back to article You'll be on a list 3 hrs after you start downloading from pirates - study

File sharers who download torrents from services such as The Pirate Bay can expect to find their IP address logged by copyright enforcers within three hours, according to a new study by computer scientists. Researchers at the UK's University of Birmingham reached the finding at the end of a two-year study into how …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What about Peerblock? Doesn't that help?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      To an extent. But as these services use third party hosting it means they can easily expand into new I.P. ranges that peerblock type applications don't have blacklisted yet.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        -Exactly. The Peer Block blacklist is as available to the enforcers as easily as it is to the torrent users. Therefore the enforcers will just use I.P ranges that aren't on the list.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Worried about being monitored from companies and entities within the ARIN block of addresses, just block them. They can change their IP's all they want, but with all ARIN, or APNIC, etc. blocked it won't matter.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      VPN is the way to go

      Good luck tracing people using a VPN...

  2. Miek
    Linux

    Is't illegal to perform any form of "Monitoring" of communications unless you control the network or are a law enforcement agency with a valid warrant?

    1. Miek

      * Isn't It Illegal *

    2. The BigYin

      No, it is not illegal. Well, not if you have the law-makers in your pocket. Although in all seriousness they could try and use the defence of "Committing a smaller crime to prevent a bigger one."

      I for one await Canonical and Red Hat's enforcement officers kicking my door down for torrenting their wares mercilessly. I'll make them a nice cup of tea, we'll have a chat and maybe they'll give me a few free stickers. :)

      1. Miek
        Linux

        "No, it is not illegal. " -- How so?

        "I for one await Canonical and Red Hat's enforcement officers kicking my door down for torrenting their wares mercilessly. I'll make them a nice cup of tea, we'll have a chat and maybe they'll give me a few free stickers. :)"

        +1

        1. janimal
          Stop

          Not illegal

          It's not illegal because they are not monitoring YOUR connection. They are merely connecting to a swarm. If you log all the ip addresses your torrent client connects to is that illegal? Nope.

          1. I. Aproveofitspendingonspecificprojects

            Re: Not illegal

            And they are no committing a small crime to stop a larger one. They are committingf a couple of whoppers to stop... nope, they are just committing major crime.

            If they can't work out who is actually doing what the best they can hope to do it drve a coach and horses over the two biggies and muddy up everything else; perhaps with the help of New Zealand's finest?

        2. Daniel Hall
          Linux

          Count me in

          +1

          /The post is required, and must contain letters./

          1. Miek
            Big Brother

            Re: Count me in

            @ Daniel Hall

            If they denounce the Human Rights Act, you will indeed be counted.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "I'll make them a nice cup of tea, we'll have a chat and maybe they'll give me a few free stickers"

        I grinned at that point, so civilised. Thanks <3

      3. h4rm0ny

        "I for one await Canonical and Red Hat's enforcement officers kicking my door down for torrenting their wares mercilessly. I'll make them a nice cup of tea, we'll have a chat and maybe they'll give me a few free stickers. :)"

        Article says they prioritize the most popular downloads. I fear that we do not live in a world where Red Hat isos are more popular than Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance.

        1. Fibbles
          Joke

          Re: harmony

          I thought pretty much everything was more popular than the Ghost Rider films?

    3. Avatar of They
      Thumb Down

      No

      Gordon 'Stalin' Brown, 'Lord of the Sith' Mandelson and Jacquie (Jack boot) Smith passed the digitial economy bill 1 week before the last election at 11PM and that that allows it. Actually it requires it of ISP's.

      1. Tom Chiverton 1
        WTF?

        Re: No

        And now we have a home sec. who wants to tear up the human rights act.

        Nice eh ?

  3. Pat 11

    BitTorrent = Honeytrap

    Torrents have always looked to me like the exact thing you'd make to catch pirates. It makes every downloader into an uploader, and we know only uploaders have ever been prosecuted because the damages awarded for merely downloading would make the effort financially unworkable. Not saying BT *was* made as a honeytrap, but anyone who uses is ought to realise the risk they take, and I doubt many do realise.

    1. g e

      Re: BitTorrent = Honeytrap

      Unless you set uploads to 0 bytes/sec of course.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: BitTorrent = Honeytrap

        The article suggests the monitors don't download any file parts, so that wouldn't stop you being added to the blacklist/watchlist.

        Of course if it got to court you could *claim* that you set uploads to 0 bytes/sec and ask them to provide proof of downloads, which they wouldn't have. This might severely curtain the damages and turn a Jammie Thomas into a Jammie Dodger.

        1. Matt Williams
          Unhappy

          Re: BitTorrent = Honeytrap

          Surely the whole point of their system is that they don't want to get you into court, they want to issue hundreds of thousands of demands for £750 that can allow you to avoid the huge cost and risk of going to court.

        2. Steve Evans

          Re: BitTorrent = Honeytrap

          Not only that, but unless they actually download from you, all they've proved is that you have an interest in a particular torrent hash... In exactly the same way *their* system has expressed an interest in the torrent hash so it can join the swarm and collect IPs.

          If you're a student doing an IT course, you have the possibility of claiming you were monitoring (exactly as they were) for a paper you are writing.

      2. lotus49
        Stop

        Re: BitTorrent = Honeytrap

        Nope, your IP address is still visible and you would be a leech into the bargain.

        1. Fibbles

          Re: BitTorrent = Honeytrap

          "and you would be a leech into the bargain."

          You're expecting honour amongst thieves*?

          *Incoming freetard pedantry in 3... 2...

  4. Waspy
    FAIL

    Not everything is illegal on torrent sites and since you aren't logging the details of the file that I am actually downloading you don't have a leg to stand on, so good luck with that.

    Of course those twats from FACT have a Pavlovian reaction whenever P2P is mentioned so I expect them to be putting out a completely ignorant statement anytime soon

    1. The BigYin

      Ummm....AIUI it's not the download they do you for, it's the upload. I would see the indirect monitoring as a way of profiling, gauging levels and marking IPs etc for a stricter check. So if one of their monitors can download even a portion of "Princess Sparkle and the Kingdom of the Fairies", then they have you bang-to-[copy]rights.

      Of course, if you are uploading a Uwe Boll movie you should be tried for crimes against cinema. ;-)

      I'm not a total innocent, I did torrent some stuff when I first got the Internet. All of which I have now purchased on DVD or deleted. I no longer do it because my attitude changed rather quickly to simply not consuming. I also have friends in the creative industries and rather than drunkenly argue about god, we argue about copyright. but anyway...with Demonoid falling I am actually awaiting the letter in the post; I'm not sure what the statute of limitations is, or if there even is one.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        portion of

        Seriously, I have always wondered about this - if they can download a portion of "Princess sparkle..." then that proves you have a portion of it, not the whole file. Have you still infringed copyright? How small does the portion have to be before the answer is no? If all you can prove is that I have 512 bytes of "Princess sparkle..." (ie. less than 1 frame of a 90min movie) then is that still enough to prosecute?

        And how reliable is btguard?

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: portion of

          Good question!

          I was going to ask the same thing....

    2. Mark McC

      "Not everything is illegal on torrent sites and since you aren't logging the details of the file that I am actually downloading you don't have a leg to stand on, so good luck with that."

      Well they can quite easily log the details of the file you're downloading. All they have to do is download the offending torrent, watch/listen/read to ensure it's not a fake, and then seed it until you've successfully downloaded the whole thing.

      1. Kwac
        Big Brother

        Optional

        You seem to be missing the point - downloading is a civil offence, uploading is a criminal offence.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Optional

          Just uploading itself is not a criminal offence, make money from it and then yes you'll be taken to court.. But the key thing in the UK is that if your not hurting their business, or doing it for a business, you wont be convicted of a crime here...

          I buy 4-5 Blu-rays/DVD's a month, and I rip them to my HDD, technically it is copyright violation, but there is virtually no chance that even a civil court would award damages based on that. But I do have to say, I am much happier with Blu-Ray than I was with DVD, I've not seen any un-skippable 'Piracy is a Crime' trailers yet!

          Hmm maybe someone should contact the ASA and get 'Piracy is a Crime' adverts banned, it is false advertising right?

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Just uploading itself is not a criminal offence, make money from it and then yes you'll

            This meme could get you into serious legal trouble. It is completely false. All you have to do is diminish the marketing potential for the material and you can be taken to court. I received this advice from a lawyer who was paid to provide advice in a context other than streaming (showing material in public that was not otherwise available or for sale in our area, but was available commercially elsewhere).

            Whether or not it is profitable for the rights holder to prosecute is a whole different issue, and many won't for small offenders because it is a money losing proposition. Of course occasionally they will pick out a random person so the can make an example of an offender.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Just uploading itself is not a criminal offence, make money from it and then yes you'll

              take a look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright,_Designs_and_Patents_Act_1988#Criminal_offences

              So it sounds as if the AC was right, it's not a crime, but a civil matter for the courts to deal with.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Just uploading itself is not a criminal offence, make money from it and then yes you'll

                Criminal shmininal. That's hair splitting which ignores the point: You CAN be in SERIOUS legal trouble, even if it is "ONLY" civil.

                The practical protection is that it costs too much to prosecute and too many people are doing it, not that you aren't making money from it.

          2. I. Aproveofitspendingonspecificprojects

            Re: Optional

            > Just uploading itself is not a criminal offence, make money from it and then yes you'll be taken to court.. But the key thing in the UK is that if your not hurting their business, or doing it for a business, you wont be convicted of a crime here...

            But you may not be convicted of a crime in the USA for it too neither. Not if they use Rendition Airlines on the return trip to pick up empties.

        2. Comments are attributed to your handle
          WTF?

          Re: downloading is a civil offence, uploading is a criminal offence

          Where the hell did you get that idea from?

      2. Tim Brown 1
        Pint

        Entrapment

        If any of these monitors is also seeding, then couldn't that be considered entrapment? as in "oh look lets make our copyright material available for free and see who takes the bait?"

      3. Mectron

        you can't commit

        a crime (according to the MPAA/RIAA ONLY) to prove a crime. i think The Pirate Bay is actually used as a research/marketing engine. you cannot know if your movie/game is popular just by sale only. Plus, event when pIracy "hurt" you (crisys), if the product is good, i can bet that a lot of peoples who "used alternate distribution chnels" to get Crysis 1, have paid for Crysis 2 and even more poeples will pay for Cysis 3.

        Piracy is actually more effective then a demo. As for movies.... well, if it's a flop, you glad your torrent it, if it's not, it;s worth the purchase of the Bluray. Beside, with 2 billions+ in profit, do you think piracy drive down the sale of Avatar?

        If i say the Pirate Bay is controlled by the MPAA/RIAA, i whould not be far from the true. That is why it is still up. it is a extremly valuable marketing tool.

        PS: a chunk of garble date is no prove of sharing. if they want to nail you for seeding, they need to get the whole thing from your IP.

        1. samlebon23
          Linux

          Re: you can't commit

          "Beside, with 2 billions+ in profit, do you think piracy drive down the sale of Avatar?"

          You are completely right. Also, how do they expect poor people in poor countries, living on a couple of dollars a day, to pay for expensive stuff like Blue Ray movies, games and high priced software. No matter how low they will bring the price, these users will never afford the goods and will look for ways to get them for free. Today they fight torrents, tomorrow will appear other methods and alternatives.

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: then seed it until you've successfully downloaded the whole thing

        How long before they start their own torrents, monitor who downloads it then send them a letter.

        I know it's been said to death, buts it beats me why the film/music industry just don't make their material legally and easier to download DRM free. DRM is useless to me, got osx/ios/linux/ms/android devices

        We've got hundreds of kids dvds, the popular ones have had to be bought many times as they get scratched, bitten and snapped. There is simply not enough time in the day to rip the dvds so I've download a few to but on a usb drive to stream or plug in, kids love the physical packaging (as I used to love album covers and cd booklets) but I'm not prepared to pay the same price again for something in a drm ridden file. Netflix has helped a lot, by far the better for for my family’s tastes but still lacking a lot of content.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          The perfect excuse:

          "Honestly guv, I didn't download any of PrincessSparkle.avi, I only joined the swarm for the .nfo file!"

    3. CaptainHook

      Not everything is illegal on torrent sites and since you aren't logging the details of the file that I am actually downloading you don't have a leg to stand on.

      ******

      The article doesn't say they aren't logging details of the file.

      They are joining the swarm of clients associated with a particular torrent and making a note of every IP address which is part of that swarm, presumably they are targetting torrents which are already flagged in someway as likely to be infringing copyrights. For example, torrents which have the name of a recent movie release would be very high on the list of torrents to check.

      They could also be downloading the torrent file as evidence seperately just to be sure what is actually being made available, they just aren't attempting to prove you are uploading parts of the torrent in the passive snooping mode and as such I doubt any legal proceeding would follow the passive mode evidence with the exception maybe of a boiler plate letter asking for money or bad things will happen.

      I suspect that in passive mode they aren't looking for legal come back, it's more likely they are looking for stats about numbers of downloaders, locations, times etc which can be used for reports to government about how they are being bled dry by evil pirates, possibly looking for the really heavy users who can be targetted later with the active snooping mode.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "They are joining the swarm of clients associated with a particular torrent and making a note of every IP address which is part of that swarm"

        I thought TPBs trackers added fake IP addresses to the active peers list, making this kind of monitoring completely unreliable.

        Unless the monitor actually connects to and downloads infringing data from an active IP address, then the 'evidence' they have proves nothing.

        I don't use bittorrent anyway so it doesn't bother me either way :)

  5. Dodgy Geezer Silver badge
    Childcatcher

    Presumably....

    ... this will be a boost for TOR...?

    1. The BigYin

      Re: Presumably....

      Maybe. But if enough TOR nodes are compromised, doesn't that make things traceable again?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Presumably....

        How do TOR nodes get compromised ? Is there any evidence of this ? Is it 1984 ?

        1. Dave 126 Silver badge

          Re: Presumably....

          >How do TOR nodes get compromised ?

          There have been a few Reg articles about just this (and other articles about fixing)... I can't remember titles off the top of my head, but you could try searching the Reg.

    2. This post has been deleted by its author

    3. Slap

      Re: Presumably....

      As somebody has already said torrenting large quantities of data through TOR is really not on. The network was created for other more worthy purposes - not that it's necessarily always used for those worthy purposes. However dragging gigabytes of data through it can really hamper those that rely on it to be able to communicate freely and without persecution from certain authorities.

      In my experience it's unlikely that the speed you would get through the TOR network would be suitable for torrenting anyway.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What do you expect from BitTorrent? It's the equivalent of running around the streets shouting "I've got some parts of a stolen item".

    1. samlebon23
      Holmes

      "It's the equivalent of running around the streets shouting "I've got some parts of a stolen item"."

      He would be arrested only by an idiot cop.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Posting as an AC because you're ashamed of your statement. There are many many things on BitTorrent that are not "stolen". Back under your bridge troll

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      no...

      It's like running around town saying you have some parts you copied from your neighbors ford Escort (with his permission) and used to build your own!

      Now I'm off to make my own petrol and get carted off to the slammer for that too... ;)

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: no...

        I'm sure the Ford Motor Company would have something to say about you copying their patented parts and trade dress.

  7. Select * From Handle

    Not hard to get around...

    "The monitors we detected don't actually collect any parts of the file from the alleged uploader, therefore the evidence of illegal file sharing collected by monitors may not stand up in court,"

    Encrypt your storage and then tell them, (i was just downloading legal torrents, distributions of linux and what not)

    If they ask you for a password to your storage say "no its got all my personal information in their, like homemade porno's, some sexy pics of my wife and a load of my passwords in files. im not letting you see that.." or "shit i forgot it..."

    1. Dave 126 Silver badge

      Re: Not hard to get around...

      I seem to recall that people have been prosecuted for not decrypting their data on request.

      1. David Neil

        Re: Not hard to get around...

        Only if the request comes from the police or via a court order, not in a civil matter.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Not hard to get around...

          The lines between civil and criminal seem to be rather moot these days, when Big Content can buy crimes and order alw enforcement a la carte.

    2. JDX Gold badge

      Re: Not hard to get around...

      Or, you know, you could NOT steal the stuff. If it gets to the point you're planning how to get off on a technicality then it's pretty clear you're not torrenting in defence of freedom, but just a freeloader.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "Or, you know, you could NOT steal the stuff"

        I pay for two cable/satellite subscriptions and my TV licence. Despite paying for all that, it's often more convenient to torrent than to watch on TV.

        Case in point: cycling coverage on Eurosport. My cable STB doesn't support jumping around in a recording, so if I only want to watch the last 10 minutes of a flat sprint stage I have to FFWD on-screen through four hours of coverage. And there's no resume so if someone sits on the remote I have to do it all over again from the beginning.

        ...and don't get me started on those unskippable "you wouldn't steal a car" warnings on DVDs.

        I just want to watch the content I pay for on whatever device I choose without being insulted.

        1. Mystic Megabyte

          Re: "Or, you know, you could NOT steal the stuff"

          >>..and don't get me started on those unskippable "you wouldn't steal a car" warnings on DVDs.

          AFAIK if you play a DVD with VLC then nine out of ten times it will skip straight to the start menu.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: "Or, you know, you could NOT steal the stuff"

          > "you wouldn't steal a car"

          or a policeman's helmet...

          1. Alistair MacRae
            Thumb Up

            Re: "Or, you know, you could NOT steal the stuff"

            You wouldn't steal a handbag.

            You wouldn't steal a car.

            You wouldn't steal a baby.

            You wouldn't shoot a policeman. And then steal his helmet.

            You wouldn't go to the toilet in his helmet. And then send it to the policeman's grieving widow. And then steal it again!

            Downloading films is stealing. If you do it, you will face the consequences.

      2. The BigYin

        Re: Not hard to get around...

        @JDX - "you could NOT steal the stuff."

        It's not stealing, it's license infringement. But your point still stands - don't do the crime unless you can do the time or pay the fine.

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Not hard to get around...

        The only reason to believe that anything has (or is) being stolen is that you've fallen for the crap put out by companies.

    3. dv
      Unhappy

      Re: Not hard to get around...

      It is actually illegal in some jurisdictions (UK included) to not hand over your password when asked nicely by the authorities. That also includes the "crime" of "forgetting" your password. 1984 indeed.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: "illegal not to hand over your password"

        Is that not actually violating laws (in civilized countries) saying you cannot be forced to incriminate yourself?

        (Assuming you *did* do naughty things which at this point is not proven either.)

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: "illegal not to hand over your password"

          In that country we all like to hold up as a bastion of freedom, the United States.

          ISTR that there was a case where the defendant argued that, but he had already incriminated himself by *having the dodgy stuff showing* for the guard to see.

    4. JimmyPage
      FAIL

      Re: Not hard to get around...

      If they ask you for a password to your storage say "no its got all my personal information in their, like homemade porno's, some sexy pics of my wife and a load of my passwords in files. im not letting you see that.." or "shit i forgot it..."

      One word: RIPA. Two years in chokey for you.

      1. P. Lee Silver badge
        Coat

        Re: Not hard to get around...

        I'm studying pseudo random number generation...

      2. jonathanb Silver badge

        Re: Not hard to get around...

        It might be better to say that it has correspondence with your solicitor. They are not allowed to see that.

        1. JimmyPage
          Big Brother

          Re: Not hard to get around...

          They are. The Law Lords (as were) ruled that privileged communication does fall under RIPA. There was a court case in Northern Ireland a few years back.

          I've won a few pints on that one.

      3. ABee
        Happy

        Re: Not hard to get around...

        Cryptography Plausible Deniability (ripped from Wikipedia...)

        "In cryptography, deniable encryption may be used to describe steganographic techniques, where the very existence of an encrypted file or message is deniable in the sense that an adversary cannot prove that an encrypted message exists. In this case the system is said to be Fully Undetectable, FUD.

        Some systems take this further, such as MaruTukku, FreeOTFE and (to a much lesser extent) TrueCrypt which nest encrypted data. The owner of the encrypted data may reveal one or more keys to decrypt certain information from it, and then deny that more keys exist, a statement which cannot be disproven without knowledge of all encryption keys involved. The existence of "hidden" data within the overtly encrypted data is then deniable in the sense that it cannot be proven to exist."

        1. The BigYin

          Re: Not hard to get around...

          @ABee - Nice in theory, does not work in practice unless further measures are also taken. Various log files and "Most recently used" lists could easily leave traces of secret volumes.

          "We see that one of you most recent documents was 'E:\Plans\Evil\TakeOverTheWorld.docx'; where is that files now?"

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Not hard to get around...

        This is devils advocate, but I'd be intrigued to know if you say, kept a password vault or used a system like supergenpass to create your encryption keys, which had a very strong, super long password of the impossible to memorise sort that you had written down, in only one place and upon attempted say, arrest , you ate, would providing a copper a turd be a legitimate compliance with RIPA? You never knew it, so couldn't recall it but there is now no written version of it, but you have in fact provided the remnants.

        Though, I guess it's arguable that it's probably destroying evidence. Are passwords evidence though? As far as I was aware, they weren't.

        1. NumptyScrub

          Re: Not hard to get around...

          quote: "You never knew it, so couldn't recall it but there is now no written version of it, but you have in fact provided the remnants."

          Unfortunately, AFAIK the wording of RIPA makes it an offense to not provide the password when requested. Not knowing the password is not a defense against this crime, as the crime is "failing to provide", not "knowing and not providing".

          So your employer could copy a TruCrypt volume to your company laptop via Group Policy, call in the plod claiming they think you're browsing kiddie porn and you are now liable to life imprisonment without parole, as you cannot provide the password to the volume (that they suspect contains kiddie porn). Yes, I know it is only 2 years, however each subsequent request for the password is a new instance of criminality if you fail to provide.

          If I have misinterpreted the actual wording of RIPA and you are only liable for 2 years total for failing to provide, please let me know. I am assuming that "we asked in 2012, you failed to provide, 2 years" is a different offense to the subsequent "we asked in 2014, you failed to provide, 2 years" (and then 2016, 2018, ad nauseum).

          1. JimmyPage

            Re: Not hard to get around...

            ISTR there is a defence to a password request, if you can demonstrate good reason why you can't provide the key - after all, your emails are probably encrypted by your employer in their exchange database. *You* wouldn't be expected to know they key. This is why the smart alecs who send "Oh, send Jack Straw an encrypted email and get him locked up for not knowing the password" were wrong.

            Regarding repeated jailing for the "same" offence ... well Scotland managed to keep the naked rambler locked up for over a year, on repeated "contempt of court" charges. So I imagine, yes, if you get 2 years, and then come out of jail and refuse to hand the password over, it'll be 2 more years for you. Pour encourage les autres and all that.

            The REAL scandal about RIPA (as previously highlighted) is that it gives the authorities access to EVERYTHING, including what used to be privileged. Under RIPA, any correspondence between you, your lawyer, your MP, your doctor, is completely fair game.

      5. lotus49

        Re: Not hard to get around...

        You are quite right but if you use something like Truecrypt, you can have two levels of protection. You hand over the password to one but not the other. It is not possible to prove that there is a second encrypted container so you cannot be done for not revealing the password because no-one will know or even have reason to believe it's there.

        It's all a lot of faffing about for very little risk though. BitTorrent has always published the IP addresses of all the peers and that information is there for all to see. If it were possible/practical to use this data (which, don't forget, is just a list of IP addresses that are not personally identifiable without access to ISP records and that requires a court order) to stop piracy, the rights holders would have done so long ago.

        There is only one solution to the issue of piracy and there only ever will be one solution. Offer a good service at a fair price and the public will beat a path to your door. It has worked for Apple.

    5. Matt Williams
      Mushroom

      Re: Not hard to get around...

      What would actually happen:

      http://xkcd.com/538/

    6. Piro

      Re: Not hard to get around...

      TrueCrypt hidden volume...

    7. Curtis

      Re: Not hard to get around...

      I prefer to make the password something epic. "G0FuckYourself" or "Fuck0ffY0uFuck1ngWank3r" - that way when they ask you can give them the answer in such a deadpan way that they'll never actually TRY what you said. So when they take you to court, there is your defense.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Options

    Well, I don't download music anymore - but the speed you could grab a full album can be less than 30 minutes, so grab it and stop sharing immediately.

    US TV shows, on the other hand...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Options

      has anyone ever been targeted for downloading/sharing TV yet?

      I bet it would be an awkward case in the uk...

      Lawyer: You downloaded Dr Who via bit torrent, pay us money!

      p2p user: I paid my TV License that produces the show and allows me to watch UK TV, I simply time-shifted using a p2p cloud reception device.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: has anyone ever been targeted for downloading/sharing TV yet?

        should be a crime for watching some US tv shows, never mind inflicting it on others ...

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: has anyone ever been targeted for downloading/sharing TV yet?

          Breaking Bad.

          'Nuff said.

  9. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Usenet

    say no more.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Usenet

      Can't I even say encrypted usenet?

  10. Florence
    Paris Hilton

    Wait... isn't TPB blocked by UK ISPs?

    Oh.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Wait... isn't TPB blocked by UK ISPs?

      I just checked and it is not blocked by my UK ISP. I don't think it's wise to tell you their name.

      Having said that I only torrent legal stuff, I don't buy DVDs but borrow them from friends or the library. I don't feel the need to watch the latest movie, this stuff is not going to disappear anytime soon. They are still screening the original 1960s Flintstones FFS.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Wait... isn't TPB blocked by UK ISPs?

        Borrowing DVDs from friends is killing Hollywood and still illegal AFAIK.

        1. Mad Mike

          Re: Wait... isn't TPB blocked by UK ISPs?

          Borrowing DVDs is in no way a crime provided it is not done for recompense. This is made quite clear in the terms and conditions on commercially purchased DVDs and why those terms and conditions are different for rental shop copies.

          Whether it is killing Hollywood, I don't know, but it definitely is not illegal.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Wait... isn't TPB blocked by UK ISPs?

      - Conceal My Donkey

      - Whole bunch of mirrors/alternate addresses

      - VPS in Iceland *cough* Erm, sorry officer?

    3. Florence

      For the record..

      Paris icon because I was playing dumb, not because I am. *SADFACE*.

      Sometimes my network is slow and things go quicker when I click the Opera Turbo button.

  11. Tommy Pock

    You're missing the point slightly

    They're not trying to catch people or prove who's downloaded what, all they want is to release this report and let fear do the rest.

    They don't have to resort to lawyers or to threaten individuals with legal action while the BBC are obediently reporting verbatim everything F@CT say to them.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: You're missing the point slightly

      Isn't iPlayer still a torrent-based application?

      1. Simon Aspland
        Black Helicopters

        Re: You're missing the point slightly

        And a lot of game update engines use bittorrent under the hood to download their patches (World of Warcraft is one).

        The bittorrent protocol itself is a very good way to distribute large popular files quickly, safely and without using too much of your own bandwidth.

        It's not very good at hiding who is downloading a file, and this makes it no good for piracy.

        But it's use for piracy has made the name 'torrent' synonymous with pirate, so the legitimate users have to hide the use of the protocol so they don't get associated with piracy.

      2. Ol'Peculier
        Thumb Up

        Re: You're missing the point slightly

        No, it's one to one. Used to be when it started, but I think the BBC ramped up their CDN system into a few ISP's

  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Curious

    A few years ago NTL Luton (for example) had exactly the same IP Address...i wonder how this would stand up in court.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Curious

      Fear IPV6?

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Public domain

    By taking part in the swarm, aren't these monitors offering the file for download. Presumably this is endorsed by the people asking them to monitor it, so they're offering a free download of it. Does this freely available, endorsed by the creator, download make the thing public domain?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Public domain

      You can connect to a torrent swarm without uploading or downloading any data, you can still see the IP addresses of other users connected to the swarm.

      1. Anonymous Cowerd
        Stop

        Re: Public domain

        "You can connect to a torrent swarm without uploading or downloading any data"

        Yes, but to prove those IP addresses are infringing copyright you would either need to download the file and look at it (woe betide you if it was somebody else's copyrighted material in there), or be a seeder of the file (then you've implicitly given permission for it to be downloaded and there is no infringement).

        Otherwise, the file could be full of any old crap. It could even be copyrighted material that the downloader already has permission to download.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Public domain

          I think they avoid this by 1) Downloading the Torrent first to see if it is infringing. They have permission for this, so no crime.

          2) Seeing if you are connected to the torrent/swarm thingy. They upload nothing though, so no infringement by them.

          Then 3)-9) = Profit for them.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Public domain

            " They have permission for this, so no crime."

            Having permission to do something unlawful is not a defence. And please note that copyright infringement is not a criminal offence, it's a civil tort.

          2. Mad Mike
            FAIL

            Re: Public domain

            @AC

            "Re: Public domain

            I think they avoid this by 1) Downloading the Torrent first to see if it is infringing. They have permission for this, so no crime.

            2) Seeing if you are connected to the torrent/swarm thingy. They upload nothing though, so no infringement by them.

            Then 3)-9) = Profit for them."

            There seems to be some error in your logic here. If they download the torrent to see if it's infringing, what happens when it isn't what they expect? They have then downloaded something they do not have permission to download!! Therefore, they are pirates just as much as anyone else. Saying they were doing it for the right reasons or they immediately deleted it is not an excuse. Otherwise, it would be impossible to prosecute anyone unless you coulc prove they'd watched it. Indeed, even that would be dubious as they must watch or listen to the content to understand if its infringing.

            In any eventuality, all these anti-piracy organisations are guilty of infringement themselves for the above and other reasons in their actions. Their behaviour is therefore no different to their targets. Of course, they don't care about that piracy as it's someone elses content and therefore doesn't matter!! To describe them as hypocrits is putting it mildly.

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What would....

    .. happen say, if someone Backtrack'd my WiFi connection and downloaded illegal movies through my Internet connection?

    Would I be held responsible?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What would....

      IANAL but currently no.

      There are a few loons (One irritating poster on uk.legal in usenetland in particular) who believe it *should* be the case. However I suspect legislating for that could prove very tricky. By definition, you have no control over something once it is unlawfully taken from you. Even if you left the keys in your car, with the engine running, IN LAW you have no responsibility if someone steals it and kills someone with it.

      The usenet loons say that it should be an offence not to secure WiFi, and that anyone using an unknown WiFi point should realise they are doing so unlawfully, To which a lot of people respond they *deliberately* leave their WiFi open as an act of neighbourlyness.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What would....

      What if your WiFi is insecure because you run a bar or coffee shop? Or it's WEP for compatibility with some legacy crap?

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What would....

      Well they would be within their rights to search your systems for evidence of the infringement, if they found none only then would they look to see if your wifi was cracked, in which case you would not be liable.

      Of course if they found an encrypted drive on your system during that first search they would think you have something to hide. They would demand the password to see inside it to check for said infringing material. Fail to provide the password for it and under RIPA it will be jail time unless you can prove the volume is not yours (yeah goodluck with that one!)

  15. Steve Button

    How to get around this?

    I'm not happy that my IP address is being logged in this way, and just in case someone comes knocking at my ISP asking for details. I know they don't generally give out customers' details, (unless there's a court order?) but I guess this might be storing up bad karma for later on?

    Any *practical* advice? Has anyone in the UK actually been picked up for this?

    On a side note, I did get a letter from my ISP a while back saying that I was sharing a file - I think the file name was "Iron Man 2"... but the irony is, the contents of that file was actually a (very large) advert for some web site - you know, go to www.somecrapware.ru to download the keys for this film. Yeah, I know stupid thing to fall for... but my point is, I did not ever possess the actual content. Crap film anyway. :(

  16. Ross K
    Coat

    Easy...

    Your honour, somebody must have cracked the WEP encryption on my wireless router.

    What was the mac address of the alleged perpetrator again?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Easy...

      WEP can be cracked inside 10 mins.

      MAC addresses are easy to spoof since they are transmitted as part of the handshake procedure.

      The only way to secure wireless is to turn it off and drill cable holes in your wall (and for good measure, wrap your cables in tinfoil to prevent emissions leakage).

      1. Ross K
        FAIL

        Re: Easy...

        "WEP can be cracked inside 10 mins.

        MAC addresses are easy to spoof since they are transmitted as part of the handshake procedure."

        Duh. Congratulations Anonymous Coward, you totally missed the point.

        In a courtroom type scenario you would be trying to introduce the element of doubt. ie an outsider was using my network.

        And yes, I'm aware of the concept of MAC address spoofing.

        You fail. Goodbye.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Easy...

      yep, WPA also crackable...

      Plus Mac address is fake-able easily, I switch my mac often when in a hotel/train, since they often break connectivity if you just close your laptop (well mac-books do anyway)

  17. Silverburn
    Black Helicopters

    IP Addresses in Switzerland...

    ... Count as "private/Personal information", and thus protected constitutionally.

    Just sayin'...

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Up

    Oh what fun.

    watching freetards running around panicking....

    How much will mummy have to pay? Quite alot methinks...

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-19370862

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Oh what fun.

      I love the combination of the pretentious Cuger Brantish "methinks" and the inability to spell "a lot". Classy.

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I've got a cineworld pass and access to all films released at the cinema. Now I can watch 'The Dark Knight Rises' in the cinema as many times as i wish. But if I were to download it, i'd be considered a criminal who has committed a henious crime and who should be punished.

    My point is, If big movie studios stopped producing drivel such as 'jack and jill' (which they should pay the audience to watch) and charged less for DVD's and cinema tickets then maybe, just maybe there would be less downloading taking place..

    1. Eponymous Cowherd
      Unhappy

      Genesis of a "Freetard"

      "If big movie studios stopped producing drivel such as 'jack and jill' (which they should pay the audience to watch) and charged less for DVD's and cinema tickets then maybe, just maybe there would be less downloading taking place.."

      Quite.

      And if they removed all of this DRM / content protection bullshit so that we can make fair use of the content we have paid for, then we wouldn't need download dodgy copies to make up for this lack of freedom. In fact, I'm guessing that a lot of people, realising that they are going to have to download a dodgy copy anyway, even though they have bought a DRMed to hell and back legitimate copy decide to skip the step of buying the legit copy altogether.

      They used to claim that "home taping is killing music". That wasn't true then, and home copying isn't going to kill music, movies, tv or ebooks. What will kill them is this rabid obsession with content protection and control freakery. It gives end users such a shite experience with legitimate media that people are compelled to "download".

      If they really want to beat the "pirates", they need to drop all of this content protection bollocks and accept a bit of "home taping" going on. That will get the public on-side, which will be the biggest and best thing that can be done to combat "piracy".

      At the moment, Big Media are seen, most certainly, as bullying, money-grabbing, control freaks while the "pirates" are often perceived (wrongly) as some kid of latter day Robin Hoods / freedom fighters. Unless they turn that perception around then it won't matter how many lawyers they employ, how many web site they shut down, how many students they prosecute or how many laws they buy, they will only ever lose

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Genesis of a "Freetard"

        Indeed, Mr. Cowherd. Gabe Newell said it even more simply, when he pointed out that for content originators and sellers to beat piracy, they must simply give a better service than the pirates. What's more, with his insane access to real time price/demand metrics, he was able to tell that things are less price sensitive than folks might imagine, barring outliers.

        At the end of the day, torrenting a Blu Ray rip encoded to a nice sensible bit rate h.264 movie is a lot quicker and less troublesome for me than going the Netflix/Lovefilm/iTunes store route, and I have more choice about where I play it. Looking at the size of my Steam library and the amount of music I own, you can see that I have a bit of an entertainment habit, and spend too much on it- but only if the hoops are comfortable to jump through.

  20. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    ISPs only have to keep records for 12 months, so any incriminating IP addresses older than that are probably useless?

    Where I work installed some equipment from a company involved in this sort of thing; I found the whole thing ridiculous. The whole methodology was flawed, and even I could see it would lead to falsely inflated piracy stats. I guess that's what the "customers" of this sevice want anyway...

    TOR isn't the answer. A VPN serious about privacy is probably a good start, but 99% of bittorrent data starts life on usenet anyway. Always has, always will. If you're a freetard, might as well go to the source?

    I used to be a downloader, but now I'd rather not consume at all than pay what I believe are over-inflated prices for fairly crappy entertainment.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Until the US oversteps its authority, like with Megaupload. Or your VPN or Usenet feed becomes or turns out to be a honeypot, similar to what happens with some black hat forums.

  21. scub
    Megaphone

    1 or 2

    1. Costs me around £50-£60 to take my family to pictures including mindless prices for a handfull or corn and some sugary water full of air.

    2. Copyright notices on legitimate material is Damn annoying. Ever started a DVD for the kids and just wanted to get on with something else whilst they where kept entertained for an hour or so..

    3. I often download movies I already have on DVD, Its faster than ripping.

    4. I often download movies and buy them on DVD - If I like the movie.

    5. They cant have it all their own way, If I buy a kids Wii game or DVD and they scratch the medium so as to make it unreadable - I should be able to march in somewhere and get a replacement. Its not the Media I bought, It was permission to view the content.

    Bananas

    1. Duncan Robertson

      Re: 1 or 2

      Here here mate!

      If you pay for a 50p disc with £35 content on it, you should be allowed to make copies of it. I've lost count of the number of tears I've experienced after the latest Lego game on XBox has been scratched or had something spilt on it.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: 1 or 2

      Faster than ripping? odd I can rip a blu-ray faster than download a DVD quality film, you must have good internet!

      I personally rip 90% of disks I buy, for backup mainly though...

      Kids can use BluRay easier than navigate the badly designed DLNA system...

    3. ChrisC

      Re: 1 or 2

      6. With a few rare exceptions, TV shows obtained via BT are nicely edited to remove the ad breaks, and so allow the shows to be viewed in the minimum length of time without any risk of your immersion into the latest gritty storyline suddenly being broken by dancing babies, Z-list schlebs turned cheap tat pushers, or that bloody opera singer...

    4. Marvin O'Gravel Balloon Face

      Re: 1 or 2

      5. March into your local Blockbusters and give them a couple of quid - they'll quite happily repair your scratched disk.

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    You can download about 5gb film in 30 minutes with high speed connection. 3hrs!! The last time I spent more than 30 minutes downloading was in early 2000s. Only mugs use Pirate bay.

  23. Derk
    Flame

    They could vastly reduce piracy very quickly

    Gabe hit the nail on the head. The entertainments industry business model simply has not caught up.

    Do I want

    A). To wait years to see Family Guy episodes, or Game of Thrones on BBC whatever channel?

    B). Buy multiple subscriptions to cable and satellite providers to get the shows I want? Stuffed full of bloody adverts, TV logos and previews of other shows whilst I'm trying to watch a different show?

    C). Pay too much to ITunes for out of date content?

    D). Pay the Producer of the content a small fee, on demand for that episode when it is ready?

    E). Pay for a good broadband connection, pay for a good VPN, and undertake illegal activity?

    I'd rather have option D thank you, I'd rather pay the producers of the content, no adverts needed, instant global launch. It is entirely feasible with todays technology. In my humble opinion, the producers of the content would make MORE money, but like the music industry there is a huge raft of parasitic entities trying to justify their existence's at every bodies expense.

    EOL EOR

    1. PT

      Re: They could vastly reduce piracy very quickly

      B). Buy multiple subscriptions to cable and satellite providers to get the shows I want? Stuffed full of bloody adverts, TV logos and previews of other shows whilst I'm trying to watch a different show?

      While I live, my household will never pay a subscription to watch TV with commercials. I swore a solemn oath when that asshat TV exec complained that skipping commercials on his (already paid for by subscription) cable channel was "stealing".

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Monitoring standards

    One thing I find is often overlooked is the standard of the information captured via any monitoring service.

    To be acceptable in a court of law, and to provide an accurate request for an account to IP address link, they must provide not only the IP Address but also a certifiably accurate timestamp. Without such a timestamp the ISP can legitimately say they have no way to ensure the accuracy of any information they provide in response to a court ordered request based upon it.

    Somehow I doubt that most of these so-called "monitors" can provide accurate timestamps and proof that they are accurate. Sonething that is much harder than it sounds.

    Added uncertainty would also be provided by any ISP's similar lack of accurate timestamps in their own logs. I'm sure a decent lawyer could capitalize upon such mutliplied inaccuracies.

    As far as I know, there is nothing in the law requiring that ISP's maintain accurate times in their log files. All they are interested in (probably) is an accurate enough measure of connection durations. Not the same thing at all and not nearly enough to use as legitimate "proof" or as a cross reference to some other agency's logs I'd have thought.

    Then of course we have the same old issues of linking an IP address to an individual person to consider.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Monitoring standards

      On that subject, I had to submit a ticket to my VPS provider last month as I had noticed the clock was fast. It was fast on the host server too, that was the problem. So if they got done their logs wouldn't match up.

  25. mike acker

    new music and video model

    notes

    it seems there are elements of the 'net that would love to inventory every computer attached to the 'net

    particularly MUSIC and VIDEO libraries

    it appears this business is in a state of flux,... it appears the New Model is: you don't own any copies. Copies are to be kept in Cloud Libraries operated by licensed vendors. when you establish an account your will be placed on the Access List and given access to those assets you have paid the access fee for...

    in this model if you have any titles on YOUR computer you are ipso facto a pirate

    think about it

    i only noticed this recently when Amazon changed their download procedures...

  26. Gil Grissum
    Pint

    Only the uploads?

    I've never uploaded anything to torrent sites. I've disabled any sort of "peer" function. I've downloaded a file or two hear and there and no suits have come knocking at the door, so I think I'm safe. As for you lot sharing illegal files, start packing. Five-OH is coming for you. LOL!!!

  27. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Pirating my own DVDs?

    I have shelves full of of DVDs, and a PC capable of rippng and encoding a film to a 700mb video format for a portable playback device in about 45 mins, but with my (apparently slow) 5mbit connection I can download the same film in a 700mb video format for a portable playback device in 22 mins, and it uses 40 watts less electricity to download the already ripped+encoded file than to get the PC to rip+encode from my DVD.

    I'm not pirating, I'm saving money and helping the environment! ;)

  28. JaitcH
    Happy

    Do Bittorrent Users Care?

    Downloading is legal in several countries.

    I have one computer permanently downloading - been running for over six years.

    Previously, I had a computer in a storage locker in Toronto doing the same thing ... Plod never showed up.

  29. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    This is good

    Those who frequent sites that illegally facilitate piracy should be monitored, arrested if they illegally access or distribute copyright protected works, prosecuted and sent to prison along with a hefty fine per copy. It would be irresponsible not to monitor such people.

  30. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Up

    When the letters arrive

    , open up your routers WiFi security..Say that you give your internet connection freely for other in the area free of charge and have no control what users do on it..

    Of course, it can be any old router not even connected to the network, spoof the MAC...They cant prove anything...

  31. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Monitoring the Monitors

    ... and then taking guesses at who they are, what they are monitoring, and why...

    1. Anonymous C0ward

      Re: Monitoring the Monitors

      Yo dawg, I heard you like monitoring.

  32. Ross K
    Black Helicopters

    What List?

    They're making a list.

    They're checking it twice.

    They're gonna find out who's sharing that shite.

    The MPAA is coming to town...

  33. Blaise Howard

    just connect via a proxy.... BTGuard ....

  34. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What a waste...

    ...of humanity pirates are. They should just fine pirates $25,000 per copy and hang them by their thumbs for a few months until they understand that piracy is a crime. Then let them go and see if they change their ways.

    1. lotus49
      FAIL

      Re: What a waste...

      I see that you have sensibly decided to protect your reputation by posting your ill-informed bilge anonymously.

      Piracy (of the copyright violation sort at least) is not a crime. Not everything that is against the law is a crime. Try reading The Idiot's Guide to the Law - you may learn something.

      Let me know if some of the long words are a bit hard though, I'll help.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: What a waste...

        Actually piracy is a crime and typically processed under civil law. It is however still a crime,(i.e. violation of law), even if processed under civil law instead of criminal law. Soon piracy is about to become a felony crime with mandatory prison time. Pirates in denial are about to get a reality check they won't like.

        Get use to reality because it will bite you in the arse when you least expect it.

        1. magrathea

          Re: What a waste...

          Whatever is implemented, If it becomes too inconvenient for the average Joe and makes too many people criminals, it will just be modified until it isn't and doesn't. The people involved in this nonesense will have to go back to duffing up old ladies to make a living rather than sueing teenagers and bribing politicians

  35. Ross K
    Facepalm

    You thinking of Somali pirates instead of software pirates, or something?

  36. Mectron

    Destroy the RIAA/MPAA

    and the problem is solved. As piracy was created, promoted and activly encouraged by content owners via DRM. make all form of DRM illegal, REGULATE DOWN the price of content and pouf...... piracy is gone.

    1. ShadowedOne
      Joke

      Re: Destroy the RIAA/MPAA

      I'm pretty sure that the mere suggestion of price regulation is grounds for execution in the U.S.

  37. Mectron

    a random list

    of ip/mac address is not proof of anything.

  38. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    uummmmm

    I now see the light. Everyone in the world can be divided into two classes. The first class are those who have downloaded copyrighted material on their computers (music, videos, news stories, and photos). The other class of people are the members of the RIAA, and their investigators. This has the makings of an interesting class war

  39. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    use a vpn

    There is a danish VPN ( citizenvpn.com ) that works well with torrents. It is legally-speaking delivering service out of the Bahamas, but have servers in several countries, so don't have to follow EU logging regulation (like most VPNs in Europe has to). They are also OK with torrenting, I get close to 40 mbit/sec on popular torrents on my 40 mbit line...

  40. Bradley Hardleigh-Hadderchance
    Holmes

    Re: PeerBlock

    This is my limited understanding, but seems to be consensus at sites like Wilderssecurity etc...

    PeerBlock will stop all the i.p. addys on the list from accessing - that is reading/writing to/from your pc.

    But it will not stop any i.p. from SEEING that you are part of a swarm/seeeding/downloading session.

    So whilst it does stop against being infected by malware etc, it won't make you invisible. Seeing as most of the stuff PeerBlock blocks is not there to infect your computer anyway, many security experts say that it is next to pointless (though it won't harm).

    They will still know your i.p. - they don't want to infect you, they want to put you on their list. This is their list. PeerBlock is not an invisibility cloak.

    That is my understanding. Please correct me if I am wrong.

  41. Roger Mew

    read the thread

    The salient part "We found six very large scale monitors, however all of them where using third-party hosting companies. Therefore we can't be sure who they really were, or if they where monitoring for legal or for marketing purposes."

    They are just wasting (your) money.

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