back to article Microsoft's Windows 8.1 secrets REVEALED ... sort of

After weeks of teasing us with vague promises, Microsoft has at last revealed some concrete details of what will be included in Windows 8.1, the update formerly known as "Blue." Describing the response to Windows 8 as "substantial," (You can say that again – Ed) Windows corporate VP Antoine Leblond wrote in a blog post on …

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  1. Tom 35

    Sounds more like 8.01

    So your car still has a square steering wheel* but they have added fuzzy dice.

    They are not going to change anything of substance, how can they possibly think this will make even a single person happy?

    *to use a common win8 comparison.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Sounds more like 8.01

      "It's Windows 8 even better," Leblond wrote. "Not only will Windows 8.1 respond to customer feedback, but it will add new features and functionality that advance the touch experience and mobile computing's potential."

      So Windows 8.1 will respond to customer feedback?

      If I call it a piece of sh*t will it respond and tell me to go and f... myself?

      If I ask it for a fully functioning Start button will it respond and automatically provide one?

      If I ask it to.....

      Is that a stupid statement or what?

      1. mmeier

        Re: Sounds more like 8.01

        Sure it will. After all Windows has a functional offline speech recognition build in since at least Win7.

        1. Anonymous Custard Silver badge

          Re: Sounds more like 8.01

          You have to wonder if this one also doesn't fly whether they'll actually take the hint?

          It sounds like rather than listening, they've decided what people actually want (again) rather than actually gone out and taken detailed note of what they're actually saying. Prime example being start button (given) vs start menu (wanted).

          But in the end the markets and sales will tell, and even if users can be ignored, their dollars spent (or lack of them) can't.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      FAIL

      Re: Sounds more like 8.01

      Agreed.

      It was half baked crap when it came out and it will still be half baked crap after 8.1. Putting a dress on Frankenstein doesn't turn it into Gwyneth Paltrow.

      "You can resize apps to any size you want" - whoopie feckin do. KDE4 has had resizeable plasmoids for years.

      1. Bob Vistakin

        Redmond orders turd polish by the tankerful

        But it's still not enough.

        It's nice to see their new official Windows 8.1 line though - "It's like having a ping pong bat shoved up your ass while you try to get on with your work.".

        1. Tom 13

          Re: Redmond orders turd polish by the tankerful

          Yep. Sounds like somebody said "lacquered up" when they should have said "liquored up."

      2. Mage Silver badge

        Re: Sounds more like 8.01

        Didn't Windows 2.0 have resizeable apps?

        It's a bikini on a hippo

        1. Gordon Stewart

          Re: Sounds more like 8.01

          or indeed, glitter on a turd

      3. Tom 13
        Joke

        Re: half baked crap

        No, no. When it came out it was half baked crap. This will be 51% baked crap. That's a huge difference!

    3. Someone Else Silver badge
      Coat

      Re: Sounds more like 8.01

      [...] how can they possibly think this will make even a single person happy?

      Well, it sounds like this feller Leblonde is happy; he'll be employed for some time trying to convince the world that up is down, everybody loves what they hate, and that a command line can be driven without a keyboard.

    4. janimal

      Re: Sounds more like 8.01

      and still just as awful as 8.0

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Sounds more like 8.01

        In fact, if they work a little harder they might get it to the standard of the original Vista.

        1. Tom 13

          Re: standard of the original Vista.

          That's more apt than MS are willing to admit, and I hadn't realized just how much until this morning.

          My dad who is not a computer type thinks it is finally time to take the plunge. For Christmas he got himself some non-name Android tablet thing and tried to configure it himself. I couldn't figure out the reset combination to try to fix it. He eventually took it back. I gave him a semi-fixed up laptop in May to replace it. This morning when I check WOOT they had a $300 reasonably powered laptop on one of the screens. When I saw it came with Windows 8 I stopped checking the rest of the specs. Yes, I might be able to install a Linux distro on it, and all he really wants to do is get an email account and check the web. But I don't personally use any Linux distros so I'm not going to put something on his PC that I can't support over the phone. So even at a really affordable price point, the Windows 8 logo stopped the sale before I really started to check it.

    5. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Sounds more like 8.01

      It has a square steering wheel, but there's a picture of a round steering wheel on it, so you know it's the steering wheel.

    6. Prowler
      Alien

      Re: Sounds more like 8.01 <--- Nailed It!

      ... and would you believe that they are also bumping the kernel version up to 6.3. So Vista was 6.0, Windows 7 was 6.1, Windows 8 is 6.2 and now Windows 8 Blew is 6.3 ( which quasi-logically might have gone to Windows 9 ). FUBAR all around. So what magical reshuffling of kernel bytes merits this step up? -Rhetorical.

      Softie Marketspeak: " Not only will Windows 8.1 respond to customer feedback, but it will add new features and functionality that advance the touch experience and mobile computing's potential "

      Meanwhile the rest of the world is already using mobile on the 99% of tablets and phones none of which have "Microsoft" or "Windows" labels anywhere on them. How exactly can they "advance mobile computing's potential" when almost no-one is laying a finger on these MicroTurds. -Rhetorical.

      And that's a big fat zero zilch nada on the listening to customer feedback, unless by "customer" they mean those MetroTards complaining that the Win8 desktop still vaguely resembles the productive pre-Win8 desktop. Installing a "Start Screen Button" that points right back to Metro is the biggest middle finger ever directed to a heretofore loyal customer base. Are they truly insane? -Rhetorical.

      Steve Jobs may have died, but his ghost is haunting the halls of Redmond wreaking havoc like a ghost in the machine.

    7. Splodger
      Unhappy

      Re: Sounds more like 8.01

      They may as well have just sent everyone a self-adhesive "start" sticker to apply to the lower left corner of the screen.

      I cannot believe that I thought MS were actually going to fix their screw up.

      Sod it, beer time.

    8. Splodger

      Re: Sounds more like 8.01

      W8 Problem: Everybody hates Metro.

      MS Solution: Put "Start" button on desktop to take you straight to Metro.

      Unalloyed genius!

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    IE11 - The only browser built for touch?

    WTF, what are they smoking up there in Redmond?

    So the browsers available in other touch orientated Operating Systems are not built for touch?

    Please MS, can't you even get some basic facts straight.

    Be careful or you will start patenting all Touch applications next...

    1. JDX Gold badge

      Re: IE11 - The only browser built for touch?

      Supporting touch is not the same as built for touch. The latter implies they are designed primarily for touch, not just regular browsers you can poke at i.e. Safari on iOS.

      There is definitely a lot to improve in this area. Maybe it's IE's turn to get things moving!!

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: IE11 - The only browser built for touch?

        JDX - The Reg's answer to Loverock Davidson

      2. Wibble
        Gimp

        Re: IE11 - The only browser built for touch?

        Then WTF is this iPad browser then?

        That Microsoft guy's just a swivel eyed loon in a gimp suit.

        1. mmeier

          Re: IE11 - The only browser built for touch?

          Currently no browser is "designed for touch". To use the typical forum(1) the ones I have used so far need

          "Smear to enlarge the display so I can hit the link"

          "Smear to reduce the display so I can read the page"

          A browser that is "designed for touch" would have a means to enlarge the links so I can reliably hit them even if the forum is not. Currently each forum / web site must be programmed to do so. Can't say wether MS managed that. Don't care since a Wacom stylus works fine in normal browsers

          (1) This one if programmed in a way to be useable by touch with relatively big text, distance between topic etc.

          1. Rattus Rattus

            Re: IE11 - The only browser built for touch?

            @mmeier

            Try Chrome for Android, then. If you are trying to touch a link that is small and near other links, Chrome will automatically enlarge that screen section so you can accurately touch the link you want.

            1. mmeier

              Re: IE11 - The only browser built for touch?

              Thanks for the info. If I ever get a touchy-toy I might try,

            2. Charlie Clark Silver badge

              Re: IE11 - The only browser built for touch?

              If you are trying to touch a link that is small and near other links, Chrome will automatically enlarge that screen section so you can accurately touch the link you want.

              FWIW Opera Mini and Mobile have always done this.

  3. Stephen Channell
    FAIL

    and..

    I'm sorry, but more production code comes out of the average work-placement by an intern. Time to fess-up that they've lost the code to Windows 7 and all the old coders have retired.

  4. ACcc

    No major change

    Honestly, and I know Eadon is going to spit so many feathers at this point to make very nice mattress, but I quite like Windows 8 as it is.

    I put in on a netbook to give it a go, keeping the old XP/Linux drive in case it was awful, but I've kept it, added Lubuntu for Linux/main OS, and am enjoying the shortcut keys, and the look and feel.

    I also know a non-techie neighbour who bought a W8 laptop after a W7 one and when I asked how it was going, thinking it would be maybe complicated, the answer was 'all good, found the desktop, no problem'

    So from a non-scientific poll of two, one IT, one not, I think the "it's an awful OS" crowd are somewhat over doing it.

    1. BrownishMonstr

      Re: No major change

      I quite like Windows 8 as it is.

      Have you used the search function? It's pretty crap compared to 7. I don't mind the rest of 8 but the search makes everything more complicated. I hope they've added the ability to open a file location from the search, cut/copy a file, copy the file path, check the properties, etc.

      1. Rattus Rattus

        Re: search function

        What? You can't do any of that in it? D: I was already unimpressed at how many functions I regularly used were missing from Windows 7's Explorer compared to XP's. Now it sounds like 8 dumbs it down even further?

    2. Diogenes
      Happy

      Re: No major change

      ACcc ,

      I agree, I have no problems with W8 , but I suspect like most people I rarely use the apps. Once I laid out my tiles in a fashion that suited me I was off. I use it on a "proper" box and a tablet, I also have a Mac sitting on my desk at home and to be honest I prefer win8 to Mountain Lion (I only bought it so that I could create resources for the iThings the kids use).

      About 1/3 of the kids in my computing & multimedia classes have tried windows & of the 50 or so that have, only 1 thinks its a pile of excrement, they are still running it. A few (@12) colleagues have new laptops that came with it preinstalled and once I showed them how to connect to the school wireless, and access the schools drives are as happy a pigs in s..t, of these 12 or so only has has gone to win7.

      1. John P
        Go

        Re: No major change

        I suspect this is the workflow of most people. I make no use at all of the Store Apps, except for the mail app because it's quite handy having that pinned to 25% of my secondary monitor while still have a desktop that thinks it is the entire screen on the rest of that monitor, meaning maximizing a Window doesn't cover up mail.

        Start Screen = big Start Menu. If you just look at it from that perspective and completely ignore the apps, there's not really a great deal of difference between 7 and 8.

        And as for the search, Vista/7 search never seemed to find what I was after in any quick manner. If it did find it at all it was several items down the list of results and/or it took 15+ seconds to find it. Search on Windows 8 finds what I want and has it at the top of the list 95% of the time. I never used search in 7, I find I use it quite often in 8.

        The only major gripe I have is with the Metro file manager, it is horrendous and my heart sinks every time I need to use it. Hopefully, they'll make that better in 8.1.

    3. Jamie Jones Silver badge
      FAIL

      Re: No major change

      Yes, I know people who run 'windows' and only have one application running at a time - always full screen.

      I suspect they won't find many problems with windows8 either...

      1. mmeier

        Re: No major change

        Doesn't repeating the same nonsense about Win8 get boring over time?

        1. Tom 13

          Re: Doesn't repeating the same nonsense about Win8 get boring over time?

          I would expect so. Yet MS persists in their behavior so apparently not.

  5. JeffyPooh
    Pint

    "You can even use more than two apps at once – three, to be precise."

    FAIL.

    In a professional working environment, one might need to have a dozen windows open at once.

    1. BrownishMonstr

      Re: "You can even use more than two apps at once – three, to be precise."

      (n a professional working environment you're probably less likely to use the "apps". Even if you do, I can't find a reason why you should need two "apps" open at once.

      1. JDX Gold badge

        Re: "You can even use more than two apps at once – three, to be precise."

        I don't think he understands that an app is not a desktop application.

        1. Mr Anonymous

          Re: "You can even use more than two apps at once – three, to be precise."

          Let me get my cut throat out to see if I can split the hair.

    2. Mr Anonymous

      Re: "You can even use more than two apps at once – three, to be precise."

      21 here across two 24" panels.

  6. LordWilmore

    I am unable to form an opinion on this. I shall await Eadon's sage wisdom

    1. BrownishMonstr

      I'm getting sick of Eadon's name appearing everywhere.

      1. Tom 13

        Re: name appearing everywhere.

        Just don't let it appear in three consecutive posts. That causes him to appear.

      2. Zot

        I agree.

        Some people on here clearly need to get a room with the name, then get over it.

  7. Hillman_Hunter

    Put the start menu properly back

    And Windows 8 will be fine, or watch the slow bleed of home customers to Mac, or Linux or whatever. and Enterprise stubbornly sit on W7 until you bring out Windows 10.

    1. Syx

      Re: Put the start menu properly back

      Going by the "skip one" history of MS, Win10 will also be a flop - Win9 will be the one to switch to ;)

      1. John Haitch

        Re: Put the start menu properly back

        Sounds like Star Trek movies.

    2. Mr. Nobby
      Alien

      Re: Put the start menu properly back

      Yeah, that makes sense...

      Boo hoo, my UI changed, better jump ship to an OS with an even more alien UI.

      1. M Gale
        1. Mr.Key

          Re: Even more alien UI

          Thanks! I always wonder why Linux UI looks so childish. Nothing has changed in 10 years... or maybe 12. Can't remember exact time when I started to play around with Linux. Those screenshots remind me year 2006 when rounded corners were cool. (Remember websites with tr/br/bl/tl.gif-s?) As well as that very, VERY oldscoolish glass hover effect. (Or whatever it is callled - remember photoshop masks tutorials?) And that centered gradient in the background with stripes - certainly an awesome UI masterpiece! Certainly, not alien UI.

          1. M Gale

            Re: Even more alien UI

            Well if you really want to go full ReTard, it can be used in toy mode too, if for some reason you can stomach that sort of thing on a bloody big non-touch monitor.

            I don't see Microsoft offering a UI choice through their app store. In fact everything so far seems to be how we're all going to love having a toy UI with bouncy animated shit all over the screen and programs that might or might not be in memory, and might or might not have remembered what you were doing with them.

            I guess if you like that sort of thing, who am I to tell you otherwise?

  8. Beau
    Holmes

    Layering on the lipstick

    As you say 'Layering on the lipstick".

    Now they just need to learn, however much lipstick you put on a pig, it's still a pig!

    1. Tom 13

      Re: Layering on the lipstick

      I think Phyllis Diller could have gone years without buying more if she'd owned as much lipstick as they've put on this pig.

  9. Anonymous Coward
    Facepalm

    How can they claim to listen to what their customers think when their customers have been screaming for a Start Menu and they're still not providing one? FFS, have they gone totally insane? Are the execs all sleeper agents trying to bankrupt them? what other explanation could there be for this madness?

    And they wonder why they're hemorrhaging money these days...

    1. JDX Gold badge

      Their customers have not been screaming for a Start Menu. Reg Linuxtards have been screaming about how Windows users are apparently screaming for it.

      In actuality, the lack of the Start BUTTON is the single biggest confusion to users. A giant screen full of applications and documents is pretty intuitive - click on the thing you want - but getting to that point is the sticking point because many people aren't aware of the windows key.

      1. hplasm
        Meh

        "Their customers have not been screaming for a Start Menu."

        True. They are Win8 customers, and therefore merely screaming because of that.

      2. Khaptain

        @JDX

        >A giant screen full of applications and documents is pretty intuitive

        I would consider a giant screen full of applications very counter productive. It takes too long to find things, scanning a screenfull of icons is a nightmare when looking for a seldomly used program

        This is one of the areas in which the original start menu was excellent and still is. Neat, short alphabetical listings/folders are far easier to scan.

        Regardless the point still remains that MS should give us a choice, TIFKAM or the original Start Menu, then everyone would be happy.

      3. Gray
        Angel

        No need to read!

        Ahhh, yes, a giant screen full of applications! Exactly the same paradigm once proposed by a Vice President at Encyclopaedia Britannica: "Why don't we just print index pages with colorful pictures of each topic/subject, over-printed with the volume/page location? we'd save our users all that pesky bother of reading listing after listing! Just take a quick glance for the proper icon and they're off to their reference ... right? RIGHT?"

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Thumb Down

        Re: "In actuality, the lack of the Start BUTTON is the single biggest confusion to users."

        No, it really isn't. Switching jarringly from one familiar GUI to another touch-based, complete different and rather crippled one on a non-touch device where it's neither needed or wanted is the source of the confusion. If Microsoft wanted to experiment with a new paradigm for touch devices, that's one thing. Suturing two completely different GUIs together like a Human (Input Device) Centipede? That's another, and they can keep it.

      5. Ged T
        FAIL

        Why do you make out the Windows 8 user is to blame?

        "In actuality, the lack of the Start BUTTON is the single biggest confusion to users. A giant screen full of applications and documents is pretty intuitive - click on the thing you want - but getting to that point is the sticking point because many people aren't aware of the windows key."

        Blaming the user, because they are unaware of a 'feature', should underline the fact that this UI/UX are NOT intuitive: that's a 'Fail' perpetrated by the vendor, not the end user!

        1. Nick Thompson

          Re: Why do you make out the Windows 8 user is to blame?

          In what way was he blaming the user? He was blaming the lack of the start button which would puts the blame on Microsoft for omitting it. Next time actually try reading what you quoted?

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "get ready for some interesting surprises when you get back from lunch."

    "You will also be able to use the camera to take pictures from the lock screen without logging in, so get ready for some interesting surprises when you get back from lunch."

    No sh*t! But that is this 'feature' for exactly? Spying on your cube mate...in an 'Office Space' world?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "get ready for some interesting surprises when you get back from lunch."

      "No sh*t! But that is this 'feature' for exactly?"

      It's 'cause iPod/iPad/iWhatevers can do that right now. Make sense if you want to take a quick snapshot with your iPhone. Makes you look stupid if you want to take a toy camera quality picture with your iPad. Makes no sense if you own a freaking laptop. Is totally asinine if you have a desktop.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "You can even use more than two apps at once – three, to be precise."

    Anyone know why its fixed at 'three, to be precise.'...?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "You can even use more than two apps at once – three, to be precise."

      Primitive people count things in three steps - "1, 2, many"

    2. Paul Shirley

      Re: Anyone know why its fixed at three

      ...any less and there'd be no improvement to SHOUT about, any more and they'd train PC users to expect more than shitty resolution Win8 tablets and WP8 phones can deliver...

      It's hard to actually improve your product when it's design exists just to advertise another, different product ;)

    3. Wang N Staines
      Trollface

      Re: "You can even use more than two apps at once – three, to be precise."

      They hard coded 3 into the loop.

  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "unified search results from your apps, files, SkyDrive, actions you can take, and the web"

    Won't this slow down file searches and make them endlessly slow....?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "unified search results from your apps, files, SkyDrive, actions you can take, and the web"

      "unified search results from your apps, files, SkyDrive, actions you can take, and the web"

      "Won't this slow down file searches and make them endlessly slow....?"

      Designed to send personal info and usage direct to MS for selling on.

      1. Richard 12 Silver badge

        Re: "unified search results from your apps, files, SkyDrive, actions you can take, and the web"

        More to the point, didn't they hear what happened when somebody else did that?

        The most annoying annoying thing about any search function is when it returns too many results, so anything that gives you more results is only going to be more annoying.

        Stand by for "Word" to become the most-clicked term on Bing...

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "new apps.. will no longer automatically appear on your Start screen"

    "When you install new apps in Windows 8.1 – assuming you ever do – they will no longer automatically appear on your Start screen. Instead, they will appear on the Apps view, where they will be flagged as new, and you can add the ones you expect to use often to your Start screen manually."

    Question:

    How will institutions that have hundreds of apps set-up their Win8 systems i.e. Universities...?

    A hierarchical start menu system was ideal before...

    1. mmeier

      Re: "new apps.. will no longer automatically appear on your Start screen"

      Like they do today - generate a setup once and use the proper tools to clone it to the workstations. Not that a University is likely to use many apps. Maybe mail and chat. The rest are applications.

    2. This post has been deleted by its author

    3. yossarianuk

      Re: "new apps.. will no longer automatically appear on your Start screen"

      By Migrating to a sensible system like Linux + puppet.

      1. mmeier

        Re: "new apps.. will no longer automatically appear on your Start screen"

        Does this run an equivalent to

        ViaVoice (Or even the build in Windows Voice recognition)

        Handwrite-Recognition with full support of Inductiv Digitizers

        MS Journal / MS Note

        Outlook or Notes

        The latest EgoShooter

        ArtRage

        And no, running Windows Emulators do not count otherwise my T731 is an Android tablet

        II not - it is not a sensible system for me

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Still the same stubborn old Microsoft.

    They are still pushing this metro crap and not even remotely addressing the REAL problems. They have bombarded with the press with mentions of start menus in the hope the PR message will be translated into "all is now well with Windows 8".

    There is only so long they can live on "licences shipped" numbers before the more easily fooled see what's going on.

  15. Khaptain

    Listening to customers -- What a joke

    How many of those customers asked for a Proxy start menu ?

    FFS there are million so users that are used too and love the traditional Start Menu. WTF can't they actually listen to the millions rather than listen to marketing bods.

    This who Touch Screen crap is becoming a f****ing joke. Mice and Keyboard are fine,

    Corporates don't want/need touch screens and corporates are where the money really lies, because they are the biggest users of MS Office ( Office is the real money spinner).

    W7 is fine, so I will remain here until this shit all fizzles out.

    ( PS : I have W8 on a secondary machine but it still pisses me off 6 months down the line, I am not being stubborn I just don't find the interface as productive as W7)

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Good thinking

    "There are also options to change what the corners do"

    OK, so the invisible commands that hide in the corners now do different things on each machine. Good thinking.

    1. BrownishMonstr

      Re: Good thinking

      Well, that's up to you. If you don't want to change the corners then fine. If you do then it's up to you...oh and I'm assuming the corners' setting may sync on each device.

  17. Herby

    A place for everything, and everything in its place....

    Yes, Virginia, touch is here to stay. That is all fine and dandy, but when people sit down and want to do WORK they have no need for a touch screen which takes reaching for the large screen they are used to having in front of them. If you aren't holding the screen, touch really doesn't make ANY sense, no matter HOW much lipstick, mascara and gold plating they do to the operating system.

    Those who have offices or cubicles who use computers use the mouse (or the occasional trackball) as the pointing device since it takes little hand movement from the keyboard. Maybe if Microsoft mandated that those who created W8 actually had to USE it on small screens and using touch they might figure out a different interface.

    So, yes, fondleslabs and smaller devices exist, but work gets done with a keyboard, mouse and a nice large (1920x1200 pixel in my case) screen.

    1. Someone Else Silver badge
      Meh

      Re: A place for everything, and everything in its place....

      ...or maybe more than one nice large (1920x1200 pixel in my case) screen.

      1. Tomato42
        Joke

        Re: A place for everything, and everything in its place....

        You're a funny little man, it's obvious that there are no screens larger than 1920x1080, after all, this is the resolution that fixes the problem ONCE AND FOR ALL

    2. mmeier

      Re: A place for everything, and everything in its place....

      And the problem using Win8 on this setup is?

      Oh right, there is none. Works fine with keyboard and/or mouse as well.

    3. nuked

      Re: A place for everything, and everything in its place....

      Equally, anybody purchasing Windows 8 for use in an operational environment wants sectioning.

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    The whole 'touch'thing is a red herring anyway, people got it in to their mind that this was the 'future' and a mouse and keyboard was 'the past'.

    Fact of the matter is touch is good for mobile devices and web browsing, but have you any tried to do any work on a touch device? It's a painful experience, and you will find yourself begging for a mouse and keyboard soon enough. Ironically MS were one of the few to listen on that front and the Surface is probably the most productive 'slab' out there.

    1. mmeier

      MS does penables (or more exactly an OS for penables) since the last decade at least. And those units can be very productive "on the move" since they are a electronic legal pad that can be used EXACTLY the same way as one and everywhere I can use one. Surface and the similar tablet formfactor units from Samsung/Lenovo/Fujitsu/Dell are just the latest incarnation.

      And if I sometimes need the full notebook - out comes the BT keyboard/mouse and there is a 10 or 12'' notebook. If I know a 50:50 split in notebook/tablet is my typical user profile I buy a convertible instead (Vaio Duo11, Taichi, T-Series). If the split is desktop/tablet a unit with a good dock (Helix, TPT2 or Dell L10)

      Sharepoint (company use) or Skydrive (privat use) sync data between the penable and the big desktop box nicely. And since the data generated in Journal or OneNote can be read and annotated on other Windows units (Win7 and up at least) data exchange with co-workers using classic desktops is no problem

  19. Christopher Rogers
    Windows

    This really doesn't sounds like MS have caught on to what is about to kill them in the consumer OS market.

  20. ecofeco Silver badge
    WTF?

    Building on IE 10?

    IE 10 is FAIL. We have banned it from our office.

  21. Mark 110

    Baffled

    I am baffled by everyone going on about how they "loved" the start menu. It was rubbish. Have you actually used Windows 8??? The best thing about it is finding and opening the application you want - the old Start Menu was useless unless you spent ages keeping it organised (which I did for a while but got bored doing silly unnecessary admin)

    As it is I have 14 apps pinned to my task bar and plenty space for another 20 more. If I need anything else its a quick search and click - all that poring through cascading menus is no more - its wonderful.

    WTF is your problem? Try using it for a bit before you curse it to hell.

    1. cmrayer
      Happy

      Re: Baffled

      Totally agree, been using 8 since the launch on non touch multi screen PCs and the only things that annoyed me were:

      No start button, the bit to get to it at the corner of the screen was too small - FIXED

      Apps took up the whole screen even if it was a 27" monitor - FIXED

      Only one app visible at a time (you can have as many as you like running and use win+tab to switch) - FIXED

      I'm very happy now!

      1. Moeluk

        Re: Baffled

        Remind me again, when was the last time you bought any product, other than Windows 8, that you had to fix 3 things on?

        Did you have to resolder the remote control for your TV set when you took it out of the box?

        Screw on the handles to the last set of saucepans you purchased?

        Did I have to change anything to get OS X to work as expected when I installed it last time...

        No....so how can you say that the shipping product is fine?

        1. Mark 110

          Re: Baffled

          I didn't say everything was fine - I said I was baffled why people want the Start Menu back - getting rid of it is a good thing.

        2. cmrayer
          Happy

          Re: Baffled

          So, you've never had a remote that wasn't ergonomically perfect, never had a saucepan where water got under the handle on the lid when you washed it, like the silly dock on OSX that gets over full once you have more than a few applications etc.

          Win 8 was better than 7 and now 8.1 has a few good tweaks.

          :-)

    2. Terry 6 Silver badge
      FAIL

      Re: Baffled

      Win 7s Start menu was not all of the issue. Software designers that made placing launch icons difficult or impossible was/is the other half of the problem.

      Every package dumps a whole folder right on the start menu, with several icons for all sorts of stuff that isn't even useful. Then and only then Win 7 made organising these much more difficult than it neeed to be..

      What users needed was an easy way to enure that only the icons to launch programmes hit the menu. And then organising themwas to be quick and intuitive.

      1. Paul Shirley

        Re: organising themwas to be quick and intuitive

        Using drag'n'drop directly in the Start Menu seems about as 'quick and intuitive' as it's possible to get. A few seconds dragging after installers work their damage is hardly a burden. What bizarre and perverse other method did you try? Haven't worked out how to do anything useful to organise the Metro version (without directly hacking the underlying folder structures) and perhaps 25% of my installed applications even show up in it.

        I'll admit the bloody Win8 UAC prompts can get annoying during multiple alterations. Also not a fan of the Win7 variant - luckily Classic Start Menu has better options. But there's not a chance in hell I'm dropping an n-dimension search structure for that 2.1D visually homogeneous sea of tiles (.1 for the utterly useless grouping).

    3. BobChip
      Linux

      Re: Baffled

      I did work with Win 8, quite intensively, albeit the pre-release version in Virtualbox, and assessed the OS and it's usability with our key software and hardware - eg 26" non-touch monitors running CAD type applications, and very large format printers no longer supported by MS.

      Which is precisely why we are NOT using it now.

      Way back when I sold stuff, it was drummed into me that the customer is always right. If you don't give the customer what he wants, he won't buy and will go elsewhere. Simples.

      P.S. We have been running everything on Linux since the Vista fiasco, but I always make a point of checking out the competition just in case they start to catch up. They have not. Full stop.

  22. schotness

    Too little too late

    roll on windows 9 or android os...

  23. CCCP
    Childcatcher

    Kids are the future an' all that

    Sample of one 12-year old kid, he's well chuffed with 8 on an Acer S3 ultrabook. Got to grips with it in about, ooh, a nanosecond. Well, quickly anyway. He loves the Mr Bean app though he actually works on it too. His younger sister then went looking for it on her nexus 10, but, lo and behold, it wasn't as good. Their words, not mine. (Lucky kids, but I really owed them the toys)

    I know this doesn't excuse MS ignoring the actual work market, but I can see the dilemma and the conflicting focus group/research feedback. On one side you have anyone young(ish) liking it. The other you have most reg commentards hating it. This isn't about a start button or not to MS, it's about betting for future customers.

    Should they stay or should they go? It looks to me like MS have decided to move on.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Kids are the future an' all that

      Why do people think the reactions of novices and children are the "sine qua non" for judging the Windows 8 interface(s)? Neophiles and children like bright shiny objects. They LITERALLY don't know any better. I don't want interfaces designed by people who think the hand-waving in "The Minority Report" was cool. Yeah, try doing that for a couple of hours a day.

      1. CCCP
        WTF?

        Re: Kids are the future an' all that

        Uhm, children may be evil, mine are too sometimes, but chill out on the stake burning. Also, not sure where you are, but 12-year olds, mostly, have already had a skinful of 'puters, mine included. XP in fact. So this (yes, sample of one) was a proper transition. MS office and all.

        Secondly, I was trying, not so well it turns out, to point out MS' dilemma. This dilemma may explain their seemingly half-arsed attempt at "fixing" 8. To a big chunk of people it just doesn't need fixing.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Kids are the future an' all that

        "Why do people think the reactions of novices and children are the "sine qua non" for judging the Windows 8 interface(s)?"

        Reminds me of how Kodak established the speed rating for black&white Tri-X film. They had panels of people off the street choosing which print quality they liked best. They chose the rather grey ones - which is basically what they were used to - from the usual chemists' processing.

        Professionals and serious photographers had to derate the speed setting to get the maximum dynamic range that gave crisp whites and blacks.

        The man on the Clapham Omnibus is content with poor quality if that's what he's told is "good".

        1. Heathroi
          Thumb Down

          Re: Kids are the future an' all that

          No thats not right at all. if people are faced with something radical, they are not going to happy about switching if there seems to be no obvious killer advantages . There are people who might buy a early 70s cortina but the people who would buy that over a new focus or anything else made today are very far between. MS has shot itself because it was only thinking of what would be good for MS and sod anyone else.

    2. JP19

      Re: Kids are the future an' all that

      "I can see the dilemma"

      That isn't the dilemma. They could put the start menu back in and make both optional. Classic shell puts the start menu back in for free - are you telling me that doing the same would stretch Microsoft's technical abilities?

      TIKFAM is in Win 8 to force it on to their captive desktop market in order to promote it, apps, and their store on fondleslabs and phones - no other reason. The dilemma is how much they dare piss off their existing desktop customers for the sake of promoting TIKFAM and their answer seems to be a LOT.

      Adding a graphic of a start button isn't a step in the right direction it just makes the shitty TIKFAM interface easier for the bewildered to find.

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Screw that

    Unfortunately MA's SecureBoot (where you have to accept the EULA before installing another OS) and the incoming HTML5 DRM will still lock folks into this shit.

  25. P. Lee
    Joke

    "... you can even run multiple instances of the same app on one screen."

    Wow.

    This is an amazing OS!

  26. Nathan 13
    FAIL

    Windows Flush

    Whether its 8.1, 8.2 etc etc it still goes down the pan just the same as 8.0

  27. Infernoz Bronze badge
    FAIL

    So.. Stardock will keep getting business to fix Windows 8

    This guarantees that I won't upgrade, very strongly suggest no one else does, and will blacklist any Windows device supplier who does not provide easy and free downgrade to Window 7.

    Microsoft are sinking, they are too stagnant to admit that they completely failed with the Windows 8 UI; even tablets look stupid with it!

    1. MigMig

      Re: So.. Stardock will keep getting business to fix Windows 8

      I'm going to blacklist them too because you suggested it and because MS hasn't graced us with the eye candy commercials we deserve. I mean, who do they think they are? If they want me back as well as many others they lost they need to invest on commercials with the sexiest actors/actresses money can buy. Hiring someone like the hunger games whatsherface chic would be a good start. I'll even settle for dancing mascots (like California Raisins or Kia's hamsters). Now THAT'S what the angry mobs really want; no one cares about software updates.

  28. Paul Shirley

    a conforting change list

    Not one actual problem I have solved.

    Not one hint of any change to the underlying OS.

    Not one reason I need to install this at all... that's comforting ;)

  29. Daniel B.
    Facepalm

    Start button yes, Start menu no

    That's all we need to know. That is, they didn't listen in on user feedback, or listened the same way Jobs did: hearing what they want to hear.

    Meanwhile, the one sole person that did like Win8 switched out to Linux Mint anyway!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Start button yes, Start menu no

      "Meanwhile, the one sole person that did like Win8 switched out to Linux Mint anyway!"

      Bullsh*t!

      Here's a question, of all you trolls out their, how many actually HAVE a win8 machine?

      None of them!

      Listen to no one! Believe nothing you hear!

  30. IGnatius T Foobar
    FAIL

    Still Metro, still unwanted.

    This is what Microsoft *failing* to have a "New Coke Moment" looks like. They refuse to simply back off and admit that users DO NOT WANT a badly done tablet-like interface on a desktop computer.

    Metro needs to go away completely, or at least be placed a couple of deliberate mouse clicks away.

    1. veti Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: Still Metro, still unwanted.

      We've been here before. The reaction to TIFKAM is eerily reminiscent, to me, of the reaction to the ribbon in Office. MS didn't back down on that, and much to my personal disgust it doesn't seem to have done them any harm.

      I predict this will work out the same way. A lot of heat, not much light, and when the dust settles we'll all be using Win 8 or its successors - without a start menu - and getting used to it, because there's no real alternative.

      I don't like it, but i have no idea how to do anything about it.

      1. dajames Silver badge
        Windows

        Re: Still Metro, still unwanted.

        The reaction to TIFKAM is eerily reminiscent, to me, of the reaction to the ribbon in Office.

        On Win8 you can at least install a 3rd-party start menu ... I don't know of any good way to rid Office of its cursed ribbon and put the menu back!

        1. captain veg Silver badge

          good way to rid Office of its cursed ribbon and put the menu back

          Doesn't completely rid Office of its cursed ribbon, but it does put the menu back.

          http://www.ubit.ch/software/ubitmenu-languages/

          -A.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          AAAAAARRRRRRGH!

          "The reaction to TIFKAM is eerily reminiscent, to me, of the reaction to the ribbon in Office.

          On Win8 you can at least install a 3rd-party start menu ... I don't know of any good way to rid Office of its cursed ribbon and put the menu back!"

          I hated the ribbon. Most people hate change.

          Now using the ribbon, actually, it works better.

          New things take time to learn and its hardly a rip out a replace change.

          One thing is for certain, our youth certainly are a whinging bunch of ladies!

          All of them PWND by apple!

  31. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Touch?

    Thanks MS but I'm giving touch, the finger

  32. flobadob
    Thumb Down

    Crap

    Windows 8 is crap. Allways was, allways will be. End of. I can't use it easily. People I know can't use it at all and I've had to install w7 for them. Utterly garbage. I'm a Microsoft fan - I develop Microsoft applications for a living but Windows 8 along with the lack of desktop application developer certifications for Visual Studio 2012 has pissed me off. Get a grip Microsoft or you are going to end up freefalling soon.

  33. Anonymous Coward
    Alien

    Windows 8 - "It just WORKS"

    Been using Windows 8 since launch - both personally and professionally - it's fine.

    Nobody likes change - it doesn't mean it won't happen - good or bad.

    I had to smile at the "we listened" part - 99% of complaints are about the lack of a start menu, so what do they do? Not give you the old start menu back which would have a) pleased 99% of complainers and b) be used as an "incredible u-turn" stick to beat MS with. Can you see Apple making such a massive u-turn? No. It's not going to happen. Look at what happened to HP's cancelled tablet....

    Install Classic Shell if you want a start menu or Start-8 - problem solved. Or go buy Win 7 and install that.

    Market research SHOULD be about finding out what customers want and delivering THAT, but all too often it's about making the product you think they want and then trying to convince us we NEED it.

  34. RAMChYLD
    Boffin

    Flying Toasters

    "As far as we can tell, however, there will not be an option to replace this slideshow with an animation of flying toasters."

    So After Dark still won't work on Windows 8.1 then?

  35. This post has been deleted by its author

  36. Rattus Rattus
    Thumb Down

    Too little change, still too much Metro

    "you can now configure your entire system from PC Settings without dropping into the desktop"

    Well that's nice and all, but how about the other war around? Can I configure my whole PC from the Control Panel so I don't have to dip into NotMetro? Because that's the way around I want it.

    "There are also options to change what the corners do"

    That's nice. Can I change them to doing absolutely nothing? 'Cause "hot corners" are a fucking ridiculous idea and nothing more than a pain in the ass from a usability point of view. While you're at it, can you please remove the fucking "Charms bar" and return its functions to more sensible locations? Like in some kind of menu, for instance? You could call it, oh I dunno, the "Start" menu, perhaps.

  37. Rattus Rattus

    Oh, and also:

    This unified search thingummy - can I set it to use Google search instead? 'Cause Bing is kinda pants and I am not going to use anything that defaults to Bing.

    1. HipposRule

      Re: Oh, and also:

      Bing maps has features sorely lacking in Google - OS view for a start where you can actually work out which way a minor road goes (hint - it's in yellow) rather than having to guess in Google.

  38. Winkypop Silver badge
    Devil

    Windows 8 ?

    Don't get me started !

  39. darklordsid
    Facepalm

    Lipstick on a pig...

    ... and it will definitely look better than Ballmer... or better than Windows 8.x? I don't know.

    What I know is that adding utter mockery (licke this farce start button) to the unmitigated Windows 8 disaster rather than listening to users asking for hierarchical start MENU back, is the attutude that is quickly killing Microsoft.

  40. Dennis Wilson

    Microsoft have a strong history of producing a product that falls outside customer demand, Windows 8 is a prime example. If they would only listen.

  41. This post has been deleted by its author

  42. Nick Ryan Silver badge

    Bah!

    "But we also recognize there are many non-touch devices in use today"

    As in 99.999%(*) of the things are non-touch. Which makes targetting an OS UI so that it's only properly usable on (smallish) touch screen systems a stupidity of amazing incompetence levels.

    "The new tip appears anytime you move the mouse to the bottom left corner of the screen, and is always visible on the taskbar when on the desktop."

    Always visible in the desktop mode is a good start. Invisible buttons (and actions) in arbitrary places on the screen are still an example of some of the worst UI design possible. If a user is not using a mouse, how are they meant to know that an arbitrary screen location has any functionality or what it is? For those rabid lovers of keyboard only interfaces or MS shills... it is very important that all actions are obvious or accessible to users. Users are not telepathic; They have many experiences, expectations and capabilities and presenting a largely blank screen to a user and expecting each one to somehow "know" to thumb the correct spot on the screen takes UI design incompetence to a new level. Even I had to google, using my phone as the computer was unusable, to find out how to unlock the ****ing lock screen on Windows 8 the first time I came across it.

    * Just an air plucked figure, but just as likely to be correct compared to many statistics.

    1. BrownishMonstr

      Re: Bah!

      As in 99.999%(*) of the things are non-touch.

      Perhaps, but if there was no support from software then the manufacturers won't support touch because it would just make the product unnecessarily more expensive. Touch is the way forward, in my opinion, and I can remember reading an article that states no one thought the mice and keyboard would catch on—unfortunately I can't find the article, so apologies.

      1. Nick Ryan Silver badge

        Re: Bah!

        Supporting touch is good. Even Windows 7 made huge strides on that front.

        Crippling the functionality of an OS's UI so that it's only properly usable on a touch screen, that's not so good.

        1. mmeier

          Re: Bah!

          Guess that is the reason MS did not do it. Win8 works fine with keyboard, mouse, stylus and (at least from what I heard) touch

  43. This post has been deleted by its author

  44. yossarianuk
    Linux

    Meanwhile Mint15 is a usable desktop and free

    KDE 4.10, Cinnamon 1.8 even Gnome 3.8 are better and more usable desktops.

    They are also free.

    Why would I want to run Windows 8.x ?

    1. mmeier

      Re: Meanwhile Mint15 is a usable desktop and free

      Because I need working

      Speech Recognition

      Handwriting Recognition

      An OS with an API/ABI that will remain stable for more than 18-60month

  45. tempemeaty
    Flame

    The Gates & Ballmer Software Circus

    IMHO this faux start button is these two Microsoft clowns mocking all of us PC end users, PC technology professionals, the PC manufactures and shoving it in our faces.

  46. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What Gives?

    Is Eadon on holiday or something?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What Gives?

      No.

      His Windows PC crashed.

      Disk error.

    2. mmeier

      Re: What Gives?

      Eadon is sitting in the "How to I make Linux and PenguBoys/Gnuliban look bad" seminar in room 4711 here at MS HQ. Right in the first row like he always did. One of my most eager pupils, even brought me an apple.

    3. BrownishMonstr
      Thumb Down

      Re: What Gives?

      Downvoted....because of the Eadon joke.

      1. mmeier

        Re: What Gives?

        What yoke?

        1. BrownishMonstr

          Re: What Gives?

          Any joke about Eadon and his love for Microsoft or whatever. It's appearing too much in the forums and it's getting quite annoying.

          It's like a variation of Godwin's Law, as a forum for an ElReg's story which mentions Microsoft/Apple/Linux gets longer, the probability of a reference to Eadon approaches 1.

  47. BobChip
    Linux

    Fundamental question..

    Just how many times can a manufacturer screw it's customers over and still expect them to remain customers? MS probably hopes the answer is 42; I suggest the true number is (95 + ME + Vista + Win 8.....?) less than 5 or 6.

    The big issue for MS is not that it has to patch up Win 8, which of course it will do, but that it has lost the confidence of its customers. Users who have had the temerity to try alternatives (Osx, Linux) quickly discover that Win is not the only viable OS out there, but also that it is by no means necessarily the best. These users are not going to come rushing back to Windows just because it has a start button.

    MS Windows is no longer the de facto automatic choice for the desktop. They will have to earn future revenues on fitness for purpose and merit, rather than by trying to force unnecessary and expensive "upgrade" cycles on hapless consumers and businesses. Seeing how MS has responded to real competition in the past (lawsuits etc.), and their well known willingness to respond positively to criticism, I suspect their future is rather bleak.

  48. This post has been deleted by its author

  49. Doctor Evil
    Happy

    Flying ... toasters?

    "For starters, you'll now be able to show a slideshow of your pictures on your PC's lock screen when you're not using it, either from your local drive or streamed from SkyDrive. As far as we can tell, however, there will not be an option to replace this slideshow with an animation of flying toasters."

    I'll settle for flying chairs.

  50. Sid_the_Kid
    FAIL

    Looks like...

    ...the nice folks at Stardock can relax.

    They'll still be doing a roaring trade in copies of Start8 - and good on them. Takes W8 from being a jarringly clunky thing to a decent incremental upgrade from W7.

  51. crtc
    FAIL

    Never fails..

    Nice to watch another major company destroy its leading product by employing morons.

  52. Gatt

    There should have been 2 separate and completely different Windows 8 releases:

    The touch feely version (RT) should have been exclusively for Tablets / Surface devices

    and version that doesn't come with the touchy-feely IFKAM - built upon Windows 7 - Start Menu and all..

    The certainly shouldn't have put TIFKAM anywhere near a server OS such as 2012!

    1. mmeier

      And what version for

      Fujitsu T-Series

      Lenovo X230 and Helix

      Asus Taichi

      Sony Vaio Duo 11

      ...

  53. Moeluk

    System Restore? A leap forwards or backwards?

    Now i've performed a system restore, to push the registry back on windows 7 many times, when something iffy has gone wrong..and it's taken at maximum about 15-20 minutes...

    One of my friends has just performed the procedure on Windows 8....and 4 hours later it's still going..and apparently this is 'normal'

    Ha! and he wonders why we all have Macbooks at home!

  54. lnLog
    FAIL

    FFS, 'Apps' belong on phones, they do not belong on desktops.

    1. jaywin

      "Apps" definitely existed on the desktop before smart phones were even thought possible. Plenty of references to them in RISC OS back in 1992.

      http://www.guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/riscos311

      1. M Gale

        GEMAPPS?

        As title.

  55. Combustable Lemon
    Meh

    hmm

    I would be interested to know how many people here have run Windows 8 themselves amongst the people so incredibly enraged about its existence.

    Credibility, some of you may have heard of it.

    1. Paul Shirley

      Re: hmm

      ...and this stock response from the Win8 marketing team is getting tired.

      Been using since launch, still haven't learned to love Metro, the shitty driver support, the bugs in Explorer, the gratuitous and unneeded detheming of desktop mode, or any of the other annoyances. But apparently to merkins like you 'I haven't used it enough' to have an opinion!

      In it's favour: I can finally use all the installed RAM and plugging my phone in doesn't crash it (like under XP). Pity I spent more replacing hardware it no longer supports than the sodding OS cost ;(

      1. mmeier

        Re: hmm

        Had the same problem back in the early 1900s when we switched from carriages to motor vehicles. Had to ditch the old wooden wheels, horse collars etc.

      2. Combustable Lemon
        Meh

        Re: hmm

        Paul, funnily enough my comment wasn't particularly aimed at you was it, are you amongst the people complaining who haven't used it? No, that's what i thought.

        I've had none of the problems you've mentioned with Win 8 so far, It worked fine on all of my (far from current) hardware, all installed smoothly as well. I upgraded rather than fragged my Win 7 install which seems to have gone smoother than previous versions of Windows did when doing this. My opinion funnily enough doesn't come from the windows marketing team, i damn well wish it did... i could use the money. It is perfectly acceptable that some people can like Windows 8, and by the same token people can dislike it.

        Disliking it without using it is somewhat less credible than having used it and disliked it though and i suspect a lot of people in these forums are the former and not the latter and i think this explains why Microsoft isn't listening to their "opinions", god knows i wouldn't.

  56. MC.JustUsBikers
    FAIL

    What MS fails to take into consideration...

    First off as a IT Manager I will not use and will refuse to use any Win8 OS's in the company. It isn't designed for business use.

    MS plans and continues pushing Win8 out to consumers and makes claims it is successful which anyone in IT knows that is propaganda! The only way MS has sold it is through consumer products which really has been unsuccessful!

    As far as I am concerned all that Win8 does is push out bloat ware and advertisement to sell services. It is not designed for business use.

    Contrary to what has been reported in blogs and other resources the PC is not dead and touch screen for business is not going to fly in the IT world. I don't see people sitting at work using a tablet or a laptop with touch screen in an office environment. Plus the additional cost is prohibitive to a lot of businesses.

    Microsoft can push it but as the old saying goes, "You can drag a horse to water but you can't make it drink it!"

  57. JeffinLondon
    FAIL

    FrankenSystem

    W8.1 will make the monster a little less scary... but it's still a monster.

    Ballmer and Gates should be shot for creating this mess of a two headed OS.

    1. Brenda McViking
      Thumb Up

      Re: FrankenSystem

      We have a phrase for it in business.

      "Not fit for purpose"

      Thank god we've just had our IT modernisation program. We'll be using Windows 7 for at least the next 5-10 years.

  58. Adrian Smart
    Coat

    Another terrifying thought...

    To all those who are hoping Windows 9 will put things back on the right track, a horrible thought has just struck me. Seeing the way things are going with Office, what's the betting Windows 9 will be subscription/rental only?

    Coat, because I'm off to Ladbroke's...

    1. tempemeaty

      Re: Another terrifying thought...

      I was thinking the same thing. I wonder how many have had the same thought.

  59. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "URL bar all the time (though not whether it will be returned to the top of the screen, where it belongs)"

    Who says that ths URL bar belongs at the top? You! PAH!

  60. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    For tech types, your complaints sure are weak as water!

    What is wrong with you people?

    Get a life!

  61. Zot
    Meh

    I haven't used Windows 8.

    So I can't comment! ; )

    But what I've gathered from all your responses, is that it's not an OS for a development environment.

    If you write applications for a living, you're not going to be in sliding-box-land, as you'll need several windows open at once all over the place for starters.

    But many jobs simply don't need anything other than a word processor running, or what ever the job's main task demands. Usually the company's own, or off the shelf accounting/sales package will sit there all day. I'm sure Bob or Deirdre from HR would be perfectly happy with, once they've set up the most used icons of course.

    Hmmm... but that's also why companies like Barclays Bank still use WinXP for their staff. It's just an OS after all.

    Oh I don't know what to think about it now! - I'll stick with 7. :)

    1. mmeier

      Re: I haven't used Windows 8.

      Than you have gathered the wrong information. Win8 works as well as and sometimes slightly better in a dev environment that Win7. The desktop is the same so no change there but

      No more need to pin needed programs to the taskbar for quick access - Win Key -> Modern -> Select

      Slightly smaller and faster, interesting in SSD based dev systems where space is still a bit short

      Good buy McAffee and similar performance breaks, build in protection is good enough

      And so on. Nobody develops in a Modern Interface, that is a start menu replacement, quick access tool and maybe for the inter-office chat etc. (Sametime-replacement)

      1. M Gale

        Re: Win Key -> Modern -> Select

        More like Win Key -> Huge list like a badly-designed shopping site from 5 years ago -> scroll -> scroll -> scroll <- scroll <- scroll <- scroll -> scroll -> I know it's somewhere around here -> scroll <-...

        Compared to the Windows 7 approach of Win Key -> I use this program often so it's RIGHT THERE automagically -> done.

        1. mmeier

          Re: Win Key -> Modern -> Select

          And another person who has NOT used Win8 and just repeats the stupid lies some people throw around.

          Not that I am surprised

          1. M Gale

            Re: Win Key -> Modern -> Select

            Quite.

            1. mmeier

              Re: Win Key -> Modern -> Select

              Noch nen Pinguin abgeschossen

  62. MACWINLINO

    Windows another shade of TIFKAM

    Well as a long time Windows user, administrator, support engineer. I have come to the conclusion that MS is losing its mind.

    Improved features in Windows 8 and Server 2012 are ignored because they both look like it was dreamt up by a elephant that uses a Mac while on LSD

    MS if you continue like this I will eventually have to move away, at least now I'll still have a job even if it is telling people how to shutdown a machine

    *Thanks MS*

  63. The Alpha Klutz

    3 apps at once

    woohoo!

    my next pc will probably be a 27" imac at least they still have a real user interface and application/task switching has always been better. imagine having any number of apps on the big screen from 1 to 50. thats what i'll be saving up for. not this windows shite.

  64. T_L_T

    Funny

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73e3Nq9vwM0

    1. Zot

      Re: Funny

      That 'singer' has really bad timing, and it wasn't very adventurous - needs more sleaze! : )

  65. garou1674
    FAIL

    Windows 8.x == Windows 3.x

    When Win8 was previewed for the world, I knew that Microsoft had created another Windows ME/Vista version of their OS. Now, with version 8.1, I am starting to have flash backs to Windows 3.x. Yeah, before there was a Start button or even a Start menu. Hell, let's skip the bloatware called Windows 8.x and go directly back to Windows 3.1. After all, that is apparently where Sinofsky's fondest memories are.

  66. Ron Christian
    Thumb Down

    absolute fail

    There's so much that failed here, I don't know where to begin. The start button -- I had a feeling they would just change the graphic rather than change the behavior. As if the graphic was the issue. How condescending.

    As I write this, I have nine apps appearing on my 1920 X 1200 screen. If I upgrade this box, I will only be able to effectively display two apps. That's such a total wet-fart fail that I am at a loss for words.

    An effective company would fire the person responsible for these decisions. It appears that Microsoft is no longer an effective company.

    At this point, it looks like I'll be using Windows 7 until I just can't use it anymore, and then switch to something else. Maybe Chrome or OSX. What a total incredible botch.

    We actually have a laptop with a touchscreen that's running Windows 8.0. (Because Windows 7 doesn't do anything reasonable with a touch screen.) Nobody uses it because it's very frustrating and time consuming to use, and some things (like comparing data from multiple apps displayed simultaneously) can't be done at all.

    We'll upgrade this appliance to Windows 8.1 because it's free, and then I'll try to find a home for it.

    1. mmeier

      Re: absolute fail

      Currently you have nine APPLICATIONS running on your system. And if you switch to Win8 - you can still have nine APPLICATIONS there. The (current) limit is on Modern apps only not on classic programs. But I guess you know that already, has been said couple of times.

      Touch on a normal notebook or desktop is useless. But nobody is forced to use it or buy this stuff. But that you already know as well, don't you?

      So shove your stupid little lies where the sun does not shine and go bonk a penguin

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