back to article Eric Schmidt: Ha ha, NO Google maps app for iPhone 5

Google has not made a maps app for the iPhone 5, its chairman Eric Schmidt said this morning - and his company is not working on one. The search engine supremo's snub will come as a blow to fanbois who "upgraded" to the latest Apple smartphone, or installed the new iOS 6 operating system on their fruity gadgets, and found …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Maybe Apple could use BING maps? :)

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Thumb Up

      Smart move by Google.

      You can have an Apple app permanently in development, watch and laugh as iTards slow give up on Apple, because the maps are a deal breaker (which they are) and they gradually work out they aren't the tech leader than some of the press seem to make out they are, and in say 2-3 years when they start approaching 50% of what Google Maps are, they can release it.

      Apple would then be in a lose/lose situation, they would have lost 2+ years of users, and if they reject the app, they will lose even more, if they accept it, it's major and very public eating of humble pie.

      Google could even launch a Google Maps on iOS6 that each time you launched it, it shows a 3 second advert splashscreen of the latest Android handsets from the OHA. How funny would that be....

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Smart move by Google.

        "Google could even launch a Google Maps on iOS6 that each time you launched it, it shows a 3 second advert splashscreen of the latest Android handsets from the OHA. How funny would that be...."

        Awesome, though that would never get accepted by the iTunes police.

        1. Aberdeen Angus
          Happy

          Re: Smart move by Google.

          It'd be better if it was a Jim Bowen soundboard.

          "Come and have a look at what you could have won"

        2. hazydave

          Re: Smart move by Google.

          Google's probably not doing that. But if they wanted to, it's a simple matter of an HTML5 app that detects the Safari mobile browser, and acts accordingly.

          Maps alone aren't the problem. Apple dumped Google Maps largely because they got maps, but not Google Navigation, the SatNav app. Every Android device gets that, and it's very high quality in most places. And thanks to Nokia, Microsoft Phone users are getting NAVTEC SatNav. So this is now a mandatory smartphone function, and Apple's in trouble without it. Sure, they take heat for awhile, and they will probably never be as good as Google. But close enough, someday, and with the required features to seem competitive.

      2. theblackhand

        Re: Maps a deal breaker?

        If Apple can sell a phone that don't work reliably as phones, what makes maps a deal breaker?

        1. Mad Chaz
          Linux

          Re: Maps a deal breaker?

          Because it's the only the apple fanboys are able to find the stores.

      3. Thorne
        FAIL

        Re: Smart move by Google.

        "You can have an Apple app permanently in development, watch and laugh as iTards slow give up on Apple, because the maps are a deal breaker (which they are) and they gradually work out they aren't the tech leader than some of the press seem to make out they are, and in say 2-3 years when they start approaching 50% of what Google Maps are, they can release it."

        They'll just hire the the entire Google Maps team and get them to rewrite it for the iPhone. Whoops, too late, they're already doing that.

      4. Robredz
        FAIL

        Re: Smart move by Google.

        The maps on even a so last decade Symbian Nokia, make Apple's maps look like they were designed by a three year old in a tantrum. Come to think of it, the maps on my Nokia C6 i keep for satnav and a spare are far better, than ones on IoS6

      5. P. Lee
        Trollface

        Re: Smart move by Google.

        Given that google knew this was coming, they should have pulled *all* there apps from ios6 and run a huge advertising campaign. Or got Samsung to run one for them.

        You want to compete against your suppliers? Fine, do all your own work.

        You want to access youtube from ios6? Here, have a flash copy of the video... ;)

      6. Psyx
        WTF?

        Re: Smart move by Google.

        "the maps are a deal breaker (which they are)"

        No they aren't.

        And even if they are a deal-breaker for you, that has no bearing on the millions of customers that never even use them.

        Not every customer is like you. Which is why some customers like different products to what you do.

    2. Ian Michael Gumby
      Boffin

      Bing Maps are Nokia/Navteq Maps

      Apple went with Tom Tom, for whatever reason. Maybe they saw Navteq's maps as part of the competition because Navteq is part of Nokia and they make a competing product?

      Who knows; except that there's more to mapping than the basic data, however it sounds like the stuff from Tom Tom isn't up to snuff.

      1. hj

        Re: Bing Maps are Nokia/Navteq Maps

        Bull, because the tomtom app works really great. Still don't unbderstand where all this tomtom "hate" comes from.

        1. Donn Bly
          Unhappy

          Re: Bing Maps are Nokia/Navteq Maps

          TomTom Hate? No, more like TomTom disgust. I don't have an iPhone and have no inclination to get one, but I am the unfortunate owner of a TomTom. I have found their maps to be so inaccurate, and their update service so pathetic, that a few months ago I walked into a store and bought a competing product. When talking to the sales girl, I told her that my first and foremost requirement would be that it not be a TomTom, because I am tired of driving down U.S. Highways that have been around for years and have it yelling at me to get out of the cornfield.

          1. RICHTO
            Mushroom

            Re: Bing Maps are Nokia/Navteq Maps

            Nokia do have the best mapping software. Just go to maps.nokia.com goto the Capital - anywhere near the Thames for instance - and select the 3D view on the top right!

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Bing Maps are Nokia/Navteq Maps

          "Still don't unbderstand where all this tomtom "hate" comes from."

          Next time you come across a Catalan, try asking them.

      2. JaitcH

        For Tom-Tom ...

        South-east Asia and China barely exist.

        Google has them completely covered.

        Thank you, Google, and for being so current with things in Ho Chi Minh City.

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Stop

        Re: Bing Maps are Nokia/Navteq Maps

        Apple just went with what was left, and stitched it all together to make a patchwork quilt of shite.

      4. hazydave

        Re: Bing Maps are Nokia/Navteq Maps

        With Google tied to Android, and NAVTEQ tied to Nokia/ Windows, TomTom/TeleAtlas was the only major SatNav not already tied to a smartphone platform. Thing I wonder... TomTom is pretty good ... how did Apple core up so short?

    3. solidsoup
      Gimp

      Apple is too fucking greedy for their own good. They could've took over Nokia for 10 billion and change (not advocating it, just a smart business move). This would've given them a map system that rivals Google's and thousands of patents with only a few that deal with corners. Think of all the havoc they could've caused with that? Windows phone wouldn't just be dead on arrival, it just wouldn't happen. Virtually every manufacturer would be paying rent to Apple. At the very least, they could've licensed Nokia maps for a few hundred mil and combined them with their own in-house features, providing their cult followers an experience that rivaled Google's.

      What they did instead was to quickly hack together a product that works worse than Google Maps in 2005. And the reason they did so is because they expect the iFans to swallow it and ask for more. Apple is getting too greedy and cocky and that will be their downfall soon enough.

      1. Frank Bough
        Stop

        Have you actually...

        ...used the new Maps app? It's not all bad, in some ways it's MILES better than Google's.

      2. Sirius Lee

        @solidsoup

        Maybe smart but it would never get past the anti-trust lawyers.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Stop

      Apple still have the lead on apps

      Aside from the much slated Apple maps app, what I would imagine riles Eric Schmidt is Apple's general dominance of revenue generation from Apps.

      Leave aside commercial apps for a minute and consider Apps created by countless dev companies globally - from my experience, developing for Apple iOS first seems to be the order of the day. In fact, usually, it's the only consideration when developing a mobile application.

      It's also arguably stated that developers prefer to create iOS apps because it's easier to generate revenue.

      To coin a horrible marketing phrase, it's easier to "monetize" iOS apps.

      I don't know offhand what the sums are - but I'm fairly sure iOS lead by a long way in terms of revenue generated from app sales, regardless of how many Android devices there are 'in the wild'

      Here's just one source:

      http://www.forbes.com/sites/darcytravlos/2012/08/22/five-reasons-why-google-android-versus-apple-ios-market-share-numbers-dont-matter/

      There's plenty more.

      It's clear that regardless of market share in devices, Apple is taking the Lions share of the bucks when it comes to Apps.

      Just bear that in mind when deriding Apples Maps application.

      1. mhenriday
        FAIL

        Re: Apple still have the lead on apps

        I read the Reuters interview with Eric Schmidt to which Anna kindly provided a link above and didn't find anything there to indicate that Mr Schmidt was in any way «rile[d]». Perhaps, «Matt 89» you are privy to some other evidence and could be prevailed upon to post a link here ? Otherwise, there's a risk that some unkind souls may perhaps be led to think that it was not Mr Schmidt, but you yourself who was perturbed at the attention paid to this failure on Apple's part....

        Henri

      2. UncleJam
        Megaphone

        Re: Apple still have the lead on apps

        In that case go pay for the TomTom App to replace what's free on other solutions.

      3. Gulfie
        FAIL

        Re: Apple still have the lead on apps

        Schmidt doesn't give a damn about app revenue. What he cares about is (a) putting Google technology into as many devices as possible and (b) the ad impressions he can sell on the back of that.

        Google make most of their money from advertising, and having a successful (and soon to be dominant) mobile OS puts them in a position to carry on making money from advertising as desktop browsing continues to wane.

        Apple make most of their money from hardware and are supposed to provide an "it just works" user experience to justify the hefty price premium paid for that hardware. Without decent mapping - actually it isn't the maps themselves that provide the value, its the ability to search for, say, Wagamama and then get walking directions to the one you choose - Apple are going to find it much harder to switch Android users - which in the high-value economies of the West is their target market these days.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Apple still have the lead on apps

          Because iTards of all shapes and sizes are 我侭 (wagamama). I wouldn't be surprised if the founder doesn't even knows what that means. Engrish is funny, but this... hmmmm...

      4. Rob Crawford

        Re: Apple still have the lead on apps

        Sorry but whats your point?

        The maps app is shit, but that doesn't matter as developers of other apps are earning money from iOS.

        I don't quite understand your train of thought.

      5. Mark .

        Re: Apple still have the lead on apps

        "developing for Apple iOS first seems to be the order of the day"

        The problem with your argument is that Apple seems to be catered for first even for applications that aren't sold for money. Indeed if anything, this is more common among applications given away for free, consider the website wrappers "apps", and the applications give to access a company's service.

        So it's nothing to do with monetizing (which seems a poor argument anyway, FUD similar to "But Linux users don't pay for software" nonsense). Nor is it to do with market share.

        "http://www.forbes.com/sites/darcytravlos/2012/08/22/five-reasons-why-google-android-versus-apple-ios-market-share-numbers-dont-matter/"

        The URL tells me all I need to know - if they only pick two platforms, it's a flawed article.

        "Just bear that in mind when deriding Apples Maps application."

        Why? Are Google Maps and Apple Maps paid applications?

    5. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Bing maps? You mean Nokia Maps....the most mature, up-to-date maps available for any mobile device.

  2. Bob Vistakin
    Pint

    iTards can all get lost

    Oh, wait...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: iTards can all get lost

      Grow up Bob. Try a comment that's slightly off your tried and tedious formula.

      1. ByeLaw101
        Happy

        Re: iTards can all get lost

        "Grow up Bob". Yikes, Bob obviously hit a nerve there.... you could be an adult yourself and just ignore the pesky kid ;)

        1. Stubar

          Re: iTards can all get lost

          Or not critisie whilst hiding behind an AC cut out dummy .....

          1. Stubar

            Re: iTards can all get lost

            Bugger, snide comment with spelling mistake.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: iTards can all get lost

          But this comment was actually funny, not just trollbait. "can all get lost" geddit??

      2. sabba
        Thumb Down

        Re: iTards can all get lost

        I thought Bob's comment was quite witty. And at least he didn't hide behind the banner of AC.

        I am guessing the respondent perhaps has an iP5 and perhaps is lost!!

        1. dogged
          Meh

          Re: iTards can all get lost

          And at least he didn't hide behind the banner of AC.

          Well no, but "Bob" "Vista" "Kin" shows pretty much where our Bob lies on the "let's consider the various qualities of these competing products and make a rational judgement on those qualities alone" scale. He registers a 44 on the trollometer.

          Not that my "name" is on my passport either, although at least mine is personally descriptive and not chosen to troll anyone, except those who'd prefer that people give up easily or who like cats.

          1. Bob Vistakin
            Happy

            Re: iTards can all get lost

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkDz4wMI9J8

            1. Mephistro
              Coffee/keyboard

              Re: iTards can all get lost (@ Bob Vistakin)

              "They sued everyone for rounded corners, now nobody can find a fucking corner!!!

              ROFL, literally

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: iTards can all get lost

            "Not that my "name" is on my passport either, although at least mine is personally descriptive and not chosen to troll anyone, except those who'd prefer that people give up easily or who like cats."

            Erm... I take it you're not British then? A dog owner is not exactly what came to my mind in looking at your handle.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: iTards can all get lost

          "I thought Bob's comment was quite witty. And at least he didn't hide behind the banner of AC."

          No difference when you hide behind monikers like "Stubar" and "sabba", genius.

      3. h4rm0ny

        Re: iTards can all get lost

        Hey. That's the first comment from Bob that I've found funny. Let him have his moment of glory. :)

      4. Anonymous Coward
        FAIL

        Re: Grow up Bob.

        Come off it. It was pertinent and very funny.

      5. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: iTards can all get lost

        "Grow up Bob"

        Oh come on, be a sport and accept that was quite a witty one.

    2. John Bailey

      Re: iTards can all get lost

      Well.. now there really is an app for that.

    3. cantankerousblogger
      Joke

      Re: iTards can all get lost

      Given that the iPhone's ubiquity in the gay man's pocket has more to do with grindr than Jonathan Ive's beautiful design, getting lost could get very embarrassing...

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Oh well, there is no usable free alternative for iOS6... there are plenty of paid-for satnav apps, though. Depends on whether you use it to get from postcode to postcode, or if you use it to find shops, museums, etc.

    1. Mark Wilson

      Bing?

      There is a free alternative. Microsoft's Bing contains their maps, maybe not the best but far better than the stock one from Apple and most things are in the right place.

      1. h4rm0ny

        Re: Bing?

        I use maps on my WP7 device (Lumia 710) and they've worked excellently for navigation whilst driving. The voice is always pretty prompt and clear about what turnings are coming up and it's very quick to locate where I am and calculate or update a route. If Apple don't like Google, then they could possibly have licenced maps from MS as these work well. They might not want to work with MS, either. But at least MS would probably agree to sell them the full technology. Apple were basically forced into this by Google which refused to allow them to use the same features that Google themselves were allowed to on Android devices. Basically, Google wanted Apple to pay for a more limited version of what Google has. The Apple maps is a big fuss right now, but two years from now they might have something feature equivalent to Google's maps, but if they didn't do this, then two years from now, they would still be hamstrung by Google deciding what they could and couldn't have on their own phones.

        1. Rob Dobs

          Re: Bing?

          I believe Lumia uses Nokia's own mapping system, which from what I understand is second only to Google.

          I wonder if AAA (American Auto Assoc. for you Brits) has sold their maps to someone. Pre internet days they were the best and only game in town as far maps in the US and traveling went. Or did they just miss the boat completely?

          1. RICHTO
            Mushroom

            Re: Bing?

            Nokia maps is far better than Google. It is what most of the car manufacturers use (NavTec).

          2. Rick Leeming

            Re: Bing?

            I've used Google Maps (On my Galaxy-S), and I've used Navteq/Nokia maps (I'm using Navigon on my HTC HD7 at the moment).

            Navteq are actually BETTER than google maps in the UK. Same maps as used by Garmin, and many car manufacturers. Google maps kept trying to get me to go up roads that are closed off (and have been for years), and sometimes routed me the LOOONG way round where I live.

            Google I'm told is very good in large cities with large populations, however we don't all live in London/New York/LA.

        2. Mark .

          Re: Bing?

          "Apple were basically forced into this by Google which refused to allow them to use the same features that Google themselves were allowed to on Android devices. Basically, Google wanted Apple to pay for a more limited version of what Google has."

          Heaven forbid that Google not want to give away their product for free to the competition!

          Next time I see someone saying they like the software that comes with OS X, I'll tell them it's Apples fault for not making it available for free for MS to ship with Windows...

          "by Google deciding what they could and couldn't have on their own phones."

          Um no, it's entirely up to Apple. But other companies aren't obliged to write software for Apple. Or perhaps you can point me to the version of Apple maps that is (a) available for Android, WP, Symbian and Blackberry, and (b) may be distributed by phone manufacturers free of charge? (Not that anyone would want it...)

    2. PaulW

      Waze

      Waze is free and quite good... bit "Social" for my liking, but it does work in both the US and UK (tried it last time I was in the UK - through Papworth I believe, and works well in the SF/San Jose area). At least it knew how to be me from St. Neots to Ely...

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Waze

        Small world....I live in St Neots and drove through Papworth this morning to get to work...

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Thumb Down

      Nonsense

      None of them provide OS integration for other apps that use maps..

      Basically any app on your iPhone that uses maps in anyway is lumbered with the shitty Apple maps.

      I'm waiting tor the class-action lawsuit from disgruntled owners of older devices, and news of mass returns of iPhone5 (which is already only 50% of forcast sales).

      1. Frank Bough
        WTF?

        Total

        Bullshit. Google Maps, Google Earth, Motion X GPS and OutSide all work fine on iOS 6.

  4. Callam McMillan

    maps.google.co.uk

    Surely navigating to the above address in the web browser will alleviate the maps issue?

    1. Big_Ted

      Re: maps.google.co.uk

      m.google.co.uk/maps

      thats the one for mobiles

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: maps.google.co.uk

        Thats a map website, not a Maps app and API.

      2. Test Man
        Stop

        Re: maps.google.co.uk

        Actually

        maps.google.co.uk

        will automatically display the mobile version on mobiles. So address works without having to go through a special URL that is actually longer.

    2. Anthony Hulse

      Re: maps.google.co.uk

      iOS Safari even allows you to make a Web app out of that link once you're there. I'm sure that one day Apple Maps will be a decent alternative, but in the meantime it's not that hard to make a Google one.

  5. Stretch
    Black Helicopters

    "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

    So true. And this free advertising facilitates the mass-brainwashing. And don't think I'm not looking at you Register.

    1. James Hughes 1

      Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

      They are obsessed because it get page views. Apple releases are big news (they probably shoudn't be quite so big but they are). Journalists report on what is popular. And hordes of Apple fans is a big market.

      Now I'm not saying they are not going over the top in their reporting - but with such a big reader base, why wouldn't they? Blame the Apple buyers and readers as well, not just the reporters. But it does have a ring of feedback to it, sadly. Still maybe this latest launch will go some way to putting a brake on it.

      1. tytus.suski
        Holmes

        Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

        "hordes of Apple fans", "more views"

        just curious. If there's more Android phones than Apple phones how come it's Apple which has "hordes of fans" and generates more page views? Could these views be in fact generated by hordes of Androids fans hording over each and every one Apple article?

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

          There's a lot more Fords, Hyundais and so on than BMWs or Porsches out there, but guess which gets the most attention in the lad's mags motoring comics?

          1. tytus.suski
            Holmes

            Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

            "There's a lot more Fords, Hyundais and so on than BMWs or Porsches out there, but guess which gets the most attention in the lad's mags motoring comics?"

            Well, you have just confirmed my suspicion, that page views of iPhone articles are in fact generated by Android, Windows Phone and Blackberry owners, not Apple fans.

            And watch out, because you have just compared Android to Hyundai. You may not be safe now.

            1. Bumpy Cat
              Happy

              What's wrong with Hyundai?

              I drive one, and it drives nicely, works well and is easy to maintain.

              Remember that only a few years ago people mocked Samsung for being the electronics equivalent of Hyundai - and now it's the market leader in TVs, and has phones and tablets so good that Apple is peeing themselves a little.

              While you weren't looking Hyundai did the same.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Coffee/keyboard

                Re: What's wrong with Hyundai?

                "While you weren't looking Hyundai did the same."

                Errrr...no they didn't.

                1. John 104

                  Re: What's wrong with Hyundai?

                  Er.. yes they did. Some of the nicest automotive kit is coming out of Korea in the form of Hyundai and Kia. Surprisingly. And the joke is, it costs less than just about everything else out there (in the US anyway) and has a great warranty. :)

                2. Dave the Cat
                  Stop

                  Re: What's wrong with Hyundai?

                  " "While you weren't looking Hyundai did the same."

                  Errrr...no they didn't."

                  Errrr, yes they did, they've spent the last 10/15 years poaching some of the best engineers from the likes of Toyota, Yamaha, Nissan etc. and some of the brightest automotive design graduates from the UK and US. They're rapidly catching up with European makers, if they haven't already done so that is.

                  I'll still be sticking with my european saloon but don't knock 'em, they're making some interesting cars at the moment.

              2. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: What's wrong with Hyundai?

                Loving that you've mentioned that you drive a Hyundai, and get five upvotes - geezer the other day said he drove an Audi and got downvoted and got all sniffy about it

            2. Interested Party

              Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

              To stick with the car metaphor, while Apple are more like McLaren, Android is like VAG (VW Audi Group). With Android you get everything from a VW Polo to a Bugatti Veryon, where as Apple only make 1 model, that competes in the high end, so there's no £50 phone to devalue the exclusivity and "I'm better than you" factor of their brand.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

                >To stick with the car metaphor, while Apple are more like McLaren

                Apple are not McLaren - that's practically libel. There isn't a smartphone which parallels them at all, even the cream of the crop are just transient, mass produced and semi-disposable gadgets. The level of human craftmanship involved @ McLaren despite the uber-tech factory has to be seen to be believed.

                ...and car analogies are kind of lame when Android OEMs - Samsung, Hyundai, Huawei etc also manufacture hundreds of millions of cars every year.

              2. Mark .

                Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

                Though I suspect most people don't think in terms of buying "Android", they're buying a "Samsung".

              3. Dave the Cat
                Thumb Up

                Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

                @ Interested Party

                Nice analogy :-)

              4. RICHTO
                Mushroom

                Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

                I would say Android are more like Skoda - taking someone else's technology (In this case Microsoft and Apple) and selling it under a different brand....

                1. Anonymous Coward
                  Anonymous Coward

                  Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

                  You should wikipedia Android and IOS ..... guess which came first? And these days Apple is stealing its 'innovation' from the same developers who added to the App store. Start the countdown!

            3. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

              I may be forced, again, to mention the Hyundai Equus.

              You know, the V-8 5.0L GDI one.

        2. John 104
          Childcatcher

          Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

          I got lost in there, somewhere around "hordes"...

        3. Frank Bough
          Facepalm

          Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

          ..because Apple users are demonstrably willing to PAY FOR STUFF. Advertisers prefer to advertise to such people.

    2. Code Monkey
      Windows

      Re: "obsessed with Apple's marketing events and Apple's branding".

      Oh come on. This is a genuine story - and quite a funny one at that

  6. Velv
    Mushroom

    Given Apples random censorship of Apps submitted by third parties it is unlikely a Google Maps app would have made it through the approval process.

    "We already have a maps app that has all the same features, why would anybody want another one"

    1. Ben Tasker Silver badge

      I suspect, though, now that Apple's Maps has seen the light of day, they might choose to avoid censoring an app that resolves the issues for free. At least, that is, until they get their own house in order.

      You think users are upset now? Imagine if the story was "Schmidt says they submitted Google Maps for iOS5 but Apple rejected it as duplicating functionality in the OS".

      1. Rob Fisher
        Linux

        Apple can block apps

        " they might choose to avoid censoring an app that resolves the issues for free. At least, that is, until they get their own house in order."

        The chances of this happening might be vanishingly small, but the possibility of it must have some marginal effect on app development. There is always a non-zero risk of spending resources developing an app only for Apple to say no.

        This is not a problem penguins have.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Google Maps for iPhone5

        But what if Google made the app and it got rejected so they made it available for loading on jailbroken phones. That could seriously upset Apple and their revenue stream if suddenly 50% of all iPhones were jailbroken.

        1. Test Man
          WTF?

          Re: Google Maps for iPhone5

          Won't happen.

          So don't be silly.

  7. Christopher Rogers
    Facepalm

    "That's great for Apple, but the numbers are on our side," he said.

    That may be so, but the profit is on Apple's side and business is not a popularity contest...

    1. James Hughes 1

      The numbers game is more long term, and I think Android (and perhaps even Windows) are going to be better options in the long term.

      1. Christopher Rogers
        Childcatcher

        AAPL Market Cap: 647.55

        GOOG Market Cap: 245.07

        The numbers game.

        1. Ben Tasker Silver badge

          @Christopher

          The thing with a market cap is it's about what shareholders think it's worth, there may be no substantive link to the real world. Apple's a valuable company, that's a given, but is it necessarily worth that cap? Especially long-term?

          I don't know the answer, and my suspicion is neither do you. For short-term profit (not necessarily a bad thing) you'd probably be best with Apple, but for a long-term investment I can't help think you'd be better off with a company that's selling greater volumes. Of course, it's swings & roundabouts as Google aren't actually selling Android, so it is a little hard to compare.

          1. Ramazan
            Headmaster

            Re: @Ben Tasker: market cap is what shareholders think it's worth

            Wrong. It's what market thinks the shares are worth.

        2. Christopher Rogers
          Windows

          I am by no means an Apple fanboi, in fact I do not own any apple products though I do recommend them to people who ask me because usually they are not clued in enough to use any other type of device. I seem to have contradicted myself with the "not a popularity contest remark" because of course retail is a popularity contest. What I should have said is that its the margins you make that matter to business.

          With that in mind, Apple under Jobs (both periods) made desirable products and charged a premium and it had been a highly effective marketing ploy. How effective? What year was Apple incorporated? 1977? Okay they dodged a bullet when MS bailed them out. Now they are in a position where they have products that are just like everyone else's (some better some worse) but they charge 2 or 3 times more and make a healthy profit. So they have shown their effectiveness in the long term, the short term gains (5million 5s in a weekend), the repeat customers (see ebay for sell ons). Much as Android have stacked them high to sell them with thin margins, Apple have stacked them high and sold them with a fat gain.

          They do the hardware, software sales and support. Google do software and sell ads. And some hardware.

    2. Ben Tasker Silver badge

      I guess it depends how you look at it though. Apple have far fewer users spending far more. What this means is that every single user that ebbs away, detracts from their future profit by a greater percentage. Sometimes it's far better to have a huge number of customers not spending much, than it is to have just a few spending loads.

      Not that Apple's going to disappear any time soon, of course, but the point is it would take fewer users slipping away for them to have to fall back on their cash reserves (or discontinue the iPhone) than it would for Google's Android.

      It's about whether you're looking for short or long-term profit. Sadly, too many businesses (read shareholders) concentrate on the now with no regard for the future.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      It is a popularity contest

      Apple IT products are rarely bought for technical reasons. But for the popularity of the nontechnical reasons, would Apple make so much profit?

      This whole phenomenon fascinates me, because they've managed to tap into the male desire to establish reproductive fitness by displays of conspicuous consumption. iPhones are basically the stag's antlers. Economics just doesn't seem to take into account, with its theories of rational markets, that there are a lot of people out there who want to be seen to be able to spend more money than the next person, even if they're giving it in handfuls to a faceless corporation. It's the poor person's equivalent of the plumber's jet ski or the barrister's Tuscan castle for August.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: It is a popularity contest

        Well you might be half right, but what about all those girls buying it? Is it phallic, or what is their reason?!

        1. TheOtherHobbes

          Re: It is a popularity contest

          Apple are one of the few companies to have cracked the cross-gender thing. MacBooks of all kinds appeal to boyz and grrlz equally.

          That's very clever design. I'm not sure how deliberate it was, but it's not an easy thing to do.

          But all the fangrrlz I know are seriously unhappy with Apple's bullying and lack of new shiny, and they're either not upgrading their iPhones at all or they're switching to Sammys. (In fact it seems that for many former fangrrrlz 'Samsung' is the new word for 'Android.')

          I hope Cook realises how badly he has fucked up. This was his to lose, he didn't have to do much to keep Apple on top of the game.

          But instead, he's rolled out epic fail. And Apple's position is a lot more fragile than he thinks it is - precisely because the strength of the brand isn't from one feature or technology or product, but the user perception of buying something special and magical.

          If the products stop being seen as special etc, Apple has lost all of its USP.

          1. Mark .

            Re: It is a popularity contest

            "Apple are one of the few companies to have cracked the cross-gender thing. MacBooks of all kinds appeal to boyz and grrlz equally."

            I think that's true of technology products in general. I mean, a laptop is a laptop, whether it's a Dell, Samsung, Apple or whatever else. Thankfully unlike many products, we don't have "men's laptops" and "women's laptops".

            (Though I sometimes wonder that things would be like that - Apple included - if laptops were around since one hundred years ago.)

            "This was his to lose, he didn't have to do much to keep Apple on top of the game."

            Note that Apple were never on top in the phone market, either by company (it was Nokia now Samsung) or platform (it was Symbian now Android). Android was way ahead of Apple before this new guy took over. I agree things do seem to be getting worse though, in the last year.

        2. BioPeek

          Re: It is a popularity contest

          >Well you might be half right, but what about all those girls buying it? Is it phallic, or what is their reason?!

          Curved corners?

        3. Anonymous Coward
          Paris Hilton

          Re: It is a popularity contest

          Custom vibration patterns.......

      2. Rob Fisher

        Re: It is a popularity contest

        " Economics just doesn't seem to take into account" -- economics absolutely does take this into account, the Austrian variety especially. It is rational to consume conspicuously if you think this will make you more sexually attractive.

        The danger, if you are Apple, is that such things are subject to the whimsy of fashion.

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Stop

        Re: It is a popularity contest

        Bought by morons that are brainwashed by the media.

        Next time you watch a TV show or movie, watch out for the darkened room with the macbook with the gleaming Apple logo, and the unnecessary camera angle that shows it off.

        Don't believe for a minute Apple didn't pay money for the product placement. It's so rife, it's not even funny anymore. Watch any American TV show or Hollywood movie, and you play the count the product placements. Apple will almost certainly come out on top.

        http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-05-10/apple-the-other-cult-in-hollywood

        I feel slightly sorry for the cretins that fall for it.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: It is a popularity contest

          "watch out for the darkened room with the macbook with the gleaming Apple log"

          I wonder if that logo is illuminated by the display's backlight or if it's a separate umm backlight? Curious if it's just sat there draining battery for Apple's benefit (it's clearly nothing more than an advert - as a user, they should never see it lit up - unless they are a way way over the top fanboi.)

          1. Frank Bough

            Re: It is a popularity contest

            why bother wondering when you have the www at your fingertips? Look past your stupid prejudice and the answer is obvious anyway.

        2. David Paul Morgan
          Pint

          Re: It is a popularity contest

          with regards to product placement, I find it depends on the movie studio.

          Columbia - Sony - all computers are VAIOs and all smart/cell phones are Sony.

          Take a look at the recent james bond films.

          Warner (used to be time/aol) it is usually Dell and a mixture of 'droid/blackberry and winMo phones - check out Smallville etc.

          It's not a hard and fast 'rule' but it's always fun to look!

        3. Mark .

          Re: It is a popularity contest

          Glad it's not just me that noticed this. It really is astonishing when you start noticing it - pretty much every American TV show that shows computers or phones will have Apple logos in it. Some shows seem to have a logo present in every other scene.

          I know it's just product placement, but this kind of advertising seems like it would be more effective on a subconscious level than direct advertising.

          And it is quite jarring and off putting to have to watch this in so many shows.

          1. RICHTO
            Mushroom

            Re: It is a popularity contest

            This is because the types that are involved in 'creative' trades - you know - the ones that got a single GCSE in Art and then went on to do 'Media Studies' - are too stupid to use a real computer, and so Macs are endemic in these areas. Same with journalists...

            Mnd you, with the new 'even stupid people can cope' interface in Windows 8 maybe Microsoft will now take back these area by storm....

  8. Mark C Casey

    They're probably negotiating over it

    Pure speculation warning.

    My guess, is Apple and Google are disagreeing over some aspect of Google Maps as a separate app. Like Apple want a feature add/removed from it. Whilst Google probably want something add/removed or possibly an option for the user to select Google Maps as the default. (which Apple would not like)

  9. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Hmm...

    This is an interesting play. IIRC Eric Schmidt was a non-exec on the board of Apple while they were developing the iPhone. His position was there because Apple and Google didn't directly compete. By complete coincidence Google purchased and developed a phone OS while Apple were developing the iPhone. It is inconceivable that a board member at Apple wouldn't know about the development of the iPhone. I'm no fan of either company, but this is pretty shitty behavior on behalf of Google and I'm only surprised that it took Apple so long to dump all their services from their products.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Hmm...

      Schmidt is a schmuck, remember how he told people that whenever they felt Google shouldn't photograph their house, they should just move? Or that people who didn't want their privacy raped by Google probably shouldn't be doing 'wrong' things in the first place? Classy guy.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        @Buck Futter

        So you're saying you want my freedom to take photographs from a public road to be curtailed?

        Interesting how all you people blabbering on about freedoms change your tune the moment anyone else uses their freedoms to do something you aren't 100% happy with. It's almost like you haven't thought your position through.

    2. PsychicMonkey
      FAIL

      Re: Hmm...

      why would him being on the board of Apple have any bearing on Google bringing out a phone OS?

      Were they supposed to cancel plans for it because Apple made a phone? Do you really think that he saw they were making a phone and then said "why don't we do that too"?

      If so you really need to stock up on your tin foil

      1. Tom 38 Silver badge

        Re: Hmm...

        He was on the board then because Apple and Google were best friends back then, with Google not interfering in anything Apple did. Apple launched a phone, then shortly afterwards Google bought a phone OS in development, secretly developed a phone and launched it. At this point, Google and Apple stopped being friends, and became frenemies.

        Now, even the veneer of friendship that is the frenemy has gone, they flat out don't like each other now, no hiding it.

        1. fandom

          Re: Hmm...

          " Apple launched a phone, then shortly afterwards Google bought a phone OS in development,"

          So, Apple launched a phone in 2007 and shortly afterwards Google bought a phone OS in 2005.

          Wow! Why is Google bragging about map apps when they have a working time machine?!

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Hmm...

        He said he wasn't developing or planning a phone, even though he was. Plus the phone OS they showed a prototype of was massively different to the end product (changed due to seeing all the media reaction to the iPhone).

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: this is pretty shitty behavior on behalf of Google

      You mean they should do an app for iOS5? Or have you hijacked a thread about Google Maps on iOS5 to go on about some historical wrong that you think is relevant here?

      While you're surprised it took apple this long to dump all google services from their product, I'm surprised apple are stupid enough to kick google maps off their OS when the replacement is not ready. I guess delivering payback to someone who wronged you is more important that delivering a usable product to your loyal fanbase. We'll see what the market thinks of that logic....

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Unhappy

        Re: this is pretty shitty behavior on behalf of Google

        Unfortunately the market will forgive them, due the dumb users, in the same way that the iPhone 4 fiasco over that stupid antenna design meant that many people could not make calls outside of high signal areas. In that case the iSheep and the iPress just carried on with their fawning of Jobs and co regardless. Put another way, this is worse than religion, it's a completely illogical belief system built around a bit of electronic kit! Mankind, well many if us, are still stupid and primitive.

        1. Ramazan
          Holmes

          Re: this is pretty shitty behavior on behalf of Google

          Some boxers are said to have a heart (apple) and public loves them despite all their illogical behaviour, while others (microsoft, google) are just soulless boxing machines. So yes, people will definitely forgive this Inferior Maps App, which will be polished and improved BTW

    4. HMB

      Re: Hmmmm : Lack of Realism

      What responsibility do Google have to Apple? Google is a profit based business. It's duty is only to it's shareholders and customers.

      Companies that let themselves get left behind because they're worried about hurting the feelings of people on the board of another company get eaten up and pooped out. They're unsuccessful companies.

      The whole idea of a free market economy is competition which drives innovation and lowers price to customers and I want the latest tech at the lowest prices.

      In any case, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW0DUg63lqU

  10. JDX Gold badge

    What's in it for GOOG?

    Releasing a free Maps app on their competitor's phone is not going to get them revenue. Deliberately not releasing one so Apple get lots of bad publicity for crap maps could drive people away from Apple.

    This could actually be good for MS/Nokia too - people upset with Apple just as WP8 comes out, and Nokia already give their free maps and GPS/satnav away on their handsets (which seems pretty decent from my tests). So Google/Android could get a lot of good press by hurting Apple, while also giving WP8 some more users and opening things up in the market more.

    Maybe.

    1. Ben Rose

      Re: What's in it for GOOG?

      Google make money from advertising services. When somebody looks at Maps, business like restaurants want to be seen. They pay Google to be there and be highly ranked when somebody searches for a restaurant in that area. Google Maps is just a modern version of Yellow Pages in that respect.

      Of course, if nobody reads it any more, nobody will want to advertise in it...as Yell has found out.

      Losing the iPhone users reduces the audience for those adverts and potentially the revenues from it. Of course, this is the revenue that Apple wants to tap into with its own maps product.

      Now advertisers have to choose whether to pay to be in Google Maps, Apple Maps or both. Potentially Bing too. Android's market share has clearly grown to the point where Google aren't too concerned about losing that income in the short term. If 4 people want to go out to dinner and one of them has Android and therefore Google Maps, which one is going to be searching for the restaurant? Google still get the hit and the revenue from the search results.

      Selling the phone and the OS is one thing, but people using it is what makes the money. If iPhone users revert to Google Maps on the web, then Google still get the income and don't have the expense of supporting the Apple device.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      FAIL

      Re: What's in it for GOOG?

      I would rather suffer crap Apple maps that Windows Phone...

      1. Jim Coleman
        Meh

        Re: What's in it for GOOG?

        Speak for yourself, plenty of people are finding Windows Phone to be a better experience. WP bashers are becoming an endangered species. Trawl the net and you'll see tons of pro-WP articles and comments. You're already starting to look a bit pointless with this kind of baseless drivel.

        1. Peter Storm

          Re: What's in it for GOOG?

          "plenty of people are finding Windows Phone to be a better experience"

          Actually I have to agree with you. I don't own a Windows phone myself, and I was a bit sceptical about them, but our company recently bought ten Lumia 800s for the engineers. All the new company phones come to me first to have their emails set up. I must admit I was quite impressed.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: What's in it for GOOG?

          Plenty of articles gushing about iPhone5 and iOS6... doesn't mean its as good as they claim.....

        3. Vic

          Re: What's in it for GOOG?

          > Trawl the net and you'll see tons of pro-WP articles and comments.

          Indeed you will :-(

          Vic.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: What's in it for GOOG?

        Personally I wouldn't touch either Apple or a Windows Phone with a bargepole. I'm an ex-Nokian now on Android and that's because it's the least locked down of all the platforms. If it hasn't got file management, expandable storage and requires some proprietary app to transfer data from a pc that's a huge no-no from me. To me a smartphone is a pc and I wouldn't tolerate that on a pc, let alone something so personal as a phone which I carry everywhere.

    3. Test Man
      Thumb Down

      Re: What's in it for GOOG?

      Er, releasing a free Maps app WILL give them revenue. That revenue is in the form of usage data - which is what they were getting until Apple replaced them as supplier. This kind of usage data is invaluable.

      No one is going to move away from Apple just because there isn't a Google Maps app on iPhone.

      1. JDX Gold badge

        @Ben Rose, Test Man

        Firstly, does Google make ads money from maps if you search for "restaurants" and then click on one? Do maps use adwords, etc - I thought it displayed everything relevant in the vicinity you were searching based on distance? I never thought about how they monetise maps before, I figured they did it for free to build the brand but am happy to be corrected how it works.

        >>No one is going to move away from Apple just because there isn't a Google Maps app on iPhone

        I don't think that's a safe assumption. To many people, maps are a must-have tool and for others, using your phone as a sat-nav is indispensable. So I could certainly see people due an upgrade thinking harder about whether they stick with Apple.

        Also, there are always new customers looking for their first phone. If they can be headed away from getting into Apple in the first place, they quite likely will end up stuck in whichever ecosystem they go for.

        Either way, Nokia have a wonderful opportunity here to sit on the edge and pick up the scraps.

      2. TheOtherHobbes

        Re: What's in it for GOOG?

        "No one is going to move away from Apple just because there isn't a Google Maps app on iPhone."

        But they are. Which is the point.

        Maps is so irredeemably pants that come upgrade time a lot of punters will be looking at Android and even Nokia with renewed interest.

        This is a fiasco for Apple because it ends the lock-in.

        Previously upgrading was a no-brainer. Now, not so much.

        And as punters drift away from the iPhone, they also start to drift away from Macs.

  11. This post has been deleted by a moderator

    1. JDX Gold badge

      Re: Heres an idea.

      Nokia Drive has proved pretty damn good for me so far even on my crappy low-spec Lumia 610. Doesn't even whinge if you turn data off and you get free worldwide maps.

      1. Mike Taylor
        Thumb Up

        Re: Heres an idea.

        Used on a tour of France over the summer. Was extremely good and completely free, since I'd downloaded the maps on wifi.

        1. sabroni Silver badge
          Thumb Up

          Re: Heres an idea.

          Port apple maps to windows phone 8! Best of both worlds!

  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Storm in a teacup. You want Google Maps - go to maps.google.co.uk and put it on your home page (10 seconds).

    You want Apple Maps - just use it. May not be perfect for everyone but I doubt Google is either. I know people who prefer Bing Maps and I have compared Apples satellite images to Googles and for my house, my parents house, my office and a few other locations Apple has the more up-to-date maps - by several years in some cases.

    Google will lose out on this - iOS was worth a LOT of cash to them - now they have turned a nice 'revenue' into an extra cost - imagine all those thousands of servers that are no longer requires as they are not serving the data.

    1. JDX Gold badge

      I think Google can re-use the servers easily for Google Drive/Docs.

      We don't know what Apple were paying for Google Maps but think of all the ads Google can run for "phones with good maps".

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      @AC: "I have compared Apples satellite images to Googles and for my house, my parents house, my office and a few other locations Apple has the more up-to-date maps - by several years in some cases."

      Also true here. Building sites finished 3-4 years ago don't appear on Google maps, but are right up to date on Apple's. Also, most businesses shown on Google maps in our area are all in the wrong place - over a mile away in many cases - whereas they are right on Apple's.

      I don't completely rely on any one map source. I have several and cross-check them whenever travelling somewhere new. It isn't at all uncommon to find that they disagree, but it's not a case of one being uniformly more up to date than the other.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Agreed, my house isn't even a building site on Google's satellite images, it's just an empty plot. Both Apple and Bing have more up to date images than that. I've lost count of the times a POI on Google Maps has been in the wrong place, duplicated or points to something not there any more. Apple's maps aren't perfect but I think the disparity between it and the alternatives is being rather overblown, especially when there's nothing stopping people using maps.google.co.uk.

      1. Peter Storm

        If you go to my business address on street view it shows a house down the road a way. Google maps shows it in someone else's garden.

        1. This post has been deleted by its author

    4. TheOtherHobbes

      Not the point

      The point is developers have to use Apple's cr(m)ap, or waste a lot of time finding and working out how to use an alternative.

      Apple's API uses Apple's 'maps.' As a dev I can use an alternative - maybe even Google's own API. But it takes extra work and possibly extra money.

      In the meantime, all the existing apps that use the mapping APIs are broken and pretty much useless.

    5. Mark .

      "Storm in a teacup. You want Google Maps - go to maps.google.co.uk and put it on your home page (10 seconds)."

      OOI, why don't people do this for every other web page? Instead it seems that every website and company is advertising an "app" just for Iphones, and I never understood why they (and only that platform) needed this.

      I agree, you might as well use the webpage. In neither case will you get features like offline maps or free satnav, that Android and Nokia have had for months or years.

    6. Dan 55 Silver badge
      Boffin

      There's a difference between Google putting a free maps app in the store and picking up ad revenue and Apple paying Google to put a free maps app on their phones and additionally picking up ad revenue.

      Apple should have waited a year to perfect it before release, it's not as if they needed to scrimp and save like Nokia do. The damage to Apple's reputation by not having a usable maps app on the phone is probably far more monetarily than what Apple were paying Google, especially when there was a usable maps app until recently.

      This is the kind of thing which drives people away from a competitor's platform and onto yours. If Apple don't want to pay Google for the app, Google certainly aren't going to provide it for free out of the goodness of their hearts just to fix Apple's damaged reputation.

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Now Apple have jumped there is no way they would go back to Google - and why should they - I reckon their mapping is better. I'm not saying it's the same for everyone but you only hear from people complaining.

    The maps are a lot quicker - the images are newer - for ME it's better.

    1. Redundent Asset

      True that you only hear from people complaining but it does seem to be a lot of people.

      1. h4rm0ny

        "True that you only hear from people complaining but it does seem to be a lot of people"

        Operative word on "seem". They've sold millions of these phones already. It only takes a handful to make a storm on the Internet. For example, many of the posters on this thread alone are overtly Android phone owners and presumably haven't any direct personal experience of the Apple maps. And yet they confidently comment about their quality. For example, have you used the Apple maps, yet?

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Trollface

    I read the article twice,

    but when did he say they were not going to develop Google Maps for iOS? "We have not done anything yet," isn't the same thing.

    If fact the Reuters article has him say that in response to :

    But he said any decision on whether Google Maps would be accepted as an application in the Apple App Store would have to be made by Apple.

    So, he has confirmed that they have not submitted the app yet. Nothing more, not much less.

    I do love The Reg, and I appreciate that you need page hits - but please try and report the story.

  15. Mike S

    not just one app

    Many of the apps show use the built in maps.

    Heres an example: use Zillow or Trulia apps to find a house for sale... iOS5, you can see train stations on the map, which is useful when assessing the location of a house to purchase. But as soon as you upgrade to iOS6, that train statio. No longer shows up. Doesnt sound like much, but compound it with everything else that uses the built in maps... non-trivial downgrade.

  16. DrXym Silver badge

    I like Google maps

    It's great just to get the satnav functionality. Satnav gives pretty good directions and speaks out the proper road names so rather than saying "Turn left" it will say "Turn left onto George Street", "Or keep right and follow signs for the M4" or whatever. it's too bad it has to be online to get directions but it works. It also has traffic analysis for some places which is neat. Maps can be cached offline but directions require being online.

    I also have offline maps & routes on a Lumia 800 which is a plan B if I have no internet. It seems more accurate online since offline some of the routes can be really bizarre. It's better than nothing though.

    I haven't seen many reviews of the satnav functionality for iOS 6 but some reports suggest it is only in the iPhone 5. This seems utterly bizarre to me. I assume older iPhones have the prerequisite bits like GPS and compass to do satnav so it's a mystery why they might be unsupported except some artificial product differentiation.

    1. Ben Rose
      Thumb Up

      Re: I like Google maps

      "it's a mystery why they might be unsupported except some artificial product differentiation"

      You got it...right there.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Apple being just like Microsoft

    Apple's approach to iMaps or CrapMaps whatever you call it reminds how Microsoft rolls out Windows ... put a barely decent product out there then let the users find the flaws and issues. Apple wants you to do their work for them as they are used to slave labor.

    If Google does put a new map app out there then they should charge as much as they can for it. iDrones will gladly pay for a map app that actually works.

    For those that say "Well this is the first cut and Google Maps sucked at first too" is full of BS because this is your great Apple who have had years to work on this and produce something “revolutionary but instead plopped a pile of poo and stuck a compass in it.

  18. Fill

    Number vs. Profits

    "That's great for Apple, but the numbers are on our side," he said.

    That may be true in raw numbers, but Google actually made more money from iOS than Android... until now.

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Consumer wins ... on a long term

    Once Apple improves their maps, Google will have to do it as well. And customers will have a choice. That`s actually good, a monopoly is never a good thing. I'd like to see the same happening with Google Search. Some alternative to consumers and advertisers would be welcome

  20. stitch

    "Google has not made a maps app for the iPhone 5"

    No, but it has one that works on every other iPhone and version of iOS. It will work on iPhone 5/iOS 6.

    The two questions are "Does Google want submit its existing app?" and "Would Apple approve it if they did?"

    1. ratfox
      Stop

      Wrong!

      The app that works on every other iPhone and version of iOS was written by Apple. It only used the data of Google maps. If Google wants to submit their own app, they have to write it from scratch.

  21. backpakdan
    Flame

    Just Pissed

    I really don't give a rat's ass about the Google and Apple squabble. But I am pissed at Apple for having me upload ios6 to my iPhone 4s and then lose google maps. Also pissed at Google for punishing me because of the spat. This smacks alot of the posturing and fights between Microsoft and Apple 15-20 years ago. The consumer lost.

    Not sure what my response to Apple is yet, but I am deleting all Google software from my iPhone. Going to try out some other options. Tired of being the battering ram. Open to suggestions to bring home the message to Apple.

    1. Jim Coleman
      Happy

      Re: Just Pissed

      The solution is Windows Phone - more specifically, the Nokia Lumia 920. That would be one in the eye for both Apple and Google. :)

    2. BioPeek

      Re: Just Pissed

      >Not sure what my response to Apple is yet, but I am deleting all Google software from my iPhone. Going to try out some other options. Tired of being the battering ram. Open to suggestions to bring home the message to Apple.

      It's my party and I'll cry if I want to....

    3. Mark .

      Re: Just Pissed

      "Open to suggestions to bring home the message to Apple."

      Buy something other than Apple. Nokia WP have great mapping solutions - but also I don't see that Google are at fault anyway, so Android is an option too. There's no obligation for them to have to write applications for Apple, especially when they're in competition. Should we complain that Apple haven't released Apple maps for Android (or anything else) (assuming it was any good)?

      (And Apple get more than their fair share of software support anyway)...

    4. Tom 38 Silver badge

      Re: Just Pissed

      I am pissed at Apple for having me upload ios6 to my iPhone 4s and then lose google maps

      Apple mind controlled you into installing the update did they?

    5. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Just Pissed

      "Also pissed at Google for punishing me because of the spat."

      Umm, serious question, but how are Google punishing you? By not spending millions in development costs to undo what Apple have done?

    6. h4rm0ny

      Re: Just Pissed

      "Open to suggestions to bring home the message to Apple."

      Can't comment on WP8 properly yet as it's not out, but I have the Lumia 710 with WP7.5 and it's extremely good and usable. And with specific regard to the maps, they are very good and can also be downloaded for use offline which can be a big help. The Nokia Drive tool which plots routes and gives vocal directions works really well, ime. Highly recommended.

  22. ratfox
    Unhappy

    Who says they are not working on one?

    Eric Schmidt says they have not done anything yet, not that they will not do it…?

  23. SiempreTuna

    Given Apple ..

    .. would take a 30% (is it?) cut of the probably-not-that-huge advertising revenue generated by a Google Maps App for iOS, you have to wonder why Google would want to do one.

    I think I read that Apple was paying Google around $1 billion annually for the maps app in the past. And that had no turn-by-turn, as Google saw that (correctly, so far as I'm concerned) as a really great USP for Android.

    I'm sure the Apple maps will improve over time. The Android one has. And Apple are busily recruiting all available ex-Google Maps devs ..

    1. Tim Almond
      Happy

      Correction

      Google never built the iOS maps app. They just supplied the back-end services for an App that Apple built.

  24. BristolBachelor Gold badge
    Joke

    "...in fact we already have Google maps for iPhone owners; it even comes with it's own processor, screen, battery, operating system..."

  25. Volker Hett

    Navigon is fine, works with offline maps in rural regions without proper 3G coverage and without massive roaming charges should I need it in another country.

    I use it on a HTC Desire at the moment.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      +1

      Yeah I tried that in EU also on an HTC and it was very good, particularly in-car, telling you to switch lanes ahead of time etc.

  26. IO-IO
    Mushroom

    just use the webapp

    I realise that most of the people commenting are clearly so directionally challenged that they are incapable of getting anywhere without their noses stuck in a smartphone.

    Go to google maps, when prompted to install a webapp on the device say yes. Enable safari location services and hey presto you have a google maps app.

    I'm not an apple fan but it is sad just how much time people that don't have an apple device spend taking pot shots. Clearly Android and every other non-apple device is so flawless that it's not worth writing about but seriously - get a life. It's JUST a phone.

  27. Mark .

    Can't they just run the Java one?

    Can't it just run the Java one?

    My 2005 bog standard feature phone ran Google Maps. Today even some dirt cheap Nokia S40 would run it. It was the full thing, only lacking in sat nav (which the Iphone version never had anyway).

    It didn't matter that Google hadn't written one especially for my make and model of phone, because it was Java, and worked on any phone. So presumably Apple users can just run this.

    Oh wait.

    (Seriously though, I do remember the days when companies would support all makes of phones. Now it's just "Get this on your Iphone", despite it being a smaller platform than the likes of Android or S40 - sorry, like most people I don't have one. Even Google are at it, their web page only seems to show support for mobile software for Android and IOS. Despite this news item, it seems their only non-Android support is for Apple.)

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Can't they just run the Java one?

      "Now it's just "Get this on your Iphone", despite it being a smaller platform than the likes of Android or S40 - sorry, like most people I don't have one."

      I think this is mostly due to higher-up management of these firms all have iPhones, so they want an iPhone app they can show their buddies. Android etc. doesn't even occur to them.

      Also, consider dev. costs, none of these platforms are cross-compatible like JavaME was, I think it'd be foolish to target more then iOS, Android & WP (and possibly Blackberry - depending on the app.)

  28. Oliver Humpage
    Facepalm

    Ho-hum... I've updated http://isthereadecentmapsappforios6yet.com/ with a link to this story. Looks like I might need to keep the domain registered for longer than I expected...

  29. Britt Johnston
    Unhappy

    What about iCloud?

    My wife, a non-expert, is complaining about her web site, which is on a mac on iCloud.

    It recently lost its link to the google map insert used to show the way to her business premises, and does not appear to have a way to get it reinstalled..

    Is this an unlucky coincidence, or is there something conspiratorial going on here?

    1. 45RPM Silver badge
      Thumb Down

      Re: What about iCloud?

      O Rly? How can that be given that Apple no longer hosts other people's web sites (that functionality was dropped with MobileMe)

      1. Britt Johnston

        Re: What about iCloud?

        Thanks for the partial answer. She has a website with an embedded map, that recently stopped working. I'm trying to find out if that is normal wear and tear, or if others know of a general problem, and/or whether there is anything left to fix, or better just start over.

  30. 45RPM Silver badge
    Trollface

    iOS users don't need maps…

    …they just blindly follow everyone else!

    1. Jurassic
      FAIL

      Re: iOS users don't need maps…

      Actually it's Android users who blindly follow others when they are told lies like:

      - you'll be able to upgrade your 1 year old phone

      - you'll get your upgrade on the day it's released

      - Android is "open source" (except for all the technologies from other companies that we license... or don't ;-)

      - Android is a "stable" operating system

      - Etc., etc., etc.

      1. Ben Tasker Silver badge

        Re: iOS users don't need maps…

        you'll be able to upgrade your 1 year old phone

        Yep, was able to do that.

        you'll get your upgrade on the day it's released

        Generally install a custom rom, so not really accurate to answer this one myself

        - Android is "open source" (except for all the technologies from other companies that we license... or don't ;-)

        Android is open source. No-one ever said the other stuff was. Much like Ubuntu is open source, but the (official) NVidia driver isn't. Not hard is it?

        Android is a "stable" operating systemv

        Seems pretty stable for me, the only major fragmentation, really seems to be in terms of UI etc. You can still take an Android app and run it on any Android device (so long as the installed version is new enough). I'd call that pretty stable, especially given the multitude of devices it runs on.

        Oh, and as we're poking fun, it goes without saying that we can still find where we're going!

  31. Jurassic
    Trollface

    the iOS version of Google Maps was always lousy

    There are many better mapping and navigation apps for iOS than just Apple Maps and Google Maps. iOS users do not miss Google Maps in the least, especially since the iOS version of Google Maps was so lame (it didn't have turn-by-turn navigation, or other features).

    1. Test Man
      Stop

      Re: the iOS version of Google Maps was always lousy

      Clearly iOS users DO miss the maps that were provided by Google for Apple's Maps app, as the numerous blogs, websites and news sites have attested to.

      As for lack of turn-by-turn, etc. features, blame Apple - it was their app and always has been.

  32. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Seriously though...

    This could be a big turning point for Apple's fortunes.

    It really doesn't matter that they have a wad of money in the bank. If the markets start turning seriously away from iPhone over the next year or two, they will burn that money away surprisingly quickly.

    1. Test Man
      Stop

      Re: Seriously though...

      Er, no. If you think that the Maps app is going to suddenly turn Apple from market leaders to also-rans, you need to stop drinking the Kool Aid.

      1. Ben Tasker Silver badge

        Re: Seriously though...

        I think it's an exaggeration to suggest Maps is going to break them, but given the quality of Maps and the issues with lightning cables, it could be a sign that Apple aren't being as careful about quality as they claim to be. Their USP is ultimately that they're cool (what other differentiation do they actually have?), something that won't hang around if they become known as the Alfa-Romeo's of the smartphone arena (look cool, break too often).

        I think it'll take a while to burn through those cash reserves though, in all seriousness if everyone stopped buying tomorrow, it still takes time to burn that much cash (assuming they don't go splashing it in an attempt to regain trade)

      2. Mark .

        Re: Seriously though...

        Apple are the market leader in phones? You should check the stats - they never have been.

  33. Marc 1
    WTF?

    Uhh...

    Open Safari, go to: http://maps.google.com

    I now have Google Maps on my iOS6 device.

    1. Paul E

      Re: Uhh...

      As others have pointed out multiple times:

      A) the web maps does not have as many features and the app

      and

      B) any like to a map from a webpage or another app with bring up the apple maps and you have to resort to copy and pasting to get the same location up in the google maps webpage.

      1. Marc 1

        Re: Uhh...

        Interesting... From my quick cruise through Google maps via Safari, it had everything the original App had. Car/Walk/Bike/Bus, layers, traffic, routing, 'locate me' button, etc.

        I'm a somewhat heavy mobile map user; In my opinion, neither are perfect but both are acceptable. Just gotta learn to work with them.

  34. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    ...

    Hahahahahahahaaha...

    Anon because...

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

  35. YankDownUnder62
    Childcatcher

    Just silliness...

    "Market share" "Power play" - who bloody well cares? Why is it that the absolute end user is the one that suffers from this hierarchical bull fluff?

  36. Observer1959

    Observer1959

    (untitled)

    Obviously many of you are not aware that Google's Map app on iOS did not offer turn by turn voice navigation as it does on Android. How many version of this app was it going to take for Google to offer this feature on the iPhone? I'm glad Apple decided to move on and offer this feature to its users. The app will improve and Google can drop dead.

  37. YARR
    Trollface

    Canny business move for Google right now....

    Introduce a Google Maps app for £499 that comes with an up-to £499 rebate when you trade-in your iPhone for an Android phone, plus on maps.google.com detect if the browser user agent identifies as an i-device, then display the message "Sorry, a flash plugin is required to view this content".

  38. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Google

    Google is like a cable tv provider that switches the channel for you.

  39. uhuznaa
    IT Angle

    Hey, The Register

    I'm somewhat missing content here. Apart from dissing Apple there seems to be an appreciable lack of decent articles that people read and comment on.

    I've started to read The Register many, many years ago (yes, I'm a veteran) for the snappy, wide-ranging and sometimes even witty reporting on all things IT. Lately The Register seems to do nothing but cater to the IT-equivalent of embassy-burning muslims everywhere. The problem is that there is no lack of this anywhere and to be honest, mostly the comments, that is: your readers are better at it than your authors anyway. You've become an Apple-haters forum. Your reviews seem to be written by someone musing about devices over a pint or five decorated with PR images straight from the company PR department. The only articles that draw hits and comments are "Apple fucked the Prophet's daughter!!!" or such.

    (Full disclosure: I'm writing this using Google Chrome on an Apple Macbook, in my pocket is an iPhone 4, besides me lays a Google Nexus 7 Android tablet, my feet rest on a PC running FreeBSD, my job is keeping a flock of Windows-PCs, Linux-Servers, Android-Phones and iPads happy.)

    I'm a brain-fanboi and what's going on here is insulting my brain and my decency.

    So: "The hand that bites IT" needs to rear up its head and look around for a change. There's more than Apple in IT, you know.

  40. This post has been deleted by its author

  41. Phredd
    Thumb Down

    Google Maps OWNS your android device

    I was a happy google maps user on my tablet until the latest update. When I looked at the 'permissions' wanted by the app, I deleted it entirely. It wants to own your device. I don't appreciate that and will find something else or do without.

  42. It'sa Mea... Mario

    Google released their own Youtube app for iOS quick enough..

    ...was in the app store even before iOS 6 was released - which also replaces the native Youtube app as well as the maps app.

    iOS user's usage data is clearly still quite important to Google and I do not believe for one moment that they do not have an iOS map app ready or almost ready to go as soon as they think the time is right for them to release it.

    Of course they are enjoying the media attention that this is generating and waiting for the handful of people that will actually switch to Android merely because of that.. but once the fuss has died down Google would be daft to just ignore what is still a huge chunk of the market - regardless of the Android 'market share lead' Schmidt was keen to remind people of.

  43. skeete
    Facepalm

    Bing maps makes a mockery of iOS6 maps. Good info locations, accurate roads and junctions, good direction calculation and to top it off Aerial Photos of a lot of places in the UK that can be rotated. Yes its not a glamorous 3d rendering, but very few people actually live in the tiny area where this has been implemented.

    Apple have REALLY fooked up on this one.

    They should change their slogan to "There's an better app for that on another smartphone"

  44. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Well there you go then

    And while the Apple maps improve so to Bing Maps, clearer and better aerial photos than Booble. I vote with my feet.

  45. NewForce
    Thumb Up

    Google should make a paid version Google Maps for the desperated iOS6 users

    I've come to think that Google should make a paid version Google Maps for the ios6 users. Without the great Google Maps, iphone 5 or ios6 users are desperate.

    Providing a paid version of Google Maps for iOS users will definitely bring big profit margin for Google. No providing one to ios6, wil bring bigger Android market share. Well either way a win-win for Google.

    Great move Google!

  46. driwatson

    Apple had no choice but to ditch Google Maps

    Look, this is really simple. Put yourself in the position of Apple execs and think ahead....location services are already a big deal and are going to be huge into the future. At the core of providing locations services is mapping - basically knowing where people are and what is nearby. Google have an excellent maps infrastructure and they've spent a lot of money on developing it over many years http://universal-machine.blogspot.co.nz/2012/09/google-ground-truth.html

    Apple made a strategic mistake back in 2007 when the iPhone was launched - Google Maps shouldn't have been on it and Apple should have put their own (crappy) maps on it. But they didn't. Now they recognize this error and know they have to get into maps or loose this entire market segment to Google forever. They're not about to do that so they will spend large over the next few years to make Apple Maps as good as Google's. Fortunately Apple have lots of $$$$s in the bank and this will encourage a mapping feature war which is good for us all.

    Not many people I suspect will ditch their iPhone because of the iOS 6 map-fail (hint: maps.google.com works just fine in Safari on the iPhone & iPad). So in the long run Apple will have saved their share of locations services.

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