back to article Microsoft's Nokia plan: WHACK APPLE AND GOOGLE

Microsoft has posted the presentation it's used to explain its decision to acquire Nokia's mobile phone business and it reveals the key reason for the acquisition: hitting back at Apple and Google. The presentation is available as a PDF or a slow HTML slideshow here and gets interesting at slide 15, depicted below. Slide 15 …

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  1. gaz 7

    RIP Nokia

    a lot felt this day was going to come. the final nail in the coffin of the old Nokia

    Goodbye Nokia we loved you.

    Why didn't you stick with Maemo/Meego - you had a world beater which only needed a bit of polish.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: RIP Microsoft

      The move that ended Microsoft.

      1. Infernoz Bronze badge
        Facepalm

        Re: RIP Microsoft

        Indeed!

        Microsoft are already in enough trouble that Balmer was binned, and as Nicholas Taleb writes in his Anti-Fragile book that large(r) corporations are more likely to be Fragile, so vulnerable to negative Black Swan events!

        1. h3

          Re: RIP Microsoft

          They are not in that much trouble they just need something to work in the next 10 years or so.

          (Think they have about 200 billion $ cash and investments.)

          So they will still have half of it if they spend 10 billion a year for 10 years.

          (Even if they stopped being profitable which won't happen).

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: RIP Microsoft

        LOL, I doubt it - Google just named the new Android 'KitKat' - What does that make me think of? Flakey? Melt Down? Easily Cracked Open?

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: RIP Microsoft

        Only if they put Roz Ho in charge of everything.

    2. Bob Vistakin
      Unhappy

      Re: RIP Nokia

      With this move, Micosoft announce they have given up competing with their own products. They see the way the market has gone, with Google/Apple dominating for the next decade at least, and just want a bigger slice of their efforts. Extortion has, and always will be, the only meaningful revenue option open to them in mobile.

      Elops back home, they can lay off all those pesky Finns now they have what they really wanted all along, and Blamer is off laughing into the sunset.

      1. h4rm0ny

        Re: RIP Nokia

        "they can lay off all those pesky Finns now they have what they really wanted all along,"

        Microsoft have money. Nokia do not. Nokia has just made multiple billions. Nokia employees now have a better chance of not being laid off than they did before.

        You seem to be confusing this deal with situations where a company takes over a competitor which is nit the case here. You're just making things up that sound bad on MS's part.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: RIP Nokia

      Nokia will still exist, Microsoft is just buying the phone division.

      1. M Gale

        Re: RIP Nokia

        Nokia will still exist, Microsoft is just buying the phone division.

        So basically, they bought the only thing about Nokia that has any brand awareness whatsoever. That is, unless you're seriously contemplating buying a pair of Nokia wellies instead of your next smartphone. Whatever of Nokia is left might as well shut up shop now. Last person to leave, please turn out the lights.

        Everybody saw this coming a mile off, apart from the Nokia execs it seems.

        1. Alex Rose
          FAIL

          Re: RIP Nokia

          "Whatever of Nokia is left might as well shut up shop now. Last person to leave, please turn out the lights."

          You mean the group of businesses with approximately EUR15 billion global revenues? Yeah, spare change mate, I wouldn't get out of bed for less than EUR30 billion myself.

          Muppet.

          1. Joe Gurman

            Re: RIP Nokia

            Erm, 15 billion Euro _revenue_ maybe, but on target to run out of cash by sometime next year. That's the whole "profit" thing business talks about, and makes it worth getting out of bed.

            Whooza muppet now?

        2. Chris 3

          Re: RIP Nokia

          The only thing that has brand awareness in the *consumer* space. Phones account for less than half of Nokia revenue, ISTR

          1. JEDIDIAH
            Linux

            Re: RIP Nokia

            > The only thing that has brand awareness in the *consumer* space. Phones account for less than half of Nokia revenue, ISTR

            That says more about how much Nokia has screwed the pooch than anything else. They were once a giant and now people are trying to distract from the fact that they aren't anymore.

        3. MacroRodent Silver badge
          Holmes

          Re: RIP Nokia

          So basically, they bought the only thing about Nokia that has any brand awareness whatsoever. That is, unless you're seriously contemplating buying a pair of Nokia wellies instead of your next smartphone. Whatever of Nokia is left might as well shut up shop now. Last person to leave, please turn out the lights.

          Sorry, but that is inaccurate to say the least. Nokia kept NSN, which is about the only profitable part these says. (Also they no more makes wellies). So you can still buy your 3G or LTE network from Nokia. In fact, after the sale, it is pretty much Nokia = NSN.

        4. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: RIP Nokia

          Actually, Microsoft can only use the Nokia name on the current product range. Nokia can very easily create a new smartphone division around Android now if they want. Nokia isn't so daft as to lose their brand fully.

          Obviously the patents Microsoft gets makes them dangerous now. They'll be knocking on a few doors soon with a baseball bat.

          This is the agreement:

          "It also gets the Asha brand and will license the Nokia brand for use with current Nokia mobile phone products. Nokia will continue to own and manage the Nokia brand."

          http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/microsoft/10282521/Microsoft-buys-Nokias-mobile-phone-arm-in-5.4bn-deal.html

          1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

            Re: Nokia isn't so daft as to lose their brand fully.

            I wouldn't bet the farm on that statement.

          2. h4rm0ny

            Re: RIP Nokia

            "Obviously the patents Microsoft gets makes them dangerous now. They'll be knocking on a few doors soon with a baseball bat."

            The Army of the Will Not Read are out in force today. MS have not bought the patents. They have licenced them for ten years with an option to renew. Nokia are still the patent owners. MS have simply paid for use of those patents and offered some if their own under the same deal.

            1. Lord Snooty

              Re: RIP Nokia

              Well, you seem to be part of the "Army of the Will Not Read" as slides 19 and 23 of the MS presentation (mentioned and linked to in the article) explicitly state that as well as licencing a ton of Nokia's patents, MS have also acquired outright 8500 patents pertaining specifically to smartphones.

            2. IGnatius T Foobar

              Re: RIP Nokia

              They have licenced them for ten years with an option to renew. Nokia are still the patent owners. MS have simply paid for use of those patents and offered some if their own under the same deal.

              This means that if Nokia is clever and aggressive enough, they can set up cross-licensing deals with phone manufacturers to pull the rug out from under Microsoft's intimidation/extortion racket. Microsoft is making a lot of money in mobile -- by extorting Android. Nokia can stick a fork in that.

        5. h3

          Re: RIP Nokia

          The other parts of Nokia make money afaik.

          (Don't get how people value brand awareness more than making money with good margins).

      2. Michael Habel Silver badge

        Re: RIP Nokia

        Did MicroSoft also buy into Nokias' Telecoms infrastructure too? AFIAK Nokia made more then just the Phones. Along with the like of Erickson Built / Sold much of the back-haul Network to the Network Operators too.

        1. Lars Silver badge
          WTF?

          Re: RIP Nokia

          Did MicroSoft also buy into Nokias' Telecoms infrastructure too?. NO

      3. Zane
        WTF?

        Re: RIP Nokia

        What you mean "...just the phone division"?

        As in: he still exists, they only cut out his stomach?

        /Zane

    4. 20legend

      Re: RIP Nokia

      A very sad day, the love for Nokia and the hopes of a Nokia Droid gone up in smoke.

      However, at least it should give a boost to Jolla - Sailfish time, bitches!

    5. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: RIP Nokia

      Nokia shareholders can still reject the deal. Yahoo rejected a Microsoft takeover remember.

      Hedge funds are the big losers in this, they bet on the shares falling 10%.

      1. monkeyfish

        Re: RIP Nokia

        Nokia shareholders can still reject the deal. Yahoo rejected a Microsoft takeover remember.

        Yeah, and that worked out really well for Yahoo!, didn't it?

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: RIP Nokia

        Luckily short sellers don't have shares to vote with....

  2. Neil Barnes Silver badge
    Unhappy

    It's OK

    I already have the last Nokia phone I will ever own.

    1. returnmyjedi

      They are very reliable so it should last you.

      1. Tom 7 Silver badge

        reliable

        mines about 8 years old - does what I want with a phone and I can loose it with impunity which is probably what I've still got it.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: reliable

          3310 I take it?

          1. Neil Barnes Silver badge

            Re: reliable

            2710 for me.

    2. N2 Silver badge

      Re: It's OK

      Yup, its been in a drawer somewhere for about the last 5 years.

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    They made $10 for a Nokia phone?

    Why did they bother at all? They make more per an Android phone from license fees.

    1. h4rm0ny

      Re: They made $10 for a Nokia phone?

      "Why did they bother at all? They make more per an Android phone from license fees"

      How much do they make from licence fees per Android phone?

  4. Stacy

    Good phones and good OS

    I know I'm going to get down voted here for daring to say something positive, but...

    I gave up on Nokia after the dismal experience that owning an N73 was - I even replaced it with a cheap Samsung flip phone long before I could upgrade on my contract as using it was just so painful.

    I now have an 820 - and it is a great phone. Sure the app store needs more apps (kind of like the Android App store when I moved from Apple to Android a few years ago) but most of what is there is useful).

    If you don't download a huge amount of apps then it's a stunning little phone that is, mostly, very intuitive.

    Lets see what they can do now...

    1. Snark
      Unhappy

      Re: Good phones and good OS

      I agree, I do like my 620 though OS development is painfully slow fixing the foibles it has (i.e. non-existant) and MS is not a good company to run a hardware division.

      I just can't see how this is going to be good for WinPho though. What competitor in their right mind is going to want to make WinPho's when MS make their own? This isn't going to be like Google producing good reference devices which people then spin, MS are going to screw it around for what they want and everyone else is going to feel cold-shouldered. They seem to see themselves as an apple who can own the whole ecosystem when they don't have the corporate structure to allow creativity. It seems a sad day all round. I'd rather have had Nokia buy MS's phone OS division ;-).

      1. Arctic fox

        @Snark "What competitor in their right mind is going to want to make WinPho's......

        ................. when MS make their own?"

        Since the launch of WP8 Nokia figures have been 80% of all phones sold. Frankly I cannot see why the other OEMs bother. They are scarcely going to lose out in any meaningful way. I run a Lumia 820 btw and am very pleased with it.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Good phones and good OS

      It is a good OS from a usability perspective and it is very easy to accomplish many tasks in very few steps.

      Android (I'm running stock 4.3) is quite clumsy and fiddly in comparison. It's just that Android is rather more superior in multitasking and notifications.

      I prefer to run a "standard" version of Android, most people don't ever see it though and their opinions are formed by Samsung and HTC's interfaces which are more powerful.

      What really pissed me off with Windows Phone was the huge lack of urgency. It seems Nokia was doing all the work trying to keep the customer happy. I received just "one" minor update in about 7 months of owning a Nokia 920.

      1. LDS Silver badge

        Re: Good phones and good OS

        Didi you get already the latest Nokia "Amber" update?

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Good phones and good OS

      I share your let's-wait-and-see approach.

      Nokia had an awful corporate culture, so I hope that their lagging performance has served as a wake up call for management to get out of the way of the people that are capable of creating the great products Nokia managed in the past (and you illustrated exactly why there is reason to believe that is happening).

      Ditto for Microsoft, with Ballmer exiting there will be a drive for people to be seen to deliver. Their main challenge is winning back trust, which also depends on developing a better culture.

      Let's see what happens. It is certainly getting interesting.

      1. hammarbtyp

        Re: Good phones and good OS

        "Nokia had an awful corporate culture, so I hope that their lagging performance has served as a wake up call for management to get out of the way of the people that are capable of creating the great products "

        Two words for you - Stack Ranking

    4. The Blacksmith
      Unhappy

      Re: Good phones and good OS

      Sorry, don't like the tiles, don't like the OS; intrusive, flashy, in your face. I prefer my phone to be quiet and to respond to me. In fact, I also need my computer to do this. I don't want to be interrupted by what it (Well, the developers) thinks is important. Oh, ok, I let it notify me when a call comes it.

      You may disagree, and good luck to you there, but I'm not buying a new Nokia. It had been 4 Nokia phones from the 1990's through to now. Now it's a Sony Android (it was a present, I didn't get to choose), but I'm not pleased when I had a play with the new Nokia phones. Lovely hardware, poor software.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Good phones and good OS

        It's not flashy and in your face. Just because there is a bit of movement on the main screen, so what? people install live wallpapers on Android that are more distracting.

        Haven't you noticed how the logos and branding of the world is going rather more flat and stylish? that's the web and metro influence.

        1. M Gale

          Re: Good phones and good OS

          that's the web and metro influence.

          I only see this in a few places, and I regard this as either fawning fanboyism (what, Microsoft has fanboys? Stranger things have happened!) or a complete lack of ideas. Or possibly both.

    5. h3

      Re: Good phones and good OS

      I am not bothered about whether it is difficult to use or intuitive.

      I want it to be a smartphone and the battery to last a week.. (Not had anything none Symbian that has managed that).

      (I have a Lumia 800 that has lasted me a year and it still perfect - usually phones last me less than 6 months I keep them in my pocket don't bother about them. See them as a tool not a trophy).

      Nokia Drive (Offline Satnav)

      Really good virtual keyboard you never make mistakes on no matter how hammered you are

      Dodonpachi Maximum (Game - Android versions of the same thing are utter garbage.)

      I can get 3 days out of the battery if I am sensible

      Good build quality

      It is setup so 3rd party apps cannot by default waste my battery.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    No Android Lumia 1030 then..?

    One of those would be my perfect smartphone...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: No Android Lumia 1030 then..?

      Nokia is free to create another phone division under a different name (Microsoft licenced the Nokia name for 10 years).

      Nokia is not being fully purchased, just the phone division.

      1. JeffinLondon

        Re: No Android Lumia 1030 then..?

        Correct.

        MS bought about 50% of Nokia.

        1. plrndl
          Holmes

          Re: No Android Lumia 1030 then..?

          "Nokia is free to create another phone division under a different name (Microsoft licenced the Nokia name for 10 years)."

          If Nokia has been paid €5 billion to lose Elop and fund the creation of their new Android division, this may turn out to be a good deal for everyone except MS, who will sink slowly with Elop at the helm.

      2. returnmyjedi

        I very much doubt that there's not a clause in the buyout contract that forbids Nokia from doing such a thing as developing an Android handset.

        1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

          Agreed. Microsoft does not have a history of leaving loopholes for anybody but itself.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Microsoft is licencing Nokia's patents and much of these patents are required for their NSN business. I doubt they are revoking the ability to use them. Why would they?

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: No Android Lumia 1030 then..?

        Nokia is NOT free to make a phone for 2 years. Microsoft did NOT license the Nokia name.

  6. JeffinLondon

    MS / Nokia

    ahhh... the sweet sound of two garbage trucks colliding!

    Guess this means we can hold one funeral rather than two.

  7. Schultz Silver badge

    "make 40$ per device"

    But will they ever be profitable?

    1. Shagbag

      Re: "make 40$ per device"

      They were already making $10 per device. They've now paid $7,200,000,000 to earn an extra $30 per device. MSFT will have to sell 2,400,000,000 phones to get their money back. At current Nokia sales rates of 30,000,000 units per year, it'll take MSFT 80 years just to break even - unless consumers change their minds about WinPho and go from their current state of 'not interested' to 'I love it'.

      1. ratfox
        Boffin

        Re: "make 40$ per device"

        I think if you check your numbers, you'll find that the number of phones they need to sell is a tenth of what you claim. 7.2 billions divided by 30 is not 2.4 billions.

      2. TheOtherHobbes

        Re: "make 40$ per device"

        But those sales will increase by a factor of 10 - at least - because the new brand is going to be 'Nokia by Microsoft'.

        And everyone knows the MS brand is consumer and enterprise gold.

      3. John Sanders
        Facepalm

        Re: "make 40$ per device"

        It will not happen, the carriers hate the idea of MS owning a big portion of the market because of Skype.

        In the same way that the carriers forced the adoption of Java to keep Microsoft at bay in the late nineties early 2000's, the carriers will just boycott MS massively.

        MS is seen as armed and extremely dangerous by the carriers.

        It doesn't help that Ballmer an Elop said that Skype was coming whether the carriers liked it or not. You can guess what the answer from the carriers is going to be.

        1. Down not across Silver badge

          "the carriers will just boycott MS massively."

          The carriers have certainly been a force to be reckoned with with regards to phone manufacturers and their chances of getting phones sold.

          However, I don't think the carriers hold quite the same power as they used to. Sure subsidies still exist but increasing number of people are starting to buy their own phones and opting for SIM only tariffs. Some carriers are even starting to separate the tariff from the phone making it clearer that the old "free" or few tens of quid for phone tariffs really are very expensive hire purchases rather than subsidy.

          Hence the power that carriers used to wield is rapidly diminishing.

  8. RobHib

    My collection of old Nokias

    Had a collection of old Nokias in a shoe box. I've just junked 'em!

    1. dogged
      Meh

      Re: My collection of old Nokias

      How rational of you.

  9. ThomH Silver badge

    Reaping what they sowed

    When Microsoft achieved monopoly status in the Internet client market, it declared that the browser was then fully evolved and left us with the five-year gap between IE6 and IE7. When its years of work on smartphones didn't translate into sales it said that obviously consumers did not want smartphones. It essentially spent a decade pushing bad products and insisting that it was everyone else that had the problem. Besides being exceedingly late to market with the decent Windows Phone iterations, Microsoft has created for itself a very tough reputation to overcome.

    When Nokia had the number-one smartphone OS it gave us extremely contextual user interfaces that only a computer scientist could love, labyrinthian APIs and barely functional tools, and expected developers to rally behind Series 60 because it omitted such frivolities as being able to display anything other than the system font. Dithering this way and that on where to go next, it was like they heard Apple had made waves and decided to copy them but accidentally copied Apple circa 1993. That's how Samsung, HTC, etc, stole the market from them.

    Both companies have shown sufficient penitence since but it's probably too late. A complete merger is probably a smart move but only as a final roll of the dice.

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "A major theme of the presentation is that owning Nokia makes Microsoft more relevant on more platforms"

    Not for long.

    1. John Sanders
      Devil

      I would say not at all.

      1. dogged
        Meh

        Oh well, since you'd say not at all, it must be true!

        Or not.

  11. returnmyjedi

    Give Nokia WP

    If MS had a lick of sense (which they apparently don't) they will hand WP development over to the Finns. It might adversely affect the dozen or so HTC and Sammy WP handsets sold per annum, but Nokia have shown that they are able to innovate within the ecosystem more nimbly than MS have managed. They haven't a hope in overtaking iOS and Android, but they could establish a very sturdy third place.

    1. h4rm0ny

      Re: Give Nokia WP

      You're suggesting taking a VERY large and established project (the WP OS) away from ten teams that have created it and still manage it and giving it to an entirely different company. On what planet does that make financial, technical or managerial sense? You're insane.

      1. Ken Hagan Gold badge

        Re: Give Nokia WP

        @h4rm0ny: and *you* are suggesting leaving that project with the ten teams that have made it the success it is today.

        For the entire life of Windows Phone and its predecessors, the parent OS has been an overwhelming success and monopoly. Despite that, WP (under these ten teams of yours) has failed to reach a double digit share. On my planet, we say that is proof that the current management aren't up to it.

    2. Jonathan 29

      Re: Give Nokia WP

      Absolutely. Microsoft seem under the delusion that the reason Windows devices don't sell has something to do with the hardware, hence the development of the Surface brand and now this. They also seem to be under the delusion that in order to catch up with Apple and Google they should slow down development and release updates less often. Nokia would have been more than capable of taking over the Windows Phone development and integrating into their devices as well as Apple does.

  12. Simon Rockman

    Please can we now have..

    A windowsphone based communicator. Clam with a keyboard and an external 12 key keypad.

  13. Hans 1
    Coat

    Elop: There is Titanic, let's jump ship

    Or how two self-obliterating companies join forces, to hasten fate.

  14. Chris G Silver badge

    Bad attitude

    MS have to change their attitude to their customers, instead of seeing them as purely a revenue source they need to understand that they are customers first and foremost with their own perceptions of what their needs are.

    The MS philosophy has been and probably still is, that they are so powerful and the market leaders so they can dictate to the customer.

    They still haven't fully realised how much Vista and 8 have hurt them, " Oh we'll issue a patch for that" seems to be the average response to any problem with their products no matter how big.

    May well have been better off spending the money on a good PR/Corporate Identity Guru.

  15. hammarbtyp

    They still don't get it

    to paraphrase the slide Success in phones-> will help tablets-> will help PC's

    Sorry MS but PC's are not relevant in a mobile world. The fact that tablets and phone's are not tied to a PC is what drove the market in the first place.

    If MS continue to hold onto that mistaken notion and define everything against their PC OS monopoly, they will continue to fail in the mobile space

  16. Nextweek

    You've all missed the point

    This buy out is super cheap. Its not about the phones its about Nokia's patents. If Apple can ask for $707m from Samsung. Imagine what Microsoft could do with 20 years of patents?

    A litigious Microsoft could ask for money from EVERY mobile maker and be happy every time the Android or Apple market share went up.

    1. Chemist

      Re: You've all missed the point

      "Its not about the phones its about Nokia's patents"

      AFAIK MS have only licensed the patents NOT bought them.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: You've all missed the point

      They don't own Nokia's patents in the deal, they just get 10 years access to them.

      Microsoft can't sue anyone as they don't own the patents.

      1. fandom

        Re: You've all missed the point

        But Nokia can sue and, since they no longer build phones, they can't be countersued,

    3. Jonathan 29

      Re: You've all missed the point

      As the Motorola acquisition showed, having patents is not the same thing as having a decent team of lawyers who can make money from them. Besides, I think all the big players are tired of these long running, money draining legal actions and have declared something of a ceasefire.

  17. Nextweek

    Skype is worth more!

    Ok, how does it work out that Skype is worth $8.5billion but a company that makes things and has an investment in actual things is worth $7.2billion?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Skype is worth more!

      "Ok, how does it work out that Skype is worth $8.5billion but a company that makes things and has an investment in actual things is worth $7.2billion?"

      Because intellectual property is far more highly valued than tools and fixed assets. Most physical assets are subject to depreciation - they wear out, and require relatively expensive maintenance and repair. And other than patented or registered designs (which are IP) almost all physical assets are easily replicated. So you could spend £20m on a new production plant, but other than any trade secrets and patents, there's nothing to stop anybody from setting up a plant making a similar product, be that a phone, or a bucket.

      A good patent requires no maintenance or repairs, and a decent bit of code can last for donkey's years. You might suggest that Silverlight (for example) isn't such code and you'd be right, but I'd raise you the kernel of NT, which has been and remains the foundations of desktop Windows for two decades. Likewise, the cobweb infested Cobol that keeps so many banks in business was written donkey's years ago, and still works. MS Office hasn't really evolved much in the past decade, with the bulk of the functionality unchanged - sticking a disjointed new UI on the front of your OS or your applications is only window dressing, and the core IP remains what it was. Now Android is relatively stable, how much will the kernel really change? Likewise IoS.

      Normally brand is another excuse for paying through the nose. But in this case the Nokia brand is a bit shabby and soiled by the reversals of strategy and the muted reception for WinPho, whereas Skype was seen (by MS) as new, exciting, sexy, and unsoiled.

      Looking at the history, the odds are against MS. They don't have a name for good hardware, they have a very poor record of making a success of acquisitions, they've been very poor when trying to make money in new markets, and they've just made a biblical mess with the entirely foreseeable botch up over Windows 8. At the core of all these failures has been a corporate arrogance, a refusal to listen to customers, which probably comes from their near monopoly in business and office OS and productivity software. If they can sell WinPho/Nokia products in volume to gormless enterprise CIOs then maybe it will all work out, or if Nokia's goodwill in emerging markets is retained. I don't see this myself.

      1. dogged

        Re: Skype is worth more!

        They don't have a name for good hardware

        I disagree.

        Their mice and keyboards have always been excellent.

        1. Eradicate all BB entrants

          I am with dogged .....

          ..... on the KB/Mouse statement. I thoroughly regret not buying a 5 pack of the Optical Intellimouse (v1.1 5 button) when they were still available. In my opinion the best wired mouse ever made.

          When mine finally died I was gutted, the newer ones just didn't seem as good and I don't fancy a pre-yellowed one from ebay.

      2. Ken Hagan Gold badge

        Re: Skype is worth more!

        "Because intellectual property is far more highly valued than tools and fixed assets."

        Sadly, yes. The idiots who make the rules have decided that merely describing an idea should entitle you to an umpty year global monopoly. Obviously if anyone were to propose the same rules about physical objects, they'd be quickly certified and re-housed where qualified medical staff could look after them, but in this new-fangled "virtual cloudy" world, there don't seem to be any clue-by-fours to whack the pollies over the head with.

        So in response to the OP's serious question ... it's in *your* world, and you may begin weeping now.

  18. Anonymous Custard Silver badge
    WTF?

    Success?

    From the slide:

    Success in phones is important to success in tablets

    Success in tablets will help PCs

    So they bought half of Nokia in the hope that it'll suddenly make Surface less of a turkey, and that will then somehow make Windows 8 suddenly a consumer darling that everyone wants and we'll all wake up and go out and but laptops and desktops?

    It sounds like they've bought an ant that's hoping to pick up an elephant, which in turn is trying to pick up a mountain. Phones are beginning to blur into tablets anyway, and the whole lot are killing off PCs for many applications, not helping them.

    Scooby Doo, where are you, cos no-one's got a scooby in this crowd...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Success?

      "From the slide:"

      Too many words on that slide. Quick, to the TufteCopter!

  19. James 51

    how much would this have cost M$ before Elop ran them into the ground?

  20. Jeff Green

    Congratulations to Elop!

    Mission accomplished, reduce the value of the phone division to Ballmer's target price and then you can come home!

  21. mark l 2 Silver badge

    What the bet that any other oems that did support Windows phone suddenly have a fire sale of them then drop the platform completely.

    the worst thing Microsoft can do now is to try and force the Windows branding more than they do already, they need them to be Nokia phones NOT Microsoft or windows phones.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      HTC were already thinking of leaving. I'm pretty sure they will now.

      1. John Sanders
        Devil

        HTC is on the verge of leaving this world altogether.

  22. Sander van der Wal

    Why now, why so sudden, and why for so little?

    For those of us without tinfoil hats, what reasonable theories are there to explain this? Is the WP strategy proving to be a major disaster, and what evidence is there to support this?

    Or, for an alternative tinfoil hat theory, is the sale the conclusion of a brilliant strategy on Nokia's part to get a Bigger Fool to pay for a worthless feature phone business. After all, if Ballmer had planned all this upfront, it would be the only plan that actually worked, wouldn't it? Much more reasonable (ha ha) to assume Nokia was also able to fool him big time, next to everybody else in the computer business.

    1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge
      Happy

      Re: Why now, why so sudden, and why for so little?

      Ballmer has just announced he's leaving. The share price immediately went up. Clearly this has offended him. So he's bought half of Nokia, in order to give his successor a massive headache as soon as he joins the company... Trying to integrate 30,000 new staff from a totally different business culture should keep the bugger busy!

      That way Ballmer's legacy is saved, and he can hope not to go down in history as Microsoft's worst CEO.

      Alternatively MS are so pissed off with their hardware partners that they're going to turn themselves into Apple. Soon they'll buy a middling PC hardware company - or maybe just contract it all out, and they'll make PCs, laptops, tablets and phones. I guess Nokia can do the tablets, given that a tablet is just a bigger phone anyway. I'm sure they'll still license Windows, and they'll not bother with the corporate desktop and server markets, but having a consumer market from all-in-one home PCs, via tablets and XBoxes, to phones makes sense. However as they've got a corporate culture as innovation-stifling as Nokia at its worst, I can't see them managing to turn themselves into a nimble consumer brand.

      Third option, the MS board have written a random policy generator. Possibly computerised, possibly with the use of post-it notes and a dart board. This, Metro and the purchase of Skype are the results.

      1. John Sanders
        Devil

        Re: Why now, why so sudden, and why for so little?

        ""Alternatively MS are so pissed off with their hardware partners that they're going to turn themselves into Apple. Soon they'll buy a middling PC hardware company""

        DELL!!!!

  23. Shonko Kid
    Devil

    The End Game...

    My guess looks something like this

    MSFT: Now then Mr OEM, to use our Mobile patents will cost you $20 per device, for the first 10 million units, or you could take advantage of our summer sale, and take a WinPho license for a bargain price of $15 per device...

    OEM: Errr...

  24. Pascal Monett Silver badge

    WHACK APPLE AND GOOGLE .

    A nice plan.

    Too bad Microsoft doesn't have anything better than a wet noodle to whack them with.

  25. poopypants

    Stack ranking*

    Kurt Eichenwald reported in Vanity Fair a year ago that the practice* led employees at Microsoft to avoid working with top developers, not cooperate on projects, and remain focused on short-term achievements rather than long-term goals. (In a first-hand account published on Monday on Slate.com, a former employee called it “as toxic for innovation and integrity and morale as media reports made it out to be, and then some.”) The program was reportedly still around as of July–in a recent interview in the Seattle Times, Ballmer said there had only been “minor changes" to the system.

    - from http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/on-leadership/wp/2013/08/27/with-steve-ballmers-departure-a-look-at-microsofts-flawed-system-of-performance-reviews/

    If they want to compete, Microsoft will have to stop making their employees afraid to take risks, or collaborate with others.

  26. Malagabay

    "High value experiences light up on great devices"

    "light up" and burn in this case... what are they smoking?

  27. gcla72
    Coat

    Oh well never mind, eh?

    I felt a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced. I fear something terrible has happened.

  28. Malagabay

    "Success in tablets will help PCs"

    Likewise:

    Failure in phones is important to failure in tablets

    Failure in tablets is important to failure in desktops

  29. Malagabay

    "But fear of Google and Apple also pervades the document"

    Sad: A frightened and wounded gorilla on the rampage will destroy a lot of value.

  30. Malagabay

    "$US40 per smart device it sells, compared to the $US10 it gathers from Nokia now"

    Except MicroClusterFuck will spend more than USD40 to earn USD40.

  31. Dazzz

    So, the final curtain has appeared, I will be sorry to see them go, but its been fairly apparent since Elop dropped the big one what was going to happen.

    I think I will be sourcing my Nokia phones from ebay in the future, No interest in Winpho, i'll keep my N8 running for awhile maybe grab an 808 when that dies or even an N9 to have a play with.

    1. Jess

      sourcing my Nokia

      I would be saying the same, except I closed my ebay account months ago. So it looks like Amazon.

  32. Mr. Peterson

    eagerly awaiting the inane WinPho ad campaign(s) sure to alienate most potential would-be buyers

  33. Ken Hagan Gold badge

    It's really too early to say

    Everything MS have done these past ten years has been blighted by the unerring mis-judgement of its now-outgoing CEO. Ask yourself this: if *you* were suddenly gifted with the top job at MS and allowed to do *any* kind of re-org you like and develop any new products you like, could *you* make a success of it? I'm guessing that most of the people here are arrogant enough to reckon they could.

    1. dogged

      Re: It's really too early to say

      I'm guessing that most of the people here are arrogant enough to reckon they could.

      Maybe some of them are right.

      Whether they could do that while doubling profits and tripling revenues is a different matter.

  34. Lord Snooty

    MS have acquired Nokia's patents, not just licensed them

    I've noticed a few people saying that MS have only licensed Nokia's portfolio of patents when in fact they have acquired the key smartphone patents and licensed the more general utility patents. Slides 19 & 23 in the MS presentation make this clear...

  35. mike panero

    Tsunami

    Oh look at all the water running out to sea, guess it will be dry from now on

    Oh fuck look at that wave!

    RUN RUN RUN

  36. William Donelson

    Microsoft brings a knife to a gun fight. Go Ballmer.

    Microsoft brings a knife to a gun fight. Go Ballmer.

  37. Bladeforce

    Its sad to see Microsoft in this state, they will be fighting the smartphone market for share even when Apple and Google/Samsung/Sony will be fighting other markets like tech wearables (smartwatch etc) They are so late to every party they just need to die

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