back to article Yahoo! staff! slapped! for! 'snubbing! own! webmail! and! preferring! Outlook!'

Yahoo! staff are catching heat from bosses for largely eschewing the company's own email service in favor of competing software, according to a leaked memo. The AllThingsD blog has published what it says is an internal communication from Yahoo! criticizing employees for failing to switch from Microsoft Outlook to Yahoo! …

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  1. FordPrefect

    Is this the same yahoo email system where people are regularly complaining about having their accounts hacked?

    1. The Man Who Fell To Earth Silver badge

      Yes. As bad as Outlook is (and it is really bad), Yahoo mail is one of the few mail systems that is worse. I've yet to see any webmail service that was as good as using a mail client like Thunderbird.

  2. Charles Manning

    Perhaps Marissa has an evil Elop-like mission

    All the best talent must have left long ago, before Marissa even started there.....

    But that was not enough. Marissa cut telecommuting and offers less maternity leave than Google et al. That must have taken the best of what was left.

    Now forcing people to use Y!Mail. Who is going to be left? Those that can't get a job elsewhere.

    Perhaps Marissa is on a mission to push Y! over a cliff and keep it dead.

    1. Denarius
      Trollface

      Re: Perhaps Marissa has an evil Elop-like mission

      could she get a job at SCO then ?

    2. Voland's right hand Silver badge

      Re: Perhaps Marissa has an evil Elop-like mission

      "Eat your own dogfood". Companies (and teams inside companies) that do not, do not go far.

      I for once agree with Marissa on this one. One of the reasons on why Yahoo is in its current appauling state is exactly that - nobody was eating their own dogfood. If she is to fix it (ever) she has to start from this so for the time being there is no reason to consider her to be an Elop.

      1. Pali Gap

        Re: Perhaps Marissa has an evil Elop-like mission

        Yes, I agree with the dogfood concept. I have given up on Yahoo mail mainly because when I open it (after reboot) it locks my PC up for a solid minute or two. Unless I'm the only one with this issue, Yahoo staff would soon twig to the problem if they tried to use their own product. Me I'm no Marissa fan. I've abandoned both Yahoo groups & mail now because of the "improvements".

  3. dan1980

    Looking at it the other way . . .

    "At this point in your life, Outlook may be familiar, which we can often confuse with productive or well designed."

    On the flip side:

    "At this point in our development cycle, Y!Mail is new and shiny, which we often confuse with productive or well designed (and, importantly, an improvement over existing solutions)."

    The thing is that whenever a product is redesigned or replaced, the teams developing it and marketing it take the unjustifiably arrogant and offensively condescending position that anyone who doesn't love their new software is unreasonably adverse to change or living in the past.

    In this instance, Yahoo! continue to hold this view despite the fact that not only have their public users rejected their new mail, so have their internal staff. So very telling that they resort to taking shots at the software being favoured over their own solution, as well as MS itself and imply that it's staying power has everything to do with users being stubborn or lazy and nothing to do with fit and functionality.

    That said, I do applaud Mr. Roumillat's memo - very well written and largely geared towards convincing users why they should adopt Y!Mail rather than why they should abandon Outlook (previous comments aside). Still, I would have loved to see him write: "If you are resisting change, please let us know why - If there are any tasks you feel are easier in Outlook than Y!mail, or important functionality missing, we'd like to know".

    Finally, while I don't know how they got their numbers, if it was a user survey or a usage chart then it's possible that many of that 75% did give it a shot and decided to go back.

    1. Phil O'Sophical Silver badge

      Re: Looking at it the other way . . .

      Yes, it does sound like those 75% are already "giving feedback to your colleagues on the Mail team"

      1. dan1980

        Re: Looking at it the other way . . .

        Quite so.

  4. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge

    I wonder what senior management use?

    I've never liked Outlook, and the only component of Office that I ever really got on with was Excel.

    However I haven't seen any webmail that even gets close to the usefulness of an email client with offline storage. Add in one that also does calendar, reminders and addresses (even if the address book rreeeeaaaallly sucks), and Outlook wins hands down.

    I can speak from recent experience here, as my work PC just died, and while setting up the replacement I had to endure several days of using webmail. Admittedly Outlook Web Access 2003 does make the Gmail UI designers look like geniuses - so at least it achieves one amazing thing...

    1. dan1980

      Re: I wonder what senior management use?

      Yep.

      I use webmail when I work from home but don't need to VPN in (I don't have Outlook on my home PC) and it's fine for checking and replying to e-mails but as a day-to-day solution it just doesn't fit my usage.

      Maybe that makes me out-dated and clinging to a superseded paradigm but it works for me.

      I have setup and customised Outlook (2007) to look and work the way I want it too and that is a big attraction; users can personalise the layout to best suit their needs and preferences. Want to view which senders requested a receipt? Easy - just add in the column. Don't need to see categories? Take them out. Only want to see e-mails from today? Collapse the groups. Use obscure functions frequently? Add a new tool bar with the items you use most.

      And, of course, almost anything I can't do directly functionality-wise, I can knock up a quick-and-dirty VBA script or invoke the Outlook object model in a scheduled VBScript task.

      I am far from Microsoft's biggest fan - especially as the program I am currently defending/praising has been butchered in the last two releases (2010 and 2013) - but what I am saying goes for other desktop e-mail clients as well, including Notes and Thunderbird. Some people may love webmail clients but for me, I like my desktop client and I would find it odd if someone else were to tell me that I was wrong in my preference.

  5. Mikel

    In the full memo

    It is pointed out that Outlook is the last remaining app from the Office suite. Yahoo has ditched all the rest

  6. Shannon Jacobs

    Hey, morons! You want to make your email system compelling attractive?

    If Yahoo wanted to make their email system compellingly attractive, all they have to do is remove the spam. Okay, they can't get all of it, but they can certainly do VASTLY better than the current patty-cake games.

    What I would like to have would be a integrated spam-fighting system WAY beyond the stupid 'report spam' button. It would run through several rounds of analysis and confirmation, identifying just what the spam is and letting me help with the targeting of the most appropriate countermeasures. The objectives are simple: Disrupt ALL of the spammers' infrastructure, pursue ALL of the spammers' accomplices, and help and protect ALL of the spammers' victims. Remove the profits and the spammers will not become decent human beings, but most of them will move under other rocks of much lower visibility and annoyance. If Yahoo Mail actually the best system of this type, then the spammers would develop and allergy to Yahoo.

    Lots of wrinkles possible, but sadly Yahoo is too near bankruptcy to tackle it. Though it would be an inconvenience to me and many other people, at this point I believe that Yahoo's bankruptcy would be an even bigger hassle for the spammers.

  7. Dan 55 Silver badge

    Sinking ship confirmed

    If Y Mail is deemed good enough for Yahoo's internal businessey stuff then there's something seriously wrong at Yahoo.

  8. Fihart

    I'm surprised.

    Management seem positively understanding of Yahoo staffers' reluctance to move to New Yahoo Mail.

    We mere customers were forced off Yahoo Classic, which we liked despite its folksy looks and the odd restriction, and made to use the New Yahoo. I find New Yahoo Mail slow, doubtless not helped by waiting for the pointless ads to be served up.

    If that doesn't improve, Yahoo staffers may be the last people using Yahoo Mail.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I'm surprised.

      I was a user of the old Yahoo web interface, mostly for spam-like stuff (e.g. facebook and other dubious companies) and tried the "new" look and shortly reverted back. Then they forced me to use it, and then they butchered it even further.

      It is slow, really slow compared to the old one and various things that used to be fairly obvious and usable have been hidden or removed.

      Most complained. The GUI designed ignored them.

      Same shit as Windows 8 TIFKAM, similar to some "improvements" to Gmail, same as recent Ubuntu gripes.

      What is it with GUI designers? Why can't the bloody well listen to the users and only change things where there is a recognisable improvement? A pox on them all :(

      1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

        Re: What is it with GUI designers?

        They are convinced that they are the annointed. They have seen the light, and they are going to make you see it whether you like it or not.

        It's for your own good, you see.

      2. Dan 55 Silver badge

        Re: I'm surprised.

        There's a basic mail option in Mail Settings. Use it before you go mad.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I'm surprised.

      You can still use Y basic. It sucks and is buggy, but less than the new version.

  9. Robert Grant

    Step one

    Add a timecode for migrating to/wrestling with/recovering from hacks of/waiting for Y!Mail to respond. Don't make people do it "in their own time".

  10. Catweazle666

    "Beyond the practical benefits of giving feedback to your colleagues on the Mail team"

    75% of the staff refuse to use it. How much more feedback do they need?

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