back to article Anonymous hackers leak Scotland Yard-FBI conference call

Members of Anonymous have released an intercept of a conference call between investigators at the FBI and Scotland Yard during which operations against hacktivist group were discussed. During the 17-minute call – which was released as an MP3 file and distributed on YouTube and elsewhere – investigators can be heard discussing …

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  1. Jacqui

    Pay IT staff ~20K

    get monkeys and end up with security holes big enough to sail the titanic through.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Pay it staff...

      You mean the ones they use in India?

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Or someone that...

      doesn't know how to use the rollcall function on a conference line.

      Hint:

      Change password for each con call.

      Once all in, perform roll call.

      Any annons, silences and unknowns, disconnect;. issue new details.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        rollcall fail

        Not the only method to obtain the call recording.. Any one of the attendees could have been on a system with call recorder that could be insecure/exposed, or even the host service might have been recording the call so that attendees could d/l later. So at least n+1 systems that could be responsible...

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Please don't suggest this

        Our internal hackers frequently listen in to senior management calls to find out what's going on. It's far more illuminating that the company intranet.

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I read somewhere

    that the FBI didn't even have email until about a decade after every criminal was using it. I forget where I read that, probably some conspiracy site full of lies.

    In times like this I like to reflect on an episode of the animated Dilbert series:

    Dilbert: What are you doing?

    Dogbert: I'm putting false information on the internet.

    Dilbert: Why?

    Dogbert: It's fun.

    1. This post has been deleted by its author

    2. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
      Big Brother

      Was that before or after the Clipper Chip Perversity proposed by President Klingon?

    3. CHRoNoSS

      WRONG

      http://www.uha1.com/15-mug.jpg

      we know what the fbi had in 2000

      and it was a sandbox

      they don't put mission crit stuff on networks you can easily access which is why this is funny they don't know......

  3. LarsG

    I LOVE IT....

    :-) HEADLINE

    FBI AND SCOTLAND YARD HAVE BEEN TANGO'D

    How do you recover from this embarrassment?

    Arrest and extradite the 12 year old hackers of course.

    Respect to Anonymous.

    1. Matt Bryant Silver badge
      Facepalm

      RE: I LOVE IT....

      This is a massive security breach, correct. But it also shows how stupid the Lultwitz and Anonyputzes are - you should NEVER give away the news that you have an inside source or access! What complete idiots! Professionals would keep schtum and mine the source for as long as possible, but the FBI and Met will now review security, check for leaks and plug any security holes, removing any advantage the tw@ivists might have had. So all this bragging does is reinforce the idea that these are just skiddiots playing at being big, bad haxors.

      1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
        Thumb Down

        Ohhh Matty...

        > Complete Idiots and skiddiots

        > Who have managed a massive security breach

        Really, doublethink much?

      2. garbo
        Holmes

        You're right. They're kids...

        ...just playful and boastful - and damaging.

        But are there _real professionals_ even deeper into the FBI and Scotland Yard, and keeping quiet?

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        There is nothing there that says they haven't been mining the security hole for ages.

        It could well have been that the compromised email address they had been using had its password changed in light of other hacks and so the anons with no further access went public.

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        @Matt

        "[they] will now review security, check for leaks and plug any security holes, removing any advantage the tw@ivists might have had."

        That's what sensible organisations would do (better late than never, a mistake is an improvement opportunity, etc).

        We're talking about the FBI and the Met here.

        What are the odds?

        1. DF118

          Or...

          ....they never had unfettered access in the first place, and all they ever had was a leaked email with the conference call sign-in details, presumably given to them by some sympathetic peon who happened to have them pass through his/her hands as part of their administrivia-based employment for either the Met, the FBI, or either of their comms providers.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            FBI and Met vs two factor authentication.

            If anyone who really cared about security was setting up a con-call between two self-important over-rated security agencies of questionable competence, wouldn't they perhaps want some kind of two-factor security? Something the participant knows (the email details) and something the participant has (a challenge/response mechanism of some kind)?

            Maybe someone will invent something like that one day.

        2. CHRoNoSS

          Anyhting made by idiots is just idiotic

      5. scarshapedstar
        Holmes

        Correct me if I'm wrong

        But I believe the stated goal of Antisec was to force the authorities to upgrade their security. After all, if Teh Terrists can listen in on given FBI conference call, then everyone's at risk - including Lulzsec.

      6. CHRoNoSS

        this breach is months and months old its matter of time befor eit gets found or leaked

        dont act foolish , go ahead fix it we/they/them/us/you will get back in

        you cant stop freedom

      7. PatientOne

        @Matt Bryant

        Or this is smoke and mirrors.

        They may never have had access, but claim to have had to distract the FBI from where this recording actually came from. For all we know, this could have been discovered on some retired bit of equipment they skip-dived. They might have been given it by someone inside one of the groups involved in the call. They might have ghosted the call and recorded it due to lax security.

        Still, wonder how long it'll be before the FBI/Met go kicking some doors down and make some arrests.

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    They have been infiltrated by an Undercover Secret Policeman

    who's been shagging everyone like crazy and has since gone native.

  5. pPPPP

    Most people seem to have this idea that emails are secure, and only the sender and recipient can read them.

    It's made worse by the "encrypt" button in email clients like Lotus Notes. People assume that only the recipient, in another company can magically decrypt it.

    Too many people are ignorant, and think that owning lots of consumer electronics makes them technically competent.

    1. CHRoNoSS

      tip for you

      encrypt your message with two types a encryption before you use the email program and just attack it and hten encrypt again....

      might help stuff like the carnivore and echelon and hte new program they use and those hundreds a pcs they have decrypting your messages get painfully slow when we all do it

      SO after a decade of hackers is the net actually a bit safer? Have you learned to be safer and keep your data safer ? HAVE YOU?

      1. Paul_Murphy
        Unhappy

        good point

        >Have you learned to be safer and keep your data safer ? HAVE YOU?

        no :-(

        and it makes me sad...

        ttfn

  6. NoneSuch Silver badge
    Joke

    Technically savvy former News of the World employees have been called in to consult with the cyber crimes division.

    Their extensive backgrounds in phone hacking will be invaluable.

  7. david 63

    Dunno about anything else...

    ...but the occupants of sheffield are up in arms.

    1. Roger Greenwood
      Happy

      Sheffield has more than a Macdonalds . .

      . . . It also has a burger king.

      1. tim 13

        No Burger King

        It shut a couple of years ago. Although I think there are still some in the burbs

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Errrm..

          Only the one by Castle Market was shut (KFC, Greggs & No 1 Chinese buffet offered cheaper food)

          The one in the train station is thriving alongside M&S, Upper Crust and other high-end establishments..

          Anon coz i stil have to live there for a year and everyone would be on my case 8 while 5!

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Shirley...

            You meant to say "eight until five", as the words you accidentally chose did not make any sense?

  8. Andy Christ
    Facepalm

    "The agency has reportedly launched an investigation into the leak..."

    They just don't know when to stop, do they?

  9. JimC

    Good tactics boys

    Lets really motoivate the cops to put your asses behind bars...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      if you listen to the call

      All their time is taken up investigating 15 year old kids for defacing their school websites. Honestly the call was so boring, I had to grip the arm rests because i fell into a coma multiple times and my head was banging on the desk.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        still

        it's comforting to know that all this anti terror legislation is being used to fight terrorism and has nothing to do with extraditing kids and vulnerable adults for any minor non violent offense they can find in the Facebook dragnet... oh wait.

    2. CHRoNoSS

      trust me when i say they will make someone a patzy but it again won't be the real deal.....

      his name is robert poulson

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I can just imagine the call

    1. Read email detailing time and dial-in number, along with passcode.

    2. Use Skype to dial in.

    3. beep "??? has joined the conference" (read this part in the sexy robo-operator lady voice)

    4. Yeah, er random-law-enforcement-agency guy here"

    5. Profit???

    Conferencing hardware / software is so shabby and delicate. People are constantly getting disconnected. Law enforcement types not being the most technically adept bunch. I can easily imagine how one might just just slip right in.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      In my experience, just join first

      You don't seem to get any kind of rundown of who's already connected when you join, hence the annoying start of every phone conference of "Who are we waiting for?", "Is everybody here?".

      Thus if somebody connected say 20 min. before the meeting (or possibly only 2min given that these are Government) and kept their mic muted, I doubt anyone could know.

      Though even if they did join late, it is rather unlikely they'd notice or remember.

      On top of that, there's no way to eject people if you realise they shouldn't be there!

      The thing that people tend to forget is that pretty much all these dial-in conference systems are just as secure as saying "We'll meet blindfolded in this cafe to discuss the secret things".

      The pin is the name of the particular cafe, and there's a chime on the door so you can hear when people enter and leave, but you've no idea who is there already.

      There are very few companies that would accept doing that.

      1. petur
        Boffin

        In your *missing* experience, you mean....

        In most teleconference systems, the 'owner' of the channel needs to connect first, if you try to connect earlier, you are put on a waiting queue...

        I like to be on time, as a matter of principle, so I often end up on that queue

  11. laird cummings
    Joke

    So, Anonymous is rectuiting...

    ...News of the World employees now, eh?

  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "Access code"?

    Was it 0000# by any chance?

    1. Fractured Cell
      Facepalm

      No, that's far to easy to guess. It must be something highly secure that no-one would guess, like 1234#...

      1. kissingthecarpet
        Facepalm

        No

        It'll be whatever the manual for that conference call software says is the factory-set password. But 1234# is probably a good bet :-)

        Unless they've got the "force strong password" option set - then it'll be 4321#

        1. Is it me?

          Or

          The conferance host always uses the same chairman and participant codes and publishes both in the eMail invite.

          Which means anyone else he's used it with knows it, which leads to fun, I've been on calls where a participant dials in as the chairman forcing the chairman to dial in as a particpant, he never commented on it.

          Other gems are that when someone leaves, they just transfer the numbers to someone else. When a senior sales person leaves, they don't change all the codes in the sales team so it is not unknown for sales people to dial into their old companies to see what's going on.

          And usualy no one challenges blanck call identifiers.

      2. ChrisM

        Damint, now i have to change the combination on my suitcase

    2. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
      Holmes

      If it was a Philips PBX, it MUST have been 0000# because there never was a way to change it.

  13. Rod MacLean
    Joke

    Well...

    ...these guys can hack into anything!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      they hacked into my ploughmans

      there was pickle left all over the work surfaces, a smashed window, and dog mess everywhere.

      then afterwards someone snuck in and stole my ploughmans. I was really upset.

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    More off to the slammer

    Dumber than dumb but I'm sure they'll have fun in the slammer. Morons.

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Or ...

    something even better

    0999#

    0911#

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    i am speechless

    why are we even working closely with these muppets lol.

    the minimum should be all internet calls through their own conference server and an admin looking at who is actually connected and all verified by IP.

    i wonder how many people will be sacked over this

    1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
      Holmes

      Let me take a guess...

      None. They will, however, demand a budget increase.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    For those asking about the access code, it was 6513211#

    The point is if you send an email with the time and date of such a call, along with the access code to around 40 different people around the world (which is what was done) and the email server of one of the recipients in compromised, then it does not matter how complicated the PIN is. Grep'ing certain names or keywords makes finding such emails easy.

  18. b166er

    How about, it's the Feds 'pretending' to be Anonymous, doing naughty deeds with the internet so as to get support for controlling the internet?

    1. CHRoNoSS

      THE TRUTH

      I can verify that this is not gov't types pretending to be hackers, i can verify that there own networks and communications are compromised....and ya can't chang that system cause to do so will cost huge bucks, BUCKS the usa don't have.....nor does britain...

      remember remember the 5th of november.....

      http://www.uha1.com/15-mug.jpg <----- a little reminder from ten years or so back

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I think I've been in an IRC with Ryan

    around the setting up of the new Encyclopaedia Dramatica. Should I expect cops?

  20. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Question ?

    So which side of the pond are these people going to disappear on ? Maybe the US/UK will work together in a joint disappearance effort .

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Who Gains?

    @b166er:

    Yes - that seems very plausible.

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    It feels appropriate and opportune to haul this out for another airing

    Davos, Switzerland. February 8, 1996.

    Full text at wherever your google search delivers you.

    "Governments of the Industrial World, you weary giants of flesh and steel, I come from Cyberspace, the new home of Mind. On behalf of the future, I ask you of the past to leave us alone. You are not welcome among us. You have no sovereignty where we gather.

    ...

    You have no moral right to rule us nor do you possess any methods of enforcement we have true reason to fear.

    ...

    You do not know our culture, our ethics, or the unwritten codes that already provide our society more order than could be obtained by any of your impositions.

    "You claim there are problems among us that you need to solve. You use this claim as an excuse to invade our precincts.

    ...

    "Your legal concepts of property, expression, identity, movement, and context do not apply to us. They are all based on matter, and there is no matter here.

    ...

    "You are terrified of your own children, since they are natives in a world where you will always be immigrants. Because you fear them, you entrust your bureaucracies with the parental responsibilities you are too cowardly to confront yourselves.

    ...

    "These increasingly hostile and colonial measures place us in the same position as those previous lovers of freedom and self-determination who had to reject the authorities of distant, uninformed powers. We must declare our virtual selves immune to your sovereignty, even as we continue to consent to your rule over our bodies. We will spread ourselves across the Planet so that no one can arrest our thoughts.

    "We will create a civilization of the Mind in Cyberspace. May it be more humane and fair than the world your governments have made before."

    1. Sean Timarco Baggaley

      Yeah, an "Irresponsibility Manifesto". That'll work.

      Let's see how long that idiotic "cyberspace" concept lasts when nobody's paying for the internet's infrastructure. Or do you think the internet runs on sunshine and rainbows too?

      Someone's paying for the electricity—you know, the stuff that most countries have to create by burning fossil fuels or some other equally nasty source of energy. The same stuff that has been the cause of wars throughout the planet. The internet has done fuck all to reduce the developed world's appetite for energy—quite the opposite, in fact—so feel free to explain how you're going to run your Neverland on windmills and sunlight when there's no wind and it's the middle of the night.

      Someone is paying for the physical connections, the routers, the servers, and all their maintenance too. In most cases, that "someone" is capitalism. People want email and access to the world-wide web for a reason, not just because it's there. Modern businesses cannot function without internet access now.

      Where do you think most of your internet tools—the World Wide Web, FTP, email, etc.—were invented? In someone's spare bedroom? No: they were invented in government-funded research labs. You don't get to have it both ways: these are tools created by governments, so if you want to turn around and bite off the hand that fed you, you have no right to complain about the consequences.

      All those "someones" are actual people, in the real world, who have every right to a say on how that money is spent.

      As for "Your legal concepts of property... do not apply to us. They are all based on matter, and there is no matter here." Seriously?

      So you won't mind if I hack into your bank account and cut and paste all your money into mine, leaving you destitute and living on the street, without any means to pay for your internet habit?

      No? So you DO have a concept of "property" then!

      The Internet is a fucking communication's network. That is all. Get over yourselves.

      1. TheOtherHobbbes

        No, I think

        "capitalism" runs on sunshine and unicorns and making shit up for profit and stealing from people who can't fight back.

        Do you think Bill Gates got rich by writing good software? Do you? Really? Huh?

        The Internet, meanwhile, runs electricity and *brain power.*

        In case you haven't noticed, quite a lot of the software that makes it work was developed by people for free. Quite a lot of the rest fell out of government-funded (oh, the horror...) research programs.

        And as for the electricity - if it weren't for loud fundamentalists like you and the political interference of idiot energy corporations genuflecting to the all-powerful god of 'free markets - if, in fact, we did proper rational planning and foresight and strategy as a culture, instead of leaving planning to coke-snorting barrow boy traders and peri-menopausal executives - energy would be cheaper, more reliable, and less in need of military support.

        But we don't.

        Which is why we still have people like you yelling loudly and irrationally that this fiasco is some kind of win for our species, instead of the epic and hugely embarrassing fail that it really is.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "The Internet is a fucking communication's network. That is all. Get over yourselves."

        No.

      3. CHRoNoSS

        WRONG we paid for it

        our taxes our buying products etc

        it should belong to all of us

        NOT 1% elite

        you think all that money means anything to me ? ALL the cash they have and they still cant control the world should tell you something

        1. Matt Bryant Silver badge
          FAIL

          RE: CHRoNoSS

          "WRONG we paid for it...." Really? Please do account for what overwhelming amount of taxes you have personally paid that you think gives you the self-imposed right to tell the rest of us what to do?

          ".....NOT 1% elite....." More of the "we are the 99%" rubbish, sprouted by the tiny 0.00001% minority.

          "....you think all that money means anything to me ?..." I think you don't have any, which is obvious by your ranting about "elite" and money in the first place.

  23. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Ah, so that's what FBI stands for

    Face Book Interface.

    Tools!

  24. g e

    Boot, meet other foot

    It's OK for them to tap calls willy nilly but shock horror and OUTRAGE!

    When they get a bit of their own medecine, eh?

    The difference between a legal and illegal wiretap is mostly your job title while you're doing it.

  25. M.A
    Facepalm

    if this is anonymous

    and i do have doubts then lads surely you should have kept your powder dry on this one (saved it till we really need it). nice idea though.

  26. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    The real joke is

    Invited call participants: 40

    Actual call participants: 3 (IIRC).

    Two thirds of those were in America.

    So much for the international law-and-order movement to control hacking.

  27. httpss

    I am minded to consider

    that a hollywood cabal is seeking to control internet usage in a way that no government has yet managed.

    To sieze persons and property outwith their national boundaries by having the FBI act on their behalf, who,in turn, activate overseas law-enforcement by proxy e.g. NZ recently.

    The recurring hacks visited by the Anonymous collective and aimed at such old-world entities, are not so much a shot across the bows of those who seek control of the free internet, as a massive firework display which says 'you can not control us but we can shaft you with impunity', or words to that effect..

    viva Anonymous

    1. CHRoNoSS

      WORD....

      THEY whomever THEY are are but a small slice of hackers that can and will join in this war on our freedoms we are watching.....never for get that

    2. Matt Bryant Silver badge
      Facepalm

      RE: I am minded to consider

      "....we can shaft you with impunity...." Yeah, tell that to Ryan Cleary, Matthew George, Jake Davis, and those are just the ones old enough to be named, most of the Anonyputz skiddies caught have been just that, minors. I hear Kevin Mitnick, Rafael Nunez, Robert Butyka all thought they were uncatchable too.

  28. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Sheffield?

    Whats wrong with Sheffield.

    They deserve a rubber glove rummage for slating my beloved home town.

    Cockwombles....

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Upvoted...

      ... just for using the word Cockwombles, luv it, carry on :)

  29. Michael Cullen
    Coat

    What do you guys know about SAS?

    It's insecure. It's dial-up. It's impossible.

    I got it, kid. What do you got?

    To go.

    1. CHRoNoSS

      that old system was replaced in late 90's

      nuff said by time you saw the movie its already old

  30. Zot
    IT Angle

    Do we know this is real?

    Because they could just have made the whole recording themselves, to make them seem 'scarier'!

    As they know the news channels will go for the scare stories every time.

  31. CHRoNoSS

    Anonymous also hacked half a dozen police websites

    ya think the federal network is compromised yet?

    OH nooos terrowists are gonna harm me now

  32. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Old Chinese curses

    1. May you live in interesting times.

    2. May you be of interest to powerful people.

    Silly thing to do really. They, the Met and the FBI have the power to find and prosecute.

  33. Magnus_Pym

    Good to know the Met have their finger on the pulse

    I wonder if they even know where Sheffield is. They appear to show a marked lack of knowledge, concern or respect for the world outside the M25. They appear to show a marked lack of knowledge, concern or respect for the world of online security.

    Perhaps it's true what they say about London weighting: Wages weighted + 25%, IQ requirement weighted - 50%.

  34. cs94njw

    Fair does. FBI in discusses hackers, who are actually hacking the FBI shocker. On the plus side, the FBI has them bang to rights ;)

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