feeling that perhaps they are just experimenting with 8 to see what the market will bear since they knew it wasn't going to be a big seller anyway.

  11. David Austin

    Win 8.x

    Until last week, I would have written a comment that it was disingenuous to represent Windows 8.0 and 8.1 as separate OS in the stats, unless you're splitting Windows 7 RTM/SP1 and the other service packs as well.

    However, Microsoft seem to have purposefully made it hard to upgrade from 8.0 to 8.1. I've seen quite a few systems where people were checking Windows Updates to see if they were up to date, but the 8.1 update only appears in the App Store for some unfathomable reason. At some point (If not already), Microsoft will stop offering security patches for 8.0, so Windows update will say they're A-OK, when they're really not

    The final straw came last week when I had a Win8 PC where Aero worked fine, but Metro wouldn't open any modern apps, including the store. some Google-fu found lots of people with similar symptoms, but an abundance of different causes and fixes, none of which seemed to work with this PC. In the end, I rebuilt it from an 8.1 iso, but this seems a semi regular problem.

    I'm hoping at some point, Microsoft will offer 8.1 through Windows Update or - gasp - as a downloadable .exe (Had to App Store upgrade to 8.1 over a 1.2meg broadband connection the other day, which was approaching 9th circle levels of torment) as part of their pull back from their Windows 8 insanity.

    Until that day, It's totally justified to split them 8.0 and 8.1 in the stats.

    1. Charlie Clark Silver badge

      Re: Win 8.x

      I don't agree. For this kind of high-level comparison the version families can be compared and would demonstrate growth in market-share for Windows 8 due to 8.1.

      Windows 8 seems to be replicating Windows Vista with businesses preferring to skip it and the majority of consumers put off by the UI despite undoubted technical improvements.

      These desktop website visitor stats should be accompanied by the desktop vs. mobile trend, which I suspect will show desktop continuing to shrink.

    2. Wade Burchette

      Re: Win 8.x

      It has been my opinion that 8.1 was offered only through the app store so people would know the app store existed and thus use it more and thus Microsoft would get their cut of anything sold through it. In short, my opinion is 8.1 is offered only through the app store to try to help Microsoft make more money.

  12. MJI Silver badge

    Just built 2 PCs

    Dual boot, very powerful, emails accesable from both OSes. SSD boot.

    Firstly I was nice and installed a Microsoft OS, top version of 7. Then I installed Mint 17 Cinnamon. Put STEAM on both boots.

    Why were there more included tools on the free OS?

    1. RTNavy

      Re: Just built 2 PCs

      The reason there are more tools on the "free" OS is because they haven't been run through the Anti Trust wringer by including all those tools "for free" in the Operating System.

      1. Terry Cloth

        They weren't sent through the ringer for _including_ stuff

        They got slapped down because you couldn't remove the ``freebies'', much less replace them. With Brand L you get multiple apps for each tool's purpose, and can pick and choose.

        1. MJI Silver badge

          Re: They weren't sent through the ringer for _including_ stuff

          I chucked Firefox and Thunderbird on, set their profiles to use the FAT32 partition, got their accounts working.

          Then booted into Linux, got the auto mount working for the FAT32 partition and pointed the new proifles at the same place.

          They were impressed when they viewed their emails in Linux when just downloaded in Win 7.

          The boys were not supposed to get PCs yet, but will built a few months early to be sure of getting a Win 7 disc as they hate 8 as well.

          1 SSD, 1 HDD, 5 user partitions (SSD NTFS EXT4, HDD NTFS, FAT32, EXT4), I had to create the FAT32 partitions on our XP box.

          1. MJI Silver badge

            Re: They weren't sent through the ringer for _including_ stuff

            Oh and if the XP PC ever gets killed off Mint 17 will be going straight on, I would only miss the video editing software. As the source engine runs fine on Mint.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Just built 2 PCs


  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    The Win 8 Car Crash

    Everyone I know who bought a Windows 8 desktop/laptop - all two of them (everyone else went for Win 7) - immediately installed the free Classic Shell utility, and customised their computer so it acted more like the familiar Windows of yore.

    My experience with Windows 8 has been very negative. There are no redeeming features that I can think of. And this has had a knock on effect - when looking for a new phone, although I hear good things about Windows Phone, the fact that it has the words Microsoft, Windows, and Eight (Point One) in its name is an immediate turn off. If the experience on the desktop is so poor, why on earth should it be any better on a phone? I'm not willing to take a risk.

    Android, on the other hand, on tablet and phone, has been very good, and has stirred an interest in Linux. If it's so friendly on a small screen, then why shouldn't it be any less friendly on desktop?

    I'm now much more likely to choose Linux over Windows, thanks to Windows 8.

    1. Belardi

      Re: The Win 8 Car Crash

      Before Windows 8 first came out, I thought the idea behind the user interface being common between the phone, tablet and desktop was an excellent idea. In order to get phone & tablet sales, people would love win 8 PC desktop experience and will buy those mobile devices instead of Android.

      then I used the preview version of Windows 8 and after 15 minutes, realized that it was pure shit. But I kept it for a few months to see if it will grow on me. I also showed it to other people and most of them hate it more than I did. Using Windows 8 made me do something I have not done and over 10 years, and that was to try Linux. on the same computer, I'm murdered windows 8 and installed Linux Mint. And guess what, it booted just as fast as Windows 8. Finding the settings and downloading applications eer... programs was easy and fast. And I have not read any help files or have to look anything up on the Internet to set it up. My wife uses it as her work computer and as a novice she has no problems using it. like many people today or primary access to the Internet is with her phone, an Android phone.

      (my response was typed and spoken into my Android phone). for most people, I see no reason why they need to buy a Microsoft product ever again.

      1. Belardi

        Re: The Win 8 Car Crash

        I would like to add, at the time when I first tried windows 8 preview. I have been using Windows 7 Phone interface on my samsung galaxy 1 S phone which is Android 2.x. Because the Windows Phone interface for simple slick and work very well. So I had high expectations for Windows 8 and was planning on buying a Windows 8 Phone replace Android. I still think metro is a good PHONE UI... And have installed Launcher 8 on novice users phones. (Launcher 8 is more advanced than wp8 in some ways - with its individual custom color icons that users can choose and rotating icons when you put your phone to landscape. This is something that it has done since launcher 7 and Microsoft never took the hint, how stupid of them)

        after using Windows 8, I change my mind to never buy anything "8" from Microsoft ever again. And as of today we can see the results of their mistakes that they have been warned about long before 8 ever shipped.

  14. Paul Shirley

    A common UI between such dissimilar devices never made much sense. Either they aren't in fact the same or you just propagated the lowest common denominator to every device. Similar interfaces properly adapted to the strengths of each platform, great idea. It's not what ms did, instead they dumbed down the input options to the lowest capability of touch on a small screen, giving an impoverished toolkit of ui elements everywhere and a design language meant for small screens that just fills our desktops with bland wasted space instead of information.

    It was blindingly obvious what was wrong with the whole concept before launch and even the astroturfing has finally been abandoned. It seems that when the paid posts are gone win8 doesn't have any friends.

  15. ElNumbre

    Asta La Vista

    Are people actually installing Vista, or is this just percentage points changing from the lower use of XP?

    1. Jess

      Re: Are people actually installing Vista

      I did, on an old machine with a Vista license that I was given.

      I suspect quite a few people will have done the same, (not that I switch it on very often, but when I need windows for something, it is better having a system that is still being given security updates)

      1. Version 1.0 Silver badge

        Re: Are people actually installing Vista

        Yes, Vista's quite decent if you give the machine enough whore's power and memory.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Asta La Vista

      Yes - as "Version 1.0" says above, Vista was always OK on a top-of-the-line machine ("easily satisfied with the best"), but was awful on affordable hardware.

      With the passage of time said top-of-the-line machines have become available 2nd hand at very keen prices because they are contaminated by the Vista license.

      My main development machine is a Thinkpad W500 with SSD, running Vista - and it does OK. Doesn't feel quite as fast as my home machine, which is an older Thinkpad T61 (also SSD) which went through the upgrade cycle XP -> 8.0 -> Linukx Mint.

      The lovely 1680x1024 and 1920x1200 IPS displays and super keyboards on these old machines are fair compensation for the strange looks I get for being a Vista user...

      1. MJI Silver badge

        Re: Asta La Vista

        I last rebuilt our home PC just as 7 was launching, so I reused its existing XP licence after finding Vista quite horid.

        Still runs fine, and as I said before if XP gets screwed Mint goes on.

  16. RTNavy

    1% of a Billion is still pretty big

    While percent market shares may be dropping, there aren't too many companies that would be complaining about selling software to 1% of a 1 Billion systems market per month.

  17. teebie

    Netmarketshare's graph is far more colourblindness friendly than StatCounter's

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What I don't get.

    Microsoft is failing is in pretty much most of it's sectors, Xbox, Windows, Office, Windows Phone, Surface

    All lame ducks. Someone want to wake up Microsoft shareholders?

  19. Terry Cloth

    Erm, don't those graphs say two different things?

    Or am I just misunderstanding?

    The Netmarketshare graph indeed shows XP down and 7 + 8.1 up. The Statcounter graph, on the other hand, shows 7 essentially flat with 8.1 taking up the slack, the opposite of the premise of the article.


  20. Version 1.0 Silver badge

    If you actually USE the systems then the answer is obvious

    WIn8 is a pretty nice OS for a first shot at a touch-screen interface, They'll probably get it right on the second release (Win 9) and screw it up by the time they get to Win10. However the issue is that you need a touchscreen interface to make Win8 useful - but we're all old farts and still secretly love WIn-XP - probably because it was so much better than WFWG.

    Win7 is a nice system too but it's getting old and as they add more and more security fixes then it will start running slower and slower and the cruft accumulates - after all, that's what happened to XP, as the bugs got fixed it got slower and slower because you patch for safety - not speed.

    The real issue for Win8 is that business use has to be reconfigured to use touch screens and that means that work spaces need to change. Businesses are even slower at doing that than they are at upgrading computers.

    My guess is that most of the voters here for keeping the XP-Vista-Win7 interface have never really used the touchscreen interface. Sure, it's different, but then so was using a mouse originally.

    1. Belardi

      Re: If you actually USE the systems then the answer is obvious

      The win 8 OS is fine. The UI is shit in operation and visually. I and many others do NOT love XP. It is the first modern OS that ms made for the masses. Yet in many ways it was still substandard to 1990 version of Amiga DOS 2.0.

      Business are not thrilled to spend money on stupid touch screens and training..

      your statement about people not having experience with touch screens it's quite chilly. Everyone and their grandmother has a touch screen phone. like Samsung TVs that use hand gestures to control a a crappy user interface is simply a crappy user interface. Windows 8 is just ugly on top of crap to boot.

  21. itzman

    If I were Microsoft...

    I'd develop a shim to run windows apps on Linux. Wine done proper.

    And sell it.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: If I were Microsoft...

      Done and done. Azure RemoteApp, currently in preview. Who cares what the device uses?

    2. N2

      Re: If I were Microsoft...

      Do well if you could config it to look like 2000, XP, Vista or 7 chez classic shell

  22. chris lively

    The whole Touch Screen paradigm is not for normal desktop use.

    The top applications for a regular computer is email, word processing and web browsing. Two of those require lots of keyboard input. Although the last one doesn't, holding my arms in the air all day just isn't worth it. Never mind that most of us have dual monitors and probably have a dozen applications running... So, what's the solution? Simple: have an interface that works well with keyboard and mouse control... Win7 did this.

    I worked on touch screen apps in the mid 90s, there is a purpose, but it's not general computer use. If you have one application, whose operation is limited to a small set of actions then touch screens are perfect. Beyond that: waste of money.

    Finally, whoever thought that a single OS INTERFACE across mobile, desktop and server usage was a good idea should be flogged. That wasn't what developers wanted. We wanted a single OS under the covers so that we didn't have to know 3 different APIs to build programs. They missed the entire point. Again.

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