Bacon sarnies can kill: Official In devastating news for bacon sarnie lovers, boffins have warned of the potentially deadly effects of overdoing it on processed meat products. The chilling results of a Europe-wide survey conclude that those scoffing more than 20g of processed meat a day - equivalent to one meagre rasher of bacon - were at increased risk of …
Decent bacon is prepared the traditional way.
Also, cavemen survived on red meat, alongside veg and fruit.
Yet another nonsensical study looking for links between certain food and death. Probably from the same brigade that tells us that fat in foods is bad and oats are good for you.
> it seems that any effort to prolong the shelf life of meat has a negative effect on your when you eat it
Maybe.
But we only know that people in the QUICK DEATH group like to eat government-pushed stuff (through subsidies, though then it is labelled as 'not good for you' in government-issued warn letters) that can be bought for cheap at Tesco's or at the Kebab corner and have otherwise strong correlation to the LOW INCOME/NOT POSH group.
Conclusion to causations are.... open.
Preservatives are there to, er, preserve stuff, which is the opposite of why you eat it - your body needs to break it down to use it. You may as well eat flavoured sawdust. You'll be full, but malnourished and you'll be putting a strain on various systems which deal with breaking the food down. The commercial imperative for long shelf life reduces the usefulness of the food.
Additionally, processing food often leads to changing the nature of what you are eating. So peanut butter may be made from just peanuts, but probably not in their natural ratios of oil to protein. Soy milk may be made from just soy beans and water, but usually its just the soy protein which has been extracted from the beans (because the beans themselves taste nasty) and bound with the water molecules (otherwise they'd separate in transit). The problem is that you may be consuming things in unnatural quantities, which puts a strain on your body's systems - too much fat, too much salt, too much sugar are common culprits - they are cheap to produce and yes, they do taste nice.
Meat is a very efficient way of consuming stuff, but stuff can be good (nutrients) or bad (poisons, fats). Animals are just a way of processing the veg before consumption. Problems increase when your animals aren't given decent things to eat or are otherwise rendered unhealthy. It gets worse since meat is more difficult to preserve than vegetables and poor diet (feeding sheep to cows) is easy to disguise. The meat industry also attracts subsidies for production which skew the market costs of food. The upshot is, the less processing is involved, the less likely it is that someone has messed up your food.
Diet is complicated - too complicated to be definitive but there are some generalisations and lessons to be learnt from statistics. Sometimes, by imposing broad guidelines you can avoid specific but common mistakes. For example, you can eat lean meat from healthy sources. However, going vegan means you cut out most of the sources of excessive fat available and can steer you away from a lifestyle-induced heart disease, which is the main cause of premature death in the West. It isn't just dropping things which helps. I've seen plenty of fat unhealthy vegetarians gorging on cheesecake. Dropping the meat isn't helping that much. However, not relying on meat for your nutrients can be a way to force yourself to look at consuming a wide variety of fresh veg, not just mushy peas from a can. Consuming fresh veg with lots of natural colours, not just white stuff, is good for you. This is why non-gmo is important - we don't want to be duped into eating unripe food by genetic shenanigans.
Personally, I've found that incorporating more raw/barely cooked food and whole grains (e.g. wheat rather than flour) into my diet has provided a lot of benefit. Its extremely planning-intensive, but the results are delicious- which is my main motivation. That's not just raw broccoli, but creative ways of using seeds, nuts and dried-fruit for filling food in tiny portions, compared to say, pasta (which usually implies cheese) which I would normally consume in huge portions. I could do a healthy pasta, but I'm more likely to dump a cheese sauce on it, or use the cheese I bought for it on toast instead. Like awkward change-control, the aim is to force myself to plan properly, rather than try winging it.
> What, you mean those guys who had an expected average life span of little more than a couple of decades?
Well yes, but they were also hunted, didn't have access to modern medicine, etc etc.
I think this is a fairly complex subject. My original point was meant to suggest that we're eating all kinds of crab including sugars, carbs and so forth. I'm pretty sure that cured meats aren't really that high on the list of things we should be worrying about in our diets.
My archaeologist wife is frothing at the mouth, but I won't let her near the computer to comment on what "cavemen" may or may not of eaten, let alone the actual term cavemen. But if you look to the east you might see a large explosion.
Vegetarian diet may lead to a 32% reduction in heart disease, but also a 32% reduction in happiness.
I think you'll find it's a 99% reduction in happiness. All vegetarians secretly eat bacon. It has been scientifically proved that people who don't eat bacon have a mortality rate of 100%!
Also, we've heard all that crap about Quorn being made of mushrooms and the tears of rescued piglets. But we all know that it's really turkey. What else can they do with what people don't eat at Christmas?
"Also, we've heard all that crap about Quorn being made of mushrooms and the tears of rescued piglets. But we all know that it's really turkey."
Mushrooms? Turkey? Soil fungus glued together with egg albumen, which sounds rather unappealing, but works OK as a low fat filler and protein in recipes with a strong flavour from other ingredients. Not sure why I should eat it again, though? No lower in fat than chicken or turkey, not noticeably cheaper, and I've no idea what resources are used to make it (other than eggs).
I'll ponder on that over my 300 calorie butter bean and bacon soup that counts as tea today.
> Vegetarian diet may lead to a 32% reduction in heart disease, but also a 32% reduction in happiness.
Bullshit. When I became vegetarian I very quickly noticed an improvement in my energy levels and general health, with a corresponding improvement in happiness. Most vegetarians will tell you the same thing. Instead of taking easy swipes at vegetarians why don't you find out for yourself by giving it a try.
It's very rare that someone 'just' becomes a vegetarian.
Most likely you also had other significant life changes at the time. Increased exercise being one of the most common changes. Also changes in diet tend to happen in a recovery stage of depression that the person was not aware of. Lastly it also depends on how terrible of diet a person had before, if they were eating 5 pounds of beef and no fibre, then yea the difference will be significant. If the person was eating a relatively balanced diet, then it is unlikely they can tell any difference unless they have a medical condition.
Oh how easy is it getting people to bite, maybe there's a bit of a meat eater in you after all.
I put the predictable vegetarian statement in there to weed out the outraged badge wearing hippy types, as a vegetarian I don't feel the need to ram my opinions down peoples throats, unless of course I wrap my opinions in bacon first and then I find people totally love my opinions.
How can you have a 32% reduction in happiness? You are either happy or not happy, maybe the lack of meat and a poor substituted diet has addled your brain.
I have tried vegetarian diet twice in my life, for about two years each time. Despite following all the guidelines to ensure no lack of key nutrients, both times I was lethargic, bad-tempered, unable to think properly, and constantly hungry despite cramming loads of food in (far more than I would on a meat diet). There was a noticeable improvement on the days I had e.g. a bacon buttie when going on a rally.
I know a datum of one isn't anything, but it does tend to suggest that your "all vegetarians are super-healthy and it is the only way forward for everyone" is - shall we say "hyperbolic"?
Wrote :- "When I became vegetarian I very quickly noticed an improvement in my energy levels and general health"
Maybe the kind of person who is relatively inactive and overweight (your case?) might benefit in this way. However, if you are already active and healthy, cutting out meat is likely to be detrimental. An active vegetarian guy I once worked with looked like a skeleton. He was slowly killing himself. We joked that he walked two paces before his clothes started to move with him.
I am very active. I have an acre of garden to maintain for a start, then I do all my car and house maintenance. I have just replaced a WC for example. I eat loads of red meat, yet I am currently losing weight a bit (following Xmas feasts) and have been told at my annual work medical that I am the healthiest guy on their books. The only thing wrong with my energy level is that there are not enough hours in the day to expend it all.
@Russ
Yep, agree it's a complex subject, the main point I was making but didn't spell out (preferring instead to make snarky comments, sorry LOL) was that these guys for all sorts of reasons never got old enough to be troubled much by diseases like cancer. So they're probably not an ideal control group to compare us against!
Absolute ballcocks. Bacon is pork that has been cured \ corned by submerging it in a brine which typically consist of a combination of sodium chloride and either sodium nitrite or sodium nitrate. The latter two can be an issue if eaten in significant amounts.
Second to that is a link (although only statistical, even though it has been studied no mechanism has yet been identified, the study was by Caldwell Esselstyn) between meat protein and an increase in cancer.
Current evidence does seem to suggest that higher consumption of meat protein (any meat or dairy product) and\or consuming processed foods (containing preservatives) increases your risk of certain health problems.
Having said that I know plenty of farmers in their 80's and 90's who eat a shedload of meat and are fit and healthy. Then again they still work 14 hour days and aren't warming a desk. I don't think it's a clear cut eat bacon and die at 30, I think it's just increasing the risk. Some folks can smoke their entire life and not catch cancer. Plenty more people do get cancer from smoking.
I don't think we need to go crazy and only nibble on grass, but it might be prudent to moderate the quantity of certain foods we eat and most definately improve the quality of many of them (i.e. traditionally smoked bacon rather than chemically smoked, organic eggs and milk etc).
In other research conducted : its is found that almost all living things have a 100% mortality rate!
the exception are: Jelly fish and some weird worm thing which have been found to be biologically immortal.
In other research jumping off cliffs has a high % of causing death especially cliffs with no water below
Maybe, but I tend to think of ketchup as an "American replacement saliva" as their kids don't appear to be able to swallow anything without smothering it in sweet red sauce. I actually quite like Blair's Megadeath on my bacon, but thought that may ruffle a few feathers.
Beer, to quench my thirst afterwards.
"I actually quite like Blair's Megadeath on my bacon, "
Try Danger Dave's Gourmet Insanity sauce, now that will get your tastebuds on the move.
Bizarrely enough Tesco briefly stocked it, but they've since retreated to boring stuff like tabasco, so it's weird deli-shops or mail order only.
Thumbs up for Dave's Insanity. I have it on almost everything savoury I eat. The Naga Jolokia version is even hotter than the normal one. I also feel your "Tesco pain". ASDA have also stopped stocking it. I suspect some namby-pamby nanny-statey do-goodery is afoot. Will have to source an alternative supplier soon. I'm down to the last six bottles in my 'Apocalypse Stash'
Take about a cup of good cider vinegar, put it in a blender with a dozen or so ripe Habeneros (seeds & all), a teaspoon of sea salt (not that nasty, metallic tasting, iodine-infused "table salt"), and about a tablespoon each of honey & turbinado/demerara sugar (muscovado or piloncillo also work, if you can find 'em). A tablespoon of chipotle powder and/or smoked cumin powder adds a nice smoky note, but isn't required. Blend well. Add a little more vinegar, or another habanero or two, if needed, to get a Tabasco-ish consistency. It's usable immediately, but bottle it & stick it in the back of your fridge for a couple months and it just gets better ... A turkey baster with the plastic bit from an eye-dropper stuck on the end works well for re-filling old Tabasco[tm] bottles.
Lovely stuff. Tastes of mango, banana, pineapple, a hint of apple, coconut & vanilla ... Is it hot? Yes! But it also tastes good ... if you can get past the heat. Doubles as pepper-spray. Do not get this on any mucous membranes, above the mustache or below the belt. Unless you're into that kinda thing, of course ;-)
Substitute the fresh chili(s) of your choice, vinegar of your choice, dried chili(s) of your choice, sweeteners (or none!), herbs (fresh & dried) etc. It's cheap, easy, tasty, healthy, keeps for years in the fridge, and no actual cooking required.
OR you can put an end to the DSWs over heat & simply purchase a gallon of pure capsaicin and bottle it. Instant "world's hottest hot sauce". Tastes like crap, though.
"I'm down to the last six bottles in my 'Apocalypse Stash'"
I'm sure we can more imported from the land of the free. So don't keep that stash to yourself - always a joy to share a proper hot sauce with somebody who hasn't sampled such delights before, and watch as their face changes colour.
I think everyone's leaping to conclusions here. With good reason, because it's intuitively true. However...
What if being at risk of cardiovascular disease means that people are more drawn to processed/salty meats? Some kind of genetic mutation that kills you slowly but makes you crave meat and alcohol. Or a parasite p'raps.
Causation, blah blah. You feel me?
Some kind of genetic mutation that kills you slowly but makes you crave meat and alcohol. Or a parasite p'raps.
Funny, I've got this terrible parasite in my head that makes me crave cake, bacon, sweets, beer, single malt whisky, chocolate, steak & kidney pudding, cheese, eggs, ham... And that's just for lunch!
I think it's called a brain, or a tongue or something, and it wobbles about in my head demanding more yummyness.
Except in the discussion on this on the R4 Today program then the figure 3% of deaths that "could be prevented" (I think they mean delayed!) was after taking into account other factors. Another point was that his research was done on European sample groups so wasn't skewed by the much larger meat consumption of people in the USA. However, seemed that sample didn't have enough data to make any comment on processed (i.e. smoked) fish such as kippers!
Do I
a. Eat bacon sarnies, kebabs, steaks and drink beer, wine and spirits then go out with a bang early with smile on my face knowing I have lived my life to the full.
or
b. Eat nuts and berries and drink spring water and live until I am 100 after having suffered dementia for the last 20 years of my life until one day the staff at the home find me dead in a puddle of my own piss.
I recommend you pick B. That way there'll be more bacon left over for me!
I have no plans to retire. Bacon and beer are my alternatives to a pension. Much cheaper that way. Can I claim the tax back on them, as eating them is a charitable endeavour. Saving the weak-willed from temptation?
I am strong-willed. I like bacon.
"Bacon and beer are my alternatives to a pension"
Doesn't matter what you want. The health fascists have all but exterminated fags. Alcohol will be next (eg Dave the Feckless' plans for a minimum alcohol price etc), and after that they'll set about fatty foods, and processed meat.
The only way forward may be a civil war. It's been a while since we've had one, so it would serve to clear the air on a lot of issues.
Low quality science as well as meat can kill. Ignore the report. It's the usual attempt to make some science out of nothing to up someone's published article count and then used by a dumb and stupid MSM to make scary headlines which is the usual attempt to up the reader count on their websites.
With all of the research into the negative effects of processed meat, it will not be long before our government tries to pass harmful legislature to interfere with my right to eat what I want. We must take a stand now, or we will lose this freedom. Once we lose the right to eat bacon, they'll be coming after our right to eat cake and eventually our right to drink fizzy drinks.
If I cannot eat bacon, I cannot make my family happy. We will not be protected from the smugness of those who eat bacon illegally. We will be at risk of seeing calm and collected, level headed immigrants with their bacon cravings satisfied, taking all of our jobs. We will see a sharp increase in violent crime as people go to extremes to fund their black market bacon purchases.
No, we must protect our freedoms. Join the NRA (National Rasher Association) and we can make a stand against our nanny state government. Because bacon doesn't kill people, people (chefs) kill people!
Wouldn't we all, but for breakfast :-
(Price from random website)
T-Bone Steak 12oz - Sale price - £9.10, (plus you need to add fries and fried onions)
Black Farmer, (ok not great), but £2.55 for 8 rashers plus you need to add four slices of bread.
One of these isn't good for a quick early morning feast. The other is great for supper.
Do you remember when the parson used to tell us "you mustn't enjoy sex, it's bad for you, it's only for making babies"? Just that now they're doing it for food.
There is NO way my bacon is going to go anywhere near a place where it could make babies.
There is not enough alcohol in the world to make me.
:)
There are rumblings of research which hint that eating pig is not the best thing for humans, since due to our genetic similarities (possibly due to pigs being omnivores) pigs can play host to a lot of nasty nasty things that are bad for humans. Unlike cows or sheep. It's posited as a possible factor in the low incidences of MS in the Muslim world
Perhaps the Muslims got it right all along.
I think you'll find that they just copied the Jews, who had already been not doing it for centuries.
(Obviously the Apple in the Garden of Eden wasn't the sort that puts a patent on all processes.)
I'm not so sure. Those two groups have been fighting over intellectual property for quite some time now...
But theres tons of Pork sausages and other pig stuff available in Tel Aviv. (Maye be to cater to the Russian Jews, who have no qualms about pork meat).
So you probably refer to the Orthodox ones.
But surely, there must be a good reason for both these clans to avoid (scientific or otherwise).
Ive also read about our genes being 99 % similar, hence , cannibalistic by nature and therefore not suitable?
>More so when processed.
In historical terms, less so when processed. Pig is a very risky item to eat when you don't have proper cooking and cleaning available. Trichinosis is bad stuff.
Nitrates and high levels of sodium are not healthy, but I'm sure that counts for any product that has them.
As a follow-up to this announcement, I think only fair to warn and remind Hon. El Reg readers of the dangers of drinking WATER!
Approximately 99.999999999999999999999999% (allowing for statistical error) percent of humans expire owing to old age!
Approximately 99.999999999999999999999999% (allowing for statistical error) percent of humans drink water, in some form, throughout their lives!
Does it require penguin logic not to rationally assume that Pure Old H20 is in someway responsible for their demise??
I rest my case
<Thinks> Right! Off to the kitchen for a bacon sarmy!</thinks>
Ah, the old dihydrogen monoxide story.
The old ones are the best.
Pfft. In the first place, they think rabbits are poultry.
In the second place, they didn't employ a chemist to assist with their chuddy cohort study. A chemist could've told them about Baconium, an essential element for meaningful human life, which is only found in bacon.
I remain unconvinced.
Is life without bacon life at all ?
Philosophising leads to a lower lifespan !
"This EPIC (European Prospective Investigation into Cancer and Nutrition) study involved ten countries and 23 centres in Europe and almost half a million people. In general a diet high in processed meat was linked to other unhealthy choices. Men and women who ate the most processed meat ate the fewest fruit and vegetables and were more likely to smoke. Men who ate a lot of meat also tended to have a high alcohol consumption.
A person’s risk of premature death (increased risk of all cause mortality) increased with the amount of processed meat eaten. This is also true after correcting for confounding variables, although residual confounding cannot be excluded. However, a small amount of red meat appeared to be beneficial which the researchers suggest is because meat is an important source of nutrients and vitamins"
http://www.alphagalileo.org/ViewItem.aspx?ItemId=129056&CultureCode=en
I can't help wondering about the correlation with "all cause" mortality. Did they not have cause of death information? Could it be that bacon affects your reaction time and gets you killed in car accidents, or perhaps sausages weigh you down and make you more likely to drown?
If they did have cause of death information, then why not look at the diseases that all the commentators have immediately assumed are caused by the great bacon threat, like heart disease and cancer? It makes me think that perhaps the correlation disappears if you do that. They'd then have wasted their time because no-one is going to take seriously a paper that proposes a sausage-drowning theory.
It all looks very suspicious to me.
If the government bans bacon ( for health reasons - of course ), I can foresee the following:
Riots all over the UK
Wife bashings for lack of bacon, consequential divorces (more) at breakfast times and others
NHS running a surplus (beneficial effects of non-pork diets) & health secretary being Knighted.
Mass migration away from the UK.
Illegal smuggling of pork meat. (might lift us out of recession - as a whole new industry)
Breakdown of Social order and 3rd World war over pigs (scarce resources).
All of the above.
EVERYONE has to die of SOMETHING ! A fact some people just don't get. Including doctors.
It's a shame that stories like this don't prompt a wider debate on the desirability of living longer. Or indeed some far-sighted research into a theoretical maximum human lifespan, taking into account the reduced resources available for new lives being ever-consumed by the ageing population.
Somehow I suspect living forever and evolution are mutually exclusive.
This post has been deleted by its author
Bullshit!
It's all just more scaremongering to frighten people into behaving the way they think you should.
There is one website out there (I'm not going to dignify it with a link) that has a calculator to show you how many years your life has been shortened by eating bacon. (according to them, each slice of bacon takes two minutes off of your life.)
I ran the calculations, guaging my bacon consumption as accurately as possible, and the result was that I died in 1989!
So, either it's bullshit, or as someone in another forum put it, I'm a bacon zombie!
To be held at the usual cafe over the usual breakfast which for me will be a doorstop sandwich with bacon and mushrooms covered in a generous layer of brown sauce.
Should I ever get to the ripe old age of my Dad (currently 89) I will no doubt have no NHS left to leave me on a trolley in some corridor to be forgotten about to die, my pension will be worthless, and I'll have to leave the kids with no inheritance, or it'll be taxed to oblivion.
So me thinks I may have two doorstops tomorrow. Then I can go out with a bang at a much younger age.
Cheers!
Tastes nice and is cheap so it must be bad for you.
Given it must be bad for you we are justified in concluding it is regardless of our research not supporting that conclusion in any meaningful way.
Our conclusions will be widely publicised by the media without question. Don't know why we bothered to do any research in the first place....
Science is a bit suspect as there is no causal link given between red meat and early death. Also they admitted that people who eat a lot of red meat smoke and drink more and eat less vegetables.... so are basically more likely to be unhealthy.
In other word, people who are more likely to be unhealthy die earlier - what a shocker! :-O
I bet if they ran a study on how many of the men wore Y-fronts they could find a similar link - yep wearing Y-fronts reduces your lifespan.....
The funding for this study (the red meat one, not y-fronts) is from a basket of funders (number of government departments, some trusts but a lot of heart and cancer charities). So this also raises a question as they all have a vested interest in this coming out bad....
My Grandfather died (of heart failure) at the age of 88. He was drinking his fifth or sixth (daily) "after work" bourbon and had just opened his third pack of smokes for the day. This was in his library after finishing his dinner of mashed taters, bacon and beef stew.
I only hope I can do something similar.
Oh dear !
Two bacon sarnies this morning, with brown sauce, washed down with a mug of black tea. Unhappily, from that excellent cafe at Penrith ( England ), not the champion cafe between Perth and Dundee.
A pint of Fuller's 'London Pride' this evening, and currently working on a medium dry martini.
It would seem I am not long for this World. I can only reassure myself with Groucho Marx's belief - 'No man goes before his time'
Chris Cosgrove
"Other enlightening facts to emerge from the survey were that "men and women in the top categories of red or processed meat intake in general consumed fewer fruits and vegetables than those with low intake", and were "likely to be current smokers and less likely to have a university degree"."
Are we therefore to understand that the analysis of the survey did not take account of other factors that might affect life expectancy? One might expect that wealthier people are eating less processed meat and probably enjoy healthier diets and lifestyles than their poorer counterparts. People with the least money are quite likely to be eating the cheapest processed meat products.
> Reg readers are invited to confirm the truth of another finding, which states: "Men with high red meat consumption consumed more alcohol than men with a low consumption"
I never eat any red meat and I drink several beers every evening. What does that tell you about the reliability of the survey's findings?
"The upshot of all this is that '3.3 per cent of deaths could be prevented if all participants had a processed meat consumption of less than 20g per day.'"
No, deaths are not prevented. At best they are merely postponed, unless they are claiming this is the way to immortality. So before we can make a rational decision about our lifestyle, we need to know just HOW LONG giving up such pleasures as eating red meat, bacon, etc. will extend our lives. I for one don't want to give up everything that makes life enjoyable to avoid a heart attack only to die from liver failure an hour later.
So, researchers, since I don't smoke, am not overweight, don't drink more that two drinks a day, take no drugs (legal or otherwise), have low blood pressure, and am in excellent health at age 63 (despite having enjoyed red and processed meats in my diet), just how much longer would I live if I gave up meat? I bet the answer is in terms of hours, not even days or weeks.
One more question for the researchers: have THEY given up red meat and processed meat? Didn't think so. So stop trying to drum up more research money by worrying all of us. Get a real job.
BMI is one of the worst-of-the-worst pseudo-science "health" thingies. Anyone who uses the phrase can almost always be safely ignored. Consider that Arnold "da Governator" Schwarzenegger's "Terminator" body was (according to BMI) "Obese". Personally, I am about 5'11", and weigh about 15 stone. My body fat percentage hovers just under 4%. According to the BMI, I am obese with a BMI of just about 30 ... In reality, I am quite fit & healthy. I think nothing of spending an afternoon with my hooks, re-stacking the set-of-joints load of Alfalfa that was delivered into the wrong location. My field hands laugh at me, because I actually enjoy the exercise afforded by re-stacking hay bales :-)
During the meanwhile, I'll continue growing, slaughtering, cooking, curing, smoking & eating all things pork.
Could it be that very fat people tend to eat more bacon, and have a higher mortality rate for many reasons, among them the consumption of unhealthy foods, regular alcohol, lack of exercise, vitamin deficiency, tendency to diabetes, heart disease, allergies, internal organ damage, joint wear etc etc ? Isn't the report just stating the obvious, ie. some people care more about their health and some less, and bad habits will cluster round the latter group ?
How did they know the diets of the 26,344 deceased ? "Data" on the living was collected by survey - does that count as empirical measurement these days ? We all know people underestimate their calorie and alcohol intake, because it was in a recent survey, and...
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