This week's BBC MELTDOWN: Savile puppet haunts kids' TV The BBC has apologised for airing an episode of kiddies show The Tweenies featuring a puppet "impersonating Jimmy Savile". Outraged parents choked on their cornflakes on Sunday morning as the offending programme, filmed back in 2001, exposed wide-eyed nippers to "Max" - a character "in a blonde wig, wearing Savile's trademark …
Is "group of people get offended" still news?
You forgot " at slightest upset".
But you think it's bad here, you should try the States - entire "special interest groups" designed to generate the outrage on a scale the Daily Mail can only dream of. If you think OFCOM are bad (and they're largely toothless), you should see the awesome might of the FCC.
Its not as if it was with malicious intent.
The program was from 2001 (IIRC) and was passed at the time as suitable for children. Is someone going to have to sit down and review every minute of every repeat to make sure that no one has been offended by a change in what is acceptable from a few years ago?
And the target audience won't even know who Jimmy Savile was, never mind be offended.
my two children couldn't stop throwing up after watching this episode at the weekend. Took them to hospital three times but the doctors kept turning us away saying it was a sickness bug!
going to write a strongly worded letter to the BBC about this
going to write a strongly worded letter to the BBC about this
NomNomNom,
Let me help you with that letter:
Dear BBC,
I don't hold with all this sex on television. I keep falling off!
Yours,
Colonel Titfield-Thunderbolt O.B.E. D.S.O & bar and looney
"...the book "A complete history of German politics - 1946 to present""
Reminds me of a Family Guy sketch where the German guide was referring to events either side of WW2 but refused to acknowledge anything between 1939-1945.
As for pretending somebody doesn't exist, WWE currently do this for Chris Benoit - they go far as to refuse to show him in matches. If it was a significant match that would otherwise look odd if it was missing (due to the theme of the collection that they compile), I think they may show him but don't acknowledge him.
"but refused to acknowledge anything between 1939-1945"
Bit like those banned cartoons from the 40`s that disney and warner keep trying to forget ever existed. Donald duck as hitler and Bugs bunny in blackface. Their portrail of japanese people is pretty funny as well.
As for this, who gives a shit really, the target audience wont get the reference, to them its just a funny man presenting songs and the program was made before ol cigar fiddler was caught with his pants down.
These stupid, daily mailesque parents are really getting worked up over a non-event and should stop being offended and shocked by every random slipup on the telly.
Ironically, their complaining has probably made sure that this particular episode of the program will be the most watched ever. Well done...
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"Seriously - do people think that there will or should be some huge effort dedicated to excising any and all reference to Saville from the BBC archives or something?"
I imagine the Beeb are treading very gingerly before broadcasting any of their usual BBC2/4 filler of TOTP from various years... Steve Wright is going to find himself very busy topping and tailing performances that are suddenly in need of an intro.
It sees like everytime something significantly bad happens a mistake is made on a channel and an innapropriate rerun is shown. Thats life, it's not intentional. It's a mistake, people need to get a grip!
I bet not a single one of those complaining were abused by Saville. If 'Concerned of Snotting Cockbury' was really that affected they need professional help, preferably from a tug of war team to assist in removing their head from their arse.
You try explaining predatory pedophile to a young 'un
Well wee laddie/lassie:
"Pedophile" is a combination of ped... a Latin prefix indicating a connection with feet (it's derived from pes, the Latin word for foot) and ...phile a suffix of Greek origin which indicates a fondness or attraction to something (derived from philos which is Greek for "loving). So, literally translated it would mean "foot-loving".
"Predatory" is derived from Latin too, it comes from praedator which meant "plunderer" and is used to indicate the behaviour of sneaking about trying to catch something.
So, a "predatory pedophile" would be someone or something with a great love for feet and which spends its time hunting. A centipede perhaps. Millipedes would seem to have an even greater love of feet but as I'm sure you know, they're detritivores and herbivores so couldn't be called predatory.
There have been lots of these Greek/Latin bastard words appearing lately. They seldom serve any useful function, other than to alert the reader to the fact that the author is too ill-educated to differentiate between the classical languages and not adequately literate to express themselves in real words... and for that alone they are invaluable.
(how did I do?)
It's a shame how the BBC panic and back down in all these cases. They even withdrew all episodes of Top Of The Pops featuring DLT due to a 30 year old allegation that is yet unproven.
Yet Challenge TV are still happily showing Big Break. I don't see The Sun on their case. But if the BBC decided to show some footage of racist unfunny "Jimbo" they'd be on their case as quicker than a Davidson marriage lasts.
Erasing Savile from the past won't stop him noncing those kids. It's done, he's dead, he got away with it.
The process by which Savile was deemed to be 'Britain's worst sex offender' was not reasonable. He suffered firstly a trial by media, then Operation Yewtree simply collected all the accusations against him and assumed they were all true. The vast majority of the accusations were only made after the initial publicity against him.
This is certainly not to say he was innocent of everything, and indeed he could even have been guilty of everything. It's just that the process by which we have decided he was 'Britain's worst sex offender' left much to be desired.
There, got it off my chest.
"He suffered firstly a trial by media, then Operation Yewtree simply collected all the accusations against him and assumed they were all true. The vast majority of the accusations were only made after the initial publicity against him."
Seems odd that no one in the media or even police seem to remotely consider there is an ulterior motive in at least some of the cases, such as the money they'll get from the Daily Mail et al.
How many of the accusations are of the like you'd see in Carry On films? Should they be banned and the memory of Sid James be erased too?
Say there is a 1 in 100 chance that a serious sexual assault on a child will be brought to justice - a depressingly low proportion but probaly not far from the mark IF you take within family offences into account.
The probability that 200 independent serious sexual offences will be committed with none being brought to justice is 99/100 to the power of 200 or about 0.13
So how lucky was Jimmy Savile feeling - or are a fair proportion of the allegations poppycock?
Or, was two children playing with toys as normal.
And why did you "have" to explain this to your four-year-old? One of them knocked over the other's toys... what's to explain exactly other than one of them is a little git interrupting the other's quiet playtime?
Get a grip, indeed.
Exactly how many of today's children were offended, or felt violated by this? Presumably none, since the vast majority have no idea who the fuck Jimmy Saville is.
Some people must sit by the telephone, with the Telegraph's number on speed dial (just behind the button for the Daily Mail) waiting with baited breath for an opportunity to be outraged. I feel sorry for "concerned father", who must spend his days rocking back and forth in a dark room worrying about the filth that exists outside his sanitised walls, trying to determine the best way of erasing any memory his children may have of Jimmy Saville from the last 18 months (because before then it Wasn't His Fault (tm) that he exposed his children to Jimmy Saville).
Actually, the Telegraph today presented the story in two small paragraphs on an even-numbered page, 6 or 8, IIRC... obviously the first few pages were all about terrorists. They did have a front page feature trailer about how Boris Johnson feels it is the start of another ice age, though.
Just a few months to go before we get photos of teenage girls in vest tops jumping for joy at their exam results! Until then, will have to make do with critiques of dresses worn at the Oscar ceremony.
And that Cliff Richards Jnr song in Thunderbirds Are Go (the first Thunderbirds movie)?
"Baby, I got friends, so baby listen to me. A shooting star will shoot you, and Mars will go to war. The man in the moon will jump on you, if you don't love me no more."
Now if ever there was a song glorifying violence and domestic abuse towards women, then this is it! A bl**dy good job that when I went to see it as a kid, all I was paying attention to was Thunderbird 2 taking off.
Has our Jimmy been tried and found guilty then?
They guy is dead and the government is probably spending a children's hospital per year to do exactly what about him?
It was an indirect reference to the guy, so bloody what, who cares? Obviously do gooders with nothing better to do.
I had to go to hospital and have intensive psychological therapy due to my reliance on the media to tell me how to think and react to the world around me as I am utterly incapable of forming an independent thought for myself.
The very kind private doctor took one look at me and warned me I would need a prolonged course of very expensive treatment though he did refer me to his brother who happens to run a no-win-no-fee company who will be able to sue the BBC on my behalf for the cost of it.
yes, it is perhaps poor taste, in light of the recent findings, but it's an episode made over 10 years ago. it's a tv show, aimed a small kids who, even 10 years ago, wouldn't have known who Jimmy Savile was, so at the time it could have only have been intended for the benefit of the parents watching the show.
what's next? do we need a Records of Department to eradicate any mention of Jimmy Savile from any tv show ever? should we have a Black List maintained to ensure Gary Glitter is never ever mentioned? or shall we be content which just giving such items an Emotional Content rating and leave it at that?
>do we need a Records of Department to eradicate any mention of Jimmy Savile from any tv show ever? should we have a Black List maintained to ensure Gary Glitter is never ever mentioned?
Well, they stopped doing TOTP some time back... though they've started showing re-runs again.
It's an 11 year old reference to a dead weirdo that no modern 4 year old would understand; but it gives the Telegraph and the like another opportunity to be outraged by the Beeb. Beeb management should grow some nuts,tell them to get knotted and the Telegraph should go back to being a newspaper.
Oh and I should probably get back to finishing the report due this afternoon :0)
The police are supposed to be investigators who offer their results of inquiries (if they can be believed) to a member of the judiciary, or an official inquiry/commission, and THEY make a finding and issue a decision.
With Saville it seems that all the normal procedures have been swept aside and the Plod have become investigators, judge and jury.
Whether the claims against Saville have been proven, or not, since the police have adopted a position against Saville, who has absolutely no one acting for him, their actions are to be questioned.
And why has it taken so long, by so many people, to find their voices? Surely one or two, or their parents, would have acted. It should also be born in mind that way back when Saville allegedly committed these assaults, "putting out" for favours was common.
Doesn't make it right but it surely changes the circumstances.
Chances are that the intended viewers, children, wouldn't even know who the character was supposed to represent, only these faux angry parents who love bitching about anything.
"With Saville it seems that all the normal procedures have been swept aside and the Plod have become investigators, judge and jury."
No, this is how the police have always operated when faced with a public baying for blood, rather than justice. Leak any damning material to the press, along with some hearsay and conjecture, while sitting on any evidence that might cast doubt on the accused's guilt. When the case comes to trial, the average potential juror has already had their mind made up for them. Plod gets a conviction and a promotion, the public get a new hate figure and all it costs is some poor sod his life. By the time the miscarriage of justice is corrected, the perpatrators have resigned/retired/passed away and can't be held to account.
I've just read the Wikipedia article to refresh my memory of one a sublime piece of satire on this topic. In fact, the outraged reaction was even funnier than the broadcast itself. Well worth reading for the IT angle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass_Eye#Paedophilia_special_.282001.29
Highlights:
-Labour MP Syd Rapson related that paedophiles were using "an area of internet the size of Ireland".
-Richard Blackwood stated that internet paedophiles could make computer keyboards emit noxious fumes to subdue children, subsequently sniffing a keyboard and claiming that he could smell the fumes, which made him feel "suggestible". Blackwood also warned watching parents that exposure to the fumes would make their children "smell like hammers".
The reaction:
-MP Beverley Hughes described the show as "unspeakably sick" but later admitted she had not seen it, and David Blunkett said he was "dismayed" by it. It later emerged that he also had not seen the episode, because he is blind.
-The Daily Star decried Morris and the show, placing the story next to a separate article about the 15-year-old singer Charlotte Church's breasts under the headline "She's a big girl now" and using the words "looking chest swell". The Daily Mail pictured Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie, who were 13 and 11, in their bikinis next to a headline describing Brass Eye as "Unspeakably Sick".
You couldn't make it up.
Caught something of it yesterday on BBC News. Seemed to be an investigation into the owners of The Telegraph which led to some fairly strongarm responses.
Time was when The Telegraph was serious if right-leaning paper: obviously against foreigners but appreciative of them especially if they could play cricket with excellent sports coverage. It now seems to have a bigger agenda than any of Murdoch's rags.
Who else is on the BBC's blacklist? Presumably any of the sherbet dippers and dope fiends: Frank Bough, Craig Charles, etc. (I'm afraid I'm not that familiar with the subject); adulterers (Brucey, well the list is probably endless…); petty criminals (Stephen Fry); wife-beaters (Geoffrey Boycott); blokes who have had sex with possibly underage women (all the bands since The Stones and most of the DJs of the 60s and 70s). We'll soon be back to the 1950s with the Light Programme featuring the charts from Chile and Percy Edwards bird impressions (I shit you not this was what was on offer in 1953, i.e. pre-satellite).
We need a catchy new slogan like: "do yourself a favour, stab a Tory today". Just waiting for that nice Mr Worstall to explain to us how this is not hysteria and all in our best interests.
'..We'll soon be back to the 1950s with the Light Programme featuring the charts from Chile and Percy Edwards '
Heh, what makes you think the '50's were so different and so innocent?.
Having had the (dubious) pleasure of knowing(non-biblical) a couple of people involved in TV/Radio from the 'Light Program' era, just be thankful that the 'class' of people that Auntie employed back them were a lot more discreet about their, umm, pecadillos. (Think: Happy Valley Set - but all over the South East).
Let's just say, as an example, the person behind the voice of a rather well known children's TV character from the 50's on has had a rather 'colourful' life, and was continuing to do so when I lost touch with these characters and their stories approximately a decade ago. (The East End adventures with the 'Princess Margaret Set', the drunk Comet pilot - it was the only way he'd fly the damn things, the nights spent drinking George Melly under the table, the orgies.. ye gods, when they got drunk, the stories they'd tell..their 'Light Program' image was an interesting 'nice' veneer).
A certain 'class' of 'media' people have always been amoral hedonists, Auntie was/is full of them, and, as the saying goes, like attracts like, but the beeb didn't have exclusivity apropos these characters.
To protect anyone's happy childhood memories , I also won't mention what I've been told people were getting up to using the Bungle costume at a party in London one weekend whilst Rainbow was still being filmed 'back in the day'.. (Ah feck it, screw your childhood, think: gfur..)
Working as a telecoms Engineer for a major international media corp and working a lot with their switchboard - Yes, I can confirm there are large (2 walls floor to ceiling white board large) numbers of nuts with nothing better to do that go looking for something to be outraged about then calling the papers.
They call it the nut wall here and it's a list of known nuisance nuts who get offended by the sun rising in the morning and feel it should be a page 1 headline denouncing that sort of thing.
Now BBC 3 and 4 are going to have to stop showing the programmes about the Inter-City modernisation in the 1970s which includes lots of Savile and the advertising campaign.
Whatever are all these digital channels going to show now that their stocks of old programmes and series are being contaminated by the unwanted?
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Personally I'm amazed by all the people who seem to be saying that no-one had ever heard of paedophilia or whatever in the 70s... I mean, excuse me. I still remember the suprise we 15 year old boys at my school felt when we were informed that the teacher who we felt was, shall we say, excessively tactile, was getting married... And about three years later at college I remember a comedy sketch at a college concert which featured a choirmaster and a scout master sodomising their charges... Of course we knew this stuff went on.
And in those days when one hitchiked everywhere we always stayed on the alert for drivers who might want more than a bit of company on the road...
I like my Retrogames.
I don't care if some of them might offend some people, if they have Michael Jackson* prancing around rescuing llttle boys, the Twin Towers being blown to smithereens or anything else potentially 'offensive'. They're a part of our heritage and changing anything about them would be wrong.
I'm not for one second going to say Tweenies has any value at all on the same level, but it's not as if it's some horrific footage of Jimmy Saville abusing anybody.
If the BBC are out to cut, re-edit or erase from history each and every reference to the man isn't that more likely to do greater damage than is solves, culling entire episodes from libraries, trying to rewrite history? Isn't that what we need protections against, not some 'offensive' scene.
* I am aware that he wasn't convinced of anything, but people had serious doubts at one point.
Claiming that Fizz looks too much like Muffy Crosswire from Arthur, except with the wrong color palette, once you have a few hits of illicit/pharmacutical drugs? (yes, it's true. I actually once thought Fizz looked a lot like Muffy after taking a little too many puffs of my asthma inhaler in quick succession).
This world needs to get ahold of itself. Times change. Tweenies was created back when that Savile guy (which I've never heard of) still wasn't fingered as a nonce.
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