Can't you put something more useful on the Chrome hardware like Windows?
Microsoft hires Pawn Stars to shaft Google
Microsoft has turned its guns on the Google Chromebook as the "Scroogled" campaign enters its nastiest phase yet. Redmond has hired the stars of a reality television show called Pawn Stars to help with its anti-Google Scroogled campaign. In an imitation of an episode of the show, a reality programme about the colourful …
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Thursday 28th November 2013 09:28 GMT John Tserkezis
"Can't you put something more useful on the Chrome hardware like Windows?"
Sometimes. They're not just plain ordinary Intel PC boxes.
With at least one, you need a hacked version of the firmware (along with the risks of bricking that go with that), then you can load ordinary windows onto the laptop.
With others, it's impossible. So no, it's not a seamless, easy and cheap way to get a wintel laptop.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 09:02 GMT Anonymous Coward
!Subtle under tones
Hi thanks for having me on.
This advert REMINDS me of those strange sort of AMERICAN adverts that emphasise WORDS they REALLY want the watchers to take AWAY. The SORT of advert that REPEATS the MESSAGE so that the OBVIOUSLY stupid watchers NEED to be told MANY times.
In the ADVERT they will EMPHASIZE words so that people WATCHING the video get the MESSAGE.
The MESSAGES in these VIDEO is often EMPHASISED to make sure the viewers get the MESSAGE.
Ideally they should end with a single line SUMMING up the MESSAGE because the viewers will only remember the LAST MESSAGE because they are obviously stupid.
I refuse to believe the average American is THAT stupid.
Thanks it's been a pleasure.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 09:21 GMT Fihart
Re: !Subtle under tones
"Tell 'em what you're going to tell them. Tell them. Then tell 'em what you've just told 'em".
And the other old marketing cliche. "Nobody ever lost money underestimating the intelligence of the American public".
However, for all the stupidity of the advertising, Microsoft does have a point. Chromebook is a bit useless without a decent broadband connection.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 09:31 GMT John Tserkezis
Re: !Subtle under tones
"However, for all the stupidity of the advertising, Microsoft does have a point. Chromebook is a bit useless without a decent broadband connection."
Agreed. Their marketing champaign is sleazy at the least, but they're still right, chromebooks are pretty useless, especially so if you lose your internet connection.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 14:56 GMT John_G
Re: !Subtle under tones
I think people get by now that a Chromebook is limited without an internet connection. So what? If I want to check my email, watch an online video, check my (google) calendar or buy something online then a top of the range PC is pretty bloody useless without an internet connection.
If a chromebook offered enough of a price advantage, performance advantage or battery/size advantage then I'd be tempted to get one over a standard laptop if I was looking for one or the other.
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Friday 29th November 2013 10:29 GMT Nuke
@John Tserkezis - Re: !Subtle under tones
Wrote :- "they're still right, chromebooks are pretty useless, especially so if you lose your internet connection"
I might be wrong, havn't used Windows for years, but I have the impression that you can't get very far with Windows without an internet connection these days, especially with their newer software rental business model.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 09:56 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: !Subtle under tones
"However, for all the stupidity of the advertising, Microsoft does have a point. Chromebook is a bit useless without a decent broadband connection."
You've fallen for the ads as well?
Firstly when is the last time you used a laptop without an internet connection? It is probably a very rare occurrence.
However Chromebooks have local storage (usb, sdcard) for movies, music etc. All documents from Google Drive can be simply opened locally for offline use (they re-sync automatically when you get a connection). Emails can be read and responded to offline (they are uploaded when re-connected). Many apps can be used offline., etc.
Finally, isn't Microsoft trying to get everyone to use their cloud services, anyway?
In fact most of what you would want or expect to do can be done offline with a chromebook.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 10:26 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: !Subtle under tones
"Firstly when is the last time you used a laptop without an internet connection? It is probably a very rare occurrence."
On my last hours-long flight, last week? It's a very rare occurrence if you don't travel only. And even when not flying, if you're in a foreign country with no free wifi access and crazy data roaming prices, you may want to keep your wireless data usage to a minimum.
Chromebooks are useful only for nerds who never leave their basement.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 13:41 GMT cambsukguy
Re: !Subtle under tones
Why would I write an email on a laptop for uploading later when I almost certainly can knock it off on a 'phone and send it now? It would have to be a pretty complicated email.
I would almost certainly tether the Chromebook to the phone and then work.
This is fine if you pay for the extra data required for commonly doing that. I presume editing on-line, mapping etc. can get pretty data intensive.
Still, a laptop without connection metering would be worse for sure and as bad at best.
The overall problem is that I could not do with just a Chromebook so I would own a laptop anyway.
Useful for people with powerful desktops instead I guess or people with the spare money.
Because they are not that cheap I would buy a netbook or a surface anyway.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 15:32 GMT RyokuMas
Re: !Subtle under tones
"Firstly when is the last time you used a laptop without an internet connection? It is probably a very rare occurrence."
Every morning and evening, actually - on the train to and from work. I have a laptop because I need a development machine. If I wanted to just browser the web, I'd get a tablet.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 10:02 GMT Crisp
Re: !Subtle under tones
REMINDS AMERICAN WORDS REALLY AWAY SORT REPEATS MESSAGE OBVIOUSLY NEED MANY. ADVERT EMPHASIZE WATCHING MESSAGE. MESSAGES VIDEO EMPHASISED MESSAGE. SUMMING MESSAGE LAST MESSAGE THAT.
Damn. It doesn't look like there's a secret message in there at all. Maybe there's some other kind of cypher I'm missing.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 14:25 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: !Subtle under tones - FIXTED
Hi thanks for having me on.
This advert reminds me of those strange sort of AMERICAN ADVERTS that EMPHASISE words they really want the watchers to take away. The sort of advert that repeats the message so that the obviously stupid watchers need to be told many times.
In the advert they will emphasize WORDS so that people watching the video get the message.
The messages in these video is often emphasised TO MAKE SURE THE VIEWERS GET THE MESSAGE.
Ideally they should end with a single line summing up the message BECAUSE the viewers will only remember the last message because they are obviously stupid.
I refuse to believe THE AVERAGE AMERICAN IS THAT STUPID.
Thanks it's been a pleasure.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 13:35 GMT cambsukguy
Re: !Subtle under tones
You haven't been to the USA much I am guessing, one can hardly make any ironic or especially sarcastic comments that aren't followed by jk, jk or something to explain quickly. Obviously I am talking about the North and West in general, I wouldn't risk it at all below the Mason-Dixon line.
All the American shows, network ones at least, always assume the viewer is that dumb, constant flashbacks to three minutes ago where a particular event crucial to the on-going plot occurred.
Constant channel changing is the culprit I expect
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Thursday 28th November 2013 15:09 GMT Don Jefe
Re: !Subtle under tones
Sarcasm is an art that was never practiced in this country. Approximately 49% of US inhabitants couldn't correctly identify sarcasm if their lives depended on it. About 49% of the remainder have a severe humor deficiency all the way around, due to the fact that they're in over their heads regarding life in general.
Most problems can't be shot or eaten so they feel helpless, thus humorless. The remainder are the weird people who had too much school and foreigners who can't speak English. The foreigners are assumed to only be discussing drug smuggling, impregnating white women or their massive campaign to take all the jobs, so it doesn't matter what they say.
Irony is something the women do when they're bored. Alternatively, irony is kids with wealthy parents advancing a corporate beer marketing campaign by eschewing corporate marketing campaigns.
There are advantages though. When party guests have overstayed their welcome you can start a run of Flying Circus and within 20mins everybody is gone. You can also deliver devastating insults and have no fear of repercussions as they'll believe you've just paid them a huge compliment.
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Sunday 1st December 2013 14:53 GMT Nasty Nick
Re: !Subtle under tones
Deprressing, but I don't think the septics have a monopoly on having a generally ignorant population anymore (assuming that was ever true) . Going on my experience of what seems to be the most popular telly and Brit news Interweb, us Brits are running you yanks a very close second if not leading by a head.
A quick rummage through recent news stories on the most popular sites (Daily Mail, Metro), especially those concerning more "technical" news , will show us up, both in the language used in reporting and that used in the public responses.
I don't think this a class/wealth related issue either, except that if you come from a wealthy back ground there is less excuse for being a dumbass than if you come from a "less wealthy" background.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 10:24 GMT Peter Gathercole
Re: The overwhelming message I get from these ads
Microsoft also had an advertising campaign in Japan based around the recent Ghost in the Shell: Arise anime.
It showed various members of Section 9 doing what they do holding and passing around a Surface, which contained some important data or something.
The problem with this, as anybody who is familiar with GITS knows, is that the people shown (I remember at least Motoko and Batau in the ads) are cyberised, i.e. they are cyborgs with cyber-brains (implanted computers) together with some kick-ass comms. They had absolutely no need for a Microsoft surface to do the things that they were supposed to be using it for!
Just showed that either MS or their advertising agency really did not know what they were doing. I suspect that the animators probably felt a bit dirty to have done the ads, but only until the money hit the bank!
I think that the ads are still knocking around on YouTube if you want to see them yourself.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 18:49 GMT John Bailey
Re: The overwhelming message I get from these ads
"Just showed that either MS or their advertising agency really did not know what they were doing. I suspect that the animators probably felt a bit dirty to have done the ads, but only until the money hit the bank!"
Didn't Microsoft almost get vista advertised on Family guy?
PR department thinking fail is not exactly a rare occurrence.
In fairness though.. Is it any worse than Cybermen talking to each other.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 09:40 GMT Tom 260
It's been a bit odd in the UK watching the hotmail (sorry, outlook) adverts that big it up as being private vs gmail's web interface which has targeted ads... except I use the pop3 servers on both, so miss the ads. The hotmail one has crap spam filters too, doesn't block the spammers using hotmail or academic domains among others.
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Saturday 30th November 2013 10:25 GMT Roo
Re: POP3?
"And some people may have missed the news. but you can use IMAP on hotmail now. It was introduced a couple of months ago."
I can't recommend Hotmail on the basis of POP3 or IMAP access over the long term. I found that Microsoft had a habit of breaking it for weeks and months at a time (no prior notice, explanations, apologies etc) - usually whenever they revamped their service (ie: at least once every 2 years). On the first occasion they dropped POP3 support they didn't bother telling anyone - when queried they said I'd have to pay for it on the basis that it wasn't an official feature. I paid, they dropped POP3 for a long time a few months later. Their customer support was non-existent and by that I really do mean literally no customer service at all.
Maybe they have improved (they couldn't get any worse) now, but I don't think it's worth the trouble finding out.
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Monday 2nd December 2013 07:56 GMT apjanes
Ads
"adverts that big it up as being private vs gmail's web interface which has targeted ads"
Personally I pride myself in having a modicum of intelligence and free will preventing me from getting unwillingly swayed by adverts no matter how targeted. If, by some slim chance, an advert DOES present me with something I'm interested in buying, I'm more likely to THANK Google than curse them!
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Thursday 28th November 2013 09:56 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: RT?
"This Surface RT isn't a real laptop," one says. "It doesn't have Windows it has RT which uses a titled interface, it has a half assed Office that runs like a dog. Without Wi-Fi those pretty tiles don't do much at all unless you suffer from epilepsy and when you are online, Microsoft sends you to bing and outlook. That's how you get Microshafted"
Joking aside though I think this is a pretty pathetic campaign. Chromebooks are aimed at people like my dear old ma who doesn't want to have to contend with AV scans / malware scans and installing Windows updates she just wants to be able to browse the web and use email and keep in touch with the grandkids.
Yeah it's a brick without a broadband connection, but in the last two years I can safely say I've lost less time to broadband not working than I have to Windows updates and all that other rubbish. Windows is just too complex for the average punter that the chromebook is aimed at and while a dumbed down RT went some of the way to resolve this issue it appears that it is about to be taken out the back and shot.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 10:30 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: RT?
"This Surface RT isn't a real laptop," one says. "It doesn't have Windows it has RT which uses a titled interface, it has a half assed Office that runs like a dog. Without Wi-Fi those pretty tiles don't do much at all unless you suffer from epilepsy and when you are online, Microsoft sends you to bing and outlook. That's how you get Microshafted"
& you work in IT? Damn, your bosses must have been extremely desperate to employ you if this is the sort of drivel you come out with!
Surface RT is NOT a laptop, but a TABLET first of all which you can attach a keyboard to, just like you can with several Android tablets & iPad's. If it doesn't have Windows what does it run as it was Windows when you look at the properties & system information. That's like saying that Windows XP or NT were not real Windows.... Half assed Office? Haven't found anything in the Office 2013 that is supplied with RT that is missing from what the vast majority of people use on the desktop versions. With or without WiFi, those "pretty tiles" don't do much anyway as most users will revert to Desktop mode where the tiles are irrelevant! Microsoft doesn't send you anywhere you don't want to go to as you do have a choice going through the desktop IE (yes that's the only drawback, you don't have much of a choice of browsers).
I haven't found any need to run malware, AV or any other scans with RT nor pestered with windows updates (other than 8.1 update & the automatic Defender definitions update).
May be it is worth opening your eyes to things other than Google, and not slate things until you have actually used them, FYI I use most of the Google products on my desktop machines, as well as using a Surface RT most of the time when I am on-site rather than lugging a much heavier laptop with a lot lower battery life, yet can still do everything I need to do.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 12:39 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: RT?
Surface RT is NOT a laptop, but a TABLET first of all which you can attach a keyboard to
I know which is why I quite clearly said - "This Surface RT isn't a real laptop,"
Do a google image search on surface RT. Sorry do a bing image search on Surface RT... With the Google one 95% of the results returned show it with a keyboard. It is a tablet masquerading as a laptop
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Thursday 28th November 2013 18:57 GMT Richard Plinston
Re: RT?
> Surface RT is NOT a laptop,
Absolutely, it is completely unusable on your lap. The floppy keyboard connection, the single poor screen angle (2! on Surface 2), the bad weight distribution (compared to a laptop), the distance from keyboard edge to rear stand forcing the keyboard too close. Swipe the screen wrong and it will go to the floor.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 10:51 GMT Ian Ringrose
Re: RT?
I think for your mother’s use case, a basic tablet would be better than a pretend laptop.
The Surface RT can be great if you need of-line access to Exchange email while on the train etc, as well as being able to work with MS-Office documents. However I tent to put in into the same camp as tablets and not think of it as a laptop.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 10:01 GMT frank ly
The response (in my dreams)
Just before Christmas, an advert appears on prime-time TV, peak viewing hours:
An office desk, with a laptop on it, running Windows, Larry Page and Tim Cook walk on-scene from opposite sides and both look at the laptop. They look at each other and say, "Windows!". They both turn to the camera and say, "It's a pile of shit." (The end).
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Thursday 28th November 2013 10:05 GMT mIRCat
Two birds; one stone!
Marketing like this sums up why I don't use Microsoft products or regularly view 'reality' television in my personal life.
Microsoft, behaving like we should forget you settled with the DOJ over your monopolistic business practices, and ended up with a slap on the wrist, just because it was over a decade ago comes off as hypocritical, self-serving, and disingenuous. Also hiring reality 'tv stars' to sling mud on your competitors and push your products reeks of pandering to the lowest common denominator. You could always look into hiring a new advertising company.
That being said, I don't expect a tiger to change it's stripes.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 10:15 GMT Aaron Browne
Microsoft - Selling The Past
This is Microsoft trying to sell the past. Pretty much everything I do nowadays requires the Internet. Feedly, productivity and Citrix connectivity to work. Unless they can offline the whole Internet onto a Windows 8 laptop then effectively it is the same as a Chromebook for me. Note: I own a Samsung Chromebook.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 11:25 GMT Anonymous Coward
Microsoft's burning platform?
The one thing that always kept wallet firmly in pocket, with Surface (the none pro version), has been my doubts about Microsoft's commitment to the platform. Looks like I was right.
Say what you want about Google turning your anonymised data into ads (not to mention giving your none anonymised data to the NSA), but at least Chrome OS seems to have a future.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 13:56 GMT Anonymous Coward
Hard-up Students..
...have bought a chromebook and saved $ in doing so but now have to pawn them.
Just wondering what their level of debt would have been if they had bought a laptop AND MS Office.
Sure they might have got a bit more for the laptop but aren't Microsoft's licenses non transferable?
Legally, wouldn't an new owner have to cough for a new office license?
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Thursday 28th November 2013 15:17 GMT Anonymous Coward
"When you're not connected, it's pretty much a brick."
Microsoft is pushing Office365 and pushing for people to store their files in the cloud. If they do that, when you're not connected then you pretty much have a brick anyway. If you're not connected you can't get the myriad of patches from Microsoft either.
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Thursday 28th November 2013 17:22 GMT Roo
Microsoft, the 90s called, they want their FUD back.
They are unable to compete technically.
They are unable to compete financially.
They are unable to sue the opposition to oblivion.
They are unable to make the threat of removing their ad dollars stick.
They are unable to buy Google...
So they resort to their original Plan A, FUD.
It would be nice if they gave competing technically a shot for a change, you know, something positive that has benefits for their end users instead of trying to eliminate the competition via propaganda. Not entirely convinced that people seeking short-term loans is a promising growth area for Microsoft though...
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Thursday 28th November 2013 21:25 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: Microsoft, the 90s called, they want their FUD back.
Strange that Microsoft are making so much money then....Record results last quarter.
Yep, they're going supernova. Right now their profits appear to shine really brightly, and they've expanded to a very large size.
Soon as the core collapses though, you'll get one of two things: a white dwarf, or a black hole.
IBM became a white dwarf.
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Friday 29th November 2013 05:13 GMT Mike Flugennock
What's the goddamn' deal with Microsoft's marketing zombies?
Are they really entirely incapable of learning from mistakes at all?
First the singing, dancing, clapping chorus lines at Microsoft shops at the shopping malls, then the Microsoft Morris Dancers, now this. What is the goddamn' deal with Microsoft's marketing types? I mean, it's not like anybody's putting a gun to their heads to get them to sign off on stuff like this. They come up with some crass, oily excuse for a marketing campaign, are laughed out of the place, and then they're back again later with something even more crass and oily?
Do they really have the memories of houseflies? Do they really think coming back with the same crassness and oiliness will produce different results? Are they consciously, proudly, gleefully stupid? What's the goddamn' deal?
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Friday 29th November 2013 10:20 GMT Fihart
Re: What's the goddamn' deal with Microsoft's marketing zombies?
A lot of hard work to make a non-point about a competitor.
My guess is there's a lot of people who had never heard of a Chromebook who now have now. They may or may not remember Microsoft's negative message.
One thing is certain, Microsoft are spending money like water on a campaign which gives Google the oxygen of publicity and does little or nothing for Microsoft products.
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Saturday 30th November 2013 11:19 GMT Jes.e
Chromebook vs Surface RT- A review
Let's review what the Chromebook was designed for shall we?
Check out the hysterical "How to remain calm, despite what's about to happen to your Chrome notebook" on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lm-Vnx58UYo
This is actually that so called innovation in action.
As an alternate thought experiment, let's take your rather nice looking Surface RT tablet (which is a bit more expensive than a Chromebook methinks) and put a real OS on it.
Wait, you can't?!?
Mandatory locked and signed bios firmware?
Perhaps the MS fanboies are not aware that Chromebooks come with a "developer switch" which when toggled allows one to do anything with the hardware one wishes?
Yes, install Windows XP on it if you are fanatical enough- it's YOUR hardware!
Heck. I can do similar things with my Nexus handset over here. Let's see you do that with a Win Phone..
Go MIcrosoft Go!
Just go.
The Chromebook isn't just for grandmother's.. it's for children, grandchildren and tech people who no longer want to do free IT support for their friends, neighbors and family members and to see these folk suffer the abuse of such inelegant, inhospitable, easily broken (from Windows Update alone), bloated and ever slowing devices.
And as for the notion that Chromebook is a content consuming device only; that was blown away in a 2012 Google developers session where the presenter edited a locally stored application on the device with nothing more than an offline text editor and the developer tools built into every Chrome browser the planet.
Simply blew me away..
No compiler needed.
Google, unlike Microsoft actually invents stuff and allows choice.
P.S. Icing on the cake- I just remembered that every Chromebook comes with a keyboard shortcut to open a shell session. Try running "top" in said command line to see the gory technical bits running the show.
There. I feel better now..
Peace!
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Monday 2nd December 2013 23:13 GMT Anonymous Coward
Geography a bit off?
She's looking for money to get to Reno, but is told it isn't worth that much (pretty much every Chromebook is a cheap device to begin with). At the end it is suggested she might get enough to make it to Reno. From Las Vegas to Hollywood is about 250 miles by road. From Las Vegas to Reno is about 450 miles by road.
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Saturday 7th December 2013 09:10 GMT Tank boy
Yeah...
I live in the United States, I've been to that pawn shop, and there's more than one commercial to bear Rick's ugly mug. They are in the business to make money, plain and simple, further, they know a little about a lot. Pretty sure they aren't the most tech saavy guys. Chromebooks are great for what they do at their price point. I read a lot of the comments about people who install Linux (whatever flavor) to make them just a bit more functional. Which tells me several things; People that are good at fiddling around with their gear (or kit if you prefer) can make these things useful, or that for grandma to sit around and surf the internet makes this machine viable. If I had the extra bread laying around, I might buy one second-hand to fiddle with it (have to ask the wife about that first), but I couldn't justify using it as what we call a "daily driver".
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Wednesday 11th December 2013 16:09 GMT agricola
If I had wanted a brick, I'd have bought a brick.
There is no defense (sic) for the existence of, or foisting on the general public, a 'computer' which is not a stand-alone device. Since when is a personal computer a device which absolutely NEEDS an external communications connection a personal computer?
Microsoft may be the epitome of sleaze, but not in this case: Google is.
Microsoft is merely pointing out what the press refuses to do; making the non-technical gullible aware of the fact that, in the Chromebook, they do NOT have a device which can be used in planes, trains, cars, or any place without internet--the objections of the cognicenti and artificial intelligentia notwithstanding. And yes, I realize (sic) that Microsoft is doing this, all the while practicing their own brand of larceny on the technical AND non-technical gullible.
This is the first time in my long career in CS that i have ever said, or thought, this: "Right on, Microsoft!".
As for the post(s) accusing us Yanks of having no sense of humor (sic), we created the Chromebook, didn't we?